Leave any maleness at home..

[Rogina B]

The mainstream world holds many possible adventures for a T girl,for sure.And,if you aren't able to be viewed 100 percent of the time as a GG,then everyone falls in the same boat,from recreational CD to transitioning TS..you don't plan on passing close scrutiny.. So,anything can happen,and especially with rednecks! Here is what happened Friday pm... I had two tipsy couples want to sit beside me at my regular spot.I was busy with the band..Next thing,one very rednecky guy has his arm up on the bar and tells me that he wants to armwrestle me! I graciously told him that women don't armwrestle. His reply was that "he never saw arms like that on a woman"..His tipsy wife then says in my ear,"he hasn't been exposed to much and I really like your answer". I ignore the two couples and their drinking and dancing get going..Next thing I know,the touchy feelly wife that thought she could bond with me is back in my ear.."what are you looking for tonight?" Nothing,I am here listening to my friends play. "No,really,I am SURE you are looking for something". "No I am not" was my final reply and I turned away. Well,after the foursome were spent and getting up to leave,the armwrestler came over and put his hand up like he wanted to "highfive me or some silly gesture" When my hand went up,he grabbed it,put his other hand around my shoulder,and pulled our faces together and squished his lips into mine...NOT A KISS, a squish!! Nothing nice about it,especially in front of 50 onlookers. He finally let me go,and off they went,out the door. They were not local. Anyway,3 women immediately rushed up with the WTF was that ? And then proceeded to tell me that I handled his assault way better than they would have.. I just laughed cause it is just another adventure in the mainstream world and further proof that most often leaving any maleness at home is the best plan.

[STACY B]

Yep ,, That's why I try an keep this whole deal an the Booze in two different worlds . I can still remember that guy !

He is in my not to distant past ,, An I know how my thought pattern was then an I know how they tick an the booze makes them do thing they wouldn't normally do in another setting ,,, Keep your guard up an be safe ,, Bars are where the Boogy Man likes to show his face ,,,lol,,,,

[linda allen]

..... So,anything can happen,and especially with rednecks! ..................Next thing,one very rednecky guy ...........

Rogina, I find your use of the term "rednecks" and "rednecky" just as offensive as if someone had used the term "fagott" or "he-she" to describe a crossdresser.

I have friends and family who would describe thenmselves as "rednecks". Also former co-workers. They hunt, they fish, they go to car races or watch them on TV and they drive four wheel drive pickups. They are also very nice and very normal people. For all I know, some of them might be crossdressers as well.

If we want acceptance from others, we must learn to be accepting ourselves and placing labels on people who may look a certain way is not going to get us that acceptance.

Certainly you have the language skills to post without using offensive labels.

[Beverley Sims]

Linda,
I wonder whether you are on the same wavelength.
I view a redneck as someone who would be outwardly violent to others that did not fit their extreme male mould.
Normal males hunt and shoot wild life, skin and cook it and drink beer.
I view a redneck as someone who would be spiteful.
As for the person that Rogina speaks about, he was drunk.
And there is no accounting for peoples actions when drunk.

[deebra]

Rogina, I'm from Va. and also use the term as you did, it refers to an obnousious jerk, exactly what they were, and find nothing wrong with it. The others mentioned were hunters, fisherman, 4 wheelers; not rednecks.

[Laura912]

The following is from that great fount of information, Wikipedia. It is not a polite term. I have used it with friends in jest, but when used seriously, it can hurt as do other derogatory terms. And it has nothing to do with crossdressing.

"Redneck is a derogatory slang term used in reference to poor, uneducated white farmers, especially from the southern United States.[1][2] It is similar in meaning to cracker (especially regarding Georgia and Florida), hillbilly (especially regarding Appalachia and the Ozarks),[3] and white trash (but without the last term's suggestions of immorality).[4][5][6]"

[linda allen]

The two posts above this one remind me of the arguments that the "N" word is not insulting to black people, that it just refers to poor, dirty, or criminal minded people. I hope we can all agree that that's not the case.

Most folks in the USA have at least heard of Jeff Foxworthy and his very popular "You might be a redneck" jokes. Do you really think he is talking about violent or spiteful people? Really?

I posted that many of my friends and family identify themselves as "rednecks". Do you think by that they are telling people that they are violent or spiteful? I don't think so.

If you apply different definitions to words than most folks do, you hurt your communication ability and confuse or offend others.

I can't control what people post on this forum so if you want to post "redneck" a hundred times, you can do it. Just know that I, and at least a few other people find it offensive when used in this context.

