Akward situation of acceptability and passability.

[Nicole Erin]

The two truely seem to be different things.

Yesterday I had a client, of course whe whole family was roaming around the shop, and a few times when they were talking about me, they said "she".
Client was like, "She is going to cut 2 inches off my hair, think it out, and we will see what it looks like then". So this happened several times.
Now either I pass or they could see I was presenting femme and being respectful (acceptance), either way I was 100% content. I was just some woman doing her hair.

Well this was good until I think after the 5th or 6th time of someone pestering me, seeming to make a point of using my male name (NOT femme at all) "Is everything going OK John?" "John, I am putting your progress report here at your station" For real, when you are staring someone dead in the eye and talking, do you really need to use their name? I mean it is clear you are addressing someone if you look in their eyes.

Well I am sure this family pretty much knew by the time I left, especially after my client reffered to me as "he" towards the end of her services.

Unrelated times have been when my now ex-friend makes it a point to overuse my male name, either talking to me or in front of clients. Or when an instructor is addressing everyone and says "ladies" and then looks at me and says "and gentlemen..."

At school, the instructors and other students, some of them know my femme name (Erin) and all of them can see I am presenting as a woman. MAde-up, clothing, etc...
Are people just stupid? I almost feel like each time I have a client, someone should come busting over to my station and say, "Oh by the way, this is John, don't mistake him for a woman, he may look like it but is not..."

I think in one of Calpernia Addams videos about Q's to not ask a TS, she correlated this to "people wanting to put us in our place".
Is that what it is?
My ex-Friend Mary at school HAS a TS MTF sibiling so she should know better than anyone..

So, how should I handle this situation? Am I wrong to assume that they would just naturally think to ask how I wish to be addressed? I mean gyod surely someone who presents as a woman is wanting to be called by male pronouns and his name... :brolleyes: I have not said anything yet.

One thing - those who have known me for years, I don't expect them to call me Erin, I mean they are exempt if they cannot adjust to Erin, I understand but these yahoos I go to school with, they have NOT earned any right to say they know me.

BTW my male name is not John, but mine IS jusdt as masculine.

How to handle this one?

[CallMeMeg]

Have you said point-blank "Please call me Erin, and I prefer to be referred to as 'she'."

I was going to add "It's less confusing." to the end of that, but then that starts a discussion. "I" statements are what you need. They can't be refuted.

A friend called to me across a shop by my boyname ~ I said "please don't do that" and she stopped. She did my makeup for me, but I think seeing the whole package sorta put her off and she did that because she felt comfortable. I think after that she didn't use either name.

But yes, your ex-friend is having a problem with how you present.

I think a lot of times when guys have a problem with us, it's homophobia. They are attracted to our female selves and feel icky about that.

[joandher]

I would just get myself a BIG name badge, and if they called me by my male name while fully dressed i would just ignore them

:hugs: J-JAY

[JenniferR771]

I just read a book and they author pointed out that scorn or condesension is the highest form of verbal aggression. Beware the body language--rolling of eyes.

[juno]

Be willing to explain TG etiquette. Most people don't realize that a crossdresser want's to be addressed by the presenting gender even when their genetic gender is known. If you make your preference known, and they still call you John, just respond as if they called you by some wierd unknown name. "Who?? My name is Erin. Are you feeling OK?"

Juno

[JulieC]

How to handle this one?

Probably not fixed over night.

I think I'd made it clear to any new acquaintances that you go by Erin. They can assume it's "Aaron" if they want. It sounds the same. Whether you're in femme or homme mode, it doesn't matter then. Lots of people have nicknames that have nothing to do with their given names.

[AlyssaT]

I have long been mystified that someone could look at a stranger dressed as a woman and address him as "sir" (happened to me at Sears with a store clerk) or use masculine pronouns. My first inclination is to think that people are either stupid or mean.

But (and this doesn't apply to people who know each other, because there are relationship issues there), with strangers, I think it's more true that many people have just never considered the idea of separating gender from sex. They address people based on their biological identity, not on what they're wearing. Changing clothes does not make a he into a she, or a sir into a ma'am. They're still what they are.

So we have to forgive them and patiently educate them. If we don't want our feelings hurt, it is our responsibility to show them that politeness requires a different way of classifying and addressing people. When enough people realize this, it will become a part of the culture, and we'll have a harder time figuring out whether we're actually passing or not.

[Rachel Morley]

IMHO people who are complete strangers and don't know us but "read" us and are unaware of the etiquette when addressing transgender people (i.e. address them as the gender it's obvious they are trying to present as) ... they are perhaps excused ...

.... but people who do know us and do (what seems to be in your case) downright rude and insensitive things like blatantly and provocatively using male names and pronouns toward MTF trans people in front of their clients at your work place is almost tantamount to a "hostile work environment" and I wouldn't be surprised if you had a case for sexual discrimination ... that's to say it might be, going on what I've learned at my workplace training on this subject, here in California. :2c: Legally, it's not the intention it's the impact that matters.

[Faith_G]

I think you need to make your expectations clear to your instructors and fellow students.

[Andy66]

many people have just never considered the idea of separating gender from sex. They address people based on their biological identity, not on what they're wearing. Changing clothes does not make a he into a she, or a sir into a ma'am. They're still what they are.
I think Alyssa mkes a good point. Some people are jerks, but some are just confused. Maybe they've met guys who dress feminine but still want to be called "him." Now they meet a TG person and don't know what to think.

[Chickhe]

I believe people just don't know what's getting under your skin, so you have to ask for their help at least once... after that you can assume they are being aggressive towards you.