The perception of balance!

[missyatl]

I dress in anything I want all of the time, my family is all aware and support me. They have been fantastic through all of this but are still getting used to things. I've talked recently with my kids and one said he thinks I do it too much. My wife has said basically the same thing to me, that she'd like me to dress like my old self on occasion (one day a week, a few hours a day, or whatever).

I don't always feel the need to dress and have worn my old things here and there. I want there to be a balance and I don't want to overwhelm them but I feel we perceive things differently. They only see me when I come home from work and I get dressed, so to them I do it all the time. For me I feel I only dress half the time, in the 16 or so hours a day I'm awake I spend over half that time dressed in guy mode for work. So when I come home I want to relax and where what I want.

I was curious to see what the rest of you do and if you feel the same way as I do.

Thanks!

[Jenniferathome]

I think you should accommodate your family. Their support cane wane if the perception is that you are always more important than them. Your time together IS the only countable time so it's not half of time thatbyounare dressed but 100% of the time with them. You should put mainly first. You will be rewarded for that

[MidnightOrchid]

Hey honey...*I'm his wife btw*.. I'm doing the best I can with support...but my issues stem from someplace else. When he first really started dressing it was in the bedroom...to enhance or put some spice into things. I felt as if I wasn't enough and grew to resent the clothes due to that simple fact. He then chose to dress outside of the bedroom, but my inadequacy issues never went away. I still have them, and am working through them.

Our 5 year old told me he wants to be a girl like Dad. What do you think a proper response should be to a 5 year old that feels his Dad wants to be a girl?

We are in therapy and are addressing these issues...seems like an hour (1.5 sometimes!) isn't enough...

Thanks for your input...Love you Daddy!

MidnightOrchid..

[kimdl93]

Missy, I certainly understand how you feel. Before I started working from home, I underdressed at work and, after our daughters moved out, dressed casual femme at home - I mean I just couldn't see getting all dressed up just for myself. I basically wore what my wife wore - lounge pants and tops.

But when I started working at home, I started dressing full time too. But still, when my wife gets home, I'm out of my day wear and back into lounge wear. Its still feminine, but far less obviously so than my other clothes. So, in a sense, my wife sees me in a far less femme presentation that during the day.

Still, I think you need to remain mindful of your family's statements. Perhaps you could modify what you wear most evenings, and save the full dress mode for the weekends. Compromise is at the heart of every lasting relationship.

MidnightOrchid, I think its important to confront those feelings of inadequacy. A lot of SOs of CDrs harbor the feeling that perhaps somehow they contribute to the desire/need to CD ...but its simply NOT TRUE. I have no doubt that Missy fell in love, and remains in love with you for both your wonderful personality and your physical attractiveness. Missy became a CD long before she met you and the contributing factors are simply not related to anything you do.

I don't know how to get you to believe that, but please try. One thing that can help is that whenever that self-negating talk occurs, interupt it immediately, and reinforce your positives , either internally, or aloud. Something like, " I'm attractive and sensual, and I bring out the very best in my husband...regardless of how he dresses!"

I don't know what to say abut your 5 year old, except that perhaps at that age, its just role playing. I certainly wouldn't give him the idea that what Daddy does is wrong or that if he did it, that he was being bad. Good one for your therapist!

[Sarah Doepner]

From working with the public on government issues we always believed that "Perception Is Reality" and had to respond to that perception, regardless of the facts. Their perception is different from yours and regardless of the 20 hours a day you spend in guy clothing, they see you mostly in the 4 hours you are en femme. That is their reality and while you are finding your own balance, they are struggling to find theirs. The other thing is they will be making decisions based on their reality, so their lives are being impacted by what they believe and it sounds like while they are supportive, they are getting close to their limits. I'd be careful.

[RADER]

I can see your family's point of view; They see you dress all the time because you are at work when you are
not dressed. You wanting to relax is good, but maybe do it in guy clothes a few days a week.
Make it a policy to dress say on the weekend, of if that does not work, only Monday to Friday.
That way the family see you as you. I understand what you are going through, My wife aloes me to dress,
but not go out of the house. So I only dress on the days I know I can stay home all day, about 1 to 2 times
a week. Sit down with your wife and ask here what would be approved with her and the family.
Rader

[Barbara Ella]

Hello MidnightOrchid. Sorry that his introduction to you had such a negative impact, definitely not the way to start, and it is understandable why these feelings would linger and have an impact on later developments. I guess he knows this, since he is here too, so no need to tell you to tell him....DUH! But does he really discuss this with you. I would hope he is not just going through the motions, and is open to compromises, and is not steadfast in his desire relax and wear what he wants. he syas he wants a balance, but it must be a balance within the time he is home with you all, and this means seriously cutting back on dressing time.

