Why lie to your SO/wife?

[Laurana]

None of you may like what this thread says and it's probably extremely harsh but *shrug* it's the truth and I will not apologize for any hurt feelings



I just don't get it. I see a lot of "My SO/Wife found out and she's pissed" threads and I keep thinking to myself "Well what did you expect?". Seriously. What do you expect when it comes to light that you've been lying/hiding something from someone who thought they could trust you? Did you expect her to jump for joy? Quite honestly, to expect anything less than a total meltdown is delusional.


And then to have the gall to think that they should go to counseling to be made to accept something they have no desire to want any part of? That just seems to me to be extremely selfish.

Yes fine, sometimes it works out. But I'd wager those instances are exceptions to the rule.


If you can't be honest with the person you're with then you shouldn't be with that person. This is one of those things that should be brought up BEFORE the other person starts to have feelings for you so they can have the choice of wanting to be apart of it or not.....not after. Not telling her you bite your toenails is one thing. Not telling her you like to dress and act like a women when she's not home is another.



Rant off

[Joni T]

If you have to sneak around doing something then you probably shouldn't be doing it. I'm one of the lucky ones that doesn't have the dressing problem-ever.
Jon

[giuseppina]

If you have to sneak around doing something then you probably shouldn't be doing it. I'm one of the lucky ones that doesn't have the dressing problem-ever.
Jon

That only comes close to applying if the relationship is healthy. Otherwise, all bets are off.

Following advice from regulated professionals (including medical advice) routinely gets me into trouble unless I have arms-length proof of necessity and correctness.

[TaraGrace]

Thanks all, this (and a few other threads) are a good read!

There.. just wanted to start of with a positive (and hopefully end on one too)

I understand a lot of you somewhat better now, which is great as we don't have to agree but a certain level of understanding and respecting peoples views is something I try to always do.. so as beaten as the subject may be, please keep it coming

So I have learned a lot, but the one thing I do have trouble accepting is those knowing fully who they were at the time of partner selection and at that point willingly hide their femine side due to the reason it is otherwise hard to find a partner.. I doubt I will ever understand this.. for short term sex ok.. for relationships of short to mid term, I'll stretch my values a bit..ok.. but for mariage or any form of long term relationship, sorry no, I don't get it and doubt I ever will.

Generalising I do find reading this (and other threads) that a lot of you in a hidden relationship (for whatever reason) do not come over as happy about the situation.

Searching for a silver lining, I hope younger and/or single crossdressers find themselves perhaps advised to learn more about what it is they seek in crossdressing before getting married, and to end my post positive, lets hope times keep changing for more acceptance and information for current and future generations. It might never get out of the taboo corner, but especially when reading posts from the older generation(s) it is comforting to know the internet and places such as this corner help.

x Tara

[Pat]

Just a side observation: couples counseling is never about getting one person "straightened out" -- it's about getting couples to come to a mutual understanding. It doesn't work otherwise.

[donnaS]

Wow.
The divorce rate would sky rocket.
Many many closeted CD out there.
And DADT relationships. They can only sneak around. Unless maybe they don't like to see thier kids due to a divorce.

[arial]

Yes...and what DonnaS states is so tragically true

[bok4fun]

Agree with Jennie 100%. Counseling can work, if both parties want it to. But it is about understanding and finding a place that works for both. Maybe that place can't be found, and if that's the case, then perhaps there is only one route left. But don't be afraid to try.

That said, I do agree that if this is so important to you, it should be brought up early rather than hiding it. Once you hide it, it becomes a Pandora's box, and can never be closed when opened, no matter how hard you try.

[Jenniferathome]

Wow.
The divorce rate would sky rocket. ..

Yes...and what DonnaS states is so tragically true

No. This is a myth just like cross dressers are gay. This is a great excuse to not come clean but there is no data to support this thesis. If you use this site alone as a proxy, divorces are not CAUSED by cross dressing. Cross dressing becomes the excuse to get out of a bad relationship. Just as the GG's here. Event he ones who are divorced say that cross dressing was not the reason.

[Kimberley May]

OK let's look on it tis way, it's hardly something you can just casually drop into a conversation with your new girlfriend over lunch, is it?

"Oh by the way babe, I like to wear women's clothes, high heels and makeup. I even own a pair of silicone breast forms. Hope you understand. Please don't tell anyone, not even your BFF".

Demonise people who already feel enough guilt and shame about their CD'ing finding it difficult enough to come out the girly closet all you like for not being automatically out and proud with it. But who's to say that not only will she not accept it and leave him, but also tell her friends who might tell his friends and his family about it too, who is also maybe on her and their Facebook?

