Passing - A New Perspective

[Paula DAngelo]

I know I haven't been here that long but I've read a lot of threads about "wanting to pass" and it got me thinking. I've seen posts where someone would say I'm sure that I pass a certain percent, or that I could never pass no matter what I do. The people that claim to pass a certain percent normally are reminded that we don't really know if we pass or not, and the ones that say they can't pass are often told don't worry about it every one will be read at some point so just do what you want to.

Personally what I'm looking for is just to be accepted as myself, another person in this world. Whether someone sees me as female, a male in a dress, or whatever it doesn't really matter to me since my goal is to be me, a person that some people will like/accept and that some will dislike/not accept. This really isn't any different than what everyone goes thru every day we just are a little different than what most people are use to.

Since my goal is be me and to be true to myself I can say that I pass, because of what I'm trying to do. I'm not worrying about what others think of me, I'm worried about living my life the way I want to, and isn't that what we all really want.

All this leads me to ask, what is it that we want when we go out in public? Do we want to be seen as females, a male in a dress, or just as another person. Maybe we all need to look inside ourselves to see what it is we're really trying to accomplish. If what you really want is to just be true to yourself and accepted as a person then I think any of us can pass.

I'm not saying that my thoughts are right, or even right for anyone other than myself. This is just another way to look at passing and the way that I see it.

So what are your thoughts, am I crazy, or is it possible that we need to reexamine some of our thoughts on passing?

[melissakozak]

Paula,

Passing is extremely important for me, and I usually do until I open my mouth....

[Kathi Lake]

Paula,

All I want to do when I go out is to be accepted - by as many people as possible - as me. Although some tell me that I pass as a woman, well, . . . I do have a mirror.

Yes. When I go out dressed as a woman, I do go out fully dressed, and trying to look as much like a woman as possible. Is it to pass? Not necessarily. I believe I do it more for security. You see, I believe that someone dressed partially as a woman would be so instantly recognizable that they would have a huge target on their back. Not being the bulkiest of individuals, and not knowing any of the martial arts, I'm not exactly equipped for that kind of attention.

So, when I dress, I guess I'm trying to pass, but to pass under the radar, so to speak.



Kathi

[Chari]

Paula, Good post with ideas from another angle. We are all individuals and that alone makes us unique and different. IMO, whether we "pass" or not is only part of how we feel when we dress. Each of us should always be comfortable and confident in whatever we choose to wear, in whatever mode we present, regardless of what society deems "OK". We all need an encouraging word or a comment to know we are accepted. Thanx for sharing your views.

[linda allen]

My goal is to pass. Realistically, I believe I would usually pass at a distance of twenty feet or so unless someone is staring at me. I wouldn't pass sitting in a restaurant or waiting in line at a theater.

Part of this is because I don't try hard enough (for various reasons). I don't shave my arms and legs, I don't wear colored nail polish, my padded panties aren't padded enough, and at 5' 8", I'm at the tall end of the range for GGs. And of course, I have large hands and feet for a woman.

Put me out in the winter time when I can cover up and I'll do a lot better than in hot weather.

You say your goal is "just to be accepted as myself". That's fine and you will be accepted as yourself by most people here, but in the cold cruel world, you will have a hard time finding acceptance as a crossdresser. It's a shame, but it's reality and you need to understand that or you will be hurt.

Best of luck!

[Sally24]

When I go out I wish to be treated as a female regardless of whether those I meet think of me as a woman, a transsexual, or a CD. Most see the effort to be feminine and treat me as such.

[MysticLady]

All this leads me to ask, what is it that we want when we go out in public?

All I want is your Respect and Honor. Because that is what I'm giving you...

[Claire Cook]

Hi Paula,

I think you've said just what I feel about this. When I go out, I present fully as female. If I'm treated that way, that's great. Sure I get read -- but if someone knows and still treats me as me, that's great too. Maybe even better! When I stopped worrying about "passing" and just accepted myself as me, I think others started to as well. And it all became more natural, and more fun.

[Dianne S]

I want to "pass" because I want to look female. My makeup and hair-styling skills are not there yet, unfortunately, but I hope to get there.

For me, it's about looking as pretty and as female as possible. If/when I do get read, I would like the reader to think "not bad for a guy" rather than "ugh, he looks ridiculous!"

[Wildaboutheels]

1] NO one can ever know for sure if they "passed" despite numerous claims here to the contrary.

