Why not! [Archive] - Crossdressers.com - #1 Community & Forum for Crossdressers, Family and Friends

Jill

10-10-2010, 03:24 PM

I've been a fairly quiet member of this forum for a long time and there always seems to be those TG folk who are uncomfortable with those who are in the closet. It's a bit strange to me that it's not easier to see. The answer is very simple. We have a lot to lose. Even though I am inching out a bit, I'm really not in a position to have the entire world know. I am interning as a therapist at local nearby agency. I see clients that I know from there in the community all the time. Should they spot me dressed, they could easily go directly to the directors and I would likely be cut loose. If I don't get my intern hours, I don't get my degree and that is a lot of wasted time and money.

For others, they may be in the middle of custody battles and things like that. Waltzing around in public dressed as a woman could greatly effect the outcome of something like that. We stay closeted because plain and simple, we have a lot to lose.

Marcia Blue

10-10-2010, 03:38 PM

I am in the first camp. It took me 50 years to do it. I go out and do quite a bit in public, however I usually travel at least 60 miles from home, to a city. In a metro setting, people tend to be used to seeing the unusual, more often. In a small town you are better off staying indoors.

To those of you who stay at home to respect your wife, I applaud your decision. Your wife is your most precious everything.

To those that can, but will not. You are missing a great experience. The whole world my not welcome you with open arms, but you would be surprised how accepting they can be.Find a Support/Social group to meet up with. There is strength in numbers, along with fun people, who understand where you are coming from.

Lots hugs to everyone,
:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:

melina

10-10-2010, 04:03 PM

Yes, thats me, closet at home but some times venture out. Lost many potential freinds because of my secrecy. Succeeded this way for 40 years. Have met other CDs for hotel get-togethers for girl time, shared myself, and was liberating letting melina out. Ive found it very difficult to actually meet others like me, because we feel so unexceptable and have so much to lose, But I keep trying.......

Emma Leigh

10-10-2010, 04:23 PM

Stephenie S

10-10-2010, 04:37 PM

Shelly67

10-10-2010, 04:45 PM

My family do not know I crossdress , therefore my answear is thus . No one is showing me the way - its a concious choice . Being married , with a very supportive partner and being respectful of her feelings is the very first reason I will not venture out enfemme . The other is my direct family .
IF I were ever to go out , it would only be accompanied with her and to an accepted establishment or friends home . It is a private choice between US both . I feel no shame in witholding my femme self in my own home . However to go out in daylight in some parts of this country is rather risky - passable or not .
It's a personel choice , but so is the strength required should it all go belly up in the face of confrontation of those who are discovered - be it with a partner , a distressed family , work mates or other people should word get round of outside adventures . Then theres even worse - what about the horrible people who could possibly assault physically in homophobic hatred ?. Imagine having to explain the reasons why of gaining injuries to direct family ..... especially those who are not aware of theyre sons behaviour and dress sense . Or the Police . The courts , then the media ??
A verbal assault by strangers is nothing more than unerving , but we do live in a dangerous culture in blighty enforced by a very real hatred and knife culture . Its undeniable and in my mind russian roulette .
Sorry if my views offend , but in stark reality they are the truth .
For me at least .

Emma Leigh

10-10-2010, 04:45 PM

Those who are are "out" are NOT complaining about those who choose to remain in the closet. They are only complaining about the ones who stay in the closet and claim it is someone ELSE (society) who is keeping them in the closet.

S

I did,nt realise anyone was complaining, I thought we all tolerated each others reasons and accepted that we are all individuals!!!

Raychel

10-10-2010, 06:37 PM

I have alot of friends and family that have no clue about Raychel. I am also very well know in the local area. For these reasons, Raychel will be staying in the house for a while.

sissystephanie

10-10-2010, 06:47 PM

I started going out dressed when I was still a teenager. My late wife knew that I was a CD and fully supported me, and even went out with me. My children did not know until recently, but don't care as long as I don't dress enfemme around them. They are grown and on their own, so not at home to cause me a problem. I just am careful to not be where they are going to be!

Most of those who dress only at home have valid reasons for doing so. It is their life, to be lived as they see fit. My own neighbors don't know that I dress, and I will keep it a secret as long as I can! It is my life, not somebody elses!!

kaitlinrenee

10-10-2010, 06:53 PM

and because it's your life thats why people need to just accept it and keep their comments to themselves, weather you're out in public or in the priviacy of your home. :)

CalamityJane

10-10-2010, 06:56 PM

kaitlinrenee

10-10-2010, 06:59 PM

i agree, :)

Ashleythenewgirl

10-10-2010, 07:58 PM

Kathryn Martin

10-10-2010, 07:59 PM

I love camping!! :)

And there's actually 3 camps!! Skirts and dressing at home... Out and about and the ones that wear womens jeans out and about... Maybe that was covered in the "etc" category? I don't know. Ok. So what was the question again?

I am with you

BLUE ORCHID

10-10-2010, 08:09 PM

nikkijo

10-10-2010, 08:09 PM

I don't care if the world cares how I dress, Its my friends and family that I worry about. Most of them would accept it if I dressed in public (in time), some would not. Losing even just one friend would make it not worth it to me.

and you would be a wuss.... and lack trust in your friends trust me, i they are your friends they will accept you... regardless... i told all my friends at a rally i put on and just toned down nikki slightly... basically kept makeup and dress situationally apropriate and minimal, it was their first time seeing nikki after all, and all are very suportive even if they need a few answers every once in a while.. but i will say i go beyond the realm of just CD....

vanityfaira

10-10-2010, 08:18 PM

We all have an image of how other people perceive us, and rightly so, because that is the image that we project for any number of legitimate reasons. Society has not accepted this (behavior?), and religion further frustrates it. Furthermore, I do care that my family and friends would see this side of me. Unfortunately, I'm increasingly finding that I need a release for my libido.

nikkijo

10-10-2010, 08:23 PM

Those who are are "out" are NOT complaining about those who choose to remain in the closet. They are only complaining about the ones who stay in the closet and claim it is someone ELSE (society) who is keeping them in the closet.

