True transexual?

[RachelDee]

I have been researching transgender/transexual/crossdressing and every other variation inbetween for a while, and something with transexual males(or females) is that from a very early age they 'know' they are the wrong gender.

So would that mean that anyone who can't say for certain they always felt 'the wrong gender' would not be classed as a proper transexual and is most likley just a crossdresser?

I am just wondering thats all, is that a requirement that therapists look for in diagnosing things like this? If someone has early memories of feeling the 'wrong gender' that makes them more viable than someone who didnt?

Thoughts?

[Helana]

Robert

There are three times as many secondary transsexuals (those who tranistion in mid to late life) than there are primary transsexuals (those who feel they were always a girl throughout their childhood and seek early transition).

There is a transgender spectrum with sexual needs at one end and emotional needs at the other. At the sexual end are fetishists, then come CDers who are mostly sexually driven but can become emotionally driven as they age and sexual drive lessens, then transgenderists who take their crossdressing seriously and want to display realistic femininity and incorporate this into their everyday lives, and finally transexuals who can no longer connect with a male personna and need to transition.

Imagine transgenderism can be measured 1 to 10. 1-2 is fetish, 3-6 crossdressing, 7-8 transgendered, 9-10 transsexual. People can shift anywhere between 0 to say 3 points. So a crossdresser on 6 points could end up on 9. But then a trangender on 7 points might just shift 1 to 8 and remain unchanged.

People move along the spectrum as they live their lives. And this drift only goes one way, from the sexual to the emotional. So those who are CDers, or more likely transgendered, can eventually shift into the transsexual end of the spectrum. Secondary transsexuals are just as true as primary ones, they just took longer to get to their final destination but the feelings are the same.

[MandyTS]

Primanry and secondary transexual is only one part of the spectra also. For example I consiider myself primary, I wanted SRS at the age of 8, but I did not transistion in my teens because of fear of my parents (I had planned to transistion around the age of 30 but am doing it now.

We also have primary who for the same fear thransistion late in life (if they do not commit suicide.

[FionaAlexis]

I agree with Helana though the labels I recall are 'true transexuals' and 'late onset' transexuals. It really doesn't matter how you arrive at the belief you are the wrong gender - its more how you deal with it.

So far as assessment is concerned, it seems to me that the current 'treatment' is more a 'self assessment' process over a period of time rather than a psych making a definitive Y/N diagnosis Hormone therapy and RLT/RLE is part of that process.

I think this is far different from the system 20 -30 years ago which was much more a selection process for GRS/SRS program and some TSs lied about their personal history and sexuality to get accepted.

Fiona xx

[Natasha Anne]

I've read loads of literature on this subject.

To me primary and secondary, and true and late onset transsexuals are misnomers. It is unreasonable to assume that all children understand what their discomfort means or translate that into being the wrong sex.

Many so-called secondary or late onset transsexuals are able to trace back behaviours in their childhood to wanting to be a girl.

In my case I'm transitioning in mid-life, despite knowing all my life I was a girl. Call it nuture (rather than nature), but I can always remember being pressured to be "good", told what a "smart boy" I was, and most of all, coming from a poor family, had the need to be a provider stomped all over me. I can recall dressing up from really early in my life, and being reprimanded for it. I was taught it was wrong, and this instilled fear in me, despite what I knew. It's really only in the last 1 1/2 years I've come to shed those and follow the path I do.

Sure some kids are more forthright, but to use labels such as primary or true for them is silly. The literature always tends to forget human personality and it's role in those things. Introverts/Extroverts, Expressive/Non-Expressive etc. all play a role in how and when a person communicates.

Would we call a boy who seemed a little girly in his youth, but became a really great rugby/American footballer in his adulthood a secondary sportsman, or would be accept what he was.

Get rid of the labels. It's silly to assume everyone has the same circumstances and is able to articulate things in the same ways in their early youth.

Most people never find the ability to be who they are, and be comfortable with that. If you decide to transition at 90 years old, you're still a transsexual.