I am relatively new to this and so far haven't told my new girlfriend who I met shortly after, god knows I want to, so I will find out first how she really feels about being with anyone who dresses, before I decide to tell her my secret. I need to understand how she thinks first before I allow her to know my big secret.

If she tells me she wouldn't accept it, then I will not tell her and stop my CD'ing for her if we decide to move in together, and nobody will get hurt. But I can't judge a guy who would find it more difficult to stop and/or too fearful of everyone finding out. We still live in a highly intolerant prejudiced society regarding straight guys who CD that it is actually easier to come out as gay and even to be a camp gay crossdresser than this. Well, unless he has a boyfriend/husband maybe.

Nobody is perfect, and you, me and everyone else find it tough enough to fully feel accepted in this intolerant society. Straight guys have so many more expectations thrust upon them that any deviations still seem unacceptable today. Can't wear pink, can't drink sherry. Bah!

Yes we know dishonesty is destructive, but instead of pointing accusing shaming fingers, which will likely send many to purge against their will again, let's just show some kindness and a little more understanding and support, asking why many can't just come out loud and proud so easily. Help them make the right decisions. If the damage has already been done, judging them more won't help in anyway, but might make him feel even more alone if they feel judged within the only safe haven they thought they had.

Just saying.

[Lorileah]

Let me address this:

Wow.
The divorce rate would sky rocket.

you miss the point. It would sky rocket because you lied. HOWEVER, if you had honest upfront the marriage (if you allowed you SO to decide for herself instead of taking it upon your self to hide it to start with) would be just as strong or stronger. The lie started long before the marriage usually but even if this was something you decided after getting married, keeping it from her is unfair and controlling. You see, SOs have minds. You may THINK you know what is best for both of you but you don't. And NOT allowing her to make her own decision is... well manipulative

Many many closeted CD out there.

their choice. They choose to be in the closet for a myriad of reasons. Some very sound. But hiding it from the SO isn't a good reason. You will be caught. In fact I would bet that most already have and the SO is ignoring it hoping you will tell them OR it will go away

And DADT relationships. They can only sneak around. Unless maybe they don't like to see thier kids due to a divorce.

Definition of DADT...The SO KNOWS, you don't flaunt it. It implies the So already has knowledge OR you have an understanding. Not getting into the whole "not seeing kids because of divorce" because first THAT is just as manipulative as sneaking and two, courts in the US won't use crossdressing against you in visitation or custody

First:

Don't you read other people's comments at all? Crossdressing was THE reason my wife divorced me, and I've written that every time we discuss this. It even becomes a topic discussed by many others who've gone through this as well.
Now.

going to throw an objection to this. It isn't the crossdressing (and you are quoting the crossdressers reasons, read the GGs reasons) It is the LIE and the lack of trust that leads to divorce

[Tracii G]

I'm one who thinks you need to be up front about yourself before the first date.
If she has a problem with it its her choice to pursue the relationship or not. Its not fair to her to hide that part of you.
If you have a problem talking about your CDing thats your fault not hers.
By telling her it shows you care about what she thinks and that you are man enough not to hide things from her.It called trust.

[Tina_gm]

I definitely agree that we should be upfront about ourselves. They deserve the truth just as we do, just as anyone does. That truth though.... Sometimes we ourselves don't always know that truth. In my case, I couldn't truly accept myself as a CDer. I had Cd'd, but would go many years without ever doing it. Honestly, maybe a dozen times from the time I 1st tried it, when I was 22, until the time which I bared my secret desires and infrequent practice of dressing to my 2nd wife which was almost 3 decades.

I did not tell my wife as I had not told my 1st wife, or anyone else. The reason, I was going to take this horrible secret problem of mine to my grave alone. In my head was not a conflict at the time. I was simply going to keep my dreadful secret of female desire to myself, as I always had.

2 years into my relationship with my now wife, I began to feel an increasing urge to dress. On a few occasions when I was alone, I would sneek and dress in what clothes she has that somewhat fit me. Once again, I beat back the urge and went into hardcore repression mode. Then the engagement got closer, my attention was on marriage and I really wasn't thinking too much about it all.

Shortly after the wedding, about a month in, it came back again, stronger than ever. Again, a couple more sneek times of dressing. I was growing ever weaker to fight the female demon inside me. I remember the day when I finally said to myself, I can't fight this anymore. I was in the shower and I realized I would have to com clean. Sooner or later if I keep on this way, I will get caught. It took me a few months.... I began showing little more fem things, I started shaving my legs.... dropping small hints. I would say something a little off the wall. One night, one of those little comments went just a little too far. Then, bam, the discussion was on and I revealed it.

