Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Catch 22.0

  1. #1
    Lost in trans-lation Carrie Ines's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    42

    Catch 22.0

    Although very much received as male by my family and friends I've always been considered a bit of a girl.

    My family teased me, in jest never serious, as a kid, my brothers and sisters would call me by the girl version of my given name, not that i minded too much. It was a kind of running thing with friends i grew up with, they'd call me a girl in certain situations, i was closer to the girls in our group etc ... but always held back and never let my full self show through. I told the odd few about my CDing but wasn't really that well received. I grew up, met a girl. Continued CDing in secret occasionally approaching the subject, trying to get close and show the real me however when i did...well, lets just say it didn't work.

    After many years that ended, before i was 30.

    Strangely I haven't dressed much since, although i took a different approach. Rather than outright saying I am female! I decided to just stop trying to fit into any specific role and just be myself, just be natural, say what i want to say in the way i want to say it, do, act, sit, walk, talk, BE who I am. And for a time that was good.

    Now i feel its not enough. Yes i portray myself naturally but i'm still cursed with a body coursing with testosterone, which is perceived everyday as male, albeit a bit of a girly one. I'm depressed, my work is suffering as i sit here sometimes with tons of things to do just thinking whats the point?. I need to take this further. so my step was to talk to family and friends.

    Not going in full steam i have Indirectly tested the water with friends and family. I've sometimes steered conversations on the subject of sex or gender to a more serious debate to get their true view on the matter but each time has been met with views i would not have expected, especially from people who are so accepting of other things and also the same people that say things like "be who you want to be" "do what you want" etc. But i've discovered that when it comes down to it that they mean "do what you want, be who you are...but i have a few exceptions"

    So basically to take this further at some point i am going to have to say goodbye to all of my family and friends, there is no way i am going to be 100% accepted and i have come to terms with that. Which wherein lays the problem.

    Friends come and go, i know this, even tho i have some real close friends i can only say there will be one couple who would be fine...ish..at a long shot.

    The problem is I love my family too much to lose them but they are such different people that if i told them then i would be ostracised anyway. So my options seem like this

    A. Tell nobody and continue on, gradually becoming more femme/ambiguous anyway as i grow older.

    B. Tell nobody, take hormones in secret and disappear to start a new life when i'm ready (altho the how financially and logistically still evades me)

    WTF WORLD!!

  2. #2
    Silver Member I Am Paula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Ontario Canada
    Posts
    3,753
    Very good thread, that touched me. My struggle was similar.
    I think you will find that you lose much fewer friends and family than expected. Even those who may not accept right now, when confronted by the here and now of it, will join your side. You may have to live with 85%, still not bad.
    There are pluses and minuses to both scenarios you suggest.

    A. Those who will NOT accept you will be made no more comfortable by gradual change as just coming out. On the positive side, you get to just carry on in place, and let the cards fall where they may.

    B. This is what I did. I just showed up in a new town as Paula. It did make it easier, but unless you are willing to sever all contact, forever, you still have to come out. Once again, delaying the inevitable. Work may also make this less than feasible.

    Either tactic will eventually get you the same result. IMHO, of the many options, transitioning leads to the same end. How you choose to do it is your own, but at the end of the day, we'll meet at the same place.

    Good luck to you, and keep us posted as to the path you choose.

  3. #3
    Silver Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    2,048
    Most likely you wont loose as many people as you fear.

    Disappearing and starting over is not so easy. And would you be losing your family anyway if you did that? Or is it more just trying to spare them the shame of you being you?

  4. #4
    Lost in trans-lation Carrie Ines's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    42
    I guess so. Stupid hey. But i think if i'm to lose them with the "shame" is it not better to spare them that part?
    Last edited by Rianna Humble; 07-15-2014 at 10:55 AM. Reason: No need to quote the entire preceding post

  5. #5
    Silver Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    2,048
    I can understand wanting to cut all ties to be stealth where everyone only knows or ever knew you as a woman (though I think it is almost impossible to do entirely) . You don't have to go through all that heartache / frustration of waiting for people to always get it right when they gender you and save you from a lot of the drama that could come. And most people will never accept you wholly as a woman even if they are nice and respectful to you.

