CDing Vs. Control

[Ballerina]

I was in therapy today, and my counselor had brought up Sally. A bit shocking, she normally doesn't. But, she had a theory... it's one that I've thought of in the past, but she had done a lot more "math" than what I have in the past.

I live with very controlling parents, specifically my mom.. Every day I feel trapped within my own home, and never feel free. My therapist is thinking that I may be using my CDing as a way to free myself from the control. You can even see how much my family influences me in my story "Locked in the Heart" (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114462).

Now, I'm not quite sure of myself.. I feel like I just had a huge part of me questioned. I've always thought of Sally as another part of me that I embraced on my own, not out of a need for personal freedom from my parents' hell. I mean, I started my CDing life by questioning what it would have been like growing up as a girl, rather than a boy; however, I feel Sally is an extension of my own feelings, rather than a separate person.. I feel so mixed up, and I would hate to think that this huge part of me was just built upon my need to be freed from my parents.. I would hate to know that everytime I dress, it's because of the controlling past of my parents...

Any help, suggestions, advice? Thanks.

[Wen4cd]

What's wrong with needing to be freed from your parents? Even with 'good' parents, it's a perfectly human, natural thing to eventually want to be free of them. It's normal.

I've asked myself the same question, if I understand you: "Did I create 'Her' as a coping mechanism? And if She's a construct, how can She be a real part of me?"

This is a big question, and in it lies the paradox. THE Paradox. The only way is to live in the eye of it. She's real, she's really you, and you can't make her die with logic, yet this particular 'form' she takes may have been created by you. Just remember you're the same person. She made you just as much as you made her.

The little film in my signature speaks heavily on this question (the "123cry" link) The filmmaker had exactly this question in mind when he made it, and though it's tragic, the real tragedy can be avoided, if you avoid it.

Believe me, I've cried long and hard over this question, stayed up nights pacing the floor over this question, and screamed to the sky over this question. It's not an easy one to frame.

[ashcrimson]

Sally, I dont know you very well but I dont think this woman in you was just created by you to feel some sort of release from your parents control. I mean, you couldve simply moved out you know... ... I dont think you have to do soemthing this big for that. But who knows still. I guess the only one who can answer this is you. Sally just try not to think too hard about it and try to feel it more. You know... what matters is if this makes you happy, doing this, its not necessarily the initial motivation behind it... there are good things that sometimes comes from bad things or mistakes or... its the end that matters, how yuod be at the end

Wen, what you said on the second line... Ive never actually thought of that you know... applied to myself I mean

[Laura Evans]

My parents were not the controlling types, they were very loving and caring so how would your therapist explain my desire to crossdress and wanting to be feminine?

[tricia_uktv]

I agree with Laura. I crossdress because I want to and because I enjoy it. My parents were kind and loving. One thing I do find though is that I feel a lot freer when dressed because I haven't got all the baggage which comes from my male side.

[Greymancd]

The same type of thought came up with my therapist since I was raised in a very controlling fundamentalist belief system. True that may have contributed to the desire to be free but I think the desire to crossdress is fom within and my desire to be free allows me to experience my feminine side.

[Ballerina]

Did I create 'Her' as a coping mechanism?

Yes, that's exactly the question that's going through my head right now. And, if it's true, am I going to hate myself and my parents every time I get the urge to dress...?


My parents were not the controlling types, they were very loving and caring so how would your therapist explain my desire to crossdress and wanting to be feminine?

Umm.. ya, she would look at another reason as to why you dress. She's an awesome therapist, and has helped me out a lot with dealing with other life's issues. She also has had TS friends that have transitioned.

[ReineD]

I feel like I just had a huge part of me questioned. I've always thought of Sally as another part of me that I embraced on my own

Sally, I'm not TG, nor am I a therapist, but your words say it all. They are your true feelings and they are real. Listen to your heart.

[Wen4cd]

Wen, what you said on the second line... Ive never actually thought of that you know... applied to myself I mean

I never did, consciously, either. Not for years and years. But it was always hidden back there somewhere, tearing up my entire life from within.

Then one night after years of blindly dressing, I changed my style, out of boredom, to something I felt might be more 'me,'

....and suddenly I was literally looking in the mirror at the spitting image of an 'imaginary friend' I had when I was 7-12 years old, who got me through some very rough times, and helped me form all of my core values.

I had never realized I was dressing looking for her again, and that she, while now distinct in herself, was actually me as well, and always was. I think my head exploded. I remember vomiting and being "in and out" of reality for a while, weeks, longer. Maybe I'm still in and out of it ever since, lol, but I'm finally becoming truly content.

This revealed the connection which forced the issue and the question, and dealing with that issue has been *the* turning point of my life, and marked the end of the 'mid-life identity crisis' I'd been living in for so many years. That is when I began my studies on the anima and the androgyny of the human psyche, and everything fell into place for me after that - at least until the next big unforseen crisis.

