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Thread: Shake hands, hug, or kiss?

  1. #1
    Complex Lolita...
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    Shake hands, hug, or kiss?

    [SIZE="2"]“You don’t get out much, do ya?” (A reply to one of my posts, c. 2009)

    Today is my birthday, and I have a special question, mainly for other MtF crossdressers on this site, but anyone may reply. I once asked one of my friends this very question, nestled among several pointed queries in a PM, but, for the life of me, I cannot remember what the response was. Please excuse my innocent curiosity, but I’ve always wanted to ask this - here goes:

    If you and I were to actually meet, would you shake my hand, hug me, or kiss me?

    Or none of the above, I mean if you knew it was me, and you and I were dressed for this fictitious encounter, i.e. one MtF crossdresser meeting another. Perhaps you would avoid me entirely, or maybe you would take the opportunity to slap my made-up face, getting back at me for all these overblown texts I spew forth. I understand, but I will be very glad to see (and meet) YOU – would you allow me to do any of the abovementioned gestures of affection? I should explain that this is NOT an attempt to find out how many people like me or dislike me, nor am I inferring that wearing women’s clothing somehow changes one’s approach to physical contact, leading us to do things that we, as males, might not normally think of doing. I assume there is no obligatory way that two women would greet each other, indeed I’m not qualified to make these kinds of assumptions, based as they are on incomplete observations – the older I get, the less I know, in other words. This is more about isolation, and a tacit acknowledgement of another person’s lonely struggles, finding that elusive needle of alternative-ness within a haystack of “normal,” unimaginative human beings...

    Perhaps you cannot contemplate meeting an abstract concept like Freddy, so just tell me how you would greet another crossdresser, one much like yourself. Many people on this board can answer this question quite easily, since you often get together for one reason or another, and it’s no big deal to meet and greet. In my case, I’ve never met another crossdresser in the flesh, yet I’ve been doing this for quite a long time now – it would be very moving for me to meet someone I know (or admire) from this site, or simply another CD, because it would verify the reality of what I (and we) do. The feeling of loneliness would soon evaporate, symbolizing the end of a long, torturous journey, and the beginning of another. After wandering for years, alone, through a desert of my own making, I finally get to meet another pilgrim – this would be a remarkable moment, so how do I express my feelings of relief and joy? I have no doubt about what I would do, but how would YOU respond?


    Let’s start with a hand shake – on the other hand (pun intended), let’s not. Males shake hands, and men gauge certain things from a handshake. My handshake is about average, meaning I don’t squeeze the life out another male’s hand to express my strength and resolve. Oddly enough, I encounter a lot of very gentle, wet noodle handshakes out in the world, even from males who wear a cloak of virility. Memorably, I once shook a woman’s hand, and she just held it out to be clasped thusly, with no return gesture forthcoming – this delicacy made an indelible impression on me at the time, but this is in no way indicative of ALL female handshakes. OK – you and I are dressed as women, actively emulating women, so how can we shake hands like males normally do? Shaking hands indicates agreement, and you and I agree resolutely, but will shaking hands stir up our delicate grip on femininity? Under these unusual circumstances, it goes without saying that high-fives or “fisting” will not be forthcoming. Chest-bumping is also out of the question, but only out of a healthy respect for our prosthetic undergarments...

    So, how about a hug? I don’t mean that quick clasp-and-release, nervous way that males “hug” each other – I mean a REAL hug, a tight hug, one where you crush the aforementioned breastforms gently together in a mutual display of affection. This is awkward, or is it? I mean, how long is she going to hold me like this? After a while it feels good, once you get past fear of the unknown and deal with the moment at hand. I’m thinking that, at this point, gender no longer becomes a point of reference – you and I are males, yet we are dressed as women, and we’re hugging each other. It gets confusing, but so what? We’re just two human beings, unconcerned with the implications of our crossdressing – I wonder if I might be monitoring the pressure of your hug for signs of repulsion or discomfort. Relax, it’s just a gesture, meant to put you at ease – I like you because I understand you, and I want you to know I care about you. We are linked in spirit, knowledge, and experience – that deserves a hug! BTW, no slapping on the back, please...