    But at the same time you take quite a lose. To do it just to spare them though I don't agree with, because there is nothing for you to be ashamed of and if others feel embarrassed or ashamed of you its there problem to get over. Some may turn their backs on you and others wont, but at least you are letting them have a say in it.

  6. #6
    Senior Member stefan37's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Central NJ
    Posts
    1,159
    Trying to gauge others opinion to gain acceptance is useless and most likely not productive. You need to figure out what is best for you. Once you figure that out and decide on a course of action. Do it and OWN IT!!. Once people see you are serious and it is benefiting you many will be respectful and show acceptance.

    Following a course of action to make others feel good will do nothing to help you.

    I would say nothing about it until you figure it out and accept yourself. I know the urge to come clean is strong, but you need to show restraint until you are 120% committed to your plan. Whatever that may be
    "When failure is off the table the only thing left is to negotiate levels of success" M Hobbes

    "Never Let your Fear Decide Your Fate" Awolnation

    "A new dawn destroys the tranquility of the darkness" Steph W

  7. #7
    Asphalt Angel Donna Joanne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Lenoir, North Carolina
    Posts
    650
    Carrie, prepare for the worst and hope for the best. What actually happens will be somewhere between. Hoping that you find happiness and inner peace.
    Namaste
    Live, love, laugh,

    Donna


    https://www.facebook.com/donna.jbrack


  8. #8
    Silver Member Angela Campbell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    4,445
    I Agee with most of these replies. You will find that once you commit to transition there will be more acceptance than you think. I had the same fear and almost let it get me, but when I started hormones and realized I could not stop this runaway train, I came out to family and work. I made a plan and worked with a specialist. It went very well overall, only losing 2 of my 3 kids. They may come around one day. I am so much better now than before. But maybe I was lucky.
    All I ever wanted was to be a girl. Is that really asking too much?

  9. #9
    Comedian Emma Beth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Southern Transplant in New York
    Posts
    568
    I agree with a lot of what has already been said.

    The one thing to remember is that this is a lot to take in and people will give you a knee jerk reaction before they have time to really give it some thought. People a lot of times feel one way about something and then when they are actually faced with it, they often surprise you.

    I feel that the people around you should be given the chance to decide for themselves. What you should do is decide for yourself if you have the courage to stand up and face the firing squad on your own two feet, or not.

    Don't get me wrong; there is merit in the other approach, but only you can decide for yourself what the best course of action for you really is. Just remember; for most of us, the fears are only in our own heads based on how we perceive others.

    Liz
    The source of fear is in the future
    And a person freed of the future
    Has nothing to fear

    "That's life. It's not always rainbows and farts. Sometimes the farts have a little something extra." -Emma

    Rock meet Hard Place.

  10. #10
    . Aprilrain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    2,749
    This is about you being ashamed of you, once you drop the shame you can transition knowing you are doing the right thing for you. Your two options will become moot.

    I transitioned "in place" but I live in a big enough city that I'm pretty anonymous. I dropped the friends That I figured couldn't handle it and family just has to deal with it. I've had to put up with their bullshit, they can put up with me being me or they can piss off.

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    1,308
    You may be surprised how people can be, give them a chance.

    My Dad I was sure would boot me out, but he took it really well. Mainly because he realised it was serious and a medical condition, he did say he wouldn't have handled it well if I was a crossdresser or ambiguous in what I was. So I would agree with the other replies, know yourself first otherwise how can they understand?

  12. #12
    Member Carlene's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    241

    Catch 22

    Hi Carrie,

    I feel for you and the discomfort you are experiencing. I suppose there is no right or wrong way to go through this. FWIW I am taking a version of your Option B. I am allowing my authentic self to develop without intentionally sharing it with many people. I hope to begin hormones in a few weeks, and will do so without any fanfare. When more people begin to recognize the physical and emotional changes in me (positive, I hope), I will deal with them then, whether they are friendly or otherwise.