Living in that paradox has become my definition of 'living" heehee. I am become one of those people who is happy to be crazy, thrilled in fact. :D


Yes, that's exactly the question that's going through my head right now. And, if it's true, am I going to hate myself and my parents every time I get the urge to dress...?

I don't. Well, I don't get the same 'urge' to dress anymore. It's done now for therapeutic and constructive reasons, and as a reminder of who and what I am. Once I finally felt 'Her' as her real living presence, and not as a 'thing I dressed-up as," once She became "real," it seemed as though every problem in the external world was put into tiny perspective. It was as if reality shifted and I could see external problems as conquerable goals instead of gigantic mountains, because I suddenly had what I needed. It's freakin' weird. :D

[Satrana]

Your therapist is dealing with a chicken and egg situation. Which came first?

As you know yourself your TG feelings came first. CDs create their alter ego in order to step outside their masculine personality to avoid dealing with the psychological barriers of "wrongness and pervertedness" which is an intrinsic part of the male gender conditioning to demonize femininity. So the origins of Sally is she is a necessary tool to enable you to access your feminine side. However by creating a separate distinct aspect of yourself you have opened the doors to other escapist opportunities. So Sally also becomes a tool to allow you to escape the depressing restrictions your parents impose upon your routine (masculine) personality.

I can relate to your feelings. I stayed with my parents for too long. While they were not overly controlling, their conservative attitudes affected me and made me feel very inhibited. It felt like my personality was being slowly crushed under a heavy weight. CDing and computer games became important avenues of escape where I could find temporary relief from my predicament.

My eventual solution is painfully obvious. Move out! and preferably far enough away that routine contact is no longer possible and where no-one else knows you so that you can restart your life and finally project the real you.

[PaulaJaneThomas]

I was in therapy today, and my counselor had brought up Sally. A bit shocking, she normally doesn't. But, she had a theory... it's one that I've thought of in the past, but she had done a lot more "math" than what I have in the past.

I live with very controlling parents, specifically my mom.. Every day I feel trapped within my own home, and never feel free. My therapist is thinking that I may be using my CDing as a way to free myself from the control.

Your counsellor is clearly an idiot. The truth is that like many males (between 5 and 10%) your gender identity has a dual aspect to it. Like many of the vectors which make up a whole person, gender identity is set in the womb; the "nurture" theory promoted by Money has been totally discredited. You will only harm yourself by listening to that charlatan.

[mklinden2010]

You and your therapist seem to be on good terms - she feels free to bring up ideas and see what you think about them. Nothing wrong with a bit of conversation. It was an idea, not a diagnosis.

The goal of therapy is to help people figure out how to cope well with life - their lives. Much of it is just giving people a handle to use in managing issues in their lives, in their relationships. A "handle" can be an idea, a method, etc.

So, this is your way of getting some control in life? Fine. If you'd prefer joining the football team - to get some time away from home, that might be fine too. It's your life. Find a way to live happy and get on with it. If one thing stops working, try something else.

Freedom is the will and ability to control and guide your happiness.

Do what you gotta do for you.

[Ms Mira]

I'm not sure your therapist is right here. Based on this forum, and everything else I know about myself and others, you don't really need a reason to be CD / TV / TG, and you most often won't find one.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

your counselor is clueless....she just made it up?? this is hurtful and ridiculous

in the end, for her to be right, we would almost ALL have to be wrong, and there is absolutely no evidence that parents cause you to be tg...what a strange way to rebel don't you think?

you really do know in your heart the truth...your counselor is not tg and simply cannot internalize this fundamental concept..just like you find it impossible to feel your are not tg...

your controlling parents are a totally completely different issue, and my guess is they make being tg even more difficult for you...i hope you work things out

take care

[Miss Anthropic]

I grew up with likely the least amount of control possible, so little control maybe social services should've stepped in at times. I mean, it was nothing for me to walk across town at 7 or 8 years old, never had a bed time, never had a curfew. Yet, I dress. not sure I buy that connection.

Maybe I'm just different in general, my sister had the exact same upbringing and ended up messing around with drugs, alcohol and getting pregnant very young; however I do not nor have ever smoked, drank or done drugs.

I think the only thing from my youth that left an imprint on me and dressing is my grandparents being really conservative and religious. Being around them and their way of thinking really left me with a lot of guilt that I still carry to this day.

I dunno..... she's pretty much saying you dress, and have created this seperate persona to cope with your parents, I can't say I've ever heard of anyone who dressed to cope with anything.

[Karren H]

Yeah... That's right! Its always the mothers fault!! I hear that from my wife all the time.... She gets blamed by our children for everything!! Lol.

