discrimination with employment

[sheridan]

Ok, this is mostly just to get something off my chest, but please feel free to comment. So I recently decided to transition and although I havent started HRT yet I have done things to make myself more comfortable, such as growing my hair out, clothing (usually just t shirt and jeans) I get the ocassional comments by some people (young men and old men who havent grown up) its rare but I roll with it. The problem I am having is finding work. I know times are tough but people are hiring. So far Ive been to 1 interview in 4 weeks and had a few quick interviews. Its always the same, we are interested and well give you a call. Or we want to get people working by tommorow so well call you. So far nothing no return calls, no job offers after the interview. Which In my experience if I get an interview I get a job. The one I went to a few days ago had me very hopeful. The lady wanted to hire me, went so far as to show me the workplace, pay, uniform everything. She said she would call me by Thursday and to feel free to give her a call anytime if I had questions. So I call friday and shes not available and I should call later, I call later and she just went home but theyll tell her I called again. I call the next day and shes busy again and I should call later, I call later and she is not working today. So basically I can take a hint, I knew I didnt have the job. Its just so infuriating, I hate being lied to and told I have a job or made to believe I have a job. Money is running out and I dont know what to do. I go to interviews in male attire (pants,dress shirt). But still...so do I have to cut my hair short, put on 50 pounds just to get a job? I know I cant prove discrimination. Anyway I just had to share because Im frustrated,scared, and disgusted. I know its something I have to deal with and I do but I still need to support myself. Eventually money will run out and then who knows what will happen. Thanks for listening and any advice is appreciated.

[kimkat]

Sorry I can not offer any help or advice. All I can offer is hope that something will turn up soon. Hang in there.


:hugs:

[Saika]

Its real tough at times finding work. I tried for like a year and a half and just have given up for awhile...

Hold in there sweetie, I hope something changes for the better soon :hugs:

[Empress Lainie]

I have been out of work for over 2 years since I was fired by a tranny hater that didn't even know me but had the authority based on two complaints by new people who didn't know me either that I said I was transgendered and was wearing a skirt and wig. I wore the wigs for 7 years before.

I worked for the census bureau for a month as a gg. But that is all the work they had.

My EEOC suit won't get to court until I'm 80.

Sheridan get hold of your local EEOC office and file some complaints. They are not allowing discrimination of tg or TS people.

I apply for jobs as female, but can't hide my age if they want to know when I graduated and all my employment history.

[Andy66]

It's hard to tell why you weren't hired. You probably shouldn't have to cut your hair if you keep it in a neat pony tail. If you REALLY think that's the deciding factor though, you might want to cut your hair temporarily. Good thing hair grows back.

[sheridan]

I dont go out in a overly femm. manor although I do have femm. mannerisms, most people just assume Im gay when Im forced to wear mens clothing. I put in a application for a job as a chef and they were doing interviews that day, they interviewed everyone except me, so I know its not 100% in my head. I dont believe it has anything to do with my hair as alot of men have long hair and I dont apply for jobs where I have to deal with the public directly(typically I work in a closed kitchen or in some sort of shipping/receiving. If I was applying for say sales positions I could see why some people wouldnt want to hire me as they are entitled to portray a certain image. Its just hard and I know that I dont have nearly as much trouble as some who have transitioned fully.The bad thing is you cant really prove discrimination because they can just say we had better applicants. Just like I cant prove discrimination when I apply for a job at a Japanese/Mexican/etc... rest. and they say they arent hiring to anyone who comes in who isnt the same ethnicity as the restaraunt. Again you cant prove it as they can make up whatever story they want. The other side is who has the time and money to file a discrim. suit? I can use that time to find a job believe me Ive thought about it, especially when you can hear managers making comments as you fill out an application. Thanks for the support :)

[Andy66]

I hope you will find an employer who can appreciate you. I'm an office lady who had to take a job at Wal-Mart because it was so hard to find work in my preferred field... but to my surprise, I kind of like it. Plus they taught me to drive heavy lifting equipment like a scizzor lift and forklift. Soooo fun! Sometimes you have to take what you can get, but it may turn out better than you think. Good luck.

BTW, I'm originally from Riverside too. Small world.

[noname]

I've been in the same situation your in. These are my thoughts and interpretations. If hair length was important and they liked you, they'd hire you and tell to cut it. I cut my hair once for a job interview, it made no difference and was not hired. As far as discrimination goes, one place told me they were specifically looking to hire women and minorities. So it does occur, and really you don't want to work for those places, your better than that.

Now, you may want to try what I call, the long shot. If you have a professional background, and you have an interview with a major national company, go dressed as a female. Many of these large corporations have strict policies and diversity.

