Need honest opinions please

[socute]

Hi! I am a woman whose boyfriend is a cd. I discovered this 6 months after we started dating. We have been together over 6 years. I have always been accepting and supportive of his desire to cd, however, he doesn't want me to have anything to do with it. Recently I found out that he is not only into cding, but also forced feminization. Like I said, I've tried to be accepting and accomodating, but he does not want me involved whatsoever. He has been posting personal ads on websites, and listing himself as "bi-curious". When I inquired about it he said he isn't bi or bi-curious, but wants to find others like him to talk to, and because he is unable to find a woman to fulfill these forced feminization fantasies, he turns to men on the internet. My question is--do you think this is the case, or is he really bi-curious and doesn't want to tell me? He also says that it is just a fantasy and really doesn't see anything wrong with doing this on the internet, as it really isn't physical. I am very hurt by this, because I consider it a betrayal.

[Jennifer Brooks]

He sounds confused and out of place with his CDing. Probably not comfortable with himself and that is why he is shunning you. I at one time felt the same way he is now. Though my wife didn't know at the time I was CDing. He needs a forum like this and maybe a Transgender meeting to go to. That way he could be around people that are like him for the most part and get some lessons on how to handle this part of his life. Or maybe both of you should do this to better understand what's going on. I'd hate to know that you two broke anything off due to frustrations and lack of knowledge. That's my 2 cents. Best of luck to both of you.

[Diane098]

First off hello and welcome to the forums. For me it seems strange that he is looking for other men to fulfill his desire. For myself, my wife is the only one I would desire for fantasy fulfillment. Maybe there is more to his bi-couriosity than he will admit.

[Nicki B]

however, he doesn't want me to have anything to do with it.

Never underestimate how much guilt we feel about this?


Recently I found out that he is not only into cding, but also forced feminization.

Which sounds exactly like guilt - 'if someone else does it to me, I'm not responsible'?


He also says that it is just a fantasy and really doesn't see anything wrong with doing this on the internet, as it really isn't physical. I am very hurt by this, because I consider it a betrayal.

It certainly sounds like he would like it to be more than a fantasy, if he's actively looking for people to do it with - he needs to understand how hurtful that is to you and how it threatens your relationship.

Honestly, I think you both need external, professional help to deal with this?

[socute]

It certainly sounds like he would like it to be more than a fantasy, if he's actively looking for people to do it with - he needs to understand how hurtful that is to you and how it threatens your relationship.

Honestly, I think you both need external, professional help to deal with this?

He's definitely embarrassed about it. He also said that he's not looking to meet anyone in real life, but he has admitted to having cyber-sex twice and has posted pics of himself dressed up on the personal ads. He said that the forced feminization is not about being with another man, but more about the clothing. He claims that he wants to be dominated by a woman, but wouldn't take me seriously if I did it. He has dressed up with me before, but said it felt "forced".

[TSchapes]

about "Forced Feminization" is it's one way of avoiding the guilt that one feels about cross-dressing. In other words since someone else is imposing this on you, it's not your fault that you're dressed that way.

Just something I read. Wish I could remember where.

I understand why you are hurt. He's not letting you in and the lines of communication are down. I feel this is just as bad as not telling your SO about your crossdressing.

You two need to talk about this. Find out where the boundaries are and if they are mutually agreeable.

Sorry, I've got my guy hat on and I'm trying to "fix the problem". I hope you two can work this out.

Love, Tracy :hugs:

[<3 Keri Lynn <3]

The best thing he can do is get him to look at this site, Ive only been on here for a week now? And it has been so much help trying to find out who I am without shunning anyone or closing off. It happens to CDers every now and again where they are in life. I've noticed it almost as our midlife crisis because we are still men down and under which sucks but thats how it seems to happen.


*Hugs*Kisses*

[JennyS.]

SoCute... I am by no means an expert but I have my own philosophies about myself. I could be wrong, but CD'ing to your boyfriend may be something he considers for himself and is not ready to let that side of him out to people that know him as a boy. I can tell you from my own experences that as of right now, know one that I know as Jenny will meet my male side. Maybe after a while that will change, don't know. Also, I don't consider myself as bi-curious either, I just like looking pretty from time to time and I am not attracted to men. There is nothing wrong with that. Now, like your boyfriend I have been on sites that are unlike this one ('hook up' sites) trying to meet people like me, not looking for a date. The life of a CD can be an arduous road, let me tell you. BUT, I have recently met some great gurls and look forward to going out with more because for that one night a week or even month, I have a terrific time and feel completely safe.
I know you're confused and frustrated... And, it's been going on for a long time. Six years, wow. You obviously love him, so don't pressure him too much to let you in to that side. Maybe you should buy him a dress, skirt or a purse. That could help you inside the closet.
Hope this helps.

Jenny

[socute]

Also, I don't consider myself as bi-curious either, I just like looking pretty from time to time and I am not attracted to men. There is nothing wrong with that. Now, like your boyfriend I have been on sites that are unlike this one ('hook up' sites) trying to meet people like me, not looking for a date.
Jenny

Thank you for your honesty. This leads to another question--if cding is a sexual turn-on to my boyfriend, does that mean that if he and another man got dressed up together, it would lead to more? I am really trying to understand how this all works, and thank you for all your help.

[TGMarla]

This has possibly always been a solitary activity for him. But I don't think most of us would shy away from a supportive woman. If he's turning you away and turning to the internet because he's "bi-curious", it may be a warning sign for you. Some kind of open dialog is in order here. You have a right to know where you stand in your relationship.

[socute]

This has possibly always been a solitary activity for him.

It is definitely. He doesn't want *anyone* to know, and didn't want me to know, either. I found out by accident.

We have the same conversation over and over again, and our relationship is in shambles. I just want some clarification, but he tells me over and over that he is not bi-curious, just looking for someone to talk to. I want to trust what he says, but I don't know if he is being honest after all the dishonesty he has displayed. All I do is cry all day, and I'm so depressed. How do I know if he is telling the truth?

