LGB....but no T...

[jennifer0918]

Good point Tracii G..

[Shelly Preston]

Gina,
You are right to choose the path that suits you.

We can't all be gender warriors and fight every battle that comes along. Its a case of picking and choosing the battles where you feel you can make a difference. A social group might be the right place for some for others its a workplace. Sometimes its down to changing peoples minds one at a time.

[ginapoodle]

The good news is that I have had some wonderful Gina time with wife and daughter gone visiting family including grandpa dying from Alzheimer's. To celebrate my day, I am wearing some vintage Hanes stockings, and nice lingerie. Slept in them last night: divine sensuality. And, it is even not too hot yet.

[donnalee]

Donna I don't see where you are disagreeing. Are you saying they don't have the right to exclude someone from a social group? That wont fly. Every social group has limits as to who can join. If you are saying that preventing the T from the LGB group that is formed for support is wrong, that's what I said. The big difference is LGB are sexualities, T is an identity. In the T we are straight, gay and bi. Now if it is a social group, let's say bent on dating or partnering, then they should include gay/lesbian T's but why would a hetero T want to be in it? You would be marginalized at the gatherings,. you wouldn't share the things they formed a group for.

Since this is a church group, I would assume it would be a social group designed for bonding over the religious doctrine, not dating or partnering. So, they are wrong excluding, or suggesting that you would not be interested. It sends the signal, to me, that the group is based more on sexuality than on tenets of the church. That's why I said call them out on it. Educate them. They may not see what we see.

As to being a "gender warrior" I think there are enough of us out there fighting for you that just knowing you support us doesn't require physical participation. But remember, you win or lose with us too. So if you want equality, even if you are in the closet, standing up for those rights should be important to you

No Lorileigh, this is where I disagree:

"I find that the L&G of the LGBT really don't want "us" tagging along and I think it is due to the small minority that makes the rest of world uncomfortable with "us"." - Lorileigh

"If we do not hang together we will certainly hang separately." -Benjamin Franklin

[Julie Gaum]

I certainly agree with my old friends Lorileah, Tracii and Rog. I do believe that, interestingly, they each represent a different segment under the TG umbrella. If that particular church wishes to exclude hetero CDs that most likely make up 80% of the entire LGBTQ communuty ---that's their right. I might question the reasoning but I have no reason to be insulted.
Julie

[Suzanne F]

I was asked not to come back to my church of 6 years when I came out as a Trans woman. I say be grateful that your church has come this far. Go and educate the other LGB people and be yourself. As far as being a gender warrior yes there are plenty of us out here fighting for equality and we appreciate your support.

[ginapoodle]

All,

Reading responses again, with more reflection, this quote comes to mind. Kudos to Lorileah!!

The big difference is LGB are sexualities, T is an identity. In the T we are straight, gay and bi. Now if it is a social group, let's say bent on dating or partnering, then they should include gay/lesbian T's but why would a hetero T want to be in it? You would be marginalized at the gatherings,. you wouldn't share the things they formed a group for.

Bingo, right to the point why I am uncomfortable going to a church, but social focused (lets date), and offsite social mixer. Focus is not on religion or Principles. Pastor confirmed, they have never had any M to F participation. As I am not gay or bi, my discomfort is extremely high and fit low. Its too bad as part of me would like to get out there and perhaps educate a bit. What I AM doing though is dialoging with three of our pastors on my T and gender dysphoric experiences, opinions and such.

[Robertacd]

I have to say that the ever changing acronym thing is boggling my mind! I was exploring a therapist and saw a new one: LGBTQQA. I give up trying to figure out where I fit in that mess. People will think what they will about me, so let them. I'm not a gender warrior, but I do want to be accepted as Joyce. So, I have been following the advice Tracii gave you. We are here on this forum to learn. I can tell you that over the last two years I have learned a lot and grown in so many ways.

Very well said Joyce.

For the life of me I never have been able to understand the obsession with labels this forum seem to have.

[Alice Torn]

Well, i an still a man, and am a rugged individualist, in spite of my cding. I never did like any kind of "group think" A little John Wayne, in this Alice. Everyone is an individual, even if going to a group of any kind. i go to a 12 step Codependents Anonymous group, and am one of the only SINGLEs there. My issues are different from all the marrieds that are there, and i am kind of left out, for it, seldom am hugged now. I have always beena bit of a loner, like my dad was.

[barbara gordon]

Well there are always different ways for cd /tg people to get out and socialize. And just as many ways to keep a more private lifestyle . All is ok for each to choose.
I agree with the idea that LGB doesnt always get the T from a deep level , but I think that the LGB gets the T from the perspective of being an outsider position. .
For that reason there is a connection of support that happens. Its not always a perfect match , but i think an invite can be measured as genuine . The church group (or any "lgbt" group)
Will probably tolerate a lot of variables in its membership .

.. i have met many crossdressers and self described trans people. The straight or gay or bi thing doesnt really make people turn away from eachother in sharing common experiences about crossgender/crossdresser ideas.

[Aunt Kelly]

Gina,
I am confused. What is it, specifically, that is making you uncomfortable? Have the clergy or other members done or said something unwelcoming or hostile?

[ginapoodle]

Kelly Marie,

Specifically I have been "hit on" several times at our church by various gay men looking. I trigger "gay-dar" even when wearing a wedding ring. My wife does not attend church with me. Wearing motorcycle leathers projects an image. Nope, I am not "leather man" -- they are to keep me safe, warm and dry during winter season riding.

I am not attracted, at all, to men. The pastors are not the issue, the male gay Senior pastor very much wants diversity, Unity and One-ness. I just can't get there in this venue.

Also I tend to be fairly introverted. Walking into a room full of mostly strangers, and being expected to explain myself as straight, M to F and T seems a bit toxic. It would be stressful as hell for me, and I also have no desire to broadcast to a large group my situation. My wife and friends that do not know about "Gina" likely would find out via wagging tongues. Poof goes any confidentiality and my wife would be mad as hell.

At my early sixties, I no longer feel I have to please others or "force" being an extravert when unwelcome. I guard my own peace and sanity.

Make sense?

[AllieSF]

Thanks for that clarification. It sounds like there is no fault with the clergy, nor its members. You just are trying to maintain your own sanity and comfort zones, which from what I understand, means minimal to zero interaction with the strangers at the church gatherings. Plus, you do not want to be found out, and that chance may truly increase if you are out at your church. Just enjoy what you have and live your life as you want under your own self instituted restrictions. If you do need to get out to test the waters or enjoy new experiences you can do that far from home when you get or make the chance. Good luck.

[Nikki A.]

Gina I think I understand where you are coming from. I used to attend two groups that were predominantly gay and lesbian and some girls who were transitioning. As a straight CDer at times I did feel like the red headed step-child. One group I stopped attending for that reason, I felt that I was ignored. The other group I did stick with and after a while I felt comfortable and made friends with all the groups. I stopped attending eventually in that it was too far away.
I'm no warrior but you make your own comfort zone.