Cliques and pecking orders!

[DaphneGrey]

There is nothing sadder to me than this fascination with perceived prejudice between crossdressers and transexuals. Every other thread has someone complaining about how transexuals look down there noses at crossdressers.

Well I just don't see it. Maybe I just have my head in the sand as was suggested by another member. Or perhaps it because I try very hard to be an individual and interact with people on an individual basis.

Transsexuals and Gays and Crossdressers are like everyone else. Some are wonderful caring fun enlightened people and some are simply just jerks! That is reality people I hate to break it to you. And I for one am sick and tired of reading post after post about she thinks she is better than me because. For fracks sake get over it! Is it that important?

How many good people have to be run off this form by this nonsense!

If your comfortable in who you are who really cares about labels any way.. What I think or anyone else thinks about where you are or should be along the gender spectrum or what you call yourself shouldn't matter.

I just don't get it.

I personally would rather interact with people on an individual basis and could care less about pecking orders and cliques.

Just my two cents.

[Karren H]

So that means that TS's are better peckers? :D

As far as I'm concerned I'm so far down on the pecking order..... I have chicken foot prints on my scalp!!

[Prissy Linda]

So that means that TS's are better peckers? :D

As far as I'm concerned I'm so far down on the pecking order..... I have chicken foot prints on my scalp!!

If she is a real TS, she doesn't have a pecker, does she?
Can I say that?

[Karren H]

We'll see.... That's why I didn't say it! Lol.

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

I think the problem is that in general we have a failure as people to remember that everyone is an individual. All to often we decide to generalize an entire group. So if we are a crossdresser, we often assume that other crossdressers do it for the same reasons we do. I know for me, I even went the other way, for a long time I tried to do the things I saw other crossdressers do because I thought, well that's just what we do. "Passing" for example.

So, while Crossdressers and Transexuals have common ground, there are also a lot of things different between us, but it is sometimes hard for us to remember that we may do the same thing but for different reasons. This analogy may be a stretch but it's sort of like a polo player and a mounted police officer. Both wear a uniform and ride a horse, but they're very different. But then again that doesn't mean that a polo player can't also work as a mounted police officer if they decide they want to do that.

Another thing goes back to the generalizing, that because one has had a bad experience with a transexual or with a crossdresser, one thinks all members of that group have a bias. Some probably do, but there are also plenty of folks that get alone fine with members of "other tribes."

[AllieSF]

I basically agree with you. I have not really seen seen that much looking down the nose attitudes. I know it exists, but then when I see it I just recognize that each one of us is at a different place in the the vast range of CD (panty wearer only) to full out post-op TS (MtF and FtM). Therefore, each person's point of view is different, especially on boundry (a hazy one for sure) crossing topics. Plus, each persons own experiences will also come into play with their responses. It is not this side against that side, just all of "us" across that wide spectrum of members here. So, when I hear someone complaining or referencing the up and down bashing, I have to ask myself, what did I not read or miss, because I hardly ever see it.

[Kathi Lake]

Oh, I've seen it and it is incredibly sad. Are there TGs out there that "look down" on some of us as "mere crossdressers"? Sure. Are they here on this forum? Doubtful. If so, I haven't seen them. Some people seem to get hurt by someone - either here or in the "real world" and then generalize that behavior to all those that share that description. That is wrong, wrong, wrong!!

Every person is an individual, and as such deserves to be treated as an individual - not as a member of a certain group. Please stop the labeling. As others have said, haven't we run enough people off of this board? We are here for each other. If those on this board - the ones that have undergone trial after trial - can't understand where we're coming from, then what hope do we really have of friendship and support anywhere?

Sigh.

Kathi

[sherri52]

We are all indivuals and should be treated as such. We are different in both the way we look and the way we act. Treat people with respect and most will treat you in the same manner. If they treat you badly get away from them. Let's not stoop to thier level. The old proberb " one bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch" should always be taken

[Lorileah]

I agree with Kathi on this. There is a certain group of TS's who consider themselves as not part of the rest of the community. They are "women" and we could not possibly understand. I have been told that at least twice here on these boards. So is my perception wrong? Maybe I just anger the ones who think that. The others just let me say what I say. There is a difference in TS and CD in my mind. I don't want to be a woman, especially now in my life. Not saying it wasn't a consideration once so technically I might be a TS??? Anyway, there are some on here who believe that if you don't go all the way you aren't doing it right. But as mentioned we has such a myriad of people here that no one fits any one definition. We just all have set ideas.

