Is crossdressing transexual purgatory?

[kittypw GG]

I do not mean to offend anyone but after watching the Opra show on Friday I have been doing some serious thinking. (dangerous I know )

Both families featured discussed their journey to living full time female. Both considered themselves crossdressers. Both wive's accepted this and even stayed when they transitioned. Both mtf's stated that the urge to crossdress became stronger and stronger progressing to more frequent and more feminine. One claimed he could have been discribed as an efeminate male (his wife said not, she had no idea). One described the feeling as a rage burning within him. A feeling that he would explode if he did not make the transition.
All the while the wive's were thinking this was a phase or something. Obviously these feelings were not expressed to the spouse.

My question is, then what is the motivation to participate if participation will lead to more frequency and fine tunning , if you will. I think most gg's are willing participants to a point but it is not our thing. We go along because it means something to our spouse, so naturally, most would prefere the frequency to diminish not accelerate.

Is crossdressing transexual purgatory? Do crossdresseres participate in active denial that they really want to be women but do not have the nerve or the ability to do so? Or is crossdressing a form of harmless expression of a feminine side that men are not allowed to routinly express?

Kitty

[Rachelhouston]

I can only speak for myself, but I have zero interest in becoming a woman full-time. As much as I love wearing dresses, heels and hose, I know for a fact that the thrill wouldn't be there if I had to dress that way for work every day...forever.

It isn't all sexual fetish for me either. I started off in miniskirts and platform heels, but I've gotten to where I like to dress more conservatively. About once a week, I'll get dolled up and putter around the house doing the things I would normally do. Maybe someday I'll work up the courage to go outside.

My wife is outstandingly wonderful and supportive, but she fell in love with me as a man and is attracted to me as a man. I try to see things from her point of view and I spend a lot of time making sure that I don't cross boundaries. For instance: I'd kind of like to shave my legs, but my wife likes the soft fine hair on my legs. If I shave, the hair grows back in coarse and it take a long time for it to get soft again. So I don't shave.

Ultimately, a relationship is a two way street. If it is all take and no give, I don't think you have a very good one.

Rachel

[Marla S]

Thanks Kitty, another thought provoking thread.

Both families featured discussed their journey to living full time female. Both considered themselves crossdressers. Both wive's accepted this and even stayed when they transitioned. Both mtf's stated that the urge to crossdress became stronger and stronger progressing to more frequent and more feminine. One claimed he could have been discribed as an efeminate male (his wife said not, she had no idea). One described the feeling as a rage burning within him. A feeling that he would explode if he did not make the transition.
All the while the wive's were thinking this was a phase or something. Obviously these feelings were not expressed to the spouse.

Thinking it is a phase is an understandable means of self-protection, but it is a misconception that inevitable will lead to conflicts and frustration for both; this can ruin a relationship. It would be the best for both not to see it as a phase. If it turns out to be a phase nevertheless, nothing is lost.

My question is, then what is the motivation to participate if participation will lead to more frequency and fine tunning , if you will. I think most gg's are willing participants to a point but it is not our thing. We go along because it means something to our spouse, so naturally, most would prefere the frequency to diminish not accelerate.

Another misconception. Of course there is the wish that it will diminish, but hoping and waiting for it will again lead to frustration for both. This way of thinking even has the potential to induce further progression. For a CD there is (almost) no way back, but if this is what is latently hoped for or demanded, the only other way for the CD to "escape" is progression. Progression to underline that there is an integral part of the personality that won't diminish and shouldn't be denied.

Participating is understood by the CD as a sign for acceptance. That could be the motivation: Acceptance, respect for the partner.
"but it is not our thing". Yes, completely understandable and nothing wrong with it, but unless it doesn't become "your thing" or the SO at least is able to find a neutral attitude, again conflicts and frustration.

Is crossdressing transexual purgatory?

Most of the time,No

Do crossdresseres participate in active denial that they really want to be women but do not have the nerve or the ability to do so?

Often, NO. But because people (CD, SO, society) obviously don't get gray shades, it is enforced to think so.
(I often think it would be more easy, more plausible, more "real" if I only would be TS or a full fem CD. But I am neither, giving me hard time at times, and makes it hard to explain it to others:
If you don't want to be a woman, why you do it at all, where's the fun in it ? It's probably fetishism then or you are a gay in denial.Nooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Or is crossdressing a form of harmless expression of a feminine side that men are not allowed to routinly express?

