Do you want to know if you are a transvestic fetishists?

[NicoleScott]

It may be important for the APA to throw the TF's out from under the TG umbrella (treatment, insurance...just guessing, I don't know), but why it's important to drive the point home here is baffling to me. I doubt that there are many (if any) purely transvestic fetishists here on the forum.....emphasis on purely.....those whose wearing is only about wearing it, getting off, and then getting it off. And doing it so frequently that it disrupts a normal life. This forum has little to support that (not a criticism, just the opposite). But there are lots of us here that get aroused by dressing, but as Sherry indicated, that doesn't mean that all CDing activity is sexual. It is possible for us to enjoy expressing a femme side occasionally and have a sexual fetish as well. They are not mutually exclusive, and so we won't fit into just one box. It seems that the more the discussion goes on, the more it is about labels (and I LIKE labels because they're useful!)...such as what defines a transitioned TS (a topic better suited for another forum), or whether TF's belong under the TG umbrella.

[Lucy_Bella]

It may be important for the APA to throw the TF's out from under the TG umbrella (treatment, insurance...just guessing, I don't know), but why it's important to drive the point home here is baffling to me. I doubt that there are many (if any) purely transvestic fetishists here on the forum.....emphasis on purely.....those whose wearing is only about wearing it, getting off, and then getting it off. And doing it so frequently that it disrupts a normal life. This forum has little to support that (not a criticism, just the opposite). But there are lots of us here that get aroused by dressing, but as Sherry indicated, that doesn't mean that all CDing activity is sexual. It is possible for us to enjoy expressing a femme side occasionally and have a sexual fetish as well. They are not mutually exclusive, and so we won't fit into just one box. It seems that the more the discussion goes on, the more it is about labels (and I LIKE labels because they're useful!)...such as what defines a transitioned TS (a topic better suited for another forum), or whether TF's belong under the TG umbrella.

Nicole,

This is what it say's for the intro of this particular "FORUM" ....

"Male to Female Crossdressing(102 Viewing)
This section is for those interested in discussing all areas of male to female crossdressing.
Moderators - Shelly Preston, Eryn and Lorileah"

Notice it say's " all areas of male to female cross-dressing" Where else was I suppose to post this? Also it seems as if you are policing why I even brought this up as I already made it clear from my" intro" that it was for a "discussion"..And as for what Sherry said.. Great !! I am glad that this thread might have worked for "some people" to get a better understanding of them selves now ,even tho it's years later ...better than never .. All I can say about this thread is for those of you who question and are angered ( for what ever reason) as to why I posted this.. The best way to get a thread to go away is to not feed it. Soon it will get buried behind the front page and forgotten .. If you are so anti about the subject why feed it?

[CherylFlint]

“Mirror, mirror, on the wall”.
And that about sums it up, at least for me.
I know who and what I am dressed or not, but THEY don’t know, so I wear a dress to let them know.
When I’m dressed and in an adult video store, the message is fairly clear.
But I must say, wearing the “appropriate” attire makes for a more enjoyable performance, I’m sure.
I’d rather be dressed than not. It has nothing to do with sex for sex’s sake, but it has everything to do with who, and what, I am, or should’ve been.
Think of it as on a perpetual birth control pill, without the cramps. Lucky is how I look at it.
Back to the mirror, I like what I see and I hope guys feel the same.

[ReineD]

You walk into a club and see several CDers sitting around a table, fully transformed and looking good. One of them gets aroused by crossdressing, but you don't know that because he's not masturbating under the table. He keeps his sexual activities private.

Then technically, Nicole, I don't think you can say that this person is strictly a transvestic fetishists. He enjoys dressing for other reasons than sex, since she is enjoying an outing with friends, and interacting with others while she is presenting as a woman. The CDing for her is more than dress/release/take-the-clothes-off.

Just because many CDers still enjoy being sexual in private, does not mean they are TF. Someone who is TF and nothing else, doesn't enjoy spending time as a woman if it doesn't involve sexual release. Also, things evolve. Early on it may be strictly transvestic fetichism for someone, then it migrates to mostly TF interspersed with some dressing sessions that don't culminate in orgasm (maybe a TG support group), and over time, as age sets in and libido naturally ebbs, it settles into mostly non-sexual with occasional sexual releases. In general. Don't you think?

