Don't know what to think

[JoAnne Wheeler]

SISTERS - I have not posted in awhile even though I get on this website at least once a day.

I have been having a very deep struggle within myself and with my spouse. I feel that I am either an obsessed crossdresser or a transgenderist (crossdresser who wants to dress 24/7) - I truly hate these labels, but I don't know how else to say it.

I told my spouse this and she went ballistic - she thinks that "transgenderist" is the same thing as "transsexual" - trying to explain the difference to her is impossible - we discussed the "D" word again

She did tell me that she can live with a crossdresser, but not with a transgenderist/transsexual

I don't know what I am - I cannot get enough crossdressing - I think that between the "pink" fog on one side and "severe frustration and depression" on the other, I am about to implode.

My spouse still thinks that she is "competing" with JoAnne and JoAnne is winning. We have had a very rough holiday period.

Some of you may say how lucky I am to have a spouse who can live with a crossdresser (as long as I do not shave off my thick body hair) - this is her boundary - like some of you, I have HATED and DESPISED my body hair since puberty - I cannot stand it - JoAnne cannot stand it. So here I am - confused and frustrated.

I am at the point where I want to "come out" to the world - I want everyone to know that JoAnne lives within me and wants out completely. I have discussed this with my biological SRS/TS sister who has advised me not to "come out" because the cost would be too high. But that darn "pink fog" keeps getting the best of me.

JoAnne has a wonderfully/complete wardrobe and is ready to go out in the world - but the costs are high (divorce, no job, no friends - other than you all - no place to live) You would think that common sense would supply the answer - but that "pink fog" and that URGE and the anxiety of not going forward are pushing me - maybe it is because I am getting older and I see life slipping away

I don't know what to think

JoAnne Wheeler

[Karren H]

Sounds to me like you need to strike a balance in your life... Of those things that are most important to you and your family. And if you can't do it for yourself then you probably need to seek professional help.... In my humble opinion.

[Kate Simmons]

I agree with Karren Hon. This thing will take on a mind of it's own and lead you around if you don't get a handle on it.:)

[Angie G]

I'm with Karren hun. You just may need help sorting all these feeling.:hugs:
Angie

[sherri52]

I think as we get older we get to the point of "I don't care". I myself have a habit of telling someone almost everyday of my crossdressing. I also get braver each day as to what I wear while i'm dress (supposedly) in drab. I am divorced and no longer have a spouse to contend with. You have that, and I would give much to have a supportive wive. I couldn't give up dressing but I believe I could tone some part of it down. Not the hair, I'm not going to let it grow back:heehee:.

[cordgrass]

I'm certainly no expert on crossdressing, being a total newbie, but severe frustration and depression raise some warning flags. You might want to try temporarily raising your serotonin level to buy you some breathing room. 5-HTP might help, or St. John's Wort. Neither require a prescription, although read up on side effects and drug interactions.

Of course a better thing to do would be to go to a doctor and get an antidepressant. At any rate, I think this sort of decision shouldn't be made hastily, and raising your serotonin will buy you some time and may dispel the pink fog a bit.

[StephanieH]

I think we all go through stages of this from time to time. I've been really down about not dressing much at all lately - very much in a funk about it.

Don't cave in to divorce, try to work through it and like Karen said, get some outside help. Take care and God bless. :straightface:

[Sandra]

JoAnne IMHO you really do need to talk to someone about how you feel. As you've been told before, your wife would be welcomed here to chat with other wives about cding, it my just help her understand a bit more.





At any rate, I think this sort of decision shouldn't be made hastily, and raising your serotonin will buy you some time and may dispel the pink fog a bit.

How will raising her levels dispel the pink fog? If anything it could make it worse, she becomes more happy so pink fog is increased...and yeah I know about serotnin levels as I take SJW to keep my levels level.

[Slim Jim]

I have been having a very deep struggle within myself and with my spouse. I feel that I am either an obsessed crossdresser or a transgenderist (crossdresser who wants to dress 24/7) - I truly hate these labels, but I don't know how else to say it.
All this drama won't help your situation.
relax and get your priorities straight. You control the cd-ing - the cd-ing doesn't control you.

[sonia_dargency]

I have been having a very deep struggle within myself and with my spouse. I feel that I am either an obsessed crossdresser or a transgenderist (crossdresser who wants to dress 24/7) - I truly hate these labels, but I don't know how else to say it.


JoAnnne,

Labels suck, forget about the semantic.

It seems that you are spiraling down toward yourself, get out of the vicious circle; there is no way you will be able to make a adult decision right now, so don't.

I went through a similar stage, now before dressing up, I ask myself I will really enjoy it or it is just an urge without real foundation. sometime I skip it and don't miss it.

