Image

[ReineD]

Ignoring the fact that the summary question basically boils down to, "How many of you are fools, or, have made fools of yourself..." I'll offer this response:

It was not my intention to call anyone here a fool. I've fallen for the "image" too a few times, and I don't consider myself to be foolish. We are all bombarded daily with the "ideal look". And perhaps using the term "service" was not accurate, since of course the retailers are in it for the bottom line and they aren't out to help us look our best.

I just wanted to raise an awareness. When I fall for a look on an online site or in a fashion magazine, I've learned to take into account the model's age and body proportions, and I do try to picture myself wearing the outfit in the places that I frequent on a daily basis. This has saved me from making some mistakes.

But still, out of weakness at the end of last summer, I bought a pair of those sexy, cagey gladiator type, modestly studded, 4 inch leather sandals on sale. I can't find anything in my closet to wear with them, and even if I bought such an outfit, I wouldn't be able to wear it in my day to day activities.

[AllieSF]

I for one do not fall for the exaggerated magazine looks. They have been there for more years than I have been around, which is a lot more than most here on this site. Those "looks" are seen in women's and men's fashions, automobiles ads , tools ads, and whatever else they sell in magazines, billboards and television. I don't think that the tgirls that may try to copy those looks are fooled by the sales pitches. I think that like the look, feel and internal opinion that they look good in what they wear. I also think that they truly do know how they "really" look, but enjoy it anyway. That is good. It goes with the saying "Dance like no one is watching you". I think that most here have their personalized vision of how they like to dress and what they actually look good in. I say dress like you want to, but do not expect everyone else to like it. When I look through the magazines, I am looking for what may look good on me, in my own opinion, and how to put together an interesting and attractive outfit for going out on the town. Yes, I am concerned what others may think, but I am also not afraid to break the "age appropriate" rule that so many here recommend. I also find that almost all the time I am OK and do not really dress inappropriately.

In summary, I think that most know exactly what they are doing in comparison to the real world. If they are happy, that is all anyone can ask.

[SandraAbsent]

I think this problem is not just with "us." Many GGs fall for this fashion model image dilemma too. Take a look around and see how often you see so many people just terribly dressed. Best example I can think of is me and a friend were at a bar one night, and the waitress had on a tank top with a gut and back fat hanging out the edges. How on earth could she think this looked good on her? If we dont already know, I think its so important to do your research on body type and face type to determine what will actually look good on you if your intention is to blend. Yes I like to wear a mini mini mini skirt, but the reality is I just don't have the body for it.

Example:
1. I am tall at 5'11" - I never never wear really short skirts or dresses because they make my body look out of wack. A mid length skirt or dress minimizes the height.

2. I tend to buy more a-lines because is flares out more and gives me more shape with out the pads.

3. I love heals, but I keep them on the shorter side for the same reason.

4. I have big feet (size 12w), Clearly wearing open toe shoes will accentuate this.

I could list a 1000 different ones, but what it comes to is that I would hate to spend money on something that just doesn't look right. I personally have spent hours reading to minimize my male appearance. Do yourselves a favor. before you buy that dress do your research. You will be so much happier if you focus on fashion thats right for your body rather that what looks good in a magazine or a mannequin.

[Sammy777]

I am concerned what others may think,
but I am also not afraid to break the "age appropriate" rule that so many here recommend.

I do not know how old you are.
But some here tend to:
push the limits,
bend the rule a bit,
bend it a lot,
Break it,
And there are those that completely shatter the "age appropriate rule"

I am not saying leave minis for those under 25, and skirts all together for those under 30, and anybody older then that should stick to "mom jeans" and pant suits.

But you at least have to agree there are members here that dress and go out in clothes way, wayyyyyyy out of their "age zone" and think it is perfectly ok.

I'm sorry but if you are old enough to carry an AARP card its time to hang up the micro minis, club wear, schoolgirl outfits, anything made of PVC, daisy dukes and shiney pantyhose.

You want to still wear it? Fine, its a free country, but please keep it at home.

