Need an Outside Opinion

[jessikasummerfox]

Okay, so I am an occasional dresser, and although I am still technically in the closet, I tend to incorporate my gender issues in my drab appearance a little. It is not overt or anything, just different. For instance, I happen to have curly hair down to the middle of my back, and I have worn braids, headbands, and bandannas out in public. But while that might appear weird to some people, it is not consciously feminine. I am not crossing the gender barrier, but I am right beside the line sometimes.

I feel more transgendered than anything else, but I don't feel the need to dress all of the time. If anything, I think I feel a little bi-gendered, able to speak both gender languages, but not really fitting into either group.

Also, another thing to know is that I believe my family suspects something about my trans issues, but I think we're both happy to make it something we don't discuss ever. They won't broach it with me, and I won't broach it with them. It's better that way for me (at least for now.)

Finally, while I am in my thirties, I am full time student at university trying to get back on my feet.

Okay, so that is the background. What follows is the thing I need an opinion on:

---

At school, there is a woman about my age, who is slightly unusual. She's somewhat of an extrovert, and maybe she discloses information about herself too readily. She's tall, but clearly a GG. I hate making generalizations, but if she were lesbian, it would not surprise me.

I have talked to her in the past about her life and schoolwork, but nothing any more than I do with anyone willing to talk about such things. I'm pretty introverted, but I like learning about other people.

So, last week in class, while we are talking about an upcoming assignment, she mentions to the class and instructor that she would like to do her assignment about transvestites. The class has a laugh along with her about it, but apart from the humorousness of the initial suggestion, she is serious. Essentially, the assignment is developing a marketing plan for a demographic of consumers.

She starts asking me advice about it. How she should go about doing the assignment or where to go for more information about trans stuff. That, combined with a passing remark or two about how I could really pass for an attractive woman if she did my makeup, throws me for a little loop. It seems like she is dropping hints. My mind is a little blown, but whatever. She won't come out and ask me about it, and even if she did, I am pretty certain I wouldn't say. To my best knowledge, even if she suspects, she can't know for sure about "jessika."

Anyway, she has ALSO been suggesting that we get together to study over coffee or hang out some time. Even before the assignment was given, she had mentioned months ago about studying together. I hemmed and hawed at the time putting her off as best I could.

About her assignment, I did mention that I had once taken a "queer theory," course for my literature classes, and so I knew a couple of things about transgender stuff, but I backpedalled (alright, lied a little) as well saying that I didn't know all that much about it, seeing as we only read short stories in that queer studies class.

I am trying to keep my distance from her. Yes, she is attractive, but I am not certain about what her agenda might be. Is she looking for a cross-dresser boyfriend, does she want a platonic and (to her mind) "gay" friend to girltalk with her? Does she want something else? Confusingly, she has also mentioned some other guy a lot, which might either be her boyfriend, her roommate, or both. I am unclear.

I don't know what her motives are, what she suspects about me, or if she could emotionally handle a relationship with someone else right now.

Any advice about this would be very, very much appreciated.

[Joni Marie Cruz]

Hi Jessika-

Well, hon, it's only coffee and talking about an assignment. I would say go for it and just see what happens. No need for immediate self disclosure or to wear a pink "TG AND PROUD" t-shirt or anything like that. And it's quite possible she has no agenda and would simply like to be friends with you. Just play it by ear, who knows, it could be the start of something good.

Hugs...Joni Mari

[KarenHiller]

I'm guessing she's very much interested in you, and she seems like she'd be a good match as she's not conventional either. If you're attracted to her, then have coffee with her, and then the next time she mentions her male friend, just ask if he's her boyfriend. There's nothing wrong with that.

In my opinion, she's asked to spend private time with you several times. It's all up to you now. You may end up with a good friend, or more. What do you have to lose?

Karen

[DonnaLynn77]

Yes, do have coffee with her! You may regret it forever if you don't. And yeah, what's the harm in casually asking about the other man, it's a natural question as you're getting to know someone. :)

[LisaKarenAZ]

My only question to you is.....
What are you waiting for? Go have coffee and talk.
As already mentioned, what do you have to lose?

[Holly]

Nowhere in your post do you say what YOUR feelings are about her. If you are intertested in her, make arrangements to spend some time together, getting to know one another better. If your not interested, just remain as classmates.

