Attraction in Relationships

[sobe1ove GG]

I see a lot of things on this message board from cross dressers who say that this is who they are, it's natural, get over it. Of course, I'm paraphrasing, but it seems like a lot of CDers can't understand why a GG SO would have a problem with it. I'd like to shed a little light.

A lot of what a relationship is comes from attraction. You are attracted to your partner in various ways. You are attracted to their personality, their aspirations and goals, how they treat you. You are also attracted to how they look and act.

When we, all of us, get in a relationship, our decision to be with someone is largely based on those attractions. If cross dressing is introduced years after the start of a relationship, attraction can be the biggest issue.

Essentially, the cross dresser is introducing a lot of new behavior and appearances. Where we were attracted to your rough appearance, you are now clean and hair free. Where we were attracted to your strength, you are now much more feminine and light.

A lot of attraction also comes from how you, all of us, look. I, for example, like men. I don't find women attractive. I'm not bi or gay. This can be a problem. Although you as cross dressers ARE men, when you are presenting as women, SOs like me have a hard time finding you attractive. We may even be repulsed. It isn't because you're a crossdresser, but because we just don't like girls.

Another thing, for me and others, is that I don't like people (romantically) who are prissy. I am not attracted to people who like frilly things and like to prance and wear heals and makeup. Even if you are obviously a guy, and aren't trying to be a woman, this is still unattractive.

Yes, there are some ladies who like this. These are then the relationships with the most acceptance. But, if you are with a GG SO who is straight and likes her man to be at least somewhat manly, then there will be a problem.

A lot of us GGs don't actually have a problem with cross dressers. We don't hate you or think what you are doing is wrong. It's all about the attraction factor. By introducing cross dressing into the relationship, you are taking away some of her attraction to you. And where a big problem comes in is if you start to change how even your man side looks. If you start thinning your eyebrows, you will look MUCH more feminine, and this will always be the case because it's not like you can take off or put on new eyebrows on a whim. In these situations we look at you and see the feminine side even when you aren't wearing a dress. Then it's like a part of you is unattractive all of the time.

Now, this may change over time. She may become attracted to that female part of you. In the meantime, you maybe might understand where she's coming from and cut her a bit of slack.

Also, this attraction thing can happen with other changes. For example, I don't really like the hip hop culture of baggy jeans and bad English and attitudes. If my guy started being like that, I'd have a problem because I think it's unattractive.

Hopefully I've shed some light on where us as GG SOs are coming from.

Sobe

[rose382832]

very well spoken. that is why my so and i came to an agreement when we started this all off. at least one day a week i am all male( most weeks more cause just too tired after work to bother.) and one day a week there is nothing but snuggle time. but i can save up she time, by being a guy more than one day a week.( im now up to about three years straight but wont ever cash it in cause i love taking care of her as much as she loves taking care of me.)

ps. we dont even try to keep track of it cause we are still having fun( just the 3 of us)

[CharleneCD]

Sobe,

You are very right in what you are saying. My wife is just like that. She has no attraction to me when I am fem. She will flat out tell you that she is not attracted to women. It has caused difficulties with our sex life during those periods when I tend to want to be fem days at a time. So I have to make sure she gets some quality guy time in. I think that is very fair. She accepts and helps out my feminine side and I make sure she doesnt totaly lose the guy she married.

[Marla S]

Thanks for posting your thoughts. You definitively shed some light on the matter.

Let me add some arguments from the other side ... exclusively from my personal experiences.

First: I don't think that emulating a woman is the most wise thing a CD can do and I see that this will (almost inevitable) cause problems (would be worth separate thread why most CDs want/have to emulate a woman).
That turns the attractiveness upside down and it is almost logical that usually attractiveness is lost for the SO.

A big misconception IMO is to dress to please others in the first instance.
In the frist instance you dress for yourself, than you hope others will like it too.
From my experience it doesn't work to tell someone what style to wear or not to wear.
I tried it with my Ex, (whished she would have dressed less masculine), she tried it with me (more the baggy style). Neither did work out. The only result has been frustration, depression and omitting to talk about clothes and appearence in general.

