When men seek to date a TS woman, what are they truely seeking? [Archive] - Crossdressers.com - #1 Community & Forum for Crossdressers, Family and Friends

Nicole Erin

10-04-2010, 02:38 PM

I have put up an ad about 3 weeks ago saying I was looking to date. (friend and lover).
I did not post photo, I said in responding, their photo gets mine.
Now I have no photos here right now but those who have seen me know I am semi-passable, semi-pretty.
I am not some she-male looking porn star, or some young pretty stealth TS.
Just the way it is.

About 1/2 the responses that I sent a photo to, I heard back from. Other 1/2, nope.

So when guys go digging thru ads looking to date a TG, what are they really expecting? I am not the cream of the crop, maybe "Average Jane". But guys who look thru them, do they not realise that if they want some "holy grail" of TS, they better be the cream of the crop themselves and/or have some serious bank-roll? I do not know of any really pretty TS who have some broke-ass ugly boyfriend.
Holy Grail TS are far and few between. Average Jane TS like me are abundant.

True that most anyone wants either Prince Charming or Princess Lust (depending on preference) but so many people are just unrealistic.

On a related note - I love the ads that some overweight single moms with 3 kids post thinking a rich handsome man is what THEY are gonna get. Dream on, lady! :brolleyes:

So do a lot of guys really have this ideal image of Princess Lust by their side?

Traci Elizabeth

10-04-2010, 02:56 PM

On a related note - I love the ads that some overweight single moms with 3 kids post thinking a rich handsome man is what THEY are gonna get. Dream on, lady! :brolleyes:

Those single mom's with three kids have just as much right to find Mr. Perfect as you do. If your comment about them is indictitive of your feelings in general then you are going to have a long wait trying to find Mr. Right yourself.

You apparently need a lesson in compassion.

GaleWarning

10-04-2010, 03:00 PM

When I was involved in the internet dating scene, like you, I only reacted to those who approached me first.
The protocol was that one had to spend some time "cyber dating" via email before one or the other suggested meeting in person.
I can't really remember how many of the "cyber dates" did NOT progress to a meeting, but not all of them did.
Lastly, when it was decided that a meeting was appropriate, I always allowed the other person to choose the (public) venue, be it a bar, a cafe, the beach ...

My photo was part of my profile. One of the things which always amused me when meeting someone new, was the comment, "You look just like your photo!"
Perhaps too many of them simply supposed that the photo was meant to be flattering?

Now a confession ... I was truly surprised by the number of people who had NOT taken the trouble to read my profile or try to make sense of my emails and had simply sought top connect because of my picture. As for me, I was more interested in their personality than their looks, although it was pointed out to me that most of them were blonde!

Also, I quickly learned that the chances of hitting it off with someone were slim ... only in the case of #4 was there a mutual attraction, and that "affair" only lasted 2 months.

Zenith

10-04-2010, 03:03 PM

Seriously it's tough for GGs, tough for everyone, and especially tough with online hookups. I don't think it's a TS thing. Cyber dating can work, but your best bet is IRL. IMHO...

CharleneT

10-04-2010, 03:50 PM

Online dating can work, but there are sooo many variables. Each site has it probs and advantages. As Julie said, it is tough out there . . . Now in terms of those who seek MTF's in particular, there are unfortunately a majority of creeps in that group. Not all but most.

Personally, I'd suggest more old fashioned methods ! You know, the grocery store etc... Join local groups, clubs and organizations. There are plenty of men out there who are not scared off by TG status.

** I agree with Traci about your comment about Mom's with 3 kids etc... maybe you were just reacting to a few odd photos or the like, but do remember everyone deserves love and you never know who will be attracted to who.

Melody Moore

10-04-2010, 07:04 PM

When men seek to date a TS woman, what are they truely seeking?

I really wouldn't care too much about how old they were or what they look like but I know that Im not attracted to anyone who is
overweight - that is my only real rule about the physical aspects of who I would date apart insisting that the person really respects me.

The thing that really annoys me about the guys who contact me on a social networking site that I am a member of is that they want a 'tranny' because they are bicurious and want someone who looks & passes well as a female but they really want the boy bits because their egos dont allow them to be completely comfortable with their true homosexual desires. So I feel they are not looking at me as a TRANSSEXUAL FEMALE but rather a MALE TRANSVESTITE. Most of them also dont want me to go ahead with SRS but they want me to stay on hormones.

Personally I am very uncomfortable & offended by this because I see myself as a female not as a male. For me to even contemplate having a relationship with anyone male or female is that I have to be totally convinced they see & accept me as a female. So far I haven't found one single guy who genuinely sees me this way. But luckily my girlfriend who I broke up with 5 months ago & I have got back together but she doesnt see me as a male anymore and she actually insists now that I remain as a female. She cant even handle seeing me anymore without my wig and insists that I never remove it in front of her which I am totally at ease with.

So I think it is how you are perceived by the guys who want to date you that is the real issue you should be more concerned
with because when it comes time for your SRS are they going to drop you & then go off in search of another 'tranny'?