Step back and give back - to your wife first, she is your main asset - take her our, bring her flowers and gifts, massage her feet, spend quality time with her as a tender sensitive man. forget about yourself a bit;

call friends, spend time with them, volunteer to help, clean something.

External help is good, I am not too much into medication (except vodka) but if it works for you, so be it. Use your crossdressing to relax, not to anguish.

You need a hug, comfort, tender loving care - give some away and it will come back to you.


You did a courageous thing by opening yourself to us, it is a sign that you are not that down below, you still have some kick in you.

Sonia

[cordgrass]

How will raising her levels dispel the pink fog? If anything it could make it worse, she becomes more happy so pink fog is increased...and yeah I know about serotnin levels as I take SJW to keep my levels level.

I did some searching on this site.

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1239117&postcount=1

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1641925&postcount=22

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1245408&postcount=15

See, and this post on Wellbutrin, which raises both serotonin and dopamine, increased the desire for cding. Most antidepressants just raise serotonin.

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=855562&postcount=1

I suspect high dopamine might contribute to the pink fog.

On the other hand, this is the wrong approach for JoAnne since she's already taking antidepressants.

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1555828&postcount=25

It might be that her various antidepressants are interacting to make things worse than they should be? Obviously therapy would be helpful, but the doctor should check to make sure the meds are in balance. Especially if any of the meds are raising her dopamine level, like if she's on Wellbutrin. :2c:

I'm not a doctor, I'm not prescribing from the backseat, but physiology does affect thoughts and vice versa.

BTW, I'm very pro-pink-fog--I live in one myself, or more like a purple fog. My dopamine levels are sky high. Not saying I'm against pink fog at all! Just that sometimes life and pink fog can be at odds, and I've learned over the years how to dispel the fog in an emergency.

[Spacey]

JoAnne, I have been struggling with some of the same feelings lately and am starting therapy this week. Myself in the closet still with my wife. You need to get your feelings out. It sounds like she doesn't want to deal with it. You need to talk to a therapist or counselor who will listen and hopefully clear your anxieties and help you cope. This should give you the tools to communicate to your wife as to where you are. I don't know If you have any health coverage or if you can afford therapy but counseling can be next to nothing and free in some cases. You just have to search it out.

[Nicole Erin]

Well if you do decide you want to live full time as a woman (labels aside) then maybe start planning how to go about this.

You know things like maybe mentally prepare for the costs. Where you might live, what if things go wrong, a back up plan.

I can understand about feeling like life is slipping away. Maybe in mid 30's I shouldn't dare say I fully understand.

Maybe it is time to live for you? I assume the kids are grown and out of the nest by now. I assume your parents have passed on so "coming out" to them is not going to be an issue.

See, when we are young, 25 or younger, people want to tell us how to live, try to manipulate our lives or in some cases, trap us in situations that would take years to recover from. It is cause many young people are naive. As one gets older, they know the harshness of life.

So, at this point, you are not some young naive kid who thinks she has to do something cause someone said.

In your golden years, it is high time to decide how you want to spend them. It is time to live for YOU.

[ReineD]

BTW, I'm very pro-pink-fog--I live in one myself, or more like a purple fog. My dopamine levels are sky high. Not saying I'm against pink fog at all! Just that sometimes life and pink fog can be at odds, and I've learned over the years how to dispel the fog in an emergency.

Cordgrass, the pink fog is not what you think it is. Here (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1986486&postcount=20) is a description from a different thread.


Joann, you may need to talk to your doctor about changing your meds if they are no longer effective. I also agree with Sandra about asking your wife to join this site and become a member of FAB. Is there a possibility the two of you could see a marital counselor who is familiar with gender issues?

[MsJoann]

I agree with Karen. There needs to be a balance in our lives. I am fortunate to have been self employed to where I can allow myself to wear women's clothing to work everyday.
My typical day starts out with facial cleansing, some mascara, trim the eyebrows,, some moisturizer and powder. Then put on a bra and panties, then usually women's jeans and a sweater (toned-down style) and sometimes an athletic jacket. Necklaces and bracelets too!
In the summer, it is always shorts and canvas sneakers.
I call it pushing it to the edge because I will not wear a dress or skirt to work. The daring-est I have gotten was white or denim capri pants.
I believe this is my own form of "balance" as it still allows some makeup and clothing application, just enough to hold my satisfaction for my feminine expression.
And yes I do get some strange looks at times but I just blow them off. It's my life, and I choose to express myself differently but also blend in with others of my gender.

[Kelly DeWinter]

I did some searching on this site.


BTW, I'm very pro-pink-fog--I live in one myself, or more like a purple fog.



I'm not sure what you man ??? You must not understand the term 'pink fog' .


Depression is something that a trained professional should treat, Reccomending anything, even over the counter products is not advisable. Some people have severe reactions to things like St Johns worts.