S

exactially.... saying you stay in because of someone else makes you a wuss... and shows your possition in life as a follower not a leader. if you chose to stay in dont whine saying i cant go out because bah blah blah... it pisses some of us off very quickly...

Jocelyn Quivers

10-10-2010, 08:44 PM

As a proud member of the second category I will list my reasons.

1. Per the wife and family-no going out in public.
2. Per my own standards. I am not ready. Granted I can look good in still photos but my overall presentation, voice, mannerisms etc. is still years from being perfected. I also am not ready to be clocked by 100% of the people that I would come in contact with, and having to deal with possible negative situations. So for me at least I've come to accept and have no problems with my life in the closet. The closet is good.

jessica renee

10-10-2010, 08:57 PM

Mine is an interesting situation. I don't have a SO, so no problems there. I do, however have two roommates, who have two young children. My roommates do not know about Jessica, so I do not dress about the house except for in the basement where my room is. I have been out on several occasions however, and am getting more comfortable with it. I'm still worried about friends and family finding out however, because I don't know how many of them would accept this part of me. When I do go out I don't as a rule wear skirts or dresses, but rather pants or jeans. It's just part of my comfort zone. So I guess you could say I am kinda in between the two groups, and I'm happy there.

Sophie_C

10-10-2010, 09:03 PM

We have two camps on this forum,

Those who wear skirts, dresses etc and leave their houses etc and let the world see them.

Those who wear skirts, dresses etc and stay in their houses etc and hides.

For those in the second category, the first category have shown the way, shown the fact that the world does not care what you wear, so what is stopping those in the second category joining those in the first, surely you still don't really believe that you can't do it because society says you can't.

What is really keeping you behind closed doors?

I am transgender, not transvestite, and the process of that, generally destroys people's lives. Most all people lose their jobs, most of their friends and family and all of the things they hold dear to themselves. There are exceptions to the rule, and if you are self-employed with little family, it's not nearly as bad, but I don't want to go there.

If I was simply a transvetite, I'd consider compatmentalizing it and just being eccentric about it all, but given the situation, I will keep things as they are...

txrobinm

10-10-2010, 09:18 PM

I was closeted for many years in respect for my (now ex) wife. It was an amazingly lonely time. I felt totally alone and isolated, I couldn't speak of this with her (due her reaction, despite her knowing since before the marriage, hence the eventual divorce), or with anyone else in my immediate area. Some old college friends knew, but they were far away and I had lost contact with them, or they with me over the years.

Now I'm selectively out. Most of my CD friends and allies are 30 miles away from my work friends, and they are 2 different social groups. Basically I work in one town, party in the other, and reside in between. This is a metropolitan area, with about 6 million people in 4 counties, roughly the same population as the entire state of Alabama. That's a lot of people to be anonymous in. Those who know me well, but who don't know of Robin, would probably not be at all surprised.

Eventually, the pain of the loneliness of hiding (and the implied shame that goes with it) drove me to seek out others like me. For a year I went to support group meetings, and for the past year I've been part of CD social groups that go out. I've been careful, avoiding places where drunk men (especially young ones) hang out, I'm almost always a part of a group, don't drink myself while out, and generally act the way I should.

The trouble is, in large part, societal. Until we, as a group, go out en masse en femme, in a decent and 'blending' way, society will continue to think we are perverts and need counseling or something. If we wish to change society's view of ourselves, we can not continue to hide in our closets. Find some way to get out, into the mainstream. Show regular people that we aren't so far away from regular ourselves, that there's no need to hide the children and reach for a weapon or spew hatred. Change is impossible without relationships, and relationships aren't possible if we remain hidden.

I'm not saying go dressed up to work tomorrow. That's too much too soon, shock for the sake of shock. I'm saying find some CD friends or CD allies, get some help with your presentation, get a babysitter if needed, and set a goal to dress up before the year is out, in a nearby town if needed, and go out together. A movie, dinner, normal stuff. Wear something that fits in. If you see someone looking more than they should, go up and say "Hi! Such a lovely evening, yes?" and just engage them in a conversation. We are a part of our society, for good or ill. Our society is what we make of it.

If you lose friends over this (and I have), then maybe they weren't really your friend to begin with. I know that hurts, but it's also true. The lonely times pass, life gets better. Now I'm better about choosing and investing in my friendships. I'm also very selective about who knows. My ex knows but my young children don't. My parents and siblings do not know, but my ex's parents do, and are supportive. Yet I have many good friends that know, with whom I socialize as both versions of me. Some of them are extremely close friends, too. It's just a part of growing up, of better integration of her into him, of raising the emotional IQ with practice and observation.

Cindi Johnson

10-10-2010, 09:31 PM

I am transgender, not transvestite, and the process of that, generally destroys people's lives. Most all people lose their jobs, most of their friends and family and all of the things they hold dear to themselves.

IMHO, very few of us who go out frequently suffer such dire consequences. In fact, I'd say that few TG's suffer any negative consequences from going out dressed. Maybe in smalller cities it's different, but most people live in or near large cities. I know I've never had anything bad happen; in fact, I'm treated better when out dressed than when out drab. You don't have to tell friends and extended family, you know; they'd probably rather not know anyhow.

The real issue is simply how it affects your relationship with your spouse, and that is affected whether or not you go out dressed.

Cindi

Miranda09

10-10-2010, 09:32 PM

A lot of interesting comments to this thread. As for myself, I'm fine with staying in the closet and going all out once a year at TG events like Be-All. For me, I just don't care about showing society how different I am and hope they are as opened mined as I am. This is a personal journey and one I'm willing to share only with those select few I trust. Although I admit to having urges to just run out the door as my femme self, I feel keeping this private makes going out that one time a year all that much more special. :)

ICU Nurse

10-10-2010, 09:57 PM

I stay in for a bunch of reasons.

First, I am built like a 3/4 scale offensive tackle. I haven't figured out how to hide that.

