Drunken rant? Where do I fit in?Estranged?

[rocketscientist]

I apologize in advance for grammatical errors and general nonsense. I just got home. I had a long, tough day at work. I decided to go have a beer when I got back to my hometown. Well, I had a few more than planned. I didn't get totally sh*tfaced or anything. BUT, I get this weird feeling as if I'm outside looking in. I see all the people partying and carrying on. Sure, I see and talk to some good friends, but it doesn't seem to go on beyond " Hey, what's up". After a while all the rest of the people seem like a rerun movie I've seen a hundred times. There's all the characters, the old barflys, the newbies, the dudes on the make, the dudes that just wanna get smashed, the hot chicks that look down at most of the guys, the chicks that are really insecure, the bar staff that's just trying to do their jobs, etc, etc,etc. I just sit and wonder. It seems like I cannot connect with anybody there on any kind of deeper level and I wonder why I am there at all. After a short time of all that I can handle, I am home now. I feel the only times I really feel "included" and "whole" is when I am with family and/or enfemme with my cd sisters. Does this seem to happen to you as well? I am just gonna click the "submit" button before I realize how silly and strange I sound right now.

[Davena Doll]

I love drunken rants give it up sister. I tryed CL worked for me "happely ever after". Cheers.

[biggirlsarah]

Firstly Why do you feel you have to fit in, is it that important to connect with people, maybe they aren't your type of people and you need to find a different place to get a drink, I have always felt like an observer, I dont seem to understand why inane conversation is important , I dont see why we have a celebrity culture and it is important to look up to these people to try and dress like they do and use the products that they endorse, I am a person of independent mind I am not a sheep on two legs, and I cant understand people who are.
I think you need to try and connect more with your type of people.
Good luck in your hunt , love and hugs Sarah xxx

[Nichola]

Well you're included & fit in just fine here. Maybe it was just a bad night?
I know what you mean about feeling you're on the outside looking in, sometimes my mind drifts a little when I have a drink & I get a little too reflective. Maybe you'll feel better in the morning

[Amy A]

It doesn't sound silly, I've often felt the same. I can't really explain it very well, but I think its because I can't be myself in such circumstances. I have to put up a veneer of a person that people expect me to be. It's my own fault as this character is one that I've created over the years as a way of fitting in and hiding the female side of me. It's tiring!

The other thing to consider is that perhaps that kind of night out just isn't for you anymore. I've been in bars supposedly frequented by the popular crowd and realised that everyone in there seemed desperate in some way, like everything they did was just for the benefit of others. So I've realised I'm much happier in a quiet pub with just a couple of friends where people are a bit more relaxed and I can have a proper chat.

At the end of the day the only person I can spend long periods of time with is my girlfriend, who is the only person who knows everything.

Rachel

[mikiSJ]

Americans' circle of close confidants has shrunk dramatically in the past two decades and the number of people who say they have no one with whom to discuss important matters has more than doubled, according to a new study by sociologists at Duke University and the University of Arizona.

This is from a study done in 2006 and I found it to be true then as now. We simply don't have confidants anymore, unless, like me you are married and then your one and only close friend, confidant is your spouse.

I don't think there is cure for this. We all think we are friends on this forum, and we are friendly, but we seldom communicate as friends. We never have conversations, we simply throw out comments, like I am doing now.

One of the biggest problems we have in conversing and not commenting is the time shift. rs started this thread two hours ago. If we were truly friends, we would be texting, or better yet actually talking on a phone, in real time.

But alas, the technology we have come to rely upon is keeping us impersonal. When I was younger (50s and 60s) I would spend afternoons with close friends talking about whatever comes after "Hey, how you doing". I remember an old girlfriend coming over to cry about not getting a car loan because she was female (1973) and we talked for hours about everything and nothing. I miss those friendships. What would the conversation have been with Heather if she had simply left me a voice mail or a text. There would not have been a conversation and there would not have been a need to be a friend. Friends are there when they are needed. Being friendly is commenting on a forum or returning a text message tomorrow.

[Jenniferathome]

Your drawing these conclusions in a BAR, at night, on a weekend? You need a change of venue.

[sandra-leigh]

Your drawing these conclusions in a BAR, at night, on a weekend?

Take your inspirations where you can find them, I would say.

Bars are one of the only collective venues we have left these days, one of the few places one can go and circulate and talk to a number of people and it is not considered "weird" to talk to people you do not know. Coffee houses used to be that way, back when "coffee house" was an rare and artistic place with a good chance of live music, rather than the modern Starbucks "sit and stare at your laptop" type of place.