The person in the original post was drunk and offensive, that's all.

edit: Since another post was added while I was typing, I'll have to add that Wikipedia is not a great source of reliable information, it's a source for junior high school students to get information without doing actual research themselves. Again, consider the Jeff Foxworthy jokes (he made a career of telling them).

[LeaP]

Your latter word – assault – is the right one. There's no adventure in this story. I don't know that I would apply the word mainstream to it, either. Then, there is the bit about maleness… if you were read, what does leaving maleness behind have to do with anything?

Finally, the concept of being in the same boat is so narrow and limited, considering the range of people you mention, that I don't really see the point. I suppose that I am Indo-European, but it doesn't have much applicability to my day-to-day life. Do you really think that someone in transition would experience that assault the same way you did? Or that the impact and after-effects might be very different?

[kimdl93]

wow...that is utterly weird. Evidently he and his wife are looking for something. Sorry you had the misfortune of attracting their attention! But you handled it well.

[Ina Girdle]

Rogina, Good for you! You did the right thing. He was either trying to fullfil a latent fantasy of his own or was trying to get you to throw the first punch. I can't say I would have had the wherewithal to stand my groung and be the better woMAN! I applaud you!!

[Rogina B]

Linda,There is a large faction of America that is quite non accepting of anything different than their world.It isn't about being a "country bumpkin" . It is about a certain mindset that exists mainly in the South that is unhappy with anything different than they are used to. And by the way,there are crossdressers that because they are so in the closet,would succumb to peer pressure to "mess with" and out and about girl if their group was doing it.I am sure of that.Would you stand up for me if I walked into the store at your marina and as I was walking out,one of your buddies said something about me? I doubt you would!

[Rogina B]

Lea,If you are seen as being Trans,it is all the same.They don't know what is in your panties,and don't really care. So,in that regard,all of us if "clocked" by an observer fall in the same boat.It was only the other day that Badtranny wrote in a thread about "what if she and ? were to visit some hardware store somewhere and I don't remember what. But her point was that it would be obvious to the store people that they were T something. So,not everyone feels they get by undetected just because they are transitioning. So,a "T" that is "detected" can be one from any part on the T spectrum.

[Barbara Ella]

Rogina, sorry this happened, but it is so totally representative of way too many attitudes towards women. Not even going to get into what he and his wife were looking for..lol. I am sure in their minds it was "no harm no foul." Can't abide that, they really have no idea of the harm that can be done if one is not as strong and steeled against the world's actions as you are. i agree, when out as Rogina or Barbara, it is always best to understand what that means and be it completely. I would have totally freaked!!

Hugs,

Barbara

[I Am Paula]

A redneck demonstrates, and is proud of 'A glorious lack of sophistication'. Jeff Foxworthy's words, not mine.

[Lorileah]

Back on topic people. The OP wasn't saying anything to cause this argument. You made your point move along. Any arguments from here on about the word will be deleted. Got it????

[Deedee Skyblue]

I get the point about the maleness. A typical male reaction would probably be to knee the guy in the groin - that would definitely be what I would be thinking. And then there would be a fight and I'm not really a fighter and we might both end up in jail and me in wearing women's clothes and probably surrounded by more drunks.

Very difficult to react correctly - but you did.

Deedee

[Julie Gaum]

Rog's reaction to a very unexpected move by a drunk was probably the only action anybody might take. He could have screamed,
yelled insults as they departed or punched him in the face. Can't think of a better option than what Rog did --- which was nothing.
As noted by others, obviously both of those characters had personal agendas of which I couldn't care less. I have, in the past, encountered a number of black gang leaders and riot provocateurs who used the "N" word verbally and in writing when referring to their followers in a loving way but if I were to do this same I would have been shot. Same is true in various countries and religions --- okay for one of your own to use derogatory descriptions but not tolerated by an outsider. Spent many years supervising stores in every southern state --- "redneck" had many different meanings depending on who you were, where you were and what you were doing.
I had some district managers who believed in having a babe in every city while the wife "should be bare-foot and pregnant". They also believed, as does this chef lady making the news, that the Civil War never ended! I called these men "rednecks" to their faces and they only laughed for their daddy and grandaddy were too. It's true, saw it often. In fact the Confederate flag flew over the Montgomery Capitol building until recently. Does that make all southerners bigoted? Of course not. I give credit to the military services --- once extremely bigoted --- to issue orders to restaurants and stores in military towns that they "would be considered off limits" if they were
to show any signs of bigotry to the troops. Most southerners of my generation did mellow considerably over the years while the next two generations have, for the most part, displayed more accepting attitudes. Witness our President. Am really wandering now ---sorry.
Will leave it for Rog to cover the "Tran" aspect of this thread as he has far more experience manning the barricades than I.
Julie

[linda allen]

Linda,There is a large faction of America that is quite non accepting of anything different than their world.It isn't about being a "country bumpkin" . It is about a certain mindset that exists mainly in the South that is unhappy with anything different than they are used to. ..................

