how come

[decoratorpro]

How come when a GG knows about her boyfriend/spouse/livein being a crossdresser, they still feel ashamed. I have told Ruth Ann about how I feel about her dressing, and showed her info all about it not being anything wrong with it, and she still shuts me out. She wants me to have very little to do with it.

I know, I know I need to give her time to adjust that someone knows about it, and also give her time to get used to the idea of someone knowing. But how much time does she need?

Donna

[Miranda09]

She may still be caught in the social stigma that CDing is WRONG!!!!! Consequently, the closet syndrome may be hard to overcome for her. Best thing is patience, as with everthing else when it comes to couples discovering this lifestyle. Keep us posted. We're here for you. :)

[Christina Horton]

I'm confused are you the GG or the CD?

[mklinden2010]

Good point about who's the GG and who has the problem...

So, what's the answer to that question?

[Holly]

Donna please cut Ruth Ann a bit of slack. She has years and years of societal conditioning to overcome. Add to that she may still be coming to terms about herself and has confusion going on in her own mind. Just make sure the stage is always set and inviting for meaningful conversation. Best wishes.

[Dragster]

Christina and Mary, I thought it was obvious that Donna was the GG, and Ruth Ann was the CD. Have I missed something?

Tony

[jasmine57]

Donna- I have just recently come out to a ouple of GG friends of mine and the were both totally accepting. It was still very difficult the first time I actually just sat down fully dressed with them. I'm very confident in who I am but the butterflies were still almost overwhelming. Neither of these girls is my SO and it was still tough. Now that I've broken the barrier it's a lot easier. Just give her time to get comfortable in her own shoes. She'll get there it just won't happen overnight.

[Deborah Jane]

Hi Donna,

For some of us self acceptance came hard for one reason or another and even then we still get some thoughts of "is this right?"
I've got an accepting SO myself [Sheila] and in all honesty i think most of the time she's more comfortable about my c/ding than i am.

As for how long will take, i think it depends on the individual, we're all differant.

[Sheila]

hun there is a very interesting, good, heart wrenching, & loving & informative thread if you click HERE (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=106866) it is entitled "If we TG's CD's could say anything"and is written bt the CDER's & Tg's, it compliments the thread in my sig by the GG'S

[SouthernBelle.GG]

But how much time does she need?

I've given my husband 21 years and he still hasn't let me see him fully en femme. I honestly don't know what else I can say or do to get him to trust me with her. I know others will say it's because he still isn't fully accepting of it all, but geez. In my mind, he must not trust me still after all this time. It hurts.

[Rachel Morley]

I've given my husband 21 years and he still hasn't let me see him fully en femme
Holy cow! .... that is surprising ... to me anyways. I'm wondering if this is such a personal thing to him that he doesn't want to share it, yet the moment I think that thought I also think to myself who wouldn't want to share it with their wife? :confused:

[Deedee Dupree]

Well, I wish one could just snap their fingers and everything would be right as rain, but for many "coming to terms", unlearning a lifetime's worth of gender conditioning is an educational process that can take many years to accomplish. IMO, the best advise over the short term is patience... pushing her too hard, and/or her doing things that are too "advanced" for her, may drive her deeper into the closet... for a long time. Let it go for a while & give your SO some space to work it out at her own pace while you reinforce those positive aspects of your relationship that have carried you both this far that have nothing to do with CDing. She will come to you when she is ready.

dd

[LisaM]

Donna,

There is a deep feeling of shame that a lot of us feel. We are conditioned from when we are little to be 'men'. And despite how we feel inside we progress along the paths we choose.

Your SO chose to marry you and be your husband. Now you have let him know that he has a secret that he has kept from you for a long time. This secret is that he has always liked to dress as a woman which makes him less than a man not only in your eyes but in his too!