This is my 2 cents about what are they truly seeking.

Hope

10-05-2010, 02:53 AM

I think this should answer your question:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPzEhWN6bP0

Melody Moore

10-05-2010, 03:48 AM

i think this should answer your question:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipzehwn6bp0

rotfpmsl :lol:

EDIT: I also have to agree with 7sisters getting involved with your local GLBTi community is a great idea, you meet so many great people when you can feel really safe and the social events are a great way to meet a wide variety of open minded & non-judgemental people that are not only gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgender but also other straight people who also like to get involved with the GLBTi community. GLBTi parties are a blast!

I also found that my introducing my girlfriend who was straight before to the GLBTi community, she was able to get to know & talk to other GLBT people & she became very accepting of my transitioning and the most amazing thing was it also helped her to get over her own homophobia about getting back together & being in a lesbian relationship with me. Now she is started to explore her sexual boundaries and is becoming very accepting about being in a same sex relationship with me. My girl doesn't know it yet but I have a surprise for her later this week, I am taking her up to Turtle Cove next Friday night for a Girls Only night out (http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=143879508987904) at the beautiful seaside resort & I am 100% sure we will have lots of fun & grow even closer together from attending this special event. :)

7sisters

10-05-2010, 04:09 AM

Umm.. this is not for me to answer, but just my 2 cents worth... I think the best bet is to increase your social circle. Join your local LGBT, take part in community activities, charity events that you could enjoy. The good outcomes are many: you will enjoy yourself, meet likeminded people, keep yourself busy, give back to your community, network for your career, and you'll meet many men who are interesting. The more people you know the better your chances of finding a relationship.

Traci Elizabeth

10-05-2010, 07:48 AM

I think this should answer your question:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPzEhWN6bP0

Well what would concern me MORE is how did Hope find this YouTube video? Maybe we have just discovered something about Hope we never knew before! :lol2:

Melissa A.

10-05-2010, 11:12 AM

Ah, Us and men, Men and us. A subject I have become more familiar with than I care to think about. It's hard for everyone, of course. The cyber dating industry is proof. And I really do hate to think of myself as extra-specially challenged because of who I am, but the facts speak the truth. I run into men who are interested in me all the time. Men who ask for my number and never call. Men who write to me and never follow up. Men who call me, and call me back....6 months later. Likewise, men who contact me online....then again, 6 months later. And get miffed that I am not completely overjoyed to hear from them. Men who ask me on the street, "where's the party?". Men who proudly show me their body parts on the subway at 2am. Men who actually do show up for coffee for our first and last meeting ever. One who actually invited me to meet him an hour away by train on a freezing cold day, then whined, "I'm just a little nervous" when I called him 2 blocks from his place. It's coffee. 1/2 hour. It's 5 degrees outside. the subway was re-routed twice. Now you should be nervous, if I ever find you.

Men who profess an interst in transsexuals seem to come in a few different catagories, a miniscule percentage of them for the reasons I find attractive and acceptable. But actually, I don't even try any more to figure out what motivates them. I don't care anymore. Thinking about it makes my head hurt too much. I'll be pre-op for a while longer, and darnit, I'm really tired of being lonely, all the time. I don't have alot of rules outside of meeting for the first time(coffee, short meeting, just to get a sense of whether or not you are minimally sane and safe). I'm not a ****, or on the other hand, a prude. I'm a grown woman. I'm not made of glass, or easily insulted. I'm intelligent, personable, and emotionally stable. I'm also, on top of being pretty cute on one level, also obviously a transsexual to anyone with minimal powers of observation. I could blame it on that, and the expectations lotsa men have when they think TS(or she-male, or whatever preconcieved notion they often have in their sometimes tiny brains). I could figure that there must be something wrong with me, which would make me no different than any other lonely woman with a pulse.

I have met a couple of nice guys who are not afraid to follow up, or assume I am completely desperate and incredibley grateful that they are lavishing a little of their time on me. Guys who don't use me as their online/telephone fantasy, or become scared adolescents when it becomes time to actually meet, as adults. Or aren't married, and looking for a temporary escape from their life. A couple. Seriously. Two. Those didnt go any further for average, normal, adult "it just didn't work out" reasons. Ok. I would welcome, at this point, the chance to see that happen a little more than once a millenium. I hope I don't sound bitter. Gosh, it's way too early for that, despite my rather advanced age. Hey.... maybe that's it. I dunno, sometimes I really, really wish I were a lesbian, like most of my ts friends. But i am afflicted with the burden of heterosexuality. But I suppose the grass is always greener, and everybody has problems, no matter their orientation. For now, I will have to say that it IS different for TS women. That there are hurdles that go with it, trying not to sound too pitiful or sorry for me. You have to keep trying....or not. Be socially active in whatever you do, and maybe, just maybe.....

By the way, If you are really, really, really bored, this is my profile on a TS dating site, and it's rather aged. I never go there anymore, unless I get a notification.

http://www.tsdating.com/?s=u&u=melissa_a.

