Insight

[Della]

I am new, here, but looking for insight. There are numerous topics dealing with the first time wearing the opposite gender's clothing. Along that line, but a little off, are my questions, which are probably more relevant to people who started an early age. (1) When did you first realize certain clothing, colors, toys, etc. went to gender and that non-gender actions or appearance would be frowned upon and cause disappointment? (2) Who would it disappoint? (3) Why did you continue, if you kept it hidden until later?

This is a step for me to be here--my first intentional, albeit anonymous to the extent that it is, outing, but I am curious to see the answers that ring familiar. Perhaps it's too deep of a question for a newbie, and I should limit my question to "pumps, sandals or mules." So, if you would rather answer "pumps, sandals or mules," go ahead. I'm curious about that too.

[Rachelakld]

One of my favorite toys for many young years was a doll that had sticky up hair
My sister & cousins used to practice make up on me.
I wore my sisters dance outfit aged 4, family saw me, but nothing said.
My family treated me the way I wanted

Peer pressure kept me on the "boy track" until I had achieved my "male goals / desires", after that, things started changing as I relaxed.

[JocelynRenee]

Welcome Della and congratulations on your first steps out. I think you'll find this to be a warm, welcoming place.

Your question is an excellent one and I look forward to the responses. I'm afraid I can't provide much insight, though as my childhood was very typically male. I did cross dress from an early age; just never had the desire to play with dolls, etc. Although if I did I suspect my parents would have perfectly fine with it.

[KlaireLarnia]

1) I think that we are taught from a very early age that boys and girls are different. Even at 4 years old when I started school this was evident - perhaps not in the way I see it now but you know girls wear dresses and boys do not. Back when I grew up in the mid 70's you also associated pink with girls and boys never wore it. Dolls where for girls yet Action man (like GI-Joe in the US) was for boys yet he was a male doll. So toys where to a degree gendered but only in as to their style and purpose. So these preconceptions are put into us at a very early age and I think that is good because as a child you need a set of standards to work with as you grow. It is only later in life we have the ability to challenge these and find a path which is our own.

2) Not at the time. For me it did not bother me at a young age. However now it disappoints me in my 40's. Why? Because I no longer see the issue which society forces us to accept. I am sat here getting ready for work and I have a satin blouse on which I know I need to cover shortly with a sheer blouse for work which is fine, but I wish I did not have to. So the disappointment came later as I understood where the real boundaries lie. AS for who it disappoints, me sadly.

3) I continue to dress because I can and see no reason why I should not. I am careful in what I choose to wear - see my example above so I present a decent look to the outside world but one which is obviously feminine whilst I remain male. As I grew up I realised the gender stereotypes do not fit and because of this I have chosen to move along a path which suits me and lets me walk between these stereotypes.

As for what you should limit yourself to. Personally I would say at the start things you can wear in male modes. Jeans, trousers, t-shirts, pretty much all non-heeled shoes etc. Then work up from there as you find what works and does not and where you comfort zone lies. It is different for us all but it takes a leap of faith at times to find it. Even I am discovering things I can and cannot wear in public now, over 25 years after I really started at this....

[UNDERDRESSER]

Well, I was brought up with sisters, so i knew girls were different, but it was never something I thought of much. One day my sister who was about 7 ( I was 8 ) suggested we switch clothes. I don't remember us being particularly shy around each other, but we did the deed on either side of the bathroom door. She was wearing classic bottle green school briefs it might have actually been gym uniform for that matter. I had just got to the point of thinking that these were an interesting feeling compared to my own stuff, when mother came home and found us. Lets just say her response was not accepting!

I think that answers all 3 questions?