He probably feels that he has lost his place in your view of him. Your acceptance is truly special but give him some time and let him open up to you. He has hiden this part of himself for years and you found out his secret--he wasn't prepared. There is shame because he feels like less of a man, there is guilt for not being honest with you, and there is anxiety and fear because he wonders if your acceptance is real.

Show him your love and I believe he will come around.:love:

[Karren H]

Because they are embarased.... I wouldn't show my wife!! ever!!!

[shesadvl]

How come when a GG knows about her boyfriend/spouse/livein being a crossdresser, they still feel ashamed. I have told Ruth Ann about how I feel about her dressing, and showed her info all about it not being anything wrong with it, and she still shuts me out. She wants me to have very little to do with it.

I know, I know I need to give her time to adjust that someone knows about it, and also give her time to get used to the idea of someone knowing. But how much time does she need?

Donna

Donna she just maybe has not caught up with how she is with being comfortable. as who and how she is... there should be no shame if you know... and your partner knows that you are supportive..., its no secret, any longer,..... perhaps you need to sit her down and talk... communication is everything....and allay any fears that he as himself or ruth ann has...... the not wanting you to have anything to do with it... any explanation???

Part of the knowing is the sharing and understanding... but then in reading what some of the others have said perhaps patience.. but as you say how long...perhaps make a dinner invite ruth ann..see what happens...

Does your partner read in the forum and see what we as GG's say being supportive ...they are the one and same person no matter how they dress in drab or enfemme., sometimes our loving CD'ers,... enfemme hasnt caught up with their guy side ...so that they are totally relaxed in being dressed in front of you so I guess if she hasnt accepted herseslf as he is in guy mode or enfemme mode,...that the two are happy being the one and same person,... paitence is a virtue as well as I see your good understanding... there are some great people in here with sound and good advice....:hugs:

wish you all the best in sharing in your partners/bf crossdressing he should be elated that you are supportive and willing to share in this with him.:battingeyelashes:


geeze you guyz laffing... dont you read public profiles... n if i get smacked for this...then oi got bigger shoulders n horns for it....:devil:

About decoratorpro
Donna
Biography
I am a GG who is 41 years of age. I have two wonderful kids.
Location
Atlanta Georgia area
Interests
Cooking, cookouts, swimming, outdoors, helping with cd'ers and dogs. Open to just about anything
Occupation
cake decorator

... sits on hands n hiney see if tamara will spank me....lol :angel:


Because they are embarased.... I wouldn't show my wife!! ever!!!


why not karen... I think yer georgeous ...lol:battingeyelashes: but then I dont mean that would be a threat to your wife I bet you are both a good looking couple....:battingeyelashes:


but then I do read your posts.... as does my partner....:battingeyelashes:

[allisonrn06]

While I have very little trouble dressing in front of my wife, I stiil feel a little strange about it sometimes. I think it has to do with having been completely in the closet so long, it still seems weird being able to dress in front of someone else. The feeling has faded alot over the past couple of years, but I still sometimes want to jump out of my shoes when I'm dressed and hear her coming down the stairs - guess old habits die hard!

[deja true]

Lotsa great answers here, Donna...

Most of us still have a problem with the shame or embarrassment factor...but...

We've gotta learn to get over it , I guess.

Maybe, in calm converstation, you might bring up the idea that if your partner is so reticent to share this with you (even though you already know) that maybe there's something else that might be the real problem(that seems to be an even bigger hurdle to get over).

That's a scary thought, but if there's not, it might be all the impetus your honey needs to open up to you. I sure hope that's the case!

:)

[Kate Simmons]

There is a great fear of potential diminished capacity as a man in the eyes of their SO by many. As was brought out by others, this is conditioning by the expectations of society for that particular role. The hardest part it seems is being enough of a man to become a "woman". Once we transcend that barrier we have the real freedom to be ourselves.:)

[Stephanie Michelle]

For me my wife of 21 years has known fron the begining. It is just between us and no one else knows I think. She is OK with it and has even participated in shopping and helping with my make up. BUT, there is always a 'BUT'. Sometimes when she gets mad at me she will use the CDing as a threat against me but assures me that it doesn't bother her. I have felt uncomfortable getting totally dressed around her the last few years and have been dressing when I can when she is not home. She knows this and doesn't say much unless I doen't get things done around the house. It is a tough way to live not sure which to share or hid it from her.

