"Excuse me Miss... but you left the toilet seat up..."

[eluuzion]

Greetings Earthlings...

This question is geared toward those of you that use the women's restroom when you are "dressed" and out in public. (Particularly if you are in a state that does not have specific bathroom gender laws/ordinances.) Anybody currently living "in a closet" or currently "out" enjoying the cough, cough, "free" world is welcome to reply,

This is not intended to be an invitation to start a civil rights debate, rehash legal statutes, or whine about the societal & prejudicial inequities of life as a CD,

I am simply curious to hear some genuine strategies that you would implement to resolve the following public restroom crisis. Common sense suggests to me that routinely using the women's restroom will at some point in your future; turn this hypothetical example into a real life consequence requiring immediate damage control, lol. Let’s begin...

You enter the women's restroom of a public place, dressed in feminine appearance. At some point during your visit, a stall door opens and out walks a GG...or just to make it more interesting ...a young underage girl. When she sees you and determines that you are a male dressed in female clothing, she becomes frightened and proceeds to start screaming in fear. This will surely attract anyone within ear shot to come running to investigate.

How would you handle this situation?

* Remember this hypothetical situation is a real life "scenario", not one on the internet where an imaginary friend or the "gender fairy" can rescue you.

Here is my personal answer...

"Just because you have the "right" to do something, doesn't mean it is the right thing to do." (Or the safest option).
Until I come up with a game plan that confidently convinces me that I have eliminated any potential for encountering this type of nightmare, I will continue to stick with the "pee cup" technique...or take my chances in the men's room.

How about you?

[LeannL]

Having done my business in the women's room many, many times, this has never happened to me nor have I gotten any stares except for one time. If it happened to me, I would quickly turn and leave.

The one time I had a problem was in Ireland at a Thai restaurant. I was dressed as a guy as I was there on work. I went into the bathroom, did my duty and when I walked out, a woman and her daughter walked in. They sort of freaked out a bit. What had happened was that the men's room was around the corner and the ladies' room had the door open so far that I couldn't see the sign. So when I saw the stalls, I just went in.

Leann

[Nicole Erin]

Wow, that is kind of a doozey of a situation.
I guess the best way to handle that - one, do not just hang out in there. get in, do business and leave.
I guess then the best thing to do AFTER the fact would just be to say you accidently went into the wrong restroom or something.

But gyod, the way this scenario sounds, I can see the headlines on it -
"Move over, State Fair collapsed stage, something more interesting happened".

Yes I know it is some big tragedy or whatever but gyod, it is all the news talks about.

[sissystephanie]

In years past I did use the ladies room when I was Stephanie. That was when my late wife really made me be passable! Now I use the mens room no matter how I am dressed, since I am definitely not passable! And I never leave the toilet seat up!!

[Jessica Jameson]

I'd probably start screaming back, but only because I like to stir stuff up a little.

[NV Susan]

[SIZE="4"]I also have used the ladies room when out en femme and never had this problem. Had this ever happened to me I guess as Leann said, I would just leave. Now with more places putting in "family" restrooms I use them when needed and it eliminates any such encounters.
[/SIZE]

[jenniferj]

I have (as jj) used the ladies' room in many venues (theaters, opera, department stores, restaurants, highway service areas) in the Northeast (US) and never had an issue. In many cases this involved standing politely in line with the other ladies while waiting my turn. If anybody notices me (how could they not?), I offer a small smile. Several times, a woman has started a conversation, which I happily joined - mostly about how much she likes my dress or my shoes or my hair (which is real, a little longer than shoulder length when not pinned up, gray, and definitely thinning )

Once , as I was leaving the restroom at Lincoln Center wearing a rose colored, silk gown with a low cut back, a lady touched my shoulder (bare) and stopped me. "Wait", she said. "Let me fix this". She then proceeded to grab the band of my strapless bra, and tugged it down so that it was covered by the dress. "Such a pretty dress" she said. "I love the color". I said, "Thank you - I do too."

But to answer the question, my reaction would probably depend on how much I needed to pee-pee. If I could wait, I would probably just turn and walk away - if I couldn't, I would say "excuse me please", go in, close the door, and do my business. And probably cry.

-jj

[Tammy V]

Honey, if you are en femme and using the ladies room why in the world are you doing doing your business standing up??? The seat should never have been lifted in the first place.