[jessikasummerfox]

Nowhere in your post do you say what YOUR feelings are about her. If you are intertested in her, make arrangements to spend some time together, getting to know one another better. If your not interested, just remain as classmates.

Good point. I have to admit that I am very attracted to her (both physically and emotionally), but I am also hesitant for two reasons.

First, my last GF strongly disapproved of men crossdressing on principle, found out about me, and then used it to embarrass me with her own family. Her brother even teased me about it at one point. It was a really mean thing for her to do, but at the time, I think I handled it really well. She came out looking more like a jerk than anything, even if her family thought I was weird. However, the emotional impact of that experience has made it so I am reluctant to jump into another relationship. I would really hate to have Jessika used against me like some kind of weapon again.

The second reason is that I am hesitant is that I am afraid it could be the total opposite of my past GF. What if a date turned out really well, and she was okay with Jessika, or even encouraging? Weird feeling to have, right? Shouldn't I be excited at this possibilty?

Instead, I am thinking, "What if we end up together and she encourages me to dress up more?" While the closet has its drawbacks, many people are in there because it feels like a safe place. No-one but yourself has to worry about your transgender stuff.

I feel like I sometimes struggle with my gender identity, and so it is already hard for me to keep Jessika inside as much as I do. As I think I mentioned in my initial post, Jessika is already coming out in little pieces in my male appearance and behavior (the long hair styled on border of feminity, the frequent "girly" conversations with female friends and classmates, and the numerous other subtle gender cues other people seem to be already picking up on.) I do my best to hide it. Yet, if I went on a date with my unconventional classmate and it led to something more--to a place where she enjoyed me as Jessika--she could tip the balance on this delicate internal struggle. I would then worry if Jessika was taking over my life. Am I really ready for Jessika to be a more visible and active part of it?

Once I got started on dating her, it would be hard for me to turn around and go back the other way if it intially went well, but then became bad for some reason. I am not very assertive by nature, so I am trying to figure all of the potential consequences out before I even get started. I would have a hard time with the inevitable conflict, or the embarrassment if my trust about Jessika and my gender stuff was betrayed. I would rather avoid it.

But, again, I also have to say that this is such an awkward position for me to be in since I never thought anything like this could happen, I really don't know what to think. I am trying to read her motivations, but for some reason, I am having a lot of trouble.

Having said all of that, I might go out with her for a cup of coffee the next time she offers (which I think she might again). No harm in just one cup of coffee I suppose. And I will be asking her about that other guy. If she is his girlfriend, then I will feel much better about pulling back from her.

Bottom line about all of this: I think I am looking for potential warning signs before I feel like I can trust her with Jessika. I have never encountered anyone in my daily life who could be okay with gender stuff like this classmate seems to be. I know how to handle people who hate it, and I expect that (as I live in a relatively small town). I have no clue on how to handle people who are enthusiastic about it. Jessika is such a private and important part of me. I don't want her/me to be betrayed again.

[Samantha Girl]

It sounds to me like she likes you, and as someone else said it's only coffee. At least over coffee or studying you can learn more about her and start to feel her out more ;)

I'm sorry to hear about your past experiences, but those were different circumstances, with different people. Plus she sounds a lot different than your ex, I say give it a shot. I understand the fear, but you have to live your life. It took me a long time to stop living in fear, about a lot more than cross dressing. I am pretty introverted and shy myself :)

Still, only you can decide, but I say go for it, Good luck! :cheer:

[steftoday]

sounds great to me! where were these girls years ago?

good God, go have coffee and talk!!

[Joni Marie Cruz]

Jessika, hon, do you ever feel like you overthink things? Too many, what if this and what if that? I know how it feels, I do it all the time, sometimes it's like a sort of mental paralysis. Just go for it and deal with things as they come up. Better than over intellectualizing and regretting it later. Just my two cents, girl.

Good luck and best wishes.

Hugs...Joni Mari



But, again, I also have to say that this is such an awkward position for me to be in since I never thought anything like this could happen, I really don't know what to think. I am trying to read her motivations, but for some reason, I am having a lot of trouble..

[Samantha Girl]

Oh and I totally forgot to say I loooove your avatar Jessika! That show is hysterical, although I myself would've chose Vendetta! :devil:

[Sweet Jane]

go, enjoy coffee and her company....you only need to disclose what you're comfortable disclosing.

it sounds to me like you're smitten with this women, so be happy, enjoy her company and whatever wil be, will be.....

