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Thread: "Ordinary" Guys Challenging Gender Stereotypes

  1. #1
    Silver Member Rhonda Jean's Avatar
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    "Ordinary" Guys Challenging Gender Stereotypes

    The Man-icures thread and another thread about not fitting into either the male or female category got me to thinking about this. I live at the buckle of the Bible belt, and I see it frequently. I'm not talking about (apparent) cd's, or even (apparent) gays. Just ordinary guys who have said, "To hell with convention, this is what I like!" Obviously, I could be seeing one of "us" in drab, but that's not the immediate impression. Most of us carry some angst about leaking the gender markers in our ordinary lives, yet some guys are able to do it without concern. Perhaps we could learn something from them.

    A few examples:

    I really won't count the Emo/Goth kids. They're not ordinary, although I do give them credit for finding a way to make femininity seem oddly masculine. I did see one otherwise ordinary looking and acting teen boy, out with a group of friends, who had long hot pink fingernails (appeared to be acrylics).

    A friend of a coworker stopped by for a visit at work. I sort of know him, but I'd only seen him in his ratty work clothes. This day he was wearing mid-thigh length shorts, had tanned hairless legs, a gold ankle bracelet, and clear polish on his toes. He is a manly guy, other than this. Married, full beard, rough talking, about 60 years old.

    I was in the waiting area at the beauty school fully enfemme when a guy came in. One of those guys who I thought would probably like to whip my ass for dressing like a girl. Messy longish hair, beard, dressed kind of like a lumberjack. I caught a glimpse of him later when I went to the restroom and he was sitting under the dryer with his hair in big curlers. I made another trip to the restroom later, mostly just to make sure I hadn't been mistaken, and the stylist was just beginning to take out his rollers.

    Also at the beauty school I saw a late teens or early 20's black male with his hair in curlers. His girlfriend or maybe his sister was standing at the chair with him. He got some kind of a chemical treatment. When they took his hair down he had these gorgeous smooth shiny spiral curls down below his shoulders.

    I used to see a couple at Sam's who looked like that Quaker couple in the photo. You know, the stoic old man in overalls with the pitchfork and his equally stoic wife, probably 80+ years old. Except this guy had hair nearly to his waist, always in a ponytail and in a single spiral curl. Hope I can do that when I'm his age.

    I've seen too many men with colored polish on their toes to count, but this one couple stands out. I saw them standing in line at WalMart. She was very plain. Hair in a bun, long dress, no makeup or earrings, no nailpolish. He was also very plain looking except he had fairly long nails, and on both his fingers and toes he wore red and blue alternating polish.

    I was at a fast food restraunt several years ago and saw a late 20's guy whith his wife and kids. He was wearing a mechanic's uniform an looked like he'd just come from work. He was wearing a cap, but I could see that his hair was in a french braid. When they were leaving, he picked up one of the kids and knocked his cap off revealing a very pretty french braid!

    I've seen 3 or 4 guys doing the "men's skirts" thing. More power to them, too!

    Anyone else?

  2. #2
    Swans have more fun! sandra-leigh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhonda Jean View Post
    A friend of a coworker stopped by for a visit at work. I sort of know him, but I'd only seen him in his ratty work clothes. This day he was wearing mid-thigh length shorts, had tanned hairless legs, a gold ankle bracelet, and clear polish on his toes.
    Gold ankle bracelet ? Isn't that the signal for being a "hot wife" ?

  3. #3
    Aspiring Member Freddy12's Avatar
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    I am really glad that you have so many examples of folks not following gender conventions. I certainly have not noticed this. I will try to be more observant!

    Freddy

  4. #4
    Silver Member Rhonda Jean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandra-leigh View Post
    Gold ankle bracelet ? Isn't that the signal for being a "hot wife" ?
    I didn't know that! And I used to wear one, back when I was kind of a "husband"!

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    Man, I must live at the edge of the known Universe as I have never seen any of that...

  6. #6
    Junior Member Roxanne_Alternate's Avatar
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    Over the years, the line between men and women started to disappear very very slightly.

    A few guys at my school wear nail polish and such as well. Then again, a lot of peeps at my school are goth/emo, but that's besides the point, IMO.

  7. #7
    the happy camper
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    Hurrah for the New Cavaliers

    The thing is, this stuff would've been par for the course as little as three hundred years ago. In those days, men wore wigs and makeup, and dressed in silk and satin. They were peacocks! I blame the Puritans for causing those styles to go out of fashion.

    Bad, bad Puritans...