I don't know what Idaho is like at this time of year, but where I am, north of you, we have just gone through a week of windchills as low as -42 ("exposed skin freezes in 8 minutes"). People huddle with their TV shows and their Netflix. Except the ones who go out to bars.

Perhaps you would say, "Well, there's work, you can talk to people there." Perhaps so, if I hadn't been laid off 10 months ago -- and if I had fit in at work in the first place. My friends at work were mostly the misfits, and as they themselves departed, few indeed gave me any way to contact them. And talking openly about important things at work can be dangerous to one's employment.

[CassandraSmith]

Drunken rant? Where do I fit in?Estranged?

Most people reach the point eventually where the public house no longer is satisfying on a deeper level. It's OK, partying full time becomes like anything else--a job.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jo1xDFAHeI

[Beverley Sims]

Try this rant tomorrow when you are home.
You have desccribed a seedy bar succintly, I think you posted it in the wrong spot.
Seedy bar descriptions go in the lounge I think.
You are not a rocketscientist for nothing.

[paulaprimo]

you don't sound silly or strange to me at all... i could have written that exact same post sober.
i often have the very same feelings, why am i here? where do i fit in? i don't have any concrete
answers at present. i know i am happiest when dressed and out, but can be a very lonely world...

[rocketscientist]

Firstly Why do you feel you have to fit in, is it that important to connect with people, maybe they aren't your type of people and you need to find a different place to get a drink, I have always felt like an observer, I dont seem to understand why inane conversation is important , I dont see why we have a celebrity culture and it is important to look up to these people to try and dress like they do and use the products that they endorse, I am a person of independent mind I am not a sheep on two legs, and I cant understand people who are.
I think you need to try and connect more with your type of people.
Good luck in your hunt , love and hugs Sarah xxx

Thank you Sarah. I too feel the same way about celebrity culture. Some people have idols that they adore, be it a star athlete, famous musician, race car driver, actor/actress, etc. I've always believed that everyone should strive for greatness in their own way instead of living vicariously through their idols. Being a fan is one thing,but some IMHO just go too far. I know a guy who had his truck painted to match the car of his favorite NASCAR driver. And of course he has EVERYTHING else associated as well(shirts,jackets, toys, toilet seat cover! You get the idea.) Most of his conversations seem to go toward this particular driver. It's like he doesn't have his OWN identity at all sometime! And I do try and DO connect with my type of people. Just not as often as I would like. The next time will probably be Dunes TG Weekend in April. Can't wait!

Well you're included & fit in just fine here. Maybe it was just a bad night?
I know what you mean about feeling you're on the outside looking in, sometimes my mind drifts a little when I have a drink & I get a little too reflective. Maybe you'll feel better in the morning

Thank you sweetheart! It's too bad all these miles and that BIG pond separate us. It would be epic hanging out together.

It doesn't sound silly, I've often felt the same. I can't really explain it very well, but I think its because I can't be myself in such circumstances. I have to put up a veneer of a person that people expect me to be. It's my own fault as this character is one that I've created over the years as a way of fitting in and hiding the female side of me. It's tiring!

The other thing to consider is that perhaps that kind of night out just isn't for you anymore. I've been in bars supposedly frequented by the popular crowd and realised that everyone in there seemed desperate in some way, like everything they did was just for the benefit of others. So I've realised I'm much happier in a quiet pub with just a couple of friends where people are a bit more relaxed and I can have a proper chat.

At the end of the day the only person I can spend long periods of time with is my girlfriend, who is the only person who knows everything.

Rachel

Thanks Rachel! You summed it up pretty good. I am envious of you with a supportive SO. Just as you said, it is tiring hiding this side of me. When I am in that moment I described I just look around and see if there is someone there that could possibly be there just for me. All the people there seem to have some definite purpose and connection. But I can't see any for me.

This is from a study done in 2006 and I found it to be true then as now. We simply don't have confidants anymore, unless, like me you are married and then your one and only close friend, confidant is your spouse.

I don't think there is cure for this. We all think we are friends on this forum, and we are friendly, but we seldom communicate as friends. We never have conversations, we simply throw out comments, like I am doing now.

One of the biggest problems we have in conversing and not commenting is the time shift. rs started this thread two hours ago. If we were truly friends, we would be texting, or better yet actually talking on a phone, in real time.

