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Thread: Trying to accept that I am a transsexual

  1. #76
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raquel June View Post
    And not transitioning will probably make you miserable.
    But what happens if Steph is not TS?
    Reine

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    Quote Originally Posted by angies GG View Post
    Yes I am hurt, yes I am angry. Guess what. So is steph!
    If Steph is truly TS this is something she's known for the 23 yrs of your marriage and a lot longer before that. A recent formal diagnosis of GID from some therapist doesn't confirm 100% that Steph is indeed TS. Transsexuality is not like cancer.

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    This has to be extremely tough for the both of you. But I hope you two can keep talking while you're both figuring out where your lives are headed. Dealing with these issues isn't something Steph signed up for, and dealing with a partner that is dealing with these issues isn't something you (angies GG) signed up for. All I can do is hope for the least painful outcome for the both of you... whatever that is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by famousunknown View Post
    If Steph is truly TS this is something she's known for the 23 yrs of your marriage and a lot longer before that.
    Not necessarily. That's just "traditional trans narrative" writ large.

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    Quote Originally Posted by famousunknown View Post
    If Steph is truly TS this is something she's known for the 23 yrs of your marriage and a lot longer before that.
    The power of the human mind to run, hide, deny, and suppress is not to be underestimated. As such, it is quite possible for a TS to convince him or herself that he or she may be otherwise, and to actually believe his or her own inner self-deception. In the long run, such a "defense mechanism" is doomed to failure. It simply is not sustainable. Some, however, maintain the self-deceit longer than others. Regardless, your statement does not necessarily follow, and is not necessarily accurate . . . .

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    Quote Originally Posted by EnglishRose View Post
    Not necessarily. That's just "traditional trans narrative" writ large.
    Yeah... there is a little bit of confusion sometimes with the "I've known since I was..." stuff.

    Some people KNOW they were trans from their earliest memories. But some people only knew that something was wrong, or that they knew they had to pretend to be a certain person. In the latter cases, it isn't after 10, 20, 50, however many years that they ACCEPT it and then realize that the label for those things that were wrong is "transsexual." Many of us KNEW, but we didn't know the label applied to how we felt.

  7. #82
    Gold Member Marleena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne2345 View Post
    The power of the human mind to run, hide, deny, and suppress is not to be underestimated. As such, it is quite possible for a TS to convince him or herself that he or she may be otherwise, and to actually believe his or her own inner self-deception. In the long run, such a "defense mechanism" is doomed to failure. It simply is not sustainable. Some, however, maintain the self-deceit longer than others. Regardless, your statement does not necessarily follow, and is not necessarily accurate . . . .
    Hi Anne! This was exactly my case, I buried any thought of being TS because there was no help for me here in the 70's. I call it survival mode that I was in. Bits and pieces are still coming back. If severe enough this crap won't go away, it comes back to haunt you.

  8. #83
    Silver Member STACY B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bree-asaurus View Post
    Yeah... there is a little bit of confusion sometimes with the "I've known since I was..." stuff.

    Some people KNOW they were trans from their earliest memories. But some people only knew that something was wrong, or that they knew they had to pretend to be a certain person. In the latter cases, it isn't after 10, 20, 50, however many years that they ACCEPT it and then realize that the label for those things that were wrong is "transsexual." Many of us KNEW, but we didn't know the label applied to how we felt.


    You Tell um Kidd !! You got the OL FAT GIRL on your side ,,, NOW ,,,, We can move on ,,We accept it an now we act on it or leave it alone ,,I am going to act ,,
    Yull Find Out !!! lol,,,,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne2345 View Post
    The power of the human mind to run, hide, deny, and suppress is not to be underestimated. As such, it is quite possible for a TS to convince him or herself that he or she may be otherwise, and to actually believe his or her own inner self-deception. In the long run, such a "defense mechanism" is doomed to failure. It simply is not sustainable. Some, however, maintain the self-deceit longer than others. Regardless, your statement does not necessarily follow, and is not necessarily accurate . . . .
    Excellent point. I guess everyone has their own personal tolerance level of self-deception and ways of dealing with it.
    Some people can live a lifetime w/o acknowledging they're TS.