  8. #8
    Girlygirl Tomboy Wannabee Toni_Lynn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhonda Jean View Post
    He was wearing a cap, but I could see that his hair was in a french braid. When they were leaving, he picked up one of the kids and knocked his cap off revealing a very pretty french braid!

    I've seen 3 or 4 guys doing the "men's skirts" thing. More power to them, too!

    Anyone else?
    While I'm far from ordinary and I am a CDer, in boy mode I challenge things regularly. My wife braids my hair quite regularly. As to the man-skirt, in boy-mode I've been wearing a kilt a lot lately and in fact just got a really great denim one. I actually own 5 kilts for all those 'boy mode' occasions.

    I guess they appeal to the ftm CDer that girl within is

    Huggles

    Toni-Lynn
    --I'm TN (transnationalist) - a Canadian born in an American's body! I stand on guard for thee!

  9. #9
    Member Ellen Ross's Avatar
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    Just yesterday watching CNN or MSNBC they did a story on man-icururs, men wearing guyliner and manscara, etc. There were about 6 or 7 different items listed, with all of them somehow incorporating the "man" (I don't remember the specifics). The story was about the increasing trend on men doing skin care and make-up. They showed examples such as Adam Lambert. The female commentator commented she had a distaste of any man doing any of these things. The male commentator said something like " I do one or two, but would never think about doing all of them", like suddenly he would be less of a "man". The whole thing pissed me off.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]I feel more complete and happier now than I ever thought possible

  10. #10
    A California Girl Rachel Morley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ellen Ross View Post
    The female commentator commented she had a distaste of any man doing any of these things.
    I know it's personal preference, and a lot of women like men to be "real men" but yeah, whenever I hear a woman saying she has a distaste for, or hates men who are doing things that are traditionally considered "girly" ... you know, like we're something smelly that's stuck to her shoe, it also pi$$es me off no end. She doesn't even know me .... I guess she doesn't want to either .... whatever!
    .
    The River City Gems - Northern California's largest and most active crossdressing & transgender support group!

  11. #11
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    Never see any of that in my little world, I'm sure its around, but I guess I dont see it, kind of a red neck area of the country.

  12. #12
    Member Dian077's Avatar
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    LMAO, I may be one of those guys you see .
    I finally did the same thing. I shave my legs and wear shorts on a reg basis. I have talked to a few people who have asked me why I shave, because they have no idea about the dressing and I have no desire to transition. I simply tell them.....I don't like hair on me. Just don't like it. I have noticed that I have seen others males that I have day to day contact with have started doing some of the same things. They either shave or trim very closely most of their visible body hair, and or take further steps of what could consider to be better personal hygiene, lol.
    Come one people, just because you turn wrenches on cars, does not mean you have to be nasty and dirty looking

  13. #13
    Accepting myself Tommie Rae's Avatar
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    I don't do the total body shaving thing because my wife likes my body hair. And yes she knows about my CDing. She is not thrilled with it but she accepts that it is part of who I am. However, we are also swingers. I know that doesn't sit well with some of you, but here is my point. A lot of the males in the "lifestyle" community are very open that they shave or wax their entire bodies, and their SOs prefer that any males they "play" with also be completely hair-free. These are guys that are hyper-masculine yet they are smoother than a lot of us CDers. So go figure. It takes all kinds to make a world.

  14. #14
    Aspiring Member goofus's Avatar
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    Wow, you must live in a more exciting part of the bible belt than me 'cause I almost never see that stuff...but then maybe I'm just not very observant :-D

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    My father works a very blue collar job working with his hands on machines and using all kinds of chemicals, at the end of the week he enjoys pampering his hands

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    I've seen some gender bending stuff. Not much though.

    I saw one guy with blue toenail polish. I saw another with black fingernail polish. I thought both were cool, and said as much to both of them. The latter became a friend for a few years before he moved away. Not a crossdresser or self identified as TG though. He was just doing it as sort of a protest against mainstream.

    I've seen many men in kilts, not at ren faires and the like (though of course I've seen them there too). I saw one guy in a man-skirt, almost a kilt but not. I saw one guy in shorts that were very billowy, slightly feminine, and very difficult to identify as shorts or a skirt. This was in a laundromat. It took a while for me to confirm he wasn't wearing a skirt. Goth mode.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandra-leigh View Post
    Gold ankle bracelet ? Isn't that the signal for being a "hot wife" ?
    Speaking from direct experience, no, it isn't. Maybe it was at one time, but not now. I've read about colored armbands having significance at conventions catering to that (think: Livestrong, but different colors), but not gold ankle bracelets. Same problems apply to that as apply to some signal for being a crossdresser (other than being en femme).