In hindsight, me not telling her was wrong. I have always preached about how wrong it is. Wrong for them, wrong for us. It causes so much pain, anxiety. distrust, communication issues. The list of negatives can be endless. If only I had been upfront since early on. Who knows what would have happened. My wife today says she does not know exactly how it would be. She doesn't know that she would have married me or not. .We had known each other for 20 years prior to getting together. What is certain had I told her is that we would have at least been friends and there would have been honesty. Perhaps our relationship would have grown still. Perhaps she would have married me anyway. She would have done so knowing and it would have all been so much easier then 3 and a half years into the relationship, 6 months into the marriage. The only issue we would have had is the CDing itself, and by the time we got married, that would have been figured out as well. The last 3 years has been a hard time of trust rebuilding, and re establishing our marriage as to who I really am, and how she deals with it. There is now some increased insecurity on the marriage lasting. We love each other, for that there is no doubt. She is confident that I will always love her and honor her, but, what the future holds is now less certain for her than it once was. Something that may never get back to from where the feelings of certainty was before the reveal.

[heatherdress]

I agree that it is usually best to be open and honest, but like every other issue we usually discuss, every situation is different and absolutes are simply not attainable.

We can't criticize all who feel they have to remain silent,from their spouses or SOs. We just don't know the circumstances that each person has to live with. We don’t know the risks of disclosure. We don’t even know whether a person realized they would continue to crossdress after they married and did not feel they had anything to hide early in their relationship. Although honesty, trust and open communications are very important for healthy relationships, circumstances and personalities can be quite different. Sometimes it might be better to remain secret, even with risk of eventual discovery, because there may be greater risks involved with immediate self-disclosure.

Anxiety and mental illnesses are unfortunately commonplace. Disclosure might be hurtful or not even possible with any degree of understanding or acceptance. Some spouses have strong religious convictions which would be very threatened and simple disclosure of an infrequent and private behavior might jeopardize the entire marriage. There are many other considerations that closet crossdressers might face that best keeps them in the closet, such as children, family, living quarters and career concerns.

We often hide other secrets from our spouses and loved ones. Many of us would not think it wrong to remain silent about our work worries, personal medical concerns, disappointments and internal fears and doubts. We often do not want to cause worry for those we love. Non-disclosure is typically admired in those circumstances and not considered lying, but we are always quick to belittle those who have to hide their crossdressing secret, even if they sincerely want to prevent certain hurt and pain. I think it is judgmental to criticize everyone who remains in-the-closet. Some really can’t or shouldn’t disclose their intimate secret.

I agree that openness is usually best, and that eventual discovery often is more hurtful. But not everyone can tell their spouses they like to wear panties, or that they occasionally need to wear a dress, because their consequences would definitely and immediately be significantly worse than remaining silent with risk of possible discovery.

[bok4fun]

Just a few ramblings from an old fart... Probably a little off in the head, so ignore me...

I always get aggravated when I read the replies from the people who are very happy to stay in the closet. If you are happy hiding it away, then that is fine, although I'm not really sure why you dress beyond the quick satisfaction.

But I think these conversations are more aptly aimed at those of us who are not content to have to hide who we are, and want to find our unicorn, aka accepting and supporting GGs, as well as being out to the world in general. There are many flavors of us in this world, and just because you are happy with your status quo, does not mean the rest of us have to be.

I have seen many discussions of divorce, where it was directly attributed to this issue. Also, I have seen many people talk about divorce and say it was for other reasons, and while some may believe this was not the cause of their divorce, it is a safe bet that it was a contributing factor.

Many people are afraid to bring it up early for fear of who she may tell. Is it better after being together for 10, 20, or more years, when she knows all of your friends and family, and then have her telling everybody you know after a nasty divorce?

i could go on and on... But it would fall on deaf ears I'm afraid.

[CONSUELO]

Because it is complicated is a cliche but true in this instance.

When we meet our future spouse it is often at an age when you don't really understand the strength of your cross dressing desires. As we go through life we change a lot. As a teenager I thought that cross dressing was just a substitute for a heterosexual relationship. It seemed to wane and I mistakenly thought it was just a phase. I told my SO before we married but she didn't think it was more than wearing a few feminine undergarments and at that time I was not interested in dressing fully.

So when we talk of honesty we have to remember that we often did not understand the real strength of our desire to cross dress or how it might change and become more intense with time.

Given the internet and forums like this, I may have had a greater insight and the "I am a transvestite" conversation might have been more useful and perhaps I would never have married. So honesty is not just a black and white issue for some as they just don't truly know themselves.