Stephanie Michelle

[JulieC]

I've given my husband 21 years and he still hasn't let me see him fully en femme. I honestly don't know what else I can say or do to get him to trust me with her. I know others will say it's because he still isn't fully accepting of it all, but geez. In my mind, he must not trust me still after all this time. It hurts.

It should. I am in your husband's shoes a bit. I don't have a rational explanation for it. It's emotional, and emotions have nothing to do with logic and trust doesn't always speak the same language either.

Last night, my wife was out for a few hours. I got the kids to bed, and after half hour or so to make sure they were asleep, I dressed up. Nothing fancy, just heels, hose, blouse and skirt. I spent about an hour like that. My wife calls and lets me know she's on the way home. This isn't and never has been a warning from her so I can get de-femmed.

My reaction? I took off the heels, skirt, blouse, put on a t-shirt and left the pantyhose on. She came home to me like that, we chatted for a few minutes, I then needed to leave the room for a minute and on the way out she says "<big smile>Hey...you look really great in pantyhose!" She's seen me in pantyhose a hundred times if she's seen me once. This sort of compliment should give me all the confidence in the world to be dressed en femme in front of her.

But, though I do dress up completely in front of her from time to time, it's not common. When I do, I feel awkward.

SB.GG, it's not trust. It really isn't. It's an internal struggle that has nothing to do with you.

I can easily imagine the scenario in his own mind being "I love her so much, need her so much in my life. She knows, and that's enough. I don't have to show her myself all dressed up. I don't want to lose her, and I must be the man she married and all that entails. I'm a husband, not a wife."

[SouthernBelle.GG]

SB.GG, it's not trust. It really isn't. It's an internal struggle that has nothing to do with you.

My husband has told me as much. Unfortunately, I'm human and stupid doubts fog my mind at times. :doh:

But still, 21 years! Like the movie...Something's gotta give.

[Deedee Dupree]

for both of you.

But still, 21 years! Like the movie...Something's gotta give.

Well hun, It could be worse, some take it to the grave, some don't make it. You have given patience a new def. I hope she will find a way for both of you...

dd

[decoratorpro]

Thank you all for the positive advice, comments, and help.

I, of course, am the GG. I know it has already been answered. I need to get one thing clear though. Ruth Ann is not my husband. We have been seeing each other since Sept of last year, after a couple of months, she moved in with me. We are not married. We have not exchanged any I Love You's. I really don't know if he loves me or not. We get along great, we have some great times together, but we never exchange I love yous.

I found out about her cd'ing about 3 months ago. She didnt like it to much because she has been in the closet for so long by herself. And when I discovered it, she wasn't dressing at the time, and hadn't for several months. She has told me that she felt akward about me knowing, because of her being in the closet for so long. She has dressed fully, wig, makeup, dress, heels, and breast, twice in front of me, both times we went out. I have assured her and assured her that there is nothing wrong with what she is doing, and I think she knows that now. The two times I have seen her fully dressed was the first two weeks I found out. Since that time, I've only seen her with toenail polish, and heels. Everytime I see her dressed to any degree, I tell her she needs to dress all the way. I enjoy seeing her fully dressed. She just says ok, but never does.

No she is not on this site, and I doubt she will. She has just totally claimed up after being on another site, where she found me talking about her and got upset, nothing bad, just didnt want me discussing her at all with anyone.

I think she is just totally in the closet and does not want me to join her. I will be chatting with her later about how I feel, prolly writing an email, cause I'm not good with words out of my mouth, just on paper.