I would think so, but the way it is expressed is corrupted by a lot of constraints, fears, and fantasies, some of which are mentioned above.

[Kate Simmons]

Everyone is different in what it means to them Kitty. An expression for sure. Harmless? It depends on how much you allow it to run your life. From what I've seen with TS people it may be just a stage of adapting to and/or getting used to wearing the clothing of the gender you actually feel you are. I don't think there is that much of a "rush" in this case, it's more of identifying with your real self. I do have friends who had to transition because they knew everything was just wrong and in a few extreme cases, the only other alternative was not wanting to live at all and there was really no other choice. Of course, most of these folks fulfill all of the requirements prior to transition and there is no question that they need to do it.

As far as crossdressers, most of it in the beginning is innoculous enough, i.e. wearing panties or bras even though it may come off as somewhat "bizarre" or eccentric behavior where the SO is concerned. This does tend to escalate however and the beaming eye reaction of a CD reflects this in a "give 'em an inch and they take a mile" scenerio. In a lot of cases, this greatly puts off the SO and they wonder just how far this thing is going to go, where it leaves them, etc. Believe me, I know.

This is when communication of intentions is essential and where partners have to seriously act like adults and this is where I failed in my personal case. Determining the intentions is the key and only openness and honesty will accomplish this. Anything less leads to mistrust, doubt and anxiety for both partners. Relationships are based on trust, respect and teamwork. Anything (not just CDing) that threatens that will eventually be detrimental to the relationship. Communication, trust and sharing is the only way. I know that now.

[Katrina]

I think for some of us, it is purgatory. For others, they just need to express a feminine side or like the fashion. I bet if you asked 1000 CDers what they thought, you'd get 1000 different answers.

[Alex R]

.......

My question is.....crossdressing transsexual purgatory? Do crossdresseres participate in active denial that they really want to be women but do not have the nerve or the ability to do so? Or is crossdressing a form of harmless expression of a feminine side that men are not allowed to routinly express?

Kitty

Good question Kitty and the answer, I fell, is that it really depends.

I've realised fairly late in life that my infrequent dabbling with crossdressing was not some form of mild fetish or whatever and was the manifestation of something much stronger and deep rooted. The more I dress the more desire to experience something more than just dressing. What that is at this stage I don't know, and it is something I'm struggling with at the moment.

So yes, considering my own feelings and reading the commentaries of many others who have parallel experiences I suggest that many crossdressers realise that they be more than just CD.

However, in saying that, there are many active crossdressers, much more active than I, who would never feel the need to start on any form of transition or even contemplate any form of body change. This has to be equally recognised.

So the answer to a very good question, Kitty, is that it really depends.

[morgan51]

I found that as long as I denied the urge to dress I was very frustrated and hard to live with. since allowing my fem. side some outlet I am calm and happy I fully intend to nurture this side of myself so I can be a better husband for my wife and a better human. I didn't ask to be made this way It just is. I have had to learn to accept it and deal with it because it won't go away not by wishing it would or stuffing it in the "closet" .I have found a very supportive wife who talks with me daily about this and thru communication have strengthened our relationship She insists we talk every day I am loving this new way of living because of her and with her. she has had a hard time comming to grips with the idea and continues to have some fear.All I can do is reassure her I Love her. Morgan

[Eugenie]

Is crossdressing transexual purgatory? Do crossdresseres participate in active denial that they really want to be women but do not have the nerve or the ability to do so? Or is crossdressing a form of harmless expression of a feminine side that men are not allowed to routinly express?
Kitty

I think that it is all of the above but to different individuals. For some it is indeed a profound feeling of being "born in the wrong body", for these persons, indeed the X-dressing part can be but a purgatory.

For other it remains a simple pleasure of wearing women clothes.

I seems though, that for many of us there is an evolution towards spending more and more time "en femme" and behaving in a way that we think is feminine. That last part can be quite a bit made of stereotyping a rather old feminine role model...