I actually ran into a guy a couple weeks ago while getting pizza who chatted me up, and I gave him my number. He struck me as a fetishist at first, but he was polite, and I thought, "what the hey". We've talked on the phone a couple of times, and while I am still not completely sure he isn't, he is at least intelligent, well read, seems to shower, and shares a few interests with me. So we'll see.

Hugs,

Melissa:)

Melissa A.

10-05-2010, 11:19 AM

I'm sorry. The link doesn't work, for whatever reason. You'll have to take my word that it's an incredibley cool and irresistable profile :)

Hugs,

Melissa:)

Melody Moore

10-05-2010, 03:24 PM

I'm sorry. The link doesn't work, for whatever reason.
There is also a function there on the main page to search for your Username (melissa_a), but you need an account there & to be logged in.

Well what would concern me MORE is how did Hope find this YouTube video? Maybe we have just discovered something about Hope we never knew before!
I know.... its a worry isnt it? :lol2:

Hope

10-05-2010, 04:40 PM

Well what would concern me MORE is how did Hope find this YouTube video? Maybe we have just discovered something about Hope we never knew before! :lol2:

Ahem... I found it the same way you did...

Stephenie S

10-05-2010, 06:07 PM

Men who look for TGs to date want only a homosexual relationship with out the guilt. That's it plain and simple.

Stephie

Nicole Erin

10-05-2010, 06:42 PM

That loser guy with the dating video - here is the sad thing, THAT is exactly the type of guy that some of the true hot women go for. You know the type - Bleach blonde highlight women that live at the mall, could have any guy they want and here they are with Mr Gross-ass at their side.

10-06-2010, 01:07 PM

AnonyMouse

10-06-2010, 03:45 PM

Men who look for TGs to date want only a homosexual relationship with out the guilt. That's it plain and simple.

Stephie

Without being a man, I'm not sure that you're really in a position to make that kind of judgment. You really don't know what's going on inside their heads. No doubt there are men who have that motivation, but it can't reasonably said that every single one of them has the exact same reason for wanting a relationship with a trans woman.

Not that I am in any way invalidating what you've dealt with with men - my issue is with your generalization, not your experience.

@Milo - yep. Super-modified string beans designed to look like Barbie dolls.

Melody Moore

10-06-2010, 04:52 PM

Without being a man, I'm not sure that you're really in a position to make that kind of judgment. You really don't know what's going on inside their heads. No doubt there are men who have that motivation, but it can't reasonably said that every single one of them has the exact same reason for wanting a relationship with a trans woman.

Not that I am in any way invalidating what you've dealt with with men - my issue is with your generalization, not your experience.

@Milo - yep. Super-modified string beans designed to look like Barbie dolls.

Well my experience with all the men who have wanted to date me so far is exactly how Stephanie
described it.... "Men who look for TGs to date want only a homosexual relationship with out the guilt."

I am a member of person.com where I inform anyone who contacts me through my profile that I am a pre-op transsexual female & I have been hit
up by hundreds of men who say they are 'Straight' on their profiles, but when I chat with them I find out they are hiding their homosexuality or
bi-curiosity and their homosexual desires always seem to indicate that this is exactly what theyre looking for from dating a transsexual like me.

A fair majority of these guys have also told me they dont want me to have SRS. So obviously they don't see &
accept me 100% as being a female so for this reason I wont even go there because I fully intend on having SRS.

Hope

10-06-2010, 05:00 PM

Men who look for TGs to date want only a homosexual relationship with out the guilt. That's it plain and simple.

I am SURE that somewhere in the entire world that there is a exception to that rule... but... I think that for the vast majority of "tranny chasers" that this is a pretty safe statement.

I think that those who didn't grow up as boys can't ever really have any idea how strong a motivator homophobia really is for men...

10-06-2010, 06:43 PM

I think that those who didn't grow up as boys can't ever really have any idea how strong a motivator homophobia really is for men...

Wow...you don't want to know what's in store for somebody such as yourself if you follow your own logic. I applaud you for your constant hypocrisy and passive-aggressive demeanor about oh-so-certain groups on this site. You certainly are dedicated.

Melody Moore

10-06-2010, 07:00 PM

Ze, I dont know why you take offence to Hope's statement, because I really don't see any issue with it because so far from my experience its very true.

Out of all the hundreds of guys that have contacted me on person.com that say they're straight, I would fairly estimate that about 80% of them are closet bisexuals, homosexuals or at the very least bi-curious. Society or I should say the churches that have had such a strong influence on the way the majority of society thinks is right & wrong is much to blame for this - Men have a huge problem with their egos in admitting to their hidden homosexuality whereas women don't. I for one am one very proud woman am am so very glad that I tethered my testosterone and finally defeated my male ego.

10-06-2010, 07:11 PM

Ze, I dont know why you take offence to Hope's statement, because I really don't see any issue with it because so far from my experience its very true.

And that, my dear, is one of the worst parts of all with this site.

If I'm to gather the info between the two of you and boil it down, it seems to come to this: Transmen can never become or understand the plights of men, but transwomen certainly can become and understand the plights of women. Whether you agree with it or not, this is what has just been expressed. Look between the lines of your own statements.