    Carlene

  13. #13
    Lost in trans-lation Carrie Ines's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    42
    Thanks for the advice. Glad to get a few different points of view.

    Although i feel its more fear than shame.

    Plus not having the means financially is probably adding to the problem, combined with my job in the music industry, albeit a small one, which needs me to be "Male". Another catch 22

    Although i'm going to stop with all this negativity. I had a bit of a binge on drugs and alcohol over the past week, ive not done this for a long time, out every night, not good. However its made me realise that drowning sorrows in a plastic party facade is a waste of time

  14. #14
    . Aprilrain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    2,749
    When you use a term like "spare them" I tend to think shame but hey I'm not you. I've been where your at though, it's a shitty place to be.

    BTW, if all you want are hormones, that's pretty cheep, granted therapists generally are not but it's not like you have to see them forever, usually just a few months and then you can get a letter for hormones.

  15. #15
    Senior Member stefan37's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Central NJ
    Posts
    1,159
    I don't get this "I need to be male for the job". It is a cop out to justify not being authentic. I know many that transitioned in much more male dominated industries than the music industry. I would think the entertainment industry would be the easiest.

    There are many members here that work in construction. Offshore oil platform. Law enforcement etc and the list is endless.

    If your gd is not intense enough you need to transition. More power to you. I for one would not think less of you. There is no need to justify your decision not to transition.
    "When failure is off the table the only thing left is to negotiate levels of success" M Hobbes

    "Never Let your Fear Decide Your Fate" Awolnation

    "A new dawn destroys the tranquility of the darkness" Steph W

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,651
    I was in the music industry. What job requires someone "to be male?"

  17. #17
    Gold Member Kaitlyn Michele's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    6,640
    That's right ...just like the parties are not going to be helpful, neither is trying to get yourself all worked up over something you probably won't do in the near future anyway...

    that's the trick..the distress will come TO you...it doesn't care about your job money religion or family... don't do things to make it worse...it like steph is saying that you are justifying your decision to hang tight..you don't need to do that to yourself!!

    its not a catch 22. if you can live as a man then that's a good thing...if you can't, everything you've mentioned is solvable and others have dealt with it and can share their stories and advice with you (as they have above)

  18. #18
    Banned Read only
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by arbon View Post
    ...most people will never accept you wholly as a woman even if they are nice and respectful to you.
    I have to wonder just how true this is. I have to wonder if this personal judgment should be qualified as a personal opinion based on personal experience which might be different for others.

  19. #19
    Untitled
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Somewhere near the "Umber" but not "Ull"
    Posts
    7,061
    This is not a personal judgement at all, it is a fact of life. People are polite because it is expected of them, especially when they are in positions that require a "public face". Who knows what goes on behind that mask?
    Listen carefully to what is said, quite often you can hear what is not being said

    The joy of correcting a mistake can bring pain to another

  20. #20
    Lost in trans-lation Carrie Ines's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    42
    My job means I perform as a Male, in a very male orientated scene. Career suicide, trust me I would be ostracised and without income, so i will have to reinvent, but not available for now.

    In regards to your response Aprilrain about sparing my family I agree that words like spare do conjure up thoughts of shame. I can see why you think this but as I said I believe it more aptly should be described as fear, fear of being alone.

    I love my family, i really do, however when approaching the subject (albeit indirectly), as well as many others we all debate at family get togethers and such I have found out that unless I am very very slow and careful with how this transition goes I will pretty much lose all of them.

    To give you the short version, a thing myself and my brothers and sisters have all done since being kids is ask "would you still love me if..." Usually brought on by recent news events etc. Recent examples - Conchita Wurst, my brother asked my mum and dad if that were him would they still love him? Talks of mental institutions, "I would never talk to you again", be so embarrassed. I chimed in of course and kept digging, asking the whys, "whats so wrong with it? are these eveil people?" and getting what could be described as ignorance but came out as pure hatred "I'd feel physically sick" was heard from someone, i can't remember.