What happened to you could have happend anywhere in the country. North, South, East, or West. Biggotry is everywhere. So is stupidity. Many people cannot control what they do when alcohol is involved. I've been in a lot of bars and such in my day and I've seen a lot of this. I watched two drunken friends attempt to fight each other over a woman. They were both so drunk that they fell down trying to hit the other and stayed down. I've watched married women flirt with other men in front of their husbands and the husbands try to fight the men for it. It's odd what the man's female companion did, but again, that could have been anywhere in the country.

If there's a lesson to be learned here it is that if we want to stay out of situations like this, we have to consider where we go when we dress. A GG wouldn't usually go to a rowdy bar alone, neither should a crossdresser when dressed. There are parts of any town or city where women don't go alone and we should take the same precautions.

If you find yourself in an uncomfortable situation, the safest strategy is to move away from it. In this case, you could have moved to a different seat as soon as these people began to annoy you. Or, you could have firmly told him to stop bothering you as soon as he started messing with you. You could have asked the bartender for help. You might want to consider scouting out places like this in advance in male mode to determine if they are safe places to go dressed.

In theory, crossdressers (and women, blacks, hispanics, etc.) should be able to go anywhere they wish and be allowed to do so in peace. In reality, that is not the case. Perhaps it will be sometime in the future, but it's not the case now.

[Marleena]

Leave any maleness at home.. I get it. If you're dressed as a lady, act like one. Rogina handled it like one. Ladies don't arm wrestle with men and she wasn't there to pick up guys either.

I'm surprised Rogina is being judged here and where she was at all. She was at a bar to hang out with her friends in a band, she was doing nothing wrong. She ran in to ignorant people that obviously don't know anything about TG people. It can happy anywhere drinks are served and people became brave and stupid.

[LeaP]

Sorry, Rogina, I don't see it the way you do. Even if the picture looks the same to the observer, it doesn't mean the same thing to the observee. I.e., the similarity is an illusion, not reality.

Let me ask a question. Did you actually not like what happened ("Nothing nice about it"), or did you have mixed feelings about it ("many possible adventures")? I can read your OP either way.

She was at a bar to hang out with her friends in a band, she was doing nothing wrong.

Agreed.

[Lorileah]

If you find yourself in an uncomfortable situation, the safest strategy is to move away from it. In this case, you could have moved to a different seat as soon as these people began to annoy you.

So being bullied out of your seat is acceptable? Seems she was there first

Or, you could have firmly told him to stop bothering you as soon as he started messing with you. You could have asked the bartender for help.

now those are two options I will agree with. I would add politely to the firmly part though

[/QUOTE]

[linda allen]

Leave any maleness at home.. I get it. If you're dressed as a lady, act like one. Rogina handled it like one. Ladies don't arm wrestle with men and she wasn't there to pick up guys either.

I'm surprised Rogina is being judged here and where she was at all. She was at a bar to hang out with her friends in a band, she was doing nothing wrong. She ran in to ignorant people that obviously don't know anything about TG people. It can happy anywhere drinks are served and people became brave and stupid.

I am not "judging her", I am pointing out reality. She went to a bar, apparently by herself. Unfortunately, this is a risky move and something that most females would not do. We need to think and act like females if we wish to present as females. It's a shame, but it is reality. Some males look at single females in a bar as fair game.

[linda allen]

So being bullied out of your seat is acceptable? Seems she was there first

Yes, she was there first and she had a perfect right to stay there. Unfortunately, sometimes we are better off forgetting our "rights" and avoiding confrontations. In a situation like this (and you don't have to be crossdressed to be in this situation), you make your choice and deal with the consequences. It's possible to be "dead right".

[Marleena]

C'mon Linda, Rogina is out and about on a regular basis. She knows the ropes and was just sharing an experience. If you were making a point for the other ladies then that's fine but I didn't see it that way.

[Deedee Skyblue]

May years ago, a woman went into a bar called Big Dan's in New Bedford, MA. She was raped on the pool table, while a number of men stood around and watched it happen - some of the laughing and cheering. My roommate's girlfriend said 'It was her own fault. She should have known better than to go into that place alone.'

I can 100% NOT understand that attitude. There should be nowhere in the world that a woman should have to 'know better' about - or a man - or a man dressed as a woman. The people who do things like rape women on pool tables, or plant an unwanted smack on a gurl who is just hanging out with the band - they are the ones who should 'know better'. Harassment is generally not the fault of the one being harassed.

Deedee