[JennyS.]

It's not always a sexual turn-on, for me. Sometimes, I just feel good looking pretty... As pretty as I can, anyway.
Here's the deal... I believe that I am attracted to women so much and love the shape, softness, and femme of them that from time to time I want to look like them. It doesn't mean I want to be a woman, by any means. That is very different from some on this site... Which is perfectly fine, too. What is needed is acceptance of the 'other' life. And the ladies on this wonderful site are a great source of information and acceptance no matter your sexual preference.
Stay aboard, SoCute... Ask all the questions you can, then introduce your boyfriend to us. This site helped me personally more than anyone can know.

Good luck to you.
Jenny

[Nicki B]

This leads to another question--if cding is a sexual turn-on to my boyfriend, does that mean that if he and another man got dressed up together, it would lead to more? I am really trying to understand how this all works, and thank you for all your help.

It's certainly not beyond the realms of possibility - nor that they would see each other as, at the very least, 'not male'..

I think he has real issues telling you the whole truth.

[twozillion]

My take is he is embarrased as well as using it as an excuse to be less than forthcoming to you. I would say do whatever you can to find a way for both of you to get your needs met. I think he would be suprised how cool it could be to let go a bit and open up to you. I bet you could easily fufill some of his fantasies and build a relationship with him if he could accept that side of himself and not lead a seperate life. Doing things behind your back will only compound any feelings of guilt he may have.

Best Wishes!

G

[socute]

Thank you all so much for replying to my posts. I am going to continue to peruse this board and ask questions. I appreciate all of your help.

[JennyS.]

This is a good begining for the two of you, but not the end all be all. Like someone stated earlier.... Professional help for your relationship may be needed. But, at least you are smart enough to seek advice on your own. Many of the gurls here are so intellegent and can be extremely helpful to your situation. As you've probably read, many of us have wives, girlfriends, and fiance's that are supportive of their SO's. Seek them out and ask questions about thier experiences and how they got through it. It won't be easy, I'm sure. But, you love him obviously, and it's worth the try.
Oh, I think it would be better to head off any fantasies into realities before they happen. Then, there is probably no turning back.

Again... Good wishes to you and yours.

[socute]

Oh, I think it would be better to head off any fantasies into realities before they happen. Then, there is probably no turning back.

That's what I don't get. He keeps saying he'll never find a woman to fulfill his fantasies, and I'm right here! He just doesn't want me involved. It really hurts. He says he has to accept that it is just a fantasy and will never happen. I'm so depressed. :sad:

[JennyS.]

He's in denial of her other self. Guilt, frustration, cognative thinking, religion, everything is completely confusing to him as it is to yourself. He is living in a fantasy world that is made just for him. That's what it sounds like to me. Like I said... I ventured onto certian sites but got scared because I don't want to 'be' with a man and just discarded those sites. And.. Again, I could be wrong. But, being supportive may just mean buying him a skirt or blouse and saying "I think this would look cute on you". Then walk away and see what happens. Maybe? I don't know. Looking in other posts... Don't pressure too much. But, you have every right to be concerned.

Does that help?

BTW... What does he do for a living? That could explain a lot.

[kathrynjanos]

I think it is possible that he doesn't want YOU involved with those fantasies. Maybe he sees you as something different, I'd even say "better" than that, as in, he thinks lowly of his desires. I am not sure, I don't know anything other than what's been said here, that's just a thought that occurs to me, so I'm throwing them out there.

That being said, if he's putting personals out there, listing as bi-curious, well, I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say he probably is. Doesn't mean he's necessarily bi, just wants a confirmation.

I think you need to determine what your limits are on the relationship before any direct conversation with him. As in, if you are not open to the possibility of him trying something that doesn't involve you, possibly sexual in nature, then you need to know that, and have a very serious talk about this. He also needs to be completely open and honest. If you get the sense that he is not being honest, it's your right to demand that you seek couples' counseling, or else you have the right to be free and clear in moving on. But that's up to you. Just try not to corner or threaten him about it, it will only drive him further away.

In regards to your question about whether or not he'd be sexually interested in a male if he or both of them were dressed, that's impossible to say without knowing him better. I will state that it is VERY common that crossdressing starts as a sexual thrill, and then, as that passes and you discover more about who you are, it becomes more of something you want to do for yourself. Self expression, as it were. Some go full-time, some just do it at home, some move on to being transsexuals.

[JennyS.]

That's a very good point Kathryn.

[kathrynjanos]

That's a very good point Kathryn.

Thanks. I'd prefer to break it down and answer on a quoted point by point basis, but thanks to caffeine and sugar, I'm a little too hyped up right now to give a straight answer.

[txrobinm]

Hi! Welcome to the forum!

My gut feeling is pro help is needed here. A question to ask:

how do YOU feel about cybersex? I think and feel that it's sex, even if the other person isn't physically there. The emotional bond and mental stimulation is there, coming from and going to another person, and he's not doing it with you. That's not monogomy in my book.

With talking it out, y'all can come to an undestanding of who needs what, exactly, and who's OK with what. Hang in there, buy him a nice (non-kinky, you want to encourage the behavior that works with you, not more hiding) femme item to help create a warm and loving environment where he can feel like talking about it, and get some pro help. Great idea on Tri-S or other such organization, too.

[kellycan27]

I have noticed that in many threads in here that there a number of crossdressers both married and with SO's that say that while dressed they often wonder or fantasize about being with another man, but seriously doubt that they would actually do it, and that they find the idea of being with another man while in guy mode totally unappealing.(that's putting it nicely)
I think it may go part and parcel with the whole crossdressing,feeling feminine, thing. Some sort of "turn" to enhance the experience. But not something that they might really do.
Perhaps you b/f ,by logging onto these sites and contacting other men is doing just that... enhancing his CDing experience. And perhaps he is so uncomfortable where you are concerned (because of how he may feel that you feel about his manliness) he is unable to to show you this side of himself. He's embaressed.

Maybe he's trying to tell you in a round about way that he would like to indulge this "forced feminization fantasy" with you,but indirectly because he may fear your reaction.

[socute]

I have noticed that in many threads in here that there a number of crossdressers both married and with SO's that say that while dressed they often wonder or fantasize about being with another man, but seriously doubt that they would actually do it, and that they find the idea of being with another man while in guy mode totally unappealing.(that's putting it nicely)


He has said that he would not be interested in a man because men are "nasty, stinky, and their voice would turn him off immediately". He believes that a man dressed as a woman is different. I guess because a man dressed as a woman is not taking on the persona of a man. He told me he would choose a woman over a man any day.


Hi! Welcome to the forum!

My gut feeling is pro help is needed here. A question to ask:

how do YOU feel about cybersex? I think and feel that it's sex, even if the other person isn't physically there. The emotional bond and mental stimulation is there, coming from and going to another person, and he's not doing it with you. That's not monogomy in my book.

I see his point where it isn't physical. When I asked about emotion, he said, "Trust me. There was no emotion involved."

I am not sure how I feel at this moment about it. I'm just confused and hurt.


I think it is possible that he doesn't want YOU involved with those fantasies. Maybe he sees you as something different, I'd even say "better" than that, as in, he thinks lowly of his desires.

I think the reason is because I am so much smaller than he is, (he could overtake me easily, so I couldn't dominate him) he wouldn't take me seriously.



That being said, if he's putting personals out there, listing as bi-curious, well, I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say he probably is. Doesn't mean he's necessarily bi, just wants a confirmation.

That's what I want from him! If I knew the truth, I could make a decision easily.


I think you need to determine what your limits are on the relationship before any direct conversation with him. As in, if you are not open to the possibility of him trying something that doesn't involve you, possibly sexual in nature, then you need to know that, and have a very serious talk about this. He also needs to be completely open and honest. If you get the sense that he is not being honest, it's your right to demand that you seek couples' counseling, or else you have the right to be free and clear in moving on. But that's up to you. Just try not to corner or threaten him about it, it will only drive him further away.

We've had the same conversation over and over again for a while now. I've been very open and honest. Not sure if he has. As for couple's counseling, he would never consider it because then he'd have to share with myself *and* someone else. He doesn't even want me to know, let alone an outside party.

I am going to counseling by myself.

[Samantha B L]

It seems to be kind of a shame that he's posting those ads and he just sort of wants to play "don't ask don't tell" about his CD'ing with you. I mean,there are all kinds of CD'rs who would just love to have an accepting and understanding female GG partner. But is he new to CD'ing? Because this could explain his being embarrassed about the subject. Or maybe he's young and doesn't want talk to make it back to his Mom,Dad,brothers,sisters if he were to "come out" more.

[kellycan27]

He has said that he would not be interested in a man because men are "nasty, stinky, and their voice would turn him off immediately". He believes that a man dressed as a woman is different. I guess because a man dressed as a woman is not taking on the persona of a man. He told me he would choose a woman over a man any day.

As i was saying.... that comes up here frequently.. exact same thing... A cder might think about being with another cder, but not a man in drab (man clothes) . I think it's fantasy, because they have to be smart enough to know that once the clothes come off... it's going to be not one but two nasty stinky men with deep voices.

[kathrynjanos]

We've had the same conversation over and over again for a while now. I've been very open and honest. Not sure if he has. As for couple's counseling, he would never consider it because then he'd have to share with myself *and* someone else. He doesn't even want me to know, let alone an outside party.

I am going to counseling by myself.

I hate to say it, but if you can't trust him to be honest (even if you have a good reason, which it seems you do!), I think your relationship is fundamentally broken. It's almost always salvageable, and sounds to me that in your case, it is, but it really requires immediate and full cooperation on both parties' behalf.

I know you are probably right that he would refuse counseling, but it may be time for that ultimatum, in this case. It seems to me that you've done everything as right as can be, and it's only fair at this juncture, when physical infidelity is a real possibility, may already even have happened, that you should be able to force him to go to counseling or leave him.

I have a limited perspective in this particular case, because I came into my realization of being a crossdresser (and more recently, probable transsexual) while involved with my current girlfriend, so she was kind of able to absorb this as I did, and we were able to kinda communicate where I was going with all this. It hasn't worked perfectly, but she gets enough information to let her know where I stand, and she is sort of OK with that.

Anyway, this may be bad advice, but from what I know of you and your situation, and literally being at the end of your rope, I think it's time to drag him (bound and gagged if needed), to your counselor. Let him speak, let it be a dialogue between them, and literally only speak when spoken to, so he doesn't feel ganged up on. It works, if you can at least get him that far.

If you are prepared to do so, if he just will not work with you on this, I think you should break up with him. It sucks, it's hard, but it's life. I think that this is only gonna get worse if it continues as is, and then it's gonna suck more. That is, at least, what I'd do.

Best of luck. If I can be of service, just PM or post back here. :hugs:

[kellycan27]

[QUOTE=kathrynjanos;1669861]I hate to say it, but if you can't trust him to be honest (even if you have a good reason, which it seems you do!), I think your relationship is fundamentally broken. It's almost always salvageable, and sounds to me that in your case, it is, but it really requires immediate and full cooperation on both parties' behalf."


Would you also say that in regard to all of the cd'ers out there who are married or in relationships where they have kept and continue to keep their cd'ing a secret from their SO? .. That their relationships are fundamentally broken? Seems he's been pretty up front with his CD'ing as well as his on-line indescretions. As for the bi-sexual question.... it's pretty much up in the air.
At this point is seems more fantasy than fact.

[Sheila]

My Ex was into all sorts of stuff and yeah he wanted me to have nothing to do with his CDing per see ............ I don't know enough about your personal situation to make any real assumptions, but what I can say, is ithere is enough similariites in you situation already in the OP here that I can say those are similar to the reasons my EX, is Now just that, my Ex ........ get you 10 posts in hun and come join us in the GG section ..... there are some wonderful ladies in there who very rarely post out in the main forum and they are full of great advice ....... plus we have cookies there :D


I suppose if you can get him to talk to you, you could ask, if he views Forced Feminization as part of an alternate life style (like CDing is viewed by some)
or
if he views Forced Feminization as a sexual practice

[Byanca]

Well, i'm not really a CD-but i'll answer anyway.

Maybe there is more to his CD'ing then he is aware of him self. Obviously many emotions involved.

I think if you want to solve this riddle. You might have to go back in time and find out were the pantihose rippled, so to speak, and mend it from there. What I am trying to say is that you might have hurt him emotionally at some point, probably when you found out. There is a big chance that you didnt find out, but he let you find out. As he didnt want to push it on you. And your reactions at that point might have been critical regarding the trust issue. So he feels you dont see him for who he is.

I don't think you are to blame. But I think you have the key. And maybe it is a mistake if you focus on the clothes. Might even be irrelevant. But instead focus on emotions. So instead of going from the concrete to the abstract- do it the other way around.

The cybersex thingy is weird. Anyway, If trust can be restored, then this aspect should solve itself.

Best of luck,
twisted-sis

[Jess_cd32]

........We've had the same conversation over and over again for a while now. I've been very open and honest. Not sure if he has. As for couple's counseling, he would never consider it because then he'd have to share with myself *and* someone else. He doesn't even want me to know, let alone an outside party.

I am going to counseling by myself.

I think Kellycan may have nailed it for the most part that he's embarrassed perhaps to open up to you about his fantasies. Even with 6 years together under your belt together, he may just think you would never understand it and think he's weird or whatever his fear is.
Like Bill Maher the commedian said in an act I saw recently, "most mens fantasies are womens worst nightmares"......so much truth to that in general terms, not saying it applies here though.

I don't think he's going to open up to you, I'm thinking from what I've read that he just can't bring himself to, but he can with a stranger anonomously on the internet. If thats as far as he goes with it fine, on the net it seems he can be himself without worry of condemnation from anyone and act out his fantasies. If he is bi-curious, well all I can say is the net may not satisfy that need he may feel, and he very well could act on it, (if) he is.
Its also possible he's just exploring a side of him re: bi-curiousity and thats all it is, and he's satisfied with that just chatting with others about it.

I think talking to a councelor is a good idea if you do, but make your own decisions, some aren't all that good in their practice. Good luck and welcome to the forum:hugs:.... I hope we've been of some help and support for you.
I'd also take Shiela's suggestion and join them in the section she mentioned.

[socute]

My Ex was into all sorts of stuff and yeah he wanted me to have nothing to do with his CDing per see ............ I don't know enough about your personal situation to make any real assumptions, but what I can say, is ithere is enough similariites in you situation already in the OP here that I can say those are similar to the reasons my EX, is Now just that, my Ex ........ get you 10 posts in hun and come join us in the GG section ..... there are some wonderful ladies in there who very rarely post out in the main forum and they are full of great advice ....... plus we have cookies there :D


I suppose if you can get him to talk to you, you could ask, if he views Forced Feminization as part of an alternate life style (like CDing is viewed by some)
or
if he views Forced Feminization as a sexual practice

How do I get to that forum, and what is a GG?


Would you also say that in regard to all of the cd'ers out there who are married or in relationships where they have kept and continue to keep their cd'ing a secret from their SO? .. That their relationships are fundamentally broken? Seems he's been pretty up front with his CD'ing as well as his on-line indescretions. As for the bi-sexual question.... it's pretty much up in the air.
At this point is seems more fantasy than fact.

He hasn't been that upfront. I found out about both by accident. Every time I try to talk to him, he shuts me down. He told me to stop trying to understand, and that I won't ever understand.

Forgot to add that he says I am taking something very little and blowing it out of proportion. I don't see it that way at all! This is really affecting me.

This is how he explained it to me: He compared it to an average guy seeing a woman and wondering what it would be like to be with her. Of course the guy wouldn't, because it would be wrong if he's in a committed relationship. Therefore, it's a fantasy that won't happen in real life.

Then why all the secrecy? Why can't we talk about it? How do I know that internet porn and chatting will be enough? I am scared to death he is going to meet someone in person and have sex with them. I can't handle that.

Every time I bring it up, we end up fighting. He is almost ready to call it quits, so I have to pretend it isn't a problem or even bring it up to avoid arguing. I can't live like this anymore, but I don't want to leave him. I love this person, and I thought we were going to get married one day. I feel like my heart is literally breaking. I started counseling, but he won't go. I guess he doesn't love me enough.

He told me if we break up, he is going to date other girls, definitely not a guy. Then he told me that he would have screw another girl just to prove to me that he isn't gay. *rolls eyes*

What's weird is that he said he put bi-curious in the personal ads because it would get more people to talk to him, since most men that are like him are gay. So, why did he tell me last weekend that most men want a woman to dominate them? He is contradicting himself.

[Shari]

You asked for honest opinions, so here's mine.
Seems to me he's already rejected you and has decided to take another road.
Dump him and move on.

[Kate Simmons]

He is obviously in conflict with his own feelings about this. He needs to talk to someone. If he really cares for you, he will find out the truth. He owes you that much.

[Fab Karen]

"Every time I bring it up, we end up fighting. He is almost ready to call it quits, so I have to pretend it isn't a problem or even bring it up to avoid arguing. I can't live like this anymore, but I don't want to leave him. I love this person, and I thought we were going to get married one day. I feel like my heart is literally breaking. I started counseling, but he won't go. I guess he doesn't love me enough.

He told me if we break up, he is going to date other girls, definitely not a guy. Then he told me that he would have screw another girl just to prove to me that he isn't gay. *rolls eyes*"

He's being very defensive, getting angry with you over it. Anger is often a cover, a way of trying to distract from the subject. Whether or not he meets up with someone, a CD doesn't place ads about being bi-curious to meet other CD's to just talk with. By refusing to communicate with you over this intimate part of his life, he's essentially saying you're not that important. Lasting relationships don't involve shutting a partner out of discussing such things.

