Thing I Do NOT Like About Being A Girl

[Miss Tessa]

There's one thing I don't like about being a woman and I'm sure many girls hate the same thing.

I don't like the fierceness that alot of girls have toward eachother both GG's and in the trans community.

We all want to be pretty looking, but we feel like it's a competition. Some girls are fierce toward what another girl wears or how she acts.

And we have the feeling that we're not the prettiest girl and there are other girls who are prettier and that upsets us.

When I lived as a man I never felt that way. I didn't care which guy was more handsome than I was.

But after going the transition I feel common female jealous sometimes.
Even against my own friends. It's a normal thing for women and girls but annoying

[Holly]

So your view if being a girl is trying to out do all the other girls? I'm getting out the popcorn.

[docrobbysherry]

I guess I make a crappy female! My competition is always with myself.

I always want ALL girls to look as pretty as possible! GGs AND TS/TG/CDs!

The more ladies for me to admire, appreciate, and fantasize about, the better!

[nicole123]

For me living in a mans world I always had an opposite perception. I always felt like among men there was an underlying aggressive need to prove who was more dominant,
And would look at women and wish I could join in the closeness and uninhibited friendship they seem to share

[Miss Tessa]

Yes but I'm not talking about males all wanting to be the Alpha male.

you're kinda on target, but that's the male version.

The girl version is how girls can be so catty and fierce to one another.

[Angie G]

Not for me I can't compete with a lot of the girls here and that doesn't bother me I only go out on Halloween and can'y really pass then. I'm just happy being me.
Angie

[DemonicDaughter]

[SIZE="3"]You know what really bothers me? Stereotyping.

But I digress...

Anyhow, I believe that the majority of women aren't "catty" over looks. I believe that they might feel insecure when seeing an attractive woman, but I don't think they instantly berate her in a conversation for it.

I think what some people perceive as women being "catty' (and could you use a more stereotypical word that just perpetuates these concepts?), is actually just a matter of personal insecurity. A lot of PEOPLE (not just male or female), instinctively feel defensive when their personal boundaries are tested. In other words, meeting someone who feels there is some sort of competition for looks is going to spur another to do the same. That's life.

You don't like it? Then try not promoting it further.[/SIZE]

[Chloe84]

I dont think Miss Tessa was Stereotyping all women and all CD/TS/TV's out there when she said "a lot", I think more so she was stating it as an observation, as well as perhaps a factor of her own life(that part im not sure of.
I know as a male, and as a CD, all i want is to look my best, I know that there are a lot more women and TS/TV/CD's out there that are so so much prettier than my self. Do i feel Catty about it, most times no, but if someone says something about my looks, i will say something about their looks back to them, either be it a compliment or a Dig. I think it is in all of us to act this way.

and as being a male for the Majority of my life(ok all of it so far) I have noticed that women can be extreamly fierce to each other , nit picking, and making snide remarks when they have a chance. I suppose its the same way that men will try and out do the other men to be the Alpha Male, women want to be the one and only important female.

OK, this was my 2cents and in no way true facts, so please don't attack me for having an opinion.

[avril findlay]

I don't see myself in any sort of competition with other girls as to "Who's the prettiest?". That's just as much nonsense in our world as it is in the "normal" world.
And I do NOT like the way heels start to hurt your feet after a couple of hours!

[Miss Tessa]

Demonic Daughter, that the point I was trying to make.


Us women both T and G have insecurities about our looks and we sometimes feel threatened by prettier girls or equally pretty girls that are even our own friends being with us when we're out.

Myself and most women would never cut somebody down verbally about their looks or fashion, that is horribly rude and insensetive. I don't think I even know anybody that is that much of a female dogg.

I have noticed my observations occurring ESPECIALLY in the YOUNG TG community.

The older ladies are more like old fashioned, seasoned women who are less insecure and were raized up in a time of being more polite.

But the young TG girls I know do things that I find downright FOOLISH.