And no matter how old you are, 19 or 91, if you are standing on a corner waiting for the light to cross the street and are mistaken for a hooker.............. then you're probably dressed like one.

[ReineD]

I think this problem is not just with "us." Many GGs fall for this fashion model image dilemma too. Take a look around and see how often you see so many people just terribly dressed. Best example I can think of is me and a friend were at a bar one night, and the waitress had on a tank top with a gut and back fat hanging out the edges. How on earth could she think this looked good on her?

Normally we don't encourage comments in this forum about how poorly other people dress (see the rules), but in this case, it is a part of the thread discussion and your point is well taken. I'd like to address it.

Sad to say that North American eating habits are not very good (not sure what they're like in other parts of the western world). Lots of fast food and soda, and not enough exercise. Obesity is a national issue. This is particularly apparent on campuses where I see the same thing. But I don't think these GGs are trying to make a fashion statement. I take it they are telling the world, "This is who I am in my natural state, take it or leave it. It's hot, so I'm wearing that tank top", which I think is a form of rebellion against the fashion industry and the Barbie Doll ideal. Guys overeat too, but they wear the baggier shorts and Tshirts so their love handles are better hidden.

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand I applaud these women for not caring if they don't conform to the ideal but on the other, I wish they would pay better attention to their health and also dress more modestly. Just as I'd rather not see a guy's butt crack when he's walking down the street. lol. But this discussion is not about them.

I address my comments to the CDs who do care a great deal how they look and who do want to appear to their best advantage when out dressed. Their motives are entirely different than the waitress in your example and so it might help to cultivate an awareness that the ideal presented in the fashion magazines do not always translate to a doable reality.

[Kathi Lake]

Normally we don't encourage comments in this forum about how poorly other people dress . . .

Sigh. True, and I do feel a bit badly about it, but I still stand with what I said - Image is important. It is not what we use to judge ourselves, but often plays a great deal in how others judge us. Is it unfortunate that people will judge based on appearance? Yes, but that is how we're wired and socialized to be. Rare is the person who can rise above it. Knowing that, remember to always put your best foot forwards, ladies and gentlemen. Does that mean that we are to always attempt to dress "vanilla" and blend into our surroundings? No. There is a time and a place for fantasy-wear, and maybe even PVC (I guess ). Is that time and place your local grocery store on a busy Friday afternoon? Maybe not.



Kathi

[SandraAbsent]

Ok bad example and I think I could have worded that differently. I think what I was really trying to express is how some people really care about their appearance, and some don't and it is noticeable. As a TG individual I go to many lengths to look good, regardless of whether I am dressed casual or "natural." I also recognize this is a choice I make and that some just want to wear what makes them feel good and not so much what anyone thinks. Truthfully this applies to myself while I am in male mode too. I am addicted to the mirror, within the confines of not making myself sick in the head or the body. I just try to be smart about what I wear en femme or drab.

I personally find the model image grossly irresponsible by the fashion industry. This is evident by all the emotional, mental, and physical/medical conditions it spawns. My last GF was 5'1" and 100 pounds soaking wet. She always complained she was fat despite the fact that she wore a size 0 or less in most occasions. I always though to myself what a shame it was that society and the fashion industry had her convinced that if she wasn't a tooth pick and wasn't always dressed to impress than she was not attractive.

I think it just takes some education to look good natural or dressed for a party despite your physical attributes. The one thing I love about womens clothes is that there are so many options depending on your body. Drab clothes don't have as many choices. So in conclusion, I agree with you in the "wear what you want" theory, but if you don't want to stick out like a soar thumb do your research and match your clothes to your body and age.

[Satrana]

For the most part I think CDs are not thinking about wearing outfits in public when they are buying. Either they exclusively stay home or they picture themselves in a nightclub setting. I think CDs who do venture out regularly will in fact seek out normal clothes to be passable. The issue probably arises when a stay-at-home CD finds an occasion to go out in public but has nothing routine to wear.