[Mariah]

I was told Flat out buy unempolyment that I can not get a job in WV.

nice hu.

Mariah

[joanlynn28]

I find my self in a similar situation as yours. I came out to my employer almost three years ago and two years ago this March I informed them that I was going full time and was taking a week off and when I returned I was living and working as myself now. Well things were going smoothly or so I thought. My supervisors and HR person were very supportive and intervined when necessary when certain people failed to address me or treat me like any other woman in the company. They even had a former female coworker move into my work area to keep me company. Any way over time things change my supervisor left the company and the supervisors in my business unit were all rotated around the different departments. There is a GLBT affinity group within my company and I was getting involved with it to start a satelite chapter in my division which is when things turned for the worse. In the end of last year 2008 my work area was being moved to a different location, during many planning meetings one particular engineer would tend to address me as he and continuely did this to me. Finally when I last did this to me in March I attempted to correct him because I was fed up with being addressed as the wrong gender. In the act of doing so this male engineer accused me of hitting him when all I did was place my hand on his shoulder to get his attention because he was purposely ignoring me and reported this to his supervisor. As a result I was placed on administrative leave pending an investigation and was told after being away from work that I could return to work only under the condition that I take a anger management course and also be under a final written warning for violating company policy of intimidating or threatening another employee as well as ignoring company safety rules. This inspite of me being the area safety representative for my department. Anyway I refused to sign the company's letter because I did not hit the guy and was not going work with this dark cloud over my head, there are people at my old employer that would have used these conditions to see me get fire. The result is I was terminated for not signing the letter and the company instead let me take it as a volantary quit, at least I am getting unemployment for the time being. So I took my loses cashed out my 401K of dimenising returns and went to Thailand and had my surgery. So now I am a much happier person, all my legal paper matches my gender and no one ever needs to know that I was once male. It was time to leave the industry I was in, it was dirty, noisey, and no place for a woman. So now I am looking for a career more suited for the woman that I am. Moved to a new city and state and am hoping to find a new career, a significant other and live the rest of my life happier. That is all I want.

[Marissa Anne]

There should be an employment section on this website for people looking and people hiring. We girls need to stick together. There have to be a few of us who are hiring...I just wish I was hiring in the U.S. and not just in Canada. But we need to network and get a grapevine going!

Marissa Anne

[CrossdressinGoth]

Sorry to hear about this happening to you.

Only thing is, certain companies and certain states protect tg and ts workers. Example being almost 1 year ago I simply got fired for being a crossdresser. I explained to them my situation with it not being just crossdressing, and that I was honestly in the steps to start going full time and transitioning. Things went well for a week and I started dressing full time in a wig and everything. After 1 1/2 weeks doing this full time I was fired from my job. In the state of Wisconsin a person in not protected under the equal employment oppertunity things. Simply being open about being gay, bi, or transgender, and you are not legally protected in this state.

I did however get a job at Wal-Mart in which I dress full time at and I am a front end supervisor. Wal-Mart has protections of its employees to not permit discrimination reguardless of being apart of the glbt or not. That is one thing I honestly like about my job.

Again these are just things that I know of, not sure how the laws are in your state but I know for certain in the state of Wisconsin you are not protected from discrimination because this is considered gender identity and Wisconsin does not recognize this as a protection in the EEO or even state laws for any sort of crime. Sad but all we can do is try to get through this and get rights we should rightfully have.

Hang in there dear, something will turn up for you. :hugs:

[Melissa A.]

Most states have Right-to-Work or Employment-at-will statutes that make it very hard to prove discrimination when you are let go. The irony is, the bigger the company you work for, the better chance you have of being protected by the company itself. Partially because most large corporations tend to be ahead of the curve on proggressive hiring and employee treatment policies(at least on paper), and partially because they don't want any bad publicity. For all of Wal-Mart's bad publicity, I have heard over and over that they are very good when it come to LGBT employment practices. I told the one of the EAP's that work with my company that I was TS over a year ago. She got back to me and told me that they said they will support me and not tolerate any harrassment. I still have not come out at work, though I am full time all other times. I am much more concerned, actually, about the guys I work with, than the company. I recently transfered and simply wanted to lay the groundwork-that I know what I'm doing and I'm easy to get along with, before I came out. Actually, very little will change. I'll still come to work in jeans, workboots and a t-shirt, and I'm certainly not going to wear makeup to move freight cars around a railyard! But since I am changing my first name, and the initial is not the same as my given name, I must let everyone know, soon. I also just feel it's the right thing to do. It does help that I'm a union member. It just adds a bit of added security to the knowledge that I cannot be fired for this. But make no mistake-the fact that my company will be fine with this is more than made up for by the male-dominated industry I work in. I like people, am friendly and outgoing, and get along with everybody, pretty much. But that might change! However, I have found that you can't really underestimate people, the folks you think may be intolerant as hell, will many times surprise ya. And I do live in NYC, where people are much more used to things like this. It's still going to be a bit of a challenge, I think.