Second, cost/benefit or risk/reward, whatever you'd like to call it. For me, the potential costs outweigh the potential reward.

As a result, I prefer to keep this part of me private.

NewDresser

10-10-2010, 10:21 PM

and you would be a wuss.... and lack trust in your friends trust me, i they are your friends they will accept you... regardless... i told all my friends at a rally i put on and just toned down nikki slightly... basically kept makeup and dress situationally apropriate and minimal, it was their first time seeing nikki after all, and all are very suportive even if they need a few answers every once in a while.. but i will say i go beyond the realm of just CD....

Well I am happy for you that your friends accepted you, however your friends are probably not my friends, the ones that I am concerned about. You cannot make the assumption that everyone will be tolerant. I know my friends quite well, most would accept me, some are questionable, and two that probably would never speak to me again.
As for calling me a wuss, not by a long shot, its all about acceptable risk. I will stand up on my motorcycle going 90+ miles an hour, most of the people I ride with won't, are any of them a wuss? No, to them the risk does not outway the possible outcome.

Cassi3

10-10-2010, 10:23 PM

I'm in the first camp! I had my reasons for getting out. Biggest reason, I've always felt I should have been a woman. That being said, and I'll probably hear it for this, but it's my opinion and how I feel based on my experience. I myself wouldn't be pushing anyone to get out of their comfort zone no matter what their reasons are for not venturing out, or even imply that I may have paved the way. I really believe we must all feel comfortable before we take that leap.

With that being said, those in camp #2, (this is from experience) probably have A LOT to loose before taking that leap.

No matter how long you know someone, how well do you truly know them? And what about family? I've known my father all my life and I wouldn't tell him even if I won the lottery. Why? He wouldn't accept and he's all I have left in my life. My mother knows, and she hasn't spoken to me in years. And knowing how religious she was, I probably should not have told her. I also chose to tell a friend of 12 years, who had been a supportive friend through thick and thin, that was the day our friendship ended. Looking back, should I have told her? Probably not. The only friends that haven't deserted me are those that do not know or I recently met. I really think those in camp #2 know their situations, friends and family better than any one else could and I myself wouldn't pass judgement, call them names, or question them why they choose to stay in the closet, they have their reasons, just as those of us in camp #1 had our reasons for getting out.

I really think whether we're in camp #1 or #2, we all have our reasons, comfort zones, situations, circumstances, friends and family, work and co-workers to consider for any of the choices we may or may not make.

Just my :2c: Hope it makes sense!

lingerieLiz

10-10-2010, 10:52 PM

When I started you would be arrested if caught. I would still sneak out and drive enfem. At that time I might have gone full time, but laws prevented it.

Lucy_Bella

10-10-2010, 10:54 PM

When I started you would be arrested if caught. I would still sneak out and drive enfem. At that time I might have gone full time, but laws prevented it.

Yelp ...It was illegal old habits hard to break..

kaitlinrenee

10-10-2010, 10:56 PM

me either, :)

Shelly67

10-11-2010, 12:03 AM

Perhaps on reflection of this thread there needs to be a question to shed a little more light on some of our behaviours ... ?
Therefore how many of the members on here who readily step out of the front door enfemme are NOT involved in relationships ?? It's an intrusive question but I consider it relevant .

KlaireLarnia

10-11-2010, 12:18 AM

Living in Englands equivalent to Helmund Province surrounded by individuals who have no tolerance for those of other cultures and would /have killed people for simply being of a different ethnic origin, I dont feel inclined to test their views on alternative sexuality, so I think I will stay in for the moment !!!!!!!

I kinda echo this thought by Emma Leigh. If the neighbors opposite me saw I dressed in any way we would be ridiculed beyond belief and to the point of moving (which we cannot afford to do yet). It was bad enough when my wife moved in as she is Asian and you got shouts of "Ting Tong" from some people in refference to the Little Britain character - which is sad and very pathetic. Thankfully all that stopped after a month or so...

Also my daughter goes to a state school where there are a lot of well off people (it is the best state school in my area), they would freak if they saw me dressed up or even knew I did and that would have implications on my daughter and wife - something I will NOT have happen.

So while I DO dress in public, it is only in certain areas under certain circumstances when I know there is no fear of reprisal or any long term contact with the people who see me. And remember in my case I go out looking like a man in women's clothes - I do not wear a wig or makeup etc. Just the clothes - so in some ways this is harder as I am not trying to disguise my masculinity, only fight what is currently socially acceptable.

Klaire

Veronica Lacey

10-11-2010, 01:31 AM

An interesting query, Nigella. An equally interesting thought is that perhaps one answer is in your very own tag line?

HAPPINESS IS A JOURNEY NOT A DESTINATION
WHICH I SHARE WITH THOSE CLOSEST TO ME

Dressing for me is a private hobby that brings me happiness. I personally need not share with the world in general an end result, that of dressing in public. I find joy in dressing in private and occasionally sharing with my wife; together we shall experience all that I care to while dressed.

Philipa Jane

10-11-2010, 01:47 AM

Hey Nikkijo, Don't hold back say exactly what you mean. Kidding.
But seriously we are all very much ingrained with the way society says we should be and breaking out of this mind set is progressive.
In years to come we will be an accepted part of society and be more in the open.
In the mean time I shall along with others continue with small steps and win a battle here and there.
PJ

Blaire

10-11-2010, 02:28 AM

...the fact that the world does not care what you wear... you can't do it because society says you can't.

What society do you speak of, and who makes up "the world?"

Patty B.

10-11-2010, 02:47 AM

It seems whether you are out and about or not going out at all seems to be a personal choice, neither one seems right or wrong just depends on your situation.

eluuzion

10-11-2010, 03:03 AM

I'm certainly a believer in setting goals. I also believe constructing a detailed plan (preferably in writing) with all of the progressive steps makes the difference between achieving my goal or wandering aimlessly.