    Would you think about kissing me? I’ll tell you, I would kiss any member on this site if I met them, no matter what nook and cranny they occupied, especially my friends. I hope that notion doesn’t put you off! Let’s talk about practicality, MtF’ers – I mean, I don’t want to disturb your makeup, nor do I wish to impart an unwanted impression of my lips on your countenance, but something meaningful and profound needs to be done! Do we kiss each other on the cheek, or do we kiss on the lips? I’m thinking about my lipstick, as you are, but don’t hold back now – we may never have this opportunity again. I have no compunction about kissing another male-by-birth within the circumstances I have outlined, but, of course, we aren’t males if we identify as females, correct? Would females kiss each other in this manner, at a moment like this? This is a kiss with no strings attached, more like a token of love and confidence, a manifestation of peace, in the absence of any ill will, like males USED to do. The kiss can be profoundly light and gentle, indicative of friendship, or more forceful, indicative of fondness, but it’s NOT an “air kiss.” We are the courageous explorers of gender, so why succumb to “normal” modes of greeting at a time like this? Think continental thoughts and be at ease, my friend...

    Like I say, I’m not alluding to a notion that wearing women’s clothing necessarily changes the dynamic of things, meaning a masculine approach to human interaction, because I feel that is already in place regardless of our outward appearance. In this case, where one lonely MtF crossdresser meets another MtF crossdresser (who may be lonely or not), it’s more like finally meeting a member of a small, unseen, alternate, or “secret” society, made even smaller by the fact that I know some of your thoughts and you know some of mine, thanks to writing. Whether or not you agree with what I may submit from time to time is irrelevant – I recognize you as a sister, and I wish to express my gratitude that you exist in the world. A handshake is simply inadequate, a hug is not enough, but kissing may be the only way to efficiently express how one feels. Do you agree? I need to tell you that if you kiss me, I’ll be crying, so you may want to bring some tissues in your purse to help me stem the flood of emotion...

    I will be so very glad to meet you, and I hope you feel the same, but I’m under no illusions – perhaps you’ll avoid me altogether and do none of the above. I understand, but, if you’re a crossdresser, I love you, and there are only so many ways to express this heartfelt feeling. I know what you might be thinking – she’s gone too far this time! If this minute examination of a moment in time is too much for you, I apologize. I merely wish to state that, if I were given the chance, I would recognize another MtF crossdresser with genuine emotion, appreciative of his (or her) unquestionable courage. It all boils down to whether or not you feel your crossdressing is special, or what your level of appreciation for another CD’er may be. I assume that some people do not appreciate me at all, but cries of “Oh, brother” can be easily replaced with, “Oh, sister!” I much prefer the positive sound of the latter, and life is much too short for half-measures...

    So, will boys necessarily BE boys, under the circumstances? Please tell me about your experiences meeting other crossdressers, or what you might do if you met ME. It goes without saying that I live vicariously through my sisters, in a vacuum, just off the Interstate, and, no, I don’t get out much...
    [/SIZE]

  2. #2
    Waxing Therapist Mandy's Avatar
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    [SIZE="4"]These are my rules ; I prefer the hug, thats as far as it goes basicly btw xx[/SIZE]
    [SIZE="3"] Mandy xx[/SIZE] [SIZE="3"]Dont knock it, till youve tried it[/SIZE]
    [SIZE="3"]Qualified & Insured Waxing Therapist[/SIZE]

  3. #3
    Miss Conception Karren H's Avatar
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    Shake hands! I only hug peope I know well and I only kiss those I love..
    Current Obsession - Breasts and Lingerie!

    .......My Photos

  4. #4
    The Girl Next Door Sally24's Avatar
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    As I have greeted many fellow CDs, some from this forum, I will answer with my experience. Let me preface that even as a male, close friends and family will get hugs regardless of gender from me. I will generally hug CDs I meet. If they are cautious or timid I might go with the ARM or shoulder touch. Friends will get a good solid hug and possible a hair or ear kiss. Messing up her makeup or mine is quite a consideration after all. I only kiss my SO and my own children on the lips. I feel personally that it is too intimate a gesture to share casually.

