Some people have a strange way of dealing with their SO's. For one thing, if my SO ever spoke aggressively to me (I would call it bullying), I would get my own luggage.
Marissa,
I certainly hope you two can come to an amicable agreement.
Some people have a strange way of dealing with their SO's. For one thing, if my SO ever spoke aggressively to me (I would call it bullying), I would get my own luggage.
Marissa,
I certainly hope you two can come to an amicable agreement.
Last edited by char GG; 11-29-2023 at 10:05 PM.
Marissa, so sorry to hear how things turned out for you. It would have been nice if she had been as open with you about your crossdressing as you were with her. that sh pretended to like it just to "land you" is so reprehensible and underhanded. I wish I had some sort of recommendation that could help make things better. Unfortunately all I can say is welcome back and know that any time you want to talk we'll be here for you.
The Pink Fog will be with you, always!
Marissa, I'm so sorry to read of your situation. I'm relatively new to cross dressing as I've only been at it for 3 1/2 years. My wife and I have been married 40 years. My desire to CD was as much a surprise to me as it was to her. While she accepts it, she is not supportive nor does she participate. The good thing is she allows me the freedom to CD as much as I like so long as family and friends don't know. That means I can dress at home or far away from home. I would hope you can come to some sort of agreement with your wife of a similar nature. Maybe it's a matter of under dressing such that it isn't visible to others. After all, nobody will likely ever see if you're wearing panties. If you live in a cooler climate, it could be a bra under sweaters or jackets. Of course, when wearing long slacks, pantyhose or thigh highs will not be noticeable assuming you also wear socks. My point is, insist on a conversation and try to negotiate what she can live with so fae as you cross dressing. You might remind her during the course of such a conversation that you were honest up front so she was well aware of what she was getting and to insist you change is unreasonable.
If she simply refuses to talk about it, definitely seek out couples counseling. I wish you well as you move forward in trying to deal with this situaqtion.
It's never too late to enjoy a happy childhood.
Live each day as though it's your last 'cause one day you'll be right.
I'm finding the more feminine side of me...and I ❤️ this adventure.
Im so sorry you have to deal with it im in a marriage of 45 years my wife used to buy me things even did my make up and her and friends we would go to gay womens bar then one time she had a friend do my make up after that night she told me never wanted to do it again i was devastated. I still have the first thing she bought me a pink bra and gater and panty set.oh it will never fit me again but it was from her im like you i need to dress to be happy but its so nice to dress with some one who dose not judge .don't get me wrong i love my wife and all my kids and great grand kids.but to be able to wear my stuff any time without judgement would be great.but this is what it is so you know life gives you lemons blah blah balh lol i wonder if us older crossdressers put up with a nonaccepting wife because when we came up there was no help or groups to share our feelings with now there are groups to help everywheres.im not sure all i know is ill never quit that i do know
Dutchess,
I always appreciate that you give your perspective here on the forum. I've read many of your posts and have seen that your past relationships with crossdressers have been fairly traumatic and I can sympathize. I hate to know that anyone has faced betrayal and disrespect.
It's our human nature to love the things about an intimate partner that we see as beneficial to ourselves and our image of ourselves. Whether it's physical attractiveness, hard work, public standing, etc... we tend to value those things that we feel give us an increased sense of value for ourselves.Originally Posted by Dutchess
Notwithstanding, abuse and infidelity, to love the benefits and reject the rest doesn't really meet my definition of love. The man who loves my wife dearly is totally male, but totally atypical. That fact has cost me dearly in intimacy and respect. It makes me sad for my wife that she's married to a man who falls so short of her expectations and in supporting her own self image.
You seem to generalize about crossdressing based on your past and on certain posts here on the forum. I get that and see it as a natural response. But, wearing leggings and a cute blouse doesn't necessarily lead to those behaviors. We each have our own pasts and sometimes the behaviors of others in our pasts will encourage us to experiment in order to find a new, more accurate self image.