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    Aspiring Member morgan51's Avatar
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    I made it 56 years I did my best and failed, truly beleive its not sustainable. Your thread is certainly hitting some tender spots in my life and my wifes ,many parallels. Best luck to you both my heart goes out to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgan51 View Post
    I made it 56 years I did my best and failed, truly beleive its not sustainable. Your thread is certainly hitting some tender spots in my life and my wifes ,many parallels. Best luck to you both my heart goes out to you.
    As hard as we have it (and I know how hard it is... I have the scars to prove it) transsexualism is really a first-world problem. When you're not spending every waking moment trying to survive, you are able to focus on other issues... including sexuality and gender identity. So I think it really varies depending on the history of each transsexual and what they are currently dealing with.

  12. #87
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    We're in the TS section, so it makes sense that we hear from people who were in denial about being TS for many years. But, in the CD section, we hear from people who at one point thought they were TS and then realized they weren't.

    (We hardly hear from anyone who moves outside the notion of binary gender.)

    It's almost like a tug of war. Generally, the TSs assume that people who are questioning themselves, are TS. The CDs who never thought they were, and the TGs who thought they might have been, assume the "questioners" aren't TS. The wives (except those who stay the course) don't want their husbands to be TS. I guess everyone has a bias, including me (I often suggest giving serious thought to the middle ground especially if someone is not certain they are TS), so I think the best thing to do for someone who is in Steph's position, is to either not post at all until they've sorted it out themselves, or post their questions/thoughts/experiences on both sides of the forum to get balanced views (keeping in mind that everyone posts in all areas).

    Angie and Steph, honestly it must be difficult to read posts from people who dissect your lives like this (including me and for this I apologize). Part of the discussion though is loosely about the two of you, but also people use your situation as a springboard for the discussion about a very important issue for most everyone here, which is the difference between the various levels of trans and how to sort through it all.

    I continue to hope that you will find a way to sort through all of this peacefully.
    Reine

  13. #88
    What is normal anyway? Rianna Humble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    We're in the TS section, so it makes sense that we hear from people who were in denial about being TS for many years. But, in the CD section, we hear from people who at one point thought they were TS and then realized they weren't.

    (We hardly hear from anyone who moves outside the notion of binary gender.)

    It's almost like a tug of war. Generally, the TSs assume that people who are questioning themselves, are TS. The CDs who never thought they were, and the TGs who thought they might have been, assume the "questioners" aren't TS.
    It is not often that I disagree with something that you write, Reine, but I think that you are taking a very broad brush approach here. What I see more often is that those of us who are TS see someone who is questioning or is trying to rush into things and advise caution as part of a web of support.

    Granted there may be one or two who encourage someone to go ahead willy-nilly, but those of us who have lived/are living the realities of GID and transition generally do not want to see someone go through the pain unnecessarily.

    I cannot speak authoritatively for the other members of this forum but I know that when I see someone post something like
    The last couple of months have been very difficult and depressing for me, as I have been coming to terms that I am a transsexual, not a crossdresser. I have memories of wanting to be a girl when I was 4 years old, and these feelings never went away, despite how hard I tried to suppress them. I lived most of my life full of guilt and shame
    I will tend to believe that the person knows what she has been experiencing better than I do. And when that person speaks of the way that is affecting their marriage to someone who is trying to be supportive, I feel compassion for both of them.

    On the other hand, when I see a person who has already stated that he is just trying out cross-dressing and who has no point of reference to understand what Gender Dysphoria does to a person or to a marriage telling the couple to "just snap out of it" I cannot sit by in silence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thera Home View Post
    I just call em as I see em
    The standard response of any prejudiced person who has spoken from ignorance.

    If you wanted to be supportive of Steph's wife, you could start by trying to understand what it is like to live with someone who is suffering from Gender Dysphoria and from that understanding attempt to make a constructive comment..
    Last edited by Rianna Humble; 10-25-2012 at 04:44 AM.
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  14. #89
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bree-asaurus View Post
    Yeah... there is a little bit of confusion sometimes with the "I've known since I was..." stuff.
    Anyone who tells you that they knew from the moment they became self aware is simply creating a narrative. Remember history is written by the victors. Most transsexuals fully become aware of their conundrum of having a gender/sex incongruence between the ages of 9-12.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bree-asaurus View Post
    As hard as we have it (and I know how hard it is... I have the scars to prove it) transsexualism is really a first-world problem. When you're not spending every waking moment trying to survive, you are able to focus on other issues... including sexuality and gender identity. So I think it really varies depending on the history of each transsexual and what they are currently dealing with.
    That is an interesting comment. I think that the emphasis of your statement should be that first world societies tend to see transsexualism as a problem. It and gender variance has much more acceptance in 2nd and 3rd world societies.

