Why Can People Not Be Honest On Here?

[Sophia KT]

I'm no mod. [in fact I'm quite new] but this is getting a little tense.

I think we should pat ourselves on the back for the torrent of supportive feelings and have done with it.

It was a good point and brought out the best in people.


Sophia XX

[DemonicDaughter]

I had a conversation a short while ago with someone on this forum. They sent me pictures of themselves. They looked okay, not my taste but fine. Would I say they'd "pass" no. And they didn't ask me if I thought they would. If they had, I would have been politely honest.

Here's the funny thing. They honestly feel that they are the one's who should be giving advice to other CDers because "so many need help". But to me, a GG, I would have spotted them a mile away. Why? Because they still needed a lot of help too.

"Honesty" coming from someone who isn't even honest with themselves is only going to lead to hurt feelings and bad tempers.

Besides... when I HAVE seen someone be honest on here, I often read the original poster defending themselves. Seems some people don't really want honesty.

[KateSpade83]

I do like honesty, and everyone's taste in clothes is different and I realize some people just don't like the stuff you buy. So in my picture posts, I put polls and I always give the option for - "I don't like your outfit." And it doesn't hurt me one bit that people don't like my outfit. Rather, I get important feedback from honest polling about the desirability of my outfits, and it's real good to know how people liked my expensive St John outfits! And then I wanna know if people think my face is ugly, because no one has ever said I was beautiful! - But I can handle that because I think I'm not photogenic and I look great in real life to pass shopping as a woman 95% of the time. And men have given me looks! - So I wear a ring!

Their was a member who went out for the first time, then posted his outfit and asked for honest opinions. And it was really good to rip him apart for the worst top I've ever seen, plus a terrible wig! In this case, real good honest criticism really helps!

And then often I see pic threads were some people just wear terrible or boring outfits and get a lot of positive comments. And I just wanna say the outfit stinks. - What would moderators do to that? Best I did was say it's not my style. And then it makes me wonder why some member post themselves in skirt suit not as good as mine but get way more positive feedback. I'm the biggest skirt suit lover here and I've made a big collection of the best skirt suits, especially high end St John ones!

[jessielee]

dear Vicky,
enjoying opening up the proverbial can of worms, eh?
yes, it has been covered before. but good discourse can always keep old topics lively! but is it civil? uplifting? or simply honest as another's expense?
brutally? pridefully?
have enjoyed reading responses where completely honest but not all encompassing tact is espoused.
please, friends, say the truth to each other here. but why be hurtful?
some have said "don't say she passes if she doesn't, best to just remain silent;" my usual tactic. however, struggling souls often really want to know if they have a chance of ever looking beautiful.
first, yes, you do
but not in a universal way perhaps.
i can't pass.
maybe someday, know what areas need to be worked on.
and many of you can; God bless you!
and the rest of us are somewhere in between
kind of like GGs regarding modern or popular standards of beauty.
some things can be worked on and some just can't, no question of "femininity" or passing here.
we are all so different.
and we share so much.
girls, please, be nice to each other,
and,
be honest without being mean.
we are all works in progress.
it is a good place for being humble.
call me idealistic,
jessie

[docrobbysherry]

There r some closet dressers here, like me. Many who will NEVER go out dressed. Our ONLY feedback is from THIS WEBSITE!
My female persona is all smoke and mirrors, but that's who I am as a CD.

I'm admitting I'm a coward. I don't go out, and I haven't posted any pics without masks.

THE BRAVE GURLS, WHO DO POST PICS OF MEN IN DRESSES HERE, SHOULD BE REWARDED, not punished! Bless their courage and forthriteness!

IF U CAN'T SAY SOMETHING NICE, DON"T SAY ANYTHING AT ALL!

[Joy Carter]

I think Vicky's thread is right on. We should give advice where it's due, and compliment where it's appropriate. She's said nothing wrong.

[Samantha B L]

I understand Vicky's thinking in that you shouldn't lie and also that there are times when pretending that you don't notice what's a little awkward about the emporor/empress's new clothes can get tiresome. And that goes for lots of things in life in general. But I also think that this forum is a place for all of the members and not just a place for those who look like fashion models. Of course,there's nothing the matter with looking like a fashion model. But for those of us who don't look like fashion models but still manage to look just fine,I think the fair and reasonable thing is to take an easy angle with eachother in critiquing the pics and be freindly and easygoing.