But alas, the technology we have come to rely upon is keeping us impersonal. When I was younger (50s and 60s) I would spend afternoons with close friends talking about whatever comes after "Hey, how you doing". I remember an old girlfriend coming over to cry about not getting a car loan because she was female (1973) and we talked for hours about everything and nothing. I miss those friendships. What would the conversation have been with Heather if she had simply left me a voice mail or a text. There would not have been a conversation and there would not have been a need to be a friend. Friends are there when they are needed. Being friendly is commenting on a forum or returning a text message tomorrow.

Yes Miki you are right. Technology seems to have made us more impersonal on some levels. You just don't see people and interact face to face as much. That HOT chick at the utility payment office, you know, the one with the big brown eyes and the impossibly long eyelashes that seems to always wear miniskirts with the sexiest heels she can get away with. Oh, maybe you DON'T know because you pay your bill online now and never leave your house for such matters anymore. I do have friends right here though that I do call and actually spend time with when the stars magically align.

Your drawing these conclusions in a BAR, at night, on a weekend? You need a change of venue.

Methinks you may be correct!

Take your inspirations where you can find them, I would say.

Bars are one of the only collective venues we have left these days, one of the few places one can go and circulate and talk to a number of people and it is not considered "weird" to talk to people you do not know. Coffee houses used to be that way, back when "coffee house" was an rare and artistic place with a good chance of live music, rather than the modern Starbucks "sit and stare at your laptop" type of place.

I don't know what Idaho is like at this time of year, but where I am, north of you, we have just gone through a week of windchills as low as -42 ("exposed skin freezes in 8 minutes"). People huddle with their TV shows and their Netflix. Except the ones who go out to bars.

Perhaps you would say, "Well, there's work, you can talk to people there." Perhaps so, if I hadn't been laid off 10 months ago -- and if I had fit in at work in the first place. My friends at work were mostly the misfits, and as they themselves departed, few indeed gave me any way to contact them. And talking openly about important things at work can be dangerous to one's employment.

Yes, discussing personal issues at work could be.

Most people reach the point eventually where the public house no longer is satisfying on a deeper level. It's OK, partying full time becomes like anything else--a job.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jo1xDFAHeI

I think I have reached this point too. Anymore, the highlight of my weekends are sitting at home and watching Pawn Stars and American Pickers or some of the newer reality shows that pique my interest. It really would be great if I had someone to share with on that deeper level. I am actually very sociable and I love to try new things. Just have no motivation to do it alone

Try this rant tomorrow when you are home.
You have desccribed a seedy bar succintly, I think you posted it in the wrong spot.
Seedy bar descriptions go in the lounge I think.
You are not a rocketscientist for nothing.

This bar is anything but "seedy". A friend of mine owns it! Another friend is a cook there(great food), and yet another friend is the MC on karaoke/dj nights. Furthermore, it is populated mostly with a energetic young crowd.

you don't sound silly or strange to me at all... i could have written that exact same post sober.
i often have the very same feelings, why am i here? where do i fit in? i don't have any concrete
answers at present. i know i am happiest when dressed and out, but can be a very lonely world...

Amen sister! This is what my OP is really about. My quest for answers that are hard to find,sober or inebriated. It is just a powerless feeling that is hard to describe accurately. I've thought about coming out to some friends and the myriad of reactions I might get. Everything from total acceptance to total ostracision. As I get older the balance of thought is shifting toward coming out more instead of hiding this part of me. The reasons for staying hidden seem to weigh less and less and the reasons for opening up more and more. Maybe it's time. Thanks for all the replies and wonderful insight. Hugs,Tonya

[Foxglove]

It seems like I cannot connect with anybody there on any kind of deeper level and I wonder why I am there at all.

This is what I've often said about Planet Earth. True, there are quite a few people I feel a connection with, but most of them have been dead for several centuries at least.

Sometimes I think perhaps we're expecting too much. How can we connect with others on a deep level when we can't connect with ourselves on a deep level? How many of us truly understand ourselves? How many of us have the courage and honesty necessary to really take a good, long, hard look at ourselves? We put on an act for ourselves, and so we put on an act for others, and then we complain that we're not connecting.

And yet sometimes we do connect with people in small ways--and I've found that these small ways can actually be quite deep. There are people I connected with in a small way many years ago, yet I still remember them and the experience.

If you want to connect with someone, are you sure you're really open to it? If you do want to connect with someone, don't come on too strong. They'll have more the feeling of an invasion than a connection. Real connections can take time.