    As to acting differently when dressed....... I find that along with appearing female other behaviors can change substantially. I have a close friend who is fairly quiet in male mode but very bubbly in girl mode. I know I am more comfortable with touching others while dressed. I am just more in touch with my body and dont feel self conscous.
    Sally

  5. #5
    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    For me it would be a big hug. After living so many years in South America, I love the touchy feely Latin cultures. If we met there I would also give you a light peck on the cheek.

    HAPPY BIRTHDAY TOOOOOOO YOU!

  6. #6
    Junior Member GMCD's Avatar
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    Happy Birthday

    Quote Originally Posted by AllieSF View Post
    I love the touchy feely Latin cultures.[/I][/B]
    I am Mexican. It's one of the "touchy feely Latin cultures." I also spend a lot of time in communities of faith where embraces of love and encouragement are also very common regardless of gender. Hugs are important to me, they symbolize acceptance and belonging, support and a willingness to be vulnerable.

    I feel a very close camaraderie with my fellow TG folks. I admire those who "live life to the fullest" and I want to be accepted by them as a companion on the journey even if I haven't accomplished what they have. I feel compassion for those who are still "weak and timid" and want to let them know that they are not by any means alone in this cold dark world that has shoved us into a corner. Everyone deserves to belong. Everyone deserves to feel wanted. Everyone deserves to have someone receive them as warm friends and to be made to feel a part of the family. Everyone deserves a hug.

    I think I like what Sally said about those who are cautious or timid, and I would definitely try to be aware and considerate of that. Although, in my experience, a TG who's coming out for the very first time is typically relieved to see another TG welcoming them rather than afraid of them, but people all have different comfort levels.

    Kissing is most definitely a more intimate act. There is a certain level of familiarity that develops over the course of a close relationship. I think everyone here is very cool, but I doubt there's anyone here I would give a kiss too the very first time we met. We haven't had any kind of relationship. But I would certainly give any and every one of you a warm loving hug and quite honestly, I would welcome any warm loving hugs you had to offer in return because I can always use them.

    As for whether these attitudes owe to any sense of gender, in my case they do not. I genuinely try to think that people are wonderful and beautiful and worthwhile (at least until they prove themselves otherwise, but that's a different story). Regardless of how I may look at any given moment, I hold the same essential views about others. I would be just as quick to embrace another person in any setting where we are receiving one another in camaraderie and friendship. In fact, I often feel heartbroken when I see a TG person out and about because I would love to go up to them and at least tell them they are loved and not alone and how proud I am to see them living life to the fullest but I know that it would probably just be all awkward and create terrible messes and that I should just smile and wish the best for them in my heart and move on. But, that's me, too much emotion in my heart to live like the other men.

    Just my silly two cents. Much love!
    “Crossdressing. Not Wrong. Crossdressing While Robbing a Bank. Wrong.” -Jessica Who

  7. #7
    the happy camper
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    As Sophie, I would react to how exuberant your greeting was. Do you look reserved when meeting someone for the first time? Then we'll just shake hands. If you're gushing, we'll hug.

    If I'm in male mode, then a first meeting just gets a hand shake. I have a few close male friends that I'll hug on occasion, but most guys would find it a bit weird to hug on a first meeting.

    As for kissing, that's usually reserved for wife and family. There are only a couple of GG friends I kiss, regardless of how I'm dressed. Both have seen me dressed.

  8. #8
    Aspiring Member Dawn cd's Avatar
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    Of course it depends on the history of the relationship. Is this someone I've corresponded with on the web, or it is someone I've accidentally encountered? If there is a history of familiarity, my impulse would be to kiss, but I would take my lead from the other person—not wanting to make her uncomfortable. I can see us exchanging a cheek press and shoulder hug.

    Dawn

  9. #9
    Silver Member kristinacd55's Avatar
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    First of all, Happy Birthday!! Second of all, as far as this goes when I greet my tg girlfriends it's always a nice big hug and usually a kiss on the cheek. It's always such a pleasure to be together!

  10. #10
    Gold Member DonnaT's Avatar
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    I've met a good number of online trans friends, and it's always been with a hug.

    If the other person reached out a hand to shake, then a shake it would be, as I would assume that is all they are comfortable with.