His, and my desire to dress gives us peace, but it gives others around us concerns and uncertainty. The hardest part is to find the balance that works for everyone. I am struggling through that right now with my wife. You have your needs, and they must be presented, and agreed to to get this balance started.

Sorry, but in my mind, a 5 year old is too young to be forced to deal with these issues. No mother should ever have to answer a question like that, especially when it is induced by the father's behavior. If it came out of the blue, that is completely different.

My best to you both

Barbara

[Jenniferathome]

Dear MO, I am not a child development expert, but my wife is (PhD). I know this much: at 5, it's just talk and mimicry. He will decide later if he has any interest for real. Kids are quite accepting and this will likely be just another aspect of Dad. Of course, Dad will be fully outed as well so I hope he is prepared for that. It is not incumbant on you to accommodate him under his rules. We Crossdressers are upsetting the balance in a family. For me, the wife or SO sets the boundaries and we have to abide by them but both must always be open to discussion on the boundaries. You may choose to expand the boundaries or narrow them.

As for dressing in the bedroom (bed), I have never understood that. I have no interest in it and for certain my wife has none. If you are uncomfortable with ANYTHING, it is your right to say no and any husband should respect that. You are in rarified air in that you so openly support your husband. For some here, it is very hard with their wife. Support can and should have limits. The limit is your comfort zone, not his.
Best of luck

[MidnightOrchid]

Really appreciate the replies. You all sound like such wonderful people. I'm wishing for my husband to join a CD'ing group that is here locally, to gain support on a personal level. He has no desire to be around people that also CD. I don't understand him..perhaps he can explain that..I think going and being with people that OPENLY and without issues accept you would be a "no brainer", but what do I know? He has his reasons. I, for instance love nature. If I were to find someone that also was into nature, "naturally" (like the play on words? I'd gravitate. But, perhaps he's just not ready. I do my best to understand what he has going on and I honestly am working on respecting him more. From my perspective this is what I see on a regular basis: He wakes up in a cami and panties..gets ready for work...puts on women's underclothes, deodorant and perfume. After coming home, he dresses in women's clothes. We have a busy schedule so we're usually going someplace. He wears women's clothes the rest of the night..in his eyes compromise comes in when he wears women's jeans as an alternative to a skirt. I still see it as women's clothes and it bothers me, but I don't say anything. (working on that as I don't want to end up resentful) We go to several places throughout the week. The only place he has worn less women's clothes or slightly more men's clothes is church. That was something we agreed would be extremely awkward for me and the kids to deal with him dressing at church..what are your thoughts on this? In my opinion he dresses 99% of the time. While I overwhelmingly want him to be true to himself and his identity..where does that leave the identity of the marriage? I also feel it's affecting my femininity. I don't want to "dress up" much anymore. I don't want to wear perfume much, put makeup on, the typical "girlie" things women (and men) do...I am losing interest. Does this mean I'm losing part of who I am as well? I've offered to share clothes, perfume, anything I have is his. I am a giver. But when it comes to him using them I feel as if he's "taking over" in my identity as a woman and I'm left with the scraps. I know these issues are MY issues and I own them, wholeheartedly. I really appreciate the opportunity to share my feelings here..thank you..MidnightOrchid...

[kimdl93]

MidnightOrchid, you're very welcome to anything tidbits of insight or advice that we might collectively have to offer. It seems you're on a very reasonable path in terms of accomodating your husband's identity. As you're both in therapy, presumably together, that would be a really good place to work out some mutually agreeable terms. And I think it would also be a good place for you to work on what you've described as "your issues". Perhaps your husband can learn some techniques to help address those feelings.

[MidnightOrchid]

Thanks, Kim,

Yes, we are in therapy together. Yesterday CD'ing was the topic of discussion. I had to nearly interrupt to be heard..but I understand that our therapist was simply gathering background info. Boundaries come up often in therapy, so perhaps we should set some and not leave things so "wide open" in terms of what he does? It's a catch 22 really. If he gives in to his desires of wearing what he wants, no matter what he does so knowing he's potentially upsetting myself or our children. But to not dress as he wishes, could potentially damage his self-esteem and opportunity for happiness in dressing. I don't want to be responsible for his diminished happiness or self-esteem. But, how can balance be established? What is a fair "scale"?