[deja true]

You asked for honest opinions, so here's mine.
Seems to me he's already rejected you and has decided to take another road.
Dump him and move on.


I'm with Shari on this one.

With all the lies and hiding and adamant defensiveness, this guy is more work than he's worth.

He obviously doesn't love himself, and isn't even trying...so how can he ever really love you. You may just be his 'cover', so he can look more 'normal' to others and to himself.

Six years of prevarication and rejection? That's not a relationship, hunny! That's a sentence! You've served your time...

Sorry!

Still, as you my have learned from all the advice and counsel that we're trying here, the vast majority of us are nowhere near like this.

Stay involved with us, dear one...

At least we can offer our

respect & love.

deja

:<3:

(a GG is a Genetic Girl. That's you! The F.A.B. (Female At Birth) private forum can be found in the menu on the opening page. Go there!)

[MsJanessa]

Lots of different facets to CDing---for some its a fetish sexual turn on---particularly related to B/D S/M kinds of sexual play(for instance "forced feminization") once the sexual release is attained, the clothes and makeup come off and every thing is as it was. For others its a feeling like they really want to be more feminine and may be a prelude, but certainly not always, to a transition to living en femme full time or in a relativly few cases involving transexuals, actually going through hormone treatment and gender reassignment surgery--- and for most of us, the reality is somewhere in between the two poles.

Where your BF is cannot be said without further information---but the fact that he wants to experiment with Forced Feminization leads me to think that s/he may be more of a fetishistic type cd---which would be better for you I think if you can handle it yourself---Would you be interested in playing the top to his/her feminine bottom--in other words take charge and make him/her dress en femme, put on his/her makeup and wig and then order him about the house(a hint if into maid service you will never have to do anyhouse work again)

My advice would be to sit down and talk with him and even suggest you would like to do a forced femme scene with him(assuming you are interested in that type of thing or at least willing to try it) If he says yes enthusiastically then you might have the start of a beautiful relationship---if he rejects this then probably something else is going on and you might want to consider whether or not you want to stay with him. If you would like some suggestions on the forced femme feel free to contact me privately What ever happens, good luck.

[Sandra]

How do I get to that forum, and what is a GG?



To find out about the FAB forum read the link in my signature FAB forum access, and please read the rules for how to join.

You are a GG :) born a female. GG= Gentic girl

[JoAnne Wheeler]

There are all types of CDers - your boyfriend appears to have sexual

fantasies that extend way beyond mere CDing - I would be tickled to death

to have you as my SO - you seem to be understanding and supportive of

more traditional "normal" ??? CDers - your SO is missing a good thing by not

confiding in you and sharing with you - my guess is that he feels guilty and

embarrassed to discuss his more bizare sexual fantasies.

JoAnne Wheeler

[Michelia]

This has possibly always been a solitary activity for him. But I don't think most of us would shy away from a supportive woman. If he's turning you away and turning to the internet because he's "bi-curious", it may be a warning sign for you. Some kind of open dialog is in order here. You have a right to know where you stand in your relationship.


While agree with most of the posts here concerning guilt and fantasies and acess to this forum, I would have to emphasize Marla's observation. In my view, there is no excuse in a 6 year relationship with a supportive wife to be so secretive. There is something wrong here. Socute, some counseling may be in order here. He needs to come clean with you or you need to dump him.
You poor lady. Crying yourself to sleep and this guy seems oblivious.
There are a ton of great crossdressers out there wishing they had someone like you.

[ReineD]

I am going to counseling by myself.

That's a wonderful idea! It will help you do determine appropriate boundaries for yourself and it will help you to communicate them clearly to your SO.

Your bf needs to understand that your feelings are valid. As a woman in love, you do not separate emotional attachment from the physical act of sex. So to you, it feels as if he is cheating and each time he engages in this, you feel betrayed. If he understands this and he still justifies seeking online thrills, then I would ask myself what his priorities are and if this is the person I want to be in a relationship with. Of course I do not know him, but judging by what you wrote, he may need the time to grow in maturity and he doesn't sound as if he is "into you" very much.

Oh, and in my view, cyber or any other form of sex that is not strictly 'physical' between two people can still be a betrayal to the relationship if it takes significant time and energy away from it. Sex is rooted in the mind.

I agree with the others that it would be good for him to join this forum and hopefully accept the CDing better and take it beyond the sexual.

And last, do apply to join the FAB (Female At Birth) forum. A GG is a genetic girl. We support each other a great deal in FAB! There is a link below my signature.
:love:

[docrobbysherry]

I AM all about fantasies, and sex! :o
And for that reason alone, I feel I CAN'T share with anyone that I dress up like a female!:eek:

Early on, as I began CDing, I had fantasies of becoming a woman, having breasts, being with a man, and forced fem, of course! All those thots turned me on! For awhile, anyway. Like most fantasies, I knew I would not act on them, and in time, they passed.

The one fantasy I've held onto, is the one I've actually LIVED! Looking like an attractive woman! It still turns me on, because it's sort of a fantasy that's become real to me! Because it's the woman in the mirror that turns me on, I have no desire, or need, to share her with anyone. Unlike your boyfriend, it seems.