[Kierci]

I do believe you make a very good point. I did notice there was no referance to sexual preferance which I just finished saying in another thread has little to no bearing on who we are in regards to this subject.
I think your posting may be of some use to GG's trying to understand. Good job and thanks.

[FionaAlexis]

Yes, labels, do tend to be misleading but equally they are necessary as a signpost to where you sit in the scheme of things and to explain your situation to friends and family.

Of course, in the TG community, they are also often used in the ‘one-up-manship’ game to set ourselves apart in some exclusive way.

I think there are a heap of factors that come into play in each of our lives that determine when we understand and put a name to our ‘condition’ and how and when we deal with it, like - our experience, our family, our character, our self esteem and confidence, our appearance and our financial status.

In my own case I was 'diagnosed' as ‘transexual’ in London in the 70s at age 21 and I was rejected from joining the GRS program here in Melbourne in the mid 80s, around age 30. I had to move on with my life. I have some regrets about not transitioning – or maybe more about not having the opportunity to go further. But then if I felt more intensely about it I probably would have.

I am always amazed at the diversity of transsexuals….

I read recently of a transsexual here who in early adult life was male police officer with family and then transitioned to female. She lived successfully as a female for many years becoming president of the local ladies bowling club in late middle age where she fell in love with one of the other club members. ‘She’ has now reverted to the male gender to marry.

Captain Sarah Parry is another Aussie example of a transsexual who doesn’t fit any standard TS profile. She captains a sailing ship that trains cadets and other young people. Her public appearance is best described as androgynous and I doubt ‘passing’ and ‘dressing’, as we discuss it here, has ever occurred to her. I’ve never seen any photos of her in classic female clothes and I don’t think she intends having GRS.

So clearly there are those who are more gender adaptable, or maybe just generally more adaptable. And also there are those who just feel more at peace identifying themselves as female or male irrespective of dress mode and body ‘plumbing’.


Fiona xx

[Helana]

Labels are how our brains work, that is how we can make sense out of the incredible complexity in this world. We can never escape from labels because they are part of our brain makeup. The important point is to remember that the world is not black and white, just varying degrees of grey. Nor is anything ever set in stone, everything changes whether quickly or slowly.

People are frightened by the idea that our position in life is not fixed, that we are all adrift at sea. That is another reason why labels are so comforting, they reassure us that there is order out there when the reality is somewhat different.

As always just know yourself and be yourself and stop worrying about labels.
Its fun to discuss it about ultimately irrelevant to who you are.

[Adele 2005]

Hi Robert,

I wish I had answers for you, but although I'm a lot older than you I'm only just beginning to ask the same questions, having struggled since I was a child with these difficult feelings.

From day one we are subjected to the stereotypes society tries to impress on us (that means family, friends, school, and work). The first question that is asked is "is it a boy or girl", and immediately we are classified! And then it goes on...

Society says:

"Men like women!"

"Women like men!"

"Men are masculine!"

"Women are feminine!"

When these lessons are beaten into you (sadly sometimes literally by bullies - and they aren't just at school!) from childhood (boys are dressed in blue and given toy guns to play with; girls are dressed in pink and given dolls to play with) we are made to consider this normal. It's all clearly defined and accepted behaviour as taught to us from an early age by society.

We are a social animal, and so it is innevitable that we wish to find some favourable recognition, acceptance and identity from the rest of society. So what do you do when you don't feel that you conform to society's lessons above that define 'normal'?

It can make you feel odd, different, a misfit, uncertain, lost, lonely, alienated, confused, frightened, anxious, to want to hide your true feelings, perhaps ashamed and even depressed. In trying to repress these thoughts, feelings and emotions we sometimes lose sense of our own identity, because we get so used to acting a conformist role that society may accept for so long, even though it's not perhaps comfortable to do so. This is understandable, because we all fear social rejection when we don't conform to expectations of us.

What I'm slowly realising, through years of agonising turmoil and emotional struggle, is that I don't have a problem: indeed, YOU don't have a problem! It's society that has the problem, because it can be a bit slow and clumsy, and it doesn't know how to deal with and accept easily people that don't easily fit into the conventional forms of behaviour it expects.

It will take time and lots of sensible thought and self-reflection to work out who you are, and with luck some good support from family and friends who will give you space, love, comfort, encouragement and even just a hug when you need it. Someday you may be able to do the same for them when they need your help.

I know this sounds very vague and inconclusive, but I think any answers you, I or anyone else here are looking for won't be found on the internet, in books, from religion, or in medicine, but within our own hearts and minds.

Here endeth my sermon on gender, sexuality, society and the individual!

Have a great day.... in fact, have a great life!

[tori-e]

Hi,

(Oops! Just realized this thread is a bit stale. (Dec 8) Oh well)

A while ago I read "My Husband Betty" by Helen Boyd. In the book, Helen tries to attach "types" to all the people they know. But soon realize that as soon as they come up with a new type they meet someone else that doesn't fit any of the types.

For me, from an early age (late 1960's) I always considered myself TS. In the 80's I discovered there was a gender clinic in my city and went for assessment. After a few sessions they told me I was CD. I was quite offended and stopped going.

Due to cut backs the clinic was disbanded a few years ago. Recently, I've gotten to know a number TG's here and many have had some experience with the clinic. It turns out the clinic had quite rigid standards and a lot of people that needed help , myself included, didn't get it.

The older I get the more I realize that the professionals, whether doctors or mechanics, don't know it all and aren't always right. Ultimately, what type you are and whether or not you need to transition can only be answered by you.

Tori

[Elizabeth]

Hi girls,

All this talk of "true transsexuals" begs the question "Is this a competition?". To me it's not. If anyone thinks they are somehow better than me because of the date at which they realized they were transsexual, that is just silly to me. That would be like me saying I am somehow better than crossdressers, which I am not.

I think it matters very little why or when a person feels like they have the wrong body. I think the only thing that is important is that we all feel it. And even though crossdressers do not feel the need to be a woman full time, they still have the feeling of needing to present themselves as woman, something we can all relate to.

As I move forward in my journey I will not be modeling my journey after anyone elses, I will find my own way. It is all of you who help me do that. I find no ones feelings of transgenderedness to be any better or worse than anyone elses. I just do not see how anyone can possibly dertermine their journey is any better or easier or has any more value than anyone elses.

I am a person who feels that they were given the wrong body, that something went wrong and my body turned male when it should have stayed female, or my brain never made the change to boy. Either way, anyone who feels that same as me, that they are not in the right body, is no better or worse off than me, provided they have accepted themselves.

I really enjoy reading all of you ladies stories of how you are transforming and coping. It helps me in my own journey and I thank all of you for that.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[CaptLex]

Hi girls,

And boy . . .

Either way, anyone who feels that same as me, that they are not in the right body, is no better or worse off than me, provided they have accepted themselves.

Hear, hear!

I totally agree with you, Elizabeth, it's taken me sooooo long, but I've finally got it. It doesn't matter how we got here, but point is we got here and now we know. What we decide to do with the information is another matter.

[bobbie frances]

I am a 62 yr old woman who has always known I was female but tried to acomplish everything a " HE_MAN" would to please my familyand try to make life easier for myself. But 4 years ago I couldnt contain this woman anymore so here I am ,sometimes in androganous apearance,but never the less all woman.A friend on premarin had stoke lately and I am frightened,Ive been off a week and I get so blue without it.I know why suiside rate is high now.

[Alison Michelle]

All this talk of "true transsexuals" begs the question "Is this a competition?"

Elizabeth,

I don't think most people that post here are in a competition. Some are, ..what ever. I label my self to understand different thoughts and feeling inside me. I am an information junky, I try to be as well versed in something as possible. I feel my life is well worth the time invested in such a misunderstood subject as CD/TV/TS.

I am mostly comfortable with who I am today, it is dealing with the feelings of others, that is the question. The people here give me insight into their life's path's. This in-turn builds on my acceptance of my self and others.

If I'm true to my self I'll be just fine.

all around everyone.