[NicoleScott]

Yes, Reine, I agree with everything you said. I was making the point that having a sexual aspect to CDing doesn't make you a TF. And, I doubt that there are many (if any) true TF's here. If psychological experts want to remove TF's from the TG group, OK with me. But doesn't it all (here we go again) depend on what is considered TG? Here on the forum, some think TG means having some level of internal feminine identity and crossdresses to express that identity, while others adhere to the broad definition which puts crossdressers under the umbrella (since they wear women's clothes thus crossing traditional gender norms).

Lucy_Bella, I'm not angry and I'm not the forum police. I didn't say TS issues aren't allowed here, I said TS issues are better suited to that forum.

[ReineD]

I was making the point that having a sexual aspect to CDing doesn't make you a TF.

Exactly! I seriously doubt that no one on this site ever experiences any release when dressed.

And, I doubt that there are many (if any) true TF's here.

I brought that up earlier when mentioning the sheer amounts of dating/porn/fantasy CD sites out there. I tend to think that the vast majority of men who like to put on one or several items of clothing do it strictly for fetish and the stuff comes off as soon as they're done. Obviously these men would not be members here. And who knows? Maybe the reason we have so many members who have joined, compared to active members, is because the fetish CDers decided after joining that this forum wasn't for them. I agree with you though, that true TFs are on the rare side here, if there are any. It wouldn't be fun for them because they wouldn't have anything to talk about other than sexual fantasies.

[Lucy_Bella]

Exactly! I seriously doubt that no one on this site ever experiences any release when dressed.



I tend to think that the vast majority of men who like to put on one or several items of clothing do it strictly for fetish and the stuff comes off as soon as they're done. Obviously these men would not be members here. And who knows? Maybe the reason we have so many members who have joined, compared to active members, is because the fetish CDers decided after joining that this forum wasn't for them. I agree with you though, that true TFs are on the rare side here, if there are any. It wouldn't be fun for them because they wouldn't have anything to talk about other than sexual fantasies.

Reine,
I think you are right on to what a Fetish cder is ( and here it comes) except......
Take the "release" part and broaden it.. Sexual Fetishes ( can/may/usually) start from the "release" time ( puberty for most ) but that isn't the end of the "fetish" it becomes a "mental issue".. I use myself as an example my dressing has to fit my fetish ( style of certain clothing,material it's made from and color) or it just doesn't happen..I do not bother..

Starting this fetish was long before the internet and in time has become embedded into me ..Finding this site and trying to learn more about myself ( because I was not aware I had a fetish issue until recently) is why I am here and you are correct I can not related to just about every thread they have here..So in time I will fade away again unless I can get more "like minded" threads such as this one going on now..

Yes that makes me some sorta freak .. Here anyways I never knew why before ( Guess I am just stupid up there sometimes) but it all makes sense to me now..

Lucy_Bella, I'm not angry and I'm not the forum police. I didn't say TS issues aren't allowed here, I said TS issues are better suited to that forum.

Nicole, I know you are not angry and this does become a problem when a small percentage ( to this page) of people like me invade this page.. You have every right to defend, if you will, your turf.. All I wanted to do was have an open discussion maybe we can all learn from each other.. No hard feelings here I think you do very well at explaining yourself and I love getting the input and knowledge you offer to me and other folks at this site..

[docrobbysherry]

Reine,
I think you are right on to what a Fetish cder is ( and here it comes) except......
Take the "release" part and broaden it.. Sexual Fetishes ( can/may/usually) start from the "release" time ( puberty for most ) but that isn't the end of the "fetish" it becomes a "mental issue".. I use myself as an example my dressing has to fit my fetish ( style of certain clothing,material it's made from and color) or it just doesn't happen..I do not bother..

Starting this fetish was long before the internet and in time has become embedded into me .------------
Yes that makes me some sorta freak ..--------------------------------

I don't think your "situation" is as rare or freaky as u may think, Lucy. I'm kind of an odd duck here, too. Yet I've received many PMs over the years from supporters on both sides of the CD/TS fence. And, from others who have similar dressing paraphilia or fetishes, for lack of better words!