I have many other sexual fantasies, which r just that! Thots that turn me on, but ones I would never act on, and would never WANT TO EXPERIENCE in real life.:doh:

It sounds like your BF wants to make his fantasies become reality. Then, they will either turn him on, and he will continue them. :thumbsup:Or, real life won't match his fantasies, and he'll give that one/those up!:thumbsdn:

Either eway, it DOESN'T sound good for u two, as a couple! Sorry!:sad:

[Karen564]

That's what I don't get. He keeps saying he'll never find a woman to fulfill his fantasies, and I'm right here! He just doesn't want me involved. It really hurts. He says he has to accept that it is just a fantasy and will never happen. I'm so depressed. :sad:

I feel so bad for you socute, It sounds like a very lonely relationship for you, if you can even call it that, it seems like it's more about what he wants, and your just there for his convenience, and this may seem harsh and quick to judge on my part, but I personally think you should just do yourself a favour and give your boyfriend the boot in order to keep your sanity if he cant come clean to you, I dont care how embarrassed he may feel, you deserve and have every right to be included since you have made it very clear to him that you would be supportive, which leads me to think he has other things lurking in his mind, and cant be trusted..It's possible he may have been faithful up to this point, but what about the near future?? if he's in some kind of figuring out what he is or wants mode.. does he really expect you to just sit on the sidelines waiting for him to figure all this out, he sounds more like a boy, not a man (Dido)

There are many CD'ers here that can only dream of having such an supportive SO as you, and would love to include them in their CDing and fantasies but are afraid of losing them because their SO's aren't supportive or will freak out about it, but you have shown nothing but openness and honesty in this relationship, and it seems he has shown very little, so I think it's time for him to either screw his head on straight and see the wonderful woman you are standing right in front of him, or just hit the door.
In all fairness, I haven't hear his side of the story, but I have no reason to disbelieve what your saying, because you seem very honest and straightforward and think that there are many here that would be happy to do right by you..
Good luck, and hope you find true love & happiness in your heart.

:hugs:

[DonnaT]

There are lots of CDs who will not, or can not, share this part of themselves with anyone else in real life. Not even with an accepting SO. Some find the idea so unappealing, they would actually rather be separated/divorced.

Some SO's realize this, and give their CDing SO the space they need to dress when they need it. Some try to think of it as a hobby they won't be sharing.

As for fantasies:

There are guys who like femdom, who are CDs and into feminization.

There are guys who like femdom, who are not CDs and not into feminization.

There are guys who like femdom, who are not CDs and find feminization to be humiliating. The humiliation turns them on.

There are guys who like humiliation and are turned on by it, but would not stand for being feminized.

There are guys who like humiliation and are turned on by being forced into a bi experience. Some are into cuckolding.

And there are lots and lots of other fantasies. Some live the life, some live thru the fantasy.

There are a lot of various forums with hundreds of members who share common fantasies online. Very few actually bring the fantasies into real life. Although some do. Whether your guy is all online talk or not cannot be judged by what you've said.

Let's assume it is all fantasy. Can you live with that?

If the fantasies are not hurting your sexual relations, there's no real harm.

Except for trust issues.

This may be what you both have to work towards achieving. Trust.

He needs to trust you enough to tell you all his fantasies. You need to trust him enough to accept that that is all they are, fantasies.

His online activity, without cluing you in has led to the mistrust you have in him. Why he cannot trust you enough to be more honest with his fantasies and online activity, I couldn't say. But he does need to open up and tell you his issues with trusting you and cluing you in on what he's up to. If he can't do that, then there will never be trust, and the relationship is bound to fail.

Since it appears the relationship is heading towards failure the way things now stand, and if he won't open up and talk without getting angry, it may be time to take things into your own hands.

You say you love him and want things to work out. Then tough love may be required.

Tell him you've left pictures of him dressed up, copies of his online activities, and addresses of family, co-workers and friends, in a sealed non-existent envelope with an unnamed friend. Tell him you love him, but that they were instructed to open the envelope over the weekend, if he refuses to go to counseling with you. To work on trust issues, not fantasy or CDing issues.

Of course, forcing someone to do what they don't want to do is the very last thing you'd want to do. If your going to counseling doesn't help, and if he refuses to go, then forcing him to go may well be the very last chance of saving the relationship.

The question is, can you live with his fantasies and online activities if he is totally honest with you about them?

If not, then do you have it in you to indulge in fantasy talk in the bedroom? There are lots of forced fem stories online that can be brought up in bedroom play. And will he be able to replace his online fantasy playing with this type of bedroom play?

If not, then do you have it in you to be dominant enough to actually force fem him? Make him your maid for a weekend? Using that same non-existent envelope of information your unnamed friend has.

[Karen564]

You say you love him and want things to work out. Then tough love may be required.

Tell him you've left pictures of him dressed up, copies of his online activities, and addresses of family, co-workers and friends, in a sealed non-existent envelope with an unnamed friend. Tell him you love him, but that they were instructed to open the envelope over the weekend, if he refuses to go to counseling with you. To work on trust issues, not fantasy or CDing issues.

Of course, forcing someone to do what they don't want to do is the very last thing you'd want to do. If your going to counseling doesn't help, and if he refuses to go, then forcing him to go may well be the very last chance of saving the relationship.



I Totally Disagree with that, There is NO WAY I would ever recommend doing such a thing to someone or anyone doing that to me..
That's just going to make things Much worse and could even resort to a violent act towards her..people can do the strangest things when backed into a corner with no way out..
If that's what it took in order to go to counseling, then that relationship is WAY past saving.!!!!
Were not talking about saving a 40 year marriage or lifelong relationship here, there not even married, so why not just cut her losses now before it goes any further?? because when you have these kind of problems before you have even said the I Do's., I sure cant imagine it getting any better after..just much worse..

I see no sense trying to feed a dead horse..just bury it, move on & get a new horse.. :2c:

[charlie]

Hello Socute!
Welcome to the forum! Thanks for coming here and please help us understand what our female mates think and feel about our dressing. I really appreciate it when real girls answer or posts and give us advice and another way of thinking. As to your man, it appears to me that he is both embarrassed by his dressing and wants to have a man involved sexually while he dresses. I do not think that it is just dressing that he wants to do. Going online and asking for a man to be with him is not just the usual urges to most CD'ers here. It is more then an urge to dress and wear clothes.

[Lorileah]

SoCute you have my empathy. It seems that in the machine that is this world the CD gear cogs just never mesh correctly. Somehow we are always one tooth off.