Of course it is always better to come out and tell the truth but what is the truth. At 20 years it might be "I just like to wear silky knickers from time to time", while at 40 it might be "I really like to dress fully as a female". Just look at the examples of men who lived their lives as heterosexual partners for decades before finding that they had latent homosexual desires that just grew stronger until they could not be resisted.

Yes, honesty is always best but to be honest we have to have an honest understanding of what we are and what we shall become and that can be difficult for some.

[Abbey11]

Hi, I fall into the late category. I have always liked women's clothes and especially heels. The most I ever did as a child was try on my mothers heels and look at pictures of women's clothes in my mothers catalogues. I've always liked drag but as a spectator, it's something that others did and they look great, I'd never even been to a fancy dress party in any women's clothing, I'd never even thought about it. May be I'm slow at understanding myself but it wasn't until recently, last 6 years, that I had a ureka type moment and it dawned on me that there is no invisible barrier between me and the women's aisle.
Now I've been married for 17 years and teenage kids. I have always loved stilettos on women and my wife knows this. I thought I'd buy, no I had a very strong desire to buy some heels and told my wife I wanted a pair, may be not the greatest move just to come out with it so bluntly but apart from being a bit taken aback she let me trundle off to the shop and I came back with a pair of 4 inches heels, this further set her back as apparently she expected a lower heel, everything was fine for a day or 2 and then she came clean about how it made her feel and it wasn't good!! However we talked about it and since then she knows I have 1 or 2 pairs plus some knee high boots 1.5 inch heel that I bought while out shopping with her she did however state I wasn't allowed to wear them over jeans..... So no problem there. However at the time of my 1st heel purchase she did quiz me on was it just shoes or was it more and at the time for me it WAS just shoes. Now overtime it has blossomed into much more than just shoes as my avatar pic testifies to. I would love to tell her of my female self but not sure I can

Sorry for the ramble
Hugs
Abbey x

[TanyaR]

As a GG/SO some of the responses on this post makes me so very angry and some just make me SMH....
We were married for 20 years, knew each other for almost 28 years, before I found her stash.
I get "the shame and guilt and fear". I get "the need went away when I got serious, but then came back later". I get the "she's so conservative she'd never understand". I get that some of you feel like you still have to hide this from your wife/so. In a perfect world, no one would give a crap about what clothes we wear or how we looked. If you are already married, there are some difficult decisions to make. If you are not married yet and in a relationship that marriage is in the future, I would hope you would make the decision to tell. We have the right to know what we are getting into and being honest up front is the only way to make choice. Once married, you take our choice away from us.

BUT please don't act like you are doing your wife/so this huge favor by lying to them. That you are making their life better by lying. All I can think when I read some of these responses is "just another man trying to control things". If you feel like you have to continue to lie, fine - it is ultimately your choice and your life. Just don't act like you are doing this "huge favor" for them by hiding this side of you and don't act all surprised when they find out and the consequence that will follow. Note: Him lying to me was the ONLY reason I even thought about divorce when I found out. I could get over the dressing part, but trying to rebuild the trust I had in him has been extremely difficult. That and the bouts of "Pink Fog".

[Lorileah]

We have the right to know what we are getting into and being honest up front is the only way to make choice. Once married, you take our choice away from us.

quote of the day....when YOU make the decision, you are saying your SO can't, either directly or indirectly.

Now I know some of you are saying MY (as in my ...Lorileah's) situation is different she's a TS. She has to be out and about. But let's go back in time. I was married, and I kept my dressing "in the closet" with my wife for many of the same reasons you all do. My job, my reputation, wanting to appear macho with friends...yes almost every one you guys cite. One small difference, my wife was the one who pulled me out, mostly because I would wander to heels and other clothes when we were shopping and she knew I wanted them. Even with that I stayed in a DADT relationship of MY doing. I didn't want to embarrass her (which by the way was her ONLY rule for me dressing and going out). Now move forward a bit. The first love of my life was dying of cancer and I was stressed to the max so what you all call the "pink fog" was strong and kept it at bay. You know what she did? (now realize she KNEW I was at least a CD0...she told me on several occasions to "put on a skirt" or "put on some hose" Nice, huh? Why did she do that? Because she knew early about me. It wasn't a secret to her.

OK moving on, I had a girlfriend and the almost first thing I told her was about "Lori". I expected that to end the relationship...and yet the first thing she said was "Let's go out together." So I am incredibly lucky? Or I only date incredibly tolerant women? Or just now having that secret made my life better...You choose. Hey, it worked for me.