[NicoleScott]

Lucy_Bella, I agree with Sherry, you are not some sorta freak. There seems to be an endless list of "things" that have the power to arouse. Pantyhose fetishes are pretty common, but I once chatted online with a guy who had a fetish for bare legs. I have heard (here on the forum) from a few others with particular attractions to fabric materials and colors. I have always had a curiosity as to when and how fetishes happen. I'm not distressed by mine, and prefer to think of them as "enhancements" rather than "disorders".

[mary something]

In regard to "TS" women who are self identified lesbians; Some are wonderful people but I've met some who straight up creep me out. I have NEVER met a TS girl who likes men that I thought was creepy, but I have met several who were all very vocal about being lesbians, and if I closed my eyes they were indistinguishable from dirty old men.

I've noticed this too. Watch this video and you'll see where I think this misconception comes from

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3342071.html


and as far as fetishes go, technically it's not a fetish if it's an arousal enhancer. Fetishes are defined by the inability to orgasm or enjoy sexual activity WITHOUT the object, not by the fact that it makes the activity more enjoyable. I know a LOT of girls who wouldn't typically have sex unless they've shaved their arm pits and legs and are looking good, but that doesn't make this a fetish for them because they are capable of having an orgasm still.

[Lucy_Bella]

I don't think your "situation" is as rare or freaky as u may think, Lucy. I'm kind of an odd duck here, too.

Thanks Doc, we have been here for just about the same amount of time that I can recall from another post.. I knew something was wrong ,mostly from reading all of the average threads on this site.. So just being honest here, I tried to fit in because I actually thought I was T.G... ( not that there is any thing wrong with that)..

I really did my best trying to be a girl, it just wasn't fitting and deep down before I started I knew this.. I just didn't know why, why do I have this urges to dress? I never threw in the thought of a fetish seriously before ( though has past my mind before)..

So I did some deep internet searching and allot of what I have learned has also came from what I have learned from here..Reading about how other people express their dressing and knowing that's not how I expressed mine was enough for me to find out why.. So going off of what I did know and finding this information out that I didn't know inspired me to think..I wonder if anyone else would like to know instead of having to go through countless hours of searching..I didn't mean to offend anyone that wasn't my goal at all..

Thanks Doc appreciate the input..

[Matia]

Maybe and if so ..Be it.. But I am also a "realist"

I just happen to find real science fascinating I don't like hearing we are stuck with what we were dealt and if there was a slight chance for a cure,treatment or advancements in either ..I would love to know about it wouldn't you ? ..We don't have to settle ..

real science ? when it comes to sociology/sexuology etc and other similar sciences I would question the word "real"

- personally I found the biggest comfort in seeing myself as a bigender person, I am happy with both my feminine and masculine sides, but to be honest, my sexuality opens mainly in my feminine side, as a man i am almost a-sexual. I think that transevestite fetishism label is too narrow, I think that it's little offensive, and when it comes to these things, it can be hardly measured, even if i try to be as honest to myself as possible to describe how i feel, or if i try to describe what my "condition" is, i find out that in time it's deeper than i originally thought

in perfect world, i would be happiest if i could freely switch bodies and be a man or a woman at will, and it doesn't have to be sexual, i would like to be in position when world just sees me as a girl and be left alone

[Trishpdxcd2]

Well just goes to show we are all different. For me it certainly started out as a fetish of sorts and there is still a strong sexual component but it has morphed into more of a pure pleasure when I get to enjoy my feminine side. Though there is something vaguely sexual about it, I rarely get off when dressed.

[Lucy_Bella]

I've noticed this too. Watch this video and you'll see where I think this misconception comes from

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3342071.html


and as far as fetishes go, technically it's not a fetish if it's an arousal enhancer. Fetishes are defined by the inability to orgasm or enjoy sexual activity WITHOUT the object, not by the fact that it makes the activity more enjoyable. I know a LOT of girls who wouldn't typically have sex unless they've shaved their arms and legs and are looking good, but that doesn't make this a fetish for them because they are capable of having an orgasm still.