There are days we hate ourselves for who we are and what we do. The majority of us take a deep breath and muddle through. Your husband has decided he wants to make this hate deeper and lower. It is so nice to hear that a woman is willing to help her CD person come to grips with this. You understand that it isn't wrong but he has not learned that yet. If he wants to learn we can help. As you know we will also help you to help him. From your side of the story it sounds like you love him very much and are willing to try and work this out. He needs to find if he as as much love for you. I don't think he is in that place right now because he doesn't even love himself. If he can't come to grips with his demons you can't help no matter how hard you try. The one thing I don't want you to do is drag yourself down with him. It is a deep rut and you can't see over the edges. Don't beat yourself up over this. The GG's here are willing to help you fight through this. They will be non-judgmental and can give you a perspective so that you know you are not alone in this.

The sexual fantasy is a hard nut to crack. He sees you as more pure than the domme in his mind. You are the light and hope at the end of his dark tunnel. His Domme (or Dom as he may want since he wants a male to force him) is evil and wicked. A person who represents all the bad he thinks he is. This person does not exist. If he followed his fantasies he would either freak out and run or he would be so disappointed that he would have to find another fantasy. But he wants it detached from his "real" life. He wants you as his Madonna, you will be his rock and harbor in the end. What we need to do is help you find a way to guide him to this harbor before severe damage is done. If we can help, please get him into this forum. If not then he really needs to talk to someone who can help him find his way out.

This is not you. You are doing the right thing by asking for help. I know that everyone one this forum who can help would be willing to give you the best advice they can. We may not be always right but we can give you paths to follow.

I wish you good luck.

Lori

(P.S. there are hundreds of sisters on here who would love to have you as their SO, you are one in a million)

[SANDRA MICHELLE]

he needs to be totally up front with you and let you know how he feels about everything. I really wish i had been that way all along with my wife, I owed that much to her and if he really is worth the effort than he needs to meet you at least in the middle. No matter what his reasons are for not letting you in he must let you in if he wants to keep the relationship going. it sounds like all the effort has been on your part thus far, thats just wrong and you deserve so much more. Good luck with the boyfriend, show him this forum and see what he thinks, he sounds very mixed up and probably could use much more help than you need.

[socute]

Lots of different facets to CDing---for some its a fetish sexual turn on---particularly related to B/D S/M kinds of sexual play(for instance "forced feminization") once the sexual release is attained, the clothes and makeup come off and every thing is as it was. For others its a feeling like they really want to be more feminine and may be a prelude, but certainly not always, to a transition to living en femme full time or in a relativly few cases involving transexuals, actually going through hormone treatment and gender reassignment surgery--- and for most of us, the reality is somewhere in between the two poles.

Where your BF is cannot be said without further information---but the fact that he wants to experiment with Forced Feminization leads me to think that s/he may be more of a fetishistic type cd---which would be better for you I think if you can handle it yourself---Would you be interested in playing the top to his/her feminine bottom--in other words take charge and make him/her dress en femme, put on his/her makeup and wig and then order him about the house(a hint if into maid service you will never have to do anyhouse work again)

My advice would be to sit down and talk with him and even suggest you would like to do a forced femme scene with him(assuming you are interested in that type of thing or at least willing to try it) If he says yes enthusiastically then you might have the start of a beautiful relationship---if he rejects this then probably something else is going on and you might want to consider whether or not you want to stay with him. If you would like some suggestions on the forced femme feel free to contact me privately What ever happens, good luck.

He is definitely into BDSM, and has told me that he has lots of different fetishes because "so many things turn him on."

[inquisitiv]

He is definitely into BDSM, and has told me that he has lots of different fetishes because "so many things turn him on."

I think you might be getting closer to the root of the problem with that comment. It is a possibility that his BDSM fantasies are so "non-vanilla" that he cannot even imagine discussing them with you because of a level of guilt, shame, embarrassment, etc. about those fantasies which eclipses anything associated with CD'ing. And he might want to live out some of those "unmentionable fantasies", and feels he can not communicate those needs/desires to you as an active partner.

[Tina B.]

You poor thing, I think you have had an over load of advice, all I can add is protect yourself as best you can (emotionally), no one should go that long feeling the way you do, without answers.
Tina

[Nicole Erin]

How well do you 2 get along normally? If you 2 are normally friends, like genuine ones, then it would seem strange that he would not trust you with his fantasies. But, if there is a lot of arguing or disagreeing, then he is not going to just trust you with his deepest thoughts and feelings. He is not going to give you ammunition to use later, like if his fantasies are really different.

Maybe he has just lost interest in you and him being together and it is time for you 2 to go your different ways.

[Satrana]

Socute

Your bf wants to keep his CD fantasies quite separate from his relationship with you. The ideas which titillate his mind involve degrading/demeaning acts which he feels should never be part of normal healthy relationship. So he believes his fantasies are too perverted and they would completely change your perception of him if you became involved.

It is not really about embarrassment rather it is about protecting you and your relationship against his fantasies which focus on the weakness and humiliation of being a girl, not something he feels you could ever understand to be what he believes to be a harmless sexual fetish.

His admission to being bi-curious sounds to me to be probably a very honest admission. Bi-curiosity is not the same as being bi-sexual. He likely feels no sexual attraction towards men while he is in male mode but his CD fantasies have washed away any homophobia he possessed so he is open to the idea as part of his CD fantasies. In other words any man he would ever talk to or act out with is nothing more than a tool who he is using for his own purposes, he is not interested in the man as an individual to develop feelings for.

I am fairly liberal so I don't feel acting out this stuff over the internet is not necessarily a betrayal unless it becomes too frequent and interferes with your own intimacy as a couple. I am guessing that the things he wants to do in his fantasies would leave you cold so I think you have a choice to make - either accept he should have a safe, harmless outlet for his fantasies which you are not interested in sharing and understand his wish that they do not reflect on you or women in general, or you ask him to try to wean himself off these ideas through therapy but in reality you cannot unlearn something you, you can only resist it and that can lead to problems later.

It is a real dilemma - he really wants this to be a quite separate and private aspect to him while you want everything out in the open and shared. There is no point in even suggesting that you will become interested because he will feel that was fake and he does not want you to be forced into doing such things. It may be hard for you to see but he is acting this way out of his sense of love to you. It has the same conditions that keep CDs in the closet, except he feels his sexual fantasies are many times more shameful.

