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Thread: Going to rant a bit

  1. #26
    Silver Member paulaprimo's Avatar
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    fantastic thread isha. you stated perfectly what i and i'm sure most here feel.
    the rude and hurtful comments are something that has been eating at me since day one.
    i've been wanting to start a similar thread, not as sugar coated as yours, and since my writing
    skills are somewhat flawed i would of blasted certain folks. i know i couldn't of
    been able to express my true feelings as well as you have done, so my thread probably would
    have been deleted, so i thank you!!
    paula

  2. #27
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    Another great post Isha. As a relative newcomer, this forum is the closest thing I have to a support group, so any reminders for members to keep advice and interactions supportive and constructive is welcome.

    As Charlenesomeone said: 'group hug'

    Daphne

    x

  3. #28
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    Isha, Your posts really help make this place special, and I couldn't agree more!! That said, I've been amazed given the subject matter here that most posters are very respectful (as you pointed out), because so many other forums are overrun by trolls, scumbags, and psychwads (oh my!!)
    So a special shout out to our admins and mods here, without whom, this place would probably become a sewer in a matter of hours.
    Hip Hip...
    Last edited by JessicaJHall; 09-15-2014 at 04:33 PM.
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  4. #29
    Junior Member Amanda1128's Avatar
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    Isha, thank you for saying what I was thinking.

  5. #30
    Member dee anne's Avatar
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    A great post. I agree with what Carla said in the first reply. I have not read them all. Thanks
    Dee anne

  6. #31
    Aspiring Member phylis anne's Avatar
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    Well spoken Isha,
    I too am one of those in dire fear of coming out to my family ,friends and workmates ,because mostly of the narrowminded attitudes and othe rissues so I choose to be phylis when it is safe to do so . Secrets? surely many people have them for their own reasons . I have only been a memeber here for a month or so and I have learned much from all of you even when a "mod" would chase me with a rolled up newspaper LOL to correct me on needed issues ,I did not feel bad from this ,instead I grew to appreciate this watchful outlook on the board as it has made it a pleasant place to be thankyou all for that. I have approached my style as somewhat unisex/blended until I get more comfy in public then maybe a little more ,so to cap this no matter who you are you are an individual and only you can decide when to tell or not tell others ,or how far in public you wish to dress do what keeps you safe ,happy and in your comfort zone
    hugs phylis anne

  7. #32
    Gold Member Read only Rachael Leigh's Avatar
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    Isha thank you you are so spot on with this, for me being in such a difficult relationship because of my choice to crossdress is very emotional indeed, as many here may remember I thought I was going to let this go and try and repair things with my wife but it didn't take long to understand it was way more than just my dressing and I needed to just be honest with my wife about many things. For some who have never told their SO it has to be guy wrenching to hold onto this type of emotional issue and something that is so close to us. All circumstances are different and we need to love and care for all that are here and remember that could be us

  8. #33
    Silver Member justmetoo's Avatar
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    Well said, Isha (as is your usual wont, it seems). Judge not and all that. Encouragement, advice, support, camaraderie, these are all good in my opinion. Name-calling is right out. Shaming should be, as well. We are all individuals, with various circumstances, and have to make the best decisions we can for ourselves and our own lives and repsect that everyone else has that right, too.

  9. #34
    Member vicky_cd99_2's Avatar
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    Isha that was a very well put post. We do need to think of the feelings of others before we open our mouths. No matter how wide our shoulders might be our psyche might not be as wide or as strong when it comes to a basic verbal smack down. When it comes from an outsider, outside of close family and friends, it can be truly painful.

  10. #35
    Lisa Allisa's Avatar
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    Isha, right-on and well said.

  11. #36
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isha View Post
    Now for the most part the comments were supportive and/or benign but as always happens with this "tell / don't tell" polarized debate, some people latch on with hurtful and downright nasty comments. Really do terms like liar, coward, deceitful and so on do anyone but yourself any good?

    [bolded font is my emphasis]
    I agree that most were benign/positive and I actually counted the bolded words.

    1) Two people used the word "coward" pejoratively (but not "liar" or "deceitful").

    2) A third person used both "liar" and "coward" pejoratively but later recanted as far as I can tell, if I look upon the second post positively. So we can scratch that one.

    3) Two others used the word "deceit" descriptively (to describe a concealment of what is known), which is what "not telling" a spouse is. This is not pejorative.

    4) No one said the OP was deceitful.

    This means that out of 33 responses so far, two were insulting without taking it back. So the score is, benign/positive=94% and negative=6%. So why are we focusing on the 6%? There will be insulting people no matter where we are on the internet. If this is one of our worse threads, I'd say that we have a pretty good batting average compared to other places, where the insult rate can easily reach 50% or more.

    I'd rather focus on the 94% and ignore the trolls.

    <edit>

    Isha, I forgot to mention that I do agree with you that we should not in general use harsh words. But for the most part, I think that members of this forum do follow this principle.
    Last edited by ReineD; 09-15-2014 at 08:13 PM.
    Reine

  12. #37
    Senior Member Eringirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post

    This means that out of 33 responses so far, two were insulting without taking it back. So the score is, benign/positive=94% and negative=6%. So why are we focusing on the 6%? There will be insulting people no matter where we are on the internet. If this is one of our worse threads, I'd say that we have a pretty good batting average compared to other places, where the insult rate can easily reach 50% or more.

    I'd rather focus on the 94% and ignore the trolls.
    Hi Reine:
    Thanks for the quantitative analysis, and I fully get your perspective. I always enjoy reading your posts.

    In my experience, people in a "fragile" or vulnerable state will focus on the negative comments. It can take 1000 "At-a-boys" to negate one negative comment, so sometimes that 6% can cause damage. So while I fully agree that this forum is head and shoulders above virtually all others, IMHO, the OP does serve as a good reminder.

    Respectively submitted,
    Erin
    Seize the day. Life is short, and you're dead a long time...just sayin' ...

  13. #38
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    Hi Reine,

    I agree it was only 6% but my observations were not so much aimed at this one post but more a general observation about how these "smarmy one liners" tend to creep into posts throughout the forum but more so when it comes to this "tell / don't tell" debate. Yes it is only 6% but if even one of those stray comments cause emotional distress to the point of someone doing themselves harm either emotionally or physically (because to be honest we don't know how people are going to take rudeness) then the other 94% good comments become a moot point.

    Advice is good, sharing is good, and this is what support is meant to do. Yes, we may have to be a little more direct from time to time but rude and hateful (even a small percentage) IMHO is not tolerable. When I go out dressed en femme, if I was assaulted (verbally and or physically) 6 percent of the time, I am not going to go home thinking "heck 94% of my outing was good so I am fine". Most likely the hate and rudeness is still going to be the salient memory of that outing. Good is good and yes, we should celebrate that as a community and that is what tends to reign here in most posts. However, rude and hate we should not ignore and we should not tolerate IMHO.

    Hugs

    Isha

  14. #39
    Valley Girl Michelle789's Avatar
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    Isha, I definitely empathize with your rant. I read the thread last night, and I posted a comment about guilt and shame.

    When I first read the thread, I could see why some of us might be outraged by the comments. There were several that were really insulting, and after reading this thread it sounds like some of them didn't really mean that. Not all of the comments were insulting or mean, but there were several that could at least be interpreted as being insulting. Whether or not the intent is that way is debatable. Even though it was only 6% of the posts that were hurtful, it is the hurtful ones that are the ones that stand out and cause the most amount of emotional pain.

    Sometimes we get caught up in the heat of the moment and it creates toxic energy. I don't like receiving or making rude or hurtful comments, because I come to this forum for a peaceful discussion of the issues, and to give and receive moral support to other CDers and TSes.

    I really hope that we can in the future be more respectful of other's opinions, and remember that we're also setting an example for the trans community by what we post, and that name-calling or mean or insulting comments are setting a bad example for our community.
    Last edited by Michelle789; 09-15-2014 at 10:42 PM.
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  15. #40
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    Isha, yes, the rash words seem to creep into the tell/don't-tell discussions more now. Years ago, the battle was between going-out/staying-in. The people who stayed at home were accused by a select few of not having any b*lls. I also recall, the average CDer didn't tell his wife then, in fact I remember a lot of "Where do you hide your stuff" threads with some very creative responses. I suppose the need to tell grows along with the need to go out.

    I wonder what the contention will be five years from now, by which time I fully suspect the "no-tells" will have diminished greatly compared to the "tells". I wonder if the debate will be whether to come out at work or not. I believe you, Isha, are one of the forerunners in this area.