    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    It's almost like a tug of war. Generally, the TSs assume that people who are questioning themselves, are TS. The CDs who never thought they were, and the TGs who thought they might have been, assume the "questioners" aren't TS. The wives (except those who stay the course) don't want their husbands to be TS.
    Reine you put your finger on something very important here. There is much desire to assume that someone who asks a question is one thing or another. These assumptions create dynamics that are more often than not not helpful and often harmful.

    What Steph and her spouse Angie are experiencing is the loss of certainty about the other. Steph is struggling with the inner dynamic of a transformation that appears by her own statements to consist of a slow breaking down of barriers of denial and resistance, that she has created over time to fend off transformation. I think her questions is: is this inevitable and will Angie love me no matter what. Angie having lived under the assumption that Steph is a man, seeing the transformation, is building defenses by placing conditions on her relationship to him. I know because I have been there with my spouse and we have come out the other side together.

    To Steph I would say: When you have learned who you are (and I believe that notwithstanding your psychologists statement this question is not answered because you have not truly answered it for yourself) then is the time to make decisions. NO matter what anyone here or elsewhere says to you about who you are it is really your own conscious awareness that will answer the question. In going through this process hang on to your wife she is an anchor in your life even if you are in rocky seas.

    To Angie I would say: I understand your anger and your confusion. It is natural to be confused because anyone who does not suffer from transsexualism cannot possibly imagine what it means to be afflicted with this condition. You must also express your anger. You have never asked for any of this, and you feel feel entitled to rely on the certainty of your marriage vows and the love that has accompanied you throughout your 23 year marriage. But understand that in expressing your anger it cannot be directed at Steph as a human being. He did not ask for this either. Beware of placing conditions on your love and commitment to Steph. If he had any other debilitating disease or illness would you tell Steph that unless she got better and returned to her former state you would leave her? And lastly after 23 years of marriage ask if you love the man or the human being.

    If you would like to speak about this you know where to find me.
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

  15. #90
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    It is the ts section....It's not a tug of war...no one here (outside of thera) has an axe to grind...it is also true that nothing is certain, we all have bias based on experience...kathryn's wife stayed, mine didn't..any advice from us reflects that

    i can only think of a very few people that have come here and said they are ts only to realize they are not....and frankly the most prolific posters here tend to have a transsexual radar (there is a good arguement kathyrn is suggesting that we should all shut up!! LOL...but i view it that we have valuable experience to share, and its each persons responsibility to read the posts and judge for themselves..), and that radar goes off or doesn't and it influences what people say..in my opinion, much for the better...otherwise every answer to every question would be...see a therapist, be honest with yourself, good luck!...there would be no point to it..

    read the first paragraph of the OP... that is not even remotely close to how crossdressers wonder/fantasize/contemplate if they are ts... it is just so easy to say "i think i may be ts, or though it was ts"...ESPECIALLY on internet message boards...thats not what the OP says...

    my therapy was very broad and i know 100's of cd's and just as many transsexuals...there are observable patterns and similarities....i have never personally met a cd that TRULY BELEIVED they were transsexual at any point..but i met tons of them that like to pretend or wonder if they are...that ask me lots of questions of what its like...kind of like its cool, fun, exciting, interesting...

    older ts women that lived a male life continue to fight being ts right up to the point they can't, they dread transition as much as they dread not transitioning, they experience this self knowledge as a blow because they invested so much in their male lives, they think of all the people they are impacting, about $$, about their jobs.... they focus on the life threatening aspects of GID..why?? because we all feel it inside eating us away and as different as we are, we feel this gender dysphoria the same way, and you can read posts and tell when another person has that feeling..

    my statements are just information...hopefully they are helpful. they are about facing your own reality as quickly as possible so you get the best quality of life for yourself while causing the least disruption in the lives around you..

    ... the best bet for steph and angie is to do their best to deeply explore this together.....i would totally respect that either one of you guys is not ready to deal with this yet, or that you don't want your lives dissected, but that's not the impression i get from your posts..

