Flying Safe

[Rachel E]

In the most recent problem with the person that was caught flying to the US. from Holland. My question is what about those of un that fly dressed or partualy underdressed?? If they start doing body scann, will they be able to detect what kind of cloths that we would be wearing??
Just a thought
Rachel E, Spokane, Wa:)

[Jason+]

An under wire bra will as I understand it already set off a metal detector or hand wand but other than having to answer a potentially embarrassing question won't get you in any direct trouble with the TSA. There are a couple of threads that support that.

I am not sure even the most sophisticated scanner could pick out and display the lace trimming on your delicates but should I be wrong about that it should also be able to determine you are a non threat as long as lace hasn't been outlawed.

:2c: as my best guess!

[Hope]

Yes.

no matter how good your tuck is, they will still see your junk, and be able to tell that you are not (physically at least) who you say you are. I would expect the more vigorous pat down after that.

[sherri52]

They will see your outline in the scanners and also catch your underwire bra. I would be more afraid of the physical patdowns which are in all of the smaller airports.

[RADER]

You could pull the wire out of your bra and hurt some-one. I believe all
the GG's should take notice of that. LOL Rader

[Michelle 51]

Just wear a non wired bra, padded with socks.

I think after that episode last week that any padding under your clothes that security notices is going to be a strip search.

[Jezebella]

CDs aren't the only ones out there who wear falsies. What about GGs who pad to enhance nature? What about survivors of breast cancer who've had surgery? I predict lawsuits if the TSA starts forcibly strip searching anyone wearing a padded bra.

[Jenny Wilson]

I've never seen or heard of an underwire bra setting off a metal detector, and I fly a lot. Other things that haven't set off a metal detector are a pair of glasses and a wedding ring.

I don't know what the 'critical mass" is, in the way of metal, that will set off the metal detector, but obviously, small amounts of metal doesn't do it.

Jenny

[theresa]

I've been thinking very much the same thing. For me, DRAB is normal routine on airlines UFN. I can still pack all my femme things and so I can still be myself once I've "arrived".

[Melanie R]

If you are concerned, just tell the scanner/TSA person that you are transgendered. They know what that means and will treat you with respect. If not, ask for their supervisor.

[sterling12]

I've never seen or heard of an underwire bra setting off a metal detector, and I fly a lot. Other things that haven't set off a metal detector are a pair of glasses and a wedding ring.

I don't know what the 'critical mass" is, in the way of metal, that will set off the metal detector, but obviously, small amounts of metal doesn't do it.

Jenny

I've used a metal detector for years Jenny. I think up until recent incidents, The TSA Folks had the Detectors Sensitivity turned down so that they wouldn't pick up things like bobbi-pins and garter clasps. But, could we really doubt that for The Foreseeable Future, they are going to have The Detectors turned "wide open" picking up the minutest bit of metal. They will also be soon using those whole body scanners everywhere, just as soon as they get them.

Now, does anyone doubt that if you presented with the slightest thing out of "The Norm," that you are going to get their full attention. Anyone care to bet that they won't be over-reacting to everything! But, then again...if you were in their shoes, wouldn't you do the same?

Peace and Love, Joanie

[Hope]

If you are concerned, just tell the scanner/TSA person that you are transgendered. They know what that means and will treat you with respect. If not, ask for their supervisor.

Ha! The TSA will treat you with respect! That is a good one!

[jennifer easton]

I was worried about my under wire bra enough that when I went to the court house to pay my personal property tax I didn't wear it for fear of setting it off, I don't know if it would or not, I under dress almost everywhere, do they set them off?

[Slim Jim]

Yes - they will see everything you have on underneath. Underwire bras really have nothing to do with it. If you don't want them to see it, here's your option...
don't wear it.

[Kickin' Crosser]

Ha! The TSA will treat you with respect! That is a good one!

The same people who consider non-organic peanut butter (that will, as a result, not have the watery substance) a liquid, no surprise there.

[Melanie R]

Ha! The TSA will treat you with respect! That is a good one!

I travel frequently and have always found this to be true. A lot depends on one's attitude and presentation.

[lingerieLiz]

I've flown almost every week for several years in drab. I've worn underwire bras and often forms on most every flight and seldom set off the alarms. None of which were because of my bra, but because I forgot which belt I was wearing, etc. I've been wanded and simply said my bra or that's the underwires. As I usually wear women's shirts and leave the second button undone. More than once I have simply pealed back the top so that they can see the bra's lace, they smile and I go on. TSA could care less.

The new system will show clothing lines. So it won't matter, the underwire will show along with the band, the cups, your cute thong, etc. Why worry, they are not going to stamp you with some symbol for crossdressing. Personally I don't care what they see, just nail the guy with the bomb. I don't want to skydive from 30,000 ft.