With appreciation..MO

[Karren H]

If you don't listen to your wife..... I'm sure her divorce lawyer will be more than willing to!

[Laura912]

One of the things that struck me about the original post was the last bit of "...I want to relax where and when I want...". Not a whole lot of room for others in that statement. And to answer the question at the end do we feel the way you do, then answer for me is no. To further crawl out on the limb, it seems there is a bit of selfishness expressed in the OP. Then, I discovered that both members of this team are here on the forum. Maybe I need to rethink the knee jerk reaction if both of you are willing to discuss this openly. Finally, going all the way to the end of the limb, it does seem that one is more giving than the other.

[missyatl]

I think that is a fair assessment, I do feel selfish and have told her that. It's difficult when one day she is picking out clothes in the store and being totally cool with it then when I actually go to put it on at a later time she'll say something like "are you going to wear that". I just want to be me and I feel like for the first time I'm actually doing that. The "man shield" really kept me from embracing and expressing my inner feminine qualities. It's new for everyone and I do need to be more mindful of their feelings as they are the most important parts of my life, above all else, except God.

You guys rock!!! Thank you for all your opinions, this is a great forum, topic aside. It's posters like you all that make this place great!

[Marleena]

I see some good stuff here. Missy's wife is okay with him dressing (bonus). They are in therapy looking for answers. Dressing isn't an issue but the frequency of it is.

Both parents need to put the kids first because they are impressionable. Fix that issue first. Then deal with keeping both Missy and the wife happy. Can underdressing help here?

Just my thoughts, good luck!

[kimdl93]

Thanks, Kim,

Yes, we are in therapy together. Yesterday CD'ing was the topic of discussion. I had to nearly interrupt to be heard..but I understand that our therapist was simply gathering background info. Boundaries come up often in therapy, so perhaps we should set some and not leave things so "wide open" in terms of what he does? It's a catch 22 really. If he gives in to his desires of wearing what he wants, no matter what he does so knowing he's potentially upsetting myself or our children. But to not dress as he wishes, could potentially damage his self-esteem and opportunity for happiness in dressing. I don't want to be responsible for his diminished happiness or self-esteem. But, how can balance be established? What is a fair "scale"?

With appreciation..MO

Honestly, Missy and Orchid, there's got to be room for compromise. As missy has stated in another response, she realizes that she can be a bit selfish. Its not black and white/ all or none. Missy can compromise on the frequency and/or extent of his dressing without damaging his self esteeem or happiness. Its just clothes...right? And you're certainly capable of making compromises of your own. What's the right mix....well, that depends on the two of you. Your therapist can help you negotiate something that you both can agree to. And of course, this can change over time.

Perhaps, if missy gives a little bit up in order to help you feel more at ease, in the long term you'll feel more able to accept somewhat greater frequency in her dressing. But you guys are both young....you have lots of time to find a good balance and lots of opportunities to make adjustments and accomodations for each other!

[Cheryl T]

My wife told me a long time ago that I could wear whatever I wanted when I wanted around the house. Most of the time I am ME...but I do find myself wondering if it's really more than she wants and I do shift to the drab mode without request because she deserves to have him around too.

[missyatl]

I do want to be more balanced at home, realizing that my family does love and support me just as I am but they also like seeing the "old me" too. I need to be more mindful of their feelings and not let the fog get in the way of that. Lately I have wanted to dress in drab more often and that has been by choice. I do stretch it a bit by dressing in less feminine stuff but it's still women's regardless. Personally I do see that as compromise but perhaps they don't. In my opinion, unless the jeans are bedazzled or something then they are just jeans, what's the difference.

I will be much more mindful in the next few weeks, I'll try to remember how often I have been dressed at home before I go to the closet next time.

[kimdl93]

I'd like to offer one more observation. A compromise isn't something you do alone - its a reflection of an agreement between you and your SO.

[missyatl]

Well her feedback has been to dress like my old self once in a while, no specific amount of time has been stated. So for now I'm going to work on having more full days of my old self, however I may still under dress in that time. We'll see how it goes with that. And I'm also working on not changing as soon as I come home, stick around in my work clothes for an hour or so. I think she's ok with this but now that she is on here she can speak for herself. But again this does fit into what compromise options her and I have spoken about.