Like I said there's nothing wrong with looking like a fashion model. I don't look like one but I'm gonna keep tryin'. But in apraising the pictures that people submit to the forum we should be apreciative and not too blunt and harsh. If things got too brash there would be lots of bitter arguments all over the forum and the forum would lose it's popularity

[Jodie_Lynn]

Yeah, Lover, I gotta agree with the rest, especially JackieS.

Constructive criticism is the best thing we can do for others.

But public humiliation will only make an unsure person feel worse and maybe hurt worse than it should.

I think a lot of deeper criticism can go on, but it might be best if it were in PMs.

Face it, honey...We all started out as dogs, right?

But a few kind words helped us keep on to the goal. And that's a goal that none of us will ever really reach to our ultimate satisfaction, I think.

Bless you for your candor, but don't forget the thing about catching more flies with honey than vinegar. M..kay?

Bravo!

While I can agree that honesty is the best policy, I don't think folk here need to be verbally slammed.
That being said, if I knew someone in R/L, and they asked my opinion of their appearance before they were to head out on the town, I might find a way to perhaps dissuade them, if I thought that they might risk being made fool of in public.

Emotions are very tricky: One's "honest opinion", might be very hurtful to someone else.

[victoriamwilliams1]

I agree with you, I think we are afraid to hurt ones feelings and I think this is also a trait of femininity that eve some GG's will say you look great when in reality they think you look bad. Even with men this too exist. It is a new problem being we are now in a litigation/P.C. society and people are afraid to speak there minds openly.

I know at times I want to say things like, "You go out the house like that", "Its called a razor or layer your hose with those legs" and other thoughts are "They call them long skirts! Get one today"

Believe it or not I and my wife who does not know of the fem me say things like this even about GG's we see in public.

[Lora Olivia]

I am going to apologize to everyone, including you Kate, in advance for this post but I am making a point of this and your post kinda got my cat claws out.

Point is Beauty is really on the inside. No one is perfect. To each his own and opinions are like a***holes most everyone has one.

And it was really good to rip him apart for the worst top I've ever seen, plus a terrible wig! In this case, real good honest criticism really helps!!

So then for me to say, "that lipstick makes your face look like a monkey's butt and for god sakes kill half the wooly worms that are riding on your brows," would be ok?

And then it makes me wonder why some member post themselves in skirt suit not as good as mine but get way more positive feedback. I'm the biggest skirt suit lover here and I've made a big collection of the best skirt suits, especially high end St John ones!

Its not about the money you spend on the clothes Kate, it is the person in them that counts.

[sissystephanie]

I have seen some pictures on this Forum of what I would consider to be pretty girls. Are they real, how do I know? Photoshop, or any other photo editing program, can work wonders.

But real or not, it is not for me or anyone else to tell them they are ugly! If you really do think they are ugly, then IM them and tell them why you think so. That is, if you have the courage to do so! Posting a new thread like yours and then immediately signing off doesn't say much for your courage!

BTW, I don't post a full picture because I know I am not "pretty." Nor can I pass, now that my dear wife has passed away. She did my makeup and wig so I could, and did, pass!

One more thing. Your Tag line about Choice is incorrect. It is true for TRANSEXUALS, but not for Crossdressers. Many of us made the conscience choice to dress, just because we like to. I am not a transgender, or a transsexual. I am a crossdresser, nothing more, and that was not decided in the womb!

Sissy/Stephanie

Girl on the outside, but man underneath!

[DemonicDaughter]

...
Their was a member who went out for the first time, then posted his outfit and asked for honest opinions. And it was really good to rip him apart for the worst top I've ever seen, plus a terrible wig! In this case, real good honest criticism really helps!
...

You know, there is a difference in offering honest criticism and then offering your opinion. Its the worst top YOU'VE ever seen but obviously they liked it. You didn't offer criticism, you offered your opinion. And how did your "ripping" them apart "really help"?

Tact, is an art that should be used when offering any advice or opinion.

See, that was advice as tact is always a good thing to have. But my opinion is that you lack that. I offered both in my post on your thread and it was done with tact.

And this IS a support site, so being SUPPORTIVE is sort of the idea.

[Ayame]

And this IS a support site, so being SUPPORTIVE is sort of the idea.

I agree thats the reason why everyone is on these forums either to get support or to give it. I've noticed something on these forums there are three types of people after they got the support they need from this site. The first type once they get the support they need they share support with others. The second type once they get the support they need they leave the site and stop using it. Last but not least the third type once they get the support and they are feeling good about themselves they feel the need to belittle others that came here for the same reason they came here for.