    Eringirl, you make a great point. The CDing can be emotionally sensitive and the negative comments (the actual insults … not the differences of opinion) can wound deeply. But this has and does happen in other areas too: people have been and are frequently insulted over such deeply personal things as race, birth defects, and deeply held spiritual beliefs. Harsh words belong nowhere in an ideal world. But, we don't live in an ideal world and I think this forum is one of the kindest I've been on overall.
    Reine

  16. #41
    Senior Member Eringirl's Avatar
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    Hi Reine. Agreed, this is one of the kindest forums around.

    Erin
    Seize the day. Life is short, and you're dead a long time...just sayin' ...

  17. #42
    Member JayeLefaye's Avatar
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    Lovely, heartfelt rant Isha! I've never liked the ease that the internet gives us to reach out and touch someone with the touch of a "send" button, consequences be damned.

    When having conversations about things that matter, (and so very very very many posts on this forum DO matter as folks try to work their way through what they're experiencing, and they've found us and want to feel safe) whether it's in real life, or on-line, I learned three simple questions that I try to ask myself before saying anything:

    1. Is it verifiably true?

    2. Is it kind?

    3. Is it necessary?

    If my response doesn't hit those three simple criteria, then my response is best just kept to myself.

    Jaye
    Last edited by JayeLefaye; 09-15-2014 at 09:37 PM. Reason: horrible spelling:-)
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  18. #43
    Super Moderator GretchenJ's Avatar
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    Hi Isha,

    thanks for the great post, for distinctly putting words for what I am feeling, and for just being you

  19. #44
    Member Michellegryl's Avatar
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    Isha this was a very well thought out and well said post. I agree with you 100% and support your leadership in making this post. I try to live by something I read once written by L Ron Hubbard. "Never evaluate or invalidate another in the name of help". Unfortunately some choose to do just that and the results can be devastating. A good friend does not tell you what is wrong with you, but rather they seek to help you find your way and your own truth.

    Hugs
    Michelle

  20. #45
    Administrator Tamara Croft's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    4) No one said the OP was deceitful.
    The word 'deceit' was used twice, one in post #3 and one in post #21.

    You're lucky if she's understanding. Not just for CDing, but for the deceit as well.
    Many a crossdresser ~ person has carried the burden of deceit for years upon years, only to find that EVERYONE already KNEW!
    I find it amazing how one word can change a sentence....

    Anyway, I found the thread interesting and also very mean, bitter and angry people should really get a life and stop focusing on trying to destroy others or go and get some serious counseling!
    Administrator

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  21. #46
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    Good post Isha,
    I know from being in the closet and now not having to hide that at times I may of been a little harsh.I don't believe I've ever called anyone a derogatory name as I don't think that fits who I am .If for some reason Roxie has ever offended any one this was not my intent.Sometimes I just speak my mind to much ie(big mouth]
    I'll try to be more helpful with my post
    Roxie

  22. #47
    Platinum Blonde member Ressie's Avatar
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    I've seen other (not CD related) forums with much worse troll activity. There's one where I might have even had a part in chasing a member or two away by just giving my opinion. It's easy for typed out words to be seen in the wrong context, since there's no body language or other non-verbal communication to go along with it. It's refreshing to see very little trolling here.

    Are some of us cowards or deceitful for not sharing this with our wives? Those are strong words no doubt that I found a bit shocking. I think many of us have the right to be frightened of what may come about by coming out to the wife.

    Anyway, others can feel hurt even without the intention of hurting. We can't all be equally empathetic and understanding unfortunately.
    "You're the only one to see the changes you take yourself through", Stevie Wonder

  23. #48
    Member wanda66's Avatar
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    Thank you, well put

  24. #49
    Aspiring drama queen Isabella Ross's Avatar
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    There's good rants, and there's great rants -- yours falls into the latter category, Isha. As a newcomer here, I have to say that I hadn't seen much in the way of insensitivity; instead, I've found it to be a pretty friendly and supportive place. Yet when I reread the thread in question, I do see what you're talking about. I'll remember your words as I write every post I make from this point on. Thank you.

  25. #50
    Aspiring Member LelaK's Avatar
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    Isha, it sounds like you're concerned about people's insensitivity on the forum. I had a similar feeling recently when one of my carefully worded posts was deleted, not by me. It's very discouraging.
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