Last edited by Bea_; 11-30-2023 at 11:49 AM.
I think it's possible that Maria 60 meant to use the word "assertive" rather than "aggressive". Certainly there's absolutely no place for aggression or violence or bullying, but assertiveness can be healthy if done in a loving way. My wife is happy for me to be assertive (as she says, "she married a man not a boy or woman").
It does sound like Maria's wife "tried it on" with him - it reads to me that he called her bluff.
Again, I am in no way condoning aggression or violence - not in either direction. A relationship can only work with mutual respect and love.
Just my 2p
Yes, I think assertive would be much more in line with what my wife expects of me. Neither of us are particularly assertive personally or professionally. I know that my wife finds my "laissez faire" attitude to be a frustration. She would never accept aggression from me.
Its alot more complicated that many here on the forum think it is .
I just know how it really goes after being involved up close and personal with them and out in public too for the last 25 years . Plus all their friends too .. we weren't hidden in the house so I knew probably close to 200+ of them .. I don't think its generalizing at all . I recognize his words . I recognize them well .
Unfortunately my experience is very common . Sadly .
I also keep up with this on Reddit , Twitter etc etc in real time so its not really in the past . I am not a typical housewife and I see these CD'ers every day through what I do for a living Every DAY and what they want I cannot say here . 3 of my clients are members here . They say one thing but do quite another . So this is how I get my outlook . all of it mixed together .
I work with women now in my spare time , worldwide , who have been hurt by this and its alot of them . I won't be stopping either .. its The CD'ers who need to check their behavior. I stand by that .
Plus I don't wish to see anyone over 40 in leggings and a blouse .. maybe a tunic but not a blouse . Not me not anyone . That's a personal thing . I know you all love them
No she meant what she meant and I don't care and shes been aggressive with me in the past too thats why isaid I would not address her . I will always stand up for women after my exp . I would be wrong not too .
I never ever bother you all anymore unless someone is being unfair or rude to a woman . I know how it felt when mine did what op is doing here and I wasn't there to defend myself and it was bad and damaging .
Last edited by Dutchess; 11-30-2023 at 01:58 PM.
IG : Knightress Oxide
I cannot believe one can write such a post in 2023 !
I hope everyone here knows that aggressivity is not an acceptable behavior. Compelling your wife to agree to your dressing desire is not acceptable. And like Dutchess, I will add that if you are a woman dealing with your SO's dressing, your love for him cannot lead you to excuse or accept any kind of violence against you. If you are facing domestic violence, get assistance.
@Marissa
It is sad to feel trapped. It will probably be a good thing to explore that feeling with a psychologist, you are listing several reasons of unhappiness (dressing, but also not really wanting kids, returning to Midwest, loneliness,...).
And just a guess too : maybe your wife is aware of your feelings and maybe it is not understandable or acceptable for her, having children to take care of, that your way to deal with the situation is to dress. You need to restore communication.
You wrote "The wife and I have talked about seeing a therapist together to discuss things, we just need to find the time in our lives to get it on the calendar. On most topics we have pretty good/ to great, communication, but sensitive topics are much more difficult to breech."
So it is time to make the couple therapy a priority ! Good luck to both of you.
Sorry to hear this Marissa - it is a lesson for the future.
My big awakening came when my GF of years, the most liberal woman imaginable , supportive of any male or female who is transgender - any male that is ...except her own BF.
At first it was an open minded declaration : " if it is part of you - there is nothing wrong with this - we will just have to work it into our lives".
We dated in HS and Uni but as the clock ticked, she made it clear that despite her liberality to other people - it had no place in her own life.
She expected a stereotypical man for a partner - his task is make big money and I spend it " a me Jane ; you Tarzan" world view - and most importantly in theis stereotypical partnership -
You cannot be anything I am not proud to tell my friends about and being a crossdresser is at the top of the list. She started making negative comments of role reversal etc - I get that - but she proclaimed herself Miss Tolerance but it was al a facade to land the fish.