So for CDs I don't think it is really about falling for marketing images but more about just buying stuff that makes us feel good about our feminine image - and of course we all picture ourselves as a sexy 18 year old no matter what our age or size. For CDs it really is an impossible fantasy.

I have realized that 75% of my female wardrobe is not really a wardrobe at all. Rather it is a collection designed for private consumption and was never intended for public display(except in my dreams). It is only recently when I did begin to venture out more regularly that I began to buy clothes that really were part of a wearable wardrobe.

For GGs, clothes purchases are always intended to be worn publically whereas most CD purchases are usually more "costumes" to fulfill a gender desire.

[Vickie_CDTV]

The models, images etc. never influenced me, but I come at this from a somewhat different perspective than most. Like many others I like try to be like the woman I find most desirable, but what I find desirable was/is a bit different than most.

When I started dressing I decided to emulate the real women in my life whom I admired and loved. Some were really thin, some were really large, some older, some were gray haired, some were rather old fashioned etc., none were the "ideal" that is presented to us as a culture but I admired them so much I wanted to be like them. The phony baloney images of women on the cover of magazines and such and never had anything I admired and therefore I never had any desire to be like and emulate them.

[ReineD]

Satrana, I wondered if you were going to chime in!

To be honest, what sparked my thread was seeing pics and videos in the Gallery over time by CDs who were out in public. I agree with you that anything goes when it is comes to dressing at home. You should see some of the stuff I wear when here alone and it's hot.

And SandraAbsent, I know, at the other extreme it is sad to see how many people, predominately women, become bulimic or anorexic in order to conform to the ideal.

[PetiteDuality]

I'm a bit confused...

Many people complaint about the images imposed by fashion magazines about being unrealistic and pushing everybody into an impossible to achieve trend.

But in the other hand, I read people complaining about how poorly other people dress, obesity in America, etc.

It seems to me that most people is not falling under the influence of fashion magazines. A few do, and if it affects us, then we are falling to and it's our fault, not fashion industry fault.

I think that we should get hold responsible for our decisions. The magazines are there and have their market. We decide if we care about it or not.

I don't like the "victim stance", as if we don't have a chance to make choices.

[Satrana]

Reine

Another thing to keep in mind is that a GG is always herself so she is self-conscious of her appearance at all times. Whereas for a CD their feminine self is usually viewed as a temporary alter ego which has never been tuned to society's intricacies for female appearance. Basically a CD either is not overly aware of the issue or simply does not care. Occasions to be in public are usually to few to waste.

[ReineD]

Another thing to keep in mind is that a GG is always herself so she is self-conscious of her appearance at all times. Whereas for a CD their feminine self is usually viewed as a temporary alter ego which has never been tuned to society's intricacies for female appearance. Basically a CD either is not overly aware of the issue or simply does not care.

Good point, if they don't care. But what if they do, and they don't understand why people react negatively and it gets them discouraged or feeling depressed? If a CD wants to go out and be seen at her best advantage, as the beautiful woman that she feels she is, then it behooves her to learn society's criteria for a female appearance in different settings.

[Satrana]

Reine

I think the ones who do make regular ventures in public are the ones who make the effort to learn the rules over time. Those who only make intermittent appearances have less incentive to learn and so want society to accept them on their own terms. There is a fine tipping point between learning to wear an attuned wardrobe and wearing a private collection. This will depend upon the degree of transgenderedness and how seriously they want their feminine selves to be accepted and also the frequency of exposure since the unwritten rules can only be learned through experience.

Excluding full time TG/TS, there are not that many CDs who are that transgendered and have that level of opportunity to reach this goal. Hence your observation that many CDs in the gallery are doing things differently from GGs and so may encounter negativity (even if it is only expressed in thought).

I don't see this situation changing either because while toleration is common now, society still does not accept and so CDs will continue growing up forced into the closeted lifestyle which promotes this differing approach which in turn makes them strangers outside of society acceptance.

[charlotte_sp]

I'm a little conflicted on this issue.

On one hand, dressing inappropriately and/or badly is not conducive to promoting acceptance of cross-dressing in society.
I'm not saying that's fair, but that's the reality of it.

