A question for those here who identify as male :)

[Teresa Monsivais]

Hey Tinker-bell this is a very good question. I identify as being male and love being a male. I love suits and ties and shoes and jackets, belts and socks! However, I also love high heel shoes. For me its very arousing and soothing and I dress so I can use heels out in public. I rather get fully dressed and hide behind make-up and a wig so that I can wear heels and hope I go unnoticed. Sometimes I wish I could just wear the high heels without having to get dolled up. I also began using women underwear bc I feel sexy and feeling sexy turns me on just like the heels do. I notice that I try to dress similar to what I am attracted to heels, short skirts, long hair. When I go out as Teresa I do enjoy it but I think I can relate to what you wrote about being competitive and driven to perfect it. I do want to perfect it and would like to be a close to passable as I can (and I may never get there because of my physical characteristics). But not because I want to be a woman but rather to blend in more and not have the spotlight on me. So I begin to work on my mannerisms, the way I dance, walk etc. My voice is something I won't change I don't know why but I don't. So that's what I think. Would I want to be a woman day in and day out, no way you girls go through much just to get out the door and the clothes is very sexy but uncomfortable ( at least the clothes I am interested in). Some of my girlfriends friends know about Teresa but none of my friends know because for me its similar to something I do with my girlfriend that is intimate and considered private. To those I don't know I don't care because I don't know them. So we hang out at places where I don't know anyone.

[docrobbysherry]

Like your style, Tink! I have posted MANY similar question threads that tip toed around this/these subjects when I first arrived here 7 years ago.

I'm a guy and back then, just couldn't understand why CDing wasn't the exciting turn on for everyone that it was/is for me? Remember, I didn't begin dressing until I was over 50. I was simply a guy with NO gender issues up until then. And, as a closet dresser, I didn't get why guys wouldn't want to see an uber hot babe in their mirror?

As a competitive guy I NEVER feel like I'm competing with other dressers or GG's. (Unless it's a costume contest on stage, etc.) I guess I compete with myself as I try to create a fem image that blows my hair back. In my case, that means a miriad of different fem looks. But, others seem to prefer to work at fine tuning the look they've developed over the years. I can understand that in trans, but not exactly in closet CD's.

The trans aspect of dressing had me befuddled for years! I believe I understand that much better now. Folks trying to express who they feel they r. With their looks being important, but NOT the over riding factor. As opposed to me, who strives to present as someone completely different from myself! With looks being everything until recently.

I'm probably learning as much from the posts by the "males" in this thread as u r!

[krissygurl]

Im just exploring what Krissy is to me. Is it an alter ego? Is it who I want to be? Most likeley it is a side of me that enjoys the clothes, the makeup, heels, and just being a fun uninhibited girl. I feel comfortable when I feel feminine but I have no problem with myself as a male and consider myself one, but I do feel more complete with having the option to be anything I want. If wearing female clothes were an excepted option in my secular world I would always wear them. whether its pants, skirts tops whatever. The fit feels much better as well as the fabrics and patterns. But I would still identify myself as a male. there has to be a million different reasons

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Reine, don't you dare go anywhere!

Lorileah, it's fine that everyone is commenting. I know I'm probably looking at the male identity side as that's my H, but really, everyone has made such fantastic comments here I want to read them all!

And seriously, I've never seen such thoughtful responses. For people who don't understand themselves, you sure do try. That's more than most people in a lifetime. Self reflection in my mind, is one of those things that makes for more compassionate, accepting people. I wish more people would do it.

And after reading through the different answers and thinking about some of them (gender dysphoria, sexuality, curiosity etc) it got me wondering something I think someone here touched on. What about all the other species where the male is the beautiful one? I mean, the male peacock makes Ru Paul look plain and the male lion has better hair than most of the avatars on this forum! I actually had a chat with a member here a while ago about men historically and how wigs, heels, make up, even skirts were worn. For those in the original question, the men here who still identify as men even when presenting as a woman, could this be a simple case of masculine primping?? I don't see why human men are the only species who don't want to look pretty and show off to the females. So is crossdressing for these men really about femininity? Or could it be about being a peacock, strutting your stuff so to speak But, because somewhere along the way, we GG's ended up with the pretty stuff, you're left having to borrow ours?

I hope we didn't steal your gig because that makes me feel bad, lol.