[JoAnne Wheeler]

To all of my sisters out there who suggested taking an anti-depressant, I am already taking 5 anti-depressants per day and I am still depressed, sad, frustrated and confused. I cannot stand many attributes of my male body, yet I realize that I would be a 6' tall, pleasantly plump, lady. I only feel relaxed and calm when I am dressed - I feel that I "crossdress" when I have to wear my male clothing (which I hate)

I do not think that society (at least in this rural red-neck, Christian-fundamentalist) area that I live could accept or even tolerate my feminine side.

I am so confused and just don't know what to do or how to exist with all the diametrically opposing pressures that are constantly tearing at me.

It seems that no matter what I choose, I lose. I think that I am in a mess.

JoAnne Wheeler

[Sandra]

JoAnne if you're taking that many tablets then I really think you should go back to your Dr and tell him that you are still depressed, obviously something is not working for you. Does your Dr know you are transgendered? if not how about telling him/her, it may help him/her to help you.

:bh:

[giuseppina]

Hi JoAnne,

Sandra has the right idea. If you are working with your family doctor, perhaps it is time for a referral to a psychiatrist. It could be that the medications you are currently taking have stopped working for you.

Drugs are only part of the equation for clearing depression, as they don't change the negative thought patterns. That is something you have to do yourself, probably with the help of a psychiatrist or therapist. Clearing depression requires taking risks in changing your thinking. While this is not easy, it is doable.

Good luck. :hugs:

[2b.Lauren]

JoAnne--I always want to be careful in any situation prior to giving suggestions and or what is easily considered advice. Not always the best thing to do. I make many referrals to medical professionals in my day. As a therapist I am not in the business of prescribing meds. I leave that to the professionals. Family Doctor's and or GP's are are really good at managing one or two anti-depressants, but once you get to more than that, it is best to see a psychiatrist for further management. They are really the best at dealing with multiple meds. As for some that have suggested herbal treatments and so on I encourage them to think twice before making such suggestions in the future. Without having knowledge of these areas it can be very dangerous.

Counseling is a great way to go and can help you as the medications adjust your biochemical situation. Having your wife as a part of this will only make this process better. Hun take it easy on yourself, and just try to find that balance in your life. I know I have personally struggled with many of the issues you mentioned and still do from time to time. Just keep seeking the assistance of the wonderful sisters in this forum and seek out others that can help you decide where you want to go. Remember, honestly we get but one spin here in our lives, this one is not a dress rehearsal, so you must do the things that will provide you with happiness and with congruence of self.

[sonia_dargency]

It seems that no matter what I choose, I lose. I think that I am in a mess.


JoAnne - it hurts me so much to read that, I used to feel the same.

I suffered severe chronic depression (the "Black Dog") - I started to get out of it a few years ago, I am still very cautious not to fall back.

Talk to us - talk to your doctor - get your medication straight - keep talking

the key is to not let your mind wanders - keep busy.
I love cleaning, it's easy, rewarding, useful, you achieve something good, keeps you absorbed witou being exhausting.

Solutions will come up to you, some choices will be hard to do.

Believe it or not but it is a sure fact that some of your red neck conservatives have their own little secret as well...

I will be away for a few weeks, will try get to the forum to see how you are doing.

Love you

Sonia

PS - move to New York
S

[Kelly DeWinter]

JoAnne,

This is something I posted in another section of this forum, When I learned to look for the triggers for my depression, it became easier to deal with the Big "D", using this does NOT cure depression, but helps you manage it. I agree that if you are suffering from heavy depression seek out competent medical care and advice.

I do work with both men and women who suffer from clinical depression, and those who use this simple method have seen an improvement in their lives

I have learned to use the HALT principals when dealing with my depression. Today I am off of the heavy meds and life is pretty good for a change. Here is a brief that may help. PM me if you want to discuss this further.

"H.A.L.T." We often resort to self defeating behaviors (addictions, negative thinking, lethargy, and depression to name a few) when we either get too Hungry, Angry, Lonely or Tired. Thus, paying attention to these fundamental vulnerabilities is a great place to begin a journey into self care.
Try not to get too:

Hungry - Eat. Nibble on healthy snacks throughout the day. Be sure to pack a lunch, or think of when and where you will eat each of your meals today. Also, drink plenty of water.
Angry - Breathe. Take a deep breath and focus on your heart. Call a friend to vent. Contact your therapist. Go exercise. Make yourself laugh out loud as if you are acting until you can't help but really laugh.
Lonely - Reach out. Contact someone who makes you feel good. Go to a group, meeting, class, church or even a public park. Connect with your animal companions. Volunteer at an elderly home or other organization.
Tired - Sleep. Nap. Be sure to get an adequate amount of sleep at night. Don't expect too much out of yourself if time is limited. Toss the to-do list or delegate. Find quiet space to simply be.