I have learned from it that far more important and far more attractive than the clothes or appearence of the other is that the other feels comfortable in his/her skin.
A confident, happy person is far more attractive than the highest heel or the longest beard can be.

To get told after years together that the hubby is a CD certainly is a shock, and hard to deal with. One time you see the man you married the other time you see some sort of a woman.
I believe in both cases you don't see the real person (both is a bogus). It's disguise this way or that way.

Like most always the truth probably is somewhere in the middle.
I hope and think it is possible to uncover this in a way that both can find it attractive.

[Tree GG]

We've said on numerous occasions, if I were single and saw you in a bar, I'd still try to pick you up. Both he & me.

Would I try to pick up Darlene? Nope.

But even en femme, holding his/her hand, walking arm-in-arm (occurs rarely) or kissing (only lightly, "her" make-up colors look awful on me), the touch is still the same. So if I close my eyes it makes no difference.

But visually I just don't get the "come hither" feeling. (I don't know what he thinks, I'll have to ask - he'll love that )

[Di]

Viva La Difference...............every relationship is different in my case I am attracted to the girly side..and do not consider myself bi or gay.

Maybe thinking about love in this way...it might help............I think
The way a person looks, their physical appearance,or what they wear isn’t as important as their inner looks, or soul. We fall in love with someone’s soul, And We fall in love with their heart. With their inner self. With their true being. And that’s what matters most.And if you look at it that way.....regardless of the clothes or hair or whatever...they are the same person.

[MJ]

well said sobe.. also there is this issue were my ex could only see the other woman and she could not be near me in our bed because of that .. a real turn off .. i never dresses en femme for bed but when she had that image in her head it's game over.. finding the wonderful woman who can accept this side of us is tough.. thanks for the post

[Rebecca Petersen]

Viva La Difference...............every relationship is different in my case I am attracted to the girly side..and do not consider myself bi or gay.
I think
The way a person looks, their physical appearance,or what they wear isn’t as important as their inner looks, or soul. We fall in love with someone’s soul, And We fall in love with their heart. With their inner self. With their true being. And that’s what matters most.And if you look at it that way.....regardless of the clothes or hair or whatever...they are the same person.

How very true. If a relationship (Love) is based on physical appearance, you're in for trouble, because as the old adage goes, "Looks fade." Love is based on the inner person, not the outer package. Taking CD'ing out of the equation, my appearance is much different today that it was 20 or 30 years ago.
I must also add, that I have met a great number of women that are attracted to and love their CD'ing SO because they see past the paint and powder. They are far from Bi or Gay, just capable of seeing deeper than many others.

[Joy Carter]

I can't say enough about my wife and what a great woman she is. But she has a body image problem. Although I'd like her to improve her looks with diet. I'd never be the one to suggest it.
So to get to my point is that she (has never said) can't look at me me dressed because I may look better than she. I know this may upset some GGs but it may be another factor here to consider. BTW I do not think I remotely look better than she does. She is most pleasing to my eye.

[Bonnie D]

I can totally understand that. I recently came out to my wife and she now understands why I shaved my moustache a couple of years ago even though I knew she how she felt about it. A moustache didn't fit into my wanting to look and dress like a woman.

I'm leaving the relationship because I need to be with a man. I'm obviously TS but have no plans to transition. My wife asked me what type of man am I looking for and she asked if I would want to have a relationship with another crossdresser. I said that I didn't for the same reasons Sobe is saying. I want my man to be manly but not over-the-top even though I am who I am. I told her that I want him to be around my age, taller, a gentleman, educated, good humour, easy to talk to and who could accept me for me.

I told her I could definitely have friendships with other TGs but for a close relationship I'm looking for a man. I did also say though that if I met a TG who I formed a serious bond with then I could be open to a relationship with her instead. I will just have to wait and see but I do understand what Sobe is talking about.

Bonnie

[sobe1ove GG]

I can't say enough about my wife and what a great woman she is. But she has a body image problem. Although I'd like her to improve her looks with diet. I'd never be the one to suggest it.