Hope

10-06-2010, 07:14 PM

Wow...you don't want to know what's in store for somebody such as yourself if you follow your own logic. I applaud you for your constant hypocrisy and passive-aggressive demeanor about oh-so-certain groups on this site. You certainly are dedicated.

I learned it from you dad, I LEARNED IT FROM YOU!!!

10-06-2010, 07:22 PM

I learned it from you dad, I LEARNED IT FROM YOU!!!

Quite cute, but I hardly think I started insulting transwomen two years back because they somehow threatened my own identity.

And since you seem to get such a jolly, I'm officially switching tactics. From this point on, I will personally be editing/deleting any and all insulting comments I see regarding FtMs from anybody. Since a portion of MtFs seem incapable of helping themselves, it's come to this. If you don't like what I'm doing, take it up with your own sisters.

AnonyMouse

10-06-2010, 07:25 PM

Here's the thing, Melody. I don't know how widespread of a phenomenon this is, but there are men out there who are nearly 100% straight, who aren't attracted to the male form and whatnot, but are interested in having a sexual experience with someone who has a penis. This demographic crosses over with the demographic of men who are straight, but like to watch porn with pre/non-op MTF's in it because it offers some variety from traditional straight porn. This is definitely a sign of sexual fluidity, but it's a long way from the guy in question being a closet case.

Men have a huge problem with their egos in admitting to their hidden homosexuality whereas women don't.
I would have to disagree. A large portion of society still views same-sex relations between cis women as something that undermines their femininity or takes them away from their designated role as baby makers (unless they are doing it strictly for the entertainment of a third party, who will be a straight cis man). This disapproval has a very real effect on the female ego, as she may come to believe that she is a failure as a woman or that her same-sex desires make her somehow dirty. Too, comes the stigma that a lesbian or bisexual woman is some kind of indiscriminate sex-mongerer who will sleep with anyone who happens to belong to a sex they are attracted to.

Barbara Dugan

10-06-2010, 07:26 PM

I dont understand the perception of some people about homosexuality either hidden or open.
It's hard for everyone out there finding the right person

Byanca

10-06-2010, 07:44 PM

In my experience(those few guys I've slept with) have anly been after my body. They have not cared at all about me. If it was not for me being drunk I would never have slept with them. On dating sites its..sex sex sex. I'm considering turning lesbian. I've really had enough of these types.

Fraye

10-06-2010, 08:24 PM

I usually stay out of these kinds of threads because my first reaction to them has an element of biting on tinfoil, so this may come off as a bit offensive to some, but....

Seriously? There's actually men out there that want to have sex with someone without wanting a relationship? There's men out there that have in idealized and probably unrealistic expectation of how their "prefect" partner will look, or what kind of body they will have? My god, I wish someone had told me this before! I always thought that whether using an internet site, a dating service, a 900 number, or real life, that every person I met would right away fall in love with me for my brilliant mind and wonderful personality, and would never, ever, have their own perhaps selfish agenda or idea of what I should look or act like. Son of a....

The worst part is, I did some more research and guess what? I found out that straight women, gay women, and gay men also do these kinds of things! Dear God, is no one safe from meeting shallow people when looking for a date? I mean, trying to take this type of behavior and imply that is an exclusive province of how cismen treat MtF trans folks is really just being incredibly self-centered and myopic. This kind of thing happens to every woman who is rejected for being overweight or dowdy, for every man who is rejected for not having a twelve pack and a mansion, for every person regardless of sexuality, gender expression, age, race, creed, whatever - somewhere out there, they have probably met and been rejected or deceived by a shallow self-absorbed person who is chasing an ideal rather than a genuine human connection.

And again, while I usually keep my opinions to myself, some of the commentary in this thread and dozens of other like it are very hurtful to a significant portion of our population. Every time someone generalizes how much men suck, how shallow and unrealistic they are, how proud they are to have beaten their masculine aspects into the ground...there's people here who are essentially reading about how their own true natures are worthy of nothing but contempt. Again...how self-absorbed and shallow. Imagine the outcry if there were people running around this forum posting how being gay is stupid, how gays are weak, pitiful, and what a great thing it is to beat your gay aspect into the ground. People would be pissed, and for good reason. So what makes it better to marginalize and trivialize members of our community by being so prone to stupid stereotypes and generalizations about men?

Every time someone says how dumb, shallow, or repulsive men are in general, they may as well walk up to one of our FtM members and spit in their faces and tell them that what they are striving for the right to be is bullshit. It would be as if someone told us MtF folks that to want to be a woman is to want to be weak, emotionally crazy, and pitiful....oh wait. Shit. People do say that and it makes us sad, makes us mad, makes us uncomfortable. How hypocritical.

If we're going to generalize, so much better to just say people can suck. They can be mean, thoughtless, rude, and shallow. And that our hope is that wading through the bullshit will allow us to find and connect with the people who don't suck, the ones who want us, accept us, and love us for who we are, whomever that may be.

We might start with each other.