[pamela_a]

Somebody please tell me why it matters?

If you are that ashamed of what you're wearing then don't wear it!!

The TSA don't care. The person sitting next to you doesn't care, or if they do you'll never see them again so who cares?

No wonder everyone thinks something must be wrong with a CD/TG person because the majority of them act that way.

[Persephone]

Faces will be automatically blurred as they already are on the existing machines that have been in use for quite some time in Phoenix, Los Angeles, Baltimore, JFK and a number of other airports.

In addition, TSA will not keep, store or transmit images. Once deleted, they are gone forever. For additional privacy, the officer viewing the image is in a separate room and will never see the passenger and the officer attending to the passenger will never see the image. The officers have 2-way radios to communicate with other in case a threat object is identified.

[PamelaRI]

It is my understanding that underwire or not, the new full body scanners will show the outline of a bra and more. That's the big objection that people have with the TSA using them - severe invasion of privacy for little added security.

Personally, I try to avoid raising the ire of the TSA as much as possible for many reasons.

[Malori Cross]

Can you say "AMTRAK"? :)

[Samantha Kelsey]

Watching a sky news bulletin yesterday they showed a scanner in use. The scanners are designed to see NON METALIC objects such as plastic. They showed several people scans and there was no difficulty in seeing a persons underclothing clearly outlined by the seams. A guys boxers stood out just as well as a womans panties. Be Ready!

.

[Lorileah]

:dh: C'mon people. It is simple. If you are transitioning you will present as a female and you will have some sort of document stating such (note form your doctor should do just like if you have a pace maker or artificial hip). If you are not transitioning and traveling in femme they already KNOW (very few of us pass off as female). If you absolutely need to wear a bra...NO ONE Cares. It is an article of clothing. If they see your "junk" as stated again, who cares? Nature gave it to you half the population has it...so what? (if you are so worried it may thrill the TSA officer, maybe a profession in the adult movie industry would be a good choice).

Look at it this way. You plays the game you pays the price. You want to fly looking like a female, and you aren't, I would expect to be scrutinized more. It is not an invasion of privacy. You know going into the airport (which by the way is a government facility and subject to the rules of the government...so you relinquish your privacy rights when you enter) that you are subject to search (been that way for 80 years...there were signs even before 9/11 stating that). You know that a certain number of people will be searched more thoroughly than others. Your privacy is not more important than my right to live. So complain all you want about being scanned. You don't have anything anyone wants to see in real life. It is an image, it isn't a picture of you standing naked with a pina colada on the beach in Mexico.

There is nothing in the Bill of Rights that keeps them from scanning you as long as they don't choose you because of race creed color religion specifically for these searches (sorry but gender and sexual orientation aren't covered yet because no one seems to want to fight to get these passed). When everyone who passes through gets scanned (first by metal detectors and now image scanners) and you don't look suspicious you will be on your way, underwire bra and all.

You have the right to walk where you are going, drive within the parameters of the law, take the train but expect that you will be scanned there also very soon. And you have the right to pay your money get a ticket on an airline and be scanned and possibly searched. It is a known thing now. It isn't a surprise.

[JulieC]

The same people who consider non-organic peanut butter (that will, as a result, not have the watery substance) a liquid, no surprise there.

There are explosives available that are made from material that can look surprisingly a lot like peanut butter, with similar malleable properties.

[Kickin' Crosser]

There are explosives available that are made from material that can look surprisingly a lot like peanut butter, with similar malleable properties.

Too bad the machines that exist that check this well are extremely expensive and/or not commonplace, that would cut down on the no peanut-butter, no play dough idiocy going on. :straightface:

[JulieC]

Too bad the machines that exist that check this well are extremely expensive and/or not commonplace, that would cut down on the no peanut-butter, no play dough idiocy going on. :straightface:

The idiocy going on is the entire system. If someone wants to take a plane down, they can, regardless of the current measures in place. The terrorists won, in that the bazillions of dollars being spent on airline security is doing essentially nothing, and causing all of us a migraine. The 3 oz liquid bottle limitations are particularly hysterical.

It's all a charade, driven by politics and the public's idiotic outcry to do SOMEthing, ANYthing, to make us feeeeeeel 'safer'.

[vspowers]

I've never seen or heard of an underwire bra setting off a metal detector, and I fly a lot. Other things that haven't set off a metal detector are a pair of glasses and a wedding ring.

I don't know what the 'critical mass" is, in the way of metal, that will set off the metal detector, but obviously, small amounts of metal doesn't do it.