[Terrihoney]

Jessika,

Stop thinking so D**n much! You've got a good looking girl right in front of you, who's into, may I say, 'alternate' lifestyles. Where's the downside?

Terri

[AmandaM]

If you don't have coffee with her, you'll regret it. And if she offers to do your makeup again, ask her if she is "into" transvestites. Why not?

[jessikasummerfox]

It's sort of funny how much consensus there seems to be about this. I will try to keep everyone posted about how it goes in the next couple of weeks or so. I just have to keep telling myself it's just a coffee invitation.

[Joanne f]

As the rest have said there will be no harm in going for coffee, don`t let one bad experience ruin the rest of your life but on the other hand use it as knowledge of what can happen , just be yourself and i am sure all will be fine , if you have a question to ask her just ask it as that will show her that you have some interest in her as well , nothing to personal though (yet).

[tricia_uktv]

I promise you will regret it forever if you don't take her up on it. It seems you are in a good position to go further so have a go, but do it slowly.

[Shari]

Jessika
By all means, go for it.
Allow the conversation to drift toward her assignment and offer yourself up as an open minded individual who would love to help her get a good grade. Volunteer to be her "guinea pig."
Ask her to turn you into a woman and see where it goes from there. You could do a "psychological" assessment together of the varying stages of dressing, how you feel with each item of clothing and make up as the male goes away and the female emerges.
After the transformation is complete, she might even want to dress you and take you out.
Honey, the door is wide open.
Don't blow this one.
Damn, I wish I were you right now.

[Jennifer Cox]

Jessika, hon, do you ever feel like you overthink things? Too many, what if this and what if that? I know how it feels, I do it all the time, sometimes it's like a sort of mental paralysis. Just go for it and deal with things as they come up. Better than over intellectualizing and regretting it later. Just my two cents, girl.

Good luck and best wishes.

Hugs...Joni Mari

Couldn't have said it any better myself, except to add that you seem to be putting barriers in place, possibly due to a fear of rejection. My advice would be to grab this opportunity with both hands, but just take it slowly until you feel more comfortable. As the saying goes "it's not what you do that you regret, but what you don't do".

[ChanDelle]

Please don't blow this opportunity! But as she seems so forthright towards you, why not draw her motivation out by simply asking her? It's obvious she's certainly interested in you for some reason, and it shouldn't be that hard to figure out. You'll never find out what's going on just rolling it about in your head.

Good luck and please do keep us posted.

ChanDelle

[Chari]

Great advice from all previous posts! It is up to you as to your comfort zone, and how much you are willing to tell her. Go slow, enjoy her company, become good friends if that is where this situation is headed. Perhaps she too has "secrets" that she would like to tell you. She may be just curious about you and need a friend. If she wants to do your makeup, play dressup - let her as long as no pics are taken! You have fought off other bad situations and survived! Whatever you decide, do not reveal too much - too soon.

[Raychel]

My opinion matches everyone else's, Go out with coffee with her, Maybe you should ask her for coffee.

Lay it all on the table and see just what her feeling are, and where she is thinking the relationship (if any) should go.

Very interesting thread, I will be watching to find out how it goes for you. :thumbsup::thumbsup:

[lavistaa62]

Without knowing her or viewing her body language she sounds very sincere, genuine and dare I say- ideal. If I'd met someone like her when I was in college I'm pretty sure I'd have gone for it in a big way. My situation going into college was similar to what you describe- I'd gotten burned big time by someone I really cared about and hence didn't date anyone for any reason the whole time as I couldn't afford drama unsetting my college plans. That was when I was young and immature though- not if I was single and met someone like you describe I'd totally go for it.

[JamieOH]

I only wish I had someone I could TALK to about this stuff.. I mean I have this board, and it is truly wonderful.. The people here are Absolutely FABULOUS.. Except Karen Hutton who is a hockey playing tramp.. :tongueout..... But seriously.. It would be great to be able to sit down in a coffee shop or something, and just talk to someone who knows.. someone who doesnt care.. My wife "knows" but dont like it.. and dont want to see it.. so I dont talk about it... though she is waning some... she has allowed me to wear nightgowns and babydolls and things to bed.. which is nice.. though I dont know how she really feels anymore about it.. I'm afraid to ask her since she gave me the look of death the last time... sigh... GO HAVE COFFEE! It will have a profound impact on the rest of your life.. one that I am sure will be positive...

[sherri52]

Go with her for coffee. Some individual time together will open the door a little and get you close enough to find out what is on her mind. She may just want to be friends or she might just want to do your makeup for you (yes), or she may even want to get closer. You have to have that coffee to find out. A few years ago I had hair down to the small of my back and I used clips, multible bands or braided it. I was proud of my hair and got a lot of compliments on it. Sometimes people take it as being femme, think about it is there a place for men to get clips for thier hair. My hair was cut but is back to my shoulders. It took 13 years to reach my belt, I'm only on three now.

[Daniela76]

Please, please, please go out with this girl!
You for sure have something to worry about. There could be bad from this. But I see so much more good coming from this. You seem to like her quite a bit. You sound like a cute innocent girl with a crush on a popular & charming boy. So what if the genders are reversed?
Give it a shot. Make sure & be honest with yourself & what you want. Be honest with her to your level of comfort. Do NOT lie to her. Just say you aren't comfortable if she asks certain things.
Maybe Jessika will come out more. Maybe you really want her to, maybe you don't.

I could ramble on all day about this, but I've reined myself in now.

[jessikasummerfox]

This is an update to this situation, but before I go any further, I would like to say how much I appreciated everyone's input. In my first post, I wrote the following:

Confusingly, she has also mentioned some other guy a lot, which might either be her boyfriend, her roommate, or both. I am unclear.

So tonight after class, she mentions him again, and taking the advice from the forum, I ask if he happens to be her boyfriend. She says "yes, he is."

Joni is right when she suggested I overthink things. I am so much of an introvert and so very shy sometimes that when someone expresses even the smallest interest in me, it sets me off running mentally in a million different directions. My classmate might be indeed sending me mixed signals, but that is likely combined with my mental gymnastics to such a degree that I wound up distorting the whole picture in my head. In brief, I may have over thought this.

To her, I did not indicate that the news she had a boyfriend registered beyond just a casual notice on my part. But inside, I felt foolish and ashamed of myself. Against common sense, I had allowed myself to hope that her attention meant something that was much more pleasing to my ego. Aside from all of these sudden realizations I had at that moment, we continued to talk pleasantly for a bit about various things like assignments before I excused myself to go home. I will work on being less of an overthinker in the future, and when we interact in the future, my emotional footing will be more sure because I know where I stand with her.

I apologise for all of my earlier ramblings about this. But, I have to admit I was really confused. I really do appreciate everyone's kind words and advice. Thank you.

[GaleWarning]

I'd still go for the coffee, Jessika.
You are classmates and both of you will benefit from studying together.
If her relationship is serious, there will be no harm.
If it is not, and she is looking around for a change, you might be it.:)

[Shelly67]

Go for the caffine , sit back and chill .You have nothing to hide , just be you . At least you'll have the chance to guage the situation . Either way the outcome , it,ll be an experience in the learning curve of life , hopefully resulting in a safe platonic relationship ......... She may after all be experiencing a worrying , nagging concern over her boyfriend , have picked up on you're considerate nature and be even about to ask you for advice .You never know ......:drink:

[carolinoakland]

Oh shoot, I'll worry a compliment to death to dear, but heck. She wants to ask you, you won't volunteer in public, ok. She figured that out. THATS WHY SHE ASKED YOU TO GO FOR COFFEE. To ask you things in private and discreetely. I know I'm dense, but even I figured this one out. Go. Have a coffee. It's not required that you post an engagement ring as a deposit when you show up...the worse thing that could happen is that you'd make a friend outside of school. Enjoy!!!!! Carol

[Joni Marie Cruz]

Hi Jessika-

Speaking for myself, my advice still stands, if she asks (no reason you can't hint or even ask outright yourself) then go out for coffee and a chat with her. Nothing in the rules say that you can't be friends, I've been married for a hundred years and most of my best friends are women who are also married. Please don't let your natural shyness keep you from making a new female friend who may be supportive, understanding and helpful. Go for it, girl.

Hugs...Joni Mari

[jessikasummerfox]

Okay, recap: I go to school with a woman who appears to be interested in me, who has mentioned a couple of times how good I would look in a dress, and who has offered to take me out to coffee. And, she also has talked about her live-in boyfriend on occasion.

- - - - -

So, the other night, she mentions that she is going for coffee and asks me if I want to come along. Fighting against impulse, I say "sure, why not?" Of course, I really want to say, "oh NO, but thanks though," and start making for the nearest exit. But I surprise myself, and maybe her, by saying "yes." (Everyone's positive comments here helped me out.) Still, this isn't like a date or anything. Just a quick run through the coffee-shop drive-thru, fifteen minutes at most. As she drives us there, we have pleasant conversation. Mostly, I ask her about her background, and we talk a little about school. She even pays for my drink. I try to pay on my own, and I feel guilty about her spending a small amount of money on me.

When we get back to campus, we go to the computer lab to work on another class assignment together. One of our other classmates from the other room soon joins us. I find myself enjoying this time we spend working in the lab as a group, even though I normally work on all my projects alone. The three of us spend about two hours total figuring out how to do the assignment. By now it is totally dark outside and the school day is over. The computer lab is closing anyway, so we all part ways.

Anyway. I am still confused about her because it seems like she is definitely flirting with me, flirting a lot! But she also mentions her boyfriend a few times in our conversations and remarks how he and she are going to be doing this thing or that or whatever. Then, while she does tell me how long she had been looking for a study group, she also says things like how much she appreciates me helping her. (She even touches my shoulder once or twice when talking to me. Laughs at my lame jokes, etc.)

All this attention feels really good. And I think that I have reached a conclusion of sorts.

I have decided I will be okay with her flirting with me at school. I take her at her word when she says she has a boyfriend, so I will not be asking her (or even suggesting, hinting, or wanting) that we have a romantic relationship. Perhaps the "study group" comments she has made really means that she is wants a study group and only a study group. Or, she might even seem to think that I can be her friendly "gay-guy" pal. I base this thought on her various crossdressing comments to me. Even though I am not gay, she might conflate dressing with being gay. Whatever. I have decided that I am NOT going to worry too much about what she is actually thinking. Instead, I am going to enjoy her attention at school and leave it at that. Or, at least that is what I intend to do.

[sallyjones]

do the whole show her a picture of yourself en femme. to have a friend that is cool with your cding really helps with your issues with yourself and gives your someome to talk to. i dont think she is talking to you to make fun but it sound like she has general interest in you. :2c:

[Joanne f]

Most people have a personal space around them (a zone that they do not like other people to enter), by her freely touching you on your shoulder means that she is happy for you to enter her comfort zone , but at this moment be careful as it may just mean she has invited you in as a close friend and nothing more but she obviously enjoys your company as you do hers .

[Jonianne]

Interesting story Jessika. Nothing wrong wth mantaining a friendship relationship, even if she isn't a "girlfriend". Sounds like you are learning from this situation about relationships. Maybe you can share the same thoughts and fears with her that you have with us in your posts. I know you are afraid it may go sour, like your previous relationship did, but remember that you did work through it. Sounds like you could risk sharing with her and also be able to handle it if things don't go as planned. You are doing a good job working through your fears.

[Claire Cook]

But she also mentions her boyfriend a few times in our conversations and remarks how he and she are going to be doing this thing or that or whatever. Then, while she does tell me how long she had been looking for a study group, she also says things like how much she appreciates me helping her. (She even touches my shoulder once or twice when talking to me. Laughs at my lame jokes, etc.)

Or, she might even seem to think that I can be her friendly "gay-guy" pal. I base this thought on her various crossdressing comments to me. Even though I am not gay, she might conflate dressing with being gay. Whatever. I have decided that I am NOT going to worry too much about what she is actually thinking. Instead, I am going to enjoy her attention at school and leave it at that. Or, at least that is what I intend to do.

Hi Jessika,

Sound to me like maybe she wants a girl friend, and I don't mean in the Lesbian sense. Have you told her about your crossdressing? I have several GG friends, and we look forward to getting together as "the girls". I'd be upfront about it, and maybe the next time the girls can have coffee.:battingeyelashes:

[Tisha Ann Ryan]

Dear Jessikasummerfox : Space Princess
I envy the dilemma you find yourself in. Finding a GG who would accept, appreciate and support your femine side is worth the risk of coming out of your closet. Investigate her position/attitude subtly over a cup of coffee in a neutral campus setting.
My best wishes to you and I hope you have good luck.
Tisha

[Joni Marie Cruz]

Yay, Jessika! You go, girl.

Hugs...Joni Mari

[kimdl93]

good advice from Sheri. She's definately putting out some interesting signals...and whether she wants a lover or friend, you gain from getting to know her better. Go for it!