Had an interesting conversation which gave be doubts about me,

[Kimberly Marie Kelly]

Yesterday I was asked a question from a friend a guy at work, he supports me in my transition. My other friend Stef was there as well. Earlier that afternoon I was talking and and joking around, I supposely hit the forklift with a closed fist and made some comments. I don't recall hitting the forklift. Anyway, my friend Manny was asking me how my transition is going, more in my mind. The point he was asking is "how feminine in my mind do I feel", because as he put it hitting the forklift with a closed fist is not what a women would do.

He also commented that he fully supports me and would like to know when the butterfly will fly. He also commented that people are watching me now especially since coming out over the last year or so and especially since my official coming out 2 month's ago. My response to him was that transitioning is a process, a long process. It's not like a light switch where one day I was a man than the next day I'm a woman. For me, all I knew I was different thru out my life, but I didn't know exactly what it was. All I knew was I wasn't comfortable doing the many things males do, sports, relationships with women ie; dating. Nonetheless, I acted the part of a man for 50 + years. My action, hitting the forklift with a closed fist was more of a habit, a mannerism. I explained that I lived my life as a man because it was expected of me, that now I have to learn new feminine traits and lose those males traits behind.

My question to my sisters is this, did you have feminine traits thru out your life, prior to your transition or were you mostly manly? When you realized you were trans, how long did it take to lose the guy habits you had? Was it a long process for you? With his question he presented me, it makes me wonder if people are looking at me closer, trying to see the woman in me or whether I'm for real. In a small way it makes me doubt myself. What is your opinion? Kimberly Marie Kelly

[noeleena]

Hi..
kicking or hitting the forklift is not a female thing .yet i know some who could dismamtale it . how we vent our selfs . on the back of our 4 wheeler is a tryer & the door jam s some times .. he he ,,,,yes i put my fist to it . & i m a woman with that male strength . may be not very femm . im just not a girl e girl . well i get the door open .
is there a line we can not go over because we are women or is it a myth . as said the karate girls time to back out i think .
It makes it harder for you tho . so i spos like you said we have to learn an other set of how to do things .....now wheres my sledge hammer ....giggle ,,,

...noeleena...

[morgan51]

Ive spent over 50 yeas of my life trying to fit into the male box this included many macho presentations I wasn't entirly comfortable with but had to do to appear as others wanted to see me . Today I can only be me and am trying to just feel natural not the fake male I've tried to show for 50 years, only you can decide whats right for you. I find "him" comming out when I least want or expect "him" to show up but there is nothing to do but keep trying to just be myself and be comfortable not what others expect.She is always present and never lets me forget it even when I do stupid male habits from my past. I am making an effort to be calm and polite no matter what is going on.Unlearning 50+ years of behavior prolly will take some time just be happy with any improvements.

[Faith_G]

To answer your questions: I tried to be very masculine. Acted tough and hostile, didn't talk much, avoided touching and being touched, had a big beard and short hair, cussed like a sailor. I started relaxing from that place about 5 years ago, I did not like that person at all but I was not willing to show myself yet. I find behaviors from time to time that I learned to fit in with the guys and I work to learn new behaviors that help me fit in with the girls. My current one is this: when a guy acknowledges a stranger's presence, there is momentary eye contact and a nod of the head. I got sick of people reading me when I would do that, so I'm training myself to simply make eye contact and smile instead of nodding.

You can't overcome a lifetime of programming in a few months. And people who know you're trans will have a tendency to scrutinize your behavior closely, looking for evidence that you aren't "really a woman". It can be annoying and helpful at the same time. I find that if I think about things too much, I am stiff and unnatural. But when there's a glaring thing I am doing "wrong" I like to know about it so I can retrain myself.

My guy habits/interests were a cause of self-doubt until I learned the difference between gender identity and gender expression. My gender identity is firmly female, but my gender expression, while still on the female side of the range, is not on the pink frilly edge. Identity is about the relationship I have with my body, while expression is about my relationship with the world and society. I'm a practical, logical, mechanically inclined girl - but I'm a girl nonetheless.

[Super Amanda]

Funny how a persons small observation can mess with us. I was talking a month or two ago to a male friend about something that made me mad at the supermarket. I think I said something like "I felt like head-butting that *@$?#%!!!" He paused and said something like "I thought the hormones were supposed to make you less aggressive.."

I had a bit of self reflection to do for a few days after that. I kept wondering if my anger was gender driven, or just a reaction to a frustrating situation. Or do I subconsciously act "tougher" around my male friends for some reason? And if it is a subconscious thing, then my subconscious is a dude? Blech~ It makes a brain tired...

After a bit I realized that my life of trying to fit in with the boys is going to take, perhaps, an equal length of time to un-learn. It was a good exercise in the ongoing lesson of self acceptance for me.

Maybe I'll look at the occasional "mannish" reaction to something as the old me popping in to say "don't forget about me..." As miserable as "he" was, "he" had the courage to step aside and let "her" take over "our" existence....

