Therapy and transition and SOs

[carri]

Hey everyone, I'm new and I could use some advice, I recently started going to therapy after the 1st visit with my SO she got to hear the therapist say that I was transgender, I have been dressing for as long as I can remember, and have always wanted more, I came out to my fiancee about 5mths ago, and she has been very supportive, I most recently told her that I would like to transition, and she has been supportive in that as well, but she is still nervous that I will become a completely different person once I start HRT. So, I would like some advice about getting the letter and how your HRT has effected you along with how long you have been on it. If you have a SO do you have any advice I could pass along to help my fiancee in this journey with me, she has planned to attend therapy with me when she is able so that she can try and gain a greater understanding but anything else would be very helpful

I think if she could see some of the experiences that others have had she would feel more at ease with it all.

Thanks !!!

[I Am Paula]

Welcome Carri,
Glad you came along. It sounds like you're doing well with you SO so far. I have been married 19 years, and transitioned right in front of her. Without the melodrama, I will warn you, you're in for a tough ride. There are more like us, who stayed together, but none will tell you it was easy in any way- sexually, socially, and the sense of loss for their spouse, these are HUGE obstacles.

Sexually- My wife and I do not sleep together. Sex has been off the table for a long time. My wife likes me, but finds the idea of sleeping with me repulsive. It simply isn't a sexual relationship anymore, and that works for us. We hold hands in public, and kiss each other good night. Since my transition, my wife has never seen me naked.

Socially- My wife's biggest concern was her parents (Mom since deceased). They had never left the farm, and were, face it, simple folk. I'm sure their only exposure to gender variance was Benny Hill in a dress. Even before transition, my FIL referred to me as 'the Homo'. Cute. Not being a devout church goer, my wife did have some connection to it. Even tho they said I was welcome in their parish, she dropped out. With me as a member, or not, she knew there would be talk. During transition, a few times we ran into her friends, in the mall for instance, and she asked me to just keep walking, while she had a short chat. She has accepted, slowly, being referred to as being in a same sex marriage, but fumes when someone calls it a gay marriage.

The sense of loss- I can't speak for her in any depth here, but I know she feels she lost me along the way. She married Paul, and Paul is gone. Paula is the same person, but I don't think she'll ever think that. Sometimes she starts a sentence, 'Remember when you....oh, yeah....'

These are just notes, in no particular order. I am fully Paula now, legally, and socially, and a lot of these issues have worked themselves out, even the father in law tolerates me now. Our marriage works, but on a completely different and new level. There is a mutual love, and it's difficult to describe, cause it's so different than when we were boy and girl.

It is worth the trouble and hardship to at least try to stay together. Good luck.

[Rogina B]

Well,you are trying to make it work with a "fiancee"....Possibly a far less encumbered relationship than many had here.It is a great thing that she wishes to learn all about you and it..

[PretzelGirl]

Carri, you have thrown enough thoughts in here that it absolutely will be an individual experience. I think HRT changes all of us. That is the goal, isn't it? But it doesn't necessarily change the core person you are. If anything, I think many of us get more comfortable with our new selves (or real selves depending on your view) that our personalities shine even more.

I think the therapy is a good thing. Then you can have someone help to mediate the thoughts. My wife has not only stayed with me, but has embraced it totally. We are together and basically have a complete same sex marriage now. But I told her about 12-13 years ago and we have been growing together within a set of mutually agreed upon boundaries all the way up to my transition completing in October. At one point, a couple of years ago, she told me to stop playing around and go full-time and have surgery. The problem? I hadn't openly decided I was transitioning at that point. So I would say she was caught up at that point.

You probably aren't in a position where you want to spend 12 years getting there. So the tough part is how fast she gets the information and changes consumed and how she adjusts to all those thoughts. Is she ready to be viewed as a lesbian? Is she interested in going through the complete journey with you? Is she ready to turn her sex life into same sex attraction?

Obviously this isn't an easy road. But you two are starting off in a good path. I would just keep emphasizing communications and the rest are things that can be worked on.

[KellyJameson]

You will become a completely different person but than again you won't. It depends on what you mean.

What are her concerns pertaining to you "becoming a completely different person" ?

What does she mean by that ? What does she imagine transitioning means "for her" and for her as "both of you together" ?

[Kimberly Kael]

You've asked some great questions that don't have brief answers. Hopefully this is the start of a meaningful conversation for you and you SO as you explore a variety of possible answers and how they'll affect your relationship.