But I also feel it is important (particularly for those people who are naturally "driven") to explore areas of life without having any goals attached to them. Those are the areas which I feel encourage creativity and expand vision. Those areas are where you find the seeds of inspiration that may/may not become my future goals. For me, those times are like paddling away from the designated swimming area out into open sea. I already know why the water is warm in the roped off area, lol. I am interested in exploring what is out there in the cold water. I have no idea where it will lead me. The goal is to float out there and see where it leads me.

I am not on a path with CDing...I am just wandering around the woods. I do not know where I am going, so I do not know when I will get "there".

Best I can do for an "explanation" when none really exists in my mind.

CharleneCD

10-11-2010, 11:12 AM

exactially.... saying you stay in because of someone else makes you a wuss... and shows your possition in life as a follower not a leader. if you chose to stay in dont whine saying i cant go out because bah blah blah... it pisses some of us off very quickly...

So a crossdressing married father of three who keeps his dressing behind closed doors to ensure his job and ability to support his family is not placed at risk, is a wuss? If the only risk was to have to suffer a bit of ridicule and maybe lose a so called friend or two, then I might agree with you. The reality is that there are many of us here who have no need to fully transition so we must look at what being out will cost us, unlike those who are TS who suffer a great cost by not coming out. Just remember dont judge someone unless you have walked in their shoes. Isnt that the message we keep trying to push out on the public which doesnt understand us?

That being said, I do support the idea that we need to be out more. It is easy for us to be ignored if the public thinks we are a very tiny minority. For that matter politicians think we are a tiny minority in that they can dump protections for the TG community feeling it is not a big risk for lost votes. Be seen, even if you need to travel 100 miles from home. Dont pass, many others dont either yet they still go out. Just join in with a group and go out with the idea of safety and anonymity in numbers. Lastly if you will not be seen, be heard. When supposed supporters in congress push us to the side, write or email them and tell them you will remember. If enough of us do it the message will get across

Lucy_Bella

10-11-2010, 11:31 AM

exactially.... saying you stay in because of someone else makes you a wuss... and shows your possition in life as a follower not a leader. if you chose to stay in dont whine saying i cant go out because bah blah blah... it pisses some of us off very quickly...

What a mean thing to say... I find that offensive that anyone can not respect a CDers right to privatcy such gull I might add. As a closet cder that statement is a slap in the face . We understand and fully back those who choose to go out and speaking for myself it doesn't piss me off . I have no clue who US is or is it just you that it pisses off?

There are plenty of reasons why extra exposer is not needed the biggest one for me is I DO NOT WISH TO LIVE MY LIFE AS A FEMALE FULL TIME!! I n fact it's very little I even have the urge to feel enfemme.. Understanding would be a great help and not placeing ones self as a higher than tho standard because you are open about your fenimine activities..

renee k

10-11-2010, 11:53 AM

For me, it's whatever one is happy doing. I was in the "closet" for a lot of the years that I have been doing this. Since I've been single I decided to push the envelope and be who I feel that I am inside. And still preserve the male side of my life. So, on days that I'm home I'm out there as "Renee". I really enjoy getting out.

Renee

munshine nightwood

10-11-2010, 12:20 PM

I cant wait to get out of the house when I'm dressed, but then again I'm starting to go out more often in the day time. You just have to have the confidence to step out the door and let the world know that this you , and that you dont care what the rest of the world think!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jenny Beth

10-11-2010, 12:28 PM

exactially.... saying you stay in because of someone else makes you a wuss... and shows your possition in life as a follower not a leader. if you chose to stay in dont whine saying i cant go out because bah blah blah... it pisses some of us off very quickly...

I am happy that you are able to live your life as you choose, I truly am. But comments like this coming from within our own community are uncalled for and hurtful. If you are pissed off that some here don't live up to your standards you don't have to stick around.:Angry3:

melissacd

10-11-2010, 01:02 PM

Those who are are "out" are NOT complaining about those who choose to remain in the closet. They are only complaining about the ones who stay in the closet and claim it is someone ELSE (society) who is keeping them in the closet.

S

Bingo, this is exactly the point! If you choose to stay in or you choose to go out - you choose. You reasons my be very good ones, but we must all stop blaming others, we are accountable for our choices and their consequences.

Nigella

10-11-2010, 01:12 PM

To add a little clarification, I am TS, but for a number of years before that considered myself TV. In deed I was out and about 24/7 for about 3 1/2 years before I accepted I was TS. I never had any doubts about going out en-femme, however I had reservations because of how my family would be seen by society. As a family we worked together to a point where we were all in the community as females. When we shared Nigella with the world, we lost one family as friends, that was it, I went to work as female, and when I was made redundant, (job changes, nothing to to with CDing) I applied for and was given my present job as Nigella.

I respect everyones wish to live their lives as they choose, but as someone commented earlier, don't blame anyone but yourself if you can go out and about but won't.

Thanks for all the replies,

Lorileah

10-11-2010, 01:25 PM

for everyone who sa they do it out of respect for the spouse, I respect that but you are missing the point that as long as YOU think it is a bad thing and you allow your spouse to believe it is a bad thing (by either reinforcing it by staying hidden or by agreeing with her that you are some sort of strange person who should be hidden from the world) it will remain something that many consider to be "bad". So are you a bad person? Are you someone who should be kept out of society? Do you truly believe that you have "something" that the world should not share? I am not saying dis your wife and just go out but this is something you need to discuss with her. Why does she think you need to be hidden from the world? Shame? That would be too bad if you were ashamed of someone you loved. Fear? Fear of getting hurt? There are many safe places one can go. Fear of something else? Here is where we need to educate. We don't have an incurable illness. We aren't plagues on society. We are not criminals and we certainly are not mentally ill. The mental problem we have is our own fears. Things that usually don't happen and if they do they are not as bad as you expect.

Losing a friend? Friends don't make judgments like that. People who use you and pretend to be friends make judgments like that. I think it was said earlier that you may be missing on many more friends that you will never know.

