The 50 shades of "Passing" and "Self confidence".

[Jenniferathome]

R u intentuonally leaving these folks out, Jenn?
"-----This includes everyone who sees u; passerbys, glancing at u as u drive by, everyone!"
I'd guess from your avatar you'd pass with at least 50% of these folks? ...

Hi Sherry, I suppose that the average person looking at their feet or smart phones would not notice me. From a peripheral vision point of view, I do not have an appearance that would draw attention, I am only 5'7" and about 150 pounds, and I dress for the venue, time, and my generation. I tend to think men are less observant than women so half the population is easier to walk past.

Still, we are more than our faces to the world. Our body shape is very different from that of a woman's (I don't wear any padding other than forms). Observe the shape of the male head-neck-shoulder. That's a significant difference. And then there is our jaw line and of course, the Adam's apple.

Frankly, I do not think any casual cross dresser can hope for more than passing the glance test. I think many here confuse the fact that people do not saying something with passing. I'll restate that I think people may suspect we are transitioned and not cross dressers. But, here's the litmus test: can you spot the cross dresser?

[Kim_Bitzflick]

Sherry,

I think this is a question llike having the fox guard the hen house. We are not really in a position to be objective on rating ourselves on passing.

When I go out, I don't notice anyone giving me the obvious double take or the SA with the the big saucer eyes but I know they do. When I go out with my wife, she wll sometimes notice people taking long looks. But then again, yesterday I went to a movie - alone. In the parking lot I walked past a group of older teenage girls and not a one noticed me. In the theater, a 5 year old girl came and sat next to me with her father on the other side of her. Neither one seemed to notice, but it was dimly lit. Did I pass in either of these situations? One might say yes and others might say no. All that matters to me is that I'm treated with respect and as I present.

I've had some CD friends say they think I pass. I've gone into stores & interacted with SA's many times and they never gave me the spider crawling reaction.

OK all that being said, I would rate myself a 67.8% passing.

[Shelly Preston]

I would say passing is not an easy thing to judge.

Sometimes folks may be respectful enough not to say anything.

As for myself It would seem to be around 75 % I don't get comments but I do get the occasional knowing look.

I was out today and had around 10 to 12 short conversation and one long one (maybe 25 minutes). Only once was I sure that I had been read.
(a cosmetics sales assistant in a short conversation.) The general public going about there business tend not to notice.

A lot of this depends on self confidence gained from being out and about on a regular basis.

[docrobbysherry]

Okay DocRobbySherry,

So most the time I go out in female clothing i'm not wearing my wig nor make-up, probably not even shaved. I'm confident and of course I'm not passing, so therefore my ability to pass is not related to my confidence.

When I put on the wig and make-up, I'm LESS confident, and at sufficient distance I get away with it, close-up forget it, no pass. I'm less confident because in this mode i'm trying to pass, at least enough to not be noticed at the gas station! Then i'm probably going to our local CD group, where everyone knows, so there's no passing option, and that's fine. 0-25%?

Thanks for the entertaining and informative post, Pam.

It reminded me of the few times Sherry has gone out amongst the muggles. While there's little chance of her passing, it doesn't seem to matter! I'm completely confident that anyone nearby will be scared too S-less to say even one word or even look directly at me!

While I have felt a powerful adrenaline rush from such experiences, I realize going out like that is ComiCon, live. And, has little to do with CDing.
P1020490 (640x607).jpg

[carhill2mn]

Based upon my experiences and what others have said, I would put myself in the 95% class.

[sara.rafaela]

It is hard to put a percentage. If I go out in a crowded downtown I can go freely and I have not noticed any stares or rude comments. While sitting in a MAC chair in Macy's I have had a fellow customer start talking to me about here daughter. I have gone to regular restaurants and bars and have been treeted just fine. If you look at me from some distance I would say 90%. But, if you talk to me face to face or check me out hard, I would say I have a 1% chance of passing.

[Danielle_cder]

for me about 50-75% open my country mouth n goes to 0%

[Princess Chantal]

Passing as female 0 to 25% I believe. Hope it is more to the 0% end of the scale.

Just like Jennifer, many folks mistaken me for someone that had transitioned or is going thru the process. It is obvious as many new acquaintances either seem to be walking on egg shells being cautious when talking to me or asking the fulltime/transitioning type of questions. The error in judgement could be chalked up to the media's focus of the transgender community being on the transitioning side of things.