[Kimberly Marie Kelly]

They have all shown me that it is a gradual process of unlearning the old mannerism's and letting my true self to be seen. I liked Amanda's reply it put it altogether for me. Thanks again to all of you. Kimberly Marie Kelly

[Kaitlyn Michele]

As miserable as "he" was, "he" had the courage to step aside and let "her" take over "our" existence....

Perfect.

..and now "she" has to keep up the courage so that "they" can be peaceful and contented..

[Anna the Dub]

I think that a lot of us have some typical male mannerisms and behaviour. After all, most of us tried very, very hard to fit in as much as possible when we were trying to be male. So much so, that a lot of the mannerisms we adopted have become second nature now, and any female mannerisms we may have had as a child will have to be relearned. I have asked myself some deep questions when I realise that I have acted in a very male way to something. But I just have to think about my emotions, my outlook, my desires, to know that I do not have the psyche of a male, and never will.

[Karan49]

Kimberly,
Women and girls not only come in all shapes and sizes but attitude as well. Women get angry as well and some get angry in very inappropriate ways. I recently read in Boulder CO that a young college student angry with her boyfriend taped a puppy to the side of a fridge with duct tape. This very creul act is not typical of most people and no one ever questioned her gender. Human beings get angry and do some horrible things and yes we should be ashamed when we do and hopefully we learn to be better next time in a similar situation. That is the lesson; we need not take it further and question all parts of our identity and in your particular case you became angry or whatever and hit something how is that masculine or feminine? Tell me you've never seen a woman hit another woman or a man or something. Heck, I've seen a woman spank a toddler in her frustration; not pretty, not feminine and I didn't like it one bit, but again I never questioned her gender.

I didn't like her behavior and I choose to not emulate it. I may become angry due to frustration or unfairness; how I exhibit the anger is important to me because I don't want to be trashy or beligerent. I would rather be kind, get beyond the anger and express the frustation and/or unfairness directly. I hope you can become the woman you want to be and realize all of humanity is a work in progress. Take good care of yourself.

Karen

[marie rose]

I copied the following from a transgender support group site.

How do I learn to act like others born into my preferred sex?

If you’re lucky, it will be automatic. Those who lived a gay or lesbian life before transition tend to blend into the new role very quickly and easily. It can be tougher for the so-called heterosexual transsexual. If you spent years living successfully as a male and now want to be accepted as female, you will have to undo the conditioned responses you learned to help you be accepted as a normal male.

Spend time watching how other people behave. Try practising what you see in the privacy of your own home. Later, practise in the company of supportive friends or a transgender support group. Don’t over-act — you’ll just draw attention to yourself.


I guess I must be lucky because it was clearly automatic with me. I
fought against my inner self for many decades and always presented as
as macho male type and my mannerisms were definitely male and
second nature to me. However when I eventually hit the wall and could no longer continue to live a lie and when I finally was able to
bring myself to accept that I was transgender everything changed
literally overnight. I went from macho male type to feminine female
and I can't explain how it happened except to say I finally gave myself
permission to be me. My wife was stunned at the transition and she
has told me several times that I am now more feminine than she. I
don't know about that but I do know that I do feel genuinely femine
all day, every day and if I have to present as a male it causes me much inner turmoil and stress and I have to concentrate like crazy to
do things that use to be second nature, i.e. present to the world as
a male person. BTW I never was gay although I guess now I could
say I'm a committed lesbian. Life is indeed strange.

[Byanca]

Dont think I have much male natural reactions. I've learned most of the male things. Like I remember at about 13 I found out I needed to learn to walk like a guy. I practised this over and over and observed others. I even adapted a slumping style forward. My mother even told me that if I was to keep up with this I would come to look like the hunchback of notredamus when I grew old. All these things I observed and adapted. The brakedown came when I was 22 and tried to have sexx with a pretty girl. It was all wrong. I tried it a few more times before I gave up. Nothing screwed with my head as much as that. So when I started to live like a girl these things was as easy to throw away as a pair of gloves and I found that I did not need to strain my consiousness with these matters. I've always been very passive, and people open doors for me, buy me drinks etc. So the male habbits have just been on the surface. I probably have way more then I am aware off, since I live very isolated, with hardly any contact with the outside world the last 10 years. Just basic stuff to stay alive.

My extroverted emotional side is not very feminine. I'm not anywhere as open as I would like to be. I dont like soap operaes, and gossip. Lots of these things. But I do like drama, but preferably with more substance.

I was told by a friend of mine later after a party when I was about 18 years old. I was to drunk to remember. But as fun he had taken a nightgown from one of the girls and put it on. I had then come past him,. Frowned and said, Rune, now you are not being much of a guy. He laughed his ass off, because of the way I had said it. Since everyone else thought it was funny. I was both perplexed and ashamed. But I guess I did not like that he made fun of it. But also reasons I quite have not figured out yet.

[Empress Lainie]

[SIZE=4]I have learned since my overnight transition that long before my transition some people thought I was very feminine.
I didn't even realize it.

I have found that living as a woman is natural to me in every way. Even my voice which I thought was terrible hasn't raised any eyebrows or questions.

Of course we aren't all the same and there is a tremendous spectrum of total male to total female behaviourisms.[/SIZE]