I can understand that a wife find this evolution of her husband difficult to live with. And that is the case most of the times. Some rare wives however have made the choice of the "person" they lived with so many years, even when that person has changed a lot physically.

Note that this shouldn't be taken as a reproach to the wives who can't accept that transition. As said above I understand very well the frustration that you (as a general "you") may feel. My wife is in that situation...

The conclusion is that there is a wide diversity among X-dressers motivations and a similar diversity in the attitudes and feelings of their wives (S/O).

Eugenie

[Raychel]

I think for some of us, it is purgatory. For others, they just need to express a feminine side or like the fashion. I bet if you asked 1000 CDers what they thought, you'd get 1000 different answers.

I think that Katrina said it best here. Although I would bet that for the most part crossdressers are comfortable with who they are. Sure there are some that would love to transition and go the whole route. But in my opinion, and it is only my opinion, I would guess that would not be the majority.

Myself, I am happy with who I am. Sure I would like more time to dress, But I am happy being a guy that like to play dressup sometimes. That is as far as I ever plan on going.

[melissacd]

I feel that the denial that I am a cross dresser was the purgatory. During that period for me it was a living hell on earth. Now that I have accepted that part of me there is a greater peace within myself.

All cross dressers, like all people, are different. How they express their cross dressing and where their cross dressing takes them in their lives is different. I have no idea where mine is taking me now, however, I do know that the denial and then the acceptance have cost me a great deal in many ways.

I feel that I am finally leaving purgatory and moving on to become a much happier human who is just trying to be who they should have been all along, not male, not female, just me. Once we recognize who we are and start living accordingly then we become happier more balanced human beings. Once we become happier more balanced human beings the rest will take care of itself.

[Lilith Moon]

Is crossdressing transexual purgatory? Do crossdresseres participate in active denial that they really want to be women but do not have the nerve or the ability to do so?

Hiya Kitty, thanks for raising this issue.

As you will see from this thread, there is no single answer to your question. Some do, some don't. We are all different. I would just like to add that a crossdresser may not know herself where things are leading to. There isn't necessarily a secret agenda of denial, or pretense, that it is "just dressing up" while transexual needs are actively concealed from SOs. The need to transition may emerge and be as much a surprise to the crossdresser as it is to her SO.

Just my

[janet1234]

just like getting dressed up, I don't feel any urges to become a total woman.

[livy_m_b]

It really goes both ways, but one is more common than the other. That is, some start out thinking they are ts-inclined and end up realizing they are just cders; others start out thinking they are cders and end up realizing they are ts-inclined. But, most people who start out thinking they are cders end up thinking they are cders and most who start out thinking they are ts-inclined end up thinking the same.

I can understand why ggs who are okay with cding would not be ok with ts, and I suppose there may be a few for whom the opposite is true, that they prefer the transwoman.

Regarding self-perception, I've learned about myself and from watching others that cd/ts are not to be _completely_ relied on about their own feelings and tendencies. I attribute that to two things - social pressures make us want to be more "acceptable" socially - for some of us that means being a cder, for others it means being a "woman" not a cder; also, it's a voyage of self discovery - we don't know what is going to happen two steps down the path until we take the next step.

Overall, most gg's who are supportive of cding can expect that is where it will end up; but for some few it will go farther without necessarily that being the desired outcome for either partner when it starts. GGs should know that too.

[Tip or Ozma]

. . . Or is crossdressing a form of harmless expression of a feminine side that men are not allowed to routinely express?

Kitty

Kitty,

I think this is likely the case (I know it is for me) and if the fear factor expressed by some SOs here was replaced by a sharing factor (genuine and authentic communication), both partners could possibly enjoy the experience and enhance their relationship. This also goes for letting your partner express her masculine side.

I find that my crossdressing practices are self-limiting by the reality of my physical being, my desire to be a true companion to my partner and an awareness of the impact of my behavior on others. I have also been dressing up as a Civil War soldier and a citizen of the 1860s. My wife dresses as a nineteenth-century woman. However, we still are part of the present (using all the inventions and conveniences in our daily life). My wife and I have developed and created a flexible bubble around our "time-traveling" experiences just as we have developed the same envelope around my wanting to wear or assume a more feminine role at time for pleasure and peace of mind. For us the crossdressing bubble is almost entirely private (we do shop in public and I underdress with her awareness of that.

