Do other TGs/CDs embarrass you ?

[FionaAlexis]

I’m wondering what your acceptance level and tolerance of other CDs and trannies is like – and I’m talking about them being dressed. I think the wonderful [?] thing about internet forums and chatrooms is that it is ideally suited to CDs and trannies as reality is well masked. I know you all love other CDs and trannies especially the hot looking ones but when you step away from your PC back to reality – how do you really feel?

How do I feel?

I’m afraid there are lots of CDs and trannies that make me cringe when I see them on television. I have seen some transsexuals telling their stories or some broader TS view and even they make me feel slightly uncomfortable. I was watching an episode of local soap - ‘Neighbours’ - at dinner time with my family. Two trannies appeared – and I could feel my face burning red with embarrassment. There are a few TSs who present very well and usually when they are talking about another topic and being transsexual is simply incidental.

A couple of years back there was some controversy here over a tranny nightclub that was situated close to a major public hospital and the patrons of the club used the hospital car park. Relatives of patients visiting in the evening hours complained about the trannies and their behaviour. I believe this resulted in the club closing down. Anyway at the time I remember listening to talkback radio and hearing a tranny call in about the imminent closure. She said a lot of the stuff we read on forums like this – about wanting to express her femininity, finding herself – and this being only venue where she could be herself. And she made me cringe – hearing those personal thoughts out loud in public in a slightly effeminate but distinctly male voice – made me cringe.

I would not go out in public with another tranny. I have really only met three trannies in my life who I felt were really passable – one of whom I went out with quite happily. Mind you, I’ve only met about 20 or 30 trannies. I think it’s hard enough to pass alone without worrying about whether your companion is making it. I once managed a shoe shop in Chapel Street, Melbourne [for those who are here! Talk about the kid in a candy store!] and two trannies came in to try on shoes – one passed very well. She was small framed, good figure, very feminine in both behaviour and manner - and the other didn’t and was clearly on ‘L’ plates. The good one could have gone anywhere – but with her friend she no longer passed. She may as well have been wearing a T-shirt with ‘I am a tranny too!’ on it.

So I guess I am not that comfortable with most other trannies in all situations.

Fiona xx

[Maddie Knight]

I would never be embarrassed by another cd no matter where I was or how I was dressed.
If we don't show understanding to our sisters who will.

[FionaAlexis]

If we don't show understanding to our sisters who will.

Don't know. But I love Australians and some of them embarrass me.

Fiona

[Clare]

I understand your views Fiona.

As you know, we are all at different levels of self acceptance and what i think is good for me may be seen as trashy by others. Not to mention the physical atrributes that some of us have to overcome!

I voted #3 as i would find that company may actually inspire confidence to make the move to be more 'out-n-about'. I have seen posts where groups of XDR's are out together and although its obvious they are crossdressers to the public, they have a great time socially and seem to enjoy themselves because of it. I can't image being so relaxed on my own to the same level.

Maybe some CD'ers prefer to be alone whilst others gain confidence from group situations. Everyone to their own i suppose.

I just see it as case of physical support as opposed to the emotional support we give to each other here in the forums.

Christine

[FionaAlexis]

Maybe some CD'ers prefer to be alone whilst others gain confidence from group situations. Everyone to their own i suppose.


Yes well put Christine.

And yes I can understand the confidence in numbers situation - and I have been there - and obviously it works to a degree - like any en masse statement. It don't think it works to the same degree with just one other person but depends on the person I suppose.

Fiona xx

[Natalie x]

This has been on my mind lately, too, after seeing some photo's recently that made me wonder if others see me as I saw the people in the pictures.

Previously, I had this image of us all as girls, at different stages along the road to achieving a semblance of female perfection. Of course, that's a misconception, only a small proportion of us are trying to reach the "passable" standard anyway, most are just happy to pop on a frock or a pair of knickers for fun or as a turn-on.

Most of us who want to pass have to overcome huge obstacles: masculine build, male faces, facial and body hair, deeper voices, bad walks and no tits. Small wonder that it takes ages to get anywhere near passing, and most of us will never achieve it.

I have to confess that I do feel embarrassed when I see someone who stands out as an unconvincing woman. I feel for them, because they are potential targets for ridicule; I feel for myself, because I am afraid that I will be seen in the same way; and I feel for all of us, because I want us to be accepted, and I think outsiders will be put off if they see us as blokes in drag.