[RADER]

I was trying on my mothers clothes at age 4 or 5. It was a big laugh At the time.
Later when i was 10 or 11, I would sneak out one of her girdles, open bottom
Playtex type, and wear them to bed at night.
I was caught, got the big lecture, so I had to find a better hiding place.
We had a built in dresser drawers in the corner of the closet. I created a false bottom
on the bottom drawer where I could hide my "Goodies"
I bet if you went to the old house, you just might find something still hidden
under the bottom drawer.
When I was in my teens, I would spend the summer up at my grand folks house on a lake.
They had a bunch of womans one piece bathing suits around for people to use to
go swimming. I would "Barrow" one and spend the night wearing one, what a thrill.
Rader

[Marcelle]

Hi Della,

I was a late bloomer in that Isha did not come on stage until last year. However, in working through counselling we have discovered this has been dormant in some form or another for a long time. So while I never acted upon anything at a young age, I can remember a discussion with my mother when I was about 5 years old (we figured it was that age because it coincided with my first year in school). I wanted to wear one of my sister's pretty dresses to school but my mother said "no" . . . I asked her why and her response was "dresses for girls and pants are for boys". She was my mom so who was I too argue so pants it was. Natural socialization took care of the rest and I dressed and acted according to my gender. However, I do recall liking the pretty clothes the girls wore more than my own. However I never dressed as a girl until I was 17 (complete en femme) one time and never again until 32 years later (last year).

Regarding toys, with the exception of two manly men uncles . . . I was raised in an all female environment, sisters and female cousins so I played army guy a lot by myself or got roped into playing house or dolls with my sisters and female cousins. Didn't have a natural affinity for playing with what was then "girl toys" but I didn't fight it either . . . still I enjoyed playing army guy more.

Hugs

Isha

[Katey888]

Hi Della,
I certainly started at an early age (around 5 or 6) so let me try to answer from memory, which I admit, is a little hazy from those early years...

1) I think I knew at that age it was 'wrong' as it was something that I would not do openly. I was fascinated by brightly coloured, acrylic furry hats that were fashionable for young girls in the mid-1960's. Many of them wore them to school and the urge I had to try them on was so strong, that I would ask to be excused during lesson time and sneak into the cloakroom when no-one was around. SO I knew about clothing and toys at that time, but I don't recall colours specifically... I think I had a fully developed idea of what items were gender specific at this time.
2) I'm sure that led to trying other items of clothing, probably at home, and at that age and after I knew that I would certainly be in trouble with teachers or my parents if caught... it was just 'wrong' even though it didn't feel wrong.
3) I can't explain at all why I would have continued from then until the advent of puberty, when the sensuality of clothing very rapidly became a sexual thing... I think as a teenager then I would have thought that crossdressing coupled with sexual fulfilment would have been seen as perverse... obviously didn't stop me though..

You must let us know how these fit with your own perspective on this weird thing we share...

Katey x

[Jaymees22]

Hi, I do remember going to my neighbors house at a young age to play with dolls. My first experience dressed was in a second grade play, I played one of Cinderella's ugly sisters along with another boy. We had both volunteered for the roles and the class voted us in. I tried dressing again when I was 17 and then took a 50 year break and started dressing again when I was 67. Now I dress every chance I can and I wear pumps, sandals or mules depending on my mood.

[Helen_Highwater]

I can remember wearing a pair of yellow frilly knickers in bed at an early age (5'ish) knowing it "wasn't the done thing" at the time. Can't remember having many more similar try-ons until really into my late teens. I can remember being drawn to the tactile nature of women's clothing. The softness, the feel of a skirt on bear legs. Never really understood the motivation but have learned it's part of me and incorporate it into my life as best I can, still being in the closet.
I think we can worry about the whys and whats too much, over analysis.

[Sarah Doepner]

I grew up with one older brother and only short visits with girl cousins. I never really had access to girls things but I do remember clearly one day at a friends house I pretended not to know a "Blouse" was a woman's shirt. I was embarrassed to have that knowledge but didn't really understand why. When I was in 8th grade I started dressing in my mothers clothing and even though I was caught a couple of times the attraction was too strong to resist. I just got better at hidding it. I had been lectured enough times to know it was not acceptable and it would hurt my parents if they knew I was doing that.

It made me feel different, more alive, more authentic and, this is probably the key, it made me someone other than the geeky kid that no one seemed to like. I could escape into a totally credible world where everything was different and there was no pressure on me. That same thing became a piece of my life when I started dressing regularly again in my late 30's or early 40's. It wasn't the only thing driving the bus, but it was one of the things that helped make it worth doing. I was a much better balanced person and better able to deal with the stresses of family and work once I was no longer denying that my gender identity wasn't totally wrapped up in male clothing.

