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Jonianne
11-16-2008, 09:12 AM
Often there are threads describing how that we CD' show more femininity than Genetic Women nowadays.

Well, lets see. Are we sensitive to another persons heart? Do we look in someone's eyes and feel the joy or pain they may have. Do we go out of our way to be friendly and helpful. Do we listen to the feelings being expressed rather than just hearing words. Sometimes "I'm ok", doesn't mean "I'm OK". Are we able to really feel empathy and actually sit in the emotions with another human being, or animal for that matter.

Do we give and sacrifice of our selves to others beyond what we have to. The person in this world I want to be like is my mother. She did not have nice fancy, sexy cloths, but she emminated true femininity more than anyone else I know.

And you don't have to be female to have a feminine heart. They did not call the great Southern general Robert E. Lee "Granny Lee" for nothing. It was the love and caring he had for his men that earned him that title.

So, I do not want to judge a womans femininity by what she wears. Neither do I want someone to judge my femiminity by the fact that I very much look like a guy no matter how I am dressed. I just want to be judged by my heart.

And thank you FAB's for being there and showing us the way.

Miss Tessa
11-16-2008, 09:36 AM
Good post!

GG's are this way because non only have they been socialized to let their feelings show, but they also have those estrogens pumping all the time nonstop.

Ever since my transition I have worked on being more and more of what you mentioned, since my whole life I was deprived of estrogens and even though I was always very emotional and sensetive, I never had my mother's capacity for those wonderful qualities.

Jennifer Devine
11-16-2008, 09:44 AM
I think that as men trying to be women, we have more of a desire to look the part and be noticed as a woman.
There are a lot of beautiful and stunning feminine women out there but there are some women out there who don't take care of their feminine appearance at all and just let themselves go.
When i'm dressed as a woman, i find myself wanting to do more feminine things like going shopping, reading gossip mags and watching chick flicks with a bottle of wine and a box of chocolates.
Before i started dressing as a woman, i used to hate going round clothes shops with my mum and sister but now i just love it!

Karren H
11-16-2008, 09:51 AM
Well I sure feel super feminine especially right after a hockey game.... when I've laid some out with a super fem crosscheck!!! hahaha

DemonicDaughter
11-16-2008, 10:46 AM
There seems to be some confusion on what is considered a "feminine" thing to do. So I thought I would provide you all a list to help. :heehee:

1. Give birth (can't get more "feminine" according to most people)
2. Wish you had more time to be pampered
3. Watch chick flicks because its the only time you might be able to get a romantic notion to pass in front of the boyfriend's eyes...
4. Drink a bottle of wine because he didn't get the hint
5. Eat the box of chocolates (that you bought yourself) because chocolate is a substitute for sex... and dammit, if he can't be romantic with you every once in a while, you might as well enjoy something decadent.
6. Enjoy being something people least expect... like a hockey player, smart, a gamer, independent and/or self sufficient
7. Endure endless invitations to sex, cybering or other activities that reduce you to an object for someone else's pleasure.
8. Endure a monthly cycle in which your clothes don't fit, you get emotional (sometimes for no reason), you have cramps and a few other things we need not going into. Not to mention having every emotional outburst blamed on it even if you don't have it at the time!
9. Live with someone who feels its perfectly fine if you pick up something for his jock itch but heaven forbid he is seen buying you feminine hygiene products
10. Have men assume you don't know anything about cars, sports, hunting, guns or other "non-feminine" activities.

Getting the hint?

Femininity isn't what you wear, what activities you participate in or what you enjoy. Its simply a state of being. I've met women who wore no make up, dressed in overalls, working on cars and let me tell you... you couldn't find a more feminine woman!

Femininity is a inner strength. Not an article of clothing nor something you do. Its something you are.

Kate Simmons
11-16-2008, 11:10 AM
DD pretty much summed it up. I can only add that those of us who are in touch with their feelings and have them somewhat balanced have more of a clue than most. Being in touch with feminine energies is something that cannot be explained that well, only experienced. Those who understand know what I mean.:)

Tomara
11-16-2008, 11:15 AM
Well stated DD !
I think there a lot of people who are stuck on themselves and don't think about what the other people in there lives are feeling .
I was one of them before I started seeing my therapist , and with her help I am more comfortable with myself and more understanding of the others in my life.
Tomara

Miss Tessa
11-16-2008, 11:23 AM
This is a really good thread we got going and I hope more ppl add to it.

One of the biggest things that bothers me is that in order to be a woman you have to be able to give birth or at least have a female reproductive system (which discludes women who are not only trans, but also GG's with hysterectomies or birth defects that left them with no internal organs)

Most TS woman are more feminine than GG's because they go that extra mile.

However, some lack those qualities mentioned in the post that began this thread, only because they were not socialized as women and/or their HRT doesn't work as well as a GG's constant flow of hormones.

sara_also
11-16-2008, 11:29 AM
I agree with DD. I belive that you must be feminine to really know what feminine is.
Sometimes we try to fool our selves as cd's in thinking we know. Do we really?

DemonicDaughter
11-16-2008, 11:59 AM
...One of the biggest things that bothers me is that in order to be a woman you have to be able to give birth or at least have a female reproductive system (which discludes women who are not only trans, but also GG's with hysterectomies or birth defects that left them with no internal organs)...