On the other hand, people should be allowed to dress how they want, badly or otherwise.
I really wouldn't feel right telling someone not to dress a certain way if they were set on it.

So my :

1. For those who aren't sure if something is appropriate, feel free to ask here. That's what this forum is for after all!

2. For those who just don't care, you have my support. But please bear in mind the way it reflects on the rest of us as a community.

[Kate Simmons]

I've never worried about trends or what those skinny models look like Reine. I'm of the opinion that with a positive self image a person can look good even wearing a burlap bag.

[Nicole Erin]

OH gyod all kinds of people break fashion rules. Not just with small things that could be "re-thought" but stuff that is horrific.

I know some 60+ CD's who dress like Shirley Temple.

Go to Family Dollar and on any given day you are bound to see some 300 pound woman wearing stretch pants and a shirt that doesn't cover her gut.

But with the mag fashions, the joke I like to make is - "You can look that good but you have to hold that exact pose while wearing it".

One must dress for their age AND figure. That is, if you plan on being seen in public. With "home enjoyment" outfits, anything goes but then no one but maybe a lover sees it.

Notice in the photo section, the threads that get many comments are the ones who truely pass, or if the person is presenting like a street walker.
Combine the two, and the comments could go close to 100, sometimes more.

I was talking to my sis about fashion mags and she said often times they are an exaggeration of what is in style, that one pretty much has to wait to see what actually hits the stores. I have seen a couple things in mags that just didn't translate well to reality.

You look thru my closet and it is pretty boring, however, it does fit my age and build.

Here is perhaps the biggest faux-pas - how come some CD/TS wear wigs that are too young? Yes, lady gaga looks good with a strawberry pink blonde wig, but not the average CD/TS who is aging.

[TGMarla]

The bad news is, as I am finding out more and more often lately, my prefered styles are somewhat dated and out of fashion.

Yeah, that about sums it up for me. LOL

[docrobbysherry]

I see an attractive look I LIKE, live, or in a TV/movie, or in a newspaper or mag,and I immediately want to copy it!
I have a collection of photos that I try to imitate!

Hooker, Barbie doll, model, whatever! That's the BEAUTY of being a closet CD, there R NO RULES or LIMITS!

On the OTHER HAND! When I went out dressed for my one and ONLY TIME at the SCC, how did I dress? MOSTLY, like a granny in dark, loose fitting outfits!

Making what SHOULD have been my happiest CD time ever, a sort of anticlimactic event! Kind of like drinking near beer at your 21st Bday party!

Last add:
Those pics of willowy, long necked, super thin models aught to be BANNED! They look so good, but drive me NUTS! No way to resemble THEM!

[tinalynn]

Neat thread...

I've been out quite a bit, but wouldn't consider myself to be someone who is constantly out. A few times a year, several days at a time... I've always tried to fit in, and feel more comfortable being out in late afternoon, early evening - when people are just leaving work. Since I prefer wearing more casual (maybe business type) clothes, it's easier to not be noticed. I'm not a club crawler, nor do I food shop in a dress! But I will walk around a mall or dept. store. While I have bought clothes from catalogs (we all have!), I purchase most items from Kohl's and/or Target, anymore. Its hard to go wrong in those stores, unless you get something too young (at least in my case). I can't pull off the cute dresses or high school aged skirts. And dear God I don't want to show abdomen!

I'm probably not always right in what I'm wearing or where I'm wearing it. But I'm not usually too far off, either. (You may have another opinion, idk... ??) I do wish, though, that more people wore age and body-type appropriate clothes - all of us! There's nothing that pulls attention so much as someone horribly dressed!

[DemonicDaughter]

[SIZE="3"]Reine, you might find this article quite interesting:

Bald is Beautiful

Despite my avatar, I'm actually quite bald with only some hair on top. I love it and have been completely bald (can't really shave it down completely though due to my skin condition)!

The author has quite a few articles regarding his life in photography and much of his blog is about the things magazines refuse to publish. Very interesting fellow. [/SIZE]