HRT is a tricky subject. There are the simple, pat answers but the reality is that different people have dramatically different outcomes. What's predictable about it? You'll have some reduction in body hair. Some breast tissue growth. Chances are you'll be more emotional. You'll probably smell different to her due to a change in your personal pheromone output, which is something I don't see a lot of people talk about. What's unpredictable? You may see some fat redistribution or a change in metabolism, or you may not. You may find you no longer have much of a sex drive or capability to sustain an erection. Your emotional reactions may be fairly predictable, or they may come and go without warning. I've been on HRT for about three years (I started two years after my social transition, which is definitely a little unusual.) I found my need for sex has all but vanished but my desire and ability have only diminished modestly.

What was it like for my SO? She may not find it especially reassuring that it started out terrifying, but over time she has eased into our new life and most of her fears haven't been realized. It's pretty rare that we get a negative reaction from anyone in public. Some of the things we've enjoyed that she saw as unthinkable post-transition have proved to be easy: spa visits while on vacation, golf vacations where we're paired with random strangers, and so forth. The list of countries we might conceivably want to travel to has narrowed considerably, and indeed there are places in this country that would be a unpredictable challenge, but fortunately we're able to live in a place that is remarkably accepting. The things that seem to bother her these days? She has occasional periods of sadness over the loss of the future together she expected. We're no longer that cute traditional couple that everyone oohs and ahhs over. We're now two women that people are surprised to find are in a relationship. So we don't get seated at the romantic table in a restaurant unless we make a point of asking. Hotels assume we want separate beds, etc. A thousand and one minor annoyances that add up and are all too familiar to the lesbian and gay community. She also has to face the fact that she's essentially closeted herself now: she interfaces as heterosexual, not as a lesbian, but that's somewhat buried in the complexities of our relationship.

[Angela Campbell]

I can't say I am a different person, because the person I was before was an act. I didn't know who I was then. Have I changed? I am me now. Don't really know who I was before.

[Sandra]

Hope you don't mind me jumping in

I am a wife of a post-op ts and one thing I will say is make sure that you talk to your fiancee, keep her in the loop at each stage. As for you changing everyone is different and all I can say is that Nigella didn't really change the hrt made her more laid back and more relaxed. It is good that she is coming with you to the therapy sessions when she can, just be prepared for a lot of questions afterwards and give her time to digest things.

[arbon]

Transition changed a lot in regards to the relationship I have with me wife. It took all intimacy out of the equation, she lost her husband. a lot of time she is okay with who I am today, a sometimes not so much. It was stressful for her on many levels as I jumped from one step in transition to the next and the whole time her hoping it would be as far as I would go - but I just kept going. Its been a heartbreaking journey for her.

[Suzanne F]

I will begin HRT next month. My wife has been supportive and realizes I have no choice but to transition. Most of her fears have not materialized as far as our children or friends support and love. I live as a woman except for the days I have to be in front of customers or appear at the company I represent. We have moments of complete love and acceptance that are so beautiful! However, I know she grieves as she loses a little more of Brent each day. This is by far the hardest thing I have ever done. I hate that she has to hurt. I have had to realize I cannot control her or anyone else's reaction to me being me.

Suzanne

[carri]

I want to thank you all for your insight and advice. I am currently continuing therapy and educating myself as much as I can about the decisions that are ahead of me. My fiancée and I are communicating about everything very openly. She has told me that before I move ahead with anything that will be more permanent she needs more time to process it all and to get more comfortable with everything. Also we both want to try and have a child the old fashioned way so I think that will give us both an opportunity to prepare for the changes. She has some health issues that may prevent that so we have already begun to research banking for IVF. Again thank you for all the helpful input and support. I look forward to getting to know you all better along this journey.

[Barbara Ella]

Carri, you are proceeding in the correct way. Over the three and a half years my wife and I have dealt with this (starting from zero at age 65) there have been immense ups and downs in her support, and you should expect some of these. It is just so very important that you continue talking and educating your fiance. We have been married 44 years, and my wife realized that neither of us was going anywhere when this started. We talked, and she learned, and sought out information, and company of other TG/TS girls to learn as much as possible. She supported my HRT just over 2.5 years ago, and recommended I start electrolysis (large volume full facial removal) last September. Will she become accepting to the point where other issues can be addressed, I don't know, but all things are open for discussion within her boundaries. we may have to move.

there have been body changes. We have not been intimate for many years due to medications, but she has become much less cuddly, although we hold hands in public, and kiss. She is adamant that she is not a lesbian, in spite of my desires. You will not become a different person. You will become much more at ease with yourself, which will make her more comfortable knowing you are finding peace.

Keep talking, and don't rush anything. At my age (68) I don't have a long time available, but that just means that some things might not get done. I am fine with that as long as i keep moving forward, and i hope you can find happiness in moving forward.