Knowing myself to be naturally happy, industrious and tolerant - I thought it best to remain a bachelor and prosper without the headache - I knew changing who I am is impossible and there was no way I was going to fund more social intolerance through divorce.
Last edited by kellyanne; 11-30-2023 at 03:16 PM.
A member that gives cherry picked quotes from his wife and responders who think that they got the whole story that way. Some who never met the wife but side with the OP no matter what.
Some (most?) who seem to have no issue in the world when another complacently explains that aggressiveness and my way or the highway is the right way to treat your SO if you want to make progress in the cool world of CDing. I know it is a support forum. But there are limits to what can be read without a reaction.
And about the gentle mansplainings to GGs who reply. Do you really think GGs generalize from just their own personal experience? They have this thing called the FAB where they share their experiences. They have this site called CDers.com where many members explain that the only problem in their relationship was the dressing but also casually mention that they cheated, hid a secret life, stole clothes, ignored their wives sexual needs, etc (oh yes, count me in, I did some of those things too, and the dressing was the least of our problems. It puzzled my wife. But the rest, the lying, the stealing, PISSED her off).
What a peculiar thread. If I was a GG, I would certainly not feel safe here.
I feel sorry for you, unfortunately people lie. Change their minds when they should not. You must scale down. Like just panties in a great hiding place. So you can get some time in when you need it. We all go through this at one time or another. Like ever time I dress up I have to go on these boards
By no means would I ever ever ever advice someone to yell, scream or use any physical force or bully anyone. I shouldn't have used the word aggressive, when I meant to be more persistent or assertive. More to the point of she doesn't want to talk about it, so ask her when she wants to talk about it, or we have to talk about it, its very important to me.
In most situations when we read a post about a wife starting to come around, most of everyone's advice would be to don't rush it and take it slow. In your situation your story is making my heart bleed so I believe my advice would be to maybe push the issue more, explain how you really feel and how important this is in your life.
As I said before I hope you find some form of pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
Dutchess, Char, Di, Miel, and DianeT, very well said, very well explained. I was going to add my thoughts about the value of assessing and reassessing priorities, the value of coping with changes, and how seldom such actions seem to be taken these days. But your responses have pointed that out, perhaps in better words. You've also pointed out what typically happens when priorities, honesty, and the willingness to accept change are ignored.
ADDED THOUGHT: Genetic women are the ONLY ONES with any experience AS WOMEN dealing with crossdressers. It may behoove many here to at least think about that.
Thank you.
Last edited by Linda Stockings; 11-30-2023 at 08:58 PM.
I would call what you are describing as abusive and manipulative. If my daughter was in such a relationship I would do all that I could to rescue her from it, as would my wife.
I can?t stand most men at the best of times. I have even less time for men who are abusive to women.
Just another man in a dress
Sounds like time to invoke the CD pre-nup! Written or unwritten but understood.
Having read Maria's posts over the years, I believe what she meant was assertive or persistent. I don't think she was advocating abusive behavior.
As for Marissa's situation, Regardless of why it was done, the wife lied. So now she shouldn't have to deal with the consequences of her lie?
If it's gone on for this long, then counseling certainly seems warranted. It takes two to tango.
I am a vessel of the goddess. Let me express my calling to a feminine life through nurturing love and relatedness.
Quoting: "She told me a women needs a strong aggressive man next to her to keep her in place." Why repeat such statements then?
Last edited by DianeT; 12-03-2023 at 06:45 AM.
See Maria's post #38.
I am a vessel of the goddess. Let me express my calling to a feminine life through nurturing love and relatedness.
Post #38 doesn't address what I highlighted above.
Post #38 was to clarify what she said in post #21, which was a quote from her mother, so my opinion as to Maria's intentions remains unchanged. She did not intend to advocate abusive behavior.
Last edited by April Rose; 12-04-2023 at 09:54 AM.
I am a vessel of the goddess. Let me express my calling to a feminine life through nurturing love and relatedness.