    Quote Originally Posted by Tommie Rae View Post
    However, we are also swingers. I know that doesn't sit well with some of you, but here is my point. A lot of the males in the "lifestyle" community are very open that they shave or wax their entire bodies, and their SOs prefer that any males they "play" with also be completely hair-free. These are guys that are hyper-masculine yet they are smoother than a lot of us CDers. So go figure. It takes all kinds to make a world.
    We are too, but around this region we've never seen a male with shaved legs at a party, though we've seen them in the regular world. We haven't yet gone to a party with me having shaved legs, but my wife (who knows and approves of my CDing) says "If the other couple is offended by you having shaved legs, they're not the kind of people we want to play with anyway".

  17. #17
    Swans have more fun! sandra-leigh's Avatar
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    Julie,
    Even now, Anklet refers to anklets worn on the right ankle as indicating "hotwife" or "cuckold's wife".


    But anyhow, didn't mean to derail the topic.

  18. #18
    Not sure where I am yet Jay Cee's Avatar
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    Haven't seen too much "girly" stuff being worn or displayed by guys. Shaved legs, the occasional toenail or fingernail polish, and occasionally an item of clothing that would only be seen in the women's wear section. I'd say that it is the 25 and under crowd that is most comfortable crossing the invisible boundaries set by society.

  19. #19
    Female Illusionist! docrobbysherry's Avatar
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    Consider yourself LUCKY, Rhonda Jean!

    Living in an area WITH individuals!

    Here in SoCal, EVERYONE looks alike!

    They ALL wear the same thing! Males and females! Jeans or shorts, T shirt, and flaps! All year around, the SAME THING!

    Some r fatter than others. Some have MORE tats than others. Some have more piercings than others. Some r older. IT'S SO BORING HERE because everyone LOOKS THE SAME!

    You're SO LUCKY living there!
    U can't keep doing the same things over and over and expect to enjoy life to the max. When u try new things, even if they r out of your comfort zone, u may experience new excitement and growth that u never expected.

    Challenge yourself and pursue your passions! When your life clock runs out, you'll have few or NO REGRETS!

  20. #20
    Gold Member NicoleScott's Avatar
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    Maybe I'm getting old, but I remember a time when no manly man worth his testosterone would be caught dead wearing diamond stud earrings.

  21. #21
    . Aprilrain's Avatar
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    i recently shaved my legs then a couple of days later i went on a climbing trip with my male climbing partner. Climbing is pretty much all we do together. Anyway day one i wore pants but roled up the cuffs so i could see my foot placements better. No comment. day two i wore long cutoff khakis. toward the end of the day he asks me if my legs are naturally hair free or if i shaved them. I told him that i shaved them because i'm weird like that and started climbing. His response was that he had also considered it as he thought it would be cooler in the summer time and then told me he trims his armpits very close. peoples attitudes about apperences are changing. I didn't feel the need to tell him my life story and left it at that.

  22. #22
    Silver Member Rhonda Jean's Avatar
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    Hmmm, Sherry, you're right, there is quite some contrast! I guess in SoCal one would stand out by not standing out. Is that kinda like saying "nobody goes there anymore because it's too crowded?"

    Nicole, I remeber that too! Now I won't wear diamond studs because they're too masculine! Besides, if I were only worth my testosterone I'd be pretty inexpensive.

  23. #23
    Member Nick2Nikki's Avatar
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    It's true that the gender lines are blurring on many fronts (something that I see as generally positive), including fashion. But then again, maybe some of these "ordinary guys" who wear nail polish or other feminine things are actually CD? I wear nail polish all the time, have no body hair, and always have my eyebrows plucked in a feminine arch, but I don't think that I really look like a crossdresser when I'm in drab (then again, what does a crossdresser look like?).

  24. #24
    One Perky Goth Gurl Pythos's Avatar
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    Why is it we need to put male prefixes in front of what really are gender neutral terms.

    Guyliner = Eyeliner
    Man-icure- manicure
    Man bag = hand bag
    Manscara = mascara

    Metro sexual = fashion freedomist

    WHAT THE HELL?

    Why these stupid moronic male centric terms? I don't wear "guyliner" I wear eyeliner. It is a style of make up that outLINES my EYES. My mascara MASKS an area around my eyes with defining colors.

    As far as that female presenter saying what she said about guys doing this. Women like her PISS the hell out of me. She should really read a little history and see that it has not been that long that her lightly made up face would be seen on the TV!!! Men did not allow women to be presenters.

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