Fiona has a good point, that a tranny with a gg or a guy or in a mixed bunch, stands a better chance of passing than two trannys together. Incidentally, I like the term "tranny"; I think it covers all members of our club (TG/TV/TS) in a light-hearted and inoffensive way, and I like it much better than "crossdresser", which seems such an inadequate and cold word.

This embarrassment doesn't change how I feel towards my sisters here, and outside our community, though. I hope I will always keep this new understanding and acceptance I have found since discovering my own femininity. Every person has a right to receive respect, whether they hold the same views as me or totally different, and in this community we have a very special relationship with each other that transcends all our differences.

[Tristen Cox]

Do other TGs/CDs embarrass you ?
On the contrary they are the only people I would go out with en fem.

[Jenny Beth]

I voted number 4. Although I have not done so yet I have been out at night both with just one other CD and in groups for dinners. I don't pass all that well and for a long time that was an obstacle. It has taken years to finally accept that fact and I have been out on my own several times in broad daylight. It's true there are some who could pass just about anywhere but it's not as much about looks as it is about confidence. However I'd have to say that if I was to be out with another CD whether it be night or day I'd hope she had done her best to look passable. What I mean is I wouldn't want to be out with someone who was all dressed but with no makeup and as hairy as a gorilla. That doesn't mean I don't accept them as a sister because I know they have the same desires and feelings I do. I guess the bottom line is I want to be as comfortable as possible when I get out otherwise the enjoyment of "being a woman" might loose some of it's appeal.

[joni-alice]

Only ones that pester me with questions like this!

But it does make one think.

It doesn't matter to me how a person looks or what he or she is wearing, but actions of certain people could cause me some bearable discomfort, whether they are trannies or not.

[Deanna2]

Fiona, you missed a number of categories. The one that applies to me is that I would socialize with other CD's at a private venue (either day or night) and have done so a couple of times.

CD's don't embarrass me, but I don't think I would be particularly comfortable in a public gathering. I once organized myself to attend a Seahorse monthly meeting, but wound up not going. There are certain hotels around town where CD's can go and enjoy themselves, but I'm a clubby sort of person. I know everyone is trying to express themselves in a certain way and so am I.

I'm not really a closet CD as I have out in femme gear in the daytime. Maybe it's a confidence thing and I need more of it.

[FionaAlexis]

Do other TGs/CDs embarrass you ?
On the contrary they are the only people I would go out with en fem.

I think you have side-stepped the question Tristen. - Fiona xx

[Tristen Cox]

I don't think so, why would I go out with them if they embarassed me?

[Laurie Ann]

I believe that dressing is an outward expression of what I am feeling at any given time. If I dress in my male clothes than I feel that way, if I am dressed in womens clothes then I feel that way, at that time. I would feel comfortable being out with other CD/TS/TV any time as it represents what they are trying to express at any given time. I am 6'1" 215 pounds and in heels stand anywhere from 3-4" higher. I doubt that anyone would ever take me for a women even at my best but so what. I am not trying to fool the world I am trying to express myself and make ME feel good. That's my opinion anyway

[Phoebe Reece]

This poll is hard to answer because other options affect the answer. If I am enfemme, I will go out with other CD's pretty much anywhere, day or night, provided they are dressed appropriately for where we are going. If I am drab, I would have to limit the places I would accompany a CD who is enfemme to places that I would not be recognized, and again the other person must be appropriately dressed for the location.

[cosmolovesph]

i voted #3, and have been to gay clubs (halloween) in drag and would do it again.

My .02 on this is people (anyone) who are "over the top" and way to dramatic or have horrid attitudes which can put others in uncomfortable situtations.
hope that makes sense... and certainly does not apply solely to TG/CD's

[Wendy me]

i voited I find it offensive that you are asking this question.....no offence to anny one
but who or what gives you , me , us or them the right to be offensived by someone that is being who thay are???? this is me , this is who i am , love me, hate me, kiss me , kick me, but this is who i am and your who you are , together we can learn and grow from each outher...i think we offensived our selfes when we close our own selfes to all outhers....some travel through life so high up on their own pedistal thay thay can't see the true meaning in everyone......i am no better than you .... as well you are no better than me ....my .02$.....

[FionaAlexis]

Fiona, you missed a number of categories. The one that applies to me is that I would socialize with other CD's at a private venue (either day or night) and have done so a couple of times.



Hi Deanna - I actually had a similar option in my first draft ie. 'I would meet another CD/tranny in private' but I took it out because it's about the level of embarassment, acceptance and tolerance in public - and I think we'd all meet someone privately in the right circumstances.

Fiona xx

[Ava Mouse]

Assuming they're dressed appropriately and behave normal in public, I'm not embarrassed at all... :)

[Jeanette H]

Well, I've never met another tranny, have never been out of the house en femme, and don't consider myself very passable, so I didn't feel I could vote for any of the options! But if I was going to go out I'd be glad of some company, and I wouldn't like to feel I'd turn down a proposed outing without at least considering it. And people aren't born passable. I imagine almost any convincing TV has had some help in the past from others.

Re voices, I remember saying over at Rose's that if some magic program could make the computer read out everyone's posts in their natural voices, the forum would feel very different. It would be a mixed blessing...

[Wendy me]

Assuming they're dressed appropriately and behave normal in public, I'm not embarrassed at all... :)



and just pray tell is that please the 1,000,000.00 answer...

[Ava Mouse]

and just pray tell is that please the 1,000,000.00 answer...

Wendy, Ah, well, I mean 'act like a typical woman would', or act appropriately.

Point is if we look/behave like freaks in public, it will set back our acceptance. Oh, and potentially embarrass our friends. LOL.

I don't care about passability, just appropriate behavior/presentation.

[Stephanie Mancini]

Having been out with numerous girls, wives, girlfriends and yes even with a few girls being accompanied by their boyfriends, it has to be honestly said that most of us don't pass, the important thing is that we're out there being ourselves, expressing who we are, we are trannies for heaven's sake, we have every right to be proud of who and what we are, yes sometimes we do get knockbacks from the public at large for the way some of us dress which is why if you are contemplating going out its very important to present yourself in an appropriate manner to the public at large, being normal if you like, god how i hate that word, blending in is the secret, real girls do recognise when a t-girl is making a bit of an effort and act accordingly, a girl with attitude is not enough but a girl with attitude and wearing the right outfit for the occasion is a girl who can Pass! Steph

[maryannsung]

Most of the time not. The only times they did are when they act like real men and started to talk loud and walk like a construction worker. Also some girls do not dress for the occasion, e.g. wearing 5-inch heels to go shopping.

[CharleneCD]

During the time of the family funeral we got a chance to escape and go to our first Tri-Ess meeting. After the meeting About 6 of the gals decided to go to a restaraunt to eat. I changed back to drab to avoid changing later at the restaraunt, as I had to be normal when we got home. So to make a long story short Bunny and I were in public with 6 other Cd's who stayed dressed. Only 2 out of the six were reasonably passable. I wasnt embarrased at all to be seen with them. Just had a good time with people who are just like me.

[Jo_2s]

If I had half a chanch of passing, I would love to meet up in public but as much as I respect eveyones right to be and dress how you want ( I do at home ) I would only feel ok it the other girl felt like me. By this I mean not over the top, dress to your age, and not try to attract attention.
Now look I am NOT trying to tell you what you should do, if you want to slap on the paint, 10" leather mini skirt, fishnets, 48 DD, etc. and shout look, that's fine but this question is about how I feel.

[Rachel Morley]

I answered number 3. I might feel uncomfortable in public though if they weren't even trying to pass at all, and were also acting very "male" around me.



I like the term "tranny"; I think it covers all members of our club (TG/TV/TS) in a light-hearted and inoffensive way, and I like it much better than "crossdresser", which seems such an inadequate and cold word.


Funny this Natalie....I feel the exact opposite :confused:

[Jenny Rose]

Never been out en femme and maybe never will. But the thing is that I think you should dress and act appropriately for the occasion. Contrived examples of poor dress: evening gown to baseball game. 5-inch heels almost anywhere except clubbing. Wearing way out of fashion eye makeup that only ever was appropriate for a girl 20 years younger than you.

I do think crossdressing is about respecting the feminine form. I don't think you need to pass, so long as you look respectable.

I went to an arts and crafts show on Friday with my wife. I spotted 4 TG's of differing degrees of passability. It looked like no one noticed, except maybe the 6' 5" TG that looked like she could be an ex football player. All of them really dressed consistent with what the women were wearing: summer dresses, low heels/flats and no nylons. They all looked great, showed their own individual style, yet you could argue that none of the passed.

Husband: "Hey honey, look at the man over there wearing the dress!"
Wife: "But you know, even though he is 6'5" and overweight, his makeup and the dress he is wearing is really flattering. I bet he doesn't look good that normally!!"
Husband to self: "hmmm, I've always wondered what it would be like"
:lol:

[jessica33]

I would go out with cds anytime . We have to remember that we are all in this together . If we can not accept those who do not pass well then we can not expect the general public to accept us as well .

[Rachel Ann]

I can't find a choice to vote on, all are true up to a point with various people in varying circumstances. Some people in all groups embarass me, and I am selective about whom I will go anywhere with, TG or not.

That said, when dressed, I prefer to go places with another CD or a GG, especially after dark. This is for safety reasons; many GGs do the same.

[Billijo49504]

I would only go out with my wife, when dressed. Because that is whay see asked of me. With the support I get a home, that's the least I can do.

[mand]

Hello Fiona, I think you have asked a very good question.

Can I just say that the first time I ever went to a TG venue I went along with the thought that everyone was going to be of a similar disposition, was I in for a shock. I was silly enough to believe that everyone would feel in some way similar to myself, born in the wrong phyiscal gender for my mind and soul. What I found on my very first time with other TG's was that the sepctrum is totally vast in it's range. The only common factor was the desire to give a female apperance, but the reasons for this desire were as different as each individual themselves.

Do other TG's embarrass me?....................I would have to say in the collective sense, No they don't. We are all born with different veiws and I do try to respsect other peoples veiws, ideas, desires, wishes.
However I have come across some TG's who I have no wish to be classed in the same league with.

I'll try to give some examples................Jane (my wife?) works in the legal system, she was telling me about a Pre-op TS who was found guilty of expossing her genitals to young children, she was sent to prison, the story was in the local papers. I found this an embarrassment to all TG's.

The next embarrasment was when I was still "in the closet". I was at University on a part time basis reading Law. In our group was a TS, I don't know if she was pre or post op?. The thing is she was totally "bonkers". People in the group were actually very accepting of her and they did their best to make her part of the group and feel wellcome. That was simply not enough for her, every single sentence that came out of her mouth began "Well because I am a woman". Every time she spoke there had to be a reference to her gender.
Anyway she soon left the University, claming that everyone (students and lecturers) were picking on her and making nasty comments and remarks about her, I know for a fact that this was totally untrue. I felt she was a bad example to people of what it means to be a TG.

As for daytime talk shows on the television, some TG's come across as genuinely good people and do portray the TG community in a positive and thoughtfull way. Some however come over as being quite mad and make me cringe, especially when family or friends are watching.



I don't go to TG venues anymore, to be honest I used to find it a struggle to fit in. In a one to one situation I can talk the "hind legs of a donkey", but in a group enviroment I tend to be a little resevered and quite shy.

As for going in public with another TG, well there is only one who I have ever been out with and she is a real lady. She is older than me and she passes much better than I could ever hope too. We are a bit like "chalk and chesee" really, she is awfully posh were I am really common. You have Tea with her and it's best "Royal Doulton or Crown Derby" china, if anyone should feel a little embarrrassed, it should be her.

love mand xxx :)

[Julie]

It's never bothered me being out with other CDs. But all the ones I've been out with give it their best effort. It's not the final result that's important to me (passable, beautiful or any other triat we all desire) but if she did her best with what she has. That's all that's important.

[FionaAlexis]

I would go out with cds anytime . We have to remember that we are all in this together . If we can not accept those who do not pass well then we can not expect the general public to accept us as well .

Yes, Jessica that is a good point and certainly a consideration that weighs on me. I think, at the end of the day, it depends whether you see yourself as part of an 'all in this together' or a simply individual trying to be 'normal' - finding their own way.

As I've said elsewhere - I don't see myself as the vanguard of any gender revolution.

Fiona xx

[FionaAlexis]

I would only go out with my wife, when dressed. Because that is whay see asked of me. With the support I get a home, that's the least I can do.

That's fine - but its about your perception and feelings - not necessarily what you've done or what you've agreed to do.

Fiona xx

[FionaAlexis]

Can I just say that the first time I ever went to a TG venue I went along with the thought that everyone was going to be of a similar disposition, was I in for a shock. I was silly enough to believe that everyone would feel in some way similar to myself, born in the wrong phyiscal gender for my mind and soul. What I found on my very first time with other TG's was that the sepctrum is totally vast in it's range. The only common factor was the desire to give a female apperance, but the reasons for this desire were as different as each individual themselves.



Thanks Mand - Yes, that's pretty much my view of, not just TG venues but, tranny groups in general.

I'm also reserved and shy in group situations - and, in addition, I admit I'm not very social.

Fiona xx

[FionaAlexis]

to UnlimitedDelight -

I am well aware of Sarah West's views in 'Emperor's New Clothes' and in 'I have a Confession to make....', ]which is more relevant to the question I raise here] and, generally, I empathise and concur with most of what she said in both threads.

However, what is YOUR view UnlimitedDelight? on the question is this thread? And I don't think it is entirely about 'passibility'.

Fiona xx

[emmicd]

Dear Fiona

I would not have the courage to go out en femme so I would not have this opportunity to go out with other cd/tgs.

However I would not judge a person whether they are convincing or not in presenting themselves as female knowing that they are not. If I had the opportunity to hang with them to learn something I think I would be better for that experience.

I would respect them and wish them well.

I try to always focus on the positive attributes of people.

Emmi

[Mandy Salamander]

,,thinking 'plausible' might be a better word to use, than 'passable',,, I'm fully aware that I don't always 'pass',, but doo present well,, I have a small frame, am quiet and polite, and always dress and ACT appropriately for occasion,(even when a bit tipsy), thus am never embarrassed for myself,and usually doo pass without problem,,, but in answer to your query,, yes, I have indeed felt shame for others who apparrently didn't have the dignity to do it for themselves,,,

[Like2BAspen]

I would love to meet ad go out with other tgs and where depends on where we are both comfortabl and how much fun we can have there

[FionaAlexis]

,,thinking 'plausible' might be a better word to use, than 'passable'


Yes - thanks Mandy. Also predictability in behaviour - even in male mode I never like being with those whose behaviour is erratic. I know others find them great fun people - but maybe I have low threshold.

Fiona xx

[FionaAlexis]

Dear Fiona

I would not have the courage to go out en femme so I would not have this opportunity to go out with other cd/tgs.

However I would not judge a person whether they are convincing or not in presenting themselves as female knowing that they are not. If I had the opportunity to hang with them to learn something I think I would be better for that experience.

I would respect them and wish them well.

I try to always focus on the positive attributes of people.

Emmi

Hi Emmi,

I have the utmost respect for any TG who lives the life they wish to live or who takes a stand on issues and pushes the boundaries. I am happy for other trannies to go out dressed as outlandishly or unplausibly - and behave as colourfully - as they wish. Good on them! I just find it embarrassing.

Neither am I trying to set those who go out dressed apart from those who don’t – in fact I am very much against peer pressure on girls who are quite happy to remain private dressers.... – in fact that was one of the points of ‘Unsatisfactory Solutions’.

But maybe I have not been clear on my poll options – they were intended to be as much hypotheticals as questions of what people had actually done.

Fiona xx

[Rikki]

I don't dress so much as to pass, because I could never paas. I dress for myself and if I do get out, I go out to places where I am not as apt to meet people.
As for being embarressed, it would have to depend on the way the other CDer acted. I say that because I get embarresed when in drab and anybody else with me gets to acting inappropriate. I am just a shy person who embarrases easy.
I would still like to meet other Crossdressers, but I would like to meet them in a private place and not in a pub or anyplace like that. Just my 2cts.


Rikki

[FionaAlexis]

I say that because I get embarresed when in drab and anybody else with me gets to acting inappropriate. I am just a shy person who embarrases easy.


Me too Rikki - and I guess at some point it becomes our problem of over sensitivity rather than theirs ?

Fiona xx

[Lisa]

I agree with Tristen .....I would only go out with other who dress while en femme, that way theres no worry and they understand you , and that really helps.

Lisa Lane.xoxo :)

[racquel]

I voted any-time any-where but I would like to clarify something.As most of the ladies stated previously it would require the other person to act and dress appropriately. ;)

[FionaAlexis]

I agree with Tristen .....I would only go out with other who dress while en femme, that way theres no worry and they understand you , and that really helps.

Lisa Lane.xoxo :)

Thanks Lisa - Well I guess my question is - how far does that 'no worry' and 'understanding' go?

Natalie Sweet put it very well:

Previously, I had this image of us all as girls, at different stages along the road to achieving a semblance of female perfection. Of course, that's a misconception, only a small proportion of us are trying to reach the "passable" standard anyway, most are just happy to pop on a frock or a pair of knickers for fun or as a turn-on.

Is your 'no worry' and feeling of 'understanding' limited to that 'small proportion trying to reach the 'passable' standard'? Or is it anyone, anywhere any time?

Fiona xx

[Rachel Ann]

I would only go out with other who dress while en femme, that way theres no worry and they understand you, and that really helps.
I sometimes hang out with CD friends while not dressed myself. For example, at a public event where other friends of mine are present. My friends are almost all hip and cool with TG/CD in principle, but they're not ready for me to be like that - and may never be.