And sandals for me. I'm tall and like being able to show off my pretty painted toenails.

[Tammy Lynn Tx]

I, also started dressing in my sisters and sometimes moms clothes at around 5 years of age. I had 1 older sister that we played dolls and dress up but never when my 2 brothers were around. I knew if they found out I was dead, i really thought that literally. I always helped mom and sis cook and clean but it was many years later that I got to clean while wearing a dress and apron. ( my brothers had left home by then).

My mom had caught me dressing a couple times and told me to never let my brothers or step father catch me ( probably why I thought I was dead... very macho people). She gave me some of my sisters old clothes and nightgowns to wear after the last brother went into the military and I was off to the races...

I under dress a lot of the time and usually wear pumps or flats when I can. High heels kill my ankles now days... too much weight

[Tiffany Jane]

I have a picture in my hallway of me in a dress about eight or nine years old. Mom was kind enough to take it, but pretty well told me it wasn't right for boys to wear dresses. It was a few years later when I discovered bra and panties and curiousity got the best of me, I tried them and liked it. Turned it off til mid twenties when I tried on a pair of wifes hose she was throwing out. Freaked her out when I told her about the fetish. Turned it off for about eight more years. Bought some clothes, heels, dress, hose, and bra and forms. Wife became more accepting after a discussion in the matter. Threw out earlier this year when I felt I needed to put feelings away after son was born. Talked to wife about it after three months and wishing I hadn't. Have bought some new stuff but trying to find time and comfort around son to be able to wear them.
That answers 1 and 3. My dad would be most dissappointed. He is always making uncomfortable comments about my male cousins who have come out as gay. I don't have their feelings but afraid my dad wouldn't know the difference.

[Della]

Your last comment made me smile. A little levity at times works wonders.

[Valerie Nova]

I'm not really sure when I first started feeling embarrassment over the fact that I was attracted to certain girl things. I know I was somewhere between 6 and 8 years old. To be honest, it could very well have been an internal conflict. I don't really remember any conflicts with my parents regarding my crossdressing. However, I was very careful about it, and was never really "caught" as a child or adolescent.

It would disappoint my parents. I'm not sure how I knew, but I knew. Whatever, they figured it out eventually. They thought much less of me, I'm sure, but they still love me and all that.

Why did I continue? I guess because sometimes boys are born with girl instincts (and vice versa). Girls have that instinct to make themselves look pretty, and sometimes boys are born with that instinct too. It's a mistake, and one I have to deal with, but it could have been worse. I'm just glad I'm at least attracted to women, and all of my abnormal instincts are more or less harmless.

[Thea Pauline]

You'll find plenty of opinions and stories from us here about these topics, but with regards to the second question, what time of year and what am I wearing?

[docrobbysherry]

Many here believe most vanilla guys would like to try on women's things. And, either do in private, or don't because they're afraid of getting caught. Some here may believe that vanilla boy children would naturally want to wear frilly things and dresses. I disagree with both theories.

I was a vanilla male with no gender issues until age 50+. When young, I wanted to wear fancy clothes all rite. A fireman's uniform. Or, a complete cowboy outfit. My mother made one for me which I'm wearing in a photo taken about age 5. I have a sister about my age. It never occurred to me to try on her or my mom's clothes. I remember plodding around in my dad's huge Floursheims. Never my mom's heels. It never occurred to me to try them on.

As I got older and began dating girls, I didn't think much about the clothes they wore. Only if I liked them and if they liked me.

By the time I reached true adulthood, at about age 35, I had had a number of girlfriends that stayed over or left clothes at my place. Then, I got married and there were closets full of pretty, sexy clothes in my house. Over the years I had many private opportunities to try a few things on, rite? But, I didn't. Why?

Because back then I was a regular guy. And, it simply never entered my mind!

[ClosetED]

Welcome! This site has the spectrum of TG and the varied opinions to go with it. Some answer personally, some go theoretical. Enjoy the variety of life and see what fits you.