[Cynthia Anne]

I guess I would jump in the stool and flush it! Really I have no clue as to what I would do! This bothers me every time I visit the ladies room!

[Tara D. Rose]

I agree tammy, hey would the seat be rasied up to start with. My wife has never complainded to me about the toilet seat up, never.

[Joanna Maguire]

I have never had any trouble going to the ladies toilet. I always sit down. GGs could see a male standing underneath the stall. Strangely at College the ladies is far from my class. So GGs in a hurry often use the nearby mens toilet.
The ladies powder rooms at The Sydney opera house are wonderful Crowded and a line up between acts. No problem for me in evening dress. The wash room has mirrors the length of the room over the basins Room is about 40 foot long ? On the back wall the mirrors are full length. The best place I have been for admiring oneself and fix your hair and make up.

[Jenny Doolittle]

I cant say I am 100% passable but to let you all know maybe society is changing I will tell you what happened last week.

I was out shopping after lunch and had to pee. I was in a Hobby Lobby and rounded the corner to the restrooms and there was the Left to the mens, or right to the ladies.... there was a young mother with a maybe pre-teen daughter standing outside the restroom and I looked at the mens and then stopped like "Opps, wrong room" The young woman smiled at me and said, "Oh, it is ok we are just waiting for a friend, there are two stalls" and motioned that I could go in front of them.

I was pleased to be treated like any other girl.

[Stephenie S]

Greetings Earthlings...

This question is geared toward those of you that use the women's restroom when you are "dressed" and out in public. (Particularly if you are in a state that does not have specific bathroom gender laws/ordinances.) Anybody currently living "in a closet" or currently "out" enjoying the cough, cough, "free" world is welcome to reply,

This is not intended to be an invitation to start a civil rights debate, rehash legal statutes, or whine about the societal & prejudicial inequities of life as a CD,

I am simply curious to hear some genuine strategies that you would implement to resolve the following public restroom crisis. Common sense suggests to me that routinely using the women's restroom will at some point in your future; turn this hypothetical example into a real life consequence requiring immediate damage control, lol. Let’s begin...

You enter the women's restroom of a public place, dressed in feminine appearance. At some point during your visit, a stall door opens and out walks a GG...or just to make it more interesting ...a young underage girl. When she sees you and determines that you are a male dressed in female clothing, she becomes frightened and proceeds to start screaming in fear. This will surely attract anyone within ear shot to come running to investigate.

How would you handle this situation?

* Remember this hypothetical situation is a real life "scenario", not one on the internet where an imaginary friend or the "gender fairy" can rescue you.

Here is my personal answer...

"Just because you have the "right" to do something, doesn't mean it is the right thing to do." (Or the safest option).
Until I come up with a game plan that confidently convinces me that I have eliminated any potential for encountering this type of nightmare, I will continue to stick with the "pee cup" technique...or take my chances in the men's room.

How about you?

So. Your "hypothetical" scenario is highly unlikely. A screaming kid in a women's room? Perhaps. But not from seeing you, I think. Are you in male clothing? Why would she scream?

Remember, women rarely go to the "lady's" alone. Kids almost ALWAYS go in with their mothers.

Run your scenario again please. You are out. Shopping? At the post office? Bank? Wherever. You are "dressed"?. I assume in women's clothes, presenting as a woman. No-one has screamed yet, right? Now you enter a lady's room to pee. You go in. Enter a stall. Line the seat with toilet paper, pick up your skirt, lower your panties, and sit. Pee. Wipe. Adjust your clothes. Check for TP stuck in your skirt. Flush. Exit the stall. Walk to the sink. Wash. Boring, right?

OK, now it gets interesting. Enter, in your example, a small child who takes one look at you and starts to scream. Why? Whatever for? You say because she "reads" you as a man in a dress and is afraid. Of what? And why is she screaming? Why has no one else screamed the whole time you have been "out". Why hasn't anyone else screamed at you today? Are you only scary when you are in a lady's room? Why?

Women and girls are taught to leave the room if they are worried about anyone in the lady's room. My mother taught me. I taught my daughters. Standing in the middle of the lady's room screaming is a really silly and unprductive behavior. Is it a small child? Why is she in the lady's room by herself? Maybe it's a teenager. She's gonna laugh, not scream. But she's gonna leave pretty darn quick. And a grown woman will leave too. PDQ.