Mod note:
Time to move on. We all are able to read what was said. Enough.
You've been consistently and completely honest with your wife from the beginning. I admire this and my heart goes out to you. I understand your frustration and current unhappiness.
I read your post from October 2013 where you describe having dated your wife for a year and having just come out to her. You said that at first she didn't like the idea of the CDing, but she was coming around with doing makeup, going shopping, etc, and you were "cautiously optimistic" about her overall acceptance. And then you didn't post anything else about your relationship until now.
Several things come to mind.
First, Please don't listen to the people here who say that your wife tricked you. It is easy to misconstrue another person's intentions or feelings about something unless the communication about the issue is crystal clear, with everything spelled out in great detail. And very few people are good at doing this. Reading through the lines, it sounds to me as if your wife did let you know in the beginning that she wasn't thrilled about the CDing, and as her feelings toward you deepened she tried to get involved and support you. You say that she now claims that she only supported you to "land" you. This is not necessarily a bad thing. I was also supportive of my own SO's CDing when we started dating because frankly, I had fallen in love with him and I wanted to land him too!Why wouldn't I have been supportive. I am in a different situation than your wife though. My SO and I are both past middle age, it is a second long-term relationship for both of us, and we certainly are well past having young kids in the house.
But, sadly things can and do change in any relationship as partners learn more about the CDing and how it fits into their lives, especially when the relationship becomes established after the first throes of new love settle down. And to complicate matters, your wife went from being a new wife to a new mother of two young children! Having kids most certainly changes any GG's priorities. So knowing what I know of GGs and human nature in general, I think your wife sincerely tried to be supportive (because she did and I am sure still does love you), but having young children around changed all of that. Do you want to come out to your kids? Or to your neighbors? Or to the people you work with? I'm guessing this is a big concern for your wife?
Second, you describe your wife as taunting you with talk about the sexy things she wants to wear. I honestly do not think she is doing this on purpose to torment you. If you keep the CDing under lid for her, she likely has no idea that you feel tormented. She cannot know what it feels like to be a suppressed CDer unless you spell it out. I also have something to add about you giving your opinion "as a guy", but please see my note about this at the end of my post.
Third, it is my impression that you see things in black and white? Either she supports you or you suppress it? You do want to share the CDing with someone, I understand this, and you would like that person to be your wife, but sadly right now this is not possible as you would like it. As your children get older this may change, but my suggestion for now is to find a support group that you can share it with.
This is what I suggest you communicate to your wife:
1. I need to crossdress.
2. I understand that you do not want to be involved, and I respect this, but this doesn't take away my need.
3. I need to share the CDing with someone else. I don't want to come out to people we know or work with, and for this reason I would like to be freer with the CDing (or CDing topics) around you, but if you are uncomfortable with this I would like to find a support group of other CDers and their wives.
4. Please understand that I am not looking for a sexual relationship with anyone. I just want to talk about fashion, makeup, or other feminine things with people who understand where I am coming from, who do not judge me negatively, and who share my interests.
5. Again, I understand that you don't want to be involved, but once I find a support group, please know that you always would be welcomed to join me. I have heard of groups where CDers and their wives meet occasionally for dinner in a private (or next town over) setting, where there is no risk of running into family, friends, or coworkers, and I will try to find such a group.
6. I would also like to dress a bit more freely at home after the kids have gone to bed, and I ask for your tolerance. Would you hate it terribly if I dressed for a few hours in the evening once in awhile, and we just carried on doing whatever it is we do? The evening doesn't have to revolve around talking about clothes or grooming, or painting fingernails, etc. We could just watch a movie together and be normal except for the clothes I am wearing.
7. What are your thoughts about all of this?
I hope you will give serious thought to taking a different approach with your wife.
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Note on giving your opinions "as a guy": Why must your opinion be as a guy, or as a girl? Why can't it be simply on whether or not you like the outfit on her? Wives ask their husbands? opinions like that all the time!