[Babbs]

I'd say 50% at a passersby glance but get up close and personal it is 0%. My voice too deep and my lat muscles are too big for a girl so my back and shoulders don't look right. I do have dainty hands and small feet and legs a woman would die for but it's not enough for the up close test. I do think I have the walk and carry myself pretty well, but its not enough to pass

[kkaye]

With me it is 100%. It is not hard to pass for a middle aged black woman. I have smaller feet and juicy thighs from my power lifting days and heavy squats that, I contribute to a fat ass with older age. I tend to not want to be bothered out in public. But when, I am treated like a lady, looked at one like it. It catches me off guard at times and, I must always be ready for the Maam, excuse me Miss.
And to say the least, I know, I must seem like a lesbian at times because, I do catch myself looking at a sexy women while out.

[S. Lisa Smith]

I wish I could answer this. I've been told I pass or blend pretty well. I don't really know. I just go out and have fun...

[Eryn]

95%, but the 5% includes everyone I converse with. Even they are polite because they can never really be sure of my genetics.

[justmetoo]

I honestly don't know, because I am not able to tell what other people are thinking and I haven't asked anyone whether I passed or not. All I can say from my point of view is that I haven't noticed much notice, but I can be pretty oblivious. I have no doubt that up close, or when talking, I don't pass at all. It's possible, that like Jennifer says, people might assume I am transitioning/have transitioned (some of the interchanges with salespeople left me with the impression they think I'm either full time or dress often.). I don't know if people notice and just don't say anything or act as if they notice. I'm not trying to be coy or anything, just trying to be honest.
All I can say is I haven't had people pointing fingers or laughing or the like, as far as I have noticed. Did I pass or do people have other things on their mind or are they just being civil or what? Say what you will; I just can't imagine I'm passing (not at nearly 6 feet tall, and with all my other attributes). In any case, it doesn't really matter to me why people are not disrespecting me to my face or within my earshot.

[Rogina B]

Being seen as full time transitioned is what matters. People then show respect because they sense that you are living as they see you. I believe[from over ten years of social transitioning] that your "look" remaining constant helps out a lot..Same hair,different day...I really don't see where the fuss or fear comes from if you are confident in your right to be yourself,regardless of what sex they gave you at birth.

[DeeDeeB]

I get by on first glance 90% of the time. But at 6' 6" in heels, I often get the second glance which brings it down to 50%. That aside, practically everyone I encounter is polite enough not to comment or call me Ma'am even when I use my credit card. Then there are those folks who know me as David and comment on how lovely I look. Go figure.

Dee

[AngelaYVR]

If you can walk down the street unmolested then it matters not a jot whether you are passing or not, the effect is the same. However, I was still rather curious so went for a two hour walk this afternoon, burned off a few calories before my GNO tonight, and took special interest in what I saw. Despite the forecast calling for sun, it was overcast and cool (so much for wearing my floppy hat) and with the threat of rain hanging in the air so I wore a 3/4 length floral skirt, stockings, 3" heels and a jacket to cover the rest. A floral scarf rounded it out. Important to note that I was effectively now 6'3" and the ONLY girl wearing a skirt and heels. Just me. So yes, with everyone else wearing black or dark blue and running shoes, I had every reason to stand out.

I walked all the touristy areas as it may be something new to them to see a CD out during the day, just to increase the chances of getting a noticeable reaction. I passed by many, many people. There were a couple of people looking from the sidelines (teens on a bench), a few second-looks. One comment: "That's a big woman!" - mind you, this was from a large group where the tallest was probably only 5'4"

By this forum's mathematics, I passed with flying colours. I of course have no idea what all those people were thinking, zilch. I have no idea why people looked in the first place: height, skirt, heels, blonde hair or OMG a tranny! If someone had asked the time, my cover would have been blown instantly for sure. In the end, it didn't and doesn't matter.
So just enjoy yourselves, girls!

[CarlyJ]

Angela, what a great comment! As you say, it really doesn't matter whether you are made or not. I prefer to stick mostly to places where TG people are more accepted, such as gay bars, or restaurants where most of the patrons are openly gay. I just feel safer, and more accepted. In Atlanta, my hometown, I have learned where these places are. As a non-drinker, I can drive to these places, and sit and enjoy my tonic water or diet Coke. I have to be honest, and admit it has been a few years since I could go out. My wife and family just cannot accept my CD needs. I have wanted to bring this issue back up, but I struggle with whether it is worth it to upset my wife and adult daughters again. So I am back in the closet for now, but hoping for understanding. Thanks for the great thread!
CarlyJ

[Jilmac]

Sherry, for me passing is blending in with my surroundings. I always try to dress age appropriate so my appearance doesn't scream "hey look at me". However there have been occasions and places where I didn't have a snowball's chance in hell, passing. Those times I rolled with the punches and went on with my endeavor. I would estimate my passability somewhere between 50 and 75%.