So should you. Pee, wash, check your face and hair, and then leave. Don't forget to smile broadly at anyone else in the room. Women smile at each other.

Have guys had difficulty with the authorities when using the lady's room? Oh yes. And sometimes this can be a real bother. Only quite recently a TG woman was asaulted in a McDonald's in Maryland. If you can't "pass", maybe you should not use the lady's. But that leaves us with the uncomfortable situation of what to do when ya gotta go. And at some point you WILL have to go.

If you are not a woman but you need to use the women's toilet facilities, you need to have some internal authority of your own. If you don't OWN your female identity, you risk this problem. What to do? I don't really have an answer.

But I do know that your original sceanario is highly unlikely. In a lifetime of using public facilities I have never run across such a situation. And I really think it too "constructed" to be something to worry about much. You could get hit by a bus, but that's not a good reason to stay home.

Stephie

[Loni]

not sure what i would do...hope i never have to find out.

but when possible i try and use the one at a time places, or family room.

[Kaitlyn26]

My answer. I move to a larger town that has paved roads and the children aren't eating paint chips. Just a thought.

I also avoid public restrooms in general so.....not really a problem there.

not sure what i would do...hope i never have to find out.

but when possible i try and use the one at a time places, or family room.

Ditto. I also will only use a "one at a time" public bathroom. I can't stand others near me when I'm using the bathroom. I feel it's a private thing and it makes me nervous.

[Stephenie S]

My answer. I move to a larger town that has paved roads and the children aren't eating paint chips. Just a thought.

My thoughts exactly.

S

[suchacutie]

As uncomfortable as your scenario may be, it has a small probability of happening (especially since, as has been pointed out, there is an even smaller chance that the young woman would be alone). But, using the men's room has an immensely higher probability of generating an issue, so don't see the men's room as a viable option at all when presenting en femme. The easiest option is the mixed-gender (one person at a time) bathroom until enough confidence and experience has been built up being in public en femme. With some experience under one's "belt", this scenario becomes a vanishingly small possibility.

tina

[Chickhe]

I think your idea is out of the movies or you are paranoid, but anyways... If it happened the best thing to do would be to carry on with your plan. Do your business, wash up quickly and leave. If you get questioned, you just explain some crazy kid was screaming on her way out of the bathroom. Besides, I think the kid would be more likely to laugh and the ignorant mother screams...but, basically, I think you should carry on doing what you went in there for and ignore them. If you run away too, you would probably have a hard time to convince someone you were not doing something wrong.

Once when I was young at a university halloween party dressed I used the mens washroom urinal (i had been drinking a lot too) and I must have been passing until then because the reaction I got in the mens room varied between laughter, shock, confusion.... would have been much better to use the womans probably, but then again at that time the attention was a lot of fun.

[eluuzion]

I guess I created a confusing scenario for everyone. Saweey' bout' dat'.

Apparently, this is another one of those examples of how bringing up safety concerns makes people think I am being paranoid (fear about a "non-existent" threat). I am in the "security" business, so I like to do these drills ("polls"). It helps me get a realistic picture of how "safe" people think they are in various areas. The responses are always enlightening.

I was simply trying to bring up a point about the risks involved in choosing to use the ladies room. The reply consensus opinion indicates that most do not see any risk to the point of suggesting it is a foolish, non-existent concern.

I respect other peoples' perspectives and opinions even when they differ from my own. Perception is reality, always unique upon an individual basis.

Thanks for replying...

Females almost kill a CD for using MacDonald's ladies room (vid clip)
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ec0_1303444048

TG is barred from hotel for life for using women's restroom.
http://www.hotelchatter.com/story/20...ng_Transgender

Crossdresser arrested for trespassing when he entered women/s restroom (Japan)
http://www.japantoday.com/category/c...in-ladies-room

Man in Women's restroom traumatizes Maryland Woman
http://www.notmyshower.com/JoansTestimony031009A.pdf

Several news reports of CDs in women's restroom, locker room.
http://www.asmainegoes.com/content/t...athroom?page=4

[Michelle.M]

My answer. I move to a larger town that has paved roads and the children aren't eating paint chips. Just a thought.

Oh, that is priceless! I'll be using that one a lot.

Bur seriously, my questions are these -

Do YOU believe you have a basic right to be treated with dignity and respect?

Do YOU think it's a plain old everyday thing just to be able to use a public restroom just like everyone else without drawing heat?

If you do, then it's those who would deny you these privileges who are wrong, and they need to be made aware of that. Don't let them put YOU on the defensive, make THEM defend THEIR actions.

[Sally24]

I'm not sure how I would handle your scenario as I've never even had qn odd look thrown my way in the ladies room. Probably a strategic retreat would be in order.

I did have something happen one time though. I was in a mqll ladies room and I could hear a young girl (15-18) crying in one of the stalls. My maternal instincts wanted to offer assistance. My instinct for self preservation wouldn't allow me to do anything but leave quietly. Sometimes it sucks to not be a FAB!

[AllieSF]

Depending on how I felt at the moment and how young the girl was, the venue I was at, I may continue my "business" or maybe just leave the room and look for the nearest waiter or employee to explain what has happened, return to my seat and wait and see what happens next. I would not run away since that would only make matters worse insinuating that I had done something wrong. I have never run into that situation and always use the woman's restroom when out dressed. I have had the same experiences as others talking to the nearby women in line waiting for an open stall. One time at a theater I did have a younger pre-teen or teen girl with her mother take the two stalls on either side of me. They saw me go in and saw me washing my hands before I left. No problems.

Eluuzion, I appreciate your interest to see what happens and what are others' opinions. However, your list of links to problems encountered can easily be interpreted as a scare tactic to warn us not to use women's restrooms. You readily admit that you fear that encounter and therefore do not use women's restrooms. That is fine by me and I understand your decision. But just like walking out of the house the first time dressed, using a women's restroom for the first time or the hundredth time takes self confidence and some courage. When those feared things never happen, your confidence and courage goes up. If they happen, you can deal with it as an confident adult who has the right to use that restroom, assuming you are in a locale where it is legal. If you are afraid of dieing in an airplane crash or car wreck, by all means do not get on a plane or in a car. Or, just treat it as a normal life risk, mitigate that risk as much as possible and get on with life.

[Emma England]

Are you an author? I ask this because you have good imagination for a scenario that doesn't happen in real life.

[eluuzion]

I "assume"...

Wow Stephie,
I do not have a clue how to respond to that interesting reply. It reads like you were having a conversation with me, where your "assumptions" represent my part of the conversation. You made "assumptions", enriched those "assumptions" by adding your own details, and then analyzed your "assumptive" and enhanced scenario as if it was something I presented. (Implying it was a correct interpretation of my thoughts.This was not the case).

I feel I presented sufficient information to generate the basic replies I was looking for. Others easily provided their version of a strategy...or a humorously sarcastic interpretation (which I enjoy).

It was a two-minute scenario, not a mystery novel.
Maybe there was a mom outside the door waiting. Maybe the ladies room was at a park, or on Saturn. Maybe there was a monster standing behind the CD. Maybe the CD was not passable and looked scary...maybe Sadaam was really hiding WMDs. Maybe the girl hit her ankle on the door post when she opened the door. Or maybe the CD's SO set it all up to frame him and get custody of their six children, which is impossible because everybody knows the CD was sterile and owns a pink Cadillac. Plus we have never known anybody that would do that to their SO, so it "never happens". Maybe it was a Sunday and the doors are locked on Sundays, so the whole scenario is "impossible".

Maybe the "toilet seat" comment in my header was not intended to relate to the scenario I posted. Maybe it was just an attempt to make a humorous comment to attract attention to the post, which I did not realize would be construed to be an integral part of the scenario. But people did, although I never referenced it directly in my scenario. Maybe I realized how confusing that might be, only after a few replies were posted.

AllieSF...

Maybe you could "assume" I posted those links as a "scare tactic" because my goal in life is to scare people and tell them what they should or should not be doing with their own lives. Maybe we can assume "I readily admitted that I fear that encounter"...(although those are your words, certainly not true and I never made that statement).

You can also "assume" I am so paranoid that I employ the "avoidance method" of dealing with the challenges of life? (This actually has never applied to any aspect of my life).

Or...Emma...