From websters..c : an object or bodily part whose real or fantasied presence is psychologically necessary for sexual gratification and that is an object of fixation to the extent that it may interfere with complete sexual expression

[mary something]

I think we're agreeing Lucy. That's why I used the term arousal enhancer instead of fetish. If someone is capable of achieving orgasm while naked for example then they do not have a fetish for crossdressing, it just makes it better in some way.

[Lucy_Bella]

I think we're agreeing Lucy. That's why I used the term arousal enhancer instead of fetish. If someone is capable of achieving orgasm while naked for example then they do not have a fetish for crossdressing, it just makes it better in some way.

I think we are agreeing to disagree here is what the meaning states "real" or fantasied and yes they actually do have a fetish for cding on record today at the APA ..Most here will not agree and for good reasons you are not into x-dressing for the fetish purpose..I am curious have you read any of the older post that have lead us up to this point? I do appreciate your input and I do understand where you are coming from thanks..

[NicoleScott]

Other sources say "may become necessary" rather than "is necessary". The way I see it is that if an object causes arousal, it's a fetish, but if arousal isn't possible without the object, it's an extreme fetish, especially if it disrupts a person's normal life.
I wonder when, since the APA regards TF as a disorder, we will hear about claims of disability caused by the disorder. "I can't function normally at work because all I can think about is wearing ___________." I have read about people who do the fetish "activity" a dozen times a day or more. That seems pretty disruptive to a normal life.

[Lucy_Bella]

I wonder when, since the APA regards TF as a disorder, we will hear about claims of disability caused by the disorder. "I can't function normally at work because all I can think about is wearing ___________." I have read about people who do the fetish "activity" a dozen times a day or more. That seems pretty disruptive to a normal life.

Nicole, imagine the energy it takes for a dozen times a day

I've also read that the APA will not diagnose you with having T.F. unless it does turn into a disorder like interfering with daily life with work ,marriages, being unsocial /lonely etc.. The way they look at it is unless it disrupts your life in a semi major or major way it's , harmless activity.. They do not want to take something they consider harmless and make it worse because it can cause depression sometimes serious when the fetish dressing stops..

[NicoleScott]

Nicole, imagine the energy it takes for a dozen times a day

Yeah, they must REALLY like wearing___________.

[Ressie]

If I'm not a transvestic festishist I'm not too far from it. I'm also a slow reader so I haven't read every post in this thread.

Yes I always change out of my women's clothes after an orgasm.
No, I don't need female clothing to achieve orgasm.

The first time I heard of men crossdressing because it relaxes them I didn't understand it. It's always made me nervous because of the fear of getting caught. Getting caught masturbating while crossdressed would be very stressful.

Also let me repeat that when I was 17 I really felt that I should have been born a GG. I wanted to be girl, but not to the point that I felt I was born in the wrong body. And the need to fit in as a male seemed more important. But I always got a thrill out of women's clothing.

[Lucy_Bella]

Wikipedia explaind how the APA diagnose's T.F.....


Transvestic fetishism refers specifically to cross-dressing; sexual arousal in response to individual garments is fetishism.[2] A person who is diagnosed with Gender Identity Disorder should not receive a diagnosis of Tranvestic Fetishism,[2] although sometimes those with this diagnosis do go on to develop gender dysphoria, and then meet the criteria for a diagnosis of Gender Identity Disorder.[2] Most men who have transvestic fetishism do not have a problem with their assigned sex.
Some male transvestic fetishists collect women's clothing, e.g. nightgowns, babydolls, bridal gowns, slips, brassieres, and other types of nightwear, lingerie, stockings, pantyhose, shoes, and boots, items of a distinct feminine look and feel. They may dress in these feminine garments and take photographs of themselves while living out their fantasies. According to the DSM-IV, this fetishism has been described only in heterosexual men.
There are two key criteria before a psychiatric diagnosis of "transvestic fetishism" is made:[2]
Recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, urges, or behaviour, involving cross-dressing.
This causes clinically significant distress or impairment, whether socially, at work, or elsewhere.
Thus, transvestic fetishism is not diagnosed unless it causes significant problems for the person concerned.