    Contrast this with a previous family get together discussion. We were watching some BBC program about a serial killer, same type of question to this subject matter. My Mum actually said "I would obviously be disappointed but would try to understand what drove you to it" Could you forgive me? "Yes, in time I reckon i'd learn to live with it" (obviously went on a bit more depth but that gives you the idea)

    So basically my "Fear" is that I don't want my family to hold me in lower favour than a serial killer.

  21. #21
    Silver Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    2,048
    Quote Originally Posted by SassySal View Post
    I have to wonder just how true this is. I have to wonder if this personal judgment should be qualified as a personal opinion based on personal experience which might be different for others.

    Whats your experience with it?

  22. #22
    . Aprilrain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    2,749
    Carrie, I get the fear, really I do, however it really doesn't matter what your family thinks about Conchita Wurst, you're not her! I could go on and on as to why she is a poor example but that's not germane to the discussion. The point is you really don't know how anyone is going to feel about you transitioning until you do it. Telling them, while necessary, doesn't even come close, they have to see it and more importantly they have to see it working! When people see you succeeding then they can feel better about your decision.

    That being said, I'm in no way trying to push transition. This is something you do because you have to, if that time comes in your life it won't matter anymore what your family thinks. Your wise to consider the financial implications of transition, if you can avoid it more power to you!

  23. #23
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,651
    Again Carrie, I played in bands. I was a rep for a music publisher (Warner Chappell). I worked in a music store. I was a rep for a guitar manufacturer. I went to the Anaheim Namm show as a buyer and as an exhibitor (there are pictures of me on the Net in various places). I built pedalboards, switching rigs and modified guitar pedals and electronics.

    I know the music industry is very male oriented, and, honestly, I transitioned outside of it. But that's the point. I walked away to transition. It was that important.

  24. #24
    Junior Member ptp009's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    75

    Give Parents a chance

    Running away from the potential problem is not the answer. First you need to know where you are if you transition and sounds like you want to. You can move soemwhere where you can get a job and feel happy but you can't run away from your family leave them wondering Is He/Her safe, where did they go what has happened. If yor serious about this and sounds lke you are, give your family a short they may not all understand but I'm willing to bet that some of them are and would be willing to support you. What do you have to lose, you were going to run away from them anyways so the catch 22 here isn't if your dammed if you do dammed if you don't, your dammed if you don't give it a try. You have nothing to lose on this. We Love support you here Carrie, think it over before acting . Jenn

  25. #25
    Woman in Progress Aly Cat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    827
    Omg I have so been where you are! Family is family and friends are friends. With family, some will accept you, some will simply remain silent. There isn't a whole lot they can say or do. It is what it is and you are blood. Some will take longer than others to recognize that this is who you really are. Recognizing who you are is different than accepting who you are. I can't say my dad accepts me, but he is starting to recognize that this really is me. We can now carry on basic conversations about doctors visits, medical info, etc without him losing his cool. My mom still isn't there. She cries at the slightest sight of makeup on my face.
    My three sisters very with every shade of acceptance from fully supportive to only talking about it and carrying on conversations with me so that I feel accepted, to not talking to me at all. I know without a shadow of a doubt that every member of my family loves me dearly regardless of their viewpoint.
    Now, friends on the other hand have the right to come and go as they please.... And they will. The nice thing that I have found is that for every friend I lose, I gain several more who accept me fully 100%. Yes, you will still feel loss for those friends who walk away. Just remember to feel joy for all the friends you gain. Reach out to support groups, find people with common interests, and above all... Be you! Whoever that may be. You have the freedom to express yourself however you want and to any degree. You can transition if you want, underdress only if that's who you are, etc. But always be you!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Check out these other hot web properties:
Catholic Personals | Jewish Personals | Millionaire Personals | Unsigned Artists | Crossdressing Relationship
BBW Personals | Latino Personals | Black Personals | Crossdresser Chat | Crossdressing QA
Biker Personals | CD Relationship | Crossdressing Dating | FTM Relationship | Dating | TG Relationship


The crossdressing community is one that needs to stick together and continue to be there for each other for whatever one needs.
We are always trying to improve the forum to better serve the crossdresser in all of us.

Browse Crossdressers By State