(1) When did you first realize certain clothing, colors, toys, etc. went to gender and that non-gender actions or appearance would be frowned upon and cause disappointment?
We all learn there are differences at very young age, but can't recall that far back. So you will remember now that you learned in your earliest memories. And pink was for Boys and blue for Girls pre-WW I. As to when we realize society expects us to follow or norm or suffer consequences depends on your local social environment. If your mother loved dressing you up, not for a while. If when you experimented the first time, you were severely chastised/spanked, then you learned earlier.

(2) Who would it disappoint?
It disappoints family and larger society, as not fitting their norm. Yet CDing is 6-10% of men with 1% being TS, according to sources.

(3) Why did you continue, if you kept it hidden until later?
Why we start and continue is the real issue and may not be the same along the spectrum. You seem to want deep, so here is my deep thoughts-feedback welcome:
So a heterosexual non-CD male grows up to "sexually desire" a woman and has a self-image of himself. Now how does he rate his own appearance, based on what standard? Does he "like" a certain male body image/look and compares himself to that? If he rates himself favorably to that standard or gets enough external support of esteem, then he feels good about himself. If he does not, he will feel "inferior" "low self-esteem" and may try to improve himself or boost self-esteem with behaviors that fit his standard, like wrestling, fighting, drinking, power.
Now take the hetero CDer - he "sexually desires" a woman as well. He has a body self-image and is this the case where the CDer does not fit his male standard (in his own mind) and feels he actually better fits in some aspect the standard of the woman he desires? So to improve self-image (as felt by the person) and not getting enough external self-esteem support, he adapts what he can to the female standard? This then allows that self-perception to be happy in fitting a standard and providing the needed self-esteem, despite what society may say.

And I like high heels-both pumps and sandal versions - because they make my legs look great and I love a woman with great legs.
Hugs, Ellen

So Della, did we help?

[Kaze_]

#1: One of my earliest memories is asking my mother for a dress, I guess I was around 4 or 5 years old. At this point I already knew it wasn't normal, but I didn't care. I remember this being the point I realized it wasn't going to be accepted. I didn't get the dress. :<

#2: I was brought up in the rural south, so I guess I was worried about disappointing everyone.

#3: I continued off and on through out my childhood as opportunities came and went. If it was there and I could get away with it I could not resist. I never got caught outside of my earliest years. I worked terribly hard at making sure I never got caught. I remember I was absolutely scared to death about getting found out. I guess I still am tody. .-.

[Della]

it provides insight. Thank you.

[Yoshisaur]

1 When I was about 4 my sisters dressed me up in one of their dresses and put make up on me. I liked it so much I went to sleep that night in the dress. Of course as I grew up I just knew that wearing girl's clothing was frowned upon.
2 I don't want to disappoint and potentially horrify the people around me. I live in Texas and a lot of people here are very close minded about anything crossgender my parents especially.
3 I find myself always wanting to be more female then male. The simple idea of dressing up excites me and keeps me at it even though i'm completely horrified and paranoid about being discovered.

[charlenesomeone]

1.Started with Moms things about 7 or 8.
2. Everyone, it was in the 70's
3. never fully stopped, But the pink tsunami has come on now.
Char

[lil-girl27]

it is amazing to read so many different experiences. i still laugh looking back from my younger years. i always hung around my sister and her friends who would dress me up and put makeup on me and i always loved it, with plenty of pictures. so from 4 or 5 i would guess. it was when i was older i figured that as a boy that was not normal, so i hid it. it was after many failed relationships i started to look at myself closer and next thing i knew im here.

[Badwolf]

Della Welcome!

"Pumps, sandals, or mules" is the more advanced so great job trying to test us.

It's generally hard to have too many memories from ages before 5-8 (varies a bit from person to person). My oldest memories have me aware enough of some differences between the sexes. It was never quite an issue until my best friend started getting closer to her female friends, and I was left out. There are a lot of other times that I noticed the difference, but most of them were small incidents.

[Della]

I have replied to others threads a few times, but come back to this to see what is said. Thanks again. I like having someone to chat with, albeit anonymously. My preference: well-heeled sandals.