Outted at your job. Well here is a problem that we see with closed minded people. They would get rid of a good hard working well respected productive part of the company because you wore something? That suit and tie sure does make you a better person..doesn't it? We see that daily when we watch the talking heads on the TV news...yes ties make you respectable. Not. In this economy though any excuse they can use to eliminate you would be bad, so yes, be careful about keeping your job. BUT on the other hand by being silent you allow this to keep happening. There is a bill called ENDA. It gets support from a great number of people and would end discrimination in the workplace for transgendered. If you ar in the closet and someone asks you how you feel about this do you hide in that closet? Do you say things like "yeah...who needs that?" or do you say "I think it is a great idea and being part of that community I support it". Well of course not. The status quo has worked so well to help protect people from discrimination who needs to change it?

In the closet, out on the streets. You do what you think is right. You live with fear or you live life.

Every home should have a walk out closet...don't you think?

Julogden

10-11-2010, 01:25 PM

If you can dress as you like in public without serious repercussions, that's great, but some simply can't do that.

Everyone has their own unique situation and comfort level to take into consideration when it comes to going out in public or not, so just because it works for one person or for a group of persons doesn't mean it works for everyone. Reducing us to two camps is over-simplifying things, IMO.

There is a continuum of "camps" ranging from being able to come and go while dressed without any problem at one extreme to putting one's life, employment, housing, relationships and/or liberty at risk if we go out dressed. Keep in mind that there are all kinds of people from all over the world in these forums. Some here would literally be at risk of being imprisoned or killed if they openly dress.

and you would be a wuss.... and lack trust in your friends trust me, i they are your friends they will accept you... regardless... i told all my friends at a rally i put on and just toned down nikki slightly... basically kept makeup and dress situationally apropriate and minimal, it was their first time seeing nikki after all, and all are very suportive even if they need a few answers every once in a while.. but i will say i go beyond the realm of just CD....

Due to the somewhat condescending nature of your response, I took a look at some of your older postings to see if this is a regular thing for you, and I see that this isn't the first time that you've managed to insult a broad swath of people here. Hon, you need to stop and think before saying stuff like that, it really is insulting to many people here. You're welcome to your opinion, but that doesn't mean that it's OK to slap people in the face with it.

Keep in mind that you are young, which can make a big difference, young and pretty will often be tolerated more than older and not pretty. Because gender issues have received lots of coverage in the media in your lifetime, your friends of the same age are a lot more likely to be tolerant of someone who is a bit different, older member's friends and family are less likely to tolerate gender differences, in my experience, as we grew up in times when people were much less educated about or tolerant of people whose gender presentation is different, and old habits die hard, each generation tends to abide by what they learned when growing up.

Also, while you are a bit tall at 5'10", you're not tall enough to really attract attention in public, as there are plenty of females around that height. Try being in your late 50's and 6'5" tall in your stocking feet and then see how comfortable you'd be in public. Believe me, it makes a very significant difference.

Carol:hugs:

Lucy_Bella

10-11-2010, 01:41 PM

until there is understanding I am in the closet, I mean why not? We can't even get understanding amung ourselves here , we all know there are many different levels on the gender bar, why can we not respect each level? Nigellia , you yourself stated that it was a long journey before you came to being a TS and some confussion was involed( I do not know your whole story ) maybe some here who complain about being restricted have valid reasons.

Maybe they are fighting urges to become TS for many different reasons or waiting for the time to come just as you did. Any supported structure without a strong foundation will collapse . You had a strong foundation many here do not. What I am saying is to be more clear , exposure to some is a gamble. A risk that will change their lives forever . Closeted Cders in my own opinion are pretty much sure they do not want to live the rest of thier lives as a woman and go through un controlable spurts to express the feeling femme . What happens when that feeling goes away like mine does ? TS that feeling stays I assume , closet cders it doesnt .

I am not sure you fully understand and in explaining this I do NOT compare or feel any different between Cders and TS's I just wish there was more understanding between the two groups.

Rianna Humble

10-11-2010, 04:17 PM

I have alot of friends and family that have no clue about Raychel. I am also very well know in the local area. For these reasons, Raychel will be staying in the house for a while.

Been there, done that, designed the teeshirt :heehee:

I had lots of friends who had no idea about Rianna, that wasn't what stopped me in the early stages, it was what others might do to those friends if the others knew about me. Then I starte dgoing out but miles away from where I live and found that almost no-one batted an eyelid.

You could say that I was well known in the area - after all I had been possibly the third most prominent politician for my party in the town (after the MP and the then leader of the council) - so it was not surprising when my transition became front page news.

But I have been blown away by the positive responses from the people I used to serve and even some who used to oppose me. One of the best has to be a neighbour who wathed out for me after the newspaper article and came out to ask if there was anything he could do to support me. He even went so far as to ask me to promise that if anyone in the area gave me grief I would talk to him about it!

Someone who used to be a vocal political opponent stops to chat whenever she sees me now and compliments me on my look.

YMMV but being well known isn't always the barrier we imagine it might be. That said, this is your life we are talking about, Raychel, not mine so it is your right to choose what you do with it.

=================

I don't care if the world cares how I dress, Its my friends and family that I worry about. Most of them would accept it if I dressed in public (in time), some would not. Losing even just one friend would make it not worth it to me.

and you would be a wuss....

When we see such blatant intolerance from within our community is it any wonder that some of our brothers and sisters expect intolerance from those who do not know better?

diannecourtney

10-11-2010, 04:35 PM

You know life is too short and people are too pissey to criticize those that are in the closet or whereever. Why not let us be whatever to preserve the moment, boy (or should girls) I love the ladies things. Love to all.

marcy77

10-11-2010, 04:43 PM

Not sure which camp I'm in. Maybe a little of both. I don't go out in public because my family and my wife would not like it. But when they are not around, and I'm out of town - It's party time!

sissystephanie

10-11-2010, 05:05 PM

Some people have said that they don't go out in public enfemme because they can't pass very well!! To me that is a very poor excuse! I went out before I was married, and I was not very good with makeup and fixing my wig. But I got away with it! Then when I married, and my dear wife did my makeup and fixed my wig!! I could easily pass when she got through!!