For example, sometimes when I go out with my friends these girls compete who can get the most numbers programmed into their cell phones without even planning to call the person ever.They do it as a stupid juvenille competition with their girlfriends.
I do not do stuff like that. I have lots of reasons why I think that behavior is wrong.


As TG people, especially the TS's, we are often angry that men think we are more sexually available because of all the ******* porn and the stereotype that we're all prostitutes.

I find alot of young TG girls perpetuate that stereotype by flaunting themselves at men even when they really are not interested in "getting" with the man.
All they want is somebody to stroke their ego, and yes I am guilty of doing that behavior, I admit it.

Those are just observations. Don't attack me for them because they are true in the sector of the mostly young T community I deal with in large Florida metropolitan areas.

[DemonicDaughter]

I dont think Miss Tessa was Stereotyping all women and all CD/TS/TV's out there when she said "a lot", I think more so she was stating it as an observation, as well as perhaps a factor of her own life(that part im not sure of.
I know as a male, and as a CD, all i want is to look my best, I know that there are a lot more women and TS/TV/CD's out there that are so so much prettier than my self. Do i feel Catty about it, most times no, but if someone says something about my looks, i will say something about their looks back to them, either be it a compliment or a Dig. I think it is in all of us to act this way.

and as being a male for the Majority of my life(ok all of it so far) I have noticed that women can be extreamly fierce to each other , nit picking, and making snide remarks when they have a chance. I suppose its the same way that men will try and out do the other men to be the Alpha Male, women want to be the one and only important female.

OK, this was my 2cents and in no way true facts, so please don't attack me for having an opinion.

[SIZE="3"]I believe saying, "It's a normal thing for women and girls but annoying" is stereotyping.

But perhaps I should re-phrase...

Making statements that perpetuate an already observed stereotype does not help eliminate the problem, it only promotes it.

I personally do not experience dislike or envy when looking at a more attractive person. I tend to believe we all have our hardships and would never assume someone has anything easier in life than I do. So they are better looking. They might also be suicide because life is just that depressing. So being envious is a useless emotion.

But when a common stereotypical phrase is used, such as women being catty over other women's appearances, it feeds the already social divide people create between the genders. It feeds the ignorance and misunderstandings that keep "men are from mars and women are from venus" a constant social concept.

In order to have ts/tg/cd to be acceptable, the lines of "us versus them" need to be less pronounced.

Making things "girl's version" or "male's version" isn't helping. Its dividing the lines and trying to put things in more boxes. This perpetuates stereotyping and social non-acceptance. [/SIZE]

Demonic Daughter, that the point I was trying to make.


Us women both T and G have insecurities about our looks and we sometimes feel threatened by prettier girls or equally pretty girls that are even our own friends being with us when we're out.

Myself and most women would never cut somebody down verbally about their looks or fashion, that is horribly rude and insensetive. I don't think I even know anybody that is that much of a female dogg.

I have noticed my observations occurring ESPECIALLY in the YOUNG TG community.

The older ladies are more like old fashioned, seasoned women who are less insecure and were raized up in a time of being more polite.

But the young TG girls I know do things that I find downright FOOLISH.

For example, sometimes when I go out with my friends these girls compete who can get the most numbers programmed into their cell phones without even planning to call the person ever.They do it as a stupid juvenille competition with their girlfriends.
I do not do stuff like that. I have lots of reasons why I think that behavior is wrong.


As TG people, especially the TS's, we are often angry that men think we are more sexually available because of all the ******* porn and the stereotype that we're all prostitutes.

I find alot of young TG girls perpetuate that stereotype by flaunting themselves at men even when they really are not interested in "getting" with the man.
All they want is somebody to stroke their ego, and yes I am guilty of doing that behavior, I admit it.

Those are just observations. Don't attack me for them because they are true in the sector of the mostly young T community I deal with in large Florida metropolitan areas.

[SIZE="3"]We both were responding at the same time, lol!

So I'll edit my post to answer yours. My post wasn't a personal attack, or an attack at all. My concerns regarding this community is often that because of things like stereotyping, ignorance and misunderstandings that it will continue to struggle greatly for social acceptance.