10-06-2010, 09:13 PM

I appreciate the sensibility in all aspects of your post, Fraye. Offensive? Only insofar as those who need to hear it don't want to. No worries.

7sisters

10-06-2010, 09:41 PM

Finding the right person is up to individual luck and destiny, I think.
Ive seen girls who seemed candidates for spinsterhood, end up with tremendous husbands. And the ladies you expect will get the best guys, remain bafflingly single. Even scientists seeking to understand 'love' have simply given up, I think! A lot of trans women eventually find their Mr. Right. I read this in a survey online. The thing is to believe we will and we will.

Stephenie S

10-06-2010, 10:31 PM

Zenith

10-07-2010, 01:33 AM

...Men who date, or try to date pre-op transwomen (women with a penis) are often (mostly) men with repressed homosexual tendencies who want to have a homosexual relationship but find they can only do it under the guise of dating a person who LOOKS like a woman...

...Are they gay? Yes. Yes they are...

A pre-op transwoman IS a woman, not just "LOOKS" like a woman. And a man who dates her is not gay. You are defining someone by a body part and a surgical procedure. I personally know a pre-op transwoman in a long term relationship with a GM. He supports her decison to undergo SRS, and plans to be with her post-op. This does not make him gay.

Yes, "trannie chasers" exist. But not all of us are "trannies"...

Melody Moore

10-07-2010, 02:37 AM

A pre-op transwoman IS a woman, not just "LOOKS" like a woman. And a man who dates her is not gay. You are defining someone by a body part and a surgical procedure. I personally know a pre-op transwoman in a long term relationship with a GM. He supports her decison to undergo SRS, and plans to be with her post-op. This does not make him gay.

Yes, "trannie chasers" exist. But not all of us are "trannies"...

Zenith, you described 1 single situation where a GM has accepted a transsexual as a woman, A man who dates a TS woman specifically because he wants to (pardon the expressions here) suck your penis or have you screw him anally then I believe they are looking me as a man & not a woman. I have chatted to hundreds of guys who want to meet with me, but I am yet to meet one who can fully appreciate me as a female.

I have also chatted to one guy who was really interested in me & thought he was OK at first, so I met with
him, but I was reminded of him when I seen the video posted by Hope. I kid you not about this... this guy
I met had no job, was a bad alcoholic & took Seroquel for mental health issues & when I refused his sexual
advances he tried to get violent with me - I ended up busting his head open defending myself against this
creep - so the choices are very limited when it comes to finding decent men in the real world when you're a
transsexual. So for this reason I have decided now to stay lesbian & am now back together with my girlfriend
who was straight, but does accept me fully as being a female now & has also opened her sexual boundaries.

I might reconsider a relationship with a guy again after SRS & only if I ever split up with my girlfriend again
& when I have a better chance to find someone decent & not desperate & who accepts me as a real woman.

I too am deeply offended by the term 'tranny' because it applies to transvestites or cross-dressers, not transsexuals.

Zenith

10-07-2010, 03:44 AM

Shelly Preston

10-07-2010, 04:21 AM

I dont often reply in this section but A few people her seem to be claiming to know the thoughts of other people

Maybe they should take up mind reading

Yes there area lot of men who may be seeking a realtionship withouth the guilt, but equally there are men who are seeking true love. A lot of these men are in a happy realtionship which may have started while the lady concerened was pre op but has continued when she is post op with some even getting married

I can personally name couples where this has happened and they continue to be happy

Hope

10-07-2010, 04:28 AM

Melody, if you find a GG who accepts you as a woman why is it so hard to imagine a GM doing the same? Yes I do know there are tons of creeps out there, but that doesn't mean all GMs are that way. What I find offensive is when some people in our own camp, who should know better, define someone by what is between their legs. A man who has a relationship with a pre-op transwoman cannot be defined as gay unless you also define her as not being a woman...

Please also try not to offend cross-dressers and transvestites, plenty of fine people in that group who have found their place on the gender spectrum...

You are right Julie, but I think we are talking about 2 different animals here. The guy who dates a woman, finds out she is TS (regardless of surgical status) and continues to date her and think of her as a woman, is one sort of guy (an all too infrequent sort) and is most certainly strait. The guy who, on the other hand, goes on-line and specifically searches out ads from TG girls, the sort of guy who is looking for a "chick with a dick" ... that is a different sort of guy... and I think that the OP and Stephenie are thinking about the latter and not the former.

Areyan

10-07-2010, 04:47 AM

i'm inclined to agree with the others here about the type of man who is trolling adverts looking for TS girls rather than GGs... anything wrong with transmen in particular? lol... just askin'.... still wondering here what real men have that we boys' don't... oh... oh... ok, i'm going to shutup now. :o

LMAO..... i'm such a cheeky boi. :devil:

Gerrijerry

10-07-2010, 06:33 AM

Byanca

10-07-2010, 06:37 AM

I doubt they are all gay. It might be as simple as 'trannies' are easier to get laid, and or something new. Depressed, low self worth etc. Easy preys.

Stephenie S

10-07-2010, 10:25 AM

Yes, "trannie chasers" exist. But not all of us are "trannies".

Good point, Zenith.

But I was not talking about those who have relationships. I was talking a bout the chasers one finds on dating sites.

Stephie

Melody Moore

10-07-2010, 10:50 AM

Melissa A.

10-07-2010, 11:38 AM

After reading the post and all of the replies. My two cents is that MtF or FtM no difference. I just wonder why not wait until after the surgery to date. That way you are in every way who you want to be. Also gender choice has nothing to do with sexuality. By all means make friends at all times with everyone. Just leave the sex out until you have completed your gender choice. Isn't it hard enough to go through that with out all the complications of sex on top of it.

Are you saying then, that those who transition "completely"(there must be varying definitions of that; apparantly, you have one, too) but will not or cannot have bottom surgery should resign themselves to a life without sexual/romantic companionship? Look, I'm sorry, everyone, if my particular rant about my love life foibles thus far came off as a generalization of men. It wasn't meant that way. It was a semi-serious, semi-amusing complaint about the struggles everyone faces when it comes to romance, and this trans woman in particular, since that was the subject. I have no personal perspective on what trans men face, So I chose not to assume to comment on them. There are men, at your local laundromat, AND on dating sites, TS or otherwise, who see me as a chick with a dick, and a sexually starved desperado. Men who are certainly gay and won't admit it to themselves, bi-curious or married men looking for a walk on the wild side, and men who have a thing for hyper-femininity, and figure they will find it in a transsexual, as if that's all we think about. There are also men out there who see a strength and a character in a trans woman. Men who may have some harmless differences in what they seek, but who would have a long-term relationship with someone like me, regardless of what is or isn't between my legs, or what will be. I know one, very well. We aren't together because of circumstances, his and mine(mostly distance, and both of our unwillingness to change that, permanantly) I'm not about to assign any deragatory assumption of latent or closeted gayness or anything else to such men. It's none of my business. If they are looking for a human connection with another human being, that is what is important, in the end. It's certainly all I am seeking. I would date a trans man in a heartbeat, if who he is inside filled my needs. I would also, under the right circumstances, have sex with a man, straight, gay, bi, trans, cd, or whatever, that I find attractive, and really not give a s**t what his motivation is. I'm a big girl, and an adult with free will, and if it's something I want to do, whatever. I'm not going to have him fill out a questionnaire to assure he isn't an evil closeted gay. Under those circumstances, it would be none of my business. Saying "all men who do this are that" is as bad a generalization as the assumptions many of them make about me. "lucky in love" isn't just a worn out saying. It's what many people are. Till now, guess I've been a bit unlucky. That's ok. To use another worn out statement, live and learn.

Hugs,

Melissa:)

Byanca

10-07-2010, 12:00 PM

from my experience with 'Tranny chasers' they are seeking 'gay M+M
type sex' NOT heterosexual M+F type sex
You can often see it how feminine the guy is, or how masculine. The masculine type tends to chase GGs and 'trannies' And is the giver, while the woman is the reciever. Now if the roles are changed. Like two girls who switches roles. That's clearly homosexual. Homo means same. Do the same things. It's that simple imo. As long as one does not do the same, it's not gay. A female and male can also be gay imo.

Zenith

10-07-2010, 12:17 PM

I think a few people here are completely overlooking the main subject of this thread.....
'WHEN MEN SEEK TO DATE A TS WOMAN - WHAT ARE THEY TRULY SEEKING?'

I thought we are meant to talking specifically about 'Tranny Chasers' who as Hope says are looking for a 'Chick with a Dick' and not
males who are seeking a genuine heterosexual type relationship...

Why is it so hard for even some of us to consider TS women real women, or to even think that there are cis gendered people that would think that way. There can be much to admire in a TS woman (or man) and some of character can appriciate that. Why would one paint a broad brush and assume they are all chasers? I'm aware of the large amount of bad out there, but do not want to ignore the good. We have to think of ourselves as worthy of more.

AnonyMouse

10-07-2010, 12:23 PM

I find I have to stand by my original statement.

Men who date, or try to date pre-op transwomen (women with a penis) are often (mostly) men with repressed homosexual tendencies who want to have a homosexual relationship but find they can only do it under the guise of dating a person who LOOKS like a woman.

This is so common that there is a name for these men. They are called "trannie-chasers". Are they gay? Yes. Yes they are. Do they want to think of themselves as gay? No. No they do not. You figure it out.

I apologize if this offends men on this forum. But this is a support site for transgendered men and women, not a support site for those trying to date them.

If you want to date one of these men (or women, as the case might be) I guess that's OK. You may be flattered at the attention, but you should know that the object of this dating will almost always be sex, plain and simple. Sex and then on to the next one.

S
Your non-apology does not amuse me. Nor does your continued insistence that someone looking for a specific juxtaposition of organs could not possibly also be a decent person looking for a long-term relationship. As Fraye has reasonably, if agitatedly, pointed out, loads of people are only in it for the sex. Men seem to do this more than women, and when one is on the Internet they tend to self-select in favor of jerks (perhaps thinking that anyone desperate enough to post on the Internet is an easy lay). It is never acceptable to make a broad generalization based on narrow experience, regardless of how much truth you feel it carries.

Now a quote to demonstrate the kind of person I'm talking about (who is not me, despite the similarity in name):

I'm definitely bisexual; I love both the boobs and the penis. If there was a classification for being immensely attracted to ladyboys/transexual MtF, then that's what I'd be. My Nikki is a ladyboy, and I must say, if, on the off chance that she and I would break up, there's no way I'd be able to settle for just one or the other... both, thank you please<3

I don't care much for myself, but you owe Mouse an apology. A real one.

ReineD

10-07-2010, 02:23 PM

Why is it so hard for even some of us to consider TS women real women, or to even think that there are cis gendered people that would think that way.

Hi Julie! Love your new avatar, you are beautiful! :)

I think that forum members do consider TS women real women. The question is about the attitudes of the men outside our community who specifically seek pre-op transwomen rather than any woman regardless of birth gender.

Discussions become difficult when we use quantifiers such as few, many, or most and of course there's no way to come up with real numbers, but based on accounts I've read of transwomen on the dating scene, I get the impression that the majority of GMs they've met (outside of our community), want pre-op transwomen for specific reasons. This doesn't mean there aren't decent men out there who will fall in love with everything a person has to offer, and not focus on specific body parts.

So what does a majority mean? 51%, 75%, or 95%? I suppose this depends on the geographic location and the venues where partners are sought. But if transwomen who aren't looking strictly for sex on online dating sites find it necessary to post in their profiles they aren't interested in blow-up pics of a prospect's penis, or no-shows, or more than just a one night stand, this has got to say something about a vast majority of what at least online guys are looking for. Sad as it is.

My SO and I attend her rather large gender support group meetings frequently. There are many transwomen, few strictly CDs (I think), and lots more people in between currently sorting it all out. Only one transwoman shows up with her bf. The others are mostly single and still looking, and IMO they are a very attractive group of ladies. It's just hard to find male partners.

Erin ... don't give up. Just keep looking, even if you have to sift through lots of creeps. Eventually you'll find Mr. Right. :)

Traci Elizabeth

10-07-2010, 02:31 PM

WOW! This thread is like a Rose...rose stem that is - full of sharp thorns. I'm just glad I'm a Lesbian and don't have to deal with this issue.

Melody Moore

10-07-2010, 08:05 PM

Why is it so hard for even some of us to consider TS women real women, or to even think that there are cis gendered people that would think that way. There can be much to admire in a TS woman (or man) and some of character can appriciate that. Why would one paint a broad brush and assume they are all chasers? I'm aware of the large amount of bad out there, but do not want to ignore the good. We have to think of ourselves as worthy of more.
Zenith I dont think for one second assume that all men who have contacted me are tranny chasers- those that havent been tranny chasers I have found to be total creeps who are rejected a lot by other women for one reason or another & dont appeal to me in anyway.

I met with one guy who I thought was alright at first, he came across online & on the telephone as being very nice & respectful, so I agreed to go out with him a couple of times but after I rejected his sexual advances he got very violent with me that was a bad mistake trying that shit with me because I busted him open real bad but he really did deserve everything I gave him. The reason I started to reject this creep was because I found out he was a bad alcoholic & it became very obvious he had serious mental health issues & was no doubt a woman abuser - the video Hope posted seriously did remind me a lot of this asshole. A transsexual friend who had her SRS in 1978 warned me a couple of months ago that trans-women are amongst the most abused women in the world - Im starting to believe it.

I dont think for one second that transsexual female are not real women - I am more female than most here because I was born a true hermaphrodite but incorrectly assigned as a male soon after birth. Irrespective of that issue I know transsexual females are worthy of so much more from guys - so you have no argument with me about that.. If you missed my earlier posts where I said that I have been contacted by a large number of tranny chasers on person.com, a social network & dating site who dont want me to have SRS. All the other guys who have accepted me as a female on that site are creeps or simply don't appeal to me for one reason or another - mainly because they only ever want to talk about sex or cant string more than two words together to make up a sentence. I consider myself to be very intelligent and a turned on by intelligent conversation.

You can often see it how feminine the guy is, or how masculine. The masculine type tends to chase GGs and 'trannies' And is the giver, while the woman is the reciever. Now if the roles are changed. Like two girls who switches roles. That's clearly homosexual. Homo means same. Do the same things. It's that simple imo. As long as one does not do the same, it's not gay. A female and male can also be gay imo.
Byanca, please dont treat me like I am some naive fool who doesnt understand the basic fundamentals of sexual orientation & gender, because I am very intelligent on such issues.

I was open to the idea of a heterosexual relationship with a guy at one stage & I considered myself to be bisexual because I prefer women but open to the idea of a relationship with a guy. However as I said the only guys that seem to be interested in me are 'tranny chasers' who are looking for a 'chick with a dick' who want to engage in homosexual acts, or creeps rejected by other women and who don't appeal to me at all - so the idea of any type of relationship with a guy has been put completely on hold now until after my SRS & then I will see how the guys accept me. As it is I am back together with my girlfriend on a very discreet basis because of her family. My girl fully accepts me as a female now and this is why I am glad that I am a lesbian at the end of the day. But sex in our relationship only plays a very small part in it, its the other things we do together & feelings that we share with each other is most important in our relationship. So Im a lesbian and would much rather stay that way if I cant find a decent guy who fully accepts & respects me as a female. I won't ever settle for second best - Here is my profile on person.com (http://person.com/personals.phtml?user_id=3872712) if anyone wants to read it.

Barbara Dugan

10-07-2010, 08:40 PM

[QUOTE=MelodyN;2284721
I too am deeply offended by the term 'tranny' because it applies to transvestites or cross-dressers, not transsexuals.[/QUOTE]

I really don't like the term but I am not a tranny either... I am just a gay transvestite

Melody Moore

10-07-2010, 09:49 PM

I really don't like the term but I am not a tranny either... I am just a gay transvestite
I was talking about how the term was generally originally applied, but I think we all agree its derogatory
and luckily now in Australia we have laws under the anti-discrimination act to prohibit the use is such terms.
So if it ever gets thrown at anyone who identifies as a member of the opposite sex we can now take legal action. :)

Kaitlyn Michele

10-07-2010, 10:16 PM

I dated a guy that was no doubt a "t chaser"..he was a really nice gentle guy..he would say he wasnt gay and i just laughed. prior to my bottom surgery he actually commented that "this might be the last time" or something like that...it was literally the absolute worst thing he could have said!!!

i won't see him anymore, but we had our fun, and i refuse to hate him or even criticize him for being himself...

everybody's different, everybody has the right to go for what they want...

going on about never settling for 2nd best and how Men are this or trannie chasers are that isnt going to get me anywhere, so i'm just going to meet people, and see what happens..

Nicole Erin

10-08-2010, 07:58 PM

Melody Moore

10-08-2010, 09:13 PM

Well, some seemingly handsome guy responded to my dating ad, and I was thinking "Alright, he looks good and all" but one of his photos was of his shangalang. That and a full description of it. I was like, OH jeeze, doesn't it get better than this?
Hahaha now you understand my problem & why my choices are extremely limited... the nice looking guys I have found often have the biggest ego & are the most demanding when it comes to sex, however the same can be said about women as well. I really thought the tide had turned had a really nice looking guy contact me the other day on person.com and no doubt he is one of the sweetest guys to ever contact me on, but as it turns out he is a quadriplegic and honestly I dont think I could ever cope with being with someone like that. My mother who also is a registered nurse was married to a quadriplegic for 21 years after she divorced my real father - she loved her new partner unconditionally right up until he passed away last year. But the relationship really took a toll on my mother & there is no way I want to go down that road. So Im still yet to meet a nice guy who isnt rejected by other women for whatever reason and one who wants to be with me as a woman above all other women & definitely not as a 'tranny'.

Fab Karen

10-09-2010, 09:19 PM

The worst part is, I did some more research and guess what? I found out that straight women, gay women, and gay men also do these kinds of things! Dear God, is no one safe from meeting shallow people when looking for a date? I mean, trying to take this type of behavior and imply that is an exclusive province of how cismen treat MtF trans folks is really just being incredibly self-centered and myopic. This kind of thing happens to every woman who is rejected for being overweight or dowdy, for every man who is rejected for not having a twelve pack and a mansion, for every person regardless of sexuality, gender expression, age, race, creed, whatever - somewhere out there, they have probably met and been rejected or deceived by a shallow self-absorbed person who is chasing an ideal rather than a genuine human connection.

And again, while I usually keep my opinions to myself, some of the commentary in this thread and dozens of other like it are very hurtful to a significant portion of our population. Every time someone generalizes how much men suck, how shallow and unrealistic they are, how proud they are to have beaten their masculine aspects into the ground...there's people here who are essentially reading about how their own true natures are worthy of nothing but contempt. Again...how self-absorbed and shallow. Imagine the outcry if there were people running around this forum posting how being gay is stupid, how gays are weak, pitiful, and what a great thing it is to beat your gay aspect into the ground. People would be pissed, and for good reason. So what makes it better to marginalize and trivialize members of our community by being so prone to stupid stereotypes and generalizations about men?

Every time someone says how dumb, shallow, or repulsive men are in general, they may as well walk up to one of our FtM members and spit in their faces and tell them that what they are striving for the right to be is bullshit. It would be as if someone told us MtF folks that to want to be a woman is to want to be weak, emotionally crazy, and pitiful....oh wait. Shit. People do say that and it makes us sad, makes us mad, makes us uncomfortable. How hypocritical.

If we're going to generalize, so much better to just say people can suck. They can be mean, thoughtless, rude, and shallow. And that our hope is that wading through the bullshit will allow us to find and connect with the people who don't suck, the ones who want us, accept us, and love us for who we are, whomever that may be.

We might start with each other.
:iagree: Bears repeating for any who didn't see it.