However, cancer took her over 5 years ago! But I love to wear feminine clothing and I love to go out in public. So I still do, as a man wearing a skirt or dress. Plus all the other female things, of course! But I very definitely look like a man. No wig and no makeup, just me!! Get compliments on my outfits, but very rarely hear any other kind. People really don't care, unless you are indecent or really weird looking.

If you don't go out because of family problems, that is one thing! But if you stay in because of the general public, you are really missing the boat!! Get dressed and get out!!!

Lorileah

10-11-2010, 05:09 PM

fascinating, until there is understanding. How does one get understanding when one is hiding in the closet?

Every movement has had to have someone who is in the light. No group ever got understanding by keeping hidden in the dark. Everyone in the group gets the benefits and claims them after the fight. The one's who are in the fray want to just get on afterward but the one's who watched the war from the sidelines want to re-live every battle. You don't get anything without asking for it. A magic fairy doesn't come down and say "you have been so discreet and quiet. I'll grant you equality or understanding or even rights"

My feelings are if you stay in the closet you cannot complain about the darkness. You cannot say "why?" You cannot ask why you cannot be who you are. The answer is you can be anything you want to be IF you are willing to work for it.

Lucy_Bella

10-11-2010, 05:34 PM

That depends on the angle of understanding, for those who are very open and those who express more Femme than Masculine compared to those who rarley express and just like dressing up sometimes. So ( I am trying to express this in a civil and polite way ). What those who represent by going out regularly isn't the same for those who wish they can take that first step..

Those of us who are still in the closet for obvious reasons remain in the closet ( we don't want the stereo typical tag tied to us ) Not because it a bad tag, but because it simply isn't us. Most of us are straight ,are in a marriage and have children,have a need to protect our way of living and have no desire to live full time as a woman. This isn't a sucker punch to anyone who does go out regularly and don'tget me wrong I am not placeing that TAG on those who do go out. Every enviroment and area we all live in is different and some need to cater to those needs.

Understanding must first begin with ones self and then branch out from there you just don't jump out of a 20 year closet and expect the world to accept who you are because people in a forum believe you are a chicken sh@t for allowing them to do all the foot work!! I have been out and to be honest for me ( maybe it was the alcohol ) it wasn't a big frickin deal so what!! I am up in the air about doing it again but the resources and ties are there for me to use and I can go out with little or no fear of being outed to anyone who may know me as my male self..

So just because some of us ( I say us because I was/am there ) want to drag our feet before jumping in head first to going out doesn't mean we will never go out.. So why the seperation? Instead encouragement and UNDERSTANDING to as why they /us have not leaped yet but the day may soon come, all we endure is we are wuss's.. Nice group..

Lorileah

10-11-2010, 06:25 PM

I have been out and to be honest for me ( maybe it was the alcohol ) it wasn't a big frickin deal so what!! I am up in the air about doing it again but the resources and ties are there for me to use and I can go out with little or no fear of being outed to anyone who may know me as my male self..

So just because some of us ( I say us because I was/am there ) want to drag our feet before jumping in head first to going out doesn't mean we will never go out..

and you just made Nigella's point. It isn't a big deal.

So why the seperation? Instead encouragement and UNDERSTANDING to as why they /us have not leaped yet but the day may soon come, all we endure is we are wuss's.. Nice group..

No one said you were a "wuss". I made the point that if you don't come out don't complain. You need encouragement? OK. go out, be who you are, dress as you like. Or do you need reinforcement that you are doing what's right? Hiding and keeping secrets is not right. The longer you do keep secrets the bigger the explosion when it comes out. You fear for your children. Educating them that there are different lifestyles and people in the world is more protective than hiding things you don't think they will understand. You can start with telling them that most crossdressers are heterosexual and not gay. One of your "tags"...gone. It all starts with education.

and yes we are a nice group.

Lucy_Bella

10-11-2010, 07:12 PM

I beg to differ on the WUSS part and that's what changed the topic because such a comment was made.. I also agree'd with Nigella, I have no problems with any group yes it is a nice group ,but to finger point on blazing any trail is just wrong. Most everyone of us start in the closet , to say one group is leading the way while others are shamefully crying about not having the balls to step out is wrong. In some cases thats far from the truth.

Understanding, meaning you yourself where there before and for what ever reason you left and moved on. Encouragement , meaning you should encourage people not be little them for what ever reason that keeps them in chains..

Not call them a wuss..

Like I suggested understanding, are you aware that some folks here have boundries they need to follow in order to keep a marriage? To break a promise even tho they long to go out because someone is pointing their finger at them and calling them a WUSS..

Now I would agree to dis agree that if the closet cder had nothing holding them back, no promises ,no boundries, no threats of loss income .. Yes maybe they shouldn't be crying and step out..

Amanda22

10-11-2010, 07:15 PM

Heather1129

10-11-2010, 07:50 PM

I am happy that you are able to live your life as you choose, I truly am. But comments like this coming from within our own community are uncalled for and hurtful. If you are pissed off that some here don't live up to your standards you don't have to stick around.:Angry3:

Well said, Jenny

Heather

kaitlinrenee

10-11-2010, 07:53 PM

sorry, but i wasn't talking about anyone on here, i was talking about people out in public, with their smart remarks, toward those who crossdress, :)