As far as being a closet dresser, I was there for too many years with two disapproving spouses and a house full of kids. I also sported a full beard for most of my closeted life which would have made it impossible to pass in public (unless I passed as a bearded lady in a circus). Now I'm a widowed empty nester and free to dress and go out as often as I like.

[Jean 103]

Sherry you tell me. We met in Vegas. I go out all the time. I've been out all weekend I'm sitting in a regular bar down the street of where I am staying right now. I'm the only non straight here and its not a problem. I think it is all about attitude . I haven't seen you with out your mask , but makeup can do wonders . I don't think I pass, but people treat me just like anyone else. Yes I sometimes get the surprise reaction or really? I just take it in stride. I seem to be getting less of it lately.

[Michelle789]

I'm a TS and I'm living full-time, so I may be biased. When I started my transition last year, I probably passed about 25-50% of the time. There were people who couldn't tell I was trans within my own trans community, although many could read me. In public I could pass under some circumstances, but people are also polite out here so it's hard to tell if I truly passed or people were just being polite. I used the ladies room publicly even before I started HRT (I was presenting close to full time) and my experience was always positive. I would get mis-gendered from time to time. Even if I didn't pass physically, confidence helped me to pass.

Fast forward to 8 months on hormones, the last time I was misgendered (other than over the phone) was more than two months ago. I have hardly been misgendered in 2015. The hormones are helping to feminize my look and to make me feel more comfortable in my own skin, and living daily is helping with my confidence. I probably pass 75-95% of the time these days.

I truly believe that confidence is a HUGE part of passing, and is probably more important than physical passing. Passing physically is nice, but I have heard stories of transwomen who passed really well physically, but they get mis-gendered because they lack confidence or show male behavioral cues, and transwomen and CDers who don't pass well physically who get gendered correctly and treated nicely who had lots of confidence in themselves and were able to let go of male behavioral cues.

Now please, I am TS and need to take hormones. Please do not try hormones unless you're TS and only use under the direction of a doctor.

[Nadine Spirit]

Interesting and tough to answer well, as I don't get to discuss whether I pass or not with most of the folks who see me.

So.... In a picture I think I can pass very well. Maybe 75%. A glance in real life is similar to a picture, so I suppose I pass well to most people who only glance at me. But that does have to do with my clothing choices as well.

But like Jennifer, face to face, I don't think anyone mistakes me for a girl. And if any do, they sure don't once I speak.

I asked my wife and she is not as sure as I am about me not passing. She thinks I probably pass about 50-75 % of the time and with face to face and speaking maybe 25%. I think she is sweet!

[Jaymees22]

I like to think 51% of the time. I like to fool some of the people some of the time. I have realized I can usually determine if a person is a man or a women from a block away and would imagine that most people can. So we may just be kidding ourselves with our special passing abilities, but if we didn't we would never leave the house. Hugs Jaymee

[docrobbysherry]

Sherry you tell me. We met in Vegas. I go out all the time. I've been out all weekend I'm sitting in a regular bar down the street of where I am staying right now. I'm the only non straight here and its not a problem. I think it is all about attitude . I haven't seen you with out your mask , but makeup can do wonders . I don't think I pass, but people treat me just like anyone else. Yes I sometimes get the surprise reaction or really? I just take it in stride. I seem to be getting less of it lately.

Yes, we did, Jean. Altho, for just a few minutes. And, I was nervous about going on stage and wearing shades at 10 PM! As I seem to recall, I mite place u in the 50%+ category?

In my OP I was referring to myself going out while wearing only makeup. Consider yourself lucky u didn't see me that way. Remember our dapper "admirer" that nite, Steve? He kind of took a liking to Sherry. Then, the next day when I went over to say hello without my mask? He couldn't move away fast enuff!

[Sonya]

Hard to say for me, I try not to make too much eye contact because I am still not very confident in going out. When I speak I will be 0% other times I hope I am somewhere between 25% to 50%

[kimdl93]

That's a tough question to answer because I can't read the minds of the people I encounter. I go out with the assumption thatt I will be read at some point, but seldom observe sings of recognition in others. Mostly, I attribute that to be pole being focused on their own lives. I've seldom heard any remark...and only once I heard a guy asking his GF to confirm his suspicions.

On balance, I think I blend fairly well, despite being somewhat on the tall side and having freakishly large hands. But up close and personal, no one is fooled. My favorite make up stylist said she thought I was a woman until she saw my neck....

So where does that put me on the scale? Maybe 50:50