Does anyone have any experience with Premarian or any of its generic equivalence.
If so how did/do you feel about this drug, good, bad, indifferent?
I have come across some anecdotal evidence that it has a more complete feminizing effect because It contains many estrogens not just estradiol.
Is it even prescribed anymore? I seem to remember reading here or somewhere that doctors now shy away from it due to it being more dangerous for your overall health then other HRT drugs. But...as you mentioned, Premarin DOES contain more then Estradiol. I have also heard that using progesterone for 7 days a month helps in development in the breast area..dunno about anything else besides possibly giving someone PMS
aprillrain never heard of premarian woud like to know more about it ;
davina
Hi April,
My first doctor came very well reccomended and she had me on Premarin twice a day along with Medroxyprogesterone. She was old school in many ways and I actually left her a couple of months ago for Dr Moser who I love and the first thing he did was take me off of Premarin and put me on a fairly high dose of Estradiol 3 times a day. He explained that Premarin was potentially dangerous for girls of a certain age and it had a lot of estrogens in it that really didn't help us anyway.
I wasn't impressed with the feminizing effects of Premarin after 8 months. I almost feel like it was wasted time, but the doc says it worked okay.
I did not go the horse pee route. LOL
To david, Premarian is a drug that is obtained from pregnant mares urine which is loaded with many different forms of estrogen. Estradiol is the main female hormone that woman produce through out their lives but there are other forms, one is produced only during pregnancy estarin? I think, and then the main hormone after menopause is esterone. Premarian contains all that and more.
To Alicia my understanding is that PMS is the result of hormone levels changing specifically the ratio of estrogen to progesterone and that diet and exercise also play a role in how bad the symptoms are.
As far as mood swings go I had that before I started HRT the only real difference being instead of getting mad now I get sad and cry a lot more. : )
To Badtranny thanks for the info. What results if any did younhave after 8 months?
While doing an internet search of Premarian I came across this. I don't know how valid it is. You might want to check it out further though.
STOP PREMARIN
If you or someone you know take Premarin PLEASE read this!!!!
Special warnings about Premarin
For women who have not had a hysterectomy, the risk of endometrial and uterine cancer increases when estrogen-only drugs are used for a long time or taken in large doses. Estrogen therapy can also worsen endometriosis (uterine tissue growing outside the uterus). If you've ever had endometriosis, make sure the doctor is aware of it. If you've had a hysterectomy but still have residual endometriosis, your doctor may want you to use an estrogen/progesterone combination.
Certain studies have shown that women taking estrogen for prolonged periods of time (4 years or more) face an increased risk of breast cancer, and a study by the National Heart, Lung and Blood Institute (NHLBI) has confirmed an increased risk among women taking estrogen/progesterone combinations. Use combination products (and estrogen-only preparations, too) with special caution if you have a family history of breast cancer or have ever had an abnormal mammogram. Be sure to get an annual breast exam from your doctor, and do your own self-examination each month.
The NHLBI study also found an increased risk of dementia for women taking estrogen/progesterone combinations. It's unknown whether this applies to estrogen-only drugs.
Because Premarin can increase the risk of heart attack, stroke, blood clots, and certain estrogen-dependent cancers, contact your doctor right away if you notice any of the following:
Abdominal pain, tenderness, or swelling
Abnormal bleeding from the vagina
Breast lumps
Coughing up blood
Pain in your chest or calves
Severe headache, dizziness, or faintness
Sudden shortness of breath
Vision changes
Women who take Premarin after menopause are more likely to develop gallbladder disease.
Estrogens such as Premarin can cause hypercalcemia, a severe increase of calcium levels in the blood. Women with breast or bone cancer are especially at risk and should stop taking Premarin immediately if they develop hypercalcemia. In addition, women with the opposite problem—hypocalcemia, or a severe decrease of calcium in the blood—should use Premarin with caution.
Women who have not had a hysterectomy and take estrogen along with progesterone have a lower risk of precancerous endometrial changes. However, you should be aware that estrogen/progesterone combinations could increase "bad" LDL cholesterol and blood sugar levels as well as increase the risk of breast cancer.
There is a slight chance that estrogen therapy could cause an increase in blood pressure. Ask your doctor to check your blood pressure regularly.
If you have high levels of fat in your blood, specifically a high triglyceride level, conjugated estrogens such as Premarin are likely to cause side effects in the pancreas.
Use Premarin with caution if you have a history of liver problems, including jaundice. Call your doctor right away if you develop abdominal pain or yellowing of the skin.