Here's another thing. You as cross dressers might have a problem with how WE look too. I've gained over 50 pounds since I started dating Leah B (working on losing it now. Lost 6 pounds these past two weeks) and I was afraid he would lose attraction to me. Heck, it would be understandable. Luckily, that didn't happen. He likes me fat. I'm soft! He's actually said that he'll miss my belly. I hope he can accept me when I'm skinny.

The way a person looks, their physical appearance,or what they wear isn’t as important as their inner looks, or soul. We fall in love with someone’s soul, And We fall in love with their heart. With their inner self. With their true being.

I agree and disagree. I totally understand where you are coming from. I do love Leah B no matter what he wears. I love him so much I could suffocate on it. However, that doesn't mean I'm attracted to certain things he does. I think that looks and actions do matter, because that's all we are ever presented with. And if looks didn't matter, then crossdressers wouldn't feel the need to represent their feminine insides by passing as a woman. How people see us is important.

I think it's great that you like Sher's lady side. I'm really happy for you, and a bit envious. But, we all have our good and bad parts of our relationships.

[EmmaB GG]

There's no right or wrong here - everyone has their own combination of what attracts them to their partner and, yes, these things do change over the years.

And physical attraction is a 2 way thing - I'd like all the CDgirls here to think deep inside themselves and admit what attracted them to their GG SO in the first place - and if all you say to yourselves is their sense of humour, wit, enquiring mind etc, we'll know many of you are lying .... !

[Chantelle CD]

Once again Sobe i totally agree with you, attraction is important!!! A woman is attracted to a MAN. Unless she is bi or gay, and if you are not you will be repulsed by it, my SO doesn't want me to touch her or come near her that way because of this, and i totally understand this. I did a reply to AmberTG thread "Guilt put on the SO" sorry i dont know how to link yet Lol so i wont repeat a lot i said there, but i know when i am dressed i look silly hehe and unattractive to my SO, i am a man, have a man body, and to have a balanced female body my butt would have to be so big, i couldn't get threw the door!!!! I have a mustache still, and love it on my me, and my So loves my go-tee, witch i have taken of, just for a change, cause i also like the mustache only look on me, but like the go-tee as well, it will come back at some point, and the mustache may go at some time as well, to play with make up and looking as good as i can get myself to look, but it will come back as well. It only takes a few weeks and is grown back in again. If your mate chooses to go threw the door of going all the way, and changing his male side so much to help make his female side look better, and you dont like it a lot, you may have to go threw a door that you have to, just to find your own peace in life, witch my dear, is your total right!!! And i would only wish for you happiness above all!!

I also seen that EMULATE word again, ekkk i not sure i like that word, again i dont thin a CD copy's a woman, but likes to feel what they do, and is a part of themselves. And i dont see that a TG or TS woman, <or dont understand a better word> is not doing the same as a CD, I imagine there a lot of different reasons why a man has chosen to throw away his maleness, as there are individual TS and TG people out there, I dont think there is a difference between them and CD's, except that a CD doesn't hate there male side!! Or maybe we CD's should all change our avatar names to male ones? My feelings on this may make me out to be an outcast here on these fourms to some, but it is how i feel, sorry all, I believe in the phrase "energy present determines the form" and we as spiritual beings can feel anything and everything we want to , and at any time we want to, just by simply tuning into it :mad: :dancing: or male or female.

Love yall

Chantelle

[Caroline]

I see a lot of things on this message board from cross dressers who say that this is who they are, it's natural, get over it. Of course, I'm paraphrasing, but it seems like a lot of CDers can't understand why a GG SO would have a problem with it. I'd like to shed a little light.

A lot of what a relationship is comes from attraction. You are attracted to your partner in various ways. You are attracted to their personality, their aspirations and goals, how they treat you. You are also attracted to how they look and act.

Very true

When we, all of us, get in a relationship, our decision to be with someone is largely based on those attractions. If cross dressing is introduced years after the start of a relationship, attraction can be the biggest issue.

I would have thought that there were more important issues involved, such as the feeling that one had been misled by one's partner from the beginning.

If the most important aspect of the relationship was the external appearance of one's partner, then the relationship is doomed once age and infirmity begin to take hold - not to mention accidents or illnesses which cause physical changes.

Essentially, the cross dresser is introducing a lot of new behavior and appearances.

So does age, infirmity, illnesses, maturity and many other things.

Where we were attracted to your rough appearance, you are now clean and hair free. Where we were attracted to your strength, you are now much more feminine and light.

That is a generalisation, and many would disputed it, even if the terms used were adequately defined and true of all CDs.

A lot of attraction also comes from how you, all of us, look. I, for example, like men. I don't find women attractive. I'm not bi or gay. This can be a problem. Although you as cross dressers ARE men, when you are presenting as women, SOs like me have a hard time finding you attractive. We may even be repulsed. It isn't because you're a crossdresser, but because we just don't like girls.

Fully understandable, and something that you have to explore with your particular partner to work out a modus vivendi for you both.

Another thing, for me and others, is that I don't like people (romantically) who are prissy. I am not attracted to people who like frilly things and like to prance and wear heals and makeup. Even if you are obviously a guy, and aren't trying to be a woman, this is still unattractive.

Once again that is how your feel - and you are entitled to do so - but it is not true for everyone.

Yes, there are some ladies who like this. These are then the relationships with the most acceptance. But, if you are with a GG SO who is straight and likes her man to be at least somewhat manly, then there will be a problem.

Agreed, which is why I think that CDs should be totally frank with their prospective girlfriends/partners/wives to be from the very beginning - i.e. the second date. Then the partner has a chance to decide whether to continue with the relationship or not, but if she does so then she has entered it with open eyes and in full knowledge.

A lot of us GGs don't actually have a problem with cross dressers. We don't hate you or think what you are doing is wrong.

Glad to hear it, and it accord with my own findings too.

It's all about the attraction factor. By introducing cross dressing into the relationship, you are taking away some of her attraction to you. And where a big problem comes in is if you start to change how even your man side looks. If you start thinning your eyebrows, you will look MUCH more feminine, and this will always be the case because it's not like you can take off or put on new eyebrows on a whim. In these situations we look at you and see the feminine side even when you aren't wearing a dress. Then it's like a part of you is unattractive all of the time.

Which is why the CDing should have been mentioned at the beginning and discussed fully before the woman became committed.

Now, this may change over time. She may become attracted to that female part of you. In the meantime, you maybe might understand where she's coming from and cut her a bit of slack.

It always takes two to tango, as they say, and you are quite right that there has to be give and take. However, a lot of the problems would probably have been obviated if the CDer had been open right from the beginning, so that the partner didn't meet with a situation they didn't expect some years down the line. To put myself in your shoes, as it were, if I was not a CDer and my partner suddenly told me some years into our relationship that she wanted to shave her head, adopt male clothing, and behave in a macho way, then I'd have some difficulty in dealing with it, so I do understand your position.

Also, this attraction thing can happen with other changes. For example, I don't really like the hip hop culture of baggy jeans and bad English and attitudes. If my guy started being like that, I'd have a problem because I think it's unattractive.

I can not only understand that, I can empathise with it, as I've tried to show by my above comment.

Hopefully I've shed some light on where us as GG SOs are coming from.

Sobe

Yes you have, but I think that the real issue is the lack honesty that some CDers show their partners from the beginning, and that they frequently only admit the truth when caught out or when the partner has invested a great deal in the relationship and is fully committed.

I hope things work out for you.

[Gunda]

Sobe1oveGG,
Logical, well considered, and well said. That is why it is often so important for crossdressers and their wives, fiances, girlfriends, to come to some sort of consensus where neither party feels uncomfortable or that the other is being too selfish. For my own part, I once admitted my crossdressing to a close female friend I once had other feelings for. Had those feelings ever been demonstrated physically, I would never had let my dressing come into the equation nor throw it in her face. She liked my male side. Although I wish she could have joined me in cultivating my other side, that was never reality and I needed to work within it.

I think it is good that you mentioned that GGs being made uncomfortable by crossdressing doesn't necessarily mean they find the practice wrong in principle - its just a matter of attractiveness.

Best,
Gunda

[sobe1ove GG]

I would have thought that there were more important issues involved, such as the feeling that one had been misled by one's partner from the beginning.

That's there too, but where it's easier to get over the betrayal (or at least, once you do, you're fine), the lack of attraction may never go away. Also, I wanted to bring up just one topic, as opposed to the whole gambit of why someone would have a problem with this.

Also, I figured that it would be assumed that not everyone applies to what I said. I think I even mentioned that. However, I'm sorry that I misled you. Everyone is different, and my examples only apply to some of us.

[Nigella]

Whilst we all find our "perfect" partner at the start of a relationship, we all change, this can be for better or worse. Sandra is not the same person I met all those years ago, and neither am I. We have developed in our relationship with each other, adapting to each other, making things easier for each other.

The one thing to remember is that we have done it together, working hard at making things work. It is not easy and there is certainly plenty of give and take.

Sandra has said that even though there has been a dramatic change in me, underneath it all I am still the same person (man) she fell in love with.

I understand that some can't accept this major change in their relationship, but I will say thank god we are all different.

This is a SUPPORT forum, it means we should help all members irrespective of their level of acceptance, but it does not give any of us the right to force our views on others.

[Caroline]

That's there too, but where it's easier to get over the betrayal (or at least, once you do, you're fine), the lack of attraction may never go away. Also, I wanted to bring up just one topic, as opposed to the whole gambit of why someone would have a problem with this.

Also, I figured that it would be assumed that not everyone applies to what I said. I think I even mentioned that. However, I'm sorry that I misled you. Everyone is different, and my examples only apply to some of us.

Sobe, You didn't mislead me, and it is difficult to say everything that needs to be said, so one can only be selective. I appreciate that, and was not being critical of you, for I think that you have genuine issues that need to be addressed, and - what's more - I both sympathise and empathise with your situation. I am amazed though that you found it relatively easy to get over the betrayal - or at least I understand that you have - since that is the most difficult thing for most partners to come to terms with (whether it is about CDing, money issues, infidelities, or whatever), and the fact that you have done so so readily shows just how forgiving you can be, and that is a credit to you, though you should not allow it to be abused.

Kind regards.

[Leah B]

Now, this may change over time. She may become attracted to that female part of you. In the meantime, you maybe might understand where she's coming from and cut her a bit of slack.

Okay :)

[Ema1234 GG]

First of all what a fantastic post!

I can completely understand what you have said, and although not everything applies to my own relationship I can certainly relate to everything you have said.

Personally, I AM attracted to woman. However, I am not a lesbian, I have no desire what so ever to be in a relationship with a woman. It's purely a physical attraction and nothing more.

This said, I think it's quite interesting that I really do not find my partner attractive when dressed. In fact, in the past it's probably been bordering on replusion but we're working on that (by improving his skills in dressing so he looks more like a woman and less like a man in drag!). However, even with time I very much doubt I will ever be able to whole heartedly say that I don't feel some element of sadness when I see him dressed.

Purely and simply I fell in love with him as a male, I was attracted to him as a male. I like rough masculine men and that won't ever change and that is what attracted me to him in the first place. I think what hurts the most is that I can still see that person that I love and am very much attracted to underneath the clothes and make up.

HOWEVER, I love this person for far more than their physical appearance. Purely physical attraction is not love, it's lust. I've been through a tough time recently with my partner's CDing but at the end of the day I love them and although their phsyical appearance may have first attracted me to them it was their personality that made me fall in love with them. As has been said before in this post, looks may fade with time but their personality will always be there.

Am I fully accepting of my partner's CDing? No I'm not, it's hard for me to see my manly man dressed and I think to some degree it probably always will be. But i love them deeply and am prepared to accept this part of them as at the end of the day, it really could be a lot worse. Just because they CD doesn't mean their personality has changed, they are still the same person.

But will I ever be attracted to them? No I probably won't, even though I am attracted to woman, I'll always see my partner underneath and to me that is the hardest part.