[crusadergirl]

Ive seen this topic before i thought it was from the same person i guess i was wrong. I understand being honest but hurting others feelings i just can't do. I don't know if that makes me a coward. I try my best to be honest about the pics ppl post. A true superheroine never hurts others.

[vanessatevesti]

Although I appreciate people being honest to me I think that it's very hard to judge someone here based on their pictures, for instance passing as a woman is not about looking pretty, it's all about attitude, I've seen a lot of "ugly" girls (GG's) but never said to myself "this girl is so ugly, she must be a crossdresser", and I've seen beautiful TG's and instantly "read" them. That's because the "ugly" girls have the confidence of being what they are, real girls.
I once met a CD that wasn't what you would call pretty, she didn't care about it and went out anyways, she was so confident that most people thought she was just an ugly woman (but she passed!!) and she was so happy!
What would've happen if someone had told her she'd better stay home? It would´ve been a waste!

Besides, I think effort should be rewarded and for some just posting a pic is a huge step and that in itself is beautiful...

[Pandora]

Vicky, this is definetely a thought provoking post, and I wouldn't even begin to pretend I have all the answers, but here is my anyway. This is not an attack on you btw, I do see where you're coming from.

First off, to say someone "looks hot" and to say "you pass" means different things. Sometimes I see pics of CDers that couldn't pass but still look hot. Not sure what it is that makes them look hot but does it matter? Can't just being ourselves be hot? Can't we accept new standards of beauty?

Secondly. and speaking strictly to CDs here and (sorry) excluding GGs and TS, we are all trying to present as something we are not. Men dressing as women (or vice-versa). Keeping that in mind, I think it's important to reiterate what others have already stated, that this is a place for support. For some it's the only place in society we can go for support. If we want brutal honesty we only need to open our front doors and walk out into the world. We don't share so many feelings of self doubt or self loathing for no reason at all. It comes from the world around us.

It's more than likely that there is an overabundance of polite comments here because when we leave coments for others we are really commenting on ourselves and who we are.

[Nadia-Maria]

It's more than likely that there is an overabundance of polite comments here because when we leave coments for others we are really commenting on ourselves and who we are.

I love your point here Pandora. You made it !!

Hugs

Nadia

[Amy Hepker]

I am as truthful as I can be. I hope I do not affend others about the pics, but think about it, why dress if your not happy about dressing, Smile and show how much you like wearing these wonderful clothes. To me a smile in the pics really shows the real you. If you don't have very good teeth like myself, you can still smile without showing teeth.

I do give my honest opinion on questions, and I try to do it without hurting someones feelings. We are a family here and a very special family, I will be open and honest.

We all need to work together for our family.

[Megan (VA)]

This is a thought provoking thread. It provoked me to try a little experiment over in the Pictures and Video Forum in a thread labeled "Honesty." My feelings on the whole subject of passing are there.

I'm happy to see such a lively discussion!

[Nicki B]

Ugliness comes from inside, IMHO..

[Fiona K]

Honest comment is one thing, malicious comment is unacceptable, especially from those who don't take the plunge and post pics.

We do, as others have noted, take enough stick in the media and from fundamentalists of all kinds, we don't need to do it to each other.

[brawearingbimbo]

Soooo form now on if you want a "HONEST" opinion ask for it and you may get it (more than you want?). If all you want is to be pumped up just ask for "FLUFF" comments (makes you fell better?). I think everyone here is honest but I don't think they want to hurt anyone which is fine. You should not go out of your way to be brutally honest, that should be left for a face to face meeting where you can really see where both of you are comming from.
I think some of you were too hard on Skirt Lover for signing off so fast. I know I don't post and then sit around waiting for responses. I don't have that much time, don't some of you have other things to do? Somebady (correct spelling) mentioned that this had been brought up before, if you go by that standard there would never be any new posts as I believe it has all been covered before at least once if not a hundred times. And no, I do not read every single post or responce, I pick and chose the ones that look interesting. If you have time to read them all you must of taken the Evelyn Wood school of speed reading. Like I said before I just don't have that kind of time. I may not stay on line enough to get any responces so don't get mad at me please, but you can be "Honest" if you like.

[JaytoJillian]

Ugliness comes from inside, IMHO..

Ditto!

[Megan (VA)]

Ugliness comes from inside, IMHO..

Absolutely.

So does femininity.

[ggtracy]

Beauty is always in the eye of the beholder. On another thread, we talked about how hard it is to take a good picture so judging someone harshly based on a photo alone wouldn't be fair. I personally find a confident and happy person very attractive. if you are happy with how you look and what you are wearing, then your true beauty shines through.