The Green Eyed Monster

[Nigella]

Sometimes as I read posts about accepting SO's I get the impression that there is some element of jealousy from the TGs.

Whilst I accept that there are some who have SO's who do not, or will not accept, for whatever reason, there are a number of TGs who have not shared their "other side".

I can understand those who's SO's know but won't/don't accept, their feelings towards accepting SO's but what about those who haven't shared the "other woman"?

Am I reading wrong?

I would also like to hear how the GGs feel about this as well, do you think that there is some jealousy?

[BrianaMarie]

I am a SO and there is absolutely no jealousy. If anything, I embrace her, specifically her emotional side. I encourage her and hope that one day she will feel whole, although I'm not sure that will ever be possible. Regardless, I will always support and encourage her to be who she is and be confident and comfortable with those choices.

Please elaborate, when you refer to jealousy? Jealous of the dress? Jealous of the look? Attention? Emotion?

[Nigella]

Please elaborate, when you refer to jealousy? Jealous of the dress? Jealous of the look? Attention? Emotion?

I mean that some of the TGs are jealous of those that have accepting SO's.

[Sandra]

I do get the impression that some are jealous, some have also said that they are envious, but alot have only their selves to blame. If they'd been honest and forthright then things may well be a lot different.

[Karren H]

It's not jealousy that we who do not have accepting SO's feel toward's those that do.... It's pure raw HATRED!!!!! lol

Sometimes they are easily confused...

[Sherlyn]

It's not jealousy that we who do not have accepting SO's feel toward's those that do.... It's pure raw HATRED!!!!! lol

Sometimes they are easily confused...

Ya I get that vibe from you alot

[Deborah Jane]

I,ve noticed there does seem to be some jealousy toward those of us with accepting SOs.
Sheila [my accepting SO] has noticed the same and commented about it to me more than once.

[PretzelGirl]

I think the jealousy is quite natural. My wife has pretty lax "rules" but does put some boundaries out there. So I am sure that there are some that would love to be under my "rules". In turn, when some talk about something they can do or their wife/gf does, then it certainly is not surprising if my mind goes "I wish" because many of us would like to push things to our comfort level as opposed to someone else's (wife/gf) comfort level.

[JoAnne Wheeler]

I have a hard time believing that there are any real GGs or Sos who really like their Spouse or SOs to crossdress - my Spouse told me again about three hours ago that she hoped that I got something out of CDing because it was driving her crazy and now she wishes I would stop.

Just how much and how far will real GGs or SOs let their CDing males go ?

I think a lot of us would like to know.

JoAnne Wheeler

[Di]

there are a number of TGs who have not shared their "other side".
I can understand those who's SO's know but won't/don't accept, their feelings towards accepting SO's but what about those who haven't shared the "other woman"?
Am I reading wrong?
I would also like to hear how the GGs feel about this as well, do you think that there is some jealousy?

Do not think you are reading it wrong Nigella at all.....some not all...I have felt a resentment towards me at times.....and although I do not let it get to me.because it comes from those that are closeted and made decisions in life to keep themselves hidden to loved ones ( everyones choice not arguing that) but I mean the ones that are so unhappy and angry a few times have made sniping remarks.
But I know they are hurting inside.. and try not to let it bother me and I keep on trying to be supportive here and esp my partner who is my first concern.


ADD to address Joannes question
you asked "Just how much and how far will real GGs or SOs let their CDing males go ?
I think a lot of us would like to know.
JoAnne Wheeler "

Sher is free to be...she makes her limitations...not I...so as far as SHE wants
I knew from day one!!.....and am love with the person....either guy or girl it makes no difference
well one difference lol my girl likes to dance so does Di:D

[Sheila]

I have a hard time believing that there are any real GGs or Sos who really like their Spouse or SOs to crossdress -
Just how much and how far will real GGs or SOs let their CDing males go ?
I think a lot of us would like to know.
JoAnne Wheeler

Okay Joanne I am areal GG and I enjoy Debs as much as her male side & fully ;)

HOW FAR .............well without going into details when we are tog if Debs is there in the evening she stays that way if she wants till morning .......

