Crossdresser or Transvestite

[Sewing_Sophie]

Reasons for preferring "transvestite":

1) More of a UK thing
2) Eddie Izzard
3) Sounds more exciting
3a) Sort of implies that there's more to it than just the clothes somehow
4) You can make puns about "TV night"
5) A "trans-" word like transgendered, transsexual - it emphasises the connection with (other) trans people
5a) There are at least two jokes that start "what's the difference between a transvestite and a transsexual"
6) Apparently Magnus Hirschfeld, the person who first coined the term, was very nice about us when he wrote about us - or so it says in My Husband Betty
7) One of my friends came up with the word "cisvestite" for a person who doesn't crossdress, I was amused by that
8) Everything sounds better in Latin
9) Did I mention Eddie Izzard?

Reasons for preferring "crossdresser":

1) crossdressers.com
2) Seems to be a better search term for finding useful information, books, etc.
3) The mental image I get of a transvestite is far too Rocky Horror for my liking - crossdresser sounds more wholesome
4) You can make puns about CDs, none are as exciting as TV night though
5) It just says what you are without too many connotations

Sometimes I'm in the mood for one, sometimes I'm in the mood for the other, most of the time I'd rather just be me.

[Vicki-Z]

Myself, I don’t like labels at all.

On one hand we say how unfair it is to us that society wants to label people as 100 % male or 100% female and there is no room for us, then on the other hand we try to label ourselves. We are so concerned about whether we are transsexuals, crossdressers, transgender, transsexual, etc.

I say let’s just be us. Let’s forget worrying about labels and be the person we are inside. Lets live our lives and just be happy being us.


Vicki

We use labels in here so that others will know where we are in the spectrum. I think it's helpful in order that we understand the different mind sets or our fellow travelers. Other than that IMO labels are meaningless, and not worth giving any extra thought to. I have already wasted too much time addressing this

Kel

Hi Kelly how are you? Hope things are going well for you. I think you and I have basically the same thoughts on this topic.

I agree with you that labels are useful to know where we and others are on the spectrum and it helps us to understand where we each are in our walk. I should have mentioned this in my original post.

I just don't like seeing us being so serious about terminology because I feel we're behaving too much like society. I for one can't fully be fit into a label. I guess the closest label for me would be non-op transexual. Do I fit totally into that label no I don't.

Instead of worrying about what label I am I rather concentrate my energy on learning more about me and who I really am inside.


Vicki

[Rachel Morley]

I know I have a problem with the term tranny because there are a lot of trans people in broader community who see the term as an epithet.

That word, in the LGBT community, is viewed (and rightly so) as the gender equivilant of the N word in racial parlance.

This is what I thought too. "Tranny" I thought, was the TG community "taking back" a previously "unkind term" to describe themselves, just like African Americans have taken back the "n-word". But then again, I also heard that in some circles (mainly the US I believe) "tranny" is becoming short for "transgendered" not "transvestite" .... it's all very confusing, don't you think? Location has a factor too as I think transvestite is more socially acceptable in the UK and the rest of Europe, than in the US ... or so I'm lead to believe.

3) The mental image I get of a transvestite is far too Rocky Horror for my liking - crossdresser sounds more wholesome.

I agree, I don't know why, but when I think of the word transvestite I think of a sharp sexualized image akin to Rocky Horror type images, whereas crossdresser seems softer, nicer, and less threatening to me. I know, for myself I hate being called a transvestite. I can almost endure tranny if I tell myself it means transgendered but crossdresser is my preferred choice of description, given the choice.

[Sewing_Sophie]

"Tranny" I thought, was the TG community "taking back" a previously "unkind term" to describe themselves, just like African Americans have taken back the "n-word". But then again, I also heard that in some circles (mainly the US I believe) "tranny" is becoming short for "transgendered" not "transvestite" .... it's all very confusing, don't you think?

The ambiguity over "tranny" is, to me, a reason not to join in with the taking back - I'm not a TS, so it feels a bit wrong to take back a word that's often used to refer to them, even if it's often used to refer to us, too.

