Fem DL... Not such a good idea

[Rhonda Jean]

A year ago I renewed my drivers license. I was going through a very fem phase at the time. I was spending a lot of time out and about enfemme, and was always concerned about being stopped by the police and presenting a male-looking DL while dressed fem. At the time I was excited about the prospect of having at least an androgenous photo on my DL. I had lost a lot of weight and was pathetically skinny for a guy, but that certainly added to my androgenous look. My hair was longer than it'd been in a long time and was so heavily highlighted it was almost completely blonde. I had my brows waxed the day before and a loose roller set on 2" velcro rollers that morning. I wore subdued makeup and large hoop earrings. No forms, no heels, and no nailpolish, a black deep v-neck top, girl's jeans, and a pendant necklace. Definately the fem side of androgenous.

I was a little anxious wondering if I'd have any problems, but I didn't see how they could stop me. It was all me. Not a disguise. It turned out to be uneventful. The only comment was, "Um...those earrings!". Unexpectedly, the girl doing the pictures took four shots before she got one that we agreed was good. Always before it was just one and done.

The picture turned out very fem. My hair was much more blonde than I realized. The makeup that I thought was subdued was obvious, as were my earrings. I was very excited to have such a feminine photo on my DL, but that excitement was short lived.

Of course, every time I was asked for ID I was presenting male. The first couple of times it was pretty cool to show that girly ID. Then I was asked for a copy of my DL at work. I told them I lost it, and went to get a replacement. They wouldn't do it! They said it was policy to not issue a new DL just because of a "bad picture". I was paniced! I ended up not having to show my DL at work, but other times when I was unwilling to show such a fem ID continued. It remained very uncomfortable for me to be carrying a girly ID as my only means of official identification, and I was apparently stuck with it for 4 years.

Yesterday I decided I'd try a different tactic. I went to the DL bureau and told them I wanted to renew. Couldn't do that either, because it had only been a year. Along with questions like, "What were you trying to do here" and "What were you thinking", this particular lady evidently took pity on me, and really tried to help. She called in to whoever had authority to approve a change and got permission to issue a new DL.

So, after dealing with an official feminine ID for an entire year, I now have a much more usable and comfortable male one. The experience of presenting a feminine ID in male mode was fun at times, but the embarassing times far outweighed them. Some interesting reactions and interactions, for sure. But, in the end, this had been a really bad idea. I'm so glad to be beyond it.

[[alice]]

I was actually thinking of doing this, but now with some insight, I think I'll stick with my blegh male one.:doh:

Thanks for the extremely valuable information!!:hugs:

[Kate Simmons]

Interesting Hon. You are the first person I know of that brought out the potential problems of having a female ID. Not all the peaches and cream it may appear. Thanks for that experience.:)

[Wen4cd]

"Oops, my DL accidentally got, umm... lost... in the shredder."

[JennyS.]

I think it was Kimberly that got an ID while dressed. If I remember correctly, it wasn't a DL, just an ID.

Kimberly... can you refresh my memory? This experience that Rhonda went through coulda been avoided.

Anyway, glad you got through it, Rhonda.

[Rhonda Jean]

I think I remember that thread from Kimberly.

Changing your picture or getting a new DL didn't used to be such a big deal. It probably has to do with "homeland security". I didn't ask (this would have been my next step) but I think that even if you lose your license, they just make a new one from your picture on file. I just happened to get a very helpful person, and it wasn't very busy that day.

When she called to get permission/access to make the new license, she was asking that person if she could look at the older photos so she could see that the fem one was not like previous photos. From that I take it that there's still a fem photo of me somewhere in my DL records.

I also wonder who all has seen that photo. I have friends who are cops, and an unrelated thing involving the police surely caused the local small-town cops to call up my ID on their computer in their car. No telling where that word spread to.

Anyway, it was a lesson. I'm so relieved that I was able to get it changed.

[kimmy p]

I think it was Kimberly that got an ID while dressed. If I remember correctly, it wasn't a DL, just an ID.

Kimberly... can you refresh my memory? This experience that Rhonda went through coulda been avoided.

Anyway, glad you got through it, Rhonda.
\

I live in Indiana and I found out that here it is illegal to have a drivers license and a state ID at the same time. :brolleyes:

[geri-tg.]