[cindym5_04]

Honestly, part of my cd'ing continued from where I had intended it to go (halloween and improving until i felt passable) because I found a certain sense of "freeness" or "being outside my normal self" due to the crap that I had to constantly deal with from my mom and sister.

[Wen4cd]

Yeah... That's right! Its always the mothers fault!! I hear that from my wife all the time.... She gets blamed by our children for everything!! Lol.

"While my brother is a Freudian, I am a Jungian! So there will be no blaming mother today!" -Niles Crane

[Karren H]

"While my brother is a Freudian, I am a Jungian! So there will be no blaming mother today!" -Niles Crane

Was that you speaking our did you mother tell you what to type? :D

My mother wasn't controlling but dominate.. As was my grandmother.. Dominating.. Controlling.. Not like I really knew at 7 wtf any of that ment let alone why I needed to escape from it so badly that I had to sneak into her closet and wear her things?

[Wen4cd]

Was that you speaking our did you mother tell you what to type? :D

My mother wasn't controlling but dominate.. As was my grandmother.. Dominating.. Controlling.. Not like I really knew at 7 wtf any of that ment let alone why I needed to escape from it so badly that I had to sneak into her closet and wear her things?

My mother wasn't controlling or dominant, the was total milquetoast. So was my father, at heart, yet they were both cops, so they had to 'put on' this fake command presence they would bring home, which was like an 'act.' This set up a confusion of role reality and a lack of stability, that needed to be coped with one way or the other.

Add to that the fact that I was an extremely sensitive child, and you have a recipe for Fail. I ended up in hospitals, mental wards, on various medications, the whole shebang. My 'Kathy" (which was her name at the time,) saved me from being affected at the core levels, and made the whole thing situational for me, a great favor.

She made me what I am through all of that, and to realize she was really half of me, and not just created for that situation, but for helping me through all of life, was a godsend.

[stevie34]

It's rare in the UK to have a therapist, but I have had two so can hopefully add some helpful insights.

As a kid I was taken to a therapist because I was disruptive. According to him it was all down to foods and artificial additives (I suspect this would have been his answer to everyone). In reality I think I was worried by the lack of anyone close to me following a parental split up. In the end it was a chemistry teacher at school that sorted me out by offering to help me with my handwriting in her own time. I was amazed that a teacher could care so much about me and it changed me around instantly. I can't thank her enough.

Next up was college. Having been transformed by my chemistry teacher I made it into Cambridge University. Everyone else in there had been through private schooling and I found myself way behind when I started. The effort of catching up in the first year drained me and I became tired and down. So off again to the therapist. He reckoned it was all down to my childhood. A Freud follower presumably and I didn't go back. In reality I was really tired, and I just kept at it and did my best. That worked, but I still wonder if I couldn't have done better if I had found techniques to help balance my tiredness against effectiveness. That was before the internet.

So I found both of my therapists both unhelpful and way off the mark. They tend to have fixed ideas which in my experience is unhelpful. Maybe suggest to them they are off the mark might have them suggest other ideas. For me these days the bad times are always down to tiredness and a holiday normally helps a lot. But that's only my own fixed idea.

Coming to the point, don't take their suggestions as the definitive answer. They'll have picked up ideas from their training and it is so easy for them to fixate on them. They are human after all, just like us. They are not gods. Having an organised person to talk to and listen to you is very useful, but if you don't agree then argue the point.

My most recent experience with therapists is having one as a friend. He is the most wonderful sensitive fellow, and I'm forever helping him out with his doubts. Therapists just need a little love just like the rest of us.

[Stephanie Miller]

So.... let me get this right....
Controlling = crossdressing
Manipulative = fishing
Passive = golfing

And if my mother was controlling and my father was passive, and lets throw a manipulative sister in the mix then I would grow up a crossdressing golfer that fishes in my spare time? Explains a lot. Thank her for me. NOT!

Therapist is not on the right track. And if she is trying to make sense of it without doing proper research - maybe you whould do the research for her and get a cut in session cost!

[Ballerina]

I'm finding it quite humerous that so many have strayed away from helping me, to just insulting my therapist. So what if your parents were nice and that doesn't explain why you dress, that's you, and is not helping me in any way. I'm looking to see if what i've said can make sense, and if any have had similar situations and how they've dealt with it.

As for PaulaJaneThomas, that was not just a severe slam on my therapist, but a severe slam on my judgement! :po: You OBVIOUSLY didn't read my later reply!

[ggtracy]

It sounds like your therapist wanted to talk more about this idea because it was something that you had already thought about. therapy is a personal process, the therapist is there to help you figure out how to process/examine things in your own life.


coping mechanisms are real and usually not negative. they are things that you do that help you make it through an uncomfortable/difficult time. they are things that help you find some comfort.

I applaude you for being brave enough to do some inner examination. I wish you the best in this journey.

