May be TRANSSEXUAL rather than a CD

[bobi jean]

I must tell everyone I am sorry, I know this is going to be longer than it should. As a matter of fact, I probably should not even write it. But I am going to, in hopes of responses with advice other than see a therapist. I can't afford it, unless someone can direct me to a PROBONO therapist, so in an attemp to further discover my real (TRUE) self, rely heavely, but not entirely, on the responses I get within this community.
Two years or so ago, I took the COGIATI test. I scored 105 and if memory serves correctly that is within the andro catagory. At the time I was amased at how accurate I felt that was. About 6 months ago, after reading a post here about the test, I retook it and scored 220. I thought that was a little high, it put me in the possible transsexual catogory but I also knew that I had changed somewhat during that period. At about that same time, I decided to tell my story. I started writing a story about myself, an "as I can remember" my crossdressing life and times story. It is totally unfinished but I am editing and remembering differant things all the time so it is an ongoing thing. Maybe one day I will start putting some of it here on the site for you all to read
This past Monday, I had a totally unexpected but enlighting conversation with one of the girls that I work with. When she arrived, I was still dressed and she made a comment about how much happier I appeared to be when I dress up compared to when I don't. I asked her to explain what she meant by that. (I didn't think I was any differant). She said, OH YEAH! a big differance. She thought I should go full time because I was always a lot happier, more relaxed and at ease when I dress up.
She told me that her and a couple of the other girls have been talking about it lately and decided to tell me just that. I could not believe what I was hearing and especially what I just said (out loud) to another human being. For the first time ever, I verbally said to someone that if I had known early on, what I know now, I would have, without any doubt, lived my adult life as a woman. 24/7 and likely, had I been able to afford it, the entire SRS, but definately would have had breast implants. She asked a lot of questions, like would I now. I told her that I would. If things were differant, I would do the whole hormone thing to achieve a more fem body, but at this stage I doubt I would do the SRS. I had never admitted this to a living sole, not even to myself. I have thought of little else since..... Well, Yesturday while fully dressed, make up and all, I retook the test again. I do not know what to think about the results. I am, at the very best, totally unsure what to make of it. I have always thought I was pretty happy just being a crossdresser. Now that I am able to dress regularly I thought I had it made. I couldn't ask for more.
I SCORED 465. That places me way UP INTO THE TRANSSEXUAL CATAGORY. (don't get me wrong, I like the idea). I just do not know what to do with it. I will say that I am not one to put much stock into something like this test but I also have to admit, there maybe something to it.

Reading the posts here about homosexual feelings, transitioning paths and a couple others, I feel the need to tell you that I have always (I think) had a desire for male companionship. Even back in high school, maybe sooner, I remember wondering what it would be like to have sex with a male. I did act on it for a while when I was much younger but stopped because of the stress. Remember 30 years ago, homosexuality or crossdressing, well, it wasn't the thing to do. anywhere, anytime!!!
JEEEZZZZZZZ, am I confused or what?????
I feel I should also say that I am not overly happy with life as it is but Im not unhappy with it either. I mean I am married with two grown childeren and a few grand kids, all of which I enjoy a lot. But I still have this damned feeling that I am missing a part of me. Perhaps a yearning to be female.
I do know that if I could change me without having anything else change
I WOULD DO IT IN A HEART BEAT.
SO, WHERE DO YOU THINK I STAND?????

SORRY
Bobi

[bethw]

Hi Bobi;
You and I could be twins. I'm going through thge same thing. I just don't know what to do either. I wish i had a magical answer for us but i don't. Does your wife know about Bobi? Mine has no isea about Beth. If she did I'm sure the marriage would be over. we've been married for 34 years and she's the love of my life. I would never do anything to jearpordize that. I guess what i'm aying is i'm stuck. If you need to unload just PM me and we can talk.
Hugs
Beth

[Michelle S]

If you cannot afford a therapist you surely cannot afford to transition. As for going 24/7 how would that effect your wife and grown children? Could you be happy with 24/5? Would you be OK being "grandDAD" for the holidays?

You might also look up the term bi-gendered.

[Marcyme]

First DO NOT base all this off a "test" that has no more pyschological merrit than a facebook quiz!! Seriously take it for what it is and no more.Sorry if that offends some anyone, but that test just has no scienitific basis! I come from a social science back ground and I just can't take that test seriously.