I am gonna try and get her to join this site, it is much better than the other one. So much positive outpouring of the souls.

Thanks again for all the great advice and comfort.

Donna

[Deedee Dupree]

Thank you all for the positive advice, comments, and help.

I, of course, am the GG. I know it has already been answered. I need to get one thing clear though. Ruth Ann is not my husband. We have been seeing each other since Sept of last year, after a couple of months, she moved in with me.

Donna

You should have pointed that out from the begining. I'm done with your threads.

[decoratorpro]

You should have pointed that out from the begining. I'm done with your threads.

Sorry you feel that way. I actually thought I did point that out. Sorry for any confusion.

Donna

[mklinden2010]

Donna,

Thank you for your post, your posts.

Looks like you came across something that he was trying to keep private and his response is like unripe fruit - hard, unyielding, not ready. Given more time and experience he may come to accept and enjoy being Ruth, "during Ruth time" and himself, his other self, just as much the rest of the time.

Along the way, speaking as a GG cannot, a man needs to decide what it takes to be a man and if he's up for it. Your guy may be working out who and what he is and what he can commit to. Be aware that he may be unsure enough of his experience in life to to mistrust your support of something he's not sure of himself: "Does she think supporting this will make me love her?" A man wants to be sure that he makes his OWN choices so that he can be proud to live with them. "I may have screwed this up. But, I screwed it up better than anyone else could have!"

Men are very emotional creatures. Make no mistake about that. Rouse them to battle and they will go to their deaths with a full heart. Touch them where they are tender, as with a sick child's unhappiness, and they will weep, then cross mountains to help that child. They are encouraged to be rational problem solvers, encouraged in many ways, but the point is they have to be shaped and trained lest they give in too easily to the same emotions everyone, men and women, have.

Your problem may be that you are dealing with neither a man or a woman. You may be dealing with a boy or a girl. Or, you could be dealing with some combination of boy/women/girl/man. Be wise in considering what you are getting out of this relationship. It is not your problem to "fix" this person so that they, then you, can be happy. Consider where YOU are, and what YOU want, and see where you need to go and who you need to be with to be happier. Your friend there may just not be ready to be happy with someone at this time. If they're not ready, they're not ready. Move on if you need to...

Thank you again for your posts. I don't think every woman involved with a crossdresser or TG person winds up with this situation, but it's common enough. I'm sorry you've bumped into this but let it be a learning experience. We only get better by living, learning, and doing better.

Good luck.

[TSchapes]

I'm confused are you the GG or the CD?

Click on her profile, then click on the tab marked, "About Me". That should keep things straight (so to speak)!

-Tracy

[Tamara Croft]

You should have pointed that out from the begining. I'm done with your threads.Donna doesn't need to point it out, it's quite CLEAR in her profile, had you bothered to read it. It is also quite clear in the first post, had those that are 'confused' read it properly. DD, don't be so rude... being done with ones threads because you didn't read it right, is just lame :thumbsdn:

[alexis GG]

Sorry you feel that way. I actually thought I did point that out. Sorry for any confusion.

Donna

You did point it out clearly in here and in your welcome thread... but as Tamara says some people cannot be arsed to read things right

[Deedee Dupree]

Donna doesn't need to point it out, it's quite CLEAR in her profile, had you bothered to read it. It is also quite clear in the first post, had those that are 'confused' read it properly. DD, don't be so rude... being done with ones threads because you didn't read it right, is just lame :thumbsdn:

I was never the least bit in doubt about Donna being a GG.. and if you had read my responses to Donna in this thread that would be clear to you. My gripe is not pointing out at the start that the relationship is relatively short term and other important characteristics, that changes the dynamics enough to have to alter my comments.

The issue/problem is trust. In my view trust is something that is earned and develops over the long term...especially if it's to be mutual. IOW, it's possible for a CD to be fairly accepting of self but very cautious about sharing too much until he is sure it's safe to share the most sensitive/intimate details.
I have to consider this possibility as a complicating factor. The "shutting out" may be more than just internalized transphobia.