    In a perfect world, you would meet every married person going through this to get feedback and share experience...this would help you think through your real life options and help you both learn how to best deal with this for yourselves..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele View Post

    ... the best bet for steph and angie is to do their best to deeply explore this together.....i would totally respect that either one of you guys is not ready to deal with this yet, or that you don't want your lives dissected, but that's not the impression i get from your posts..

    In a perfect world, you would meet every married person going through this to get feedback and share experience...this would help you think through your real life options and help you both learn how to best deal with this for yourselves..
    Can I hear you all say "amen" sisters and brothers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele View Post
    It is the ts section....It's not a tug of war...no one here (outside of thera) has an axe to grind...
    As Rianna pointed out, I was speaking from a much broader perspective than just this thread, or this section of the forum. It is an argument that is pervasive here and that we see over and over again, in all sections of the forum: whether someone is TS or not, or what does "TS" mean. The members who have come to the conclusion they are TS themselves, will sympathize more towards the possibility that any Questioners might be TS as well and further that like the TSs, the Questioners will not be happy unless they transition. The members who have seriously questioned this within themselves and who have come to different conclusions will not make the same assumptions. This is why I suggest that if a Questioner wants other people's opinions, he or she should not limit the questions to one or the other side of the forum. This doesn't mean asking members who have no concept of alternative gender identity and who think that all persons born with penises are men. On the other side of the forum, the questions can be phrased in such a way as to ask the specific members who have seriously believed they might be TS at some point in their lives.

    I liken this to a need to be objective in scientific research. The whole point is that if a person needs to investigate something, he or she should investigate it thoroughly in order to avoid confirmation bias.
    Reine

  18. #93
    trans punk Badtranny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    The members who have come to the conclusion they are TS themselves, will sympathize more towards the possibility that any Questioners might be TS as well
    Excellent observation RD, but I think my perspective has tilted since being an active member here. I definitely used to think that people don't question their station for nothing. Where there is smoke there's fire right? But that perspective was born of ignorance about the "continuum". I didn't really understand that people could cross dress and still be perfectly happy with their genetic situation. My story has been one of resistance and eventual acceptance so I just kind of colored everyone else with the only brush that I had on me.

    Lately I've come to learn that there are indeed degrees of TG'ness but I've also noticed a tendency to sort of idealize the TS girls. I sense a feeling that some of the CD's want or wish they could be TS because they think of it as more of an elite sorority instead of what it really is. A bizarre and horrifying life change that begins with a 100 days of terror and eventually becomes just an average life as an odd looking woman.

    I have become sensitive to this idea that CD'rs are "ready for the next step" or that they are "almost full time already" so transition is just paperwork. What me and the other transitioners have done is simply make a commitment to be honest with ourselves and the world. It's a commitment that ripples through every single aspect of our lives and so I have to admit to a little eye rolling when a CD'r decides that they are "really transsexual". They may be of course and I'm certainly not making judgements nor do I think I'm qualified to do so. I'm just a another tranny struggling through transition, but I'm living a real life and suffering real consequences and people who dress up and go shopping in the next town over don't get to say they are just like me.
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  19. #94
    Gold Member Marleena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny View Post
    Lately I've come to learn that there are indeed degrees of TG'ness but I've also noticed a tendency to sort of idealize the TS girls. I sense a feeling that some of the CD's want or wish they could be TS because they think of it as more of an elite sorority instead of what it really is. A bizarre and horrifying life change that begins with a 100 days of terror and eventually becomes just an average life as an odd looking woman.
    What I'm seeing is a lot of self diagnosing going on here lately. It's like I have some of the clues, so I must be TS! This is a forum and we can't diagnose anybody. We can only give clues. If somebody thinks they may be TS they need confirmation from a professional. A diagnosis takes time so why all the panic until an answer is found? I agree with Melissa there is nothing glamorous about being TS, in fact I think it sucks!
    Last edited by Marleena; 10-26-2012 at 10:18 PM. Reason: correction

  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marleena View Post
    If somebody thinks they may be TS they need confirmation from a professional.
    Professionals cannot tell someone whether they are TS or not. Professionals can only be guided by a patient's self-reporting. Also, professionals are or should be trained to rule out major conditions other than dressing for sexual gratification, such as bi-polar, depression, etc, that once treated might lessen GID, but even then, professionals are not infallible. Ultimately the only source for answers is within the patients/clients themselves.