Barbara

[PaulaQ]

Carri - whether you'll be a completely different person or not depends on the perspective of the observer.

People who didn't know me look at old photos of me usually without recognition. Am I a completely different person? Seems so from their perspective.

To a lot of people who did know me, I am very different seeming because I hid who I was, so they never really knew me well to begin with. My activities and pastimes are different now - I have no interest in lots of stuff that I used to be fascinated by. I faked my way through a lot of stuff. I still love classical music though.

My sister tells me I am exactly the same person she's always known, and we've always been quite close.

I certainly feel like a totally different person.

The Meyers-Briggs Personality assessment notes some changes in my personality - before transition, I was INTP. 16 months into transition, I scored ENFP - I'm more extroverted now than before, and deal with things more from a perspective of feelings rather than thoughts - although of course I still think plenty about things.

So I guess in some ways I'm the same, in other ways totally different.

[LeaP]

...It took all intimacy out of the equation, she lost her husband. a lot of time she is okay with who I am today, a sometimes not so much. It was stressful for her on many levels as I jumped from one step in transition to the next and the whole time her hoping it would be as far as I would go - but I just kept going. Its been a heartbreaking journey for her.

In spades ... I could have written that, word-for-word.

[Rogina B]

And along with that goes "How do you see and love me ? As a friend?"... There is no "good answer"...

[PretzelGirl]

Why isn't there a good answer Rogina? My wife and I basically have a normal, same-sex marriage. What isn't good about that? I know it is far from common, but let's not bury possibilities before we have tried to keep things the way we want them. There is the old axiom, love is worth fighting for.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

so if you fight hard enough your love will win out??

guess a lot of us didn't fight hard enough..

[PretzelGirl]

I'm sorry Kaitlyn. I didn't mean it that way. It was in reference to there being no good answer. There is a good answer. You try and some can make it. The toll is heavy, no doubt. But it shouldn't just be waved off as a loss before trying.

[Rogina B]

Not saying that Sue...The comment was brought about because of the changing dynamics of a marriage...Of course you want her...as a friend... It is just not the same,for her or you[you means all]..No point in being delusional..It is no longer the same marriage.

[becky77]

The odds are that it won't work, simply because you will change, a lot. And you won't be that same person anymore, so on average most wives even the supportive ones can't handle it.
For those that are supportive it usually comes down to the fact that they married a man, therefore they are Hetrosexual, you are becoming a woman and that's not how they are wired. However as Sue said and rightly so, there are lot's of cases of those that do come through and in some cases their love is stronger. You have to remember that some of us can't hide that female core and it is this that they have fallen for in the first place.
If you hid this so well that you pretended to be Mr macho and sportsfan type, compensating so much that you are the total opposite to that person inside, your marriage is never going to survive.
The bigger the lie you have led in your life the harder it is for anyone, wife, friend, sibling to be able to cope with the change.

It can work, however it usually doesn't hence the warnings.

I am still with my wife, she has always known about me (Felt I was female etc) since before we got married and that was 17 years ago. She is the strong one and likes feminine looking men and has supported me throughout (It hasn't been easy for her at all). I have told her the truth throughout and yet as I have moved on, that truth has changed. I kept moving moving the goal posts, not intentially it's just how it is, you think you know yourself only to discover something else. After therapy I finally accepted who I was and started transition to be a woman (not a feminine man). We now live as best friends but the future is uncertain, I think we will always be in each others lives but our marriage is effectively over.

[PretzelGirl]

Rogina, marriages evolve all the time, even if it is just from getting older. So no delusion there. But your inference is that it will change to just being friends. I have multiple friends in my area that prove that isn't true. My wife is my best friend. My wife is my lover. My wife jumped right out there and said she was lesbian because she loved me. I know it is rare, but as I said about those in my area, it isn't just us. So to us, it is the same marriage. We love each other. We spend time enjoying each other's company. We love our kids. We love our grandchildren. What is different? Our outward projection of our type of marriage being same sex. That's it.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

That was kind of my point Sue. you mention trying....Trying what exactly???
Your wife is sexually into it. It has nothing to do with love or trying.
Your implication that you can love your way out or that a wife can work to change her sexuality is simply not the way it works.

Those of us that got divorced love our kids, and some of us continue to love each other but somehow found a way to acknowledge the reality of the transsexual condition and move on with our lives. I am not bitter or even out of love... my ex is the beneficiary of my will...i trust her totally... we share custody and spend social time together even traveling together.. is this an attractive possibility to a fiance?? its up to her but it's got nothing to do with try.

you are much older...the situation you found yourself in is light years away from Cari's.