[socute]

I told him that I was posting on this board, and he said that he has actually lurked here before. He told me that I need to trust him because our relationship is not going to move forward unless I do. He said that he doesn't have the cd or forced fem. urge often anymore, and hasn't done anything else online since I found out about the personal ads. He knows it is wrong--he is supposed to be in a committed relationship with me, whether he is attracted to girls or a cder, so he will not act on it. (Like a man who's married wonders what it's like to be w/ another woman, but won't because he has a wife.)

Basically, he says it's a fantasy that won't happen in real life. I believe he cares about me, and loves me. He says that there aren't many people here who are into forced fem (most are into makeup more than he is--he's what he calls "a lazy cder") and he isn't into cding as much as the posters here--that is why he tried to find others like himself to talk to on those "hook up" sites. I really want to believe him. He claims he has been brutally honest with me about everything since I found out.

To end on a good note, he wants to work everything out and not just throw our relationship away.

[Fab Karen]

"supposed to be" in a committed relationship is not the same as WANTING to be in a committed relationship.

You should just blindly trust him after you've discovered he's been hiding things from you? Think about that. It sounds more like he's telling you what sounds good to get you to drop it, and he'll go back to doing things in secret. Ask your therapist what they think of what he's said ( including about talking to people on hook-up sites ).

[socute]

"supposed to be" in a committed relationship is not the same as WANTING to be in a committed relationship.

You should just blindly trust him after you've discovered he's been hiding things from you? Think about that. It sounds more like he's telling you what sounds good to get you to drop it, and he'll go back to doing things in secret. Ask your therapist what they think of what he's said ( including about talking to people on hook-up sites ).

I shouldn't have said "supposed". I can't remember what he said verbatim. He considers us in a committed relationship. He definitely does not want me to do anything physical with anyone else, and says he hasn't and won't.

[kathrynjanos]

Would you also say that in regard to all of the cd'ers out there who are married or in relationships where they have kept and continue to keep their cd'ing a secret from their SO? .. That their relationships are fundamentally broken? Seems he's been pretty up front with his CD'ing as well as his on-line indescretions. As for the bi-sexual question.... it's pretty much up in the air.
At this point is seems more fantasy than fact.

Well, unless I'm misreading the post (it's possible), she found these posts. I don't see where it states that he told her about them. So... yes, I would say that's different.

Insofar as the difference between a CD who doesn't tell their SO, and the CD actually seeking some sort of outside relationship (again, it strikes me that he's less innocent than seems, but this is my interpolation, not fact, but it does drive my opinions), that is different. A CD SHOULD be honest with their SO (not necessarily right away, I will add! It's ok to retain that little factoid until after you're even sure if you want to pursue longterm relations), and if the SO simply cannot handle that, well, then the love there is truly not unconditional, and really, therefore not love.

Love, by definition, is unconditional.

Also, I'm not saying that your SO has to LIKE your CDing, just at least accept it within the bounds of the relationship. As long as you get some "me" time, that's all you need.*

(*Living fulltime is different. I feel that if you wish to live fulltime, then you are fundamentally altering the original boundaries of the relationship.)

[Satrana]

He said that he doesn't have the cd or forced fem. urge often anymore, and hasn't done anything else online since I found out about the personal ads.
While he may have given up for now because of the stress and guilt involved in you finding out, be aware you cannot unlearn these thoughts. All CDs are CDs for life, it is only a matter of time before he begins again no matter how resolved her feels at this moment. Many CDs purge, meaning they throw out their clothes and promise to never crossdress again. It always fails.


He claims he has been brutally honest with me about everything since I found out. You are probably the only lover he has ever told so he has told you many things he thought he would take with him to his grave. Not so sure he was 100% honest, probably more like 90% because he will have held back some details he thought could be particularly upsetting to you.

If you feel he truly is committed to the relationship then try to see everything that has happened in a positive light. You have gotten closer to him than anyone else so there is a strong bond created by the revelation of his secret . If you can accept him for who he is then build on the basis of the shared secret. Right now he is trying to sweep the issue under the carpet. Tell him that is not necessary, that he would be living a lie to deny what he is, give him the space and support for him to be a whole person.

[noeleena]

hi...Socute yea wellcome . i am going to come from a womens point of view. the word ..trust.. went out the window a long time ago .with out that trust the relationship changes ... i know from personal experience. . with out that trust you see that person in a different way .. would i wont to be in bed with some one i dont trust . no because you give every thing that you are of your whole being if you like in that moment of true love . can that lost trust be regained . that in your case only you can answer .. you said 6 years .... try 35 living with some one you really get to know them ...yet did our kids really know me ......they are 30 to 35 . 3 of them . the point being can your trust last that long ..... when you get my point youll see what i am saying words are easy trust has to be worked on .. if you dont trust your partner with who you are .then theres not much left ...does yours even though is uncertin of him ./.her self ..
...noeleena...

[Tammy298]

Socute

In many ways, I feel I am very much like your boyfriend. I've never really been so much into all the makeup and a lot of the details involved with CDing, as much as a BDSM and forced femdom aspect of crossdressing and being "used". In my 9-year relationship with my wife, we do play crossdressing and BDSM, but the "forced femdom" aspect is still pretty much a fantasy rather than part of our play. This is something I'm trying to work into our play.

That a bit of my background.

The main thing that I find similar to your situation, is that my wife and I have a lot of trouble talking about "it". The one thing I can say is that for my part, I find it impossible to talk about what I want or would like to do. We just don't talk about what we do, in or out of the bedroom!

The one thing I have found that I can do, is send her email and leave her written notes. I must sound really strange, but I can't even get myself to hand her one of these notes.

This has helped alleviate the communication problem and it's something you might want to try. Your boyfriend might find it impossible to talk directly to your face, but may respond to an email or letter. There is just something, so difficult in talking face-to-face to anyone about things like this that are so personal and intimate, especially when it is far from mainstream.