[AlisonRenee]

I score "probable transsexual" on COGIATI also, as well as a couple of other online tests I've found... and I can't say it's a surprise.

I'm pretty sure that I am TS, although nowhere near out with it and likely never will be. I just know how I feel and what I've felt throughout all the stages of my life, and I didn't need a test to tell me that. I've said this before -- if not for the collateral damage that would result I think I might pursue "the change". And, honestly, I don't think I have the nerve. I really admire the women who've carried it through and found happiness. I should have their courage.

All of that said, COGIATI and other such tests are enlightening, as well as fun, but probably not enough to hang your cute little hat upon. And I *like* hats on women. :heehee:

As Marcyme said, those tests - just by their nature - are short on science. I could see the direction of the questions and had a pretty good idea how I could skew my score toward femme if I chose. I tried not to do that, but if I was thinking it I can't rule out some score-bending, intentional or not.

I'm sure that most of the women who've transitioned or are in transition would say that the first thing you'd need would be to see a therapist who deals with gender issues.

[CherylFlint]

We're in the same boat, except for one little philosophical hang-up. I agree with everything you wrote until you came to the part about hormone injections, implants, and anything else that changes the already established "balance" that your mind and body has already achieved.
Okay, you can "pass", which is, when everything is said and done, the Holy Grail of us crossdressers. About the sex part, look, 90% of us check-out the ******* sites for a number of reasons, from how they look to what they do. And there are a number of other crossdressing sites, such as U are not alone, and blogs that have regular chats, such as this one, to sites that have very naughty chats.
The point is this: play the hand that you have been delt. You have the ability to crossdress and crossover, take advantage of your choices, but keep your feet firmly planted on the ground. The grass always looks greener on the other side of the fence, afterall.
I'm sure that you can work it out. It's no big mystery, most of us have been exactly where you are now and have managed to come to peace with our desires, wants, and, most important, needs. There's no reason why you can't dress-up and have one heck of a good time. Have fun.

[Katesback]

Well for the record I am post opp TS. I NEVER once went to a therapist. I simply knew.

In my opinion you simply know you are TS or not. What is more complex is wether you are willing to make that big decision to transtion. Now on the other hand if you are considering transtion you might wish to watch two of my videos on youtube. They discuss the important things you need to know if ya want to succeed in transition. here is the link http://www.youtube.com/user/katesback#p/u/3/3Phn_XUVUS0

You have to crank up the volume since the mic was not any good.

Katie

[carolinoakland]

Honey, there is a statement about TS's. All transexuals' stories are exactly the same, just the names and dates are diferent. I can't tell you how many of the same exact thoughts and words I had about myself, like; " I'd convinced myself that I was happy as a male crossdresser. " Yep, that was me, and l couldn't deny that everyday I woke up in that 'happy' life I'd put my head in hands and ACHE with the knowledge that I wished I was a woman. I so resonated with your story, you are almost there. And while there is no choice about being transexual, what you do about it IS. I had a choice that you are just about ready to answear for yourself, and honestly; DO seek a therapist. A GOOD GENDER therapist will show you that THEY don't have the answear. YOU ALLREADY KNOW THE ANSWEAR. Once you make your choice... the rest is just details.

I will second the comment that if you are having trouble's with affording a therapist then maybe you aren't ready to move forward. I would also not recomend that you present two gender presentations, it will take away your credibility as a woman and they will treat you as a fetishist.

Now, that all being said I will tell you that I am the education co chair for Transgender San Francisco, and that I regularly help girls in our community find the services and products to help them transition. There HAS to be a therapist that can work with you on a sliding scale, there ARE places to get your hormone costs subsidized. They're up here, they have to have some there as well. I know it would be a haul but it might be wise to reach out to the trans community in LA as well. If you really are having trouble finding things get in touch and I'll do what I can from here.

On another topic, about the girls in the office comments about your change in demenour... I've had the same things said about me once I transitioned. Comments like
" As long as I've known you there has this strained look about you and your personality that I never noticed until it was gone!"

" A lot of people have noted that you used to be a very angry man. "
That last one stunned my because my whole 'front' / male presentation was supposed to be a happy, funny guy.