Surely if you are not transitioning then there is a possible negotiation as to all the rules around names and presentation, but that's a whole different ballgame than transitioning
Surely if you are not in need of surgery that is something that a wife could consider..perhaps the wife is just not that interested in sexuality anymore, or is comfortable with the "arrangement" ..


Cari's on the ground problem is that its very early in the game..it is not a long term marriage that can evolve.
...she is not fully decided about what to do... she would "like to transition", her fiance is getting this put on her and is "trying to be supportive"... i've heard this one before..

anything is possible....staying honest and positive and taking it day by day is in order but you can't really believe or know that today's support will follow through as things change...

Trying to fight gender dysphoria and trapping yourself in a marriage that does not allow for your true gender identity is a recipe for disaster for both people. If somebody would like to transition but would prefer to stay or get married they are going to have a to take a flyer on whether their GD gets worse or not...there is no way to know (unless the person knows they are really just daydreaming about it..and even then things change...that's what i thought i was doing..it was just a pipe dream)
and the fiance is going to have to gamble too. she has to gamble that her feelings won't completely change as the changes happen...

[Jorja]

I am sure statistics are not kept on how many mtf marriages and relationships last or not. If they were, I am sure you would find the percentage that fail rather high. Does this mean that a couple should not try? NO! As the OP is early on in their transition, I think this is something they and their spouse/SO should be talking about. If both agree to try, then more power to you.

[LeaP]

Maybe it's my mood and maybe I'm projecting. But it strikes me how irrelevant all of the chat and advice is on this topic. Harking back to another thread, there is a paradox here. There is no way I would ever advise someone not to anticipate, not to plan. But I would also tell you that you cannot anticipate more than a fraction of the scenarios, emotions, priorities, or changes in your thinking and perceptions that will occur. Moreover, you may not even be aware of them. You will still perceive yourself as yourself (more so, in fact), and that is that. What that actually is and how it comes across to everyone else is quite another thing.

I most often describe my own situation as a train wreck. It's apt. A normal life runs on a more or less well-regulated system of tracks. You may switch to another set. You may go through switching yards. You may incur delays. You may pick up some cars or discard some. Sometimes there is a lot of baggage, sometimes less. But the train continues to run, one way or another. Past youth, you are running quite a long train. Everything is connected. And it's good – as long as you keep that damn train on the tracks! Because the minute you go off, you are going to find out just how connected things are. You will also discover the consequences of deferred maintenance, decisions made long ago about what you put together in what order and why loose ends, so to speak, that didn't matter much as long as things were running smoothly now matter a great deal. It doesn't matter much whether you are an engineer or the conductor. You are about to find out just how much you rely on the other to do and be all the things that you never even had to think about, that you actually don't even know about.

In short, when the train goes off the rails, you have no idea what is going to happen. Every once in a while, there are derailments with no damage. More often than you think, actually. Most of them happen in minor ways at low speeds. Little bumps when getting started, so to speak. You may be tempted to compare this to the the start of a relationship. That would be a mistake. Because your intention is not to run on a well regulated track (despite what you think). The truth is that you are already off the tracks and intend to run off the tracks from this point forward. Believe it or not, this is how the first trains were designed to run! Early 19th century engineers and designers found out very quickly how unstable trains are without an unyielding and predictable running surface. And so will you.

I was running a pretty ponderous train. Lots of cars. Lots of baggage. The wreck scene is dramatic. Not as spectacular as some others, but still pretty gruesome. Is that all bad? Nope. But none of the good stuff pertains much to relationships. And there's no cosmic balance scale that makes everything even out and everyone happy, either.

Were I in your position, I would probably be doing exactly what you're doing. I'm almost sure of that. I am just as sure that it would be a much better idea to hold off on relationships until things (e.g., transition) were settled and well underway.

I'm coming up on three years on hormones.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

The analogy is apt.
there is actually no good answer...trying doesn't come into play...we all try. Most of us try VERY hard.

Transsexuals cannot predict or control how bad it(it being the GD) is going to get...it is an existential crisis that you either have or you don't...and not having it now is no guarantee of the future (assuming you are ts)
fiances and wives cannot predict how they will feel when REALITY sets in..

Promises regarding gender are a high risk area for transsexuals..this is just the way it is.

As you evaluate the posts and decide what to do,.take in the mix of messages and note how lopsided the answers are especially from people that have fully transitioned...do the math..

that why
.....stay honest(especially with yourself as trite as that sounds), stay positive as best you can, and stay living day by day...