Jenny

Jenny,

I never had a problem for most flights, but I did have one flight out of Cleveland Hopkins where the metal walk through detector picked up my underwire. The agent asked "wearing a necklace?" when the wand went off on my upper body. This was before 9/11. Then he asked to see it. I said "OK, it's not a necklace, it's a bra!" I pulled down the neckline of my stretchy top far enough for him to see. He let me through without further comment.

[Persephone]

The idiocy going on is the entire system. If someone wants to take a plane down, they can, regardless of the current measures in place. The terrorists won, in that the bazillions of dollars being spent on airline security is doing essentially nothing, and causing all of us a migraine. The 3 oz liquid bottle limitations are particularly hysterical.

It's all a charade, driven by politics and the public's idiotic outcry to do SOMEthing, ANYthing, to make us feeeeeeel 'safer'.

Julie,

I'm always looking for a way to make a buck or two, so I have an idea I'd like to run by you.

Based upon the feeling that you and some others have, I'm thinking of starting an airline that will have no security checks. You buy a ticket, you get on, that's it.

So here's the serious question -- remember, I'm going to be betting my bucks and the bucks of investors on your answer (and some other surveys, of course) -- assuming our prices were the same, maybe even a bit lower, would you choose my airline?

Thanks,
Persephone.

[Kickin' Crosser]

They could start by spending more money on fixing the planes.
We were FAR down the runway a few days ago when they suddenly aborted the flight.

Actually, aborted takeoffs are rare, and can/do occur for many reasons. Some are aircraft related yes, some are due to weather, and some are due to other reasons - aircraft inadvertently straying onto the runway.

[Sweet Jane]

I guess if you're only underdressing, then you'll probably raise a few eyebrows. I saw an article that showed the image the operator sees and its reasonably clear!!

If you are presenting as a woman, then lets face it, they'll know you're transgendered. My guess would be one in a few hundred tgirls, may on close inspection be totally accepted as female, so there shouldn't be any surprises for the operator for most of us

[Daenna Paz]

[QUOTE=Lorileah;1995959]:dh: C'mon people. It is simple.

Sing it girl........................... :notworthy::notworthy:

[victoriamwilliams1]

The person who I know who fly en fem all the time is no longer on the forum! So from I have read is that if your flying domestic you should have no problems. I do think because of the recent event that happened in my area they have increased rules when flying out of or into the country. If you are flying out I would recommend a letter from a therapist to present to TSA if you are leaving the country. We can say we are transgender however with out documentation it can cause problems when flying international.

I know some say they carry check their fem items and that they have some "privacy" this is not true especially in ATL where every time I flew out my bags where checked! They leave a nice note in your bag to let you know they checked it. Remember your locks on your bags they have the keys too!

I say fly how you want and be ready for everything right now.

[Hope]

The idiocy going on is the entire system. If someone wants to take a plane down, they can, regardless of the current measures in place. The terrorists won, in that the bazillions of dollars being spent on airline security is doing essentially nothing, and causing all of us a migraine. The 3 oz liquid bottle limitations are particularly hysterical.

It's all a charade, driven by politics and the public's idiotic outcry to do SOMEthing, ANYthing, to make us feeeeeeel 'safer'.

Amen sister.

This is what the terrorists want. This panic, this chicken little response, this waisting our efforts and our resources on unfathomably expensive machines designed to violate our fundamental human dignity - to say nothing of our civil rights. This is what the terrorists want. Those of you who think the TSA is great and encourage deeper intrusions into our lives have been frightened into doing the terrorists bidding.

Here is the kicker in all of this - the airport where the Christmas day bomber got on the airplane, (after having been turned in to intelligence agencies by his family members and put on a watch list) apparently HAS these back scatter nude-o-vision machines. The machines didn't work in Amsterdam, why on earth would we think they were going to work here?

Risk is a part of life. No matter how difficult or degrading the TSA makes flying there will always be (and always has been) a risk of terrorism. Or technical malfunction. Or pilot error. Or some other just bat-dung crazy thing happening. Life is not, and cannot be made inherently safe.

People who want to get on an airplane with a bomb will always be able to do it. People who are willing to give up their lives in order to take someone else's are extremely hard, if not impossible to stop. These people are not stupid, and they do not lack resources. They will continue to get on airplanes with bombs, and the TSA will continue to fail to detect them, no matter what technology, or what extraordinary measures are used.

You can't stop people from getting on airplanes with bombs. It cannot be done. What you CAN do is change the nature of people's lives so that killing themselves does not look like an attractive career option. But that is not nearly as sexy (or as profitable) as a $300,000 backscatter nude-o-vision machine.