What you observe in the TG community locally, may not be true for another given GG social group. Why? Because GGs that aren't tg/ts/cd or don't have someone they are close to that is, have no idea what it is like, what you go through nor how you feel. The view points of those two separate groups cannot be lumped together.

Are younger people more competitive? Or is it just the newest generations that are more so? Is it more the ts/tg community that is? There are far more factors involved than saying its a "female problem". Its not. Its an individual problem and to be accepted as the same social group (ts/tg and ggs), again, those lines of continual social divide need to end, in my opinion.[/SIZE]

[Karren H]

Well I'm not a girl so what's not to like? Actually I don't experience any of the bad things of being a woman... child birth... monthly moodiness.... having to dress up every day for work vs when I want to.... glass ceilings..... Low pay..... Crossdressing has all the advantages and none of the disadvantages, imho!!!

[SabrinaDubh]

I wonder how much of Miss Tessas experiences are due to the age and/or socio-economic status of the people she encounters.

Young girls do tend to exhibit the behavours described more than middle aged women.

Edit: Well said, DemonicDaughter.

[MarcieM]

I don't like the fierceness that alot of girls have toward eachother both GG's and in the trans community.

you're taking this too seriously. lighten up.
maybe the whole goth attitude/frame of mind isn't working for you anymore.

[Beth-Lock]

I think what we are criticizing here is shallowness. That is why people need a spiritual side, to give a perspective beyond conventional, very worldly roles.

[Valeria]

What you observe in the TG community locally, may not be true for another given GG social group. Why? Because GGs that aren't tg/ts/cd or don't have someone they are close to that is, have no idea what it is like, what you go through nor how you feel. The view points of those two separate groups cannot be lumped together.

Please keep in mind that Tessa speaks for herself, and perhaps some young TG women she has known in her regional socioeconomic group.

She does NOT speak for all trans females (not even all young ones), nor does she accurately describe the majority of TS women, in my experience. I know lots of feminist trans females who'd be appalled at some of the things she's said in various threads. Accepting that her worldview holds true for most TS women is just as much perpetuating (or in this case, creating) a negative stereotype as anything Tessa has said.

Its an individual problem and to be accepted as the same social group (ts/tg and ggs), again, those lines of continual social divide need to end, in my opinion.

These lines are non-existent, IMO. But then, that trans females and cis females are the same social group is already taken for granted in much of my social environment.

I don't even know why this thread is in the crossdressing section. It seems to be about female-identified people (both cis and trans) who live as woman, and not particularly about crossdressers.

[Miss Tessa]

Goth attitude????? I was just about to post this post right here telling Demonic Daughter about her having a goth attitude about this.


Goth people are notorious for complaining about "stereotyping"


And I don't really dress goth anymore. Alot of the middle aged CD's on this board dabble more into corsets, fancy dark sexy dresses, and bondage gear than I do nowdays.
I haven't listened to any music like Bauhaus or Siouxsie and The Banshees in years.

Don't STEREOTYPE ME and tell me I have something I quit in early adulthood.


And yes, it is exactly due to the socio-economic status of the TG ppl I know.

I admit I hang with a whole lot of escorts and straight up street walking TS's who are young. I also hang with alot of TG ppl into Underground music or Drag.

Some of you are attacking me with certain words while confirming my exact points I was trying to make with the same words you are using to make it look like I was saying something else.

Do you get it? The points I was making is what almost all of you are saying.......I just had my own way of wording it that made sense to me....

We're all on the same page here, except some people are trying to make it seem like I mean something else.

[serinalynn]

The girl version is how girls can be so catty and fierce to one another.

My wife has told me and other women I know have stated that women are always in competition with each other. How your dressed, how much money you(or your spouse) make, and how you live. You as a woman are always in competition.

[Tracii G]

Miss Tessa you may be growing out if that group of people.
Thats just a part of maturing which is what it sounds like to me that you are feeling.Thats a good thing too.
From the age 10 -16 I was in a pretty nasty gang and they were my "family" so to speak.I came to the realization I was maturing and they were doing all they knew how to do degrade others, fight and cause trouble ie steal,vandalize etc.
I felt it was time to move on and do something with my life. I joined the Army and found something with some structure and it put me on the right track.
I hope you find whats right for you. You seem very intelligent AND have street smarts both good qualities IMO.

[Miss Tessa]

Also, how the heck do we make observations without discussing gender differences, such as the males wanting to be alpha males and women wanting to feel attractive?

As a world population of people, human beings have not evolved to a state of telepathic consciousness or have internet-like technology beamed to everybodies heads to make eachother know exactly what we mean without placing labels and terminology on things?

That whole nihilistic "goth" attitude doesn't go far with me Demonic Daughter, I figured that out years ago.

And personally I quoted that and labeled it "goth" purposely. I'm being satyrical because the other person said it and it's a label and it's also a label of something I don't associate with or want to be labeled as. I have no idea where they even got that from about me?

I'm making light of that because that bugs me that someone would say such a thing about me that I was thinking about somebody else in the first place. And something I am not into.

[DemonicDaughter]

you're taking this too seriously. lighten up.
maybe the whole goth attitude/frame of mind isn't working for you anymore.

[SIZE="3"]Please note, not all goths are depressed, competitive or "fierce". Goth ranges just as much as any social group.[/SIZE]

Please keep in mind that Tessa speaks for herself, and perhaps some young TG women she has known in her regional socioeconomic group.

She does NOT speak for all trans females (not even all young ones), nor does she accurately describe the majority of TS women, in my experience. I know lots of feminist trans females who'd be appalled at some of the things she's said in various threads. Accepting that her worldview holds true for most TS women is just as much perpetuating (or in this case, creating) a negative stereotype as anything Tessa has said.

[SIZE="3"]I don't presume anyone speaks for the majority. Its the reason I stress in my own posts the words "I believe" and such. I've been in the tg community since my teens and know that there are endless amounts of personal views and personalities. I happen to truly care a great deal about how this community is view because I love quite a few people in it. Its why I always seem to have posts trying desperately to abolish stereotypes and generalized statements.

I would love for all of you to be accepted as the individual you are. Albeit, the odds of that happening aren't in my favor, but a person can dream... [/SIZE]

These lines are non-existent, IMO. But then, that trans females and cis females are the same social group is already taken for granted in much of my social environment.

I don't even know why this thread is in the crossdressing section. It seems to be about female-identified people (both cis and trans) who live as woman, and not particularly about crossdressers.

[SIZE="3"]I was referring more to male versus female attribute lines. It seems some people that want to present as females often specifically pick what is considered a "typical female trait" to over-emphasize their femininity. It in turn separates even further the lines between fighting for rights as women and arguing a stereotype often enforced by males. I feel its counterproductive. [/SIZE]

Also, how the heck do we make observations without discussing gender differences, such as the males wanting to be alpha males and women wanting to feel attractive?

[SIZE="3"]Because men desire to feel attractive as well. And woman can want to be the alpha female. Most "gender differences" aren't actual personality traits that belong to one specific gender or the other, they are social stereotypes. Its like saying all Irish are alcoholics, all Hispanic people steal cars or all black people are on welfare. We know these aren't true statements. We know that they are over-exaggerated statements that are easily dismissed when looking at particular economic, geographic, etc factors of any one group of people. [/SIZE]

That whole nihilistic "goth" attitude doesn't go far with me Demonic Daughter, I figured that out years ago.

And personally I quoted that and labeled it "goth" purposely. I'm being satyrical because the other person said it and it's a label and it's also a label of something I don't associate with or want to be labeled as. I have no idea where they even got that from about me?

[SIZE="3"]
But yet you make that same assumption with me. That I identify with "that whole nihilistic goth attitude". I find it rather odd that you just did what you complained someone did to you. My attire has no bearing on my personal views of society. Just as you wish to be accepted as how you identify and not by a social label, you should practice what you preach.

Though I'd happily admit, I'd gladly accept the label "goth" if its primary social view point was to blur the gender lines and allow people to accept each other on a more individual basis than lumped into groups, slapped with erroneous labels all so someone can feel they fit in or out of that group.

Its human to want to feel attractive. Not just female, not just male. Human. [/SIZE]

[Joy Carter]

Look at female K9's. Most of the time, you can't have two in the same house. Once they get into a confrontation, they are likely to fight again. Males always seam to reconcile.

[Bev06 GG]

There's one thing I don't like about being a woman and I'm sure many girls hate the same thing.

I don't like the fierceness that alot of girls have toward eachother both GG's and in the trans community.

We all want to be pretty looking, but we feel like it's a competition. Some girls are fierce toward what another girl wears or how she acts.

And we have the feeling that we're not the prettiest girl and there are other girls who are prettier and that upsets us.

When I lived as a man I never felt that way. I didn't care which guy was more handsome than I was.

But after going the transition I feel common female jealous sometimes.
Even against my own friends. It's a normal thing for women and girls but annoying

LOl, Well I cannot comment on the male population but sometimes there can be a bit of competition between ladies. It does tend to emenate from insecurity but I think its a human condition which manifests itself in both sexes but perhaps in different ways. I have actually met some men on a professional basis who are every bit the hormonal bitch but I have to admit that is rare.
I like you have come to the conclusion that generally the older more mature TS's are more chilled out and happy with who they are, but then when you think about it, they have had more time to adapt to circumstances and they have a few life skills under their belt (both male and female) with which to deal with every day issues. They have probably had a life time of knocks and if it hasn't made them bitter it has turned them into well rounded individuals who know what it is like to suffer persecution and disappointment and would never dream of inflicting the same on another person. This is of course generalising because we are all individuals and I would hate to be accussed of stereotyping, but this has certainly been my experience.
Take care
Bev

[Valeria]

I was referring more to male versus female attribute lines. It seems some people that want to present as females often specifically pick what is considered a "typical female trait" to over-emphasize their femininity. It in turn separates even further the lines between fighting for rights as women and arguing a stereotype often enforced by males. I feel its counterproductive.

Yes, that happens, like in this thread:
http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...ad.php?t=92513

Sigh. FWIW, not everyone thinks that way. There are plenty of TS women who'd reject that type of logic.

BTW, a saying that I like to quote from one of my psych classes is that reality is closer to men are from North Dakota, women are from South Dakota. There are a few subtle differences, but they are rarely all that important.

[DemonicDaughter]

Yes, that happens, like in this thread:
http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...ad.php?t=92513

Sigh. FWIW, not everyone thinks that way. There are plenty of TS women who'd reject that type of logic.

BTW, a saying that I like to quote from one of my psych classes is that reality is closer to men are from North Dakota, women are from South Dakota. There are a few subtle differences, but they are rarely all that important.

[SIZE="3"]
I agree. Sometimes it seems that much of the supposed "male and female traits" are really nothing more than socially imposed roles, not actual genetic make up.

A perfect example is, its much more understandable that women are seen as emotional because hormonal spikes during a woman's cycle can cause her to be upset. It also works the same in men as their hormones can often cause anger. So those two generalizations are not that far off. But saying someone can't... oh, let's use mechanics... saying they can't understand mechanics "naturally" because of the body parts they were born with... well that's just silly. No body actually knows mechanics naturally. You are either interested in it and therefore seek out knowledge on it or you don't. You can have a natural talent for something but being such talents aren't based on gender... well its wrong to say that an interest in cars is a "male" trait. Or that cooking is more of a "female" trait.

So yeah... we aren't from different planets, just different social structures that emphasized specific characteristics associated with one gender or the other. Thus stereotyping still plays such a huge role in our current society that it makes it quite difficult for anyone that goes outside those social norms. [/SIZE]