    Also, we've seen countless threads here, debating what is a TS. Is there a difference between a true TS who cannot be happy without full transition, and someone who can manage a life switching back and forth? Is the first a classic definition of a woman born in the wrong body and the latter being more on a middle path? Does TS = woman, or does TS = TS? I'm not providing answers here, just saying there is a great deal of debate about this. Although ultimately I believe this varies according to the individual.
    Last edited by ReineD; 10-25-2012 at 12:09 PM.
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  21. #96
    Gold Member Marleena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    Professionals cannot tell someone whether they are TS or not. Professionals can only be guided by a patient's self-reporting. Also, professionals are or should be trained to rule out major other conditions, such as bi-polar, depression, etc, that once treated might lessen GID, but even then, professionals are not infallible. Ultimately the only source for answers is within the patients/clients themselves.
    A gender therapist will be able to tell after a while based on the patients answers. They are trained for this, unlike the majority of people on a message board. They will help the patient come to a conclusion. I would think misdiagnosis would be kept to a minimum by going to a gender therapist.

  22. #97
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    That's the point, Marleena. Not everyone is trained to the same degree of proficiency. Just looking at the physical side of this (HRT), some doctors refuse to administer it, while others push people through, no questions asked, and everything else in between. This is still very much a developing field.
    Reine

  23. #98
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    Wow. This thread is like a soap opera. At times it reads like the 5 blind men each describing an elephant and calling each other wrong. At times I hear the shrieking metal and booming collisions of a train wreck.

    Steph 1964 and Angie's GG, it's so difficult. My wife and I are in your same boat, four rows back on the right.
    It's scary. It's emotional. It's way more change than we'd like to deal with. We've always been a very close couple, but I've always been dishonest with her about my TS wants - sometimes lies to her were because I was trying to lie to my self, othertimes I lied from fear that if I tell her she will leave me. I gave it all up and have been telling my wife the truth, and finally admitting the truth about myself to her. She's finally hearing what counselors and forum members have heard for decades.

    We now have the most honest dialogue we have ever had. And we have found a new closeness. At least I feel a sense of rediscovery of myself and perhaps that kind of happiness is showing through, and it is shared with her, my best friend. And in that we seem to be finding a new chapter in our relationship.

    I wish you both the best, and wish you courage and strength as you move into this new chapter in your lives.
    Hugs,
    'lissa

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    "Sometimes, it's even better."
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  24. #99
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    Professionals cannot tell someone whether they are TS or not. Professionals can only be guided by a patient's self-reporting. Also, professionals are or should be trained to rule out major conditions other than dressing for sexual gratification, such as bi-polar, depression, etc, that once treated might lessen GID, but even then, professionals are not infallible. Ultimately the only source for answers is within the patients/clients themselves.
    People seek professional validation because it provides the "medical justification" defense.
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

  25. #100
    What is normal anyway? Rianna Humble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    As Rianna pointed out, I was speaking from a much broader perspective than just this thread, or this section of the forum. It is an argument that is pervasive here and that we see over and over again, in all sections of the forum: whether someone is TS or not, or what does "TS" mean. The members who have come to the conclusion they are TS themselves, will sympathize more towards the possibility that any Questioners might be TS as well and further that like the TSs, the Questioners will not be happy unless they transition.
    I'm sorry, Reine, this position is the exact opposite of my contribution in this thread and of my wider observations.

    We may accept when someone says "I think I am TS, I have been fighting this knowledge but have reluctantly come to the conclusion that I can fight it no longer". I do not see people I know to be TS saying to a questioner that they will only be happy if they transition.

    Almost every regular TS contributor in this TS forum has at some time posted words to the effect of "Do not transition unless you have to".

    You will find people in the CD sections saying something to the effect of "I thought I would like to be a woman, but the reality was different and I now see it was pink fog". You will also see those in that section saying to others as they said to me "Do not act in haste, make sure you really are TS and not just in a pink fog". That advice was good when offered to me and is equally good when offered to others.

    You will find the self same advice being offered week in and week out in this forum. We know the difficulties of transition - not just intellectually but viscerally. We live the sideways glances, the mis-gendering, the transphobia, the sheer hell of looking in the mirror and only seeing our former self staring back. Do you really think that any of us would wish those experiences on someone who does not need to suffer them?

    On the other hand, for those of us who do need to transition, even that degree of suffering is better than the living death of being forced to exist as the wrong gender.
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