I have lost both of those incredible women...that led me to stop "protecting" them from me...not the way to do it but I am now able, without fear of what would happen to them if I did "come out, to transition. Once again, not the way I would recommend you do it. Honestly I don't know how my wife would have handled that because she didn't get the chance. My GF would have been right beside me now encouraging me on...but she didn't get the chance either. Not their decision...it was ME being selfish. YOU don't know what is right for your SO...you are guessing and you have a good chance you are wrong.

[sometimes_miss]

One small difference, my wife was the one who pulled me out, mostly because I would wander to heels and other clothes when we were shopping and she knew I wanted them.

^this is the most frequent mistake made by those of you who are already out to your mates; you tend to have forgotten what it's like to be on the verge of potentially destroying the relationship. It's not a 'small difference'. It a HUGE DIFFERENCE. Having lived through the disastrous effects of coming out after already being married for some years, I remember well what it was like. Again, we lose sight of the most important thing: WE haven't changed. Only their perception of us has changed, and perhaps their biggest disappointment is in that they weren't smart enough to figure it out earlier. If they choose to believe that we're suddenly completely different people, there's nothing we can do to fix that.

Edit: About the 'hiding something we know she wouldn't like'. As I've mentioned before, there are all kinds of things that people hide from their mates, stuff they feel isn't that important. Two more things that people routinely hide, are shoplifting and cheating at gambling. Suppose you learned early how to do card tricks, and it became very easy for you to palm and hide cards. So for years you cheated casually in games with your friends, co-workers, neighbors, not enough to rip them off, but enough so that you always never lost. Or if you learned how to shoot pool expertly as a kid, and occasionally go out with your friends, lose the first game by a little, then up the odds and win the next few, but by just enough so it seems you're not a hustler? You take advantage of other people. That would disturb your wife. Same if you cheated at any other game or sport. Do you tell? How about if your wife steals a nail polish or such once in a while? Are you going to feel better if she admits that to you, just so that she feels better? Or will you be happy living with a thief?

[Marcelle]

Hi MM,

I don't disagree However, what I would not / cannot ever do is set myself up as the moral guardian of what is right and what is wrong. I have done way too much in my life which precludes me from such a title.

Each of us must travel the path set for us and learn from whatever mistakes we make. The one thing I have learned in my 50 plus years of life, the minute we force a person down a pathway (even with the best of intentions), should things go awry it is that person who suffers the torment, not us. I will dispense advice should someone come to me and is struggling with which way to go (tell/don't tell) and I will give them both sides of the outcome and yes, I will tell them that the potential for things to go well is there . . . but I would never, ever in a million years say . . . it worked out for me so it will for you or that they are a bad person for not telling. A gentle nudge in a positive direction . . . yes. An outright forced push . . . for me . . . a big no.

Cheers

Marcelle

[Launa]

Cowards and Liars..... Yes I am one of those individuals that have used these words in the past and I will stand here and say I own it. If your doing something behind your SO's back and it happened once then OK, it was a mistake say no more. If it happens all the time and you can't control it then buck up to the table and say it out loud.... For those of you that justify your lies well that's OK I guess, its up to you to check your moral compass and decide whats right and wrong. Just like having an affair on Ashley Madison

[Stephanie47]

Launa, you're really being judgmental tonight! Not telling one's wife about his interest in wearing women's clothing is akin to cheating on a wife through Ashley Madison? I think not! Sometimes ago back on 11/22/2013 someone said,

"Then said to myself one day I'll die and not have to deal with this shit. I don't wish to die but I hate this curse."

I suppose some are better able to handle this "curse" better than others.

[AngelaYVR]

So we can all rest assured that those throwing stones have thoroughly rid their lives of anything questionable whatsoever, right?
Hey, I did tell my wife and yeah it worked out great for me. Yet I have enough experience to know those who like to crow the loudest about how chaste and pure they are, are the people with the biggest collections of skeletons in the closet.

[Lori Kurtz]

Not telling one's wife about his interest in wearing women's clothing is akin to cheating on a wife through Ashley Madison? I think not!

For me, crossdressing was very much akin to cheating on my wife. It was a sexual activity that took energy away from my relationship with her; it gave me sexual pleasure at her expense, without her having the opportunity to understand what was (and was not) going on between the two of us. There is so much diversity in what the experience of crossdressing means, that our discussion is not well served by universalizing anyone's individual experience. I certainly wouldn't reject anyone's assertion that he/she engages in crossdressing in a way that is not destructive to the honesty that a good marriage requires--for some, the crossdressing, even though secret, might be perfectly harmless. But I know from experience that secret crossdressing can definitely be harmful to a marriage, because I know that my secret life was harmful to my marriage long before my wife discovered the truth and decided to end the marriage.