Crossdressing Conformity

[DaphneGrey]

I have been reading threads lately and something has stuck out a little. When someone posts a question about motivation or reasons why they dress, there are always many posts about how no to CDs are the same. That everyone has different reasons, we are all individuals etc.....

However when someone actually describes something about themselves that is different (in the realm of gender variance) without a doubt they get their head bitten off. Sometimes quite brutally!

I have been open about who I am on this forum probably to a fault. I have been raked over the coals for being honest about my feelings and desires.

For standing up for wives and Sos:)

For fighting homophobia:Angry3:

For preaching personal responsibility:D

For standing up for Transexuals who too many crossdressers seem to think have no business posting in their threads!:devil::devil::devil:

My point is this. Why conform? Why jump on the band wagon? I mean if you spent half your life or more finding the courage to leave the closet why jump into another?

To be part of community that the world looks at with at best curiosity and worst with disdain, seeing this happening the in fighting, the division, and clique's is more than sad! It is downright scary!

Perhaps if you feel the need to flame over these thoughts you should think about this. If you are really comfortable with who you are, than anything I have to say shouldn't matter!

I will quote Marc Jacobs "The only opinion that should matter to you is your own"

[Karren H]

Yeah... Your right. none of what anyone says matters... Its a friggin chatty room about crossdressing after all.. Entertainment at best... The only thing we have in common is we like to wear womens clothing... if I got offended every time someone didn't like what I said (which is quite often I'm sure)... I'd go crawl into a hole and cry myself to sleep.. But that's not me... Were not cows... Lumbering along in a herd... and this isn't the UN so no one is voting on anything..

And I admit I like to take the other side of the arguments a lot even though I may not even agree with what I'm arguing for.. I'm not out to save the world and make it a better place for us... I just like to talk about crossdressing.. Plain and simple..

Ohhhh. Womens jeans still suck!! Ha!

[Kitty Sue]

I am inclined to agree with you. I think sometimes people reach a certain comfort level and after that they get scared if they find another person's traits, personality forces them to take a harder look at themselves. I think everything is a process and accepting others takes time and patience.

I generally have no issue with any member of the GLBT family posting anywhere on this forum. I find the variation within our community exciting and most interesting. FtM, MtF, CD, TS, Lesbian, Homosexual, Heterosexual, Bi etc etc.

I think all people conform in some areas of their lives. I think that is part of being human. Like all traits it is only a problem if taken to extremes. I know I have jumped on and off bandwagons all my life. Again I think people want to be accepted within groups. Sometimes this can be a good thing, and at other times not so much.

I do like, and agree with the groups of people you stand up for. I too agree with standing up for wives, GGs, and the partners of CDs/TGs etc. I

These partners of whatever gender deserve in my opinion the utmost respect from our community. I do not agree with members not telling their S.O about dressing or their gender identification. In my opinion if I am not telling my S.O about my gender ID then I am attempting a form of control and manipulation. On the other hand I think honesty is a process. Everybody likes to believe they are honest. Yet in reality the average person lies 5 times a day. Total honesty is a great goal, but I do not believe anybody is 100% honest 100% of the time.


And unlike most people I think people are heard animals ( I like Karen's reference to cows) and I am okay with that most, but not all of the time. People like to believe the best in others, so it is easy to be born a sucker. I know I am.

[Kate Simmons]

This is one problem associated with this community Daphne. Most, it seems, simply trade one set of behaviors for another based on what the majority do. When I see a person who is an individual regardless of gender or presentation, I find it quite refreshing my friend. Sadly, as you say most folks are conformists in one way or another. That eventually makes for a dull world regardless of where one tries to fit in.:)

[Tomara]

Hi Daphne
Plain and simple I couldn't agree with you more !

At times here there seems to be more nonacceptance than acceptance.

We are all different and in my mind that is what makes life so great to live.

Thank you for starting this post

Tomara

[Sarah Doepner]

I'm in favor of a large an umbrella as possible here. The more people we welcome and bring in to the discussions, or respectful disagreements, the larger our community gets. The larger the community get the more easily we move about in larger society. It would be nice to be able to move beyond feeling comfortable wearing rubber bands on wrists to feeling comfortable and safe wearing skirts, makeup and cute tops when we want.

[docrobbysherry]

When I first arrived here 2 years ago, still wet behind the ears from 10 years of COMPLETELY isolated dressing, I was SO THRILLED to find others like me!:D Or, so I thot!

Then, I found that CDs, especially those that enjoyed sex dressed, and that wore masks, were NOT exactly acceptable here!:sad:

However, after 2 years, I've received so many encouraging PMs, and made so many friends here, I can't count them all!:hugs:

We all start out as STRANGERS. It takes time to find out what each other person is really like! Once we do, I think we ALL have MANY THINGS in common.:)

Don't under estimate the "tribal" blood still running thru our veins! I think it is our nature not to trust, or accept, anyone that appears "different" from ourselves! :eek:

[Andy66]

Well said, Daphne, and thank you for sticking up for people. But I think others' opinions DO matter at least a little, otherwise why would anyone bother reading or posting to a forum like this?

It seems to me that people who are part of a minority group would think twice before picking on another group, because they know how it feels to be picked on. :(

You can feel better about yourself by making up reasons why other people aren't as good as you... or you can feel better about yourself by improving yourself. :)

[DaphneGrey]

Well said, Daphne, and thank you for sticking up for people. But I think others' opinions DO matter, otherwise why would anyone bother reading or posting to a forum like this?

It seems to me that people who are part of a minority group would think twice before picking on another group, because they know how it feels to be picked on. :(

You are quite welcome Anne:) I often wonder why myself. And the strict conformity is also mind blowing! I often refer to myself as Genderqueer I get more responses like "you just like womens clothing and there is nothing queer about that!" I mean seriously people just need to get over it!

I don't mind opinions or even debates but sometimes people get treated with downright disdain if they present any thing outside the box. Which is supposed to be this everyone is different lets all celebrate ideal.

You cant say in one breath everyone is different and then when someone says "I am different" come back with most CDs do this and Most TGs do That and 75% of us think and bla bla bla....

Any way I started ranting again oops! But I know exactly what you are saying:hugs:

[Jill]

I just want to echo and support some of what you have said. I enjoy this forum for the support and it's just good to know sometimes that I'm not alone. But any kind of controversy or failure to fall in line around here can result in some pretty nasty backlash.

I don't understand why some people who want acceptance have a hard time giving it.

[abigailf]

I guess at some level, we are all a bit "catty".

Some people do seem to be a bit "extreme" in their responses or reactions to posts. That's just people and people are all different, even though we have a common bond.

I suppose we all need to just take the comments with a bit of salt and keep doing what we like to do.

By the way, this thread has been quite active in its short life span. I guess we all like a subject a bit of controversy.

[melissacd]

Then it is decided...we should celebrate and respect each others differences!

The thing that we have in common with each other is that we are all different.

Swimming upstream sure isn't easy but it is far more interesting.

[Babette]

....a question about motivation or reasons why they dress, there are always many posts about how no to CDs are the same. That everyone has different reasons, we are all individuals etc.....

However when someone actually describes something about themselves that is different (in the realm of gender variance) without a doubt they get their head bitten off. Sometimes quite brutally!"


I don't mind opinions or even debates but sometimes people get treated with downright disdain if they present any thing outside the box. Which is supposed to be this everyone is different lets all celebrate ideal.

These are all good points Daphne. I suppose many of us have noticed the recurrence of similar threads over time. As you say, someone posts a seemingly innocent thread and tone of the replies suddenly goes downhill. Six months later, another person creates a new thread covering the same subject and everyone endorses it. Could this be the signs of "group think"? How about a lack of tact or diplomacy in a few instances?

For whatever the reasons people exercise their freedom of speech, I still find this forum interesting. If everyone agreed with my opinions and replied without much fanfare, this website would become terribly dull (IMO). For me, there is value in divergent viewpoints so long as they are expressed without malice. Kudos to you for expressing your's in this thread.

Babette

[girlalex]

You are absolutely right and this is a great post i give it a 5 out of 5 rating. this subject is actually very touchy for me because I've been through a lot in high school and especially college around people who didn't accept me for who i was and i always tried to conform with their masculine mentality and the more i tried the worse it got. i was trying and forcing my self to conform and try to be something im not. so the only time you know you found the right group of friends is when you feel that there is no need to conform to others in order to seem "normal"
all in all our individuality and uniqueness is what makes humanity so powerful.

[Frédérique]

I have been open about who I am on this forum probably to a fault. I have been raked over the coals for being honest about my feelings and desires.
For standing up for wives and Sos
For fighting homophobia
For preaching personal responsibility

I like your view of things, Daphne – as far as I’m concerned, there are no coals for you to be raked over (at least I haven’t seen any). Standing up for SO’s? Excellent. Fighting homophobia? I’m with you all the way. Preaching personal responsibility? Amen. You’re OK with me, dear…:bighug:


I mean if you spent half your life or more finding the courage to leave the closet why jump into another?
To be part of community that the world looks at with at best curiosity and worst with disdain, seeing this happening the in fighting, the division, and clique's is more than sad! It is downright scary!
Perhaps if you feel the need to flame over these thoughts you should think about this. If you are really comfortable with who you are, than anything I have to say shouldn't matter!

Everyone’s opinion counts, and I came here to be part of the “community.” I’m comfortable with who I am, so I read everything with equal fascination, albeit from my remote observation post in the corner of this “room.” I read your OP’s with interest, Daphne, but I haven’t been able to come up with a response worthy of your time – you see, I’m not married, and I have no children, so I can’t comment on most posts with a familial bent. I would never talk about something I find hard to relate to, even though it’s all interesting to me, and I certainly wouldn’t begrudge you (or anyone else) their opinion, even if it clashes with mine. I’m here to read and learn, not argue and join cliques – this is about as close as I’ve come to being accepted by a group, and I’m a lover, not a fighter. I'm very pleased to meet you here, Daphne, and I’ll see you along the way – carry on, soldier girl…:Peace:

[vikki2020]

It seems that we've all had very similar starts on the path that led us here, but after the first mile, the road opens up in different directions. I thinks it's great that we are all on the journey, wherever it takes us.

[SuzanneBender]

My point is this. Why conform? Why jump on the band wagon? I mean if you spent half your life or more finding the courage to leave the closet why jump into another?

To be part of community that the world looks at with at best curiosity and worst with disdain, seeing this happening the in fighting, the division, and clique's is more than sad! It is downright scary!

Right on girl. I think many of us, myself sometimes included, are victims of low self esteem. We have been teased, lost loved ones, and even physically threatened because of who we are, because of this we crave acceptance. When we perceive that we are accepted into a group our self image begins to inflate. Most of us didn’t have the opportunity to mature as women during our formative years. We all no how catty young ladies are when they are young. All of a sudden the little wall flowers are now acting like the narcissistic Divas with an over inflated sense of self worth and a poor opinion of anyone that differs from us. That is why it important to have well grounded young ladies like you on this site that will provide a cyber bitch slap every so often to make us realize that ultimately Divas end up on Oprah talking about how poopy their lives have become.

We can't throw rocks at any one label or at women that identify a certain way on this site. Many of us have been on this journey for years and have yet to figure our where we fit. I find myself relating to most of the women on this site in one way or the other.
Ultimately, who knows where I will end up. I could easily be one of those gals that sacrifices my Norman Rockwell life to be a woman or I may stay partial closeted with some of those in my life never knowing who I am. Where is the balance? Only time will tell. All I do know is that if I toss rocks at the girls on here because they are a little different those rocks will likely come flying back at me like baseballs from a Cy Young winning pitcher that I just called a bad name.

Your list of things that you stand for is almost perfect. The only things I would add are:

1. Be good parents for those of us that are parents.

2. Be proud of who you are. Never ever feel ashamed of your transgenderism. Don't let fear limit who you are.

I have always dug the term genderqueer. It has an outlaw ring to it while simply meaning just something different from the polar societal norms of male and female. I am fully in agreement with many in the GLBT community that we need to take the word queer back from the negative bigoted piggies that corrupted it. It means different and difference is often good.

Gender is a spectrum. Like a rainbow each one of us brings beauty to that spectrum. Let’s embrace the beauty.

[Byllie]

This forum, like any other forum, is like a huge room where members of a diverse club meet. The people in the room form small groups, talk, discuss, and these groups constantly reform themselves. This is the nature of group behavior.

But, like any group with a common interest, the way each member approaches that interest can vary, sometimes dramatically. As long as we each respect each other - and sometimes, I know, that can be hard - we will all gain from the group what we need. It seems to me that problems arise when a group member sees their view of the "common interest" as the only view. Or, when a member feels that their view has not been fully accepted.

Remember, the term acceptance does not mean agreement. I can accept your position, understand it and appreciate it, without seeing it as my position. In my opinion, acceptance, cooperation, and respect, are far more important that agreement. Do you agree?:iagree:

Toodles!
Byllie/Bill

[Toni_Lynn]

The subject of conformity is touchy one with me, because as others, such as girlalex have said, I didn't conform in high school or college, and in fact don't conform in most cases. Even in matters of my own personal religious beliefs, I don't conform with many Roman Catholics, in that I am a lot more conforming to the tenants and commands of my faith. For my non-conformity, I have suffered a bit, in school, when I was home living with my parents as a teen, and even at work. There are times, somewhat quite often as of late, that felt that I don't fit in because I don't conform to that which some CDers see as the way I must be. By that I mean:

to be a CDer you must

1) Go ga-ga over RuPaul and every other drag queen out there and consider them idols and heros
2) Have To Wong Foo and Priscilla Queen of the Desert as your favourite films -- you must NOT hate them.
3) March in gay pride parades
4) Feel a tingle inside when a man flirts with you when you are en femme
5) Attach submission to femininty
6) Feel that men's clothes are icky in every way

I could go on. I am NOT saying that these are bad things, and if you do 'em that's you. Of course if you don't fitr to the above, you are always guilty of, as a certain departed person put it, internalised transphobia. Oh, and you must accept that concept as regards your non-conformity to CDing standards.

But just because I don't do any of these I am no less a CDer than anyone else. Just my two pennies!

Huggles

Toni-Lynn

[Alice B]

As usual Karren hits it right on the head, except that woman's jeans suck.

[Presh GG]

Hi Daphney,

I have noticed that yours is a kind voice toward the GGs here. We are but a small group and get kicked a bit by some who have been burned in their past.

We are very appreciative of those who do support us as S/Os and wifes and trully are sorry some of you have been hurt in your lives.

But tomarrow is another day.

Thanks Daphney,
All the best,
spring

[DaphneGrey]

Hi Daphney,

I have noticed that yours is a kind voice toward the GGs here. We are but a small group and get kicked a bit by some who have been burned in their past.

We are very appreciative of those who do support us as S/Os and wifes and trully are sorry some of you have been hurt in your lives.

But tomarrow is another day.

Thanks Daphney,
All the best,
spring

Thanks Spring, I do try to stick up for GGs and SOs because in most cases they didn't sign up for this. My So included. I don't like it when they get slammed for wanting the man they married, being accused of snooping etc. I know it is not easy living with a gender variant person. I believe the ones who stick with us deserve the absolute best we can give.

[Crissy Kay]

I find threads like this very interesting, but usually do not reply. I enjoy reading about different points of view here. I"m still kind of suprized myself that I have not got any flack because I am a part timer, and fetish dresser at that!!! I do try to respect the members here when I do any postings. From what I have seen on the net, this site is the best for cds that I have seen.