Thanks for sharing. I have often thought about changing my picture. Now I think I will leave my male picture in place.

[Sally2005]

...what were you thinking? ;-) Pink fog gets pretty heavy at times and come to think of it, I never considered the possibility of needing in for your male life...although its obvious. I wonder if you could do half of your face in makeup and the other half natural? Would people see the male half or female half? Could be an interesting experiment.

[Kristen Kelly]

I am due to have my drivers license renewed next month, after all the changes in me in the last 4 years, I will be glad to have a pic that looks like me. This pic is of me without the makeup, that is my own hair as for earrings I always have at least a pair of small hoops in. Little difference than my avatair. My new license will still say M, but at least the pic will look like me no matter how I'm dressed. Will post my new DMV pic after I get it taken.

99651,99652

[Andy66]

That's really interesting, and something most people probably don't think about.

[PhillyGuy2Girl]

I don't know about other states but here in PA if you lose your license during the 4 years its valid, PennDot will just issue you a duplicate with the picture you had taken when you last renewed. On it on the top in small letters,it will say "Dup 01" which means its the the first one. If you lose it again, the next one will be "Dup 02" and so on till you renew next time plus its illegal to have a DL and state ID. When you get IDed for whatever reason and they see its a dup, then you have to show a back up which can be a real pain. Even though I drive femme at times, I would keep my male pic on my DL and if I ever get stopped and the Officer asks, I'll be respectful and just tell him or her I'm in the process of transitioning and leave it at that.



Felicity

[Rachel_Red]

I would think that would be a good idea if you were going to CD 24/7 but if not then yah keeping a male ID is probably the best way to go as you stated.

[Faith_G]

I don't know about other states but here in PA if you lose your license during the 4 years its valid, PennDot will just issue you a duplicate with the picture you had taken when you last renewed. On it on the top in small letters,it will say "Dup 01" which means its the the first one. If you lose it again, the next one will be "Dup 02" and so on till you renew next time plus its illegal to have a DL and state ID. When you get IDed for whatever reason and they see its a dup, then you have to show a back up which can be a real pain. Even though I drive femme at times, I would keep my male pic on my DL and if I ever get stopped and the Officer asks, I'll be respectful and just tell him or her I'm in the process of transitioning and leave it at that.



FelicityYep, went through that myself. I used to have a huge beard, and after I shaved it off I always got the hairy eyeball when I had to show ID. I tried to get a new picture when I moved to a new address, but they wouldn't retake it for an address change. I was stuck with that pic until I had to renew my license.

[Karen564]

:thumbsup:
Thanks to your own experiences,

This will hopefully clear away the heavy pink fog that many get into to show the harsh realities of what they thought was a great idea today may & often does create an very uncomfortable situation for them afterwards that also isn't so easily reversed..

So to the ones that do NOT desire or plan on living female 24/7, be very careful for what you wish for, you might just get it.. :straightface:

:hugs:

[sherri52]

The rule of the DL change would be if your not all out stay male. Femme Id calls for 24/7 enfemme

[Rogina B]

Some of us have a state ID for our girl mode.Our license pic is in boy mode. When stopped dressed,you just hand over both and no questions asked. When you are flying pretty,you breeze through security with you pretty ID. When flying internationally,your girl ID becomes your second form of picture ID...no take the wig off embarrassment. However,in the state of Florida,the last pic taken by the DMV is what the officer sees on his computer screen in his car! So,that is why you hand him your ID card when questioned.:2c:

[spiroxlii]

You could always have two forms of acceptable photo ID. One "Bubba" and one "en femme."

Here in GA, you're only allowed to have one DL, of course... but GA also issues a state ID which looks very similar to a DL. It works just as well as a government-issued photo ID, but it doesn't carry driving priveleges. In GA, you're allowed to get both cards (though few people do, because if you have a DL, why do you need a state ID?).

[Maddie]

My license is in male

got stopped once and it was the greatest thing to see the look on the cops face when he saw it. lots of questions but he was polite except for the ticket.

btw i was in the right so i fought the ticket
wanted to see his face when i showed up in drab

he never did make it to court and it got thrown out

ruined all my fun

Maddie

[barbie lanai]

I got a Fem picture on my DL back in 98. Seemed like a good idea at the time, but likewise changed back to a male pic in around 6 months.