Great, now I've come up with another theory to add to the endless list. I'm starting to like Lorileahs idea that it just is, who cares!

Then again, I also enjoy talking with you all here, and given my propensity to over think everything, chatting here helps keep me sane, and my marriage in one piece

[Nadine Spirit]

I really like your deep thoughts. Your name should be Thinkerbell.

[sometimes_miss]

I wish every day that I could be a more accepting wife. I can't even see my H dressed! But I just can't, and believe me I've tried, and just as you're hard wired I guess I am, too. Not fair, is it?

That's part of the problem that a lot of guys here simply either don't understand, or won't accept; that women don't get to choose what turns you on, and off, any more than we do. The tolerance thing is understandable; but guys simply don't understand that women need to be sexually attracted to her mate in order for a marriage to work, and that sexual attraction can easily be killed by a lot of things. Otherwise, you'll never be able to be more than 'just good friends'. Men don't need this connection; our sex drive is so strong, that a woman doesn't have to be feminine all the time for us to get turned on, while for women, it's way more than just instant physical, visual appeal. Studies over and over have proven that even on one night stands, women want the same characteristics in a sexual partner that she does in a husband, your inner 'potential mommy' brain is always working. Men have no such qualms, so they don't 'get it'.
And no, life isn't always fair. We just have to do the best with the life we have. What you have to try to learn to do, is 'compartmentalize'. Men do it automatically. Women don't, you're relationship driven and take everything into consideration when dealing with another person's life. You need to separate different parts of your relationship with your husband. Good luck, most women find that extremely difficult.

[harmony]

an earthquake releases the tension between plates the earths surface is made up of.for me,and may be some of the sisters here,presenting as female in society served to ease tension between what is male and female in my inner being.may be us crossdressers are more challenged in that regard?to beginn with we are all individuals who then split into gender with the appropriate appendages.does our condition go back to a point in our development where that split was kind of murky?
the outcome could also be a hermaphrodite.
my name is harmony and i think that,at age 68,i think i have achieved this.after making crossdressing an artistic endevour where every time i went out was a different creation with the outcome to be determined in the process i had a lot of fun.i do not do it any more since the canvas has aged too much and i can center myself without an aid.this may change at any time but it has been a few years now.i do enjoy hanging out with my sisters though!

[Jenniferathome]

...
So why does a simple crossdressing curiosity eventually become an identity for so many here? Is crossdressing really that innate, or does natural male competitiveness mean you are driven to perfect all interests. ....

Hi Tinkerbell, this is an interesting thought. I have sometimes wondered if part of presentation is pure competition. My personality is such that when I do something, I have to do it really well. I don't do anything half-assed. And yet, is it that we progress beyond "curiosity" or is is that we simply can't present as we would like because we have no clue when we are young (or first experimenting)? I think it is much more than just competition, but for me, there is an element of competitiveness as well. Good question.

[mechamoose]

Why does crossdressing eventually become an innate part of your personality?

So why does a simple crossdressing curiosity eventually become an identity for so many here?

People.. all people.. want to look *sharp*, to look *interesting*. You want to be YOU.

Once you internally accept that you are willing to dress as you like rather that what others expect, you have crossed a threshold.

Once you have thrown off those limits, you have a hard time figuring out why those limits were there in the first place.

<3

- MM

[Jilmac]

I started experimenting with female clothes at age 7 after a cousin dared me to wear panties and a dress. In my early years of crossdressing there was much confusion but also much arousal at the look and feel of feminine undergarments. As my dressing progressed, it became clear to me that there was more than fetish, I actually enjoyed my psuedo-feminine persona and realized that I was hard wired to be the way i am. So yes, for me it's innate, I'll never go all the way with SRS but I will always enjoy acting totally feminine at every opportunity.

[ReineD]

What a fun thread!

What about all the other species where the male is the beautiful one?

Darwin's sexual selection. It all depends on which sex chooses the other and also how many mates they have.

When females choose males, the males will either develop combat characteristics to fight each other off, or they develop display characteristics to attract the female. They also develop these characteristics to mate with as many females as possible. In humans, however, it is the male who has deliberately chosen the female, so females have had to develop beauty, red lips, shapely breasts, etc, to attract men ... and later on added adornment (jewelry, sexy dresses, makeup), in order to enhance their beauty. Of course, women (at least in recent history) have been free to either accept or refuse the male based on things that women found attractive, such as strength, power, financial security, etc. Traditionally, females have not chased males and this is the one thing I don't think has changed very much, even in our modern times.