Premarin can alter thyroid function. If you're taking thyroid medication, you may need your dosage adjusted.
Premarin can also cause fluid retention. Use the drug with caution if you have heart or kidney problems, or any other condition that's affected by excess fluid in the body.
Some studies have shown that using estrogen-only drugs, especially for 10 years or more, could increase the risk of ovarian cancer. It's unknown whether this also applies to estrogen/progesterone combinations. Another study showed that certain estrogen/progesterone combinations increased the risk of dementia (e.g., Alzheimer's disease).
Estrogens such as Premarin have been known to make certain conditions worse, including asthma, diabetes, epilepsy, migraine, porphyria (a genetic enzyme deficiency), lupus, and liver tumors.
If you are using Premarin vaginal cream, you should be aware that this product can weaken latex condoms, diaphragms, and cervical caps
Read more: http://www.drugs.com/pdr/premarin.html#ixzz0yu5kd7mH
About these studies...I'm not sure how many of us have ovaries or a uterus...
It figures that someone would pickout the obvious. Never mind that 58% or more of the US population has asthma, diabetes, epilepsy, migraine, porphyria, lupus, liver tumors. Or the fact that Premarin can increase the risk of heart attack, stroke, blood clots, and certain estrogen-dependent cancers.Originally Posted by Zenith
Well if it's so obvious why did you post it?
Breast cancer and blood clots have always been a given. Many of the other side effects are seen with medications in a small percentage of the population. The circulatory issues can be mitigated somewhat by compensating for the increase in blood pressure with lowering drugs such as Spriro or Lisinopril.
I'm not a proponent of any one HRT regimen, as there are too many variables in how an individual may react. But the applicable facts need to be weighed carefully.
Premarin is the old gold standard of HRT ( for either MTF's or GG's). Many doctors are now recommending estradiol valerate for various reasons. My endo said that one of main reasons for this is that women (or MTF's) on Premarin end up with a dis-balanced ratio of estrone to estradiol ( as measured in circulating blood ). Often on Premarin there is around a 2 to 1 ratio of those two. Normally, in a non-pregnant, pre-menopausal woman, this ratio would be the reverse of that. When on a regime of EV the ratio is normally closer to a natal female's. When a GG is post-menopausal, she will have more estrone than estradiol floating around. That ratio may in fact be part of what triggers menopause.
There are also some concerns with whether Premarin has bad side effects. Everyone who is considering, or is on HRT (for feminization) should read the basic write up from the WHI study. It can be found here:
http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/whi/
Note: I believe there is a generic version of Premarin now, but I do not think it is available in the USA.
Note 2: for those who want to read some chemistry about this issue, try this ref:
http://books.google.com/books?id=NHQ...0women&f=false
It deals with why Premarin was created, and why oral routes for ERT are generally troublesome.
Last edited by CharleneT; 06-14-2011 at 04:06 PM. Reason: added 2nd note
There is a road—no simple highway—between the dawn and the dark of night.
And if you go no one may follow. That path is for your steps alone.
The doctor I first spoke to about transitioning told me that I would have to take Premarin, but he also made sure
that I knew how it was made from pregnant mare's piss. This same doctor was telling me I was going to have to
move over 2500klms down to Brisbane to transition because there was no support services here in Cairns which I
later found out was not true. So much for what this doctor knows? Either that or he was trying to talk me out of
transitioning. LOL Anyway I mentioned this all to my endocrinologist at the Cairns Sexual Health Service, including
how I was told I would have to take Premarin & the doctor told me that Premarin was not a good medication & that
she would not be prescribing it to me. I trust her advice so I am not going to go anywhere near Premarin.
Wait a sec...from the text cited...
"In pre-menopausal women, the physiological ratio of estradiol to estrone is 2:1, but after oral administration of estradiol, this ratio shifts substantially in favor of higher circulating estrone levels..."
So with oral estradiol, estrone levels increase as well?
Is there data on how these estrone levels compare to those of MtF on Premarin? Is there a big difference?
I have no idea what effects hormones have on men but here is what it did for my wife for the last 39 years.