[Annie D]

I have a driver's license with my male picture and a state id with my female picture; it has my correct male name and address as it is illegal to falsefy pertanent information. Why don't you go back to the license bureau and get a state id in male mode? Then when asked for identification, you can produce a fairly accurate picture of yourself. State id's are accepted for everything a driver's license is used for. All states should issue them as teenagers below 16 who want to get a job secure them routinely.

Good luck!

[Rachel Morley]

This is an interesting thread. I agree with Anne66 this is something most don't give much thought to - what happens if you have second thoughts or need to show your ID at places like work? I have a male pic on my DL but it's from a time when I was less girly than I am now when in boy mode. I don't think I'll be quite as feminine as you seem to indicate you were, but I do think that when it's time to renew I might femme up a little bit more than my current one with say some eye make up, earrings, and a girls t-shirt. :)

[tricia_uktv]

Isn't it all in the mind and doesn't it depend how far you are out?

[Anna the Dub]

I am changing mine shortly. My original pic is absolutely awful, I look like a convict. This time, with my longer hair, my softer face from the hormones and so on, I expect it to look a lot more like me. However, I still will not be wearing any make up in it, or dangly earrings, just studs. So it will be androgynous, and will more or less reflect how I dress most of the time.

[TJ Tresa]

I think that some states will allow you to have a a dublicate DL. I don't know if they would let you have both a male picture on one and a feminine picture on the other. Might be worth looking into.

[carolinoakland]

sounds like a cautionary tale of the perils of the dreaded PINK FOG ( feel free to use what ever scary voice for the words pink fog!) I'm glad to hear it worked out, I find that a person's demeanor and poise is what people will ALLWAYS remember about a person. Carol

[TxKimberly]

Like others here, I have both - a state drivers license (100% male) and a state ID. The state ID has all of my male information BUT it has my femme pic on it. Since all of the information on it is legal and correct, the ID is 100% legal and proper. In this way, I use my DL for all things male, and my state ID for all things female. It wasn't really needed for anything, but it is a confidence and ego booster.
The catch here is that it is legal in Texas and many other states, but I know for certain that there are some states where you are not allowed to have both at the same time. Do your homework before you go.
It was easy, very little hassle, and no real reason to worry. If your curious, here is the thread on it:
http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103633&highlight=state+ID

[docrobbysherry]

What you're DREADED DL photo looked like!:eek:

Probably no chance of u posting just the picture on it?:brolleyes:

[Rhonda Jean]

It was exactly a case of pink fog. I just didn't know it at the time. I also thought it wouldn't be a big deal to get a new pic if I changed my mind. If I hadn't happened to get a particularly helpful clerk this time, this could have been a real problem. I also didn't realize how fem the pic would turn out. As far a my hair, I lived with the highlights all the time. The roller set was a little much. My eyebrows have become ordinary for me. I didn't think the makeup would even be noticable. The V-neck top didn't seem all that fem when I put it on. The earrings, well... that was just dumb, but I didn't think they'd be that noticable either.

I think this is really an example of things that many of us do in a particularly brave moment, not really thinking of the consequences. We each have our own list. With the exception of getting our ears pierced, it's usually temporary stuff. Everything I did was temporary, too. It was just archived in a very official way, which made it sort of permanent.

Also, at the time I did it I felt like I was moving toward a much more feminine daily appearance. I was quite proud of myself, and happy to carry around what amounted to an official fem avatar. The fun faded pretty quickly, though.

[jenniesweaters]

Thanks for sharing your experience. I think it was a very brave thing to do initially despite the outcome. I wish I were that brave.

Jen

[Karen564]

I think that some states will allow you to have a a dublicate DL. I don't know if they would let you have both a male picture on one and a feminine picture on the other. Might be worth looking into.

In Mass, they keep your latest picture on file until it's time to renew after 4 years, so if you go for a duplicate, it will have the same picture as before, they dont retake pictures, and think most states work that way now for DL's..

That's the whole point of what the OP is warning you about..

As far as state ID's, that all depends on the state..

[RADER]

In Illinois, you can get a State I D card that looks like a drivers License, but
is for I D youse only. It has your picture on it and resembles a license.
You can get this even thougt you have a drilers license. Just a Thought.

[Kitty Sue]

Thanks for the informative post. Very enlightening.

[Rhonda Jean]

What you're DREADED DL photo looked like!:eek:

Probably no chance of u posting just the picture on it?:brolleyes:

I left it at the DL bureau. I hope it's been shredded! At the time I did it, I didn't have any photos on here, and strongly considered posting it. It was really a pretty good photo. About like my avatar, except for the heavy blonde highlights. I don't know what kind of light that is they use on those things, but it made my makeup really stand out. Unfortunately, so did my beard shadow, especially since I wore only regular foundation. it was a good hair day, though. For the first few weeks I WANTED someone, anyone, to ask for ID!

Changing the subject Sherry, but speaking of pictures... Didn't you promise us pictures of you without the mask??? Did I miss them??? I've been anxiously awaiting! You're one of the nicest people on this board,and you're always so complimentary of the rest of us. I wish you'd give the rest of us the chance to get to see the real YOU! It took me years to get up the nerve to post any pictures on here. Now I'm so glad I did. Chicken???:)

[Angel.Marie76]

In Mass, they keep your latest picture on file until it's time to renew after 4 years, so if you go for a duplicate, it will have the same picture as before, they dont retake pictures, and think most states work that way now for DL's..

That's the whole point of what the OP is warning you about..

As far as state ID's, that all depends on the state..

DO you know if Mass will allow us folks to get both the DL and the State ID too? My DL has a bearded pick of me, and my passport does not, so I have at least something to work with, but if I could go in and have the State ID done now it would make my life endlessly easier into the near and distant future.

I know, I know.. I cold just call the RMV, and wait on hold for an hour, and.. blah. ;)

[Karen564]

DO you know if Mass will allow us folks to get both the DL and the State ID too? My DL has a bearded pick of me, and my passport does not, so I have at least something to work with, but if I could go in and have the State ID done now it would make my life endlessly easier into the near and distant future.

I know, I know.. I cold just call the RMV, and wait on hold for an hour, and.. blah. ;)

I never looked into getting the state ID, but if you go to their web site, It may answer your questions..


OK, here's the Link http://www.mass.gov/rmv/license/13bMAID.htm

From what I can make out there is, it says you cannot hold a valid DL in any state , so I'd assume if you already have a MA DL, you wont get an MA ID ..
But when anyone thinks about it, it does make sense, why would a state issue a ID when you already have an DL with your picture on it..

check it out & see what you think..

:hugs:

[Persephone]

I think you have to do what is right for you. Rhonda Jean clearly did not like the result of having her more femme picture on her DL, which is fine.

On the other hand, I've had my more femme picture on my DL for several years and love it. It works for me in femme mode and I'm perfectly content with it for en drab purposes. Never been questioned so far.

If I get to do another photo, I'll probably go more femme, rather than less. I have dark hair, which I wore down, rather than in a pony tail, for the pic, but made the mistake of wearing a black top, so my hair is sorta indistinct. On the next one I'll probably go for a pastel top.

[Ann Thomas]

Wow, what an interesting story. Honestly, I've got have mine redone, and was trying to figure out how to do it en femme down here in OC. Up in Washington I felt it important to do it en femme, just in case. But, it wasn't over the top either. Got it done with earrings, makeup that was professionally done, and a cute girly outfit. I've had absolutely no problems with it for the last year or more. Honestly I really don't care. I'm more concerned about what an officer sees when he pulls up my pic on his latop - that's the same pic, but alot bigger in hi-res. I'd rather the officer sees it and realizes I'm a crossdresser from that. The pic on the ID is soooo small you can't really tell much from it. I'm also considering the same for my new passport, which I'll be getting next year.

I don't dress 24/7 en femme. I also don't care if I pass or not. That's not the point. I am who I am and that's a guy that likes to dress girly. So to me the picture needs to be authentic. Seems like when we hear of news stories of CDing it's bad news, like a robbery. If an officer sees I like to dress that way in the picture, then it won't be so odd if I'm en femme when they need to talk to me about something.

Anyway, that's my take on it, and it's a bit different than most of the posts above. Really, I'm more interested in finding a good makeup artist around here, cuz I want to get my new CA DL done this week. Anyone have any suggestions? (I have almost no money, btw!)

Hugs,
Ann


Update 10/21: Got my new DL today, done en femme, had to do my makeup myself. Full story in the Out and About forum.