Samantha B L

10-11-2010, 08:26 PM

When I was 19 and 20 years old I used to go out everyday in satiny tops and stuff like polyester bell bottums. I had hair halfway down my back and it was dyed with a lot of Miss clairol and frost and tip. through shear persistance I figured out how to give myself boofoos,updos,topknots and even beehives! I was doing the best I could. I tried to do makeup but i couldn't get the hang of it and I would end up purging my makeup purchase stash then going out and buying it all over again. And I went out like this all the time. I found that people mostly just ignored me. I got an ocaisional dirty look or smart remark from a redneck type but it wasn't anything to be too concerned with. What happened eventually was that my mother and my brothers and some of my relatives who only lived a block away became so utterly hostile and openly menacing about my dressing that I made a kind of partial retreat and I told them "I quit dressing in drag". that was back around 1976 or 1977. A family freind advised me that my Mom and a couple of other people in my family "will never ever accept it". Yet I continue to dress when I can and of course,I am a member of this forum. I still dress and I NEVER QUIT DRESSING. I plan to look for opportunities to go out dressed in the coming years of my life. Now 80% of the time people aren't that uptight about "guys in drag" you might over hear them remark that they feel sorry for you or they might hurriedly tell their kids don't stare and eat your hamburger. Then you have to be cautious about stuff like rednecks or gangs. But are they at the cosmetic counter or David's Bridal? Probably not. So it's cool yet there is just a little bit of a stigma and just for the time being I dress at home and I don't go out in the suburban area of Minneapolis/St.Paul where I live as long as my Nephew is living at home and going to college. Just in case,and maybe I'm being overly cautious I don't want any kind of whammy coming back on him about his "weird Uncle". At the same time I've gotta say that being dressed in publc isn't as heavy a thing with most people as you might think and it's definately something I would recommend.

kaitlinrenee

10-11-2010, 08:33 PM

i completely agree, there's people in my family that wouldn't agree with my dress style either, :)

Michaela42

10-11-2010, 08:46 PM

I am now 36 years old. In my life I have been spit on, stabbed (2x), beat-up (countless times), electrocuted, burnt, shot at (countless times), been in a half dozen car accidents, suffered 10 broken bones, four major surgaries, called everything under the sun and in numerous languages. . . . "checks" yep, I am still here and breathing. I have told commissioned officers (on up to full admrils) to kiss my A$$. I simply do not care if you like me or not.

So why do I not go out dressed as Makaila? One word.

FAMILY

Like I said, I do not care what you think or do to me, but my family is basically all I really have. Spare me the "real friends will understand" bit. Too many of my family would be negatively affected and so Makaila will remain a bit of a secret. For now.

kaitlinrenee

10-11-2010, 08:55 PM

i go out sometimes like that, but i have to sneak around about it because when i walk out my apartment door, my mom can look right out her back window, and see me, and basicly she would not be supportive of me doing this, if she did know about it, which she doesn't, :)

suchacutie

10-11-2010, 08:58 PM

I am sorry to say that I find this thread a bit depressing. Maybe I always get depressed when I see us casting aspersions, names, and other detritus. People being called a wuss because they have agreements with their spouses? omg. Ok...people who blame their issues on others are not living in a real world. I get that, but is this the way we really want to conduct ourselves? Can we possibly think that this is the kind of support we should be giving to each other?

:(

tina

kaitlinrenee

10-11-2010, 09:02 PM

ok,thank you, :)

Jennifer Girl

10-11-2010, 10:23 PM

As soon as I feel more comfortable with my ability to do my own makeup, I’m going to be going out all the time. As silly as it sounds, for me it’s just a matter of not feeling comfortable with my ability to do my own makeup well. :o

Although, it’s easy for me to feel this way because I’m single and live alone and live thousands of miles away from any of my family and I live in a very accepting city and my friends probably wouldn’t care. If I was married and had children and had family nearby, then I’d probably feel differently.

Sedona

10-11-2010, 10:45 PM

@Makaila, sounds like you're either a former gang member, or an operator. If it's the later, thank you for your service.
@lorileah, I understand the reason to go all Stonewall, but like others have said, you have to respect others' situations and circumstances.

I think that there's the assumption that we are all crazed CDers who constantly "go out" or are scheming on how to "go out." I can't speak for anybody else, but I don't really care much about "going out."

I usually wear girl panties under the guy clothes, and dress up fully maybe a dozen days a year, maybe. Seven of them will come starting this week. I'll take a few vacation days, hit the salon, play dress up around the house, get my jollies (alone and with my wife), and will find I'll get bored with it after five or six days. It's a good thing my desire to dress is fairly low, as it gels with my wife's wishes regarding "going out" (she's generally opposed to it). But, for Halloween this year, she's kind of pushing me to go all out en femme. I might, but there's a cool guy costume I'd be happy to wear as well.

So, to answer the original question, Why Not? Maybe because I don't really care all that much to.

Jorja

10-11-2010, 10:54 PM

kaitlinrenee

10-11-2010, 11:13 PM

i live alone too, except that i live right behind my parents, and would not be accepting of this, if they knew about it, :)

GaleWarning

10-11-2010, 11:50 PM

I have tried to stay out of this ... there are at least three reasons why I don't go out en-femme
1. As a teacher, I know the ministry of education would not understand.
2. Shesa is more nervous than I, and I don't want or need to make her feel uncomfortable.
3. I really don't want to scare the natives!
:D

On a serious note, I have no problem with anyone wearing anything they choose to. I believe we ought to have complete freedom to be able to wear women's clothes without anyone even thinking it strange.
To those who think they are blazing a trail on which I am a mere worthless follower ... you are welcome to your opinion. Don't judge people like me and you will not be judged.

kaitlinrenee

10-11-2010, 11:57 PM

the last part of ypour message, where it says to be able to wear what we want, and not have anyone to lool or think of us as being strange, is all i've been trying to say, :)

Tina B.

10-12-2010, 12:14 AM

I'm in the second camp, and I stay in because I want to! Those that don't want to should go out and have a ball, but for those of us that don't want to for what ever reason, I just don't understand why it bothers people so much?
Tina B.

Michaela42

10-12-2010, 12:50 AM

@Makaila, sounds like you're either a former gang member, or an operator. If it's the later, thank you for your service.

Thanks dear, but I was just a rather unlucky ordinary service member that has very interesting luck ;) and a childhood that bordered on the insane.