We are Marrying as Sheila and male Debs on 21st Oct this year and as Debs and Sheila on Dec 1st ( okay we can't marrry as Debs and Sheila legally, but we are having a "Debs and Sheila weding ceremony", where the vows we make as Sheila and male Debs (which we be in our own words), will be repeated word for word with the exception of the name I use to Debs, it will be her male name on the 21st Oct and Debs on 1st Dec), and incase you are wondering, I asked Debs if she would do me the honour, just as male Debs asked me. We are both having our bachaelor/ette/hen nights :D

I can't wait for both "Wedding" to take place and neither can Debs :):daydreaming::)

I hope that answers your question and rather than cause any jealousy, encourages some to realise, that yes there are those of us who accept and love our partners fully, but I know I am lucky, beacause Debs is a balanced individual, who happens to enjoy both sides of herself

[pinkeverything]

I mean that some of the TGs are jealous of those that have accepting SO's.

I wish I had one.

[mylitta]

Just how much and how far will real GGs or SOs let their CDing males go ?

I think a lot of us would like to know.

JoAnne Wheeler
It's nothing to do with 'letting'- he is his own person and does whatever he wants and wears whatever he wants. Our relationship is based on trying to make each other happy, not controlling each other.

[LilSissyStevie]

Perhaps what some interpret as jealousy is actually just resentment to the constant self-righteous finger wagging of certain "out" CDs and their accepting SOs towards those who are still closeted. Just a thought.

BTW, my wife is beyond accepting and there is nothing about me she doesn't know so please don't wag your finger at me!

[Nigella]

Perhaps what some interpret as jealousy is actually just resentment to the constant self-righteous finger wagging of certain "out" CDs and their accepting SOs towards those who are still closeted. Just a thought.

BTW, my wife is beyond accepting and there is nothing about me she doesn't know so please don't wag your finger at me!

As you have made this comment in a thread I have started, I believe, and I may be wrong, it is aimed at me.

Just to put the records straight, I do not wag my finger at anyone, each to their own. I don't believe I have ever said "You Will", I try to say maybe "you should".

Most of my threads and comments in others threads are meant to offer a different perspective. I can't and won't "tell" anyone what they should and shouln't do, each person knows their own situation and how it effects them. For those who are just finding out about this side of their lives they need to know about both sides of the coin, the good and the bad.

I am sorry for you if you feel my comments are finger wagging, but that is your interpretion and that is something no-one can have an influence on.

[Sandra]

I have a hard time believing that there are any real GGs or Sos who really like their Spouse or SOs to crossdress - my Spouse told me again about three hours ago that she hoped that I got something out of CDing because it was driving her crazy and now she wishes I would stop.

Just how much and how far will real GGs or SOs let their CDing males go ?

I think a lot of us would like to know.

JoAnne Wheeler

Joanne

I have been married to Nigella coming up to 22 years in Aug. She has gone from dressing on the odd occasion to being 24/7 for the past 4 years ish, now do you think that if I didn't really like what she does I would have let it go on? I think not, you know what it took a lot of time for us to get to where we are, but looking back I just wish I'd had the guts to have done it all sooner.


Perhaps what some interpret as jealousy is actually just resentment to the constant self-righteous finger wagging of certain "out" CDs and their accepting SOs towards those who are still closeted. Just a thought.

BTW, my wife is beyond accepting and there is nothing about me she doesn't know so please don't wag your finger at me!

Erm are you saying that accepting SOs are wagging their finger? Belive me hun this SO is not wagging her finger. If someone asks a questions or wants advise then I will give it, then it is up to that person whether she takes that advise and uses it or not.

If people take it as finger wagging then there is nothing I can do about that, but it won't stop me posting and saying what I think.

[LilSissyStevie]

As you have made this comment in a thread I have started, I believe, and I may be wrong, it is aimed at me.

Just to put the records straight, I do not wag my finger at anyone, each to their own. I don't believe I have ever said "You Will", I try to say maybe "you should".

Most of my threads and comments in others threads are meant to offer a different perspective. I can't and won't "tell" anyone what they should and shouldn't do, each person knows their own situation and how it effects them. For those who are just finding out about this side of their lives they need to know about both sides of the coin, the good and the bad.

I am sorry for you if you feel my comments are finger wagging, but that is your interpretation and that is something no-one can have an influence on.


My comment wasn't directed at anyone in particular, so no need to take offence if it doesn't apply to you.

I've been reading this forum for a while and I've never noticed anything I would interpret as jealousy towards CDs with accepting SOs. A little envy or longing for a similar situation perhaps but not the anger and resentment of jealousy. But I can understand if there is some resentment, which might be misinterpreted as jealousy, towards what I called the "self-righteous finger wagging" of the "total honesty" crowd.