And as much as you think you're scared of that future, you find yourself stronger than you thought once you stop carrying that fear. I definately feel lighter, in all ways.
And before you say "but what about the family?" I raised a daughter by myself from the time she was 8, she's now 20. I didn't start coming out until AFTER she moved out of the home.

So, while you've posted here to get advice... you allready KNOW. Don't you? The rest is just details. Be well, be safe, and reach out if you want. Our first mistake, that you've fixed is thinking that you are alone, you're not. We're your sisters. Carol

[AlisonRenee]

On another topic, about the girls in the office comments about your change in demenour... I've had the same things said about me once I transitioned. Comments like
" As long as I've known you there has this strained look about you and your personality that I never noticed until it was gone!"

" A lot of people have noted that you used to be a very angry man. "
That last one stunned my because my whole 'front' / male presentation was supposed to be a happy, funny guy.

That makes so much sense to me, Carol. Putting on a front IS a strain, and doing it for years knowing it's phony is soul-draining.

I would guess that you felt like a much happier and more whole person once you got the testosterone out of your system - was that true? I've read quite a few experiences of TS women who've felt much more calm and whole on female hormones.

(that said, as others have noted, I know that hormones aren't a do-it-yourself project)

[CLARRISA]

The thing i found about doing the gender test was that i was dissappointed at first for having a low score, that put me in at the Andro level....i found that on subsequent re-tests, i managed to up my score to a higher level...The brain plays a trick, turns the thing into a competition, wants to get the highest score....Though of course it maybe i've only been training myself to be more honest with my answers...so thats the real question, was it about competing for a higher score, or simply being blatantly honest....?

[SuzanneBender]

Bobi not a lot of advice from this gal because I am in the seat right next to you on this darn boat. I have only taken the COGIATI once and score a 360 which places me at a level four. Many of the other batteries that my therapist provided show the same thing.

We are working through what those feelings mean compared to my current life situation. I have a very comfy and well paying job which I would loose if I transistion; a wife who says that crossdressing is the boundary and if I go past that the marriage would have to end; and four children that rely on Dad for the guidance and love in a way that only Dad can provide.

I have been told multiple times, even by my spouse, that I am a totally different person when dressed and that I smile more as Suzanne. Does the smile come from not having to put on a front or does it come from the escapism that being Suzanne provides?

I used my family as an excuse to not even think about it, but at last years SCC I met a couple of TS women that were single moms and others that were still highly involved parents in their childrens' lives. That fact has inspired me to at least explore the possibility.

My therapist and I are working on trying to find what she calls the point of balance. I am not sure where it is on the spectrum but I know it exists for all of us.

As your shipmate on this little trip I look forward to reading more posts. So far there is so much wisdom from the ladies that have traveled this path that its hard to fathom it all. Perhaps if we both fall near each other on the spectrum of balance we can find a 2 for 1 special on GRS. :hugs:

Good luck and best wishes Bobi and girls, thanks for the advice and keep it coming.

[Karren H]

I just love the idea of a "placement" test.. Guess a person could take some classes and improve their scores? Maybe take it under another name.. Or get a female to take it for her... Seems to me and my small little brain that you know in your own mind that your TS or not and don't really need a test or a theripst to confirm it?

Hell I knew I was going to be an engineer way before I entered college.. And you want to talk about a social stigma!! Just read Dilbert sometime.. :). "He has the nack... All things mechanical and electrical and other social insuficiencies....".

[Sally2005]

The problem with tests like that is you can cheat because when you repeat the test you can learn to adjust your answers to get the desired outcome. Secondly, your answers are based on your perception of what the question is asking vs. what the person who designed the question intended to ask. It seems unusual to have results that change so greatly over time... what if you did transition and took the test again and it indicates the other end of the scale?

Others have said, it... only you know what is true. The key questions are, do you hate being male? Have you tried to and could you be dressed enfem for a long time, say 2-3 weeks 100% without needing to change back?

Therapists have their place, maybe they can help speed the process, but in the end you have to figure it out for yourself. I think if you research it, ask a lot of questions and be honest to yourself, experiement and reflect a lot, you will figure it out.

[GypsyKaren]

Bobi, don't waste your time with COGIATI because it's nothing but a joke and means nothing, go with what you feel in your heart about yourself, the heart always knows.

Karen :g1:

[Dana Lane]

Those Gender tests are not to be taken seriously.

http://www.tsroadmap.com/mental/gendertests.html

I would recommend going to http://www.tsroadmap.com to see if there are any resources you might be able to use.

Here in Philadelphia there is a transgender care center called Mazzoni Center that i hear charges based on what you can afford.

[Stephenie S]

As had been said so well by others already, those tests are for entertainment purposes only. Please do not put ANY diagnostic faith in them at all.

You CAN find a therapist. When you call, ask for one who will take a sliding scale based on your resources. They ARE out there, it just takes a bit of effort on your part to find one.

Does this mean you have no insurance? Or just that you are unwilling to see a therapist billed to your insurance company. Most therapists are willing to bill for "personality disorder" to protect their clients.

I, like others, believe you know the answers already, but to go forward it would help to have a formal diagnosis.

Lovies,
Stephenie

[JoAnne Wheeler]

I feel like I want to dress as JoAnne several times a week. It used to satisfy

but now I need more. I really do not have much faith in the COGIATI Test,

but I took it a month ago and scored 400. I do not know if it really makes

any difference where we are on our Femininity Scale, but I now would love

to dress 24/7 and I sort of consider myselt to be a "Transgenderist" and/or a

"Non-op Transsexual." As I said, I really don't like labels or categories, but

I feel like I am on my way to being more than just a "crossdresser". Right

now, that dream is not likely to happen anytime soon due to 1) Spouse,

2) Marriage would end; 3) Job would end; 4) Friends would leave -

the typical problems that we face.

JoAnne Wheeler

[docrobbysherry]

We should be tested rite after birth! Then, raised as whatever gender we REALLY r! Of course, that's not possible yet!:sad:

After you've lived many years of your life as one gender, can ANYONE take seriously, a test that says NOW u should become ANOTHER GENDER!? Irregardless of the LIFE consequences?:eek:

Sounds like the individual human factor is LEFT OUT of that equation. And, I believe it's the MOST important!:straightface:

[Kaitlyn Michele]

please please please ignore that stupid test!!! it causes so much confusion and suffering..

are you starting to suffer just being a man?

i can't tell you how many crossdressers i know say they think they are transsexual..i relate to this because years ago i said the same thing..

then the suffering started...it was like once i realized what i felt inside of me, all my defenses and all the lies i told myself stopped protecting me..

some girls get there very early in life, never questioning their femaleness

for those of us that grew up defining our gender by our bodies, it can get very complicated...

you will get all kinds of advice and here's mine...don't worry what others say...dont waste time on tests.
getting feedback from people doesnt tellyou anything about what's inside of you....if you feel that your male life cannot offer you peace and contentment over the rest of your life, then you need to consider the transition path and all the realities of that. if you are not comfortable risking everything then you need to consider how to cope with your feelings without transitioning.

and don't let others experience get you down...some girls have had horrible experiences and some have had wonderful experiences...all of us took a huge risk and now deal with the consequences. whatever you do , this is about YOU YOU YOU and figuring out a way to be content with yourself...then you can worry about all that other stuff

i hope that helps you think about things
all the best
Kate

[joyce483]

bobi jean, you did not mention who you would like to be with after you went through with the change over. i personnally still like both sexes and after i went threw the change would i still want both?

[bobi jean]

Hello everyone
Thank you all, each one of you, for your responses and advice. In most, I could feel your concern, just from reading. Well, I will tell you all that I do not intend to fully transition. At my age (60) about the only thing that would accomplish is, some Doctor getting to go on vacation, after the operation and, if I ain't going with him, it ain't gonna happen. I also have to let you know that " IF " anything changes between my wife and myself, I will either be dead, or a widower, or divorced, if either of the latter two happens I will start living as a woman, except while my grandchildren are present.
I DO NOT EXPECT OR PLAN on any changes anytime soon so I will continue to live as I have for the last 5 years or so. I am pretty content with things as they are now, it's just that I am convinced that I would be a happier woman than I am a man. As I stated in the first post, If I could start over at the age of 18 or so, kowing what I do now, I would have never admitted my age a few minutes ago because a woman never reveals her true age. I can't do that so I will just continue on being a crossdresser, and loving it when I can.
OH ! I have decided to TRY to find a therapist locally that is willing to see me on a " go as I can type " payment plan. The VA isn't to keen on paying for this type of stuff so all expenses will come out of pocket (shallow pockets). If anyone in the San Diego Ca. area knows of any local therapist(s)please let me know.
Thank each of you again for your concern, advice, and comments, I appreciate it all, and will consider all of the advice. I know I am the one that has to decide what to do.
I must say that my heart goes out to each of you that has made the decision (whichever way you decided). I know that for some it may have been a "no brainer", but still, the decision had to be made. For those that had to consider every aspect of life and living itself, It is hard.Especially for those that started later in life, it's hard just to think about it. For those that have not yet even considered it and are wondering what the hell I am talking about, I feel for you, wish you the best, and GOOD LUCK !
Thanks again
Bobi

[Hope]

What do you mean you can't afford a therapist?

It's your brain. How much is your brain worth to you? Beyond that it is your life, your happiness, we are talking about.

What are you spending $150/month on that is less important to you than your very life?

[SuzanneBender]

Those Gender tests are not to be taken seriously.

http://www.tsroadmap.com/mental/gendertests.html

I would recommend going to http://www.tsroadmap.com to see if there are any resources you might be able to use.

Here in Philadelphia there is a transgender care center called Mazzoni Center that i hear charges based on what you can afford.

great site Dana. Thanks for the information

[Beth-Lock]

I think there is some validity in some of the questions asked. For example, the one on how good you are with parking the car. It is a womanly characteristic not to be able to do it too well. It has been a definite comfort to me to find on going to the trans-support group, that I am the worst of them all in getting my car in the center of a marked space in the parking lot, even if I make several tries.

[AKAMichelle]

As I stated in the first post, If I could start over at the age of 18 or so, kowing what I do now

Wouldn't we all. :D GypsyKaren has it right about the tests. You can't rely on them to tell you what is in your heart.

Last year I was in a similar quandry, wondering if I was TS or not. I began my journey by finding a good support group that I could ask lots of questions. Everybody is different but we all seem to have some common threads. So I explored my feelings by talking to a lot of people. I even found a few TS and asked them a lot of questions. They told me many things which I had never thought about.

The long and short of it is that through all of that research I found that I was somewhere in between. That journey left me with a peace that I can live with for now. I still don't know where I will end up, but I found a way to accept myself.

This is the only advice that I can give you. I hope you are able to find yourself and get the answers that you are searching for.

[Joan Merrie]

Well for the record I am post opp TS. I NEVER once went to a therapist. I simply knew.

Katie
How did you get the surgery, with out the 2 letters, we need.

[dilane]

That Cogiati test must be really good:

My wife and oldest GG friend scored in the 150's, and I scored in the high 200's. And yes, they both are more naturally feminine than little old me ...

If you're well read on gender stuff, it's easy to know how to answer the questions.

[Kimberly Marie Kelly]

But as I grew older knew things were not right for me, just didn't feel right being a man. Once I started to realize that I was transsexual and accepting that for me, I felt right and chose to transition. As I transitioned my daughter commented to me that I was a much happier, less angry person. She said she liked me much better but to me I didn't feel that much different. The funny thing is other people have noticed a change in my personality, all for the good. Goes back to what Caroline mentioned in her posting, " A lot of people have noted that you used to be a very angry man. " That last one stunned me because my whole 'front' / male presentation was supposed to be a happy, funny guy. Seems when you hide your true self there is a hostility, an anger because you can't be you.

I guess what I'm getting too is this, if you feel happier being a woman go for it, don't worry about your age or what people think. You'll be a happier woman and your family will be happier. For me my relationship with my children is so much better, I wouldn't go back.. Kimberly :battingeyelashes:

[Alicia Grey]

My two cents worth says, that if the more you do something pleasurable (like dressing) the more you want to do it. At least that the simple way I look at it. It's the old pleasure and reward cycle.

If it's more than that, what then? Can you be truly happy in your present state?


The message of Joseph Campbell—the amazing mythology guru and mentor to George Lucas who based much of Star Wars on the classic archetypal journeys Campbell documented.

It's rather simple.

Three words: 1. Follow. 2. Your. 3. Bliss.

Key words: "bliss" and "your." Not someone else's idea of your bliss. Not what you think should be your bliss. Not what you think would impress the crowd or appease the family.

YOUR bliss. What truly gets you giddy.

[Alicia Grey]

Hi Everyone I don't know if I'm allowed to post again on one thread so soon. I just took the COGIATI test online and I was surprised when I tested 140 and that puts me in the beginning category of the "you might be a transsexual"

[Alice Torn]

I have been an angry man for 55 yrs, with angry brothers, and a very angry dad. I take meds, vitamins, minerals, but don't exercise like i should, except bicycle some, in a dangerous community. I also feel much more light, and positive dressed up fully. If much younger, with lots of financial security, i may have condidered it, but, if i'd had money, i may had been married, too! You have to consider your wife's feelings, because of your vows to her, and be willing to compromise. We can be selfish, as we all know! I don't think i would do it, either. I sure feel like you do, though! It is a b---h being male, much of the time! Sounds like you are manning up, and making a sound decision, from your last post. One minute at a time! (It used to be one Day at a time.)

[melissacd]

I think there is some validity in some of the questions asked. For example, the one on how good you are with parking the car. It is a womanly characteristic not to be able to do it too well. It has been a definite comfort to me to find on going to the trans-support group, that I am the worst of them all in getting my car in the center of a marked space in the parking lot, even if I make several tries.

You are kidding right...I hope you posted this statement in jest because I am not aware of any factual evidence to suggest that in any way shape or form a woman is any less capable of parking a car than a man. Sorry I am not trying to put you down, it just really concerns me when someone makes such important decisions on such things and uses these types of things as justifications for how you feel or where you want to go. Transitioning is serious business with serious consequences not to be taken lightly.

You need to base your feelings of trans-ness on something other than perceived notions of what a man or a woman is or is not good at because that is nonsense. While I have a perception of the things in my world that are feminine (not female) that I gravitate towards, I would never base my decisions on these things. It is so much deeper than that, a feeling that you have inside. If you are basing your decisions and feelings of comfort on how you park a car then you need a great deal more therapy. Men and women are more the same than different, please keep that in mind when making your decisions.


Hi Everyone I don't know if I'm allowed to post again on one thread so soon. I just took the COGIATI test online and I was surprised when I tested 140 and that puts me in the beginning category of the "you might be a transsexual"

Alicia, the Cogiati is not is substitute for formal therapy. It is easy to rig the results to get the result that you want. Also the questions are too circumstantial. When I first took it it said that I was androgynous. The next time I took it it said that I was a definite candidate to be a transexual. The only thing that changed between the first test and the second test was that in the first case I was living with my ex and could not dress freely. The second time I was out on my own and could and do dress en femme all the time. I am not sure that is a true and proper measure to make any decision on other than perhaps I need more closet space ;)

Consider the questions carefully then go see a gender therapist.

Melissa

[Erica2Sweet]

...
SO, WHERE DO YOU THINK I STAND????? ...Bobi

I think any decision like this should be made through introspection and with the help of those that the decision will affect directly (your family).

A forum like this is very useful in getting your thoughts and feelings down so you can piece together what you are feeling and can read it back, but I shudder when I think about someone... anyone... taking the advise from strangers on a forum to heart when it comes to life-altering decisions like the one you are contemplating. Message boards contain a wide gamut of folks with all sorts of different backgrounds, goals, strengths, weaknesses, and problems. We are not you. It doesn't matter what we think, or, where we think you are in life... What matters is what you think and how you feel about your situation.

I personally have wrestled with much of what you mention in your OP. It all seems quite familiar. I wish you all the best. :)

[Erica2Sweet]

...For example, the one on how good you are with parking the car. It is a womanly characteristic not to be able to do it too well...

I have seen a documentary featuring a study that demonstrated men are statistically better at solving problems where hand-eye coordination was needed, but overall, I'd say that the parking thing is mostly an unsubstantiated stereo-type.

[nikkijo]

cogiati.. was fairly close to what i consider myself... i totaled a -15 or androgyne.. which is how ii basically feel... can play both sides as long as i dont really push to each extreme.. and that is basically how i live or try to...

[Laura_Stephens]

Without regards to tests, I have felt like I was supposed to have been borm female from the time I was 3 years old.