Tip

[Sally24]

My question is, then what is the motivation to participate if participation will lead to more frequency and fine tunning.

You participate because you love your SO and this is a part of them. If they are really transexual instead of cd then I think eventually that will come out, with or without support. If your spouce was transexual, would you really like to "force" them ,directly or indirectly, to remain where they are not happy? I don't think so. I am honest with my wife that there are some urges for something more than CDing. But I am also honest to myself that transitioning would probably not be an improvement for me. There are trade offs in both cases and each person has to balance all the possible pros and cons before taking non-reversable actions.

[Taffy]

One distinction, at least for me, is that the desire to be feminine, with all of the fabulous clothes, is completely different from a desire to be female. I have no interest in being female, but love the clothes. I loooove females, to be around them and dress like them, but I don't want to be one...

[docrobbysherry]

Taffy said it all for me. "Exiting fetishist" is me. I think!
RS

One distinction, at least for me, is that the desire to be feminine, with all of the fabulous clothes, is completely different from a desire to be female. I have no interest in being female, but love the clothes. I loooove females, to be around them and dress like them, but I don't want to be one...

[Tvanessa]

I have considered transitioning in the past and came to the realization that even though I did want to I did not need to. I value my family and friends who love me just the way I am (they do not know I cd) and that means more to me than transitioning. I am very satisfied with my choice.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Kittygg

you are wonderful and i always enjoy your posts...i'm gonna go with the thousand answers response...

HOWEVER..thats probably true of everything..

specifically i buy into the concept that 100% straight or 100% gay is not reality and we all experience a scale of sexuality and its probably true of our gender issues... so one plausible explanation is that fetishy crossdressing and trannssexualism are really very different but very few of us are 100% on either side of that scale...just a thought.

the other major major factor is how you look.....on the inside our feelings are more similar...but tell that to a 6' 300 lbs ham fisted guy who wants to feel like a woman!!! its not fair, but its the reality of it..so ithink how good you are at pulling off being accepted in your role can have some impact on how you think of yourself..

that would certainly explain why there are so many different answers

its interesting how vehement some of us are when answering this question (and the gay question too!)....

great posts!!

[Ðarissa]

As much as I like dressing up and whatnot, I certainly don't mind being a guy and doing guy stuffs including dressing like one, or at least 80% like one because I'm always in lingerie. I know for certain I won't be heading down the road to transexual purgatory as I can't imagine going for the full meal deal. I like the way I am right now, being a dude and dressing up like a girl. It's a turn on, it's fun and relaxing as well. No need to go any further except to buy and try new items of clothing....

That being said, I figure if we do get multiple lives, I want to come back as a girl for the next 10 to compensate for this one. Otherwise I may get a little ticked at whatever deity is involved or whatever crappy biological chromosome switch that messed up.

If I'm going anywhere, it's crazy.

[jaina]

I do not mean to offend anyone but after watching the Opra show on Friday I have been doing some serious thinking. (dangerous I know )

Both families featured discussed their journey to living full time female. Both considered themselves crossdressers. Both wive's accepted this and even stayed when they transitioned. Both mtf's stated that the urge to crossdress became stronger and stronger progressing to more frequent and more feminine. One claimed he could have been discribed as an efeminate male (his wife said not, she had no idea). One described the feeling as a rage burning within him. A feeling that he would explode if he did not make the transition.
All the while the wive's were thinking this was a phase or something. Obviously these feelings were not expressed to the spouse.

My question is, then what is the motivation to participate if participation will lead to more frequency and fine tunning , if you will. I think most gg's are willing participants to a point but it is not our thing. We go along because it means something to our spouse, so naturally, most would prefere the frequency to diminish not accelerate.

Is crossdressing transexual purgatory? Do crossdresseres participate in active denial that they really want to be women but do not have the nerve or the ability to do so? Or is crossdressing a form of harmless expression of a feminine side that men are not allowed to routinly express?

Kitty

For some it is, for most it isn't.
Transitioning and Post-Ops mean ratings and are a black and white idea. I'm sure they looked for it. Non-Ops and crossdressers aren't so black and white, require thought to discuss and don't have the ratings shock value.