[Fab Karen]

Also, I figured that it would be assumed that not everyone applies to what I said. I think I even mentioned that. However, I'm sorry that I misled you. Everyone is different, and my examples only apply to some of us.

The language you use tends to give the impression that all women hold the same feelings about men's body hair. Glad to see a correction about that. It seems logical that you'd be turned off by a hairless guy regardless of crossdressing - hypothetically, if someone chooses not to have an intimate relationship with someone simply because of that, they're entitled to do so, shallow as it may be. I would make the point that a hairless man isn't less a man, a gay man isn't less a man, a woman with hairy legs &/or without make-up isn't less a woman, a gay woman isn't less a woman, etc.

[Toyah]

I understand what you are saying but I really had no sucess with the rough and hairy look kinda pug ugly only get by (just )with humour but not great at that.
I honestly dont know why my wife likes me I usually dont like myself but WTF

[TxKimberly]

. . . I'd like all the CDgirls here to think deep inside themselves and admit what attracted them to their GG SO in the first place - and if all you say to yourselves is their sense of humour, wit, enquiring mind etc, we'll know many of you are lying .... !

Her eyes - no joke, and no fib, her eyes are what attracted me. It didn't hurt that those eyes were on top of a cute little figure and in a pretty face, but it WAS the eyes.

And for the record, Sobi is of course spot on. I would NOT be delighted were the rolls reversed and SHE wanted to spend as much time as possible looking like a man. I would hope that I could deal with it with a fraction of the grace and kindness she has shown me, but I would not be pleased.

Kim / Matt

[Rachel Morley]

Hi Sobe,

I'm very lucky because my wife likes it. She had a crossdressing boyfriend before and looked to date a cder before she met me. She's even encouraging her sister to date crossdressers!

Another thing, for me and others, is that I don't like people (romantically) who are prissy. I am not attracted to people who like frilly things and like to prance and wear heals and makeup. Even if you are obviously a guy, and aren't trying to be a woman, this is still unattractive.

Not for my wife! I am so very very fortunate. Marla has told me many times that no matter how much I feminize myself or look like a woman (providing I don't take hormones or get any permanent body modifications) she can, and will always "see the boy". Ok, a girly boy but a boy just the same, and this is where the difference really kicks in because she is the opposite to you (and almost every woman I know) she really likes feminine men, especially me, and especially when I wear women's clothes, makeup, BUT NO WIG. I know ... it took me ages to accept this.

Yes, there are some ladies who like this. These are then the relationships with the most acceptance. But, if you are with a GG SO who is straight and likes her man to be at least somewhat manly, then there will be a problem.

I agree. Likes manly men yes, straight not necessarily (not in my case) my wife IS straight. I know this for a fact because she's told me she's already tried women and she didn't like it. I grant you this does make her different but as you already correctly indicated, these are the relationships with the most acceptance. Like I said, I'm extremely lucky and in the minority.

A lot of us GGs don't actually have a problem with cross dressers. We don't hate you or think what you are doing is wrong. It's all about the attraction factor.

This for me is where you "hit the nail on the head" it's all about what turns people on. Lets say a person is a GG who thinks a hairy chest is manly and attractive but she has a crossdressing husband who wants to shave his chest and abdomen, then I would say he is basically doing something that is less attractive to his wife/girlfriend. I can see how this would be a problem. I adore my wife's long hair and I would not like it very much if she one day told me "this is what she is" and then got a buzz cut. I wouldn't love her any less, and I would still find her attractive (her appearance is only a small part of what makes her attractive to me) but I would miss her hair and it would take some getting used to but I know I could.

I just thank the Lord that I am who I am, and my wife is who she is. How we ever found one another is truly a miracle that could only have happened because of something bigger than the both of us. No one will ever convince me of anything different. Here's how it happened - click here if you're interested.

[Carin's Wife GG]

it all about what turns you on the first place. I look back over my live at see at different times and see what was really important and attractive to me
about Carin. Even in her femme mode I am attracted to her. (She is helping me typing).

Cant type much more! Maybe I can add so more tomorrow.


Louise.