A New Way of Looking at Things (for me)

The other day a post here got me thinking (can't recall the title) about where I am in the gender expression/identity spectrum and I got this thought in my head.

I dress and present a as a male (matches my birth gender, easy to pull off) when I want to work and play as one. Do typically "mannish" things like heavy lifting, dirty smelly hot tasks, rescue people from true peril, hang out with the guys and BS drink beer...
AND

I dress and present like a female when I want to work and play as one. Do typical "womanly" things like get my hair colored, curled, a manicure/pedicure with color, shop and try on makeup and hang out with the girls chit-chat (see BS above) and talk fashion and drink beer...(yes I believe beer drinking is an androgynous activity!)

This sort of gave me a new perspective, your thoughts?

I'm just wondering what's wrong with doing either one dressed either way Sara?With beer of course. ;). That's what I do and presentation is mostly my choice at any given time. :)

I think that's classic bi-gender behavior. If your two sides aren't in conflict, go with it and enjoy!

I don't see any problem.Go with the way you feel. I for one would not want to trash my girly clothes working, and wearing girly things wile doing girly stuff one word, happiness. My job/work is all guy if a girl was to do it she would wear the same things.

Kate, not in my world. I know a bit about northeast Pa. and I think a guy in men's jeans and a tee shirt getting a makeup application in Macy's might not be readily accepted by his guy friends at the pub. I'm glad this doesn't apply to you.
Plus as Jean said most of my manly work is done in the same clothes male or female and they ain't girly at all.
Paula, my sides are diametrically opposed and with this revelation, if you will, I'm concluding that for me to do these two vastly different varieties of activities (half readily acceptable for me looking/dressing male-like and the other not so, that is where the crossdressing occurs. Yes I do enjoy to a certain degree, wearing women's clothing but i think the main motivation is so that I can do the feminine things I love with less scrutiny and with less stress.

Go with what works best for you my friend. :thumbsup: :)

Sara - something has struck me as interesting in the contrast between your perspective and that of Ginger (and her experiences) in the other thread current today...

I'd hazard a guess that your perspective is heavily influenced by your age (similar generation to me and many others here) and reflects some stereotyping of roles and presentation that goes back to your formative years. That also impacts your drinking buddies (I guess...) in either mode, and your presentation simply reflects alignment with the image you have for those pastimes (and, in fairness, probably aligns with your buddies expectations too).

Ginger and her friends, on the other hand, are of a younger generation - perhaps without those strong stereotypes of role and gender - and her buddies do reflect what Kate suggests: to be able to hang out, drink beer, talk trucks or metal or cricket (as we do here.. ;)) whether you're wearing a boiler suit or an LBD. So I think it might generational as well...

Don't you wish our generation would just chill a bit more about this gender-flexing thing and accept us in denims or a denim skirt - it really shouldn't make any difference about the true nature of the person underneath... :)

Katey x

I went through a phase like that a long time ago.

Hi Sara
Perhaps a sabbatical is in order?
Pick a time frame (a week, 2 weeks, a month...?) and abstain; however, keep a JOURNAL. Jot down your feelings. You will learn so much about yourself! I'm envious;)

Ciao Bella
Mia

Katey, My dear!

It is extremely difficult for men to stay with the current time and trends...My male stereotype was Magnum P.I...Uhm, WOW, times have changed ;)

Women shop...they are on top of the current fashions...they know what the young-uns are up to. On the other hand, guys are clueless to their environment. (I am not touching on emotional differences in this post).

As Boys: we were told not to cry, so we didn't. We were told "Don't touch yourself"...so, we didn't...nor did we explore our emotional side...connection, I don't know? We were told what it meant to be a man, then I failed (because, I'm not confident that testosterone based logic & reason will get this world out of the "Mess" it is now. Sorry, what were we discussing? Society is changing...it's happening in the 18-25 yo...they will change things...helping them, would help us...hmmm

Ciao
Darlins

We're all very different, Sara. Sometimes I think all we have in common is that we all dress. I think Katey is on to something, too. Your posted activities peg u as someone much younger---------than I.

[I dress and present like a female when I want to work and play as one. Do typical "womanly" things like get my hair colored, curled, a manicure/pedicure with color, shop and try on makeup and hang out with the girls chit-chat (see BS above) and talk fashion and drink beer...(yes I believe beer drinking is an androgynous activity!]

I don't claim to be a manly man. I KNOW I'm not. But, I can't be bothered doing any of those things u like to do dressed. I'd ruin my nails within 5 minutes after having them done. I shop on line or in drab. I wear wigs. Rarely ever use make up or even shave. And, don't hang with guy friends my age. They're mostly in their rockers babysitting their grand kids. I DO go out a lot with younger Tgirls these days. But, fashion discussions have been rare and far between. Mostly, we dance and have fun!

And, lastly? I quite beer for wine years ago when I wanted a more fem figure!

You got me figured out Katey888, my livelihood and favorite manly activity consists of a huge majority of old fashion thinking males, who challenge each other's masculinity as a major pastime. Our activities require confidence in each other's abilities and fortitude. Sadly both would come into serious question if they new the other side of me.
Great posts by all.

Hi,

Difference ,

What say you , your born nether male or female or both does not matter ether way . what then .

your strong and can do most things males do yet female enough to i dont know just be a female, from what i know and what i,v been told quite forcefully i may add this person, myself , would not be accepted .

i can go back to the 60,s age 13 and i saw a few details , and we had a few who were different not like myself though , yet i did both male and female work, i saw no difference,

Mentally and Emotionally this is where it becomes very different in my case, just i could not talk about it had i , i would have been as i had been abused just it would have been far worse

One detail i learnt from age 10 keep your trap shut tight dont even let on a thing, two years later some knew i was different , again nothing was said till about 7-8 years ago and i was told they knew more about me .

Clothes did not make any difference to me other than my total hate of male clothes and even now clothes dont factor in to what ever i do,

what i do see is this could i have been one of the boys , well no i never was at any time in my life ever, just because i had to work with them did not change who i am

Just thinking about your old fashioned thinking males, a ? for you how would i get on with them being what i am . not sure your job though, i was with the fire service and Railways apart from other building work and farms very male work place,s, of cause,

yet i did it, just as well they never knew i was /am female , id hate to think what would have happened to me then. i was abused before then so i knew what would happen ,

Whats your take on how they see females, how do they treat us ,

Not many here were i live have an issue with me as i do hold a rank that puts me in a very good position of respect with the men , and i have worked for a few as well, so from that point i do have respect from them as well .yet they do accept me for who i am ,
would this be the case with your mates = work mates,

i wonder. what would i have to do to be accepted.

...noeleena...

Noeleena
I can only speculate the response of my work mates since I'm not in a position to try and find out first hand. Too much at risk. I wish you well, thanks for your reply.

I get out enough that I no longer dress at home and when l'm out I'm a lady. As a lady I get gentlemen to do the heavy, dirty work for me! I also make stuff up that isn't always 100 percent truth!

I can be the same way. When I'm in guy-mode, I don't even think about this stuff.

But there are times when I just want to be the girl, who I think I'm supposed to be. Sometimes it drives me craaaazy!

same here, but sometimes when I'm in guy-mode and I see a beautiful women the first thing I think is: Oh, she's really beautiful! But immediately I can't stop imagining about wearing her clothes and how that would look good on me:)

Sarasometimes I'm with you, but I probably dress less often than you do. I save my money and use my dressing adventures as a reward for being a good man, a good father and a good friend.
Getting my hair highlighted, cut and styled as Ophelia in Montreal was a singular pleasure in my dressing journey.
But so is splitting wood, changing the oil, cutting the grass and engaging in potty-mouth, macho pissing contests at male gatherings.
Sorry Mr. Heston, but my two worlds of masculine and feminine are as separate as The Red Sea. Put your staff down.
May it ever be so.