A good way for two people to connect is to be stinking drunk at the time. Then the next day you probably won't be able to look each other in the face. I speak from experience.

Best wishes, Annabelle

[Bree Wagner]

I can totally sympathize, but there's a lot to be happy about too! It's really just about finding that group where you fit in and have fun. If that's your family and other CDs that's OK and is probably better than OK, you have two groups! I'd think having one group is good, two is better, and the more the merrier. I have an amazing group of friends from back in high school that I keep in touch with but through college and over 10 years moving around and working I've rarely made more than casual friends and acquaintances. Even with that group of friends 1500 miles away I'm thankful to have them and to know there will always be a place somewhere where I totally fit in. (Even if none of them know about Bree )

[sandra-leigh]

On the point of connecting with ourselves:

It seems to me that I connected better to myself, or at least more peacefully to myself, back in my youth, walking in the woods, or laying down in a meadow, or camping under the stars. And I don't do those things anymore. The closest "adult" activity is perhaps cross-country skiing in a natural area.... and I don't do that anymore either.

"The new job's a hassle / And the kids have the flu / But it's sure nice talking to you"

[lingerieLiz]

Do you really like yourself? While I don't hang out there a lot anymore I do think that it is very similar to years ago. Having worked in them I found there were those who enjoyed it and then there were the ones who never felt a part of the scene.

I trully believe you have to feel comfortable and like yourself to enjoy going to a bar. If you are not comfortable you will send off vibes and others will avoid you. As for CDing at a bar you have to accept that some confusion will be added. If I dress wearing a pretty blouse and bra, I'm viewed differently. The interesting part is that if I'm friendly I will find frindly people. If I'm distant why would someone else want to be frienly?

[JenniferR771]

Long week, Rocket! You have been working hard and thinking about too much nerdy stuff. It takes while to unwind that analytical mind, and if the alcohol catches up to your before you establish a social connection...well...in my case I feel really isolated..so alone...so looking in from the outside. Sometimes I feel like the whole world has someplace to go, something to do, someone to talk to...except me.
Go shopping. You cannot wear the same thing to Saugatuck two years in a row--that is a rule.

[docrobbysherry]

20+ years before I began dressing, I began limiting my time with the guys I grew up with. When in a group, it was invariably all; drinking, pissing, bragging, fart jokes, and other boring, childish, frat stuff! Even tho we were into our 30's!

I did find that if it was just me and one other guy, we could often carry on interesting and penetrating chats. Even with booze involved!

I grew up as an outsider in high school for a number of reasons. None related to dressing, which I began in my 50's.

However, I became involved with our high reunions many years ago. Many of the others were the "soc's" to my "untouchable" status back then. Over the years, I've come to find many of them r now sensitive, caring individuals. Maybe they were in hi school. I'll never know. Turns out, some were as clueless back then as I was. They just ran with the in crowd. I'm not fond of all of them now. Or, them of me. But, we treat each as equals in any case!

One thing to remember when u feel like an outsider, RS, many of them may feel the same way! Which is why they continue acting. Playing that same old part everyone knows.

And, no matter what u think or feel. You'll always have much in common with those u grew up with. Because no matter what else, u all lived thru the same place and time! As those old memories fade farther into the past, it may push u closer together, too.

It has for me! Some of the most surprising things come out of the mouths of some of the most unexpected class mates at every reunion! With all differences I assumed existed back then, they WERE as clueless as I was!

And, most r fun to be around now. It's like we're all celebrating where we came from and still being here! Many of us aren't and the rest of us r running out of time!

Don't waste your time, RS. To find out who people really r, tell them who u really r! U may be VERY surprised at what happens!

Why don't I go to a reunion dressed, u ask? Sherry is the main reason. But, maybe I will anyway!

[flatlander_48]

I am just gonna click the "submit" button before I realize how silly and strange I sound right now.

No, I don't think it's silly. Rather it is more a commentary on modern life. Times have changed. It used to be that our jobs were so physical that folks went to a bar after work to just ease the pain; mental and physical. Now it probably is much less physical and more of a mental release.

You mentioned some of the types that you are likely to see in a bar. Basically everyone has their own agenda. Many don't come to hang out with friends. The come to do something else. It's still social, but people seem more focused on whatever their deal is; whether conscious or unconscious. That leaves you without the stimulation that you need because you didn't seem to come with a similar agenda. Yours is less defined and it seems there's hardly anyone else with the same viewpoint. You know, there may be other more interesting establishments with more interesting people.