[RachelPortugal]

I did start to multi-quote on some points but soon realised my post would be very long. A few common points seem to have been addressed.

Labels - yes I too hate labels. We are all individuals.

US vs Europe - in the main, one term is favoured in different regions.

Media - don't they try to spoil everyones' fun.

"Tranny" - well I am showing my age here, because I thought it was an abbreviation for transistorised radio. How times change?

I am also a naturist, or am I a nudist - we have the same problems with labels in that community. The Germans use "free body culture" which does exactly what it says on the packet.

Rachael

[girlalex]

from the comments it appears that the difference between a crossdresser and a transvestite is different for everyone since most of us seem to associate the terms with how we personally view them based on our life experience. there are places where transvestite doesn't have the same meaning as a cross dresser and so we base our opinion upon how the term is viewed in our environment. but i personally think that well... if someone asks me then i guess my answer would be that im a crossdresser because im a transvestite. not because im an actor or a female impersonator or someone who likes to wear female clothing.

[Freddy12]

For me, crossdresser is the prefered term.

It describes what I like to do, and I feel that there are not the sexual connotations I think our society places on the term transvestite. It just sounds kinder and gentler. I guess that there's no really good reason for my feeling this way, but I do.

[Elizabeth 66]

I in my understanding, and doing some research, there is a small difference between a Cross-dresser and a Transvestite.

A Cross dresser is someone who dresses in the style of manner traditionally associated with the opposite sex.

A Transvestite is someone who dresses and acts in a style or manner traditionally associated with the opposite sex.

Just my

[zoe m]

"Transvestite" is just the Latin version of "crossdresser." Transvestite has as full a range of meanings as crossdresser, no it's not just the fetish image or the person who does it for sex. In Spanish-speaking countries "travesti" is the only word that exists, and it refers to all kinds of different people and communities whose only trait in common is that they habitually wear clothes of the opposite sex, either occasionally or permanently, for all kinds of reasons, though of course what general society most associates it with is sex or prostitution. I know some people are starting to use the English "crossdresser" but I think that's kinda silly.

The truth is, both terms are very negatively loaded, because society has a very bad perception of the whole thing. That's just the way it is. Neither term by itself is gonna save us, only what we do with them and how we are able to change society's perception of crossdressing.

That said, I personally feel that transvestite and crossdresser should be reserved for people who do it part-time, and transgender along with transsexual should be for people who do it full time or who intend to, and who want to switch over to and identify with the other gender (regardless of whether they have SRS, what matters is how you live your life). Those are two poles that are far apart from each other. Of course, then there are a whole range of people who fall on different points along the spectrum between those two poles.

[gigiluv]

I read PortiaHoney's reply, copied it and pasted it into my word processor. I will keep it forever. That is the most perfect description of why I do what I do. I am a woman that must go through this world with a penis.

Ok, I can do that. Thanks PortiaHoney

[tricia_uktv]

Ha-ha, read my last blog "The meaning of life". I'm just a t-girl so what do I know,

Hugs

[Rianna Humble]

I am also a naturist, or am I a nudist - we have the same problems with labels in that community.

A cross-dressing nudist? The mind boggles

[sherri52]

The term transvestite generally signifies that the person is gay and for many CD'ers we are not. Crossdressing means just that dressing in teh clothing of the opposite gender. Some may be gay, some straight, and others bisexual but nothing is writen in stone

[Michelia]

I've always said (half in jest) that a crossdresser is someone who wont admitt that they are a transvestite.

I like this. Tee hee.

[RachelPortugal]

A cross-dressing nudist? The mind boggles

Yes it may seem strange, but I do know one other cross-dressing nudist.

My preferences are:

1, No clothes (I wear sarongs to quickly cover up for unexpected visitors).
2, Femme clothes.
3, Drab clothes.

Rachael

[willowgurl]

I think of myself as a transvestite, and welcome all the connotations that go with that term, cause that's who I am.