[ReluctantDebutant]

I believe the root cause of my cross-dressing is Autogynephilia. If I was asked why I cross-dress about 5 or 10 years ago the idea that it was some sort of fetish would not have crossed my mind. I would've said "I just liked it", "it makes me feel happy", or"it relieves stress". I felt cross-dressing was something special that exhilarated me that made me feel good. To say that it was for sexual purposes would've been out of the question. I thought of myself as a decent person whose motivations for doing things were pure and honorable and not because of some lowly base indecent reasons such as mere sexual pleasure. No I was cross-dressing to express the more sensitive, peaceful side of myself. But despite me "knowing" this is what it was for us to couldn't help but wonder why I did it. So I kept searching.

I came across the term Autogynephilia on the web along with Blanchard's theory. Though I wasn't convinced of everything he had to say basic premise of his theory opened my mind. And for the first time in my cross-dressing life the answers to the question why became so apparent to me. I could not fool myself anymore and a good or pleasurable feelings I had while dressing were from sexual arousal. I may never have done any sexual acts while enfeme I couldn't deny the intense exhilaration I got from the clothes. The truth had always been there I don't know whether it was willful blindness or naïveté that kept me from seeing it. The revelation of Autogynephilia has helping out a lot in dealing with my cross-dressing. I find knowing the why of it all immensely helpful I only wish I had learned of this when I was lot younger.

[LilSissyStevie]

Lucy, you seem to put a lot of stock in the APA and their DSM. So this interview with Dr. Blanchard should be revealing. What it reveals to me is 1) he is an ultra-reactionary ideologue with regards to sex and gender. He believes that the only legitimate reason for sexual activity is procreation - anything else is a fetish. Blanchard is the master at ginning up new paraphilias (fetishes). Even my Southern Baptists kin don't believe that crap anymore. He believes that homosexuality is a paraphilia. 2) he's unprincipled. Note that he proposed autoandrophilia for inclusion to the DSM-5 when he doesn't even believe it exists - probably because he doesn't believe women have true sexual feelings. He just wanted to make sure that "feminists" didn't get on his back.

This comes from a guy that believes there are two types of transsexuals: homosexual men that transition in order to trick straight men in to having sex with them and non-homosexual men that transition in order to have sex with themselves. And if they dispute this, the're lying.

This isn't science, it's ideology. The whole of the DSM is ideology. If people experience "clinically significant distress or impairment, whether socially, at work, or elsewhere" because of their sexual interests, it's because of people like Dr. Blanchard being in a position to stigmatize it.

[Lucy_Bella]

Lucy, you seem to put a lot of stock in the APA and their DSM.

L.S.S.
I don't know if you have read all my post but I did leave a link in one of them that directs you to recent and old studies of the DMS5 work ..The work has been revised several times because much of the original work was flawed.. Really now all I give Blanchard credit for is some of the studies ( not all ) and coining the name.. Much of his work has been defined from other professional studies..

There has been a push from the T.G. communities to have the APA remove transvestic fetishists from the T.G. umbrella but even with strong opposition from them the APA kept the disorder as a mental disorder in early spring of this year.. I think you had until 06/15/13 to sign a petition to have the APA remove "transvestic disorder" but here is the link to that.. http://www.bilerico.com/2011/05/tran...rans_dia_1.php

Here is another link ...In this link they use the clinical name Trans sexual often just so you know I guess everyone who is male and wears female clothing are T.S.....This is from the opposition ..http://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2...now-it-anyway/

I find knowing the why of it all immensely helpful I only wish I had learned of this when I was lot younger.

Reluctant..You pretty much summed me to a "T".. Since reading and placing everything I have learned that best fits me ..I feel better and more secure and I don't know if this is a temporary feeling or not ( most likely ) but most of my urges to dress have all left..

[mary something]

L.S.S.
I feel better and more secure and I don't know if this is a temporary feeling or not ( most likely ) but most of my urges to dress have all left..

have you ever experienced the urge lessening before and then getting stronger?