Sure, I think the best relationships are those based on honesty. But not everybody can have the best relationship. In many cases it would be foolish and self-destructive to be totally honest with an un-accepting SO. On the other hand, that kind of a relationship can't last. I know because I've been there. What to do? What to do? Some hard choices have to be made and they won't always be the right ones. The last thing that anyone in this situation needs is the smug condemnation of those of us who have it made.

[paulaN]

My wife divorced me because I am TG. She could not live with me and it any longer. After 31 years go figure. She had known about me for about twenty of them. I don't meen to. But I sure as hell am jelous of any one who has an accepting wife. I don't think I am angry about it though. heck I am not even angry about the divorce. Not too much anyway.

[Kate Simmons]

Not at all. I'm happy for anyone who has an accepting SO.:)

[Sarah...]

I have a hard time believing that there are any real GGs or Sos who really like their Spouse or SOs to crossdress
JoAnne Wheeler

My wife prefers me to be honest and open. So I'm Sarah (not "him", and whichever way I'm dressed) and she knows that and prefers Sarah by a long way. She'd prefer me to be me at all times basically.


...I have felt a resentment towards me at times.....

Sadly my wife has felt the same. :sad: It's why she no longer contributes on this forum. She is however a very supportive person for me and other TGs and offers and indeed gives substantial support and a great deal of time to us in a variety of other ways. :)

Sarah...

[LisaElizabeth]

I've never seen it as jealousy...
'Wistful thinking' maybe...... a sort of What if.... in the responders message.
My wife took 27 years to get to the point where Lisa can go out to play.
She has come along for the fun a few times over the past 6 years. This has been something new and different!
Do I relish in the fact she helps me look my best? Not really, but it does make shopping for a new look easier with a second opinion about the clothing I'm selecting. I at least don't look like a 60 yr old trying to look 25!!
Before she became more willing to allow Lisa out, I always thought.... 'Gee what a nice thing to have and do together' when I would read about other girls that had more accepting SO's than me.
Not jealous, just daydreamng of a life like that.....
Just my opinion!
Lisa Ellizabeth

[Michelia]

I have a hard time believing that there are any real GGs or Sos who really like their Spouse or SOs to crossdress - my Spouse told me again about three hours ago that she hoped that I got something out of CDing because it was driving her crazy and now she wishes I would stop.

Just how much and how far will real GGs or SOs let their CDing males go ?

I think a lot of us would like to know.

JoAnne Wheeler


I am definitely a very lucky individual in having the SO that I have. I am proud of her and of the fact. And I would not consider that finger-wagging and I will make no apologies for it. Nor will I feel guilty in any way.

I really have not seen the jealousy that is mentioned in this thread in any kind of pervasive manner so I would tend to agree with LilSissyStevie on that. However, I disagree with LilSissy in that I also do not see any pervasive finger-wagging. Maybe I do not spend enough time on this forum to really get the full sense of either.

And yes, Joanne, there GGs out there that like it and I am starting to suspect there are many that would tolerate well after several interactions with other GG's wanting to flirt with me while en femme. I have even had one ask me to got home with her so she could dress me up. I also had another one ask me out to lunch. In addition, I have a permanent invitation to pick up a manager of a clothing store I have visited anytime I like. I never, ever received attention like this as a non-CD male. Fortunately, I have an awesome SO and would not trade her for any other.

Actually it has been the encouragement of my SO that has brought me this far. It has also been counterproductive, because she has persuaded me to do some things that impacted me so - keeping me in the closet much longer than I would have been. If it was up to her, I would be completely out.

She loves me when I am en femme. She goes nuts. She tells me how pretty I am and gets really turned on. When I am en femme she treats me totally like another girl calling me by my femme name. She is my lover and confidant and best friend.

Jealous anyone? Eat your heart out.

We have spent zillions of hours working it all out. This is incredibly hard. It is really tough to keep things fresh and exciting and loving when you are analyzing, dichotomizing, and integrating your relationship. This is by far the toughest relationship I have ever had. Countless sleepless night and tears having to go to work next day became routine for a while. I have also lived with a few women and have had many a heartache on my way to this point in my life. My wife is awesome, but none of this has occurred by magic.

It also comes at a price. You also have to make compromises. I have many limitations imposed on me. My internet time is very restricted. My SO is currently away and I am taking full advantage of it now. This is why you see me so sporadically on these pages. And I miss all of you, even when I am in such good company. I work very hard at giving my wife the prescence of a male as she wants it. She likes both sides of me. I have to work very hard at balancing it all - when in reality I am not a very balanced person. I do many things around my house I never did before - for any one. I often fall short and have to make amends. I never liked big girls. My wife, being the best thing that ever happened to me, is FAT. I had to get used to it. How many of us will not look at a girl twice because she is too ugly, too fat, too tall, whatever? I sure did. Maybe we need to not be so picky. There are a few other important restrictions and compromises I have to deal with that discussing would make this post even longer than it is.

I admire those that live without this support and feel for their struggles. Many of the CDs inhabiting this forum are incredible people, constant to their wife and kids regardless of the obstacles in place because of CDing, making the best of a situation with utmost determination and courage.

On the other hand, I have also seen the CDs that lose hope. The ones that stop believing. The ones that do not invest in their relationships or spend the time required to sort things out. The ones that think things are so easy for people like me. To those, I say without finger-wagging, that there is hope and your must believe in yourself. That you must get out there and expose yourself a little bit. That you must take those little risks. Come clean with your loved ones if at all possible. To work out your differences. Please do not be jealous of people like me. Find ways of making it work. For those that are lonely - there is some one out there for you.

Sorry if I sound like a preacher. It all comes from the heart and although I want to go back and edit, I will let it stand as it came out.

And Karren, it is OK if you hate me. You are one of those totally awesome people that does the best you can with everything you do and I so wish you would have that acceptance from your SO.

[gennee]

It took my SO a while to get over the initial shock :eek: but she accepts this part of my life. She's not totally accepting but it's better than nothing. What helped was that I told her everything when she found some of my stuff. She has asked me questions from time to time. I'm always happy to answer them.

Yesterday, she wore one of my sweaters to church. So far we have had any fights over my clothes :D. My son accepts me dressing, also. I am free to be myself.

Gennee

[Jacky Aikou]

Michelia, thanks for the long and interesting post! It would've taken me 2 hours to write that. :doh:

I agree with much of what you say, though I wouldn't add anything so incendiary as "Eat your heart out" to all the unhappy CD's here who can't share this wonderful part of our lives.

I came out to my wife in fall of 2007, before we got engaged. We were very close even back then and I think she sensed something undisclosed was always aggrevating me, and I wanted to be fair and get everything out in the open before taking the plunge. She may not have been thrilled with the news, but it was kind of a relief for her to hear the root cause of my woes. As it turns out, entrusting her was the right choice as it was a huge weight off my chest and we've only grown closer due to more open communication, more sensitivity to each other's needs, and enjoyed some other fun bonuses like getting to shop together and harmonious TV time (she gets to watch a lot more "What Not to Wear" now). :heehee:

Almost nobody walks into a totally accepting spouse, though; a lot of patience, work, and compromise is required to find that happy balance. For me, it's all worth it to get a measure of tolerance from my wife. I can sympathize, though, with others who stayed closeted after marriage or don't want to push the envelope for fear of losing wife and family just for more personal freedom.

Naturally, we're all jealous of girls with more liberty than ourselves. JennyBaby's relationship (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98264) seems like over the rainbow in genderland to me! :daydreaming: But I don't sense any real malice here on the forum. I think we're all adults and understand you have to make your own happiness.

[sometimes_miss]

I do get the impression that some are jealous, some have also said that they are envious, but alot have only their selves to blame. If they'd been honest and forthright then things may well be a lot different.

Perhaps this one explains it all. There often seems to be a very commonly held belief that if we'd come out, and 'expose ourselves a little' as another post mentioned, that we'd all have accepting girlfriends or wives. I don't think that's necessarily true; there are at the very least twice as many of us as women who would even consider dating us, and it's not like those women are wearing CD friendly I.D. tags or anything. Lots of us have had CD open personal ads running for years with zero interest. Like anything else, we tend to see the world in our own reality; having someone in our lives who openly accepts crossdressing can easily distort our perception of the rest of the world. Sure, there are some; but the majority do not want anything to do with us. Knowing that we're facing a >99% failure rate, 'exposing ourselves a little' does seem like quite a risk to take. Kind of like buying a lottery ticket with our mortgage payment. Might win, sure; but much more likely to lose, and cause problems. And if you've lost once and been severely burned because of it, you're much less likely to ever do it again. My 'exposing myself a little' wound up in a nasty divorce, getting blackmailed, with me losing everything. Took years to climb out of the financial hole. Not something I really want to risk happening again.

So if I've ever come across as jealous of anyone here, well, I've never felt that way. I'm not sure I'd recognise it if I were. Sure, it'd be nice to have a mate who's receptive to the idea, but I'd never want to steal someone else's. Just doesn't seem right.

[Michelia]

I agree with much of what you say, though I wouldn't add anything so incendiary as "Eat your heart out" to all the unhappy CD's here who can't share this wonderful part of our lives.



Jacky, that was meant tongue in cheek. My post seemed too serious by then. I hope no one takes it the wrong way.

What I really want to convey (even though I do not feel like there is a lot of jealousy out there) is there is no time to waste being jealous. Get out there and live your life. Maybe it is because I am already in my 50s and have been knocked around a few times. Had to start my life over several times. The fact is there are millions of people who have lost their jobs unfairly or divorced or taken to the cleaners in many different ways, and they all get new jobs or remarry or whatever.

I have had some real low points in my life. Real low. Hopeless. I know despair. I have been there. I could not find anyone to date me in my town. But I never gave up. I contacted women all over the world to find my current SO. Went through dozens of women.

Someone very close to me went through two different cancers and heart surgery in his 70's. Then divorced. Then fell and had multiple fractures in his legs and was in a wheelchair for a year. Today this person is 80 and just remarried to a gorgeous 36 year old and is in great shape. I have tried to learn from this person. Yet my life is a struggle too. We all have our shackles.

I do have some advice for those that post on the internet as CDs. You will be lucky if you ever find someone that way. It could happen. But the best way is to find someone you are compatible with and you can have fun with. Then you can bring up the CD issue early in your relationship.

[msginaadoll]

I would not say Im jealous, but I am envious of others situations. My wife doenst know about Gina, and I know that it would not go over well- most likely would end in divorce and two hurt people. I am more angry when I hear folks tell me u have to tell or get all holier than thou on me. Especially from folks that have been married 20 years and have just told. I see only a little bit of that here, but a lot of it at a support group I went to. I didnt return. Every one's situation is different and we dont live in a perfect world. My suggestion for others who may tell is prepare for the worst if you do, including divorce. Im not saying honesty isnt the best policy and have had many restless nights but.. That is what im willing to live with at least right now. Gina

[DemonicDaughter]

Without a doubt, I've seen some very jealous remarks come across the screen in reference to accepting SOs. From comments like JoAnne's of disbelief to us being entirely delusional.

Truth is, an accepting or not accepting SO is not a guarantee of a happy or unhappy relationship.

I've received many messages on various levels of rude asking if I'm "for real" or if I'm just "pretending, just to get attention". Its attitudes like that which explain the person's lack of relationships.

[ReineD]

I generally haven't picked up on jealousy or envy. Both indicate the presence of resentment over someone else's good fortune. I have come across some remarks that I've considered snippy, but not many. I usually put these down to someone having a bad day, or perhaps not communicating their intended message well. Or, my perception of the message might have been skewed if I was experiencing negative emotions at that moment.

If anything, I would describe the general mood as covetousness .. a wish to also have a supportive partner, but with no resentment against those who do. I've also sensed some resignation among those who travel this road alone. :sad:

But, I have sensed an inability for some folks to put themselves in others' shoes; a lack of imagination for anyone else having different experiences than their own. The incredulity stemming from these individuals' limited views might give rise to impressions of jealousy.
:hugs:

[ColleenShivas]

We all have to deal with our CDing in our own way. This includes the history and experience of how our SO learns about it. If we can teach each other how to make it less of a shock and less threatening to our SOs, then there may be more of us with "accepting" SOs.

Jealousy is not a helpful emotion. If we feel it, we should try to find a way to get past it - even to use the example as proof that there may be a better way. If we each understand this then we may be able to help ourselves, and through forums like this we can help each other. But we must all realize that every experience is different.

[kathtx]

One big gap in mutual understanding in our little community seems to be between those of us who are out to our SOs and those who are closeted. The "to tell or not to tell your SO" discussion seems a little heated at times.

While I'm an advocate of openness, I try to understand that in some couples it may take time and effort to get to that point. My buttons are pushed when it seems like someone's not even trying to reach a point of openness with their SO. On the other hand, I can see how someone in the closet might get annoyed by the constant urging to come out; most of us have been there at one time or another and know it's easy to say "come out", but not always easy to do.

Oh, and I confess: I'm horribly envious of Tomara for getting to live in one of my favorite small cities :) I miss Western Massachusetts!!:sad:.