[Julie York]

As the others have said, there is a huge range of desires and goals and so there isn't a definite answer.

However, I did notice one thing about your post that was rather enlightening because I think you aren't the only GG on the forum to hold this view about being reluctant to participate, as you think it might be 'corrupting' somehow.

Encouraging, or being accepting of a partner who crossdresses, is NOT some form of corruption. You won't make them 'worse'. The reason for this is because the person ALREADY harbours the desires they've been hiding (and probably have done for dozens of years before you even met!). So when someone allows them to express those desires in a safe environment, all it means is that they no longer have to be secretive or deceitful about something they want to do anyway. And may even be more open to observing your comfort limits.

In many cases it is actually the forbidden nature of CDing that makes it fun! It's the same difference between stealing an apple from an orchard and going to the shops and buying one. So when you take away that forbidden element the obsessive nature diminishes.

However, having said this, you must bear in mind that the end of the road....the point at which a CD is quite happy....maybe further along the road than you wish to go.

Some folk are quite happy with a bit of clothing once a month....some want to go out on the town in full-on tranny mode.....others want to go the whole way and transition. By being supportive, it will not make that desire any different. It will just be expressed openly, honestly, and without all the resentment and secrets that go with a supressed desire.

[jill carey]

hi , I think it must be some sort of purgatory , I'v been dressing and progressing for as long as I can remember.being torn apart on a regular basis for the last forty something years and I still cant see an end in sight.
I so wanted to be a woman and I still do and it seems to be getting harder to cope.
Jill

[janelle]

This is my on this. For me it is hell. Can you picture yourself some place you do not want to be, yet can not leave. Yes you maybe able get get away for a time just to ease things(cd is the closet),yet you are always pulled back to where you were. You hate it more & more & wish for that relief more & more. Soon you come to see that, that this you, & you have been stuck in this other place forever. Now that you meet the terms of yourself you need to tell your spouse, you need to find someone to help you understand what is truely going on, & yet the people you seek are few & far between. So you go mostly on your own. Then your friends start giving you the 5th degree, your job starts to hurt because you know what you need yet your afraid to let them know. You end up seeing a Dr. for depression & you finally see its ok to be yourself,yet you have no to stand with you.
I guess I just gave you my story the only thing is I made the choice to let myself out & be who I found out I was. Is it wrong to want to correct something if you can? I don't believe so. Is it hard for those you love, for sure, yet it eats at you too because you don't wish to hurt anyone you care so much for so you try to hold back. Yet the person you found that has been caged up is alive & wants her freedom so what than?
Yes , I would say that this is when most marriages fall apart. As myself I need to be the woman I know I am inside & slowing letting out. On the other hand I know my wife has needs & this idea of what I was or am should be, so everybodies world is upside down. So what do you do????
Well for me I keep moving forward slowly. I try to make sure that my wife knows how much I love her & how much we need each other. I tell her that what is inside me is the same except I understand her needs abit better as I learn more about myself. So really all that has changed is what people see on the outside. What each person is what is inside them.

Sorry about this being long but this is from my heart & what my wife & I are working at. Yes it can be hell, but it is for both. Yes it can be something beautiful if both people can understand & respect each other( the give & take when you first got married,idea). Yes it is a long & hard road but if one does not take it what happens. Some just split up & then there are those that can not live with it all & take their lives. So is it hell?

Thank you for reading this & again it is only my , well maybe worth.
xoxoxoxoxoxoxo,
Janelle

[Faith_G]

One distinction, at least for me, is that the desire to be feminine, with all of the fabulous clothes, is completely different from a desire to be female. I have no interest in being female, but love the clothes. I loooove females, to be around them and dress like them, but I don't want to be one...

As much as I like dressing up and whatnot, I certainly don't mind being a guy and doing guy stuffs including dressing like one, or at least 80% like one because I'm always in lingerie. I know for certain I won't be heading down the road to transexual purgatory as I can't imagine going for the full meal deal. I like the way I am right now, being a dude and dressing up like a girl. It's a turn on, it's fun and relaxing as well. No need to go any further except to buy and try new items of clothing....

Me three.