[ashcrimson]

*removed

sent instead

[Jeanna]

I'm finding it quite humerous that so many have strayed away from helping me, to just insulting my therapist. So what if your parents were nice and that doesn't explain why you dress, that's you, and is not helping me in any way. I'm looking to see if what i've said can make sense, and if any have had similar situations and how they've dealt with it.

I do believe that you are Sally and Sally is you. Unless your Dr concludes that you a schizo,,don't worry about it. I also believe that you need to get away from mommy, be free and discover your life.

Jeanna

[Jonianne]

Sally, I know how you feel. When I was in therapy I felt afraid that I might find out that my crossdressing was caused by something in my life and that I would feel devestated or start questioning myself, like you felt. What I found out was that it is OK to search down every rabbit trail to see where it leads. The reason why the question "Why do I crossdress?" is never answered, is because there is no single reason. It's the comming together of many factors. I think what your therapist may be doing is trying to help you find out what coping mechanisms you use in dealing with your parents control. It could be you are using CD'ing, just like you could be using sports, putting your head in the books in studing, it could be a job. It could be a whole bunch of things, none of which are necessarly bad. Abusing alcohol or drugs is certainly not a healthy way of coping.

Just know that being transgender is a part of your spirit and that will always be with you. You can search any path for unhealthy areas and still know that who you are is not going to change, just get better.

I always remind myself that "others have the right to tell me how they feel, but they do not have the right to tell me how I should be."

[Stephanie Miller]

Do not mistake any humor as not caring. Everyone cares or they wouldn't waste any time talking to you. Also do not just read what is on the surface of posts - go deeper. Inside my humor I was trying to convey a very important message. You stated that your therapist brought up her "theory". Her theory, unless she is well versed in crossdressing, could be misleading your thoughts of who and where you are in this world. If she IS well versed then she may well be trying to lead your thought pattern another direction for you. I, nor does anyone else on this board knows which. What I would like to see is what I expressed in my last few words " you should do the research". Then you will know for yourself if your sessions are on the right track. I know of too many ladies that have gone to "therapy" only to come out totaly screwed up because the "therapist" didn't know squat and was winging it. On the other hand there are many out there that had good and benefited. There is no such thing as too much information. Take care and know that we are on your side.
Steph

[Jamie VieJolie]

I don't think it's as simple as you dress because you have controlling parents. Of course you could move out and see if living on your own creates a change.

And so what if dressing is a coping mechanism. Some people cope with alcohol, gambling and other destructive behaviors. I'd rather just be a woman for a while. Works for me.

[Barbara Dugan]

Your therapist is dealing with a chicken and egg situation. Which came first?

As you know yourself your TG feelings came first. CDs create their alter ego in order to step outside their masculine personality to avoid dealing with the psychological barriers of "wrongness and pervertedness" which is an intrinsic part of the male gender conditioning to demonize femininity. So the origins of Sally is she is a necessary tool to enable you to access your feminine side. However by creating a separate distinct aspect of yourself you have opened the doors to other escapist opportunities. So Sally also becomes a tool to allow you to escape the depressing restrictions your parents impose upon your routine (masculine) personality.

I can relate to your feelings. I stayed with my parents for too long. While they were not overly controlling, their conservative attitudes affected me and made me feel very inhibited. It felt like my personality was being slowly crushed under a heavy weight. CDing and computer games became important avenues of escape where I could find temporary relief from my predicament.

My eventual solution is painfully obvious. Move out! and preferably far enough away that routine contact is no longer possible and where no-one else knows you so that you can restart your life and finally project the real you.

I also relate to the same kind of situations and as always Satrana has very nice observations

[Sally2005]

Another Sally... :-)

Stress can trigger the desire to CD. If your parents are causing you a lot of stress then maybe they do trigger it. However, many people deal with stress in other ways, so why did you choose to CD? I doubt your parents caused you to pick CDing in the first place...but I believe they do cause you stress which causes you to seek some way to escape. Your therapist may be on to something, but its probably not the big answer we're all looking for.

[Ballerina]

I've finally settled my mind down, and have found a good chunk of answers. I took Satrana's advice and found out that the egg came first, not the chicken. In other words, I found that Sally had been born strictly out of curiosity, and possibly genetics; not my parents' need to control my life and abuse my childhood.

When I first started fantasizing about CDing, I had pretty much turned 10, and things were going fairly smooth in my life. My youngest cousin was living with us, and that's where all my parents' frustration and control need was taken out of (like it mattered, she was/is HIGHLY ADHD). Also, it was a summer that I actually had free, and wasn't grounded because of school work. So, things were actually kind of happy for me.

I think the only influence that my parents have had on my CDing is the fact that maybe the walls have been strengthened (not created). I do have to remember that Sally is just an extension to my own feelings, not a seperate entity (I think that goes for just about everyone on this forum).