2] "Passing" is highly desired here by many but yet no one ever wants to really address exactly what "passing" to them means.

I think # 2 is because most [that want to pass] want to be SEEN as/treated as "females" so they go to major efforts to LOOK female. Probably not all that hard [to pass] sitting down with one's nose buried in a book. An entirely different matter if you throw in walking and talking into the equation.

I also think that for a very small minority, "passing" to them means no one gives them any dirty looks/and/or laughs at them and makes derogatory statements. They don't NEED to interact with people they just want to be left alone and not made to feel bad because of how they are "attired".

To me worrying about "passing" or not is pretty silly since few people with even a modicum of class are going to call a CDer out. Just because the vast majority of folks are not going to bat an eye [teenagers don't count] doesn't mean they thought you were a female and didn't see a man in a dress from 100 feet away.

[Rebecca Watson]

All this leads me to ask, what is it that we want when we go out in public? Do we want to be seen as females, a male in a dress, or just as another person. Maybe we all need to look inside ourselves to see what it is we're really trying to accomplish. If what you really want is to just be true to yourself and accepted as a person then I think any of us can pass.

If I were able to pass (in the usual sense), I would be satisfied. I don't pass, however; although, I'm fairly sure I've left a few people unsure.

My overall aim is to look like a respectable lady. Regardless of whether or not I pass, most people seem to think I've made an admirable attempt and look fairly pretty. In this sense I believe I "pass". People don't seem uncomfortable having their children around me while I'm in girl mode; on the bus, girls will sit next to me in preference to a guy.

There are other reasons too, e.g. (a) it's fun (guys are missing out!), (b) it also is a way I can do girly things without needing to explain myself (or have some cover story).

I'm not worrying about what others think of me, I'm worried about living my life the way I want to, and isn't that what we all really want.

I, on the other hand, am quite worried about what others think of me. In fact, I often ask others for their opinion: "so, how do I look?"

Do we want to be seen as females, a male in a dress, or just as another person.

Definitely as a female. If I'm shopping and they say "sir", there's no way I'm going back there again. I tend to leave a generous tip at restaurants if they call me "miss" or something exclusively female. Some people use "hun" or "sweetheart", which are somewhat ambiguous.

- Becky

[Kate Simmons]

People want to accomplish different things it seems when crossdressing. Myself? I just dress as a matter of choice and have fun with it for the most part. Some use it as a vehicle to get in touch with their feelings, while others dress simply for pleasure. "Different strokes for different folks" as the songs goes basically.

[Beverley Sims]

I do not particularly wish to be read but pass with some doubt is ok.

[Leslie Langford]

I like to think that I "pass" under most conditions as I always try to dress in an elegant and age-appropriate manner and take great care with my make up and choice of wigs. I also try to dress somewhat better than most of the GG's around me when I am out in public - but not so much as to stick out like a sore thumb - in order not to give them an excuse to diss me, even if it is unsaid or via "the look".

Now, when I say "pass", I don't know if I pass as a GG or as a pre- or post-op transsexual in most peoples' eyes, and frankly, I don't care. The point is - I have always been treated as a woman and with both dignity and respect, never had an issue with using the women's restrooms or fitting rooms, and have even received the occasional compliment on my outfits from GG's. And yes, I've even been hit on by men on a couple of occasions (not that I seek that - LOL!), although - truth be known - alcohol might have been involved on their part in some of these instances .

In short, I love going out in public as "Leslie", and all these positive reinforcements just encourage me to do more and more of it...

[Paula DAngelo]

Reading some of the replies I think I might not have explained myself clearly. First let me say when I go out it might be dressed as a male, completely dressed (clothes, wig, forms, makeup, the works) or somewhere in between depending on circumstances. Second regardless of the sex that I was born, I see myself as both male and female (I know sex and gender are two different things) leaning more to the female side.

Having said all that I admit that it feels good to be treated/thought of as a female, but that's not my goal. My goal is to be myself and that's something that I can do regardless of what others think. I guess what I've been trying to say is that the only one that I really need to pass for is myself and if I'm being true to myself then I'm doing that.

Yes, I know the outside world can be cruel I've seen it, and have to deal with it on a daily basis, but I'm confident enough in myself that it doesn't have to bother me and keep me from being me.

[Claire Cook]

Now, when I say "pass", I don't know if I pass as a GG or as a pre- or post-op transsexual in most peoples' eyes, and frankly, I don't care. The point is - I have always been treated as a woman and with both dignity and respect, never had an issue with using the women's restrooms or fitting rooms, and have even received the occasional compliment on my outfits from GG's.

..... and all these positive reinforcements just encourage me to do more and more of it...

..

Leslie, I think this is what I was trying to say. Yes, yes and yes!

[Paula DAngelo]

Quote Originally Posted by Leslie Langford View Post
Now, when I say "pass", I don't know if I pass as a GG or as a pre- or post-op transsexual in most peoples' eyes, and frankly, I don't care. The point is - I have always been treated as a woman and with both dignity and respect, never had an issue with using the women's restrooms or fitting rooms, and have even received the occasional compliment on my outfits from GG's.

..... and all these positive reinforcements just encourage me to do more and more of it...
..

..

Leslie, I think this is what I was trying to say. Yes, yes and yes!

This is the same as I'm thinking, you're being accepted as you and isn't that what we all really want?

[CherylFlint]

I agree with Lathi Lake.
Passing to me is the whole idea, to be accepted as the woman I am. I know the reality of the situation, that I’m not going to fool the people 100% of the time, but if I don’t make eye contact or speak I do pretty well.
The part about “passing” is very important from a safety issue. Some people really get bent out of shape, even mean, when they “make you”. I had a really bad time at a gas station, once, which is why I recommend to stay away from them if at all possible when dressed. Heck, they’re even dangerous places when any of us are in drab in the daytime these days.
My worst encounter was at the mall, at the makeup counter. Some woman was there with her husband, on the other side, when she said VERY LOUD “He’s dressed up as a woman!” and her husband tried to calm her down. I was going to make a purchase but just turn tail and walked away.
Whew!
Stay safe is the key. Makes your outing that much more enjoyable.

[Jaymees22]

I recently had a thought on this subject. I would like to consider myself a "plausible" woman. The casual observer would say that's probably a woman. Jaymee

[KatieV]

Perhaps it not so much passing but the fear of being read and publicly humiliated by some jerk - this does happen. If I'm read but accepted that's fine and has even been flattering; read and ignored is OK, too.
Passing 100% is for me simply not in the realm of possibility, especially since I usually dress to attract attention.

Kay

[I Am Paula]

Everybody loves a compliment. Sometimes when someone says 'I admire your bravery', or 'you just do what you gotta do', and my fave 'be yourself'. These are all comments that PROVE I did not pass, but are reaffirming, and validating, so I'll take them as compliments. As long as I fit in, pass or no pass, I'm happy.

[shawnsheila]

in my current state of mind / stage I am in, I really strive to "pass" or be "passable" not sure why other then to want to really feel/look like a woman but still keep my boy parts. I think I need to reflect a bit more to see what my goal is but I sense it is something that will change as Sheila matures

[Leona]

Paula,

All I want to do when I go out is to be accepted - by as many people as possible - as me. Although some tell me that I pass as a woman, well, . . . I do have a mirror.

I don't see a disagreement here. I also want to be accepted as me, and since some days, I *am* a woman, on those days I want to be accepted as a woman, which is precisely what "passing" is.

[Lynn Marie]

Of those of you who's ambition is to "pass", how many of you are 6'3" or more? What's a tall girl to do in your world of "passing"? Can I pass? Probably not, but I do my best to present myself as a classy old broad with confidence and grace. Oh would I love to be 5'10" and skinny.

[AmyGaleRT]

Oh, I know I have my deficiencies in my appearance. I'm built to slightly too large a scale (in both dimensions!) And I don't have enough padding down below...and Sabrina is dead-set against me actually wearing hip/butt padding. I do everything I can to tip the scales the other way, but I'm probably borderline at best.

But, when I go out, as I've said elsewhere, I don't worry about whether I "pass" or not. I just maintain confidence in myself, and confidence in my presentation. And it seems to work...last weekend, when I went to Lane Bryant to shop (and redeem about $50 in "Real Woman Dollars"), I was greeted and complimented on my appearance, called "sweetie," and accepted as "Amy" when I went to use the dressing room. (I saw a little magic-marker board they had to keep track of who had what dressing room. The square for the one I was using had "Amy" written in it, nothing else. It was slightly thrilling.) Before that, on a previous occasion, I was walking into a supermarket a bit late, and a woman by the registers just looked up and said, "Ma'am, we're closed."

That's the best advice I can give...maintain your confidence, own it, hold your head up high. Believe in yourself first, and it helps others believe in you.

- Amy