[suchacutie]

JoAnne....run...do not walk...to the nearest phone and call your physician. Make an appointment and talk about a diagnosis for depression. It is important that before you make any life decisions that you have this doctor's visit. This cannot be self-diagnosed! Trust me! You absolutely need an outsider to ask you the important questions and let them make a decision. Depression can be dealt with. It is a chemical imbalance and has nothing to do with you or your situation. It is very much like getting a sinus infection that needs drugs or it will never get better!

Please...this is important...please call your physician asap and let nothing stop you. Very important!

please.

tina

[Wen4cd]

It's not supposed to work like this. :( Coming to terms with your feminine side is supposed to improve relationships, not destroy them.

It sounds like there's some big miscommunication in your relationship, dealing with terms, obsessions, and archetypes, desire, identity etc. It's probably coming from you own 'torn' state right now.

You want to be 'yourself' which you see as JoAnne, and are being pulled in that direction, and your wife sees it differently, that JoAnne is not 'you,' but someone else entierely. You: inverted. She's clinging to a persona you are trying to not be, because that persona means unhappiness anymore, and you've transferred most of your good traits over to the JoAnne persona by now. Self-hate and conflict is probably projecting, bouncing off the walls all around your home lke a pall.

Then there's the fact that you, both as JoAnne and as him, are not really 'made of clothes' either way. I've lived torn in the dualism, and as CD's, we're used to expressing it literally 'on our shirtsleeves,' externally, and this causes a rift of sorts. The feelings that the clothes and pronouns represent to us don't actually require clothes or the gender status at all, but that's how we do it, because it just is.

It needs reframing badly. First off, you should rule out obsession if you can, and you should try to see what your wife sees in this situation.

The mose effective, but most painful way to do that, I've found, is to go out to the library, and check out a book called "Christine" by Stephen King, every library has it. Substiture "JoAnne" every time you see the word "Christine" If there are way too many negative paralells, you're likely dealing with obsession, and possibly negative/shadow anima identity posession.

I did this myself because I am of an obsessive personality, and look for paralells like these, and normal phychological labels like 'depression' are a bad joke compared to the anguish issues like this cause.

Try to find the 'feminine' traits that inherently know how to relate to your SO and understand where's she's coming from. Not just the words, but the emotions. There's more than 'dressing as' involved. You should be able to relate to your wife, or be able to find the parts that can, if you consider yourself a girl inside. It's there in all people, regardless of gender.

[Sweet Jane]

I'm so sorry that theres such internal and external conflict in your life causing you such unhappiness

The only advice I dare offer is that both you and your wife should seek some form of counselling together. It seems she doesn't understand who you are and maybe you are missing her subtle points as well. At least together, with a trained facilitator you can be understood.

I would also see another doctor....you seem to be on far too much medication to still be feeling depressed, theres something wrong there too

I hope you work it all out, and there is joy in the endxx

[Joanne f]

What may help you to cope with the situation is a slightly different way of thinking, you say that you can only cope when you are dressed as JoAnne as you hate your male side so in one sense you are letting the clothes dictate who you are or how you feel.
With a little practice you can keep that feeling whatever clothes you have on , it does not cure it but it can relieve a lot of the anxiety and necessity to dress to get that relief, just learn how to keep the feminine feeling whatever you are wearing and the clothes will become a bonus and not a necessity, and hopefully this in turn may help your wife to cope with the situation .

[Tommie Rae]

Let's look at the costs of coming out - divorce, no job, no friends, no place to live. Every one of us has to face these problems. We have the right to be who we are, and our wives have the right to be married to the person they want. If those two things cannot be resolved then divorce may be the solution. I don't like it either but that is for many of us the reality.

There are plenty of feminine things that can be worn to a job and no one will think twice about it. If you want to keep in stealth on the job you can do it and still bring out your female side. And I see that you are 64 years old. You might want to think about applying for Social Security soon.

If your "friends" reject you after you come out then they really were not the kind of people you want as friends. So make some new ones. The only opinion that counts is really your wife's, and she has already made it known how she feels. A lot of people will have to reject you in public in order to maintain their standing in the Moral Majority but a lot of those same people will respect you for having the courage of your convictions. And some of them are probably going through the same inner conflict as you.

Why would you have no place to live? Your wife can tell you to leave and you can tell her you have no intention of leaving. Unless the house is in her name you have just as much right to live in it as she does. The atmosphere would be pretty nasty, but it would be that way with her no matter where you live. Stand your ground if it comes to that.

Please note that I am not advocating any of these actions. I am just trying to point out that you can take these possible negative outcomes and turn them around to be positive. Think about how you can make this work before you either give up or make a break without a set of clearly defined goals.

We are all hoping that whatever happens is the best possible for you and your loved ones.