    I've been kissed on the cheek a couple of times, but it's not my thing.
    DonnaT

  11. #11
    eluuzion eluuzion's Avatar
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    Hey, I never pass up an opportunity to hug another human, especially females, I am a pretty tactile person.

    I am usually quite accurate when it comes to "reading" people. So I would use the greeting that seemed most comfortable. But a kiss...no, not at a first meeting...because that is how I got my ex wife pregnant. It had to be kissing, since I always used a condom...

    Happy Birthday!

    I baked you a cake and boxed it up. Then I just wrote "Freddy" on the outside of the box and left it at the post office. I hope you get it...

    oops...gotta' run...just noticed my pants are on fire!...

    I hope you have some friends to spank you tonight...


    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  12. #12
    Senior Age Member sissystephanie's Avatar
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    A Very Happy Birthday to You, Frederique!! And many more!!!

    If I know the person I will hug them, and if the person is a lady (even if really a CD) I will kiss her cheek!! Been doing that for more years than a lot of you have been alive!! And my dear late wife did not mind at all!! Shaking hands is a kind of standoffish way of saying hello!!
    Stephanie

    Lady on the outside, but man underneath!

  13. #13
    Platinum Member Eryn's Avatar
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    First order of business: Happy Birthday!

    Now, onto the question.

    How I am presenting would make a very big difference in the way I greet you.

    If I am presenting as a male, it would be a handshake, and the manner of the handshake would be different if I were meeting someone presenting as male or female. Males receive a straight-on, hands vertical, firm, but not crushing handshake lasting perhaps a second. I reach out to females with fingers bent so that she can delicately fold her fingers over mine while holding her palm downward. It would be more of a gentle grasp than a shake and would last a bit longer than the male version. I've occasionally done otherwise but it isn't comfortable for me.

    Now, there are exceptions. My hairdresser hugs everybody so naturally she receives a hug back from me. Other friends don't like to touch at all and that is OK too.

    If I am presenting as a female it would be more complex. In a business situation or in a situation where I don't know the person at all it would be handshakes. OTOH, if the person was known to me, and Frédérique you fall into this category, you would likely get a hug if I got a sense that is what you wanted. It's all in the body language and admittedly I'm not really an expert in that. The first encounter might be a bit awkward.

    A kiss? I don't think so, beyond the "air kiss" so popular among celebrities. Kisses are very personal, are potentially damaging to makeup, and at the moment are pretty much reserved for my spouse.

    After reading your posts here, Frédérique, I think that it would be fascinating to sit down and have a talk with you. Unfortunately, I'm half a continent away so I'll have to settle for what I have.

    Birthday Hugs, Eryn
    Last edited by Eryn; 06-08-2011 at 03:30 PM.
    Eryn
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  14. #14
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    I've only met one other cd face to face ( that I know of ). He is a member here. I'm going to use the word "he" when refering to this experience, because we were both in male mode when it happened. We met here on this site and began a friendship. Mostly because of our proximity to each other, and because of several other non cd interests that we share.
    I had been going back and forth on whether to meet or not, but I finally realised that I had to meet him. Afterall, we had soooo many things in common. I emailed him on a Sunday morning and told him where I would be, if he was still interested, and I gave him my cell number. While I was driving to the destination, my cell phone rang. I started sweating, my hands shaking, but I tried to be calm when I answered.
    I pulled into the parking lot and waited. Telling myself that I could not believe I was actually doing this. Outing myself to someone that I had only talked to online. After what seemed like an eternity, I saw him pull in. We both got out of our cars and walked toward each other. A handshake was the first thing we did, if I remember correctly. We walked and talked together for over an hour ( probably more like 2 hours ). Getting to know each other better, discussing our other similar interests, and finally discussing the real reason we were meeting. Our shared interests in cd'ing. It felt so liberating to open up to another human being about this part of me. I really felt good about the experience, and I think he did too.
    When we parted ways, I was ready for another handshake, but he opened his arms, and said " how about a man hug ". I wasn't prepared for that since hugging another man isnt something that I do on a regular basis. I shrugged my shoulders and said, sure why not.
    It was a quick guy type hug. Nothing out of the ordinary for two friends to do I suppose.
    Happy Birthday Frederique !
    Last edited by Heather Daniels; 06-08-2011 at 03:46 PM. Reason: added something

  15. #15
    The best of both worlds Kathi Lake's Avatar
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    For something relational, like how to greet someone, I go by the relationship. Our relationship? You would *definitely* get a hug - and not just because it's your birthday, but because you're you.

    Happy birthday, Freddo!!



    Kathi

  16. #16
    Member Christine1954's Avatar
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    I would have to go with Karren and Sophie. Hope you have a wonderful and Happy Birthday.
    Christine
    Happiness is not doing the things one likes to do, but liking the things one has to do.

  17. #17
    Member drushin703's Avatar
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    happy birthday first of all.

    here in Detroit, when a crossdresser encounters another crossdresser we always hug one another.you see, in this tg friendly city, there is
    an expectation of friendliness and ultimate respect in the cd community.personally when I see one I want an embrace and expect one in return.
    MY reasons are quite simple.I respect the journey, the sacrifice, the courage and the resolve that puts a person on this path of self fullfilment.
    so if I ever see you frederique, expect a big hug.....................a sincere hug...dana.

  18. #18
    Fab Karen Fab Karen's Avatar
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    Hug people I know, shake hands with others, though if offered hug by someone I wouldn't back away ( doesn't change by how I'm dressed ). I was raised in America, where kissing is considered more intimate ( unlike France for example where a peck on the cheek is common among friends ) so personally you'd have to be someone close to me for that. btw I'm not a member of a secret society.
    Last edited by Fab Karen; 06-08-2011 at 05:57 PM.
    [SIZE="3"]Gender is a state of mind[/SIZE]
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  19. #19
    Junior Member GMCD's Avatar
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    For a group of people who claims to want to enjoy life and live to the fullest, some folks seem a little standoffish.

    Would this be for cultural reasons (American's are very standoffish and often mean)? Or would this be because of our masculine upbringings (many many men tend to be stoic and standoffish by nature)? Or am I just a far more openly expressive person (and some of you are with me in being like this)?
    “Crossdressing. Not Wrong. Crossdressing While Robbing a Bank. Wrong.” -Jessica Who

  20. #20
    My name is Carol Julogden's Avatar
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    A big hug, stranger or not!
    My name is Carol.

  21. #21
    The best of both worlds Kathi Lake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMCD View Post
    . . . Americans are very standoffish and often mean
    Coming from your culture, it may seem that way, but mean? Really? We don't have the Latin disregard for personal space. Instead, we're much quieter and reserved. In our culture, we see not intruding into your personal space as more of a sign of respect than meanness.

    Kathi

  22. #22
    Girl Inside Jeanna's Avatar
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    Happy Birthday!
    I'm already taken so all I could give you is a hug

  23. #23
    Junior Member GMCD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathi Lake View Post
    Coming from your culture, it may seem that way, but mean? Really? We don't have the Latin disregard for personal space. Instead, we're much quieter and reserved. In our culture, we see not intruding into your personal space as more of a sign of respect than meanness.

    Kathi
    I don't mean meanness in that respect, I mean in just generally being disinterested in others. Americans are a very "me first" bunch and have little regard for the next person. (NOT ALL AMERICANS! I know! I know!) but in general.

    Also, I am latin of Mexican decent, but I was born and raised in the US, am a citizen, voter, and tax-payer, and a US Navy combat veteran.
    “Crossdressing. Not Wrong. Crossdressing While Robbing a Bank. Wrong.” -Jessica Who

  24. #24
    The Girl will Out! Kaz's Avatar
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    Happy Birthday Freddie! It is 00.21 here so it should still be today over there!

    If we are dressed and I knew it was you and vice versa I would consider you a friend/colleague and it would be a hug and kiss on the cheek!
    Kaz xx

    __________________________________________________ ____________

    This Woman Within is Flying without Wings

  25. #25
    The best of both worlds Kathi Lake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMCD View Post
    . . . and a US Navy combat veteran.
    My first response was, "Navy? Combat veteran? Isn't that mutually exclusive?"

    Kidding! I'm an Air Force puke here. The most combat we get is battling to see who can get their room service orders in first.

    And yes, I know what you mean about our relationship styles. From our families to our friends to other relationships, oftentimes the closeness just isn't there.

    Kathi

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