I actually had a chat with a member here a while ago about men historically and how wigs, heels, make up, even skirts were worn.

These things were considered a sign of wealth then, but the quantity that men wore definitely looked more masculine compared to what the females were wearing.

For those in the original question, the men here who still identify as men even when presenting as a woman, could this be a simple case of masculine primping?? I don't see why human men are the only species who don't want to look pretty and show off to the females. So is crossdressing for these men really about femininity? Or could it be about being a peacock, strutting your stuff so to speak But, because somewhere along the way, we GG's ended up with the pretty stuff, you're left having to borrow ours?

Men have their own way of attracting women. They don't have to impress us with their ability to fight tigers anymore, but women are already attracted to certain male physical traits: their pecs, firm abs, wide shoulders, muscular legs, slim hips. I guess this is what motivates younger men to work out. And men certainly aren't devoid of facial beauty!

https://www.google.com/search?q=hand...e+men&tbm=isch

This is a side note, but I think that so many people assume CDers are gay because they embellish themselves in ways that women have traditionally embellished themselves in order to attract men, even though I know that most CDers here don't adorn themselves for this reason (except maybe the CDers who participate in the date-a-man threads).

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Um, Reine, thank you for posting that link. I will admit I might have perused it a little longer than planned

And it is fascinating to ponder all this. I think maybe your first comment about dopamine is the most logical for someone like my H, or maybe the synesthesia theory I read yesterday. It's amazing how complex we humans are though, isn't it? All the many ways we behave and express ourselves - when I really think about it I do start to wonder what societies problem is with crossdressing. Really, it's just another color in the vast human rainbow and wow are their many colors.

Of course, there might always be the issue with us GGs. I don't know how many struggle with the sexual attraction side of CD like I do, but given how we're hard wired to seek out masculinity, I'd assume a majority of GGs struggle, too? That's hard for the crossdresser and I don't really know the answer to that either. Time? Evolution?!! Or maybe just ordinary old public education letting kids know that there are many types of people in this world and they should give each and every one a fair chance. I often wonder if I'd been raised to see crossdressing as ordinary whether I might feel differently now. Or is my hard wiring just too dang hard!!

Now back to that link...

[ReineD]

I often wonder if I'd been raised to see crossdressing as ordinary whether I might feel differently now. Or is my hard wiring just too dang hard!!

If we had all been raised with neighbors, family members or friends who crossdressed, we'd accept it as part of the human fabric! Although I don't think the percentage of males who CD would change so I don't know how ordinary it might be?

Still this wouldn't change a GG's sexual attraction. If she wasn't sexually attracted to a feminine male, then she'd choose someone else to be her husband. She and the CDer might just be good friends.

I think a lot of wives who accept the crossdressing draw a line at the bedroom, so you're not alone there.

I'm glad that your attitudes are beginning to soften a little towards the CDing though!

[Marcelle]

Hi Tinkerbell,

A bit late to the game (darn work always getting in the way). I have thought long and hard on the question "How do I identify . . . male or female?" My genetic predisposition is "male, dude, man, guy, bloke, homme." However that is genetics and based on primary and sexual characteristics so yes . . . I am man (beating chest and making grunting noises now )

Personality wise . . . I am me. My personality does not differ based on my gender presentation. My look differs. Boy me won't be wearing panties under his combat fatigues any time soon. Girl me wears make-up, girl clothes and a wig (my real hair is fighting a hasty retreat from the battle field ). But this is presentation. My personality stays the same. Both Isha and boy me have the same likes, dislikes and emotional responses but that is because I am only one person . . . me. If I had two distinct personalities . . . well let's say it might be time to visit a therapist who deals in other psych issues.

However I think you are really interested in why the gender presentation? I can't answer that one. I came to this late in life. Had an inkling when I was younger but that was it. Dressing up as a woman is as natural to me as dressing up as guy is. Have I told people? Yes, because I am not ashamed of who I am and these are good friends who will either support me or choose not to be my friends. I owe them that and to be honest I owe myself. I don't like hiding if I don't have to. Do I have mild GID . . . quite possible but it relates more to how I feel on a given day. Sometimes I want to walk the world as Isha and most other days not so much.

Sorry not a great answer but nonetheless it is all I have.