Maybe your carefully constructed "question" asking if I am an author is relevant. Maybe I displayed a "good imagination" when suggesting risk is involved when you can "factually state" that this type of scenario "doesn't happen in real life".

You can also "assume" that all of the various times on the newscasts, when we see an interview of a victim of crisis or tragedy...and one of the first things typical said is..."I never imagined something like this could happen, and certainly not to me" is irrelevant. You can simply "assume" that if you are not aware of any examples of a particular event occurring...then it "doesn't happen in real life".

OR...in summary to all I addressed here...

Maybe "assumption" is not the only option when replying to a post. Another option might be requesting clarification from the OP. Maybe that would have allowed me an opportunity to correct some "innocent" misinterpretations and "assumptions".

Maybe...
I don't have any personal agendas or aspirations to tell people what they "should/should not" do. I do not relate to that forum-favorite term "Fear" as being the innate and absolute measuring tool of motivation behind all actions. I fear very few things in life and certainly never let emotions dictate decisions I make.

Literally every decision I make is based upon generating options and calculating percentages relating to risk/reward and potential for success. Using the ladies room example, my goal is to relieve myself by picking the strategy/action that will provide the greatest chance of realizing my goal (peeing), with the least amount of potential risk involved. If entering the ladies room was the best option, I would take it. If peeing in a cup in some secluded area was best, I would choose that. It has nothing to do with "Fear". It has everything to do with logical and efficient decision making. There may be an 85% chance of peeing in the cup with no incidents, and 50% change of using the ladies room without incident. So I pee in the cup.

In retrospect, I might have just asked if anyone felt there were potential risks involved with using the ladies room.

Instead, I opted to toss out a hypothetical scenario. My only point to this thread was to suggest that certain circumstances carry risk potential, whether something actually happens or not. I am not scared of anything, lobbying for a cause nor want to be your parent. I posted the links in response to the implication that there is no risk involved in entering the ladies room. I happen to disagree and offered evidence to support my claim. I could care less what you decide to do. Life is too short.

I don't apologize for posting what I posted. I enjoy hearing opinions and respect your right to express them. A professional "author" or "writer" could surely have constructed a "better" post. Asking for clarification instead of assuming would have also been a constructive approach. But, hey, where is the fun in that for you? Hehehhee.

I had to decide whether it was worth the effort to post this reply, or just blow it off.

There is probably a...
-90% probability nobody will read this anyway, aside from scanning for punctuation errors
-80% probability nobody cares anyway, individual objectives were accomplished
-80%+ probability nobody grasped my points, intentions.
-90%+ probability a moderator will delete it, lol
-95% chance everybody will take everything I post seriously
-100% probability I won't do this again, lol

So, based upon those percentages for “success”...I will ignore my better judgment, and post it anyway,

I am happy regardless of the outcome.
Thanks for the replies...

HaveFun, BeHappy

E

[Stephenie S]

Please don't apologize. You raised a very pertinent question. Are there risks involved for a crossdressers using a lady's room? Yes. Yes indeed. And I talked a little about the incident in Maryland where the TG woman was assaulted. Horrible. And she was NOT a crossdresser. She was TG.

So, what to do? I also asked that question. Of course, a single use room with a lock is by far the best solution. But SOMETIMES these wonderful places are not available. Sometimes you just have to pee.

I suggested that if you want to use the lady's, then you will need to OWN your female identity. I meant that you need the confidence to know you belong there. Women will see you. Women may "read" you, perhaps. We are perceptive, after all. And SOME women can just freak out at the thought of a person with a penis in the lady's room. Personally, I don't like the idea either. But remember, the lady's is always (at least in MY experience), a private place with locking stalls to do your business in. These are private and what goes on in them is NO ones business. And what appendages someone has in the stall is also no one's business.

If you are reasonably passable, reasonably presentable, and reasonably polite (SMILE), 99.9% of the time you will have no problems. Get in, do your business, wash, and get out. Smile. Smile at that little girl. Smile at her mother waiting just outside the door. Tell her you think her daughter needs some help.

What else to say? Repeat the scenario of the bus. Just 'cause you MIGHT get hit by a bus does not mean you should stay home. Security guys are supposed to be careful and suspicious. Thank you for your concern. But as I said, the scenario you painted is highly unlikely.

Stephie