Hugs,

Melissa :)

[Miss M!]

I'm just curious as to why you think being TG is the reason you didn't get any of those jobs. I'm sure there are lots of people out there in the same situation that you are, who have gone on interviews that looked promising only to not get hired, only they're not tg. I know it's cliche, but these are tough economic times for everyone.

I'm a lot like you - almost every job that I've interviewed for I've gotten, but I'm sure it would be a lot harder for me to get one now because of the economy. That doesn't mean that I'm going to cry race discrimination every time because I'm Mexican and THAT must be the only reason I didn't get what I wanted. Maybe a more qualified applicant came along after you did. Maybe it was someone who had the same qualifications, but asked for a lower rate of pay. You never know.

By crying "discrimination" without knowing for sure that's what happened, you're just making yourself a victim and setting back your cause. Now, if the interviewer was acting put out and uncomfortable around you during your time there I might think differently. But, the fact that you stated she showed you around and discussed all those things with you about the job leads me to believe she was very comfortable with the thought of hiring you, and something else must have happened.

Believe me, I know how hard it is to need to find a job and not be able to locate one. I'm sure it's even more stressful when you're worried about the integration of your female and male times in your everyday life, and how things overlap (like with your hair). Don't add to that by making it more than it has to be though. It's too easy to slap a label on yourself and place all the blame there. You'll just make yourself miserable.

[Veronica_Jean]

I changed jobs in December of last year. I am not full time but I am over 50 and I have had hair in a pony tail past my shoulders for years.

When I came out to my new employer, they have been very receptive and helpful. I have not gone full time yet and I am trying to coordinate all this with my company so it works out the best it can for all of us.

I know the job market is really bad because my daughter has been looking for 3 months with nothing in sight. She was suddenly left holding the bag when her husband decided he wanted to be free and left her and the kids with little at best. She has a good work history and is still finding it difficult to find anything... anywhere.

Just hang in there and don't let your fears creep into your mind that they are holding your looks against you. I suspect it is just a tough job market where there are 100 people for 1 job.

Veronica

[luvSophia]

Having recently sat on the other side of the interview table for the first time I found out a few things. The first is that there are a LOT of people applying for jobs they're not qualified for. I had to quickly find ways to whittle down the list of applicants. And none of those ways had anything to do with discrimination of any sort, unless the inability to spell check is actually a disability I didn't know about. I'm sure some perfectly acceptable candidates got weeded out in the process. And in my experiences, from both sides of the hiring desk, appearance does matter. That's your first impression and you only get one shot to make it. Sure, we all know that your hair doesn't have anything to do with the ability to do a job. But if two otherwise equally qualified people apply for a job and one shows up neatly groomed, has a fresh hair cut and is wearing a suit and tie while the other is casually dressed with long hair, which do you think is going to have made a better impression on the person doing the hiring? Where I work no one actually wears a suit, it's strictly business casual, but when I interview someone and they've obviously put in the extra effort and time to make sure their appearance is top notch then I get the feeling in my mind (right or wrong) that they'll also put that extra effort into doing their job.

Something else I found was that I simply didn't have the time to follow-up with people that didn't make the cut. When I first started interviewing I made sure that I sent an email to each applicant, thanking them for their interest and letting them know their resume had been received. I know how I felt the last time I was job hunting, the anxiety over not knowing what was going on. And it pained me to eventually just focus on the people that were going forward in the hiring/interview process, but I simply got overwhelmed. After all, I have a regular job to get done and I was interviewing people because I already had too much on my plate.

[Siobhan Marie]

Sheridan, sorry to hear that you're having a tough time finding work sis, something'll turn up soon.

I work in security and I won't be transitioning with my current employer because I live in fear of my boss (who I don't get on with) trying to find a way to get rid of me. I know he can't, but if he can get of me then he will. To be totally honest, I want out of security and work in a job where I can transition without having to live in fear of being fired for being TS.
:love: :hugs::hugs::hugs:

[VeronikaDonahue]

There should be an employment section on this website for people looking and people hiring. We girls need to stick together. There have to be a few of us who are hiring...I just wish I was hiring in the U.S. and not just in Canada. But we need to network and get a grapevine going!