Hugs

Isha

[TinaZ]

What a thought-provoking thread.

As a CDer who very recently progressed to another level maybe my perspective can be as helpful as some of the other answers.

First, I literally have no memory of myself NOT being attracted to lingerie. Meaning, this fascination was prepubescent, so I believe Sarahcsc's answers are important to consider. I fully believe my neurons, or my brain chemistry, reacts unusually. Heck, I still get a little ping in my head when I'm picking out a pair of panties for the day.

But on a psychological level, I recently had a mid-life crisis of sorts, and this is what propelled me to "advance" my dressing from lingerie to skirts, tops, shoes, wigs and make up. Looking at my own mortality forced me to consider what I wanted from CDing. And (so far) it turns out that I feel more like me when I'm dressed. I feel like I don't have to behave in any certain way. It's liberating. I can be take-charge. I can be soft. I can grunt. I can coo. Being "Tina" allows me to cast away what's expected and just be.

Essentially, you asked for responses from those who identify as men, but for me when I'm Tina, I identify as neither or both.

I hope this helps! Thanks for the great questions.

[mechamoose]

Um, Reine, thank you for posting that link. I will admit I might have perused it a little longer than planned

Um.. yah. Woof!

[susan54]

This thread gets better and better.

The primping thing is more complex in the human and animal worlds. Animals that hold territory and a harem by aggression are often not the fathers of the offspring - so the females actually mate with non-dominant males, the 'sneaky f*****s'. How do the females benefit from this? I have no idea. Read the scientific press - I don't have the time.

Here we see the suggestion (no more than that) from ReineD (a GG) that women dress to impress men. Most women seem to stress that they dress for their own satisfaction and to impress other women. In my own case, I certainly dress to look and feel good - and when I go out, to impress women. The idea of impressing men when dressed is somewhere I do not want to go, even in my mind. I am fortunate that even at my age (late 50s) I have great legs and my shape looks good in women's clothes - I have even been told I look better in skirts and dresses than in trousers. I get much, much more praise wearing womenswear than menswear and that sort of feedback is an encouragement to go out more. I do not feel feminine or masculine when dressed and out - I am just me. I make an attempt to move in a feminine way which I find good fun (no idea what to make of this - it is possibly the same fun people get out of amateur acting on the stage). When I do my thing I need to be the best possible at it - it is a matter of great pride and satisfaction. On the rare occasions someone I have been interacting with has assumed I am a woman, I do not feel womanly, I feel I have done a job really, really well, and that is very satisfying. In contrast, I feel most masculine when wearing a kilt (I am Scottish). Again - make of that what you will.

Recently I have gone out less frequently because I am getting slightly uncomfortable about the idea of suppressing my masculinity. I still wear a complete outfit of clothes and jewellery in almost all my free time (I even put them on for breakfast on work days) but am increasingly rejecting the idea (I always disliked the messy process) of make-up. So, if anything, I am becoming more assertive about my male identity when dressed. But I can't see myself abandoning the bra and boobs at home - they are just so nice to wear (a modest 36B) and the clotehs look so good with that shape in them.

To put it in a nutshell - like many women I dress to look good and with my shape I seem to look better in women's clothes, by which I mean outfits based on skirts and dresses (never, ever trousers). The clothes feel nice and look nice, and perhaps it is the sort of obsession that many women have for lovely clothes (and it is obsessive for me and them). I have felt increasingly isolated from other cross-dressers because I do not get this girlie-ID thing and this thread has been wonderful - thank you Tinkerbell.

On the other hand the huge public perception of cross-dressing as sexual or gay or gender confusion makes it almost impossible for those of us who just wish to be male in these lovely clothes to get our own reasons across - who would believe us? - we seem to be a very small minority.

[flatlander_48]

I have never invested much time in the Why of what I do. I suspect that even if I had some degree of clinical understanding of why I crossdress, it wouldn't change anything. That said, there is a reason that I suspect provides a clue, but I don't dwell there. I accept it as an IS.

For me, it seems, crossdressing provides, or helps to provide, some degree of balance that wouldn't always happen. I have worked in a male-dominated field for more than 40 years with the accompanying male thought processes and habits. Dressing seems to give me space to detox from that. Presumably it also satisfies other needs as well.

[susan54]

Sorry - one more thought.

The problem for us blokes who want to look nice in what are regarded as women's clothes while still behaving like men is that society does not have a box for us. So they put us in a box they do have. Square peg in round hole. Once women were derided for wearing trousers. Now most women wear trousers and probably have more choice of fabric and styles than men. Men's skirts and even dresses are beginning to appear but are nowhere near mainstream yet. For me a lot of the fun is from putting the right outfit and accessories together, which definitely conveys a female appearance - not sure what to make of that - I just do not feel female. I occasionally go out as a man in a skirt (not yet a dress) and am astonished by the lack of reaction - people seem to wait until I am out of sight/hearing before they stare or make a remark - if they do so at all, and double takes are quite rare. But when I do the whole gig I do try and move like a woman because that is the best way for society to cope with someone dressed like that even if they know it is a man. When I am at home I do not try and move like a woman, but a skirt and heels change the walk of anyone who wears them, including women. When a man wears a kilt there is skirt management and you have to sit with your legs together. I know some men don't, but that is just gross.

Perhaps of society comes to grips with guys who just want to wear tights, skirts, dresses and heels, perhaps with earrings and bangles thrown in, then we can do so more openly. Actually we can already - just not in places where people know you (at least in the UK). What is stopping me is not PUBLIC reaction, it is the reaction of my peers in my line of work - I have a status that is dependent on my authority in my field and it is unrealistic to expect that this status will not be affected by wearing a skirt. There are a few high status men who wear skirts but possibly their status would be even higher if they did not - but part of that might be because their skirts tend to be of styles and length that no women of that age wold dream of wearing in public. It is the actual skirt that looks ridiculous - not the fact that a man is wearing a skirt. The more I think about it we can move this situation on if we do it with taste.

Now that is enough from me for one day. Apologies - but this has really got me thinking.

[Jessica86]

I think it really goes for anything that we do. How come some kids play football at an early age, then never go professional? Not very many go all the way to the NFL. Same with any other hobby or sport you can have as a child. I played trumpet since 5th grade, and went on to play in a regional jazz tournament. No other person I knew from high school or college did that. I found something I was curious about as a child, and I expanded on what I felt would be a great thing for me.

I feel just as good as Jessica as I do being up on a stage playing, or while I was on the field playing football. I love motorcycles also, and used to always modify every bicycle I would get. I have taken it so far, that I work....riding a motorcycle as a job/career every single day. Rain or shine. I just love the experience. Not everyone will take their love for motorcyles as far as I have, but the big question is why shouldn't I? If I am good at it, enjoy it, and it is not illegal why can't I go do it?

I think you see where that is leading to. I'm not a trans person because I choose not to take my dressing that far. I do take it....pretty far....but there will be others that will take it way further than I ever will, and others who wouldn't go as far as I do when I dress.

[mechamoose]

I have often wondered about the difference between humans and animals. In the animal world, it is often the males with all the plumage, while the females tend towards camouflage to protect the cubs/chicks.

Thanks for bringing up the discussion/question!

My lilly white ass is tickled pink
When I listen to the music that makes me think

- RHCP

<3

- MM

[Wildaboutheels]

Here's a little hint for folks who are "confused".

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...w+us+your+legs

[mechamoose]

If you present in a way that attracts a 'mundane', they you are either trying to be deliberately obfuscatory, or you have been successful. It all depends on what they do next.

Think "The Crying Game". Some HATE to be tricked. Some welcome it.

- MM

[NicoleScott]

What about all the other species where the male is the beautiful one?

Interesting thought, but in the real life of human attraction it would be counter-productive for a man to transform himself into a pretty woman in order to attract a female. Since we're talking about CDers who identify as males, I suspect there are many who are so deeply closeted that they wouldn't dare to join the forum, even anonymously and without a pic, but still like to get pretty for their own pleasure and for nobody else.
In my opinion and in my own experience, CDers (again, who identify as males) like to present the image of a pretty, sexy woman for the man looking into the mirror.

[mechamoose]

In my opinion and in my own experience, CDers (again, who identify as males) like to present the image of a pretty, sexy woman for the man looking into the mirror.

Pretty is relative, isn't it? Lots find Mel Gibson in Braveheart, or Johnny Depp in 'Pirates' movies to be attractive. They are 'pretty' in a male way. There are lots of examples of 'Bad Boys' being breeding stock while less 'pretty' guys are solid homemakers.

- MM