[MidnightOrchid]

For some reason I feel like I'm being unfair when I request him to wear some of the things from the past. I've tried to be of the mindset of letting others' feelings come before mine. (Mainly..not always..but for the most part) This has gotten me in trouble in many aspects of my life and I'm growing...being more vocal..speaking my mind. I know I have a long way to go. I'm hoping therapy helps me to formulate what is fair and what's respectful to our marriage and family as a whole. What I may want may be nowhere near what he wants. I can't see compromise working with such a difference of opinions. I feel he would rather go out dressed then dress at home. I feel he likes to show himself off..but I may be wrong..I'm not sure. Perhaps he likes the attention he may get from people around..whereas I don't like the idea of the negative attention it could infer. But, that's my issue. However, I take his issues into consideration when making my personal decisions. Our therapist is really big on things being his/her issues. We've been told he has an unhealthy attachment to me..not sure how that correlates but perhaps that comes into play with this as well..I'm not sure..I wish I had all the answers..

[Being Paige]

I don't think that you can count the hours that you are at work as time not spent dressing. Your home time is what needs to be used in your calculations to balance your dressing time. I'm all for spending as much time as possible to be dressed but I don't factor in the hours I spend at work. I don't wear anything femme at work. I also wear womens jean's going out with the family to where ever it is we're going, my wife knows their womens jeans but likes how they look better then men's jeans. I believe they are way more comfortable to wear and as far as I'm concerned jeans are jeans up to a point.

[kendra_gurl]

Missy you just asked this same question not 6 weeks ago. Lots of great advice was givin to you at that time and you responded with this quote

Reine, you've said it best. For me, I don't identify as a woman, I'm a man and always will be. Having said that, I have feminine qualities or a fem side to my personality. I'm now choosing what to wear based on how I feel in that moment, what I think looks good or comfortable. I don't care about labels, I like the clothes I've bought. Sometimes I want to wear a skirt, others jeans. Basically to me its a closet full of clothes and I'll pick up what speaks to me that day, regardless of the label.

I was leaning towards the same thing of some days all mens, some days all womens. I don't feel the need to mix so to speak but I'm still working out what I feel looks good. In my opinion, I do dress fem everyday but some days I dress "less" fem. Meaning jeans not skirt. I felt that was a compromise but I don't feel my wife agree's with that. She's extremely supportive and wants me happy. But like she said "sometimes I miss seeing you dress like a man".

So I think I'll do that, a day or so a week I'll not put on any womens "outter" clothing. I don't want to give up the underwear, they are far more comfortable then my "tighty wighties" ever were. I'm also not sure about the panty hose or cami's, they are so damn comfortable. I'll run it by my wife and we'll see, I'll keep ya posted.

Thank you for your advice everybody, you rock!!

How did that work out or did you even try it? What have you learned from your therapy secessions?

From your post in this thread it seems you are not satisfied with compromise or balance but only with satisfying YOUR NEEDS.

You may be a male with a feminine side which needs to be expressed (most of us here are the same way) but Dude you are still a male and you have a wife and a family so MAN up and stop letting that little girl inside control you.

If you truly want some balance and to be controlled by your feminine side try reversing things and wear your girl jeans and a blouse to work. Let you and your coworkers deal with the stress instead of your family.

[missyatl]

WOW, now that was a direct as it comes. Thank you Kendra, perhaps I needed that. I have given what I suggested a try and I've been ok with all of it. I am dressing less often but still a little too much. It's a process and I'm working through it with my wife and our therapist.

Today for example, my wife and kids are on their way to pick me up from work and I'm taking the kids shopping for some new clothes. I didn't say "let me go home and dress up first". I genuinely want to go straight from work dressed as a man. I want to have that time with my kids and the focus to be strictly on them. This is me working on balance, for my family's sake.

[kendra_gurl]

Good for you Missy

I was starting to think of you as something a little different. The way you accepted my post tells me perhaps my first impression was not quite as bad as I thought. I really hope you both can work this out.

I'd still like to hear your response to the question I asked you 6 weeks ago?

I'd suggest you ask yourself when you do come home and slip on a pair of womens jeans or leggings, What am I really getting out of this and at what cost to my relationship with her?