Now I am wondering about who has been run off? I have never seen anyone on here say anything that would run someone off. Anger someone...yes. Make someone think...yes. But no one has been chased away that I know

[Frédérique]

There is nothing sadder to me than this fascination with perceived prejudice between crossdressers and transexuals. Every other thread has someone complaining about how transexuals look down there noses at crossdressers.
Well I just don't see it. Maybe I just have my head in the sand as was suggested by another member. Or perhaps it because I try very hard to be an individual and interact with people on an individual basis.

I’m happy to say I have a lovely transsexual friend here (one who WRITES to me) – hello, Kitty! Personally, I don’t see what the problem is, but I’m an individualist myself. I came here to stand beside people, not be looked down upon or (certainly) not to look down on anyone. You must treat everyone as an individual around here, but I’m predisposed to, because I know just how diverse the crossdressing community is. As far as cliques or pecking-orders go, I was on another, similar site where that was quite noticeable – by comparison, it’s not that bad here, but I sit in the back of the room watching everyone with equal fascination. I could make a cute joke right now, but I’ll abstain…:heehee:

BTW, Daphne, I hope you’re not contemplating actually “going, going, gone,” because you’re doing good work inserting fresh air and creativity into these…ahem…stale threads. Looking around for something to write about or respond to often feels like panning for gold in the Mississippi River with a teaspoon (with a hole in it)! Pull up a chair, dear, it’s just getting interesting. I know how you feel, but don’t let the big girl’s blouses get to you…

PS – there’s a clique of sorts around here that derails decent discussion for cheap laughs, but please don’t get me started…:naughty

[joandher]

My old man had a true saying, "THERES NO ONE BETTER THAN YOU ON THIS EARTH AND YOU ARE NO BETTER THAN ANYBODY ELSE" I personally take everyone as i find them,and i treat them as they treat me,, hopefully with respect
we are all different ???

:hugs: J-JAY

[Fab Karen]

The "we're real, you're not, you're just a sexual fetishist" types are a small percentage of all TS's ( and probably the same ones who say anyone not post-op isn't a "real" TS ). They don't represent the majority, so as others are saying, if you run into them, don't take it as the view of most TS's. Most TS's I have met are sweet people who treat me as a sister.

[StaceyJane]

I've come across some TS's that believed that if you weren't dedicating your life to transitioning then you should just stop dressing and put the boy clothes back on.
But that just a few bad apples.

[Kate Simmons]

My thoughts exactly Daphene. I don't have time to waste with a bunch of chickens who have nothing better to do than peck on each other.:rolleyes:

[sterling12]

Yes! We can safely say that 99% of The Folks on this Forum and about everywhere else, have no special "agenda," and prefer to get along. More and more we see each other as people who fit in somewhere on The TG Spectrum. And that is true whether your TS, TG, CD, DQ, GQ, TM, straight, gay, bi, asexual, or Bozo The Clown.

Around here, that 1% who seem to have some kind of chip on their shoulder, very quickly gets an "ear-full.". If you want to cause trouble, start "flame wars," be provocative for no good purpose, your going to catch a lot of reasoned-out flak from others, and ultimately get yourself banned!

As Individuals, and as Trans-People we have many differences, but we also share a great deal in common. When someone steps out of line, I think it's good that they are "tactfully reminded" that their wisdom is not in touch with reality. Ah, but The Beauty of this place, "If you play nice, get along with others; you can still have your opinions and learn how other people think." Since we do that around here with a minimum of "fuss," it is a good thing!

Peace and Love, Joanie

[carolinoakland]

I really don't get it either, I've been on the receiving end of it when I started as a CD. And I didn't get it, why would what I do be any less real? Now that I'm TS I don't have a problem with CD's. We're all part of the "Gender Gifted." rainbow. I second the opinion that some people are just jerks. Not my job to fix that, Carol

[Nigella23]

Transsexuals and Gays and Crossdressers are like everyone else. Some are wonderful caring fun enlightened people and some are simply just jerks! That is reality people I hate to break it to you.

Couldn't agree more with this statement, no matter what social group I have ever been involved with, in the main most people are ameniable but always there will be an exception. True for a football team, classroom, workplace, chess club, or Masonic Lodge. I think sometimes here that people expect a much commoner ground than exists - "We wear skirts, we must be the same.", whereas in my perception there seems to be a vast array and diversity amongst the members, even if you try to narrow the spectrum down to solely what would be known as one class of crossdressers, the people therein would probably have much less in common than the members of a pub footie team.


If your comfortable in who you are who really cares about labels any way.. What I think or anyone else thinks about where you are or should be along the gender spectrum or what you call yourself shouldn't matter..

In theory this statement is fine, and suits my own sentiments. But from what I've read alot of people come here because they are looking for guidance, answers, help, clarification, definition. It can matter alot to you, what people think of you, if you are confused and or are uncomfortable on where you sit on that gender spectrum! So yes, it shouldn't matter, and probably doesn't to those who are living their dream, but spare a thought to those who don't share your luxury.

[SuzanneBender]

We are individuals not labels. It amazes me that a group as diverse as ours that deals with prejudice everyday insists on placing a labels on others. Worse yet some of us look down on others because of those labels. Unfortunately, Daphene is right there will be narrow minded jerks and jerkettes that will always insist on doing this.

I am so confused by all the labels and rhetoric that I can't even find the pecking order let alone figure out where I stand in it. I just know I identify with so many of the sisters in my life across all spectrums of transgenderism and I like not fitting in one single hole. I have friends across the country that range from the totally passable and now married with kids TS to total hobbyist crossdressers, to partial dressers. I am proud of all of my sisters and want to move forward hand in hand with them towards gaining more acceptance in our society. Groups gain acceptance and rights in our society not individuals. We need to remember that before we start excluding girls from the cool chick club.

I will never let someone’s haughtiness run me off this site. Stupidity wins when no one is there to challenge it. Besides I love my sisters on this site and the wonderful rainbow of interests that they represent.

To paraphrase Dr. King, I have a dream, a dream of the day when little crossdressers and little transsexuals will play hand in hand together. :daydreaming:

[Babette]

Let's forget about being CD, TG, TS or any other label. Now take a look at most subsets of human kind. Pecking order, condescension or simply disrespectful behavior often has to do with a person's competitive nature. Through my personal observations, I notice the ultra competitive people often being the worst offenders of "looking down their noses".

If someone treats you poorly, then I would suggest you simply ignore them. Putting a twist on an old saying, "Treat me bad, then shame on you. Treat me bad again, then shame on me."

I have noticed a lot of threads discussing Daphne's point. However, I have never been treated disrespectful by anyone on this forum. That is the main reason why I participate. With that said, if someone wants to rip me apart here or anywhere else, then go forth and conquer. Just don't expect me to take the bait. :2c:

Babette

[docrobbysherry]

We're ALL HUMAN!:brolleyes:


The "we're real, you're not, you're just a sexual fetishist" types are a small percentage of all TS's ( and probably the same ones who say anyone not post-op isn't a "real" TS ). They don't represent the majority, so as others are saying, if you run into them, don't take it as the view of most TS's. Most TS's I have met are sweet people who treat me as a sister.

U said it Karen, NOT ME! All I know is; if u post here, and mention, "CD", and, "sex", together, prepare to be FLAMED!:devil:
And the word, "fetish", should be used to describe OTHERS, NOT yourself! Everyone knows how disgusting "those" fetish dressers R!:heehee:


All to often we decide to generalize an entire group. So if we are a crossdresser, we often assume that other crossdressers do it for the same reasons we do. I know for me, I even went the other way, for a long time I tried to do the things I saw other crossdressers do because I thought, well that's just what we do. "Passing" for example.

Great post, Ryan! When I first discovered this site, after 10 years of dressing COMPLETELY on my own, I ASSUMED everyone got turned on when they CDed!:o

After getting my head handed to me a few times, I stepped BACK from the "sex" talk!:sad:
And yet, I'm told MOST CDs dress and become aroused!:eek:
Why don't we hear more from THEM? Maybe they, unlike U and me, do NOT have thick skins!?:brolleyes: