Is there a connection..crossdressing and being submissive?

[BRANDYJ]

I wonder how many of us that are crossdressers happen to also consider themselves submissive to GG's..or want to be submissive to a GG. I see this as a common thread from those that identify as being submissive.

I could just as easily ask this same question at another site, similar to this site but for those mainly interested in Dominant/submissive relationships. Over there it seems to be fairly prevalent. I have also seen this connection at various other sites. And no, I am not talking about porn sites. I mean other sites that deal with alternate lifestyles such as we share here.

For me, I developed my interest and desire to become a submissive to a dominant woman later in life. To explain how or why is another story.
That was maybe 10 years ago. Prior to then, I never in my life gave any thought about anything related to BDSM, the umbrella term that dominance/submission falls under. And I hate that it does since most BDSM is not my cup of tea or is way to far out for me to consider.

I think my interest is born out of my deep respect, admiration and love of women due to my personal path as a crossdresser since age 10 or so.

Like many late blooming CD's, it was a learning experience. From just wanting it to be a part time kink or bedroom play, to my now living in a 24/7 relationship with a woman that is truly a dominant person. Kind of like she wears the pants in the family.

Look around. Ever notice how many CD's like to dress in maids uniforms?
It kind of goes with the territory of service to a dominant woman. I'm sure not in all cases.

It's not a case of all CD's being submissive, or all submissive men being a CD. But I feel that many CD's are interested in being submissive to a GG. In some cases, maybe even to a man. Everything from just fantasy play to 24/7 relationships.

For our GG's.... Does the idea of your CD being submissive to you have any appeal? Like having him/her clean house, do the laundry, give massages, pedicures, manicures and simply and lovingly obey your every wish.

I would think this interest is less prevalent among our transitioning members, but perhaps rather an interest or fantasy of our CD's.

[Karentv]

Hi babe,
to be honest, being sub to a GG doesn't appeal at all to me but the idea of being accepted as slightly submissive to a man does! I'm not talking in terms of being a slave or pushed around but just being more accepting that a man is the stronger and more dominant ego in my world.
If I were to have a friendship/relationship with a GG then I'd want it on equal terms...

Just my tuppence worth!!

Karen x

[Loni]

me a submissive type..no way. no how, no matter how i am dressed.

.

[GBNatarii]

I am extremely submissive around both sexes in lots of random situations, even a lot of ones that are in no way sexual.

But, I do not feel it is because of crossdressing. I mean, over half the time I'm CD'ing, I'm aiming to be the confident girl who does her own thing, ya know? So for me at least, it's not really related to the CD'ing at all.

[Deborah Jane]

Submissive?
Me?
No chance........I'd sooner swim with Great White Sharks than become submissive to anyone!!

[Sheila]

For our GG's.... Does the idea of your CD being submissive to you have any appeal? Like having him/her clean house, do the laundry, give massages, pedicures, manicures and simply and lovingly obey your every wish.

Not for this GG .............. I like the partnership we have, we discuss most things, sometimes she leads sometimes I lead but most times we walk and do things together ............ I have no interest in being dominant or submissive to any body least of all to my partner :straightface:

[BRANDYJ]

Now Debs and Sheila, somehow I already knew that about you two.:hugs:


Hi babe,
to be honest, being sub to a GG doesn't appeal at all to me but the idea of being accepted as slightly submissive to a man does! I'm not talking in terms of being a slave or pushed around but just being more accepting that a man is the stronger and more dominant ego in my world.
If I were to have a friendship/relationship with a GG then I'd want it on equal terms...

Just my tuppence worth!!

Karen x

I know many think of D/s as someone being pushed around But that is not the case. Many D/s relationships are very caring, very loving and both the dominant one and the submissive one share on an equal basis. Both getting out of it what they desire, need and want.

If I felt I was being pushed around, I'd be out of there.

[tammygirl79]

I am a little more submissive as a woman. As a man I am neither submissive or dominent, I act differently depending on the woman I am with. If she is a more dominent kind of woman, then i will be more submissive. If she is a more of a submissive type of a woman, then I will be a little more dominent. But by nature, I am submissive more on the submissive side regardless of what sex i am being. I hope that made sense? lol.

[Deborah Jane]

Not for this GG .............. I like the partnership we have, we discuss most things, sometimes she leads sometimes I lead but most times we walk and do things together ............ I have no interest in being dominant or submissive to any body least of all to my partner :straightface:

This is not strictly true, She just told me I can't have a Husky [dog] :sad:

[Lorileah]

One thing that concerns me about this theory is that it makes the assumption that female=submissive in the eyes of those that follow the CD as a sub concept.

Is it a chicken or egg thing? I am sure there are plenty of people here who started out dressing as a submissive gesture. Some even thought they had to be sub to dress (hello, my name is Lori and I fit that description). And yes there are some who use dressing and submission to let the real world go when we have to "be" something all day and we really don't want to be that.

Being a sub is an interesting concept. One that many people think they would enjoy. Some do, most will find the concept much better than the reality.

It would really depend on what your definition of being a sub is. It can be fun for role playing. Not so much when you are treated like dirt all the time. If being "sub" means you like to have someone cater to you then most of us will like that at least sometimes. I like being pampered, having someone by me dinner maybe even make the decision what to order. I like to play the timid, shy, naive belle. I love the thought of not having the will to fight. BUT I find that this isn't more than a one night at a time thing and I am a controlling witch in reality. I could never be the Donna Reed/June Cleaver housewife. Even being that submissive loses luster quickly

[BRANDYJ]

It makes sense to me Tammy. In my previous marriage I was always the more dominant one. I can see where we can be either dominant or submissive depending on who we are with.
In my work and social life, I am neither submissive or dominant too. My submission is a gift to only one woman. If anything, i have had to be rather dominant in the work force since I have always held management positions.

What!!!!!! No Husky dog? Sheila is such a hard stern dominant. Don't protest to much or she will make you do corner time Debs! :devil:

[Deborah Jane]

Right that's settled, I'm going to get the Husky :D:tongueout

Right after I finish my swim with the Great Whites

[minalost]

I think of myself as flexable - I can (and am) ether dominant or submissive as the situation requires.
:hugs:

[BRANDYJ]

Hi Lori,
I agree and tried to convey that it means and is something different for everyone. From 24/7 to an "every now and then play thing"
But I can assure you of one thing, this man does not view women as submissive or even the weaker sex. Quite the opposite in fact. I thought I made that clear in my original post. My desire to serve the woman I love is out of total respect, admiration and love for her. She is the strongest woman I have ever known. I happen to like strong intelligent women. So this works for us and we could not be happier.
So yes, it depends on what each person would consider being submissive. My SO being the one in charge works for the both of us. I've never known a more loving, caring, open and honest relationship then I am blessed to have with her.

[Nicole Erin]

Submissive?
I think not.

I would rather be the dominant one.

[ReineD]

There's a fetish thread in the MtF where so many fantasies are related to some form of submission. It's a theme I've seen over and over again in this forum.

I wish I could find it, but there was a study done of hundreds of CDs that showed a high correlation with CDing and sexual submission. Not saying that every CD wants to be submissive, just that there are an awful lot who do.

If I find the study I'll come back and post a link to it.

[Kate Simmons]

I think like anything else, it just comes down to personal preference.:)

[BRANDYJ]

Hi Reine,
I am aware that it is a popular sexual fantasy (sexual submission). But for some of us it goes beyond just sexual. Just like crossdressing goes beyond sexual fetish.

Now if we include all males it is still a very popular sexual fetish. Ever look around to see how many so called Pro Dominatrix's there are? They would not be making a living if there was just a few men interested in sexual domination. And my understanding is that most of them will not have sex with a client. Go figure. But a pro is something I'd never waste my time or money on. Same gores for a call girl or hooker. No interest what so ever. In fact...YUK!

[Jess81CD]

Everyone's different. I'd like to be seen as equal as opposed to submissive to a woman. Sexually speaking i'm actually quite dominant.

[tinalynn]

Interesting thread! I go both ways - dominant when not dressed but submissive when dressed. Actually, I met my wife because of the DS part of BDSM. I'll avoid the bedroom talk, but will say that when dressed I'll do whatever she wants done. That usually means cleaning the kitchen, baking, and sometimes cleaning the rest of the house. She is not dominant, so won't be that way (never happens when I've been dressed, anyway). I keep trying to get her to demand more from me, but in vain. No worries, I get to dress when I want (mostly), so I don't push it at all.

[BRANDYJ]

Reine, maybe this is the thread you were thinking of. It is part of what we call BDSM. It's about bondage/crossdressing. Nine pages total. It is a closed thread, but I read some of the posts and the general consensus is that there is a connection for many when it comes to bondage at least. D/s was often mentioned.

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115061&highlight=submissive

[AKAMichelle]

Definitely not me. I am extremely alpha male and dominant in my relationships. I don't like taking orders from anybody. :D

[Schatten Lupus]

I doubt there are any real correlations. Being submissive sexually and around the house are two different things. What may seem as being submissive around the house might be due to house chores being typically a woman's things, so it could the appeal of doing something of the female role. It also goes for being submissive in general. A submissive female, although dying, is still a stereotype which might fuel the submissiveness of some transgender MtF.
As far as being sexually submissive, like any other fetish, it just varies from person to person.
Myself, I do alot of housework, but that is because if I don't, then it doesn't get done (which I'm starting to get tired of). But all my life I have had a problem with being submissive. My dad beat me with his belt a few times, some school trouble, and a handful of write-ups because I have a problem with authority. Not in the since that I am always fighting the law, but in the since that if it came down to submit or die, I would choose death.

[Sarah Doepner]

I'm thinking that our marriage doesn't have a dom-sub subtext, so I don't really know how that would work. In the rest of my life I usually try to be cooperative and enabling to others, primarily because I'm lazy and if I can get them to handle stuff, I can sit. Sometimes, however I end up being the one in control because no one else wants it and there is no good way out of it. I do okay.

May I leave the thread now Mistress?

[Barbara_MacKenzie]

Hi Brandy,
I agree with your sentiments. I am naturally submissive, but not in a servile way. My wife tends to take the lead in many issues and I'm comfortable enough in myself that I'm quite happy with the situation. I too admire and respect strong women, I can't be their alpha male even if I wanted to, I'm just not hard wired for it.

I know very little about BDSM and can't see myself pursuing an interest in it. I do enjoy being the domesticated one in our partnership and I am happy to clean the house and do the washing and ironing.

There may well be a strong correlation between Cd'ing and (gently) submissive behaviour but I have no empirical data to support this hunch.

You are quite right to differentiate our behaviour from any reference to women being kept in a 1950's kind of repression. I'm happy to let my wife wear the pants, does that demean me - I don't think so. I try and be the best partner I can to my wife, we've been married nearly 30 years btw.
Barabra

[BRANDYJ]

I'm thinking that our marriage doesn't have a dom-sub subtext, so I don't really know how that would work. In the rest of my life I usually try to be cooperative and enabling to others, primarily because I'm lazy and if I can get them to handle stuff, I can sit. Sometimes, however I end up being the one in control because no one else wants it and there is no good way out of it. I do okay.

May I leave the thread now Mistress?

I think if you stretch the terms dominant and submissive, all marriages have an element of it. Maybe one is dominant over one area of the relationship while the other is dominant over another. Like maybe the man is the one who dominates the family budget while the wife dominates the home and it's decor and meal planning. Ever hear the terms "hen pecked or worse... pu$$y whipped? I think many households have an element of them but the couple does not even give it a name. It's just the way it is. Even the hen pecked husband won't admit to it. lol

BTW, my SO and I both dislike the term MISTRESS and don't use it at all.

[Lorileah]

But I can assure you of one thing, this man does not view women as submissive or even the weaker sex. Quite the opposite in fact. I thought I made that clear in my original post. My desire to serve the woman I love is out of total respect, admiration and love for her.

Let me rephrase what I said because honestly I agree with you, in a relationship women can and do have the power. It is the use of clothing to convey that power, the idea that a man who is dressed as a female is thus rendered powerless and the idea that the clothes are subjugating. They are, especially in the context that many here wear them. You are bound, torqued, twisted, stretched and made unable to move except in small increments. Corsets, pantyhose and high heels are not 1)comfortable (Oh gawd am I gonna hear from people who will insist they are or 2) practical. None of the D/s fantasies seem to say "I am going to put you in comfortable shoes, make you wear pants and a loose T-shirt." As Reine stated it is a common part of the CD experience. Never say never and always avoid always but it is probably almost an always thing when someone (male) starts out and they are not convinced or just are not TS. "Make me" that way it isn't their fault or idea. Maybe even most stay there and that is why they stay closeted. Others expand beyond sexual fetish and become something else (no labels here). Do you think that maybe that is why there are more older people on these boards rather than the 20 somethings? I think that is one reason.

Of course everything is fluid. Subs often become Dom as life goes on. But my point, if there was a point, was how the female attire was really the sub (humiliation) part, not being placed in a female role context exactly. Still not making sense I know.

Now a quick impression (no not Elvis) about the thread. There seems to be a lot of Doms posting and few subs. Yet we know (as Reine pointed out) that there are probably many more subs in this "lifestyle". Is it because
a) the subs are fearful of the repercussions?
b) Their Doms told them to say that?

[Madilyn A.]

Well, my turn to weigh in on this one, as the comments seem all over the board.....I have always felt submissive to GGs, not males. I agree with some of the comments about there being a relationship between Cding and submissive. Again, the term "submissive" has many meanings to many people and I believe is a relative term. I have become more submissive as I have grown older. My desire to please, seems to almost be scary some times. I also love to dress as a maid, and all the submissive connotations which go with it. I am not, nor have I ever been into S&M or bondage. Just plain old boring maid stuff. Also, I believe I would have loved and do very much present myself as the Donna Reed and June Clever, 50's housewife. Wish I could afford the wardrobe. lol. So, I think I am very much like Brandy in my outlook on life.

[Tommie T.]

Can't happen,won't happen ,hasn't happened.Kind and considerate?Yes,Submissive No. Maybe once I'm dead.

[tammygirl79]

I doubt there are any real correlations. Being submissive sexually and around the house are two different things. What may seem as being submissive around the house might be due to house chores being typically a woman's things, so it could the appeal of doing something of the female role. It also goes for being submissive in general. A submissive female, although dying, is still a stereotype which might fuel the submissiveness of some transgender MtF.
As far as being sexually submissive, like any other fetish, it just varies from person to person.
Myself, I do alot of housework, but that is because if I don't, then it doesn't get done (which I'm starting to get tired of). But all my life I have had a problem with being submissive. My dad beat me with his belt a few times, some school trouble, and a handful of write-ups because I have a problem with authority. Not in the since that I am always fighting the law, but in the since that if it came down to submit or die, I would choose death.
I can relate to what you are saying. When I say i am more submisive, it doesn't mean that I take orders or anything like that...it means I am just not an agresive woman (or man) by nature. I do all the house work, but then again I am a single parent so I have to do all the house work, go to pta meetings, take my daughter to her ballet classes, volunteer at her school.....stuff like that which is usually viewed as a womens role. Maybe that is why it is so much easier and comfortable for me to be a woman...even as a man, I was living a woman like life. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. I enjoy & love my role in life....wouldn't have it any other way. :)

[Crysten]

I'm thinking that our marriage doesn't have a dom-sub subtext, so I don't really know how that would work. In the rest of my life I usually try to be cooperative and enabling to others, primarily because I'm lazy and if I can get them to handle stuff, I can sit. Sometimes, however I end up being the one in control because no one else wants it and there is no good way out of it. I do okay.

May I leave the thread now Mistress?

Agree. Not really applicable to us. We're equals, that's about it.

[sissystephanie]

My late wife and I had almost 50 years of happy married life. Neither of us was submissive or dominant! We didn't need that, we had each other!!

[sometimes_miss]

For me, there will always be a touch of guilt in my crossdressing, because I've never met a woman who really accepts it, so I kind of feel bad wanting to have them 'take the reins' in the relationship, so to speak. So the 'submissive' part will always be connected to me wanting to be the 'girl' in the relationship, the one acted upon, not initiating contact or behavior. Problem of course is that women expect to be the woman in the relationship too. Two people waiting for the other to 'direct the action'; not a good mix.

[BRANDYJ]

Hi Lori, You make some valid points. But just like any male that is involved with any degree of gender bending, crossdressing etc. You can't make generalizations about why one might want to be submissive to a woman. I am submissive to my sweetheart regardless of how I am dressed. The crossdressing has nothing to do with my submission. But maybe my being a crossdresser that has what I call a higher degree of respect, admiration and even lust for everything a GG is, might be what made me want to be of service to them. Women were thought to be and were treated as second class citizens for way to long. In some societies they still are. Like women were only put on earth to serve man and have babies. I despise men who think that way. Women are still battling for equality. I support that battle.

[Frédérique]

Is there a connection..crossdressing and being submissive?
I think my interest is born out of my deep respect, admiration and love of women due to my personal path as a crossdresser since age 10 or so.

Is there a connection? For me, crossdressing springs from my innate submissiveness, but I would clarify by calling it “passivity” or non-confrontation. I tend to be equal with whoever I’m with, which takes away from any domination that may be implied or present. I never take on a dominating role, which may be because I associate this “position” with typical male behavior. At heart, I am a crossdresser because of the kind of person I am – the desire to dress developed out of my gentle nature, and I continue to nurture that to this day. I also love, respect and admire women (of certain types) and always have, leading to the inevitable path I follow, but I recognize the feminine in all people, regardless of the gender one was born with. If you and I were sitting at a table, having a pleasant conversation, it would be very relaxing – I would let you do the talking, but I wouldn’t expect you to dominate the proceedings. Just ask me a question now and then, OK? :heehee:

[Rebeccarabbit]

Hi Brandy,

I have very great admiration for females and enjoy the female form. I think most crossdressers do, each to varying degrees I guess. I am submissive natured, I never realised this until I met My SO Rr. At that time Rr was submissive with a naturally dominant nature. It was'nt long before we found a natural ground...........and now we both live contently

[BRANDYJ]

Hi Brandy,

I have very great admiration for females and enjoy the female form. I think most crossdressers do, each to varying degrees I guess. I am submissive natured, I never realised this until I met My SO Rr. At that time Rr was submissive with a naturally dominant nature. It was'nt long before we found a natural ground...........and now we both live contently

Hi Rebecca. So glad you chimed in. So if I understand you correctly, you never thought of or knew you were submissive until you met your SO? And she was submissive when you met, and now is dominant over you. Is that what you mean when you say you found your natural ground together?

[rufus rabbit]

Hello...the other half of the bunny duo here.....

It took meeting each other to find our natural positioning in life.. we are very different characters naturally, I am a naturally strong person, with a element of the dominant in me.. and becky is very soft and submissive as a girl.. it all got very confusing a while back but we now seem to have found a balance..

before becky met me her first wife was vey strong too, but more bully like.. but i'm not like that.... its just two very different personalitlies... does that help or are you even more confused.. :)

[tinalynn]

This is all getting a bit philosophical for me! I've never wanted to be a woman, nor do I think I am when dressed. You won't see me refer to myself in that fashion. However, when dressed, I do enjoy the role and want it reinforced through the naturally submissive side of dressing (as others have put it quite well). As for 'typical' BDSM play, I really do like being the submissive when dressed, its a different type of thrill than the dom side (but they each have their place).

'Submissiveness' can mean very different things between two people - as we've already seen in this thread. It almost needs to be defined prior to discussion to really get an idea about what people think. Although, it is kind of neat seeing the various definitions here! There's certainly more to think about it than whatever niche one person assigns it...

[erika130]

I think there's a slight connection, but I'd imagine any sub feelings/desires are more related to whatever causes the CDing in the first place rather than a direct connection with dressing. Anyways this is another thread where I can only say so much being that I haven't been in a relationship myself. I'm pretty sure that I'm a bit submissive in nature, so I would probably be slightly sub to an SO, but for the most part, in a long-term relationship/marriage, like many here I believe that it's more about balance and partnership on equal terms. I think the whole sub/dom apply to specific moments, such as one sexual encounter, rather than an entire relationship. So based on that I think I would enjoy being sub sexually a time or two, but for the most part neither sub or dom. :2c:

[MsJanessa]

I don't think of myself as submissive at all

[BRANDYJ]

Hello...the other half of the bunny duo here.....

It took meeting each other to find our natural positioning in life.. we are very different characters naturally, I am a naturally strong person, with a element of the dominant in me.. and becky is very soft and submissive as a girl.. it all got very confusing a while back but we now seem to have found a balance..

before becky met me her first wife was vey strong too, but more bully like.. but i'm not like that.... its just two very different personalitlies... does that help or are you even more confused.. :)

Hi rufus rabbit. Thanks for your comments and trying to un-confuse me. Being a dominant woman surely does not mean being a bully. Sorry that was the experience Becky had to endure.
I am glad to hear that you both have the balance with each other to find your natural positioning in life. So I take that to mean that in your relationship, you are now the more dominant one and Becky is the more submissive one.
This got me to thinking. I would bet that most closeted CDers that have not told their wives for whatever reason, would gladly be submissive to their wives if their wives would only accept the crossdressing. OK, a random thought for those that fear sharing this part of themselves with their SO's.

I am no less a man, nor more of a woman simply because I submit to the woman I love. My greatest joy is in giving my SO pleasure. In doing so, I gain my pleasure.

[Dutchess]

My husband is naturally submissive , again not in a servile way ,, but just his nature . He has CD'd most of his life . The only problem has been that I Am not very dominant at all and have had to learn to be stronger to balance us out , because he would just wilt if he had to be any letter of alpha at all . Fortunately I can be kind of a southern smartmouth ala Julia Sugarbaker so I just go into that mode .. If he had his way , Id be boss 100% of the time, but I am just too girly girl for that ,,sometimes I have to make him be boss in certain situations and he does not like it and will get all funky about it lol....:heehee:

[ColleenW]

I don't think there's a connection between cross dressing and being submissive. I do find myself less aggressive when I'm dressed, even when I'm underdressed only, but I really wouldn't think of myself as submissive.

[docrobbysherry]

I think we need definitions to carry on a meaningful conversation about this!:straightface:

When my now unattractive ex started saying, " If u want sex, you've got to kick start ME!" Our sex life was OVER!:doh: Is THAT "submissive"!?:brolleyes:

I've ALWAYS gotten pushy after my date kicked started my motor. Is THAT "submissive" or not?:brolleyes:

On the other hand, if that date was a BAD, SLOPPY kisser, and/or started shaking, screaming and fumbling in panic for my zipper, baby I'M OUT!:eek: Scare me, and it's NOT happenin'!:thumbsdn: It THAT "NOT submissive"!?:brolleyes:

I have no idea if I'm "submissive" or not! Does ANYONE?:eek:

[BRANDYJ]

Docrobbysherry, I'm not sure if your post is serious or said in a joking manner. You totally lost me.
But on the chance that you are serious, I'd have to say that not a thing you said is submissive behavior.

[docrobbysherry]

Docrobbysherry, I'm not sure if your post is serious or said in a joking manner. You totally lost me.
But on the chance that you are serious, I'd have to say that not a thing you said is submissive behavior.

No, I really have no idea. I've always thot I was a pushover for women that wanted me! And, I've slept with women I wasn't into for that reason alone:o

So, I've always thot of myself as "submissive". Maybe I'm NOT!? I just don't know. :brolleyes:

[BRANDYJ]

No, I really have no idea. I've always thot I was a pushover for women that wanted me! And, I've slept with women I wasn't into for that reason alone:o

So, I've always thot of myself as "submissive". Maybe I'm NOT!? I just don't know. :brolleyes:

It could be that you are at least open to being submissive IF the right woman came along.

Well it's a male thing to be a push over for a woman that wants him even when or if he was not attracted to her. Years ago, I could have been the same way as you. Sex for sex sake. But I'd like to think I had some taste in just what lady got me. And I think I did.

[Virgin_CD]

I think fem and submissive go hand in hand. this may be hard to understand, but gays repulse me but me, dressed, just wants to serve and pleasurize my mate... male of female. To the point of martyr. <Not sure that is the right word> I would definitely be a crowd pleaser if I indulged my fanasies. Like "walk on the wild side"... she was everybodie darlin...Afraid to say I would be the biggest hore. But they say all men are hores?

[Sheila]

Brandy from the very, very little I know about the lifestyle, I do understand (I think) that at the end of the day the sub "has the upper-hand" so to speak, in any good sub/DOM relationship, especially if it does involve physical correction/pleasure in that safe words/signals are used between the DOM/sub and once spoken/or signaled the play ends immediately or have I got that very very wrong ?

[fallen_rayne]

When i cross-dress, i don't change any part of my personality. I only change how I sit and how I walk, and of course the voice. All of little quirks and kinks, and what not are manifested over. Depending on my mood, I'm either submissive or dominant.

My SO knows about my cross-dressing, (that was a great story btw)so when we do our thing. It's either when I'm male or female, doesn't matter. In our out of bed, it's an equality thing. Even in bed, it depends on my mood, dominant with her and submissive with her no matter the "mode" I'm in.

[BRANDYJ]

Brandy from the very, very little I know about the lifestyle, I do understand (I think) that at the end of the day the sub "has the upper-hand" so to speak, in any good sub/DOM relationship, especially if it does involve physical correction/pleasure in that safe words/signals are used between the DOM/sub and once spoken/or signaled the play ends immediately or have I got that very very wrong ?

Sheila, thanks for asking. I'm not sure the sub has the upper hand. In fact as hard as it may be to understand, a the end of the day, both my Dominant and I are very equal in the sense that we share and care deeply for each other. She gives me dominance that I want and need. I give her the power over me that she wants and needs.
There is a time for physical play with various things like crops, canes, paddles or floggers. Sometimes, maybe even bondage. It is what I as a submissive enjoys and she as a dominant enjoys by seeing my total trust and submission to her. We both get something equal out of it. It's my way of expressing total trust in her and showing her how much I love her to allow my total physical submission to her.

Then there is the very real punishment should I displease her in some way. It is not always physical, but can be. And when it is, i fear it in some ways since I am not into pain. Yet, with her, something comes over me and allows me to take that physical punishment and feel like I made up for the misdeed that caused her the need to punish me. It's like the pain does not even bother me since it is a way of giving and then being totally forgiven and the misdeed is forgotten. Again a way to show my respect, trust and love for her. Such a mixed bag of emotions. That punishment is always with a cane. OUCH! But punishment is not supposed to be fun or even erotic. Again, very different from play.
Safe words are only used in play, not in real punishment. A good dominant never punishes her submissive while upset or mad. She will wait until she is calm so as not to be to hard on the submissive and hurt him beyond tolerance.
Like every marriage, no two D/s relationships are the same. Everything is agreed upon in advance including protocols, rituals and the way we address each other. Again, I am her submissive in either male or fem mode. The manner of dress makes no difference. It is not just a game with us. No, she does not wear leather, boots and chains all the time. In fact that is very rare. She dresses and acts like any other loving wife/partner would. I am free to call her Honey, sweetheart or even her name. But when she gives me an order, I had better say "Yes Ma'am" or "yes M'lady"

I hope that helps you understand a little more.

[Sheila]

Thanks Brandy & yes it was/is very much like I understood the D/s relationship to work mainly, although I had forgotten that it is not always a playtime for alll couples, but can be a way of life (thanks for the reminder)

You reminded me one extremely important aspect of the D/s relationship, that of "total Trust", something I think some people find hard to grasp/understand or even accept that one would, "allow/desire" ...... punishment (be it, physical/verbal/chore doing/sexual/mental)..... from/impose on, the one they love

Questions ? ..........

1)would/could the Dom demand that the sub refrain from dressing as a punishment & would that be seen by Subs as acceptable ....... (I would **think** in a loving relationship it could be used as a short term/loving punishment, but has the possibility for a D/S relationship to be badly misused by the Dom, if they suddenly hates the dressing and so could use it to her advantage, especially if as for you and your sweetie it is a lifestyle and not playtime as such ........ and yes, I think I am aware that D/s is not about power play per-se, but I would think the potential is there for abuse in certain situations)

As we are aware many CDERs will **Push Boundaries** on a regular basis, if so, could CDing be used to
2) get ones own way with CDing desires, knowing full well that chastisement of some form would be the outcome, if/when discovered, so thereby heightening the pleasure of doing boundary pushing ???

3)Could the D/s lifestyle, in your opinion ... (and anybody else's who cares to chip in) .... be/is being used in a controlling manner by SO's who hate CDing.... (but have a willing sub (perhaps albeit unknowingly))......... is that perhaps why some stay with unaccepting SO's, they in actuality buy into the D/s lifestyle again maybe unaware themselves that they in actuality gain some pleasure from the disapproval knowing that there will be repercussions from CDing.

Maybe I am doing the over thinking bit in the last question (sometimes I do that :doh: ......... I have in the past been involved marginally in the D/s lifestyle (for a very brief period/way to long period) in the past and as the sub, I know hard to believe this gobby biatch as a sub :devil::devil:, but it was done as a gesture of love to my partner at the time, who was into the lifestyle (or so i thought), while I hated every moment of it, eventually I called a halt and said no more, but having researched a little I soon realised he was more into sadism and was not a true Dom as I understood a Dom to be in a D/s lifestyle :straightface::Angry3::Angry3:


Oooopsssss I will shut up now as I just realise,d I have turned a few points into an in depth under the microscope Q & A session :doh:

[noeleena]

Hi.
I spos im on the outer in most ways here , I can see what is being said tho im not so sure as it effects me being a woman,
so my ? is ( im a bit nieve here,)

What roll does a woman play in this , I see your talking as a man ,
im not completly wired that way so i lack some things a male has in this regard ,I dont relate to or with men. hence my ?

Fact is im struggling with the ? ,

Of my self as a person for my part there is no male or female .you allready know what i am,
so if it comes down to dom or sub its no to both,
yet in family life & thats from age 10 on i had to do many things most kids would not have done, health reasons with in the family , & that meant i had to take over both the male & female roll & have done since then ,
Im not a wimp just very strong in holding things together though out my life, & our lifes, family,
That does not say i dont go down, i do & if you like time out,

I know theres more to it than the main ? , so Psychologically ,& Emotionally wise, that gets in to harder ?? s ,
ill leave that one.

...noeleena...

[BRANDYJ]

Sheila. I appreciate your questions and will try to give my opinions and response from my personal experience and understanding.

1) Yes, I guess the Domme (pronounced dom may) could use it to her advantage and incorporate it as either a punishment. Especially if, as you say, she starts to hate the dressing, I have not heard of it, but I am sure it can happen. But at the same time, she could even use the crossdressing as a reward. Yes, she could control the dressing as either a punishment or a reward and use it to her advantage. There was a time my SO did not want me to dress without her either asking me to dress, or my getting her permission first. I know many will not understand this, but I accepted that and it made my desire to dress even more special since it was when I knew she really wanted me in fem mode to serve her. She never refused to allow me to dress when I asked.

2) I am aware that some subs push boundaries. I can honestly say that I never did or do. I definitely would not disrespect her by dressing without her permission just to be chastised to heighten the thrill. I don't get pleasure out of chastisement. My thrill and pleasure comes from doing my very best to obey her wishes, follow the rules, and I can't think of doing anything behind her back. So there would never be any "getting caught" It hurts me deeply to displease her, so I try to never do that. Of course I'm human and will displease her from time to time by forgetting to do something she asked or that she knows I should have done without her even asking.

3) I am sure there are some that push buttons and that some Dommes may use cross dressing in a controlling manner. But from a unaccepting SO. You might be right some sub/CD's might like the repercussions if caught. But in my way of thinking, there is a problem if the sub disobeys or does anything just to get that kind of attention. A good submisisve simply wold not do that any more then a loving Domme would use this to her advantage. I'd say the relationship is in trouble if this was the case.

I'm sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the lifestyle. To "try" to be a sub for a Dom you cared about had to be hard if your heart was not into it. Amazing what we will do out of love for someone else. As for sadist, I could not deal with that either. On that note, I confess, I don't trust most men that call themselves Doms. Let's just say I don't trust their motives or methods of dominating a woman. I have seen some very loving male Dom/ female sub relationships, but I've seen my share of sexual abuse in those relationships too. OK, I'm sure there are some abusive Domme/sub relationships too. I just have not seen nearly as many.

You are right, there has to be "total trust" Yes, most people don't understand that someone would give over to punishment from someone that they love. I feel it is a cleansing thing. I paid for my disobedience by allowing her to punish me. Again it demonstrates my love, trust and respect for her to allow her to punish me when and if needed. I freely give her control and the power over me. It is not power play, but definitely there is a agreed upon power exchange. I can not be dominated by anyone without my first giving consent and agreed upon boundaries on both sides.

I hope I answered your questions Sheila. Since I differ from what examples you gave, it was not easy. lol

Hi noeleena, If your question is what role does the woman play in this, I can only say that she is the one that has the power over me, her submissive. Of course the genders cold be switched to being a male Dom and a female sub. so it comes down to dominant/submissive and forget or exchange the genders in either the Dom or the sub. So I am not clear exactly what you mean by the "role" the woman plays in this.

Many women get great satisfaction. pleasure out of dominating either a male or female submissive. ( Her roll)
Just as many subs get great satisfaction and pleasure in submitting to a Domme.

[lilyrose]

Brandy,

Frankly, I think CD's come in as many flavors as the rest of the world & the ability to modify identity by being a CD would seem to imply the ability to modify "normal" behavior. But obviously the term "submissive" is being interpreted in a number of different ways in these responses. To some, it seems like a fundamental threat to their freedom; to others, it's one way of expressing their "feminine side," or the ability to abandon, however temporarily, the "masculine" need to control things. It will be interesting to follow this discussion. Thanks for posting.

Lily

[Sheila]

Some women get great pleasure in the power exchange, they may in daily life be on the lower level of a career and many above her telling her what to do etc, she may have to be Submissive in her place of work because of her position, so being a Domme redresses some balance in her life, while on the other hand many males are already in power positions and seek the release that being a sub gives them from having such power over others in daily lives, hence the term power exchange Brandy uses, both Domme and sub gain from the said exchange :)

For many, it is not a sexual thing at all, in fact many Domme's rarely involve themselves with the sub sexually, unless they are in a relationship in the first place, although some do develop into a relationship at a later date.

There are some Domme's who make a very good living out of being a Domme, traveling many thousands of miles to serve their clients (while being very well paid for it), in some cases a Domme will have one or several subs who are collard to her and her alone (or him if it is a male Domme), collaring is a special bond between the Domme and sub and should not be entered into lightly by either and many have a special ceremony called a calling ceremony in which vows very similar to wedding vows are given and exchanged and the Sub is given a Collar to be worn.

It is however a general recommendation that Subs are not collard to anyone within their first year or even of entering into the lifestyle due to the range of emotions that can take place at that time :straightface:

For some one who knows little about it i have a lot to say, hopefully most of it is accurate :)


Many submissive s wear a "collar" to denote their status and commitment. It can be much like a wedding band, except that only the submissive partner wears one. The traditional collar is a neck band in leather or metal, chosen, designed or even crafted by the dominant partner. Some subs wear a "symbolic collar", often a bracelet or ankle chain, which is more subdued than the traditional collar and can pass in vanilla (non-BDSM) situations. It is not uncommon for a sub to have several collars for special occasions

A collard sub can be to a professional Domme or a play partner Domme, but while I understand Domme's can have several collard subs, a sub can only be collard to one Domme generally (although I am sure there are exceptions to this rule as in many of lifes situations)

[BRANDYJ]

Brandy,

Frankly, I think CD's come in as many flavors as the rest of the world & the ability to modify identity by being a CD would seem to imply the ability to modify "normal" behavior. But obviously the term "submissive" is being interpreted in a number of different ways in these responses. To some, it seems like a fundamental threat to their freedom; to others, it's one way of expressing their "feminine side," or the ability to abandon, however temporarily, the "masculine" need to control things. It will be interesting to follow this discussion. Thanks for posting.

Lily

Lily, you are correct. We do come in many flavors. We all have different likes, dislikes, turn ons, turn offs, levels of tolerance, and so on. You are also correct in saying that the term submissive is interpreted in different ways by many that read this thread. But I want to point out, that my observation is that many Cd's are also submissive, but I don't think it is just a way to express their feminine side. for some it might be. But for me, my submissive side might have been born out of my being a CD, but there is where the connection ends. I don't connect the two as in "can't be one without the other".
I am sure there are more men that are submissive and NOT a CD then there are CD's that are submissive.

Back to the many flavors for a minute... Some may be submissive only as a bedroom game and see it as just something kinky and sexual. Many others see it as much more. Just like some CD's use crossdressing as merely a sexual outlet (fetish) or release, and many of us see crossdressing as something much deeper and part of our emotional makeup.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

WOW Sheila, yo sure do know a lot about it. You are very correct in all that you shared. Yo are very correct. Some Pro Dommes make a very good living from men that have a need to submit and can't find any other outlet for it, or don't want it as a regular everyday part of their life, but need it from time to time. $250.00 an hour is not uncommon. Even some that will pay a Pro to let them come and clean her house either crossdressed or naked. Of course they expect to be punished if the dusting does not pass the white glove test. Most Dommes do not have sex with their clients. Personally I would never have the need to submit to someone so bad that I'd pay a pro! It would ruin the whole exchange for me since the only reason the Domme wants me to submit is for money. Big turn off to me. The same way I feel about hookers and prostitutes. I have no use for them.
As for the collar. There are 4 distinctly different collars. One is called a "play collar" That means the sub is only collared for a short period of time for the purpose of any kind of BDSM play. Next is the "collar of consideration" This is given when a Domme is considering taking on the new submissive but has not committed to him yet.
Then comes the "training collar" This is when the Domme has accepted the submissive and is interested in furthering his training to her ways of doing things to see if the final collar is to be offered to the sub. That collar is called "The collar of ownership"
So they are sort of like an engagement ring and then finally the wedding ring. For many, the collar means as much, if not more then wedding rings. It's a sincere committment just like being married.
For many, there is a collaring ceremony when that final collar is offered by the Domme. Some of these ceremonies can be very elaborate. Others might include only close accepting friends in the lifestyle. They have as much meaning as a wedding ceremony to those that are into the lifestyle. All the same emotions are there. Perhaps even more.
It's rare, but many D/s relationships are stronger then many marriages due to the total openness, trust and communication that living this lifestyle demands.

Again Sheila, you knowledge impresses me!:clap:

[Anneliese]

I've always been into "equality" in a relationship. My last was with bisexual woman who called herself a submissive. I was in way over my head with that stuff. I don't understand it, to be honest. When married, however, although I'm sure my ex would have loved it if I'd been more dominating...not in a violent or tied-up way, but showing more sexual aggression, she, in fact, had me pussy-whipped (in hindsight). While married, I barely held on to who I really was, but the sex was so great I was more than willing to lose myself. Scary. I will never allow that kind of thing to happen again. I've never had a desire to be sexually submissive with a woman, and being dressed would have no effect on this. However, with a CD or TS (hasn't happened, and will likely stay only a fantasy), I could see being a top or a bottom, but wouldn't be either exclusively.

[Rebeccarabbit]

Hi Brandy,

Sheila is quite right in what she says!!.....I totally adore my SO rr...very much. Our journey together was very special, things literally just fell into place. Most of the time as Becky I need help and guidance.....I'm still learning to be the best i can be......I need my SOs guidance in sensibly achieving that. I'm always conscious of her needs.

I'm a gentle and soft person at heart....... a girl and yes "submissive" but not a door mat.........and I enjoy my life :)

Thanks Sheila.........for the research 10/10 xx

[Annemarie]

Yes, there is a correlation between Cding and submissiveness, but also masochism in the broadest and narrow sense of the meaning. Cds often delight in tight, uncomfortable clothes or shoes, love putting themselves in potentially humiliating situations, often engage in BDSM, often sleep with men even if they are not really attracted to them etc.

[BRANDYJ]

Yes, there is a correlation between Cding and submissiveness, but also masochism in the broadest and narrow sense of the meaning. Cds often delight in tight, uncomfortable clothes or shoes, love putting themselves in potentially humiliating situations, often engage in BDSM, often sleep with men even if they are not really attracted to them etc.

Hi Annemarie, I'm not sure what you mean by masochism in the broadest and narrow sense of the word. I am submissive, but did not consider myself the least bit masochistic. That is until I looked up the definition of masochist, Simply stated...
1) Someone who obtains pleasure from receiving punishment.
2) receiving punishment (physical or psychological)

So OK, I guess I have another label. I always thought it meant someone who likes severe, brutal pain. I admit, I fear pain, do not like pain and only accept it when it is delivered from my SO/Domme. But there are limits to my tolerance level. Well known to my SO. That line is never crossed even if it is for punishment.

[Virgin_CD]

Listen, everyone has a mix of all these charcteristics. It's only when you breech a threshold you become "certifiable" I am not into S&M but a little nipple pinch, well timed is welcome. If you want to please your spouse does it make you subissive or opposite; when you accept pleasure are you dominant? Besides, even severe S&M or B&D can bea beautiful thing when the right ones are matched and no unwilling parties are affected! Likewise, there are no pure 100% masculine men or fem women. Mywife doesn't feel sexy in lingere. She is gorgeous in every respect but can't get into the fem sductress, like I would like to. 2 weeks ago I came out to her and suggested I wear the lingerie and you can grab my ears. I think we are in the doorway of a new era, a second horneymoon, after 15 years of marriage. Does anyone know a good babysitter? I am 55 and the longer I live the more I find that EVERYBODY has something to hide AND we all have a lower opinin of ourselves, inside... despite outside persona. SO I sorta feel sory for everyone and try to bolster every persons self worth. We all need compliments to help wit this false sense of guilt. We think we are the only one with dirty little secrets, when if we really knew... we be like "Holly cow, I'm an angel next to this sicko". It's the "Normal people" that REALLY scare me. I thank God that my passion is such a simple a innocent one, not affecting anyone badly... and that my passio don't stray towards child molestaion, drug addiction/gambling or wife beating anger, etc... I thank God those passions that we cannot control are innocent. It's like the Beatles said "Everyones' got something to hide except for me and my monkey" (i.e. the monkey on his back/ addiction? I'm sorta proud to be a CD really.

[VikkiVixen7188]

Im actually part of the D-s Scene as a Dominant. So... there ya go :)

[Virgin_CD]

I have heard some terms and really don't understand the DS thing, although I am sure I fit in there somewhere in the middle (pun intended). Cold you elaborate? I must leave for work but will search "D-S" afterwork for any posts. Thanks.

PS: what is a top and bottom (I lack imagination).

[BRANDYJ]

Virgin_CD, Very well said. I agree with you 100% Something I read in a a book titled "The Goddess Path", or was it something my SO said she read in one of her books, anyway, it's a simple statement that I wish all religions would adopt and follow. It is: If it harms no one, do as thy will How simple of a statement and so true and can be applied to almost anything.
"It's the "Normal people" that REALLY scare me", is the way I feel too.
BTW, in the book I mentioned, it had a few paragraphs about how the increase of male crossdressing might be the way some men are coming back to the Great Mother Goddess. It went on to say that BC, many men would wear robes that were like that of the Goddess to feel closer to them. It also mentioned that the practice of priests wearing long robes instead of pants, might also have been born out of this ancient practice.


I have heard some terms and really don't understand the DS thing, although I am sure I fit in there somewhere in the middle (pun intended). Cold you elaborate? I must leave for work but will search "D-S" afterwork for any posts. Thanks.

PS: what is a top and bottom (I lack imagination).

D/s means Dominant?submissive. Notice the "D" is capitolized and the "s" is in lower case. =D/s
A male is called a Dom and a female dominant is called a Domme (pronounced Dom-may

A top is one that is dominant and a bottom is one that is submissive. However it also can mean someone who is on top and someone who is on bottom in a sexual way only.

[maggiecdva]

I have a definite submissive side whether I am enfem or not. I guess I always have to a certain extent.

The one thing and this may get a few folks upset (I don't mean too). I do believe there is a gentleness and grace that women have that men don't have. Maybe this is the maternal instinct that men lack .... although this is changing.

I grew up where the man was the bread winner, mothers stayed at home and ran the house.

Anyway ... I do feel better as a woman.

hugs - maggie

[KATIE TV]

This is a very complex subject, so I am only going to comment on my feelings and experiences.
Although I have always had a CD interest it only really came out in my D/s spanking role play games.
I found that only when I was dressed fem could I really get into being sub to a GG as a man it just didn’t work and as for being sub to man NO WAY. But dressed it was a totally different ball game. My role play dressing made me feel so good that I extended it to my life style. Hears the rub, just being dressed dose not make me submissive, it is HOW I am dressed that counts. Katie school girl, maid, etc is submissive and likes being dominated, spanked and the like by GGs (including my partner) and men.
Katie, dressed to kill, or in Dom bitch, strict aunty mode is completely dominant. As a man I don’t think I am either, I am an easy going live & let live kind of guy, and in my relationship (real life) we take equal responsibilities.
For the last 5 years I have turned my “Hobby” into a job I am a professional TV. offering Dom/sub role play games to paying clients, and I must say business is good. In sub role my gentlemen always stay masculine to dominate & punish me. They are for filling a fantasy that they cant, for whatever reason do for real. Who knows, maybe their wife’s are very dominant in their relationship? When I am Dom, about 80% of my work a great proportion of my gentlemen want to cross dress, so I think that there is a connection between cross dressing and being submissive if only in “play”
Again this is only my take on the subject and I don’t want to offend any one who disagrees with me, We are all individual and do what we do for lots of different reasons. So in conclusion “If it works for you keep on doing it”

[DonniDarkness]

Hey Brandy,

What an awesome discussion. My wife and i have been talking about this thread while she did her makeup for work. We thought we had some insight to this conversation since we are both switches....We play both roles of D/s

1) the first thing we wanted to say is, that coming from the newer generation, we do not see house work as a submissive act. No. 1 complaint from married women is...."i dont get any help around the house, i wish i wasnt so tired"....that is the truth.

I find nothing submissive about being a house dad, i can understand where some of the "leave it to beaver" generation would see this as submissive, on the grounds that those 50' housewives were coveted for being the "good wife".

2) Being a switch....enfemme. We have been together for a long time, over the years we have learned to read each others moods to decipher the others needs. Sometimes i have the need to be submitted, and sometimes i just have the need to dominate. As does she have the same needs.

So, with that said i have found more fun and excitement in being me. Dressing is a part of me, an extension of me, and a conduit for my fantasies. Some nights i am Mistress Donni(full dominatrix attire)....and some nights i am Mistress's Donni(ringed collar,ringed leather cuffs and anklets)....just depends on our moods and needs at the time.

For her, Dominance is about the trust i give her to fulfill her needs to "use" me. She finds it erotic that i have the need to "please" her, offering my body in total trust.

For me, Dominance is about the control of my own desires inflicting pleasure where it is needed. Her need for submitted pleasure is highly erotic for me.

3) Sexual D/s, This term is really very broad when you take into account taste, turn-ons, turn-offs, and our personal boundaries.

We read earlier in this thread about the dominant one being "mean" to the sub. This we personally do not find attractive.
We are not out to humiliate each other during our fantasies. My wife has this way of being sweet and "matter of fact" when she is commanding me or making her intentions known.
Dominance is also NOT about pain as many people misconstrue, it is about CONTROL and TRUST.

Pain is usually associated with Bondage, which is different than D/s, but both can go hand in hand if you wish it. For us this would be a topic that we have far more experience in, than even our D/s roles. If i went into detail on this forum with all that, i would definatley be getting edited in a new york second!:D

4) Submitted Sex....for the straight guy.....(sounds weird huh!?)
Well not really, a long time ago...(about 10 years)...my wife and i started experimenting sexually. She liked the whole Dominatrix thing and i thought she was a dream....:love:
About a year into sex and dating, i came out as a CD....it wasnt long after that i was "pitched" the idea of her having the "tool" of the trade...(im trying admins). I had experimented on myself various times, and didnt find it displeasing. However being much younger and way in the closet, i found myself a little reserved in agreeing to it. But i did agree. Now i find myself enjoying it as if it were just another "position"

For me offering this type of sex is far more submissive than anything else i could do as a submitted lover. No amount of clothes (or lack of), bondage rope, or hot wax could equal the act of "gifting" myself to her in that way.

One Hot Freaky Couple,
-Donni and Sugar-

[Virgin_CD]

I am CD/ Sub very much...and my wife is sort of a strict german woman. We never dabled in much of anything so after 15 years our sex life is pretty "Stale". Plus she is a very devout catholic (ugh)... still, at 50 she has a body that don't quit but not ver fem feelings/ behavior. I told her about CD 3 weeks afoand she is understanding... accepting in time I trust. She loves me very much and is a good woman. I think she is a NATURAL for a strict dom persona. She would fit right in but I am at a loss for how to ease into it? Advice...

[BRANDYJ]

1) the first thing we wanted to say is, that coming from the newer generation, we do not see house work as a submissive act. No. 1 complaint from married women is...."i dont get any help around the house, i wish i wasnt so tired"....that is the truth.


I don't see housework as a submissive thing either. However it is a responsibility of mine to do the housework when dressed as the maid. But I do it as a partner either way and still enjoy keeping things neat and clean for my SO. Yes, she does help and does her share. It's not like I have to do all of it.


3) Sexual D/s, This term is really very broad when you take into account taste, turn-ons, turn-offs, and our personal boundaries.

For us it is not just sexual D/s. Basically, she is the head of the household. That is when we were living together. Right now family matters keep us in 2 different states...for now.
I have very mixed feelings when it comes to sexual things. At times, I simply feel like a man pleasing the woman I love. Other times I do feel very feminine and love to worship her body with massages that last for hours it seems. Those massages always turn into sexual things. Most of the time it's not a matter of being submissive, just a feeling of pleasing the woman I love. But all emotions and feelings can be present in the same time spent with her in the bedroom. So it never gets stale. However, I never feel dominant over her. Frankly, I detest males dominating women since I find that many men use women just for sex and I don't respect that mindset. (hard to express what i mean here) I surely do not mean to insult anyone who feels dominant with the woman they love. But I could never see myself dominating her, not even in play. I have felt somewhat dominant sexually or socially with past lovers, but never with my present SO.


We read earlier in this thread about the dominant one being "mean" to the sub. This we personally do not find attractive.
We are not out to humiliate each other during our fantasies

Mean is abuse and NOT a loving D/s relationship. If my SO was mean, we would not be a partnership.


For me offering this type of sex is far more submissive than anything else i could do as a submitted lover. No amount of clothes (or lack of), bondage rope, or hot wax could equal the act of "gifting" myself to her in that way.

I understand and feel very much the same way. I love to totally give myself to my SO for her pleasure. Yes, it does make me feel more feminine, even when not dressed.

Thank you for sharing Miss Donni

[BRANDYJ]

How to introduce Wife to Dom role?
I am CD/ Sub very much...and my wife is sort of a strict german woman. We never dabled in much of anything so after 15 years our sex life is pretty "Stale". Plus she is a very devout catholic (ugh)... still, at 50 she has a body that don't quit but not ver fem feelings/ behavior. I told her about CD 3 weeks afoand she is understanding... accepting in time I trust. She loves me very much and is a good woman. I think she is a NATURAL for a strict dom persona. She would fit right in but I am at a loss for how to ease into it? Advice...

Due to an apparent typo, I don't know when you said you told your wife about your CDing. Was it 3 weeks ago, or 3 weeks into your relationship? (afoand)???

My advice would be to talk to her about it. Tell her how you feel. Suggest she try to play dominant over you. See how she feels about it. I assume you have good communication between you.

[ReineD]

so I think that there is a connection between cross dressing and being submissive if only in “play”

That's what I sense too, just from general impressions I've gotten from reading so many threads here. There's a desire to be submissive, whether or not it translates into RL practices. I think that behaviors associated with submission makes CDs feel more feminine.

EDIT I want to add that I'm referring to a higher incidence of CDs (compared to the non-CDs), who give the impression they wish to be submissive. I don't think that all CDs want to be submissive.

[Marcie4you]

Can ONLY speak for myself, personally hate terms, dom/sub, top/bot, I'm me! I want a loving, respectful guy, that I can love in return......and housework here, would be 50/50! Sorry, No fantasy of mine.

[t-girlxsophie]

Wait a sec and ill go ask my Wife what she wants me to say :D:D:D

[izzfan]

Being submissive is certainly an interesting fantasy but, probably, in reality it wouldn't be a very fun way of life.

[BRANDYJ]

Being submissive is certainly an interesting fantasy but, probably, in reality it wouldn't be a very fun way of life.

Interesting comment. Makes me think....You could apply the part about anything being an interesting fantasy, but in reality it wouldn't be a very fun way of life.

Being full time female
Being in transition
Being petite
Being big breasted...... Well you get the idea. It is a fun way of life for many. Maybe "fun" is not the correct word. But it is a way of life I like, want and do live. I would not want to change it. The each his/her own.

So like all the examples above. (Being anything) can be fun (your word) for someone, just perhaps not you or me.

[Miss Brianna]

This is definitely the case for me. Forced feminization and bondage while dressed is great. I love it when my girlfried suprises me with a "get dressed!" or "put on your shoes!"

[BRANDYJ]

Miss Brianna...that term "forced femization" I never have gotten that. How can a man say he is into forced femization when in fact if he is into it, he is not being forced at all. Talk about an oxymoron! Ok, I get it that some men need to pretend he is being forced so it is like this act was not his idea. Usually a man that does not accept the fact that he enjoys crossdressing. So it is really just play acting and not real at all.
My SO does tell em when she wants me to dress. it might even be in the form of an order. But never is it forced or even close to it. I want to dress for her. She wants me to dress for her, so I would not even like to "play" like it is forced. I just don't get it.
I also enjoy bondage. Hand cuffs or ankle shackles. I trust makes me feel like she is keeping me all for herself and to serve her every wish. Which I do. Sometimes it kind of scares me about what I'd do to please her. Not sure if it's all about being submissive to her, or out of deep love for her. BUT IN EITHER CASE, I HAVE 100% TRUST IN HER.

[Mea GG]

There seems to be a lot of Doms posting and few subs. Yet we know (as Reine pointed out) that there are probably many more subs in this "lifestyle". Is it because
a) the subs are fearful of the repercussions?
b) Their Doms told them to say that?

Imagine an auditorium full of people.
The speaker asks all the extroverts to stand up and shake hands with all around them. Pretty good odds most of the extroverts will do so.

Now, all the shy people, do the same thing...
anybody? ...no shy people?

I'd love to have a nice sub taking care of my wishes, doing my pedicures and manicures, and trying to keep me happy (actually not hard to do, lol). And if he looked like a babe while doing so, what's not to like? :daydreaming:

Mea, not shy

[Jonianne]

As someone mentioned earlier, Passive or introvert, is probably a more appropiate word for me, than submissive. I have learned to be more assertive than when I was younger and shy'er.

In pretty much everything in life, I do prefer taking on the helper, "wind beneath the wings", kind of role.

However, if someone tries to force me into submission, I can be very much a rebeller. If someone treats me decently and with respect, I always let them have the lead and am satisfied with being the helper/supporter.

If someone has a project, I love anticipating their next move and have the right tools and stuff ready for them to have handy as they are proceding. That is my happiest role in life. I probably would have made a good surgical nurse, helping the doctors.

I also have always prefered strong women as leaders in my life and wanted to pattern my life after them. I have never had a desire to have a male role model and I consciensly made that choice when I was around 5 or 6. My crossdressing started around age 7, so there could be a very natural link for me.

[BRANDYJ]

Imagine an auditorium full of people.
The speaker asks all the extroverts to stand up and shake hands with all around them. Pretty good odds most of the extroverts will do so.

Now, all the shy people, do the same thing...
anybody? ...no shy people?

I'd love to have a nice sub taking care of my wishes, doing my pedicures and manicures, and trying to keep me happy (actually not hard to do, lol). And if he looked like a babe while doing so, what's not to like? :daydreaming:

Mea, not shy

Hi Mea, Your comments got me to thinking about something I have done around female friends from time to time. Now I'm talking about mostly or very vanilla GG women. None that knew of my being either a crossdresser or a submissive at the time. In some cases it was one on one and I remember at different parties, maybe 3-4 women all in a conversation together.

I'd start off asking how they would like a guy that would give them a massage for as long as they liked. Then ask if they would like a guy that did the cooking, cleaning up afterwards, a guy that did the laundry, the main household chores such as vacuuming, dusting, dishes etc. Then I'd ask how they'd like a guy that would brush their hair and care for it, even give them a bath and shave their legs for them. He would do pedicures and manicures, I'd ask if they would like a guy that ran all the errands, would give up a day of fishing or golf and do something together with you even if he would rather do something else. He'd even do all your ironing. And to top it off, he does windows! lol

Well the response was nothing but YES, YES YES! Other then some that did not like someone giving them a bath or brushing their hair or one or another point. But as soon as I said this guy would be submissive to all their needs and wants and look to be dominated by them, some, not all, then would say they don't like submissive men or being dominated. Funny how adding the words dominant and submissive instantly gave them a different view of the picture I painted.

Of course i might have outed myself as a submissive to them, and that's fine. But if I also outed myself as a CD, then things might have really gone negative. However, there are a few that I did trust in telling in private. Not one felt any differently about me as a man or a person.

Interesting how many women would love the attention, but don't want to put a label on it.

[MsJanessa]

That's because the GGs dont want anybody to know that their guy is submissive--actually want they really want is a guy who is dominant with everybody else but submissive to them and their needs.

[leotard fan]

...are crossdressers that are submissive, and are crossdressers are not!
not all crossdressers are submissive, and not all submissive are crossdressers...

big hug to you all!!

[adrienner99]

For those CDs who experience guilt (a needles feeling we impose on ourselves after years of having to be male) submission may help relieve it. Being "forced" to dress or serve a woman may in some way take some of their own decision-making out of it.

Just a theory, but as there are whole sites devoted to submissive "sissies" and some guilt may be inevitable, for some of us anyway, I think it is one possible reason.

The extraordinary pressure some males in high business places deal with may lead to submissive crossdressing, too, or at least be associated with it.

[Cassandra Lynn]

Brandy from the very, very little I know about the lifestyle, I do understand (I think) that at the end of the day the sub "has the upper-hand" so to speak, in any good sub/DOM relationship, especially if it does involve physical correction/pleasure in that safe words/signals are used between the DOM/sub and once spoken/or signaled the play ends immediately or have I got that very very wrong ?

In typical D/s relationships there is a power exchange. Since the top can only behave as the bottom has allowed through negotiations, the bottom has the most power. The power to give, the power to allow, and most importantly the power to say NO!
Any supposed D/s relationship where the bottom just does whatever the top says and is bullied is frowned upon by the BDSM community at large.
These types of bottoms who put themselves in these situations are usually lacking in self esteem and can be somewhat mentally unstable, in other words, a bad situation.
I'm saying this not from experience but because i've done some research and talk with friends in my local BDSM community.
I'm hoping that i may meet a GG that is supportive and accepting of a TG mate, and is also somewhat dominant as i'm naturally submissive.
And i like your discription Brandy, i too wish too serve my mate and honor her in her beauty and femininity by doing so.
mj (Cassie)

[Toni_Lynn]

This is far too general a topic to adraw conclusions, so I shall speak of myself only. It is also far too easy to confuse empathy with submission. As male, I do not do not seek to rule over my wife (or other GGs), for I do not have that right. That said, I do tend to be a lot more open to her needs and wants. I believe in partnership, and think that CDing is a great leveler in that regard.

My CDing when combined with that great partnership has made me stronger, though. I refuse to submit to those who would put me down for being me. I've been hurt too bad in the past, and the stuff won't happen again, because I have a great ally in my my wife.

The final thing I'll say in all this is that I hate the way CDing is presented by porn purveyors. Whilst I can't accurately quantify it, I feel that there is a out of proportion emphasis on submission there.

Huggles

Toni-Lynn

[suzy]

Nope...not submissive but I am flexible. I am an Alpha male in drab but when CD'ing I tend to be a bit less Alpha and more flexible. I mean, I enjoy feeling both feminine (when dressed) and masculine when in drab. I am not ever looking for a fight or trouble but don't like taking direct orders either (dressed or not). I do enjoy helping clean the house while dressed and cook, and ya know, my wife likes it too!:):battingeyelashes:

[suchacutie]

My male self is a control freak and Tina is incredibly high-maintenance (as my wife will tell you!) and is a neatness freak. We do understand well the D/s lifestyle, but my wife and I are "into" equality and empathy, something the arrival of Tina has enhanced greatly!

In keeping with the thread, since Tina only arrive 5 years ago, the reality is that there was nothing submissive about me before Tina, and nothing has changed. In fact, I would venture so far as to say that I see becoming Tina as a very dominant act, taking control of a part of my life that was "floating" up to that point. Ah yes, the control freak in me seems to be in full bloom, even controlling existence to permit my feminine side to flourish.

Tina!

[Midnight Skye]

I'm a switch and dressing doesn't appear to have a direct impact on my dominant or submissive behaviors.

Now choice of clothing certainly does... which is to say if I go for a pink flower soft outfit... it swings my submissive mindset into play.

On the other hand when I grab my leather skirt, a dark red or deep violet top tight to my body... my dominate side takes a nice step forward.

I suspect if one were too do a study on people (any sex) you would find that how one dresses can directly effect how dominate or submissive the person feels (or reacts in a given situation). There have been studies which touch upon these basis's and we know how one dresses effects ones emotions and mood on a multitude of levels.

If I were to gather a guess... most men who cross-dress (and have a significant and healthy male side) will likely feel more submissive when dressed in females clothing. But there we always be some (and some outfits) which work the other way ;)

[~Michelle~]

Is there a connection..crossdressing and being submissive?

The answer is simple in my opinion: no.

[BRANDYJ]

The answer is simple in my opinion: no.

I would disagree with your simple answer Michelle.

I never said anything about 'ALL Cder's being submissive, but I do feel there is a definite connection for 'MANY' CD's to desire being submissive to their wife or SO...or maybe just for play with any GG that would play the role of a Domme. I am not talking about being submissive in general to just anyone or in their social or work place life. I for one am not submissive to anyone any place or time other then the one woman I am in love with. My desire or interest in being submissive to GG's was definitely born out of my admiration, respect, love and yes, even lust for women in general. I simply think this may be true for many of us. Again, not all of course. In fact some CD's like to be or play the Domme role when dressed. Some like to dominate women and some like to dominate other CD's or even men. We surely are not all cut from the same mold. But again, I think it is a popular feeling in many of us.

[BRANDYJ]

I'm a switch and dressing doesn't appear to have a direct impact on my dominant or submissive behaviors.

Now choice of clothing certainly does... which is to say if I go for a pink flower soft outfit... it swings my submissive mindset into play.

On the other hand when I grab my leather skirt, a dark red or deep violet top tight to my body... my dominate side takes a nice step forward.

I suspect if one were too do a study on people (any sex) you would find that how one dresses can directly effect how dominate or submissive the person feels (or reacts in a given situation). There have been studies which touch upon these basis's and we know how one dresses effects ones emotions and mood on a multitude of levels.

If I were to gather a guess... most men who cross-dress (and have a significant and healthy male side) will likely feel more submissive when dressed in females clothing. But there we always be some (and some outfits) which work the other way ;)

Hi Skye, You bring up a very valid point. I will admit that I do feel more submissive when dressed. And further, if I am dressed in a maid's uniform, I feel even more submissive. I would suspect that for the GG Domme, she might also feel more dominant when she is wearing leather, boots, hose and other things that are typically worn by those that engage in BDSM or D/s. However, most truly dominant women dress like anyone else other then for play time, party time etc.
But you make me wonder...If I was to dress in leather and what is considered the dominant look, would I then feel more dominant? I think so. Of course I can't see myself ever dominating my SO. It just would not work or be right for me....and definitely would be a hard limit for her. As in it's not happening! lol

So the way anyone dresses might make them feel differently with each different mode of dress.

[BobbiU]

I can almost copy Tinalynn's words, word for word. As a Male, I am the traditional husband, who is very much in control of the household, and my wife and I are equals in the house. Everyone of our friends would see us as the "traditional" couple. I work, manage the household stuff, and she's the traditional "wife" stereotype. Neither one is submissive or dominate.

However, behind closed doors, all she has to do is say a few words, and we both know who is in control. Not for things such as cleaning, cooking, etc, just small hints of control, like to go get her this or that, or do this small task.

Now, from a CD size, The submissive part has been around for most of our marriage, however, prior to the start of wearing her lingerie, I had to initiate it. Now, as the CD part of our relationship has come out over the past 5 years, she is very comfortable being the Dominate one, and actually is to the point where she enjoys it, and wants more. Nothing big, just mild bdsm stuff. When I'm dressed in lingerie, I totally forget about being the male, and will do anything she ask, and she takes advantage of that. When she leaves a nice nightie on the bathroom counter at night, I immediately know she wishes to dominate me, and I immediately get excited about pleasing her in every way she asks. No questions asked.

So, I don't know if there's a connection, however, both parts have been around for 20 years or so, and it's become more open the last 5 years, and enjoyable to both. As our son will be leaving for the military in 4 months, I'm hoping that the CD and Submissive part of our relationship will grow, and become more of a regular part of our routine.

[BRANDYJ]

Hello again Bobbi, (said hello in your introduction) I too agree with what Tinalynn had to say. There really is no one way or right way to feel or be submissive or dominant. Each couple has to work out what is right for them both to enjoy their roles in each other's life. No different then any other interaction as husband and wife. I think I said it before, for some it's just a weekend or every now and then play thing. For others it's a 24/7 way to interact with each other. Or at least know who is the dominant one and wears the pants so to speak. There are various rituals, protocal that many follow each and everyday. My SO and I did for quite awhile until life got in the way. And when we are able to live together again, it will have to change since we now have her 3 granddaughters to raise. So nothing will be giving us away as to how we interact. We will simply be grandma and grandpa to them. But behind closed doors we know we will still be able to enjoy the private moments in our respective roles in each other's life. But maybe the girls will see how a man does like to help out and do things for the lady he loves. That a woman is not the only one to do chores and housework etc. So I think we can instill some good impressions as to what a caring gentleman is. At the same time, we will always know I serve her and she is in charge. For me, it makes no difference as to how I am dressed. Yet I do feel somewhat more submissive when dressed for her. I'm glad she really enjoys that side of me too.
You are very lucky to have such a wonderful wife that has learned to enjoy your fem and sub side.

[NicoleScott]

The simple answer is: no.
Yes, there are cd's who are submissive, but that doesn't mean there's a connection. And there are guys who don't crossdress, are manly men, take-charge dominant leaders at work and in the community, who are extremely submissive at home.
No connection.

[Mea GG]

The final thing I'll say in all this is that I hate the way CDing is presented by porn purveyors. Whilst I can't accurately quantify it, I feel that there is a out of proportion emphasis on submission there.


But here's a factor...

(oh, gosh, never thought I'd ever be defending purveyors of porn)

the customers of the product are both the dom type who can imagine themselves being the one playing with the sub shown...

while the same images are easy enough for the sub type to imagine being the sub shown.

(Not that I would know :D )

[DonniDarkness]

Hey brandy,

i had some thoughts about the term Forced Femme....
The Forced part is usually part of the Dom's perspective of attraction, as to where the Femme part is is more part of the Subs perception of attraction. Its a two part fantasy, the terminology was created to be attractive for both parties....not just the "sissy"

Skye had a great point as well in her view of the attire/switch persona. Being a switch, i have to agree....Dress and undies is much more the mindset/attitude of being the Sub....as to where the Leather and chains is more the Dom's side of the sexual role play...I tend to think softer and be more open to the Submissive role with softer clothing. When im feeling the Dom side kicking in, its all about the hard edge of the leather and boots....However this just speaks to the sexual side of D/s fantasy

Id also point out sometimes 50/50......means you both have an active role in productivity around your house not just inside....50/50 of the house work, 50/50 of the yard work....
Why cant we just split the 50/50's......ill do the house....and you do the yard.....lol....Just teasing :D

-Donni-

[CdChloe]

I'm more a neutral type as well, however I do notice that I'm sometime more submissive when I'm dressed... I tend to just go with the flow an the only time alarm bells have rung for me at the moment have been when my wife asks if the mail has been. I wouldn't mind toting with the idea of me being submissive but I supposed that's a step for another heeled day ;)

[Melissa A.]

When a young boy feels an attraction to femininity, and things feminine, there will be effects. Living in our culture, it's not unusual for parents, peers, advertising, and the media in general, to often equate femininity, and femaleness in general with frivolousness, weakness and passivity. Shame, embarrassment, and self-loathing can easily accompany a boy's desire to be feminine. It's not a huge step for a developing youngster to sexualize his feelings to deal with the shame he (quite unnecessarilly) feels, and turn his embarrasment and anxiety over being different into a turn-on, something that is alot easier to handle. I didnt just make this up. I have seen it described by more than one person who was a cd or used to identify as one. Seems as good an explanation as, actually better than, any other I have seen.

Hugs,

Melissa:)

[Jo_Larens]

Personally, I would rather be in a relationship in which both parties share responsibilities and "power" equally. then again, i'm a socialist and think damn near everything should be equal.

[Lynn Marie]

Way down deep I'm a man. Shush, keep that kind of quiet around here. I like being a man and I lead in dance, and in the dance of life. I don't really dominate, I lead. I'm subject to correction and am enjoy learning from women on how to lead better. Someone has to lead. I will step up to that responsibility. I work for a woman who lets me lead. She's very smart and knows how to get the best from me. If a woman wants to lead, I'll let her. I'm sure not going to fight her for the lead, but following does not come naturally or easy for me.

Now a little role playing is quite another thing. I'd love for a female dominant to tie me up en femme and force me to submit to her. I'd also like to do the reverse and be that dominant. I love to play and am game for just about anything. I'll be driving on the way home though.

[darla_g]

Hmmm I don't personally think it is so cut and dried as CD = Submissive. I think there are times I like to play a bit submissive and then there are others where I want to be the one to call the shots. :hugs:

[BRANDYJ]

Hmmm I don't personally think it is so cut and dried as CD = Submissive. I think there are times I like to play a bit submissive and then there are others where I want to be the one to call the shots. :hugs:

Hi Darla,

I agree, nothing is cut and dry. I merely suggested that many CD's also enjoy the submissive roll with a GG. Of course there are some that are either gay or bi that enjoy being submissive to a male or even another TG.

At another site expressly for those of us into D/s or other BDSM activities or lifestyles, it just seems that so many submissive males there are also crossdressers. Also in reading many posts here on various topics, many CD's mention they are either submissive or would like to be.

Again for some, it is just a roll play thing they'd love to try with a partner. For others it's merely a bedroom game with their SO. But in every other way they are either equal or even dominate int e day to day relationship with their partner.

The activities, interest, and depth of submission is as wide as the spectrum of a rainbow. No two are just alike. And the personal reasons some of us are into it would vary as much.

There are also many men that do not consider themselves to be crossdressers, but are submissive's that would obey a Dominant's order to dress in a feminine manner. They wold never dress in feminine clothes without being ordered to or expected to by the dominant woman in their life. Some men get off on the humiliation of it. But to a CD, their is no humiliation in dressing for the dominant.

Just my observations and opinion of course.

[Miss Brianna]

Miss Brianna...that term "forced femization" I never have gotten that. How can a man say he is into forced femization when in fact if he is into it, he is not being forced at all. Talk about an oxymoron! Ok, I get it that some men need to pretend he is being forced so it is like this act was not his idea. Usually a man that does not accept the fact that he enjoys crossdressing. So it is really just play acting and not real at all.
My SO does tell em when she wants me to dress. it might even be in the form of an order. But never is it forced or even close to it. I want to dress for her. She wants me to dress for her, so I would not even like to "play" like it is forced. I just don't get it.
I also enjoy bondage. Hand cuffs or ankle shackles. I trust makes me feel like she is keeping me all for herself and to serve her every wish. Which I do. Sometimes it kind of scares me about what I'd do to please her. Not sure if it's all about being submissive to her, or out of deep love for her. BUT IN EITHER CASE, I HAVE 100% TRUST IN HER.


Thanks for the reply. I'm probably a different degree of crossdresser than you. I've only been completely made up with wig and make-up, etc. once in my life. I get what your saying about "forced feminization" being an oxymoron in relation to this forum. On the contrary, I've read many posts of others, on this site, expressing their interest in being commanded on what female articles their SO wants them to wear. With that being said, to each their own. Got more feedback?

[tricia_uktv]

Aaaargh - we are all different. There will be some doms and some subs amongst us. But lets just play the games and have fun.

Me? I'm definately a sub. And proud of it. Because I call the shots!

Hugs

[Melissa in hose]

I am submissive by nature, my wife is also submissive by nature, I am way more into BDSM than she is and she will treat me as a submissive during play time if I ask for it. she prefers me to take the reins so to speak when she is in that mood. She is not into BDSM Dom/sub behavior as much but as far as personality traits, I was submissive prior to discovering I was a crossdresser.

[BRANDYJ]

I was submissive prior to discovering I was a crossdresser.

Hmm, I was a crossdresser long before I discovered I was a submissive. Interesting

[Sissy_Michelle]

I have to agree that when I am dressed up I am submissive and my wife is more dominate, though when she wants me to be more dominate she has her ways. It is about reading my partner. I had a girlfriend once that no matter what I did she was in charge, in a way it was nice and sexy but after awhile no matter what I did or tried to do she would shoot me down or belittle me infront of folks and make me feel real bad. No at that time she didn't know I would then secretly dress up. We only were together for just under a year. She put me on the spot once infront of her friends and I said "no". I haven't spoken to her since.

If you are going to try some Sub / Dom experience you should first speak about it with your partner. Use a "safe word" so that if either of you don't like what is going on there is an easy out. And most importantly communicate with your partner. Whether it is about her / him asking you to clean the house or cook supper to whatever yall do in the bedroom. Don't take anything for granted and don't ever get angry if she / he isn't into Sub / Dom ideas.

Being Dominate can be fun as is being Submissive. I prefer being Submissive...

:daydreaming:

[BRANDYJ]

I have to agree that when I am dressed up I am submissive and my wife is more dominate, though when she wants me to be more dominate she has her ways. It is about reading my partner. I had a girlfriend once that no matter what I did she was in charge, in a way it was nice and sexy but after awhile no matter what I did or tried to do she would shoot me down or belittle me infront of folks and make me feel real bad. No at that time she didn't know I would then secretly dress up. We only were together for just under a year. She put me on the spot once infront of her friends and I said "no". I haven't spoken to her since.

If you are going to try some Sub / Dom experience you should first speak about it with your partner. Use a "safe word" so that if either of you don't like what is going on there is an easy out. And most importantly communicate with your partner. Whether it is about her / him asking you to clean the house or cook supper to whatever yall do in the bedroom. Don't take anything for granted and don't ever get angry if she / he isn't into Sub / Dom ideas.

Being Dominate can be fun as is being Submissive. I prefer being Submissive...

:daydreaming:

Sissy_Michelle, A Dominant GG that would belittle you and put you down, especially in front of others is not being a Dominant, it's being dominating. I am only interested in those relationships that are in fact very loving and caring D/s relationships between a CD or man and the woman he loves. In fact any partner that would humiliate their mate that way is not what I'd calla good partner at all, even without acknowledging any Dom/sub roles.
A good D/s relationship is no different then any other when it comes to trust, honesty and communication. The only difference is that roles are defined and lines are drawn as to who is in charge and when (if not 24/7) There is no right or wrong way. Each couple will be different with different rules and again, like any other relationship, some boundaries will likely be agreed upon.

[Olivia2]

Like many others have pointed out in this thread, there seem to be many different definitions of submission. As for me, I often think of it more as having more comfort with being responsive rather than taking the initiative in relationships, particularly with women. I prefer being pursued rather than pursuing, which in some case may makes me believe I am somewhat narcissistic and does not make it easy in intimate relationships with women.

In my fantasy life, I enjoy being submissive to the point of being "forced" to do certain things sexually or non-sexually by a woman, and has been part of my fantasy life since adolescence. However, in reality when I have felt pressured by a women to have sex or do non-sexual activities, I rarely find it exciting or enjoyable and frequently find it shaming and invalidating.

The stereotypically feminine clothing that I enjoy wearing to me represents the sexual power that women in our culture are "allowed" to express and had to use historically when they had little other avenues to be powerful. IMHO, men in our culture, outside of the gay community are not "permitted" to express their sexuality in clothing and behavior, at least outside of the bedroom. That I think is a big reason why I express that side of myself in feminine clothing. I seem to be more comfortable expressing power that way rather than overtly by being dominant or in control.

[BRANDYJ]

Odd that your fantasy does not match the reality of those times a woman 'pressured' you to do something. But that might be the key. You felt pressured as apposed to being ordered to do something she demanded you to do.
I have never felt pressured to do anything that my Domme has ordered me to do. it was my pleasure, privilege and desire to do all she asks of me. The clothes have little to do with my desire to serve her wants and needs.
I see no shame or invalidating by my doing as she wishes me to do.

[tinadcd]

I am quite submissive to GG's when dressed, and love femdom play. A cute GG that smokes can do ANYTHING she wants with/to me! But I'm VERY dominant to men, boi's and some tgurls when I'm dressed. But I agree the line between dominant and @$$hole gets crossed a lot, especially with genetic males. I work very hard at avoiding such people.

[Lexi X]

I flip flop. I'm a quiet guy. I'm not really the take charge type. I like when my wife takes charge, which is good cuz thats how she is. I like to be more submissive. Maybe I'm just lazy? I like it but in a loving way. Now when I'm dressed she says I'm very aggressive and she really likes that. Psychology is an interesting thing...

[KellyG]

In a recent RuPaul segment they did drag makeovers for tomboy GGs. In one exchange the GG says she always dressed as a boy when she was child because she felt the need to feel powerful. RuPaul says he dresses as a woman in order to feel powerful.
Yes, psychology is an interesting thing.

[sometimes_miss]

For me, I'm not sure the correct word would be submissive. But like girls, I prefer to be re-active to being the initiator of activities, and that includes romantic stuff as well as sex. I'd much prefer she lead and I follow.

[BRANDYJ]

You know, I had a thought. Seems to me that in some relationships where the CD is pressuring his wife or SO into accepting or allowing more dressing or whatever his desires are is the opposite of being submissive. In fact, it could be said he is dominating the relationship by continually pushing for more acceptance or expanding the agreed upon boundaries. So with that said, I suspect those personalities would not be good candidates for being submissive. No wonder their wives are frustrated! If those same CD's would give more of themselves in any way the wife wishes, I bet they'd get a lot more acceptance.
How many times have we read where a CD finally tells his wife, she accepts at first and then soon becomes overwhelmed with her mate's always pushing the envelope. You know...where that newly discovered acceptance puts them in the pink cloud and they can't seem to get enough. And by doing so, turns the wife against what she at first accepted. Maybe not quite being a submissive to his wife, but if he paid more attention to her wants, needs, desires and was more helpful around the house, she would be more in tune with giving back to him what he needs.
I cherish my SO, I want to please her in every way I can. I freely admit to being submissive to her and she freely will admit to being a Domina. It's who we are to each other. So we both win in our chosen roles in each other's lives.

[DameErrant]

Whenever I fantacize about BDSM play, I am always the Dominatrix, with both men and women submitting to me. I am in charge of the bondage and discipline, though always remembering that the sub must have power too; if they don't get what they need, they don't come back. So it's a delicate balance in the relationship of mutual trust, respect and consent. But I do love holding the cat of nine tails.

Maybe it's some subconscious thing, like I want my feminine side to dominate my masculine, or at least get more expression, but that's how it works for me.

[BRANDYJ]

DameErrant, interesting that you feel it could be your subconscious may see your fem side as a Dominatrix over both men and women. In trying to relate to that, I have to think of what kind of a woman I strive to emulate in my dressing. In my case, I see my fem side as that of a Lady, perhaps subservient to other women. After all I do like the role of being my Lady's maid when she wants me to be. But I never see myself subservient to a man or even to another CD. Even a CD/TG that I find very attractive. I see myself as anything but submissive other then to a woman that I admire, adore, love or lust after. There is no way I'd ever submit to another man or even a CD/TG. go figure.
So many different takes on who we are and what makes us tick.
Thanks for your post on the topic. I enjoy others views on BDSM or mainly D/s as much as I do reading, learning and sharing opinions, experiences and the psychology of being TG.
Like cross dressing itself, the world of BDSM ranges from a 24/7 lifestyle, like it is for me, to just an every now and then fun thing to do. For some it's just play or fantasy and for others it's a way of life.

[PantyBoots]

I wouldn't want to be a submissive. However, I wouldn't mind being a partner of sorts with a dominatrix.

For example, there was this lady on the web named Lady Samantha. I don't know if any of you have heard of her. She had a site called ladysamantha.co.uk. Very attractive tall blond woman, about 5'11. I like the outfits that she wears. She wears boots, lingerie, and leather.

I wouldn't want to be one of her subjects. However, I wouldn't mind being a partner of hers that wears boots and lingerie around her mansion and helps her. Not with spanking and torturing submissives, but other things.

[Ashley_Marie]

Heck, no. I would prefer being on more equal footing with whatever woman I finally get involved with. Sure doing something being dominant or submissive might be fun in the bedroom every once in awhile, like once every year or something. But my being submissive is just not going to happen. I don't take orders from other people very well, which is probably why I have gotten laid off from so many jobs over the last 20 years since I graduated high school.

[LilSissyStevie]

There is a connection for me but it's not really clear cut. My earliest erotic fantasies, well before puberty, involved me being kidnapped and molested by adult women. Then, when I was 8, I actually was molested by some older girls. I rather liked it at the time, but it probably messed me up in the long run. I always wonder if I brought it on somehow since it kind of fit into my fantasy life. I also crossdressed since I was 4 or 5 but there was nothing sexual about it. I just wanted to be a girl.

I didn't have sexual fantasies involving crossdressing until I reached puberty. About that time I stumbled upon a stash of porn novels. One of the books was about a bunch of horny teenage boys who weren't having any luck getting girls to have sex with them. As a substitute, they devised some competitions among themselves where the loser had to dress up as a girl and let the other boys have their way with "her." For whatever reason, I was totally turned on by the thought of being the "girl" in those stories. I also thought I was probably gay, but I eventually got over that. One of the other books that made a big impression on me was about a Dominatrix and her male sex slaves. I often fantasized about being one of her slaves but there was no crossdressing or feminization in that book that I can remember.

The common theme in all my sexual fantasies, including the gentle, loving romantic ones, was that I was the bottom. In real life, it caused me big problems in relationships because, despite protestations and propaganda to the contrary, most GGs want to be the bottom, too – at least in the bedroom. I find that true even though I'm not particularly attracted to feminine women. We always seem to end up competing for the bottom spot because I approach sex more like the average GG than like the average male. I tried taking the male role all my life but never enjoyed it much and wasn't very good at it.

That's the way the marriage to my current wife started out. Things were starting to go a little sour in the bedroom department after a couple of years, especially since her libido is much greater than mine. I finally got honest with her and told her what I liked instead of just hinting around. I wanted to serve her without regard to my so-called needs. In fact it is what I find most satisfying. That's very difficult for most GGs -- at least the ones I've been involved with. They want to please their man and they take offense if he isn't interested. For her part, my wife was able to find her inner dominatrix and give me the domination I craved. In fact, I think she enjoys it a little too much sometimes. LOL. The main thing was that I got freed from having to be the “male” in the bedroom.

Ours is not like some cartoon, porn story femdom relationship. She isn't a leather clad, stiletto heeled, heavily made up, whip wielding Domme. Her Dominatrix outfit is flannel pjs and if she ever feels the need to wear makeup, she has to borrow it from me. She tells me that if one of us has to wear trashy underwear, it's not going to be her. The reason I started crossdressing again after about 15 years where I hardly ever dressed – and even then never all the way – was that she ordered me one day to put on a pair of her panties as part of an emasculation game. That triggered my desire to dress again. Now, she likes it when I get all sissied up but probably thinks she created a monster sometimes. So, what is the connection between crossdressing and submission? I don't know. Submissive is something I am, crossdressing is something I do. But, I'm submissive whether I'm crossdressed or not.

BTW, I'm hardly submissive in any other area of my life. I'm not really dominant either. I guess you could call me a lone wolf -- but a sweet and gentle one.:love:

[Annaliese2010]

I wonder how many of us that are crossdressers happen to also consider themselves submissive to GG's..or want to be submissive to a GG...Oh! Me! Me me me me! Where? Who? LOL... Seriously though...I tend to be yielding and too willing to please (in general, not just sexually). It's just the way I've always been towards GG's but...I'm trying to change now actually. I mean...I'm down for anything sexually (with a GG or qualified truly transgendered M2F TG, though not ever with a male of any stripe, whether a CD'er or not). Kinky fun in the bedroom is one thing, but to be totally submissive to ANY one on a general daily basis isn't a good idea. First off, it's not healthy. Secondly, you're gonna get used and left in the end. No one respects anyone who gives and gives ad infinitum. Whether man, woman or somewhere in between, it's intrinsically weak & demeaning, severely so.

[BRANDYJ]

Lil Sissy Stevie, Thanks for sharing your story with us. It's interesting to know how others came to be the way they are concerning their dominance or submissiveness. Just like the way we came to be crossdressers. Many are similar but with a twist and others found their way to CD later in life etc.
But you made me think. Maybe the connection is that when we were growing up, it was always Daddy as the head of household. The housewife more or less submitted to her husband. So maybe our wanting to be submissive to a GG is a subconscious desire to be like the way it was when we were growing up. Many men think of women as being submissive, so it's natural that when we crossdress, we may see ourselves as submissive like the women around us when we were kids.
I am submissive to no one but the lady I love. Other then that, I am not a bit submissive to anyone including at work. I admit, I am not one to take orders well from a supervisor or manager. I have butted heads with several. Almost got me fired a time or two. But then again, I have owned my own business and I have been a manager in other businesses. So my tolerance for poor managers is low. lol

[BRANDYJ]

Kinky fun in the bedroom is one thing, but to be totally submissive to ANY one on a general daily basis isn't a good idea. First off, it's not healthy. Secondly, you're gonna get used and left in the end. No one respects anyone who gives and gives ad infinitum. Whether man, woman or somewhere in between, it's intrinsically weak & demeaning, severely so.

Annaliese, I'm sorry, I have to disagree wiht you. If it is my desire to always be submissive to the lady I love, then there is nothing wrong with it. I don't think you understand exactly what a loving D/s relationship is all about. Notice I said "loving"

I also disagree with you saying no one respects anyone who gives and gives. My Lady has the highest respect for me I could possibly have from a women. She does not use and abuse me. She loves me and realizes the gift of submission I freely give to her.

No it is not intrinsically weak and demeaning for me at all. If it was, I'd have nothing to do with it. In fact, it is my belief that it takes a strong man to give of himself so selflessly to a woman he loves.

How simple can this be...She gives me exactly what I want and I give her exactly what she wants. We are happy and will continue to be happy the way things are.

It's only demeaning when it is forced upon someone. Like the way some men control a woman. Yes, even some CD's. And sadly, some women are so beaten into submission (not necessarily literally) with hurtful words, threats and insults from those men, that they become to weak to leave it.

[LilSissyStevie]

Maybe the connection is that when we were growing up, it was always Daddy as the head of household. The housewife more or less submitted to her husband. So maybe our wanting to be submissive to a GG is a subconscious desire to be like the way it was when we were growing up.

Well, not in my case. My father was locked up somewhere most of my childhood before he disappeared for good. My mother worked to support us and my sisters and I were raised mostly by our physically abusive grandmother. There were no men in my life at all except for peripheral characters. I choose not to psychoanalyze it any more because no matter what happened in the past, you could spin it to explain the present - just like we have two totally different stories right here with the same outcome. The real question is "do I like my life the way it is?" and the answer is: Yes! Absolutely!:D

[Sophie A Walker]

An interesting thread that raises all sorts of questions. Unsurprisingly I suppose a lot of those questions would seem to come back to assumptions about gender and gender roles.

I would guess that the answer to the question posed would have to be, for some yes, for others no. I wonder if there is a generational element for some, especially those who grew up in an era when there was a cultural expectation that women would be submissive and obedient.

For myself it seems the other way round, my masculine side was never particularly dominant or confrontational, though stubborn and doggedly determined, however my feminine side is outgoing, extroverted, quite argumentative, and easily exasperated.

I could see myself playing a dominatrix role in a relationship, but not asubmisive role.

I would hazzard a guess that CD's TG's TS's are no more likely to be dominant or submissive than other groups in society, but that when they are it plays a role in why or more likely how they dress. :)

[Steph.TS]

I'm pretty submissive...

[Annaliese2010]

Personally, I would rather be in a relationship in which both parties share responsibilities and "power" equally. then again, i'm a socialist and think damn near everything should be equal.See, now this to me is the ideal and a very, very cool 21st century mindset.


Annaliese, I'm sorry, I have to disagree wiht you. If it is my desire to always be submissive to the lady I love, then there is nothing wrong with it. I don't think you understand exactly what a loving D/s relationship is all about. Notice I said "loving"Your point is well taken. But I'm guessing your the exception i.e. to find what I assume to be long term happiness & balance in such a skewed relationship. You do realize though that you put yourself at a serious disadvantage. How do you know she's not goin out on you? Or more to the point perhaps, would you care? I mean where does one draw the line?


I also disagree with you saying no one respects anyone who gives and gives. My Lady has the highest respect for me I could possibly have from a women. She does not use and abuse me. She loves me and realizes the gift of submission I freely give to her.Are you SURE about that? Just wondering...


No it is not intrinsically weak and demeaning for me at all. If it was, I'd have nothing to do with it. In fact, it is my belief that it takes a strong man to give of himself so selflessly to a woman he loves.I used to think that, experience has taught me otherwise.


How simple can this be...She gives me exactly what I want and I give her exactly what she wants. We are happy and will continue to be happy the way things are. Hope so. IMO there is nothing sure or 'good' in this world. And there's nothing safe in this world.


It's only demeaning when it is forced upon someone. Like the way some men control a woman. Yes, even some CD's. And sadly, some women are so beaten into submission (not necessarily literally) with hurtful words, threats and insults from those men, that they become to weak to leave it.Or the way some women control abuse and beat to a pulp some men. Ouch! That's why I became transgendered in fact. Got fcin tired of it. Decided if I can't win em, might as well join em! What's the big deal. I take great delight knowing how I'm hotter than the GG's who've fcd me over. And I say this with true humbleness & humility. Lol...

[longdog]

Well, I always secretly wished my girl friends would ask me to put on a pair of tight panties or something tight and stretchy that only females can wear and be like "You need a good spanking" or something along the lines of BDSM, with me tied up.....
:o

All though I was always to shy to talk about such things to my past girl friends, fearing judgement. Ideally, she'd want me to do the same thing to her, but want to do it to me just as often.....

So yes, I think along the the lines of the first poster there is a connection.

But im not a submissive person, I've always taken charge in the bedroom, but its a turn on to not always have to.

Edit:
Oh and wanted to add, I've never had girl friend who came up with that specific fantasy above on her own unfortunately...

[BRANDYJ]

See, now this to me is the ideal and a very, very cool 21st century mindset.

Your point is well taken. But I'm guessing your the exception i.e. to find what I assume to be long term happiness & balance in such a skewed relationship. You do realize though that you put yourself at a serious disadvantage. How do you know she's not goin out on you? Or more to the point perhaps, would you care? I mean where does one draw the line?

Are you SURE about that? Just wondering...
I don't see me at a serious disadvantage at all. You don't know the depth of our commitment to each other and what honor, loyalty means to each of us. As for me knowing that she is not going out on me, that's simple to answer. She is the most honest and loyal person that I've ever known. She is one of the most honorable individuals that I've ever known. Further, if she was going out on me, it would crush me, just as if anyone equal, Dominant or submissive would crush me. I love her, so it would definitely be the end of the relationship just as it would be for many that would feel the rejection or deceit from a partner.
We drew the line a lone time ago. Be open, be honest, be loyal, be faithful and respectful of each other. Because she is the dominant one in our relationship and I submit to her, does not give her a license to break those simple boundaries we put on each other willfully.

I used to think that, experience has taught me otherwise.

Sorry your experience was not good. Perhaps you picked the wrong partner(s), or it was just a game for you and your partner(s) If you had experience in a loving D/s relationship, maybe you let yourself become a doormat to be walked on by someone less honorable that used you and cheated on you with little regard for your wellbeing. Of course that happen in even so called equal relationships.

Hope so. IMO there is nothing sure or 'good' in this world. And there's nothing safe in this world.

To bad you feel that way. Sad that you can't trust someone or have someone as loyal as the Lady I have been blessed in finding as my life partner. I feel sorry for anyone who thinks this way.

Or the way some women control abuse and beat to a pulp some men. Ouch! That's why I became transgendered in fact. Got fcin tired of it. Decided if I can't win em, might as well join em! What's the big deal. I take great delight knowing how I'm hotter than the GG's who've fcd me over. And I say this with true humbleness & humility. Lol...

So you were abused, cheated on and used and that's why you became transgendered????????? Never heard a worse reason in my life. It sounds liek you were really hurt by a woman somewhere along the path if life. I feel sorry for you.

[Satrana]

I can't say that I agree with the premise that CDs are looking for submissiveness especially that found in a D/S relationship. I think the answer is more about CDs having the heavy male burden of responsibility removed from their shoulders leaving them free to explore the whimsical fun aspects of femininity.

I know many men do not feel they have a natural inclination to be a dominant, authoritative, decision-making partner. It is a role we are forced to play but does not feel comfortable. I think as young boys this male role can seem especially daunting and this is what kick-starts the idea of being a girl. Put on a skirt and I will not be picked on, will not have to fight, will not have to prove my worth, will not have to test my courage, will not have to lead, will not have to make decisions etc.

This is not submissiveness rather it is about not wanting to be the leader and feeling free to choose and wanting the same freedom for others. I am an independent person who hates taking orders but at the same time feels I have no right to order anyone else just because I am male.

I would concur that when the CDing is focused on sexual fantasies then the perceived submissiveness of the female role is indeed acted out and this may in turn lead to exploration of BDSM activites. So there is a link to the secondary sexual fetish behavior but not to the origins of why we became CDers in the first place.

[ginafaye]

i love beining the submissive one, as gina grew in a lot of ways our roles reversed, it still seems i still do all the hard guy jobs around the house to . but when we first met and datet i truly was the alpha dog out door construcion worker type, slow over time gina grew and we became true partners in life and in love

[abassi]

submissive, not in the same universe

Im a laid back kind of person, I lead my friends when its necessary. Or bite instead of barking at people.

[Pythos]

I don't think I am predominately sub or Dom, I think it is fun to trade off :)
I don't admire weak. But I also dislike people pushing their prowess upon others.

So this is an area of slight conflict for me.

[BRANDYJ]

I don't think I am predominately sub or Dom, I think it is fun to trade off :)
I don't admire weak. But I also dislike people pushing their prowess upon others.

So this is an area of slight conflict for me.

Hi Pythos, So in your view a submissive is weak? I don't agree. As for someone pushing their prowess on another, I assume you mean in a way that the submissive has not agreed to respond to. Yes, there are some very cruel people, both male and female that abuse and use a submissive in a very unhealthy way for the submissive. I am not tolerant of that either. I especially do not like most male Doms that I have run into and the way they treat a GG female submissive. To many males are into the lifestyle for the wrong reasons and unfortunately their are some GG females with low self esteem that tolerate it. Yes, it happens with GG Dommes too, but far less.
My Dominant is not only a Dominant, but we are in love with each other. She pushes nothing on me. I submit to her freely and willingly and love making her life easier and hopefully better. Her love care and sincere concern for me makes my life better. It works for us and we are very happy in the interaction we share between us. I feel like the luckiest CD and man in the world. She is a dream come true for me.

[Shananigans]

Hi Pythos, So in your view a submissive is weak? I don't agree. As for someone pushing their prowess on another, I assume you mean in a way that the submissive has not agreed to respond to. Yes, there are some very cruel people, both male and female that abuse and use a submissive in a very unhealthy way for the submissive. I am not tolerant of that either. I especially do not like most male Doms that I have run into and the way they treat a GG female submissive. To many males are into the lifestyle for the wrong reasons and unfortunately their are some GG females with low self esteem that tolerate it. Yes, it happens with GG Dommes too, but far less.
My Dominant is not only a Dominant, but we are in love with each other. She pushes nothing on me. I submit to her freely and willingly and love making her life easier and hopefully better. Her love care and sincere concern for me makes my life better. It works for us and we are very happy in the interaction we share between us. I feel like the luckiest CD and man in the world. She is a dream come true for me.

My SO does enjoy being submissive, but we are both pretty flexible in our roles.

It's obvious that submission is prevalent in the CD community; however, I feel it's just a pretty common fantasy in general. I think a lot of men find a female in a powerful role sexually appealing...not just CDs.

But, in response to your original post. Sex is sex is sex. Sure, it's fun to role play and have a good time. But, do I want someone submissive 24/7? No. Do I want to boss someone around and make them my b*tch every chance I get? No. That's stupid. I generally like to date people with spines and someone that I actually respect.

I think that anyone who wants to be forced into submission and doing tasks for a dominant individual 24/7 is seriously emotionally disturbed and needs counseling.

Besides, it's much more fun to make a really proud man submissive than one that is just a lost little puppy from the get go. ;)

[BRANDYJ]

My SO does enjoy being submissive, but we are both pretty flexible in our roles.

It's obvious that submission is prevalent in the CD community; however, I feel it's just a pretty common fantasy in general. I think a lot of men find a female in a powerful role sexually appealing...not just CDs.

But, in response to your original post. Sex is sex is sex. Sure, it's fun to role play and have a good time. But, do I want someone submissive 24/7? No. Do I want to boss someone around and make them my b*tch every chance I get? No. That's stupid. I generally like to date people with spines and someone that I actually respect.

I think that anyone who wants to be forced into submission and doing tasks for a dominant individual 24/7 is seriously emotionally disturbed and needs counseling.

Besides, it's much more fun to make a really proud man submissive than one that is just a lost little puppy from the get go. ;)

Hi Shananigans,

I agree with the first part of what you said. Up to the statement of "that's stupid" Having read many of your posts, I have come to like and respect you.
However, maybe I'm taking your statement to personal, or the wrong way.

At least wanting to set the record straight. First, it's your not wanting to boss somebody around 24/7 and make them your bitch.
See, this is your take, your understanding or view of what a D/s relationship is about. Believe me, it's not; Especially a loving D/s relationship.

Then you say anyone wanting to be "forced into submission" is seriously emotionally disturbed. My original post is not about being forced into anything. How can someone be forced into something they want?
I'm far from being forced into anything by anyone. I freely submit to the lady I love. I freely like doing things for her. I am not forced. I do not like the idea of anyone being forced to do anything they do not want to do. That includes any act of sex. And BTW, D/s is not all about sex anymore then being a Cd is all about sex. Sure, it can be a part of both... and I agree that it is high on most subs, and dominants list as it is for being on the minds of many Cds.

You use the term "making someone your b*tch" In the first place, I'm no one's bitch and never will be. But of course that could be a role play thing some get into. I understand that.

I further hope you did not mean that anyone that likes to be submissive to someone 24/7 is in serious need of counseling and is emotionally disturbs. That would be about as insulting and wrong as saying that most CDs need counseling and are emotionally disturbs.

As far as making a proud man a submissive then a whipped puppy, I'd have to agree with you there... And so would my Lady. I am very proud of who I am and no problem in being who and what I am....a honorable man, a crossdresser, a lover, and one that happens to enjoy my Lady being the dominant one in our everyday life.

I certainly hope you were not making a judgment of me personally and that I either misinterpreted your post or you did not word your thoughts correctly.

[Pythos]

Brandy,

You seem to ignore something.

Society.

The only submissives I have met have had extremely low self esteem, are usually women that have been raised in a manner that makes their self worth very low unless they have "a man"

When I think submissive I don't think the terms you are saying, I am thinking of a person that essentially gives up their "rights" and go into abject misery, just so they can "serve" their partner.

I am curently mixed up with a girl that falls into that latter category. She is very submissive, and is often upset with how she is unhappy, but at least her lover is happy.

That sounds like a crummy relationship to me.

But when you talk to me you are talking to someone that finds men attracted to women that are bound up and helpless, to have a couple of screws loose.

Oh I know of the whole "trust" thing, but to me this is just taking it a bit far.

What doesn't help me is many of the styles of the bdsm community I like :)

The term "submissive" strikes me in the same manner as the work "sissy", though to a lesser extent.

Ah hell, why can't people just love one another without one domineering the other? LOL

On a side note, I accidentally came across a video on you tube with the word Scissors grip or something in the title.

Essentially a body stockinged female wraps her legs around some normal clothed dude, and proceeds to squeeze her legs and crush his neck. His head turns beat red, and he does not look like he is enjoying himself. But this is love? This makes absolutely no sense to me. Heck to me, this is disturbing. Then I saw the several other videos that were much the same, and with different people.

[BRANDYJ]

Brandy,

You seem to ignore something.

Society.

The only submissives I have met have had extremely low self esteem, are usually women that have been raised in a manner that makes their self worth very low unless they have "a man"

When I think submissive I don't think the terms you are saying, I am thinking of a person that essentially gives up their "rights" and go into abject misery, just so they can "serve" their partner.

I am curently mixed up with a girl that falls into that latter category. She is very submissive, and is often upset with how she is unhappy, but at least her lover is happy.

That sounds like a crummy relationship to me.

But when you talk to me you are talking to someone that finds men attracted to women that are bound up and helpless, to have a couple of screws loose.

Oh I know of the whole "trust" thing, but to me this is just taking it a bit far.

What doesn't help me is many of the styles of the bdsm community I like :)

The term "submissive" strikes me in the same manner as the work "sissy", though to a lesser extent.

Ah hell, why can't people just love one another without one domineering the other? LOL

On a side note, I accidentally came across a video on you tube with the word Scissors grip or something in the title.

Essentially a body stockinged female wraps her legs around some normal clothed dude, and proceeds to squeeze her legs and crush his neck. His head turns beat red, and he does not look like he is enjoying himself. But this is love? This makes absolutely no sense to me. Heck to me, this is disturbing. Then I saw the several other videos that were much the same, and with different people.

Not sure what you mean in my ignoring society. But let's just say I disagree since I am very aware of what society norms, expectations and limits society puts on all of us.

I have also met submissive GG's that seem to fit your description. The sad part is that they are not only submissive to some guy, but also abused, used and not highly thought of by the so called Dom they serve. It's sad.

Sorry you are mixed up in a relationship with a women like you describe. How sad. I'd say her lover is the one with a bigger problem since he uses her to get what he wants. Frankly, I am very suspicious of any so called dominant men and their motives. It sure as heck is not love for the majority of them.

Like you, I don't like the word sissy either. If anyone were to call me that, I'd deck them for sure. As for the word submissive, it is just to describe my desire to serve the lady I love in any manner she wishes. But I think I get it in what you mean. As for domineering...to me it is not the same thing as dominating someone. My Lady is not domineering, yet she is dominant in a very fair, loving way. We are equal in all respects other then who wears the pants so to speak. We both get out of the relationship what we both want. Now that's equal. lol

[Pythos]

I just realized I left out.

I absolutely like the idea of mutual love between me and my future girlfriend.

I want her to do stuff not because she feels she must but because it is what she wishes.

I am all about empowering people, I really dislike hearing people saying "their purpose is to serve others, at the expense of themselves" There are only some few times this is a good thing in my eyes and one of those is when a heroic action is involved.

[Shananigans]

Hi Shananigans,

I agree with the first part of what you said. Up to the statement of "that's stupid" Having read many of your posts, I have come to like and respect you.
However, maybe I'm taking your statement to personal, or the wrong way.

At least wanting to set the record straight. First, it's your not wanting to boss somebody around 24/7 and make them your bitch.
See, this is your take, your understanding or view of what a D/s relationship is about. Believe me, it's not; Especially a loving D/s relationship.

Then you say anyone wanting to be "forced into submission" is seriously emotionally disturbed. My original post is not about being forced into anything. How can someone be forced into something they want?
I'm far from being forced into anything by anyone. I freely submit to the lady I love. I freely like doing things for her. I am not forced. I do not like the idea of anyone being forced to do anything they do not want to do. That includes any act of sex. And BTW, D/s is not all about sex anymore then being a Cd is all about sex. Sure, it can be a part of both... and I agree that it is high on most subs, and dominants list as it is for being on the minds of many Cds.

You use the term "making someone your b*tch" In the first place, I'm no one's bitch and never will be. But of course that could be a role play thing some get into. I understand that.

I further hope you did not mean that anyone that likes to be submissive to someone 24/7 is in serious need of counseling and is emotionally disturbs. That would be about as insulting and wrong as saying that most CDs need counseling and are emotionally disturbs.

As far as making a proud man a submissive then a whipped puppy, I'd have to agree with you there... And so would my Lady. I am very proud of who I am and no problem in being who and what I am....a honorable man, a crossdresser, a lover, and one that happens to enjoy my Lady being the dominant one in our everyday life.

I certainly hope you were not making a judgment of me personally and that I either misinterpreted your post or you did not word your thoughts correctly.

Hey, Brandy, I didn't mean to offend...let me set what I am saying straight. As I have said, I enjoy the D/S roles. However, these roles stay in the bedroom. We do not take them beyond the bedroom. (Although it could be argued that I am a very domineering and aggressive person outside of the bedroom when it comes to other things like work). I personally think that living in that submissive relationship to a person 24/7 IS dumb. Again, it's my opinion. (And, opinion are like a**holes, I know, and everyone's got one). But, I don't know how you go about your daily life or what your relationship is. I agree that what happens in the bedroom isn't "forced" submission. Whoever is in that role wants it.

What I am talking about is having that roleplaying go on 24/7 in your everyday life. For my SO and I it is very much roleplaying. Emphasis on the "playing" and that's why it is fun and exciting.

However, I must point out that you say that you freely love doing things for the lady you love...maybe your idea of D/S is different from what we do. It's not like I'm saying, "Baby, can you please take out the trash for me?" And, he does it and that is making him submissive. No, that's just being courteous and in a relationship. That's not submission.

And, I still stand by my grounds that if you are groveling to a person and submitting to their every whim 24/7 that it IS disturbing. I just personally don't find that to be a healthy relationship. I also think it's unfair of you to lump every CD into that category of being totally submissive. I'm sorry, but this just isn't true. I see a trend with a lot of CDs wanting it in the bedroom, but I don't see many saying that they want to live their lives in total submission.

Again, I am making a lot of assumptions here. I don't know personally what you do in your everyday life for your SO. Personality wise, sure, I would say I am the "domineering" one in my relationship. But, by THAT domineering and bedroom domineering...completely different story. And, I don't encourage Ryan to tap into his submissive behaviors in our everyday relationship. Even though I may be the more dominant one naturally, I put him on my level as my equal. I do stuff for him and he does stuff for me...not because I'm dominant or he's submissive...just because we love each other. And, if THAT'S what you are talking about, I think that's perfectly normal. If not...then I am confused. I don't want to offend you and I don't judge you, but I am for expressing my viewpoints. If I have misinterpreted what you are saying, please let me know. Either in PM or on here. :hugs:

[BRANDYJ]

Hey, Brandy, I didn't mean to offend...let me set what I am saying straight. As I have said, I enjoy the D/S roles. However, these roles stay in the bedroom. We do not take them beyond the bedroom. (Although it could be argued that I am a very domineering and aggressive person outside of the bedroom when it comes to other things like work). I personally think that living in that submissive relationship to a person 24/7 IS dumb. Again, it's my opinion. (And, opinion are like a**holes, I know, and everyone's got one). But, I don't know how you go about your daily life or what your relationship is. I agree that what happens in the bedroom isn't "forced" submission. Whoever is in that role wants it.







What I am talking about is having that roleplaying go on 24/7 in your everyday life. For my SO and I it is very much roleplaying. Emphasis on the "playing" and that's why it is fun and exciting.

However, I must point out that you say that you freely love doing things for the lady you love...maybe your idea of D/S is different from what we do. It's not like I'm saying, "Baby, can you please take out the trash for me?" And, he does it and that is making him submissive. No, that's just being courteous and in a relationship. That's not submission.

And, I still stand by my grounds that if you are groveling to a person and submitting to their every whim 24/7 that it IS disturbing. I just personally don't find that to be a healthy relationship. I also think it's unfair of you to lump every CD into that category of being totally submissive. I'm sorry, but this just isn't true. I see a trend with a lot of CDs wanting it in the bedroom, but I don't see many saying that they want to live their lives in total submission.

Again, I am making a lot of assumptions here. I don't know personally what you do in your everyday life for your SO. Personality wise, sure, I would say I am the "domineering" one in my relationship. But, by THAT domineering and bedroom domineering...completely different story. And, I don't encourage Ryan to tap into his submissive behaviors in our everyday relationship. Even though I may be the more dominant one naturally, I put him on my level as my equal. I do stuff for him and he does stuff for me...not because I'm dominant or he's submissive...just because we love each other. And, if THAT'S what you are talking about, I think that's perfectly normal. If not...then I am confused. I don't want to offend you and I don't judge you, but I am for expressing my viewpoints. If I have misinterpreted what you are saying, please let me know. Either in PM or on here. :hugs:

Shananigans, first let me apologize for taking so long to respond to your last post. I think I understand what you are trying to say and that you were not making a personal attack on me. No harm done. See, your view of what a submissive and a Dominant is, is very different then mine when I think read or hear those terms. Your mind processes it as something fun and fun only in the bedroom. I get this thought process you have from this one line you wrote: And, I still stand by my grounds that if you are groveling to a person and submitting to their every whim 24/7 that it IS disturbing. And in the way you think about it and expressed it, I would agree with you.
So when someone says they are submissive 24/7 to someone, you have those images of the things some might do ONLY in the bedroom. You don't see the loving side of what it is to some of us in a 24/7 relationship. But I can see why you feel that way. Not all D/s relationships are good or even healthy. Especially when it is the male that is the dominant. So many take advantage of someone's low self esteem and low opinion of themselves. They feel they have to submit to keep that so called Dom. Many are abused and used my some low-life jerk of a man that calls himself a Dom simply to get a woman to do anything he says. Now that's sick. I'm sure there are some GG Dommes that do the same thing to a male that has a low level of self respect and self esteem. But it's more rare...I hope.
The images and what we think when we read or hear certain words can set of a very negative thought process for us. Kind of like the images and thoughts I have when I hear or read the term sissy, or sissy maid. I hate those terms and have very negative thoughts about what anyone that calls themselves a sissy is really like. So I think I see where you are coming from. Again, no harm done. I still respect and like you. :):D

[Candice Mae]

I'm usually more calm and relaxed when dressed, Its weird as soon as I put on my lingerie its like a switch is turned on.

[Fab Karen]

Submission in the bedroom is fun & exciting, regardless of whether it's with a male, female, or TG person. Other than that, no- I'm a modern woman. :)

[cobra6481]

I'm thinking that our marriage doesn't have a dom-sub subtext, so I don't really know how that would work. In the rest of my life I usually try to be cooperative and enabling to others, primarily because I'm lazy and if I can get them to handle stuff, I can sit. Sometimes, however I end up being the one in control because no one else wants it and there is no good way out of it. I do okay.

similar to my relationship/life

[kellyanne]

All Nonsense ! ... here is your riding crop Madame... ;o)

[BRANDYJ]

All Nonsense ! ... here is your riding crop Madame... ;o)

Now that's funny, I don't care who ya are.:eek:

[BRANDYJ]

I just want to tell those that are interested, that my SO, the one I love and serve, that she has joined this site and is just waiting for the Administrators to approve her. I am glad she has honored me by wanting to be a part of our site.
I hope some of you will give her a warm welcome when she makes her introduction message. She will also join FAB once she makes the necessary 10 posts and receives an invitation.

[xdresser4u2dressup]

I think at some point we all like to be submissive , we are creatures of habit and change . Even Straight Men < the considered norm > likes to be submissive at some point as well as the Woman being Dominant at some point . I think it comes down to whoever has the Strongest Physical urge wants to be the more Dominent .

[BRANDYJ]

I think at some point we all like to be submissive , we are creatures of habit and change . Even Straight Men < the considered norm > likes to be submissive at some point as well as the Woman being Dominant at some point . I think it comes down to whoever has the Strongest Physical urge wants to be the more Dominent .

You are so right. so many men CD or not, want to be submissive to women. That's why there are so many professional Dominatrices making a living catering to the need, desire or urge for males that want to submit. Some make $200.00 plus an hour by simply letting a man clean their house for them and then punish him if he does not do a good job. I have read of and heard of many men of power in the corporate world, the government world that pay big bucks to have a woman dominate them. Maybe it's an escape or release just as crossdressing is for so many. I know for me, I could never... or would never pay a woman to dominate me. It's to artificial, and it would bother me that her only interest in me is the amount of money she will get paid. But for some men, that is the only way they can live out their desire to submit. I frankly feel sorry for them. Just search the web and in every larger city you will find a professional to meet the needs of those that pay to play. I don't get it, but hey, that's me.
Not to get to far off track about my original post and thoughts, I simply wanted to see how many other crossdressers "might" be or want to be submissive to a woman. Especially to one they really care about, such as a wife or girlfriend. I understand that very few live it 24/7...anymore then they cross dress 24/7. For many it is just a very sexy, erotic fun thing to do with a mate. Basically in the bedroom so to speak; No doubt it is the majority of those that have this desire to submit. I am surely NOT suggesting that all crossdressers are or want to be submissive. And our personal reasons will vary as much as our style of dress.

I hope my SO will find this thread and chime in with her comments. She has joined this site and will drop in from time to time when not busy with her granddaughters that now dominant her everyday life and free time is rare.

[adrienner99]

I would never be submissive as a lifestyle, but it is an exciting fantasy and absolutely connected to CDing, somehow. Look at how many CDs enjoy the French maid look and scenario. It combines both...There are also degrees of submission, even in fantasy role play. I would never want to be abused, but there are scenes I could do--keeping in mind it's all fun and games, not a lifetime choice...

[BRANDYJ]

Adrienner, you make some good points. You are right about how many CD's like the French maid fantasy. I bet as many French maid costumes are sold to males as are sold to GG's. And I agree, most interest in submission is in fantasy role play. Some of us just take that a bit further. I also agree...I mean who wants to be abused? Let's understand, that submission is NOT abuse. Abuse happens in any type of relationship, not just for those that are submissive. The 2 things are not related. Lifetime choice...hmmm? Is cross dressing a lifetime choice? Do we make the choice to be who we are? Thanks for your comments.

[Shananigans]

Shananigans, first let me apologize for taking so long to respond to your last post. I think I understand what you are trying to say and that you were not making a personal attack on me. No harm done. See, your view of what a submissive and a Dominant is, is very different then mine when I think read or hear those terms. Your mind processes it as something fun and fun only in the bedroom. I get this thought process you have from this one line you wrote: And, I still stand by my grounds that if you are groveling to a person and submitting to their every whim 24/7 that it IS disturbing. And in the way you think about it and expressed it, I would agree with you.
So when someone says they are submissive 24/7 to someone, you have those images of the things some might do ONLY in the bedroom. You don't see the loving side of what it is to some of us in a 24/7 relationship. But I can see why you feel that way. Not all D/s relationships are good or even healthy. Especially when it is the male that is the dominant. So many take advantage of someone's low self esteem and low opinion of themselves. They feel they have to submit to keep that so called Dom. Many are abused and used my some low-life jerk of a man that calls himself a Dom simply to get a woman to do anything he says. Now that's sick. I'm sure there are some GG Dommes that do the same thing to a male that has a low level of self respect and self esteem. But it's more rare...I hope.
The images and what we think when we read or hear certain words can set of a very negative thought process for us. Kind of like the images and thoughts I have when I hear or read the term sissy, or sissy maid. I hate those terms and have very negative thoughts about what anyone that calls themselves a sissy is really like. So I think I see where you are coming from. Again, no harm done. I still respect and like you. :):D

I don't see the term "Dominant" or "Submissive" as negative terms. Just since they are so widely use in accordance to BDSM, I tend to think along those lines of what that usually entails.

One could say that I have a domineering personality outside of the bedroom, or that Ryan tends to be the one more willing to bend. But, it seems so weird to say that we have these set assigned "roles" 24/7. I think most well-rounded personalities have a blend of both dominant and submissive characteristics. This blend of personality traits is quite different from what I would assign as the "dominant" and "submissive" roles of that are synonymous with the BDSM culture.

If I ask Ryan to do something...9 times out of 10, he will do it. And, vice versa. It's not really a dominance or submission thing...it's just a relationship. You do things to make the other person happy.

Am I completely missing your point? I'm still kind of confused on what you are assigning as these 24/7 D/S roles.

[Tina P Hose]

Crossdressing is my way of being submissive, I am a sissy. I suppose, when it comes to sex.

[DianeCDPhx]

I find myself attracted to both roles dressed in female clothes and male clothes. When dating a gg I was both' but when I put on my girl clothes I really liked to dominate her. When I have dated men I find that I like being the top and bottom. It might very well depend on what kind of mood I am in.

[sandra-leigh]

I never learned how to be submissive. I'd probably have gotten a lot further in careerdom if I had.

I'm the person who, at company presentations, asks the questions that everyone wants to know the answer to and doesn't dare to ask. "Q: There's a rumour that there are going to be layoffs." "A: No! Never thought of them!" "Q: that's not what you said last meeting" "A: Oh, well, things are different now"

I had a girlfriend once who was quite controlling; after three months I had to get out and take a break and regain my balance.

My wife has asked me to not get the hair on my face removed. I'd prefer to get it removed, and probably will some day. But in the meantime it is in the status of "I don't need to do it now and it makes her more comfortable with me that I don't do it; I can compromise on this matter. She asked, she didn't order or belittle or anything like that: important to her but not so important to me at this time. Meanwhile, I walk around the house with my decorated toenails and my wife offered me a blouse that is too big for her and didn't mind at all that I was out for my monthly meeting last night... sometimes giving up a little can gain a lot without there being any "submission" involved.

[Sara74]

I think being a CD and being submissive is all about perspective. I myself have had a lot of experience in the BDSM community and have seen many men crossdress or be "feminized" for their Mistress' delight and entertainment. Some of them do it only for that particular "scene" and some do it simply because they love the feeling they get portraying a woman. Suprisingly enough though only a small handful actually do this as part of their life. As I said, it's all about perspective. Now, I can see every single one of us feeling a bit submissive, especially when we are taking the first big steps of making our femme sides a reality. We watch, listen, follow directions and even obey the wishes of the GG women in our lives. That is not being submissive per say, but learning from the best teachers we have. I agree with most of you, that becoming a groveling foot kisser is disgusting and de-moralizing to any gender. That is what is called a "slave" in the BDSM realm. A submissive is totally seperate from a slave in many ways, such as the sub will be nurtured and cared for and cherished. The slave is just an object and a toy. Nothing more. It's a sad reality, but there are many who enjoy that way of life, but who are we to throw stones?

Be your own Dominant, and at the sametime, be your own submissive. Set the rules for yourself girls and live up to the decisions and promises that you make to yourself and your families. We are different, yes. But we are all still people and should be respected no less than anyone else. Be proud of who you are and be exactly that...YOU!

[Ms.KatarinaRose]

Good Morning
By way of introduction, I’m Ms. Kat; SO to Brady J , and new to your forum. I’m impressed with the posting of members here. One thing that pops right up … everyone has a healthy respect for each others choices.

Having lived an alternative lifestyle most of my life, I’ve had the pleasure of meeting and interacting with many different folks with a “fetish” … don’t like that word, but I’ll use it. While I wouldn’t say there is a connection between the two, Many men over 40 that I’ve met who are also CD’s adored their Mother and Fathers relationship, and grew up in the gender bias Era with the belief that women were born to be beautiful, soft, sensual and … to serve. It doesn’t make them less of a Man or more of a Woman … simply increases the desire to fulfill more of the female role … hence in their mind/view “submissive”.


Someone said “I’d rather be considered an equal”. I’m a Dominant Woman, and consider my SO and equal partner in life. A Dominant can’t dominate without a willing submissive, just as a submissive can’t submit without a Dominant to lead. Like the two sides of a battery to keep the car running smoothly. Two personalities, bodies etc to create one union … Etc…you get the picture.

Just my 5cents worth at 5am

Sara74

Very well said !! wish I had read your post before submitting my own. I would have just said ... Yeah, What Sara said (-;

[BRANDYJ]

Good morning Honey. (Ms.KatarinaRose) I am so glad you commented on my thread and noticed that at this site, you won't see disrespectful people that are always negative, hurtful or unkind to others like I've have seen in other forums. If I had posted a thread about either crossdressing or D/s related things at a few other sites I belong to, the flamers would jump all over it. You will see very few people attacking others for either a difference of opinions or our lifestyle choices. We may not agree with some things discussed, but we will disagree in a respectful way or just leave the thread alone. The few times I've seen a thread get out of hand with personal attacks or other potentiality hurtful posts, the administration and the mods are all over it and will shut the thread down. I think they do a great job.

But most important, I am so happy to see you join us! Thank you Ma'am! I love you with all my heart.

[Jane P]

I have explored the idea of my being submissive to my wife and have been a part of a discussion group that explores this type of relationship. In my case the word submissive simply means that I have put my wife's career ahead of my own while taking on the role of support staff in the home. (support staff meaning the role typically or traditionally taken on by the wife or woman in the relationship)
By saying this I am not suggesting that women are in any way submissive or inferior in any way by taking on this role , (having now done it I know how challenging and important this job really is) many GG's no doubt still rule the roost from this position.

For me , my thoughts of crossdressing go way farther back than thoughts of my submissive role in the relationship. When the time came , it was I that simply found that this role was better suited for me. I often struggle with my urges to dress as I do not find it appropriate to have my son see me this way. So blah blah blah , blah blah blah blah .............for me there is somewhat of a connection between crossdressing and being submissive, but I do not think that for everyone in similar situations this has to be the case.

Jonnie

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

To answer the original question I would have to say no, but my reasons may not equal another persons reason for that. My S/O and I go to clubs, we have "play" time and as male I am mostly Dominant with an occasional switch to sub if the mood hits me. We fit together perfectly in our playtime and it stays in the bedroom unless we go to a place where others can play, demonstrate and explore in the usual "Safe Sane & Concensual" atmosphere.
As for CDing, I've never felt anything either way as femme. Although it might be interesting to explore my other personality's Dominant traits ;)
Now, where did I leave that crop?

*hugs*
Zarabeth

[eluuzion]

Well, I guess I enjoy the technique of self-deprecation-- I'm just not very good at it. lol

I can relate to the "submissive" concept, but I do not feel it is specifically attached to GG issues. I believe it is more of an open perspective as a compensatory behavior engaged to offset the constant demands and stress associated with being the "leader" or "boss" in business world.

Just my view..

But I can change it, if that is what you want me to do. Just tell me what you want to hear, and I will make you happy...really...I'll do anything you want...

hehehehe

E

[BRANDYJ]

To answer the original question I would have to say no, but my reasons may not equal another persons reason for that. My S/O and I go to clubs, we have "play" time and as male I am mostly Dominant with an occasional switch to sub if the mood hits me. We fit together perfectly in our playtime and it stays in the bedroom unless we go to a place where others can play, demonstrate and explore in the usual "Safe Sane & Concensual" atmosphere.
As for CDing, I've never felt anything either way as femme. Although it might be interesting to explore my other personality's Dominant traits ;)
Now, where did I leave that crop? *hugs*
Zarabeth

So I assume your wife is also up for switching from sub to Domme if her mood hits her? How does that work if you are in the mood to be Dom and she is in the mood to be Domme? Who wins the coin toss? lol I think it's great if both of you enjoy both roles and your way of play works for you both.


Well, I guess I enjoy the technique of self-deprecation-- I'm just not very good at it. lol

I can relate to the "submissive" concept, but I do not feel it is specifically attached to GG issues. I believe it is more of an open perspective as a compensatory behavior engaged to offset the constant demands and stress associated with being the "leader" or "boss" in business world.

Just my view..

But I can change it, if that is what you want me to do. Just tell me what you want to hear, and I will make you happy...really...I'll do anything you want...

hehehehe

E

Eluuzion, Now that's funny! Is that anything like self whipping? (I've heard of it, but don't get it) lol

You are so right, submission, for many is a way to escape the demands and stress of the business world. Just as we know that crossdressing also serves that same purpose for many. BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts. You do have an interesting way of sharing your thoughts and opinions. Usually with a sense of humor.
So now I will invoke my Dom side (if I can find it) and order you to NOT change! lol

[AlexisWest]

I prefer sub

[Danielle Gee]

Hello: I guess I've never thought of myself as either "Dominent' or as a "Submissive" untill I started P/Ming Brandy that is.

My Sweetie has my paycheck direct deposited into her account and give me an allowance each week.

I'm responsible for keeping the house neat and clean and the dishes washed (she helps somtimes)

I do all the laundry (washing, folding and putting them away)

I do at least 75% of the cooking and washing dishes

I'm "dressed' at home about half the time

If i'm "bad" i'm punished (usuallly corner time , but sometimes something more severe)

But on the other hand she's very sweet to me, doesn't involve me in difficult decisions, and generally treats me like a genuine woman. I love her so much!!

Brandy once told me I was in a D&s relationship (and I sure wasn't the "D") That may me true, but we're very happy in our life.. Does anyone else have a similer story?

Danielle

[BRANDYJ]

Hello: I guess I've never thought of myself as either "Dominent' or as a "Submissive" untill I started P/Ming Brandy that is.

My Sweetie has my paycheck direct deposited into her account and give me an allowance each week.

I'm responsible for keeping the house neat and clean and the dishes washed (she helps somtimes)

I do all the laundry (washing, folding and putting them away)

I do at least 75% of the cooking and washing dishes

I'm "dressed' at home about half the time

If i'm "bad" i'm punished (usuallly corner time , but sometimes something more severe)

But on the other hand she's very sweet to me, doesn't involve me in difficult decisions, and generally treats me like a genuine woman. I love her so much!!

Brandy once told me I was in a D&s relationship (and I sure wasn't the "D") That may me true, but we're very happy in our life.. Does anyone else have a similer story?

Danielle

I find it interesting that Danielle has always been in a Dominant/submissive relationship, but had never given thought to it being D/s. I think there are many relationships and marriages where there is a definite roll reversal and the woman is head of household in many ways. Most of us have heard the terms hen pecked or pussy-whipped referring to men that let the wife rule his every action. But in most of those marriages, the couple never gives it a name or thinks of it as a lifestyle choice. They just accept that it's the way it is and how they are happy with one another. I find it refreshing to see more men, CD or not that wants to more then help out with thew housework, laundry and preparing meals whether or not recognizing it as a lifestyle choice. Like Danielle, I like to make my SO happy and do everything I can to make her life easier, more comfortable and to follow her lead on many day to day issues. She is the head of my household even though for now we are many miles apart to to circumstances out of our control. Hopefully this will change in a short time and I will be much happier being her submissive and doing all that Danielle does for his wife. And yes, endure the punishment if I displease her. That in it self is another way for me to show her how much I love her. I know it sounds weird to many, but since she is the only person that could ever paddle or cane me and not be dealt with harshly, it is another way of giving myself to her and her alone. I enjoy obeying her and sharing life with her in every other way. For me, it would be only a game if I did not love her so much. But beyond that, I truly respect, admire, adore her. And I appreciate all she is to me. She gets the best of my male persona and of course the best of my female persona when she wants either. Simply stated, she rules and I would have it no other way.

Thanks for sharing Danielle dear friend.

[KarenCDFL]

I personally don't believe so.

I do think that many cross dressers in relationships may confuse being submissive with being "in a woman's role"

A lot of us in in our 50's and 60's and have fond memories of Mrs Cleaver, (you know the Beaver's Late Great mom Barbary Billingsly) who was the epitome of being in the "woman's role". She raised her children, cooked and cleaned and was the perfect wife to her Television husband but she was very strong and definitely not submissive.

Some people especially the young women of today's society may call that kind of her role in that type of relationship submissive.

I remember as a young child wishing I could grow up and take care of my family like she did. (Yes even as a little boy I wanted to grow up to be a wife)

[Josie M]

I know, a bit late getting into this thread but I've been thinking about this lately. I can sort of understand how entering into a D/s relationship might help a crossdresser explore a little further than they would have gone on their own. In that way, the dominant is sort of a guide. I suppose that, if the relationship is mutually beneficial, then who am I to judge?

For myself, however, it was a very important step for me that I "own" this part of who I am. Josie is a part of how I express myself, and it has to be on my terms.

Then again, I really supressed her after I got married and started a family. It wasn't my wife pressuring me either, it was all me. I've come to regret that decision. You can't stop being yourself when you start a family.

[rocktheplank]

Yeah I would say so atleast in my case. When I am dressed and things are getting intimate, I don't want to take control, I want to be taken control of.

[maryellen]

I'm also of the view that crossdressing has no necessary connection to submission. That said, it is associated with shedding masculinity and we all know that guys are in control: in the workplace, in conversations, etc. It diminishes the crossdressing experience to continue to exhibit those traits rather than embrace our softer side.