[carolinoakland]

As part of the outreach presentations we cover definitions. Crossdressing is the term used to describe a typically ( but not always!) hetero male ( but not always!) who enjoys dressing the clothing of the opposite gender. A transvestite is the clinical term for a typically ( but not always!) hetero male ( but not always) who enjoys wearing the clothing of the opposite gender for the purpose of sexual stimulation.

The above prove's my statement about trying to describe the Transgender community.
" All poodles are dogs. But not all dogs are poodles."

And I to view the T word as the N word for the Transgender community.

Just my two cents.

[Annaliese2010]

Crossdresser: Umbrella (non-specific) generic term ~ anyone who crossdresses.

Simple CD (Transvestite): Wears opposite-gender clothes; no significant inward identification as the opposite gender; a man in woman's clothing, but acts behaves thinks feels like a man. The reasons for crossdressing are many and variable, ranging from innocent fun and thrill seeking to an overriding compulsion to do so, although other than the wearing of female clothing there is no significant need desire or tendancy to act, think or feel in a female manner. A simple CD may behave female while crossdressed, this is a conscious act, a conceit, or willful, controlled form of acting out for any number of reasons such as to heighten sexual pleasure. However such behavior is contrived. It is not 'natural' in the sense that it is for truly transgendered individuals i.e. the behavior does not seemlessly flow from a genuinely female center. The inner state of being remains definitively male, even though one may try to convince oneself otherwise for whatever reason(s).

Transgendered : Man who has a legitimate i.e. natural (not forced, faked or merely imagined) female indwelling to such an extent that he thinks feels and acts in ways that are definitively feminine - to one degree or another. A 1st degree (1°) transgendered individual has a < 50% female flavor to his natural character (typically Non-Op; no intention of sexual reassignment by surgical methods); someone who is transgendered to the 2nd degree (2°) (typically Non-Op or Pre-Op) has about 50 % female self-identification. Many from this category take the steps require to prepare for sexual reassignment by surgical methods or at least seriously consider it; many others however do not intend to go the surgical route; a 3rd degree (3°) transgendered (typically Pre-Op) have inside them a profoundly female subjective presence, one that is overriding in influence and well dominant over any male-like character that may or may not coexist; most of these individuals will undergo sexual reassignment by surgical means, or wish they were able to.

Transsexual : Post-Op transgendered individuals exhibit the greatest degree of femininity within and without.

[RachelPortugal]

Crossdresser: Umbrella (non-specific) generic term ~ anyone who crossdresses.

Simple CD (Transvestite): ..........

Thanks for these quite full definitions. I can understand the umbrella concept.

I, myself, fall into the first category Simple CD but the "simple" connotaion had other meanings in my language, in terms of lack of intelligence. So I think I prefer the bracketed term Transvestite.

I am a transvestite (TV). I am not simple and I am not a television either.

Rachael

[Chickhe]

I don't like being cast as either. What is do sometimes is wear women's clothing... it is not who I am, it is one thing I do. The word crossdressing describes what I do, but I am not a crossdresser. I also do woodworking and I am not a woodworker and I do welding, but I am not a welder. ...does that make sense?

[Elizabeth 66]

I don't know about this, from my knowledge and what i have read, in the definition of the two words, a cross-dresser is someone who just dresses in clothes that were intended for the opposite sex, and they are not trying to look or act like someone of that gender, a transvestite however also try's to look like a someone of the opposite sex and to act like one while they are dressed. that is my interpretation of what i have read,

However i feel that people should feel free to be what they want, and to dress and act however they feel they want to without labels or stigmas attached to them. But if someone feels more comfortable calling themselves cross-dresser than transvestite or visa versa, then why should we be bothered or even think that it is our business, that is the good thing about this site, we all get along together and don't judge.

That is my take on things, right or wrong it doesn't matter its just an opinion.

[Katesback]

If you read the definition of transgender you will find that CDs fall under the word.

I use transgender all the time since I work with a lot of trans people and I really dont care if they are cd, ts, or whatever. They are trans and that is all that counts.

Katie

[t-girlxsophie]

Like I have already said earlier in this Thread before I came on sites like this I always considered myself a Transvestite,never saw anything negative in that,now I am astounded how disgusted ppl are with the word "Transvestite",I think that it is over-reaction in the extreme.

Recently self confessed Transvestite Eddie Izzard completed an astounding 46 marathons in only 30 days,the subject of him being a TV was brought up positively on many occasions,To me this was a very positive step in peoples perceptions of the CD/TV Community,showing us in a positive light,Does the fact he labels himself as a Transvestite lessen his achievements in any way.Of course not.

And for goodness sake the T word does not equates with the N word,in no way,shape or form,thats just myworth

[Annaliese2010]

More than anything else, the ability to use words is what makes us different from any other animal in the world. To be able to represent (re-present) or assign a word to an object, a person, an event or experience is a very powerful thing indeed. It means you can re-experience that thing without it being immediately present. Merely thinking the word 'orange' can evoke its shape color size and maybe even make your mouth water. Without being anywhere near a real orange and even after much time has passed since you last saw held or ate an orange you are able to re-experience the thing that is an orange by virtue of your ability for symbolic thought. Or you can take a word which represents one thing and put it next to, opposite of, or in combination with other words that are the symbolic representations of other things. The symbolic representation of things is itself the very basis of thought and language. It's what allows us to reason, learn, have new ideas, gain insight, and understand the world, other people and ourselves as individuals. It is what advances our personal lives and our species as a whole. But words must have clear definitions before one can think reasonable thoughts. Thus the importance of word definition. Not every word has a single meaning, in fact the same word can mean widely divergent things depending on context. Also, the more complex the 'thing' the more difficult it is to label in an unambiguous way. Human behavior definitely falls into this category. If there is no one organization, scientific discipline, congressionally mandated law or other generally accepted authoritative source that defines specific terminology for these kinds of things, then they are used by different people to mean different things and misunderstanding and miscommunication can result.

When it comes to something so variable and complex as cross-genderism or crossdressing there probably isn't one word that can be used to categorically represent the entire community or any of its sub-sets because of the many variables present as they relate to 'how' and 'why'. The down side of words is that they are symbols and as such can never capture or describe that which they are supposed to represent. And when it comes to something so complex as crossdressing and transgendered people, no one word can adequately represent who and all the different ways why's and wherefores. Oddly enough, this is exactly why there is a more important need for accurately defined 'labels'. It is the only way to more fully understand ourselves individually and as members of a community that is itself diverse in so many ways with respect the people who comprise it, let alone how we relate to the greater surrounding mass of people who are by their constitution more homogeneous than different, and in whose midst we shall forever be an island paradise. Words that more clearly represent who you are, what you're like, your motives and reasons, and how you are alike and different from other crossdressers would only help in this regard. I tried to take a little baby step in that direction by the definitions suggested above.

Words are a powerful and convenient tool but they can never fully define or describe the thing they're supposed to represent no matter how simple that thing is, let alone something as complex as guys who are girls and vice verse. Lets face it, the exceptionally gendered are a very special lot. Words as symbols can only hint at that which they represent. They are sign-posts that point to the bigger reality. You cannot completely know anything just by describing it or studying it. You have to look at, smell, feel and taste an orange to really know it.

[RachelPortugal]

I don't like being cast as either. What I do sometimes is wear women's clothing... it is not who I am, it is one thing I do. The word crossdressing describes what I do, but I am not a crossdresser. I also do woodworking and I am not a woodworker and I do welding, but I am not a welder. ...does that make sense?

A good point. I, too, don't like be cast. we are after all indivduals.

Linguistically, there is no verb associated with the noun transvestite, one cannot "transvest". To say that one dresses in clothes of the opposite sex is longwinded so a literal definition of transvestite would give us the noun crossdresser (is it with or without a hyphen? - maybe that depends on your spellchecker). So out of that new noun was born a new verb - to crossdress.

Maybe transvestite has a more permanent or full-time sense, a way of life, but crossdressing can include it as a part-time habit or activity, a hobby even!

If I have to have a label, I still prefer transvestite to crossdresser.

Rachael