That's why most of that list was done rather tongue-in-cheek. And okay, FINE, giving birth is solely a woman thing but I do NOT believe you need to give birth or have a monthly hormonal cycle to be female or feminine. I greatly dislike when that particular situation is used to distinguish cders/ts/tg from ggs, why? Because I agree that those who choose not to have children or those who cannot have children are no less women or feminine than those that do.

mylitta
11-16-2008, 01:41 PM
Actually, one thing coming here has done for me is to question just what is femininity. The traits usually associated with femininity- empathy, communication ,nurturing, can be found in men too- and very nice it is to find them. Clothing, makeup, hairstyle? I am the same person whether I am in skirt and make up or in boots and jeans. The ability to give birth? As has aready been pointed out, not even genetic females all have that.
So I have no answers- I've never doubted that I am female, but don't know what makes me feminine or not. But I often think about it while walking the dog.

Michelle8
11-16-2008, 02:02 PM
I've always had feminine traits.I'm a good listener and
Have empathy to other peoples problems.When my son
was dumped by his girlfriend my ex-wife said It would
toughen him up.I knew what he was going through and felt bad
for him.I'm the one that helped him through it.

Sarah_GG
11-16-2008, 02:30 PM
When i'm dressed as a woman, i find myself wanting to do more feminine things like going shopping, reading gossip mags and watching chick flicks with a bottle of wine and a box of chocolates.

Where's that smiley emoticon thing that lays on it's back, kicking it's legs, clutching it's stomach with laughter when you need it!

Wait a sec while I just empty the washing machine, load the tumble dryer, put up the ironing board, make sure everyone's got a shirt for tomorrow, prepare supper (from the weeks groceries purchased yesterday on my 'day off'!, cook it, serve it, clear it, load it into the dishwasher, walk the dog, empty the washing machine, empty the tumble dryer (yes again) distribute clean underwear and laundered clothing throughout the house, pick up dropped rugby/football shoes, kit, dirt, prepare packed lunches for the morning, finish that bit of work i didn't have time to on Friday because I got waylaid on crossdressers.com, write mother's birthday card, arrange transport and dogsitter for Wednesday, pick up wet towel from bed, clean dog paw prints (it's raining), clean kitchen from pre bedtime snacks... and I'll join you on the sofa with those chocs and a glass of wine... what you've finished them!

Ronni Seymour
11-16-2008, 02:57 PM
I think a lot of this has to do with 'nature vs. nurture'. I believe both sexes have similar capacities for the softer, more caring attributes of personality. But in our societies, males are hardened in order to take on responsibilities that have to do with survival. This reinforces and strengthens that which testosterone has already begun to produce in our personalities.
It still doesn't come easy, believing myself to be feminine, even when I go out dressed, (as much as I attempt to take on a feminine persona). I know though it has to do with a lifetime of social programming, not nature, because the longer I CD and take on feminine attributes the easier it is for me to be more in tune with a more feminine part of myself.

So much for my 'philosphy'!:battingeyelashes:

Sarah...
11-16-2008, 03:01 PM
Thanks DD - your post was a very good read.



Most TS woman are more feminine than GG's because they go that extra mile.


Most? Nope, can't believe that generalisation. Some might be, some might not be. depends on your point of view. I can't say.



But I often think about it while walking the dog.

LOL - I walk the dog too, I must be feminine!!!!

YES - I know, that's an absurd statement and of course it's not true, it's totally tongue in cheek. But it is an extreme example of the kind of activity that can get appropriated as an example of femininity when it's really just another human trait/activity that some of us have/indulge in and some of us don't. It makes no odds to one's perceived gender.

Thanks Mylitta - I definitely know it wasn't the intention for your closing remark to mean that, it just seemed too good an opportunity to miss in making a point.

Sarah...

Karen_Ski
11-16-2008, 03:13 PM
Often there are threads describing how that we CD' show more femininity than Genetic Women nowadays.

Well, lets see. Are we sensitive to another persons heart? Do we look in someone's eyes and feel the joy or pain they may have. Do we go out of our way to be friendly and helpful. Do we listen to the feelings being expressed rather than just hearing words. Sometimes "I'm ok", doesn't mean "I'm OK". Are we able to really feel empathy and actually sit in the emotions with another human being, or animal for that matter.

Do we give and sacrifice of our selves to others beyond what we have to. The person in this world I want to be like is my mother. She did not have nice fancy, sexy cloths, but she emminated true femininity more than anyone else I know.

And you don't have to be female to have a feminine heart. They did not call the great Southern general Robert E. Lee "Granny Lee" for nothing. It was the love and caring he had for his men that earned him that title.

So, I do not want to judge a womans femininity by what she wears. Neither do I want someone to judge my femiminity by the fact that I very much look like a guy no matter how I am dressed. I just want to be judged by my heart.

And thank you FAB's for being there and showing us the way.

:love: I couldn't have said it better myself Jodianne! Although I do love my femininity it seems like we place to much value on the appearance side of femininity, it is far deeper and must come from the heart and soul!

Bev06 GG
11-16-2008, 04:12 PM
Thanks Jonnianne,
That sure was a thoughtful thread straight from your heart.
I think you would be feminine whatever you wore, the overalls and spanners that DD mentioned wouldnt rob you of your feminine traits, cause you are one of the kindest, sweetest ladies I know.
Love ya
Bev