You are right about my comment being rude. I appologize to the OP for my impulsive remark... I will step away from the forums for a while.

[Carin]

There is a thread in the Loved Ones forum titled "I get confused" that has insights into this behavior. Rather than repeat my response, see it here regarding the Fantasyland of the closet vs the Reality of someone else knowing.

[Fab Karen]

But still, 21 years! Like the movie...Something's gotta give.
21 years? Time to sit down with a therapist. Walking on eggshells for a lifetime is not living.

[Patricia1]

We all come wrapped in different packaging. Self-confidence & self-assurance are behaviors that are years in the making & very vulnerable. Clearly your SO has a vision of you & him and no one else. Maybe he fears losing you if "she" comes into the picture. We always talk about borders in CD/SO relationships. If this is a border he does not not wish to cross, you should honor the request.

[5150 Girl]

My ex didn't care for my CDing one little bit.
While my new SO seems to be acepting, (almost enthusiastic) I'm just a little gun-shy if I may use that term.
I'm so used to having to keep to myself, I don't know what's ok, and what's going to far.

[sometimes_miss]

Decorator Pro, most people don't like to have their very personal lives talked about by other people. As kids, guys were told that under no circumstances were we to ever 'kiss and tell', or discuss our intimate relationships with anyone else; yes, a few guys do just that to brag about their sexual conquests, but most of us were trained to keep our mouthes shut tight. As we get older and find out that women discuss us amongst yourselves in detail, it can be very disconcerting. My guess is that your SO might be very upset that you are talking about him to other people, especially about something that he's probably tried very hard to keep secret for so long.

Southern Belle, all I can say is that after my wife found out about me, she supposedly tried to understand and accept it a bit. But the horrified look on her face when she finally saw me dressed up changed everything. I suppose that until then, she could always remain at least a little in denial, for whatever reason she needed to. But sometimes having to face it in reality pushes some people over the edge. I'm guessing your husband knows this, and wants to avoid any disasters. Like 5150 girl, my ex told the therapist we were seeing that she was trying to accept it; but as time went on, she admitted she hated the crossdressing and everything about it. It's very hard to know how much we can 'get away with'.

[Nicki B]

SB.GG, it's not trust. It really isn't. It's an internal struggle that has nothing to do with you.

And people rubbish this idea of 'internalised transphobia'. So, what else should we call this behaviour? :strugglin

[kynw08]

I've recently voluntarily come out to a couple of GG friends again, and was seen(and made up) by the girl who's been helping me(also happens to be an ex I've crossdressed during....ummm "intimate time" with). It was awkward even with her to be just kyndal around her, not her bf, not any sexual connection. I told these people that I trust immensley, and controlled how and what they found out, and am/was still terrified by it. Give him time and don't push to hard......a gentle nudge may move him out of his shell, but the shove will initiate the immediate clam up reaction.

[darla_g]

Donna,
i think this is fabulous that you took the initiative to find out about CDing and embrace your SO's desires. I think if you read any number of stories you will see that is not the case. It seems she(he) is just uncomfortable and does not realize how good they have it. Believe me there are a large number of people that are not in that situation, but would love to be. For me having a partner to really embrace my dressing was really a special thing. Its great to have someone like yourself on this site.
Darla

[curse within]

How come when a GG knows about her boyfriend/spouse/livein being a crossdresser, they still feel ashamed. I have told Ruth Ann about how I feel about her dressing, and showed her info all about it not being anything wrong with it, and she still shuts me out. She wants me to have very little to do with it.



I know, I know I need to give her time to adjust that someone knows about it, and also give her time to get used to the idea of someone knowing. But how much time does she need?

DonnaFor me it was years of supression...I was always in denial about my dressing and never wanted to share it with anyone..I am to this date ashamed of my crossdressing..