In 1973 my wife had a vagina Hysterectomy removing only her uterus but was put on HRT because her ovaries would no longer produce estrogen. Back then her doctor gave her a once a month shot of estrogen but I don't recall exactly what it was. I do remember telling her doctor who lived in our neighborhood once that she had really lost most of her sexual desire ( not he desire for intimacy but just for sex) and he said he could change her dosage and help that. Well that never happened but fast forward to around 1985 her doctor moved and her new doctor put her on Premerin. About the only changes she noticed for about the first year was a little mustache developing on her upper lip but in time that stopped. She cannot contribute any increase in her bust size to anything other than weight gain over time and whether the Premerin contributed to that more than her eating habits I cannot say. In 1995 because of scar tissue from another surgery they removed her left over overies but that did not effect her afterwards in any way.
Just in this last 6 months schangedged doctors again and her new female Doctor took her off Premerin and prescribed Estradiol 3 . I don't really know why but so far there has beabsolutelytly no difference in her from the Premerin that either of us can tell. Both have helped to keep her from ever suffering any sort of PMS and I suppose that was all it was ever intended to do for her
Julie,
If you are wondering if you can produce estrone without ovaries, then it might be possible since the ovaries
are not the only endocrine organ that produces this hormone. If you are taking Progesterone then Estrone
could be synthesised from derivatives of Progesterone & released into our bodies through our body fats.
From Wikipedia:
Estrone (E1, and also oestrone) is an estrogenic hormone secreted by the ovary as well as adipose tissue.
Estrone is synthesized via aromatase from androstenedione, a derivative of progesterone. The conversion consists of the de-methylation of C-19 and the aromaticity of the 'A' ring. This reaction is similar to the conversion of testosterone to estradiol.
Adipose tissue or body fat or just fat is loose connective tissue composed of adipocytes. It is technically composed of roughly only 80% fat; fat in its solitary state exists in the liver and muscles. Adipose tissue is derived from lipoblasts. Its main role is to store energy in the form of lipids, although it also cushions and insulates the body. Far from hormonally inert, adipose tissue has in recent years been recognized a major endocrine organ.
Yes, and that is part of the problem with oral estrogen !!!!! As for data on MtF, not too much, although I have seen a couple of studies. I've got to go to bed, but will try and search 'em out tomorrow.
There is a road—no simple highway—between the dawn and the dark of night.
And if you go no one may follow. That path is for your steps alone.
I just have to demonstrate my ignorance.
I know Premarin is made from pregnant horse urine.
Just how was this discovered? and How is it "harvested / collected"?
Lead me NOT into temptation
(I can find my own way)
I HAVE WALKED THAT MILE IN HER HEELS
CURTSY to all BOW to [SIZE="3"]NONE[/SIZE]
http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt...6284/event.png
This might give you some idea of how it was discovered. http://www.horsefund.org/premarin-timeline.php
This might give you some insight. as to how it is collected. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3995076/.../t/hrt-horses/
Yep, not many.
[SIGPIC]http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=82706&dateline=137762 0356[/SIGPIC]Linda
A doctor gave my wife a prescription for a Premarian cream for a dry vagina. She was to squirt some in every day or two. It didn't help her and she stopped using it. I used to rub a little on my breasts when I had a chance. It didn't help me either.
[SIGPIC]http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=82706&dateline=137762 0356[/SIGPIC]Linda
I have been on premarin for 5 years. I had a total hysterectomy in 1996 due to severe endimetriosis which was creating cysts. Initially, I used a hormone patch, but I constantly had problems with the patches irritating my skin or falling off. So for a first-hand report of a GG
I am a 53 year old woman, weighing 110 lbs, with 30% body fat, and my cholesterol is a little high but is more than compensated for by my good cholesterol. I have had severe migraines since I was pregnant with my son (21 years ago), and none of the hormones made them better or worse. I have no heart or other organ problems. My blood pressure stays pretty much at 117/68. No cancer (though I am also a long time smoker). It hasn't impacted my sex drive negatively or positively. So far, to my knowledge, I don't suffer from dementia. The only negative I experience is my spouse's estradiol is a lot less expensive than my premarin, for which there is no generic available.
There is a generic it must not be available in the USA. It is called Estrin and is much cheeper than Premarian. For instance 90 .625 mg Estrin tablets cost $27 and 84 .625 mg Premarian tablets cost $55. You do the math.
I used to purchase it on the black market when in college. It's alright. I kept myself on a low dosage, but still saw nice subtle effects including chest development.
Hello,
I was on Premarin for a couple of years then switched to injectables for the past 8 years.
I highly recommend Premarin for it's development capabilities but of course your mileage may vary.
Julia
The objection to premarin (not Premaran), may be aesthetic rather than medical.
I, for one, would never take a drug manufactured from PREnant MAres urINe.
It certainly was the drug of choice for many, many, years.
S
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