You mention wanting to tell her how you would wear the outfit, but as a GG, I can tell you that when a friend asks whether I like an outfit on her or not, the last thing I want is to turn the conversation around and make it all about me and how I would wear it! This just seems so selfish and competitive! GGs don't do that to their friends unless they are immature or completely self-involved! If my friend asks about whether an outfit suits her, I don't even think about how the outfit would look on me or how I would wear it. I look at her objectively and do my best to give an honest answer (tactfully if I don't think the outfit looks good on her), just like any husband would.
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Bravo!!
[SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]
This is a long thread, sorry I've just read this. It might be a good idea to find a therapist if you can't find a CD support group. But the issue should be about improving the communication with your wife more than the CDing in itself. It sounds as if you know yourself well and what you need, but you don't feel you are getting it from your wife and because you want to keep the CDing private, it is difficult to share it with anyone. I also would recommend you and your wife taking the time to see see a marital counselor, so that you can both get to the bottom of what each of you needs in your marriage. I would hate to see your marriage get to the point where your (or your wife's?) frustrations mount to the point of divorce and breaking up your children's family.
Last edited by ReineD; 12-07-2023 at 07:53 AM.
Reine
I will speak from my own experience about this. I've been in therapy for the last three years, starting with dealing with some long term trauma and when some of those issues became less current, we moved to talking about my crossdressing. For me, the hours of discussion about my need to dress and the motivations for that need have helped me to clarify the things that I could never articulate to my wife. I've had a general understanding about how I felt while dressed, but verbally expressing those feelings has been a challenge. My therapist has consistently challenged my lack of clarity in expressing my feelings, both about my crossdressing and my marriage in general. In the long run the biggest takeaway has been that I'm learning to accept how my personal tastes and needs fit into my overall identity. I'm learning that I'm not just a crossdresser but rather a very complex person who crossdresses.
Reine,
I see how often you take the time to give very well articulated points in your responses. You've been kind enough to write responses like this to at least one of my posts and I appreciate it. I actually wrote out three or four responses to your comments and ended up deleting them because many of the things you mentioned did not lend themselves to a public response and I am not comfortable having private conversations with other women about my marriage. I just wanted to acknowledge that I appreciated your well thought out response. Thank you.
We are fortunate to have you on the forum.
Precisely! Effective communication is key, and in order to accomplish this we must learn to be assertive, which is hugely difficult when it comes to sensitive topics between spouses - whether the topic is the crossdressing, sex, compulsions, addictions, or any other deeply rooted need that one partner has and the other doesn't. Knowing what to say is one thing. Losing the fear of saying it is quite another.
Sadly, some people are so afraid to proverbially rock the boat, they allow unspoken resentments to fester until a marriage is ruined. Marital counselors can guide and provide a safe place for couples to discuss the difficult things.
To Marissa Mae: Earlier I suggested seven things you might say to your wife. I would like to add an eighth.
8) In an attempt to discuss the CDing with people who won't judge me negatively, years ago I joined a CDer general discussion forum. They have a private support section just for the wives that CDers cannot access, and you might consider joining as well. There are many wives of CDers who would prefer their husbands to not crossdress, and some of these wives might have insight on how to successfully navigate a marriage where the husband wants to crossdress and the wife would rather he didn't.
So Marissa, there may be things you've said in this thread and perhaps in earlier, much older threads that you would not want your wife to read? If so, please do not convince yourself that your wife would not want to join. Ask her. She is a mother of young children and I am guessing that she does not want to become a single mother. If you let her know how unhappy you've become and she wants to save her marriage, she will be willing to seek a solution, whether it is joining this forum or going with you to couples counseling. Or both. Please do not be afraid to share your truth.
You might also, from this point forward, ask yourself if you would be OK with your wife reading your post as written, and then editing it accordingly before you post. I think this would help you be even more objective.
Last edited by ReineD; 12-07-2023 at 11:21 AM.
Reine
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