Marissa Anne

I agree, that if we could find a way to stick together, things would be a teency bit easier. However, with the economic times being the way they are, it is definately tough. I just recently found a job, it wasn't my first choice, but apparently it is my only choice. I too have had several interviews, and always got the same reply "We will call you tomorrow, or I think you will be a good fit, I just need to get with our HR dept". Years ago, I got any job I applied for (within reason of course), just by simply filling out an application. Now, if you don't have that little tag on your resume that says you have a MS, BS etc, most companies don't want to look at you. Why do we get judged on what a piece of paper says, instead of what we can actually do? It sickens me, to know that we as a society are no longer people, but pieces of paper. I have alot of undocumented experience, and I let potential employers know that, and in some cases prove it even, and still nothing. I hope all works out for you, as I was in your shoes recently.

[Melissa A.]

There should be an employment section on this website for people looking and people hiring. We girls need to stick together. There have to be a few of us who are hiring...I just wish I was hiring in the U.S. and not just in Canada. But we need to network and get a grapevine going!

Marissa Anne

http://www.tjobbank.com/

It's not perfect and it's fairly new(a little over a year, I think), but it looks like it may be helpful to some.

Hugs,

Melissa :)

[Marissa Anne]

http://www.tjobbank.com/

It's not perfect and it's fairly new(a little over a year, I think), but it looks like it may be helpful to some.

Hugs,

Melissa :)

This is excellent! It should be part of a LGBT hiring portal but I definitely see why there are unique issues related to TG hires...I'd say we're the least accepted of the least accepted.

Marissa

[sheridan]

I'm just curious as to why you think being TG is the reason you didn't get any of those jobs...

filling out an application where they are conducting on-site interviews, after turning in the application being told they would call me, and they arent interviewing anyone at this time. Mean while people who applied for the same position are getting or waiting for interviews along with dozens of other applicants.

Having one interview with a manager who wants to hire me and tells me I have to interview with the GM but its just a formality. Go into the interview with the GM, where he takes a brief look and tells me there was some mistake and theres no position available

seeing a help wanted sign and seeing other applicants come out with applications. I go in to get an application and they are all out, I come back around the area again and I see people getting applications.

filling out an application and hearing things like "your not going to hire that f'ing homo are you?" from another room when they think I cant hear.

I dont scream discrimination at every situation that comes up, Ive never sceamed discrimination at anything (except for this time because Im just venting and if you notice I dint say which companies I had bad experiences with), I dont complain to management or file lawsuits. I know its the way of the world. Im not stupid either Ive faced discrimination numerous times, restauraunts are highly discrimninatory businesses, so Im used to it. Im just venting thats all. Yes there are people more qualified or who are willing to work for less or thousands of other reasons I didnt get jobs. But there are times when its pretty obvious.

As far as someone not getting a job because they have long hair as opposed to short is ludicrious if that was the case no women would have jobs. I dress well, I know how to apply for a job, as a matter of fact I laugh when I see these kids applying in shorts and caps. Yes going around applying like you want the job is key no matter what the job is (although applying for a Burgerking Job in a $3000 suit is overkill and may actually hurt your chances) Its funny when I was 200# and masculine I could get a job in my industry within a week, even in a bad economy or with places that arent hiring just because of my experience. Now I have to fight just to get an application.

[Marissa Anne]

Some sad and troubled stories here. I forget sometimes that I'm lucky to be in Vancouver, BC and in the tech business where I think there is a lot of acceptance. Vancouver is like San Francisco...we have openly gay city councillors, legislators, and members of parliament (city/state/fed). Our Pride celebration is the second largest in Canada with 600,000 people at yesterday's parade.

If you don't like gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgender people, Vancouver is not your town.

It's unfortunate that not everyone lives in an inclusive place or works in an industry or workplace that can accomodate us. My only advice is if you're in such a town, find a way to get out and go somewhere more sensible. Vancouver is nice :). You just can't bring your guns with you, and you have to suffer with universal health care. Sorry.

Marissa

Marissa

[Nicole Erin]

It is kind of hard to know whether or not places will discriminate against TG.
IN Colorado, I had a couple TS friends, one had worked at Walmart but got fired over something that had nothing to do with being TS. Another one was a well qualified electronics tech that could not get a job after going full time.
Both of them "passed" on about the same level except the one who could find a job had a better attitude and the voice was a bit more "there".
The one who worked at Walmart soon got a job as an SA at Target. Ok, not big time by any means but it was work.

I do not live full time yet so I don't really know much about it.
I would assume the better pulled together a TS is the less likely being TS would be an issue. Part of being pulled together is having a decent voice and attitude.

My last job, I was part of the big layoff. They knew I was TG. I think though the main reason I got laid off with the others is cause my attendance was shaky. I was discriminated against cause I like to sleep in. :heehee: