Question: Partial Presentation

[ReineD]

I was going to post this in a current thread, but then decided to post it separately since I'd love to hear from everyone (and I didn't want to hijack the thread) :)

To those of you who wish to present in public partially femme (not under-dress, since under-dressing doesn't show), why do you wish to do this? This is not a judgment or criticism, just trying to understand.

As a GG who fundamentally has no clue, I've assumed up until now that the point of dressing was to *present/pass/blend in/be treated as a woman* or however you want to define it, and not be taken as a guy wearing a dress or other articles of women's clothing.

I know there are different types of CDs and there are members here who proudly wear skirts in guy mode with no makeup or forms and with guy style haircuts, but the skirts I've seen them wear were decidedly androgynous looking especially when combined with male tops and unisex footwear. The skirts weren't particularly feminine in their design, fabric, and color, and the presentation was without a doubt as a male who prefers alternative clothing. Not as a guy in a dress. I know the difference is subtle, but I hope you understand what I'm trying to describe.

So, to those of you who don't fit the "presenting as a guy wearing alternate clothing" style: when you wish to wear outer-clothing that is clearly women's yet not go all the way, do you wish to present as woman, or as a man, or a mixture of both? Or does it matter how others perceive you?

Or, do you wish to push your male presentation to the limit without hopefully giving yourselves away? How do you see yourselves?

I've seen a few threads discussing this recently and I'd love to understand a bit more.

Thanks! :)

[Karren H]

I have gone out totally enfemme with minimal makeup and no hair and subdued jewelry.. And yes fem dress slacks... Pale green top, womens flat shoes... Nylons.. Womans leather jacket and I went shopping and to a casino and out to eat and I enjoyed it.. No one seemed to care that I was an enfemmenate male and was treated well.. I would have rather gone out enfemme but this was the next best thing..

And I certainly didn't care how they perceived me... I just wanted ti dress up some and go out. Given the chance I'd probably dress more like that on a daily basis but the wife would not be very happy...

[StacyCD]

I guess that I don't wear women's clothing, I wear my clothing. However, the real issue is that every crossdresser is different. I think each person who is asked this question may have a different answer. I rarely go out unless I'm fully dressed but I often am partially dressed around the house all the time.

[DeeDee1974]

Sometimes i want to dress, but not go through the hassle of putting on make up. Now I already have long hair so I don't have to worry about a wig. I'm really passable with make up, but only about 50% without. I thank my mom for passing on her features to me (5'5 130). Because if I was 6'4 like my dad I might not be as bold.

[Anne Elizabeth]

I have not yet gone out in dresses but have worn jeans and top. However to answer the question I want to go out dressed as a female because that is the way I feel. I believe deep down that I should have been a female rather than a male. To me it would just feel right.

[NV Susan]

Hi Reine, When I lived in Nevada I often went to casinos all over the state partially en femme. I would wear lady's dress slacks, a not to femme top and female flat shoes and hose. On some of the tops you could see my bra straps if you looked close. I even carried a clutch purse if the slacks lacked pockets. I also wore low heals when feeling very playful. :devil:
Now, to answer your question....I just wanted to be out as a female but without having to worry about passing. I also liked the thrill of being among people and enjoying my female side without any stares or questions. I'm sure some people "made" me but never said anything to me.
I did meet a GG once, had a few drinks and talked for awhile. I finally asked her if she noticed and she swore she didn't { I wasn't carrying a purse that night} even though I know you could see my bra through my top if you looked close. We continued talking for a while and the conversation even drifted to fashion and other girly topics. :daydreaming:
I also enjoy driving dressed this way but with a skirt or dress, but usually only get out for to fuel, or got thru a drive thru. :brolleyes:

[Debra Russell]

The only way I will go out en femm is all the way -- Do not want to look like a what is it ? or just what? if I am going to dress I am going to shoot for blending, as if I feel female and look like one I want to present as one.

[Kathi Lake]

Hi Reine,

Like Karren said, "it was the next best thing." Last week, since I couldn't go "all the way" due to my girl stuff being in storage, I "went commando" instead. I wore ladies jeans and a top, had a complete makeover at Ulta and then did some shopping. Yes, I wanted to present fully, but was willing to "settle" for something a bit less. Part of it was due to not being able to get out there for months and months. Part of it was to see how I felt. A small part was to kind of see just how high my confidence in myself really was.

So, although I much prefer blending into my surroundings by dressing all the way, I guess I can go out dressed in much less, so to speak.

Kathi

p.s. I saw your entries for the contest. Cute! I sure hope you win. :)

[kimdl93]

I guess I'm femininizing my "male" presentation to the point that my courage will allow - at this point, that's fairly androgynous tops, sandals that really can't be easily mistaken for male footware, and a hint of make up. I don't know if its really understandable...I guess I'd like to be able to blend in as much as possible and still get to wear feminine things.

[Tima]

To those of you who wish to present in public partially femme (not under-dress, since under-dressing doesn't show), why do you wish to do this?

I want to present as a 100% female in public 24/7, but, for me at least, it’s a question of safety and survival. Where I live it’s fairly overcrowded, so there’s a lot of hustle and bustle at all times. If I walk over to the post office all dolled up (as I’d like to), I can expect to have a fair amount of abuse hurled in my direction. I’d rather avoid this situation. I know the world I’m living in. Men will call me all sorts of derogatory names, women will look at me askance, and children will laugh at me. It’s hard to crossdress in this environment, so I’m forced to reduce my presentation. I’m not a confrontational person. I’d rather not be noticed, but I will be.


So, to those of you who don't fit the "presenting as a guy wearing alternate clothing" style: when you wish to wear outer-clothing that is clearly women's yet not go all the way, do you wish to present as woman, or as a man, or a mixture of both? Or does it matter how others perceive you?

I want to express my transgendered nature and present, at least partially, as a female. I very rarely present as 100% male. For me, that is crossdressing, and it makes me uncomfortable. I feel like I’m letting down the home side, or worse, not being true to myself. It does matter how others perceive me, and I want to be seen as somehow different, but at the same time I’m not going to dangle myself in front of those who may do me harm like some kind of bait. If I present as a female, I will attract homophobic reactions, which will lead to all kinds of situations I would just as soon avoid. I can attract or repel, but I would prefer to blend in as much as possible.


Or, do you wish to push your male presentation to the limit without hopefully giving yourselves away? How do you see yourselves?

I would rarely, if ever, do that, for reasons I have already mentioned. Giving myself away is a positive thing, but I spoon it out in small doses if receptiveness is in the air. A totally male presentation would make me ill. How could I dress as the very thing I’m turning away from? For this reason I seek to incorporate some percentage of female into everything I do, even if it’s only underdressing, some jewelry, some makeup, or a male shirt with female jeans. It all depends on the situation at hand. I would like to make it from point A to point B unscathed, please!

How do I see myself? That could be a thread all by itself!

[sissystephanie]

My dear late wife always did my makeup and fixed my wig when I was going out in public as Stephanie. When she passed away 5 years ago, I knew things would have to change since I am absolutely terrible with make up, not to mention fixing my wig.

So I now go totally enfemme from the neck down. Shoes, panties, bra, a definite feminine top, and of course a feminine skirt! BTW, with natural 40 B's the mtops look real natural!! All my feminine clothes are definitely feminine, as are the majority of my shoes. I dress feminine because I like to, and to me that means presenting a feminine appearance even if it is only from the neck down. And I do go almost everywhere dressed like that!! I went grocery shopping earlier today wearing green lace panties, pink bra, a flowing green skirt, and a very low cut v-neck tee that showed both my bra and my cleavage!! Spent close to an hour shopping at two different places and the only comment I heard was from the first SA! She said she really liked my Tee shirt! And since I had no wig or makeup I was definitely male!! People just don't care!!

[Charleen]

I'm TG and only wear "men's" clothing when I have to be him. Just more comfortable physically and mentally.

[Jennifer N.]

Reine,
There are many times that I will go out shopping for shoes are other women clothes with women jeans or my male jean (or dress pants) with panties, pantyhose, and women shoes (flats mostly, sometime low heels). It is a matter of not being able to fully dress when ever I like. I have gone out fully dress with makeup, wig,....; I even went into a Merel Norman and had a makeover with male shirt, jeans, hose and 3in. maryjane heels and walked through the mall fully dressed with women dress pants, hose, kitten heels, and women sweater.

For me I feel less threaten when I am partially dressed, for if I am found out, I don't have that threat of being deceptive (I know that I should not, but it is the feeling I get), because it is hard for me to pass with confidence. When partially dreesed I feel that I can pass it off as being just me (I know can be me any way I choose). I know it sounds strange, but I have less fear when I am partially dreessed as to when I am fully made up (which I love, just hard to find the opportunities).

[Loni]

if you mean why would i want to have a pair of ladies jeans on ver men's jeans? they fit better.
men's are made baggy it feels like i am walking around with a load in them.
i do not try to look like a lady, just my male self out and about. no wig, no forms, no make up, (well sometimes a tiny bit), nothing filly. just basic clothing.
but when i dress up i try to not wear jeans. will tonight for school, but it ill not look even close to male. (clothing that is).
now if i could get my face to be a bit thinner, and drop 40 pounds, (what my Dr wants me to do) this would help a lot. in bicycle jargon i am a honorary Clydesdale. (aka over 200 pounds).
but if i could i would go almost every place (but work) all dressed up.
to say we are in drab when in mens things is because they are drab.
womens clothing is just so much better, many more styles, colors, and fabrics. just look at emelda marcos how many shoes did she have? and still she did not have all the styles.
but even my mom is sick of me as i have more pretty things then her right now.

[Christie ann]

There are many reasons why I can't present as a woman so as Karren and Kathi said, this is the next best thing.

And, really, I just love the clothes.

[Jonianne]

Reine, I just want my outside presentation to be the degree of feminine that I feel on the inside. I don't really want to spend a lot of time and effort, working at trying to fool people into thinking I am a female. Sure, sometimes I like to dress fully (except, myself, I don't like to wear fake breasts), but what I really want to present most of the time, is me, Johnny, a somewhat feminine male, that likes to wear what I am comfortable wearing. That is being real. That is being genuine.

I am saddened that in one other thread, a cd'er feels the necessity to critisize partial dressing as not being respectful to the cd community. Even here on this forum, there is peer pressure to conform to unnecessary standards.

Reine, fully crossdressing is neat and fun for a while, but for me, it gets old quickly and I just want to resort to wearing the feminine (and male) things I am most comfortable in 24/7.

[jayme357]

What a great question. Although I love getting all gussied up and playing the role of an honest to goodness woman, the reality is that the opportunity to do that is quite limited. The main reason is that my SO fell in love with a guy and even though she goes out of her way to support me I know in my heart that she would prefer the guy not the boobs. So, I too often cheat and just partially dress. If I can wear some sandals, perhaps a bra, some earrings and a little mascara, I can make believe that I'm really a girl. I have convinced myself that this is less of an "in your face" and therefore I have taken her feelings into consideration. I know I'm kidding myself but it seems to work.

[Jorja]

I find this thread quite interesting. I have often wondered about this but have not known anyone that only partially presented to ask them about it. Not to be a critic or anything, to each thier own. Myself it was all or nothing. I just felt....... ridiculous only half dressed. I also felt it would draw more attention to myself than was necessary.

[Rhonda Jean]

This is tough to answer. I don't look remarkably different in drab, and to me the line between drab and fem is kind of squiggly. The quick and easy answer is that I sometimes enjoy the reaction I get from... let's call it a decidedly androgenous presentation. Some of it I can't get away from. Long highlighted hair, particularly when I've straightened it, kind of puts me there already, especially considering my skinny body. For the sake of discussion though, take my most male presentation at work. Jeans or slacks, dress shirt, dress shoes (all men's), hair in a ponytail. I can fem this up quite a bit and still look male. Some things, for reasons I don't understand, just look stupid when I'm presenting this way. I've actually experimented with this in the mirror. For instance...

Not that I'd wear obvious makeup to work, but I think a little makeup looks great! In fact, if I stick to earth tones I can get away with quite a bit and I think it is a great male look for me. Any eyeshadow color other than brown, even those that I love in fem, look terrible. Same goes for earrings. I think hoops of about 1" look great as guy wear, but my favorite silver dollar size discs and my huge hoops that I love in fem mode look ridiculous in male. When it comes to shoes, I just bought a pair of boots with a 3-1/2" heel that I think look awsome in guy mode. Wore them to Home Depot and Wal-Mart last night. Same goes with polished toes. I wear flip flops all summer as a guy with my polished toes shining and love it. It's just a little something that I like.

It's difficult to articulate. Roughly, I'd say I do it for the shock value. Although there have been times that that's exactly why I did it, that's not quite it. Sometimes it's because I just love being "pretty", and I guess a little edgy. It's a look that's just right there between looking like a male and looking like a female, which is probably the most accurate representation of me.

[ReineD]

I am saddened that in one other thread, a cd'er feels the necessity to critisize partial dressing as not being respectful to the cd community. Even here on this forum, there is peer pressure to conform

Well, I sincerely hope that no one will come into this thread and criticize others for how they feel. :sad:

I'd like to keep this free of debate. It's the only way to listen. To really listen. :)

Thank you all so very much for your candid responses. I see now that there are more than a few basic motives for the choices in dressing. I'm afraid I've been guilty of over generalizing in the past (in my mind sometimes, if not openly in threads). I suppose this is normal since my knowledge is based on the personal experiences I share with my SO and the other CDs that I do know, and also the bulk of threads here!

You all are sweethearts, and please keep your responses coming! (If anyone wants to debate the notion of partial dressing, please start your own thread). :hugs:

[Barbara Dugan]

If I ever decide to go out ...I think it will apply the same principle I apply now..has to be completely dressed and present myself as feminine as is possible to me.

[MichelleL]

Reine, I don't think I have much to add to what has already been stated here. I dress as much as I can based on who I'm with and where I am. If I feel I can get away with dressing more, I will.

It has really been interesting reading everyone else's thoughts on this as well. Thanks, Reine.

[docrobbysherry]

Well, I sincerely hope that no one will come into this thread and criticize others for how they feel. :sad:

I'd like to keep this free of debate. It's the only way to listen. To really listen. :)

Thank you all so very much for your candid responses. I see now that there are more than a few basic motives for the choices in dressing. I'm afraid I've been guilty of over generalizing in the past (in my mind sometimes, if not openly in threads). I suppose this is normal since my knowledge is based on the personal experiences I share with my SO and the other CDs that I do know, and also the bulk of threads here!

You all are sweethearts, and please keep your responses coming! (If anyone wants to debate the notion of partial dressing, please start your own thread). :hugs:

Some dress partially for conveniece, or to accomodate their SO!:)
Unfortunately, many posts make me SAD!:sad: They dressing the way they do because of their FEARS! NOT unreasonable ones, in my mind, either!:brolleyes:

[Rachel Morley]

Hi Renie,

If you don't mind, I would like to recite to you an incident that happened to me that I think might explain how I feel.

My wife Marla and I were on vacation in Las Vegas. We were walking down the strip in the Saturday afternoon sunshine, and as we approached a woman handing out fliers, she held out her flier to me, made eye contact with me, and said "How about a show Ladies... umm ... Sir.... I mean, Ma'am." I was beaming with happiness when this happened. So why was I so happy, you may well ask? You see, I don't really think of myself as a "man", but I don't (not truthfully) think of myself as a woman either. I think of myself as ... well, as just "me." I mean obviously, I am a genetically male person, but I'm talking about my gender here.

In my mind I identify as a feminine male, a girly boy, an androgynous person, a "something in between." However, unfortunately I don't always look "that" androgynous. When I'm at work I look like a non-manly (slightly girly) type of guy and I wear women's clothes that aren't too obvious that they are women's. Obviously, when I'm en femme I think I look like a woman because I'm in in full make up, wig, forms, padding, a skirt and heels, my non-manly body language is more pronounced etc. But, the "zone" I really identify with the most is somewhere in the middle. A blending if you like. So you see, for a person to actually be confused about my gender when they looked at me made me feel fabulous. :)

You might be now wondering how I looked and what I was wearing? First off, I want to tell you I'm not a very big person to start with. I'm only 5'4" tall and I weigh 130 lbs. I have small hands and I take a women's size 8 shoe. I also have thinly plucked eyebrows and long fingernails with subtle nail polish. I was wearing a baseball cap, and I had my gold stud earrings in. However I wasn't wearing any make up, except eyeliner, mascara, and lip gloss, that day. I was also wearing pink and white tennis shoes, tight fitting low rise boot cut jeans with pink stitching, a women's fitted pale blue t-shirt and a women's black ribbed rayon/nylon mix cardigan. Add all this together and I guess I didn't look much like a man, but I didn't think I looked enough like a woman to be mistaken (or confused) for one either, because I wasn't dressed fully en femme. When I go out en femme with Marla we get called ladies all the time (it happened all the time over the Las Vegas weekend too) and I love this. I'd prefer not to, but don't mind being called Sir when I'm wearing my unisex work clothes, but the idea of a person not knowing how to address me when I'm neither at work nor en femme is totally in harmony with where I'm I feel I am on the TG spectrum.

Girly boy or feminine male is what I think of myself as most of the time .... except when I'm fully en femme. Then I am so "in the zone" that I let my mind go and think and tell myself I am a girl :)

Hope this helps - hugs - Rachel

[Amanda22]

I guess that I don't wear women's clothing, I wear my clothing.

Wow, I love that! I'm going to try to remember that, because it is true for me and others, I'm sure.

[Amanda22]

Thanks for your very lucid explanation, Rachel.

[Lucy_Bella]

Renie,
I hope I am on the right page ( I have never been in public dressed ),
I think what is driving the urge for me here latley is the enfamous "Pink Fog" !! But I am not sure if that's it completley because I have been stuck in it for so long I can't even tell you what the difference is anymore.

I get dressed up, even apply make up ( something I just recently started to do ) and sit around secluded in my bedroom attached to my closet! The Mirror, being the trickster it is , ( and I look in it a lot being alone and bored) reveals an Image I have never seen before, a sometimes pretty female image appears..

I know that I have branched my hobby to get out, a need to be seen has emerged from that lil pain in the ass voice that causes all this in the back of my mind!! I look in the mirror , I tell myself " I can sorta pass if it's dark enough outside and didn't see anyone".. But common sense tells me that it's all a dumb Ideal..

I go through "Ego battles " with myself to step out that door and I just end up staying in my room kicking myself in the butt for not going out.. I have even went as far joining the "Meet Up Group " and chickened out of the first meet up..My biggest fear and prolly why I did chicken out is because I know I will like it and want to do it more often ..That means my desire will grow even more and that's not my goal..Think about that not wanting it to grow and meet new friends that dress and promote me going more public..

I don't know , It scares me to be honest and will change my whole life as I know it..










'

[Christy_M]

I think Doc pointed out the fears...I can't imagine presenting in a manner that would:

out me
put my family into the spotlight
draw unnecessary attention to me
jeopardize my safety
stimulate criticism

Now at 6 feet, 200 lbs, and four inch heels, I do all of these things. My biggest fear is that people (all of them or any one of them) will say "Hey, look, there's a guy in a dress." and while I am looking around trying to find him, all eyes are on me. Why is it that one of my biggest fears doesn't keep me from being seen? Apparently I haven't paid for that therapy session yet...

[Butterfly Bill]

For example, this last week in Oklahoma it has still been getting up into the 90s (mid-30s C), and I feel just fine in a loose fitting patio dress with the breezes blowing up and down my bod. In a few weeks it will be getting cool enough for polyester and pantyhose sliding over me making every movement a caress. I prefer the feel of "women's" fabrics, I definitely like the greater variety of colors, and I like the free and easy feeling I feel when I'm in them.

When the whole idea is comfort, I don't want to scrape my face with a razor and then put a bunch of sticky pasty makeup all over it, and a hot and prickly wig on my head. I can see why a lot of women don't like bras and high heels.

I'm for men's liberation, and don't feel succeeding in deceiving others into thinking I'm a woman is finding it. The people who support me and give me compliments usually do it because they like the unabashed honesty. I don't think that conforming to the other side of rigid gender roles is tearing them down, as I want.

[Gisele]

I rather go full out when out in public. Sometimes I when running around our very small town, I will just wear my "girl" jeans, sneakers & socks. Most of the time with that I will will wear one of my "guy" t-shirts also. When daring I will apply very light make-up which is most of the time. No bra nor breats forms either. I keep my hair pulled in a high pony tail out of the back of my ball cap like alot of girls do.

I wear my hair like that when in guy mode at work and not a single word has been said. So, I guess it's not really a bad look on a guy. Who knows.

As soon as I am home I am full girl sans make up unless I am off that day.

[Inna]

For most Transgender identity of female is deeply rooted in their psyche, when deprived of possibility of affirmation through visual stimuli, complex arises. Crossdressing involving image affirmation and feeling of assertion is the only way person can feel whole and reassured of place in realm of this world. Some crossdress for fetishistic reasons, those involve sexually charged feeling and do it for the purpose of arousal. For most TG though wearing feminine clothing fulfills the other part of self identity through outside stimuli, and is not purely sexual act but rather physical representation of their inner femininity.

[Stevie71]

Same here. I'm mostly just a bottom dresser for now. Wear wonderfully comfortable Woman's slacks or knit pants 99 percent of the time, An also enjoys my favorite silky underthings. I'm comfortably in touch with my fem side.

[RobinScott]

While I do enjoy "going all out" when going to the clubs or special occasions, I know I will never be seen as a beautiful woman. For me it is about being the every day woman. Women have more freedom to were whatever they choose and I have been read as female more often when I am not trying to impress.

Love,
Robin