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After taking an online quiz and getting the results of a so called scientific one, I was classified as a "transgenderist". Just what we need another category. I fell in between a CDer and a TS female.
More info here: http://www.firelily.com/gender/giann...enderists.html
There was a thread a few months ago doing a take on the old Jeff Foxworthy line....you might be a (fill in the blank). I read this particular essay. I thought the categorizations were a bit inaccurate - for example, I would submit that a person can be transsexual without transitioning, resorting to HRT or cosmetic surgery, and a CDr might chose to dress more than occassionally, but I also thought that the author coined yet another term where one was hardly needed: Transgenderist. (does the "ist" really add anything?)
But, in the end, all these labels and categorizations are arbitrary creations - abstractions meant to help a person interpret the broad spectrum of human behaviors associated with cross dressing and gender identification. And there will be wide disagreement about how to apply the lables and who fits in what category.
I suppose the more important question, is (lables and such not withstanding) how you view yourself. If you feel you're expressing a gender preference as well as a clothing preference, maybe transgender (or add the "ist" if you wish) might come close for you. I would put myself in a similar category - I dress nearly full time and feel decidedly feminine...but I don't envision myself as transitioning in the foreseable future.
I know it can be overwhelming, especially when starting out, but this kind of distinction is a long time in coming! Yes, I know about the label thing as well, but for communication purposes, it is needed to describe and hopefully understand that these are human traits and not mental disorders as some seem determined to insist! We need to recognize the even more subtle differences within the whole of the Transgender catagory. With knowledge and understanding comes acceptance.
Thank you for pointing out the article!
Dana
Thanks Kim. It really does get a bit confusing although this new term does fit me quite well. I like my guy parts, I'm straight, I just melted after seeing a beautiful blonde walk by my house while letting the dog on in.:) I only like my guy mode for hiding Marleena, when I'm not dressed I wish I was, etc.
@ Dana you're welcome.:)
Wow if I'm a transgenderist do I get a plaque or a certificate! Just as long as I don't have to take the pesky test. Transgenderist sounds like something you do to others that sorta pisses me off.
Labels are simply categories. They are necessary in order to conduct a meaningful discussion or debate and for purposes of writing an essay, conducting a study and so on. In these instances, there should be a clear cut definition at the outset, of what is to be included in each of the categories. Other than for such purposes, the use of labels can be very confusing and misleading, especially as applied to a community as varied as ours. We are all individuals, and few of us ever fit neatly into any of these categories, unless we are defining the categories ourself, and then we probably fit into one because of our own bias.
I especially dislike a label that labels the person rather than the activity, such as crossdresser, transvestite or transgendered. Of these three terms, only crossdress lends itself neatly to being used as a verb. We are much more than something that can be summed up by one word, but that single word can take on such an importance and significance that it overshadows who we really are. For example, if I play a round of golf, then I am one of the golfers on the course. But it is so seldom that I play that the term golfer hardly describes who I am. I feel that it is the same with crossdressing. While dressed I am a crossdresser, and am engaging in what many would describe as a transgendered activity because society has created a gender differentiation to clothing. That does not mean that I am transgendered, but rather it is just the activity that I was doing that day that is transgendered. Crossdresser(ing) describes me and what I am doing on that particular day and only at such times. Transgendered, an adjective, implies that there is a constance to my description in the same sense as I am right-handed. If crossdressing became a major aspect of my being, such as for instance, I was a professional, then it would be more accurate to describe me as a crossdresser in the same sense as saying someone is a farmer, butcher etc.
To Kimdl93: I think the term transgenderist has been around for a long time, but is not used very often. I believe that it is what Virginia Prince used to describe herself, but I could be wrong. I am going by memory and can't be bothered looking it up. In one sense, it could be more accurate than transgendered as the "ist" denotes one who engages in something while "ed" describes the person. Gender is a construct of society, and it is the behaviours, appearances and expressions that possess a gender and not the individual. But this is all academic gobbledegook, and like labels, does little toward our understanding and acceptance of who we are. As you said, the important thing is how we view ourselves.
Veronica
I really don't like to put labels on myself.... Let alone define myself based on an online survey...
Makes sense.. I know online surveys are not to be trusted as fact. It did however add to the confusion of crossdressing. One size does not fit all type of thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Karren Hutton
Kim I believe you have hit the nail on the head. There is indeed a broad spectrum of behavior associated with crossdressing and gender identification and in addition to that, there is wide disagreement about how to classify, label, and identify these behaviors. Just reading a few threads on this site confirms that fact.Quote:
Originally Posted by kimdl93
I agree that the more important question is how you view yourself. Nobody can decide where you fit in and where you're going with all this but you.
I do think that it would be helpful to come to some kind of consensus on our terminology and classifications, that would only make sense because the behaviors, motivations, and path of a crossdresser is wholly distinct from that of a transitioning transexual.
But beyond the general classifications, we define for ourselves where we stand, what are our preferences, what direction we decide to take with it. Some people take the position that everything that is trans-natured is defined for us and we are just fulfilling some pre-programmed identity and that is our destiny. But I disagree. We all have choices and we all have differing opinions about ourselves. And even within our self-defined place in the crossdressing spectrum, we find ourselves fluctuating in depth, intensity, and duration of these behaviors. That is because our desires fluctuate from time to time.
No doubt there are outside influences that help determine our outcomes; things like our SOs and families, the demands of jobs and the other cares of life. But ultimately we navigate our own course. Each person is Captain of their own Destiny to the degree that we exercise our own personal choices.
For some, it means progression on a transition continuum. For some, it means dabbling here and there with feminine things. And for some, it means holding off and denying the decision to fulfill desires for the sake of other reasons, whatever they may be.
Each person must decide for themselves where they fit, and how they will find their happiness in this broad spectrum.
I love transgender diversity and all those spots between crossdressed male and transsexual woman.
I met a very nice drag performer in Boston who actually is dressed full time and very passing but still identifies as male despite living as a woman full time.
Genderqueers who feel both male and female on the inside are among the most open minded and understanding of TG people.
I knew someone who tried to be an androgynist and pass as either gender on a whim with minimal effort, he however gave up due to his body build working against it.
I find the spots in between on the TG spectrum fascinating.
The problem with all these terms is;
I find one that I think fits me and then awhile later I find I've moved to a different one!
I understand that perfectly. I have the scientific kind of mind that likes to classify and understand things. Sadly the one thing that defies understanding is me. I have trouble grasping and pinning down what I am when much of it is amorphous and unexplored.Quote:
Originally Posted by docrobbysherry
I want to be free to be me, but that me is too changable.
The one thing I know is I have yet to find a category I fit in nicely with. Which after years of rejection gets me a bit defensive at times.
There are far to many labels under the "transgender" umbrella.
You are either TS/IS or TG (transgender).
If people wish to sub set within the transgender term then that's fine.
I'm not under the "transgender" umbrella term and never have been.
Transsexual and intersexed issues are far different from the perspective of mental therapy and and medical needs than the majority of those listed as transgender.
Not better, not more important , just different and because of that you will see catagories when it comes to the U.S. medical establishment in order for them to assign ICD-9 medical codes and separate billing codes to this faction.
At the rate the transgender faction is going we are going to see cats and dogs who like to cross dress along with contemporary furniture who likes to wear plastic protective covers because it turn them on listed as transgender. LOL!!!
Julia
Good points Julia! As for my dog (a golden retriever) she has the most beautiful red eyelashes, but hasn't shown any inclinations to CD... yet.:)
Marleena,
Put mascara on her!!!!!!!!!!! :o)
Thank you for the post, it was enlightening and confusing. For me I see I fall into the category. But the whole debate on labeling and categorizing its a hate/love situation people love it, when you receive benefits and hate when it don't. Look at American (u.s) history.
Good idea.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Julia_in_Pa
I want her darn eyelashes!
The problem with all these labels is that they assume that we fit into one of them. The fact is that we are a spectrum of ideas, feelings, and goals. It is not digital in that we all fall into one of a very few categories.
So, for example with this "transgenderist" term: A significant number of the posts here seem to fall into a group that has no desire for SRS, wish to present in their other gender for some fraction of time, and are certainly transgendered. However, the variations in all three terms in this list are tremendous. After all, how many of us present completely as our feminine sides for a block of time and then don't get to for a month or more!
Until someone comes up with a sliding scale (please, no one take this on as a project) let's just all be transgendered, except for those who have transitioned to full time as their femme selves, and then, as I mentioned to Julia a few posts ago, let's just call them she! So much easier!
tina
p.s. and then we can sit here and fire matzoh balls at those who try to label us :)
Very well put. Nothing like a bit of humour to make a point. This whole umbrella thing is all about the numbers game and political expediency. It divides rather than unites.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julia_in_Pa
Marleena,
My quiz rates you a wonderful human being. :)
Btw the way a recent online test that I take rated me straight.:heehee:
Keep in mind it is not a definitive answer to TG issues. I'm adding it it for entertainment purposes.: http://transsexual.org/cogiati_english.html
@ Arlene, online tests can can never substitute for what we ourselves know, or for what a good therapist can help us discover that we didn't know.:)
It is all arbitrary. The labels have a purpose for the observer but aren't that useful for the subject.
I don't think anyone really needs a quiz to tell them what they are feeling. When you dress up as a girl, do you feel like you are one? Do you want to behave as the girls you know or have known? Do you TRY to behave as you think women do? Is it connected to feeling sexually aroused? Gee, here I am making up a quiz myself. I must be not just TG, but crazy too.