Shelly67

10-12-2010, 12:59 AM

I can't think on this question anymore . I do for some strange reason feel guilty . Perhaps this is deep rooted in the fact I haven't come out to the big wide world , told my family just who I really am , then celebrated it all by going on the town dressed up to the nines .
Then again praps its just what I've read .
Personally , I think I've done my most honest basic attribute to crossdressing .
I told my partner .
And thats all that matters .
We live in our comfort zone - our little bubble . the rest is by choice , a gamble of region , understanding , and the possiblity of confrontation we simply do not need .
We are happy as we are .
My wifes read this thread , and commented - isn't the site supposed to be committed to support and understanding ?
She also remarked that she considers theres enough guilt for most crossdressers to deal with as it is ( from her own experience with me ) and that some of the comments she has read of late be selfish .
I think she has a point .

Why not ?

Why bring it up in the first bloody place - it REALLY doesn't matter .

Angela Rose

10-12-2010, 03:56 AM

Sedona

10-12-2010, 08:16 AM

Shelly67, thanks for showing the thread to your wife, and great post.

Thanks dear, but I was just a rather unlucky ordinary service member that has very interesting luck ;) and a childhood that bordered on the insane.

No kidding, glad you made it through!

Jorja

10-12-2010, 10:11 AM

i live alone too, except that i live right behind my parents, and would not be accepting of this, if they knew about it, :)

consider it a lesson learned, don't live within sight of the parents house :D

kaitlinrenee

10-12-2010, 10:23 AM

it is within sight, the apartment is right behind their house, they can look out their back winow and clearly see me, :)

MandyLee

10-12-2010, 10:57 AM

well here is my take for what its worth. I try to all ways look good when I go out just being my male self. when I can look good as mandy I will go out maybe i'm vain about how I look but if I dont look good male or enfemme I dont go out the door.

Abbyru1

10-12-2010, 11:33 AM

I live in a world of my own making. Here inside my own home , no one can say anything to me.
My wife knows but just doesn't want to be part of what I do. My neighbors might not say anything either.I'm not going to give anyone a chance to form an opinion be it right or any
other way.In here ,I can wear what ever I want from ****ty to pretty nice. If I have something on that I like,it doesn't matter to anyone what it is and I don't have to be "accepted" as female or a male in women's clothing. I only have to please myself and I can
do that here in my own world.

I amazed by what some of you do and I will be the first to support what you do. It's great to
be out there and let the world know what you can "get away"with. I am also thrilled that there
so many of you who look fantastic. I couldn't "pass" if it was the only way out of hell. And,
once again,in here,I don't have to.

The last thing I might mention is that a few short years ago, a young gay student attending
college in my state, was tortured and tied to a fence and left to die. I'm not saying that
because I might wear something that society does not accept as male would put me on a
fence somewhere would happen, but when I am dressed in the safty of my own home, I
really don't worry about the freaks out there who would try their best to rid society of something that to them is not "right".

With that in mind, I will remain in the second group.

Jane P

10-12-2010, 01:59 PM

Why not?

I wouldn't want the undesired attention that a beautiful woman or someone who appears to be a beautiful woman receives. I'm not saying that I could even pass , let alone appear beautiful but I would want to look my best.

The problem is men ( I know because I am one) men find beautiful women sexy , as in , would want to have sex with them. I think women (GG's) have this same problem, they would like to dress sexier sometimes maybe but don't want to deal with fighting off the wolves.

It may be flattering in the same way that it might be flattering if a gay man found me attractive in male mode except the gay guy probably isn't going to be freaked out when you say you aren't interested , mostly because he already knew before he approached you that you were a guy.

annecwesley

10-12-2010, 02:27 PM

Hi Nigella

#2 Out of respect for my wife and family.
My wife tolerates Orchid but it's a don't ask///don't tell thinggie you know
My wife is the only person that knows about Orchid other than
the thousands or so on this forum.
So I will be happy here in my little corner of the world
dressing and surfing the Forum.

Orchid

That's where I'm at. The best I manage to do outside is an occasional walk in the woods whee only the squirrils see me. I'm getting bolder though, but still keeping out of public view within a hundred miles of home.

kaitlinrenee

10-12-2010, 02:34 PM

i agree with what you're saying, :)

kimdl93

10-12-2010, 02:41 PM

as I responded to the "greatest" fear thread, the thing that deters me from being fully "out" and in public is the fear of embarrassment. I know I'm not remotely passable and sincerely wish I could be. But we play the cards we're dealt.

kaitlinrenee

10-12-2010, 03:10 PM

i feel the same way, because i wouldn't be passable either, but i wish i could be, :)

RebeccaLynne

10-12-2010, 03:42 PM

Those who wear skirts, dresses etc and stay in their houses etc and hides.

Firstly, I'm not hiding. I don't seek approval, or validation, from the public. I don't need it, and please DO NOT equate my preference for privacy with "hiding". I don't denigrate your choices, they're yours. And I have my own. Respect them, please!

What is really keeping you behind closed doors?

'Cause I choose to enjoy being "en femme" in private...by choice...

Is there really any need to divide us into "camps"?...I think this is greatly polarizing, and does the community no good. To each their own.

Sarah Michelle

10-12-2010, 04:00 PM

I live in a small town so my wife, children and grand-children would be affected by my actions. I'm not prepared to inflict that on them. If I could move and live apart enough that the two worlds didn't collide, I would go out.

DonniDarkness

10-12-2010, 04:14 PM

ShellyMadison78

10-12-2010, 04:36 PM

The main reason I haven't ventured out in public yet is I don't feel I could blend in with the natives yet. I know I can pass (except for my voice maybe), I just don't have the resources yet to complete my feminine side. When the time comes to take that big step, It'll be to a GLBT venue where there are like minded people, it'll also be out of my town, and I'll hopefully will have made some good friends by then and won't take the step alone.
Doing this 24/7 or even half the time, using hormones, or surgeries is something that is not on my table of options and most likely will not be for many years to come....if at all.
Another thing is my wife doesn't approve (don't ask, don't tell policy). She says she needs a man in her life and I provide that to her, also with my daughter who is 1 1/2, I don't want to be seen as a freak or a failure as a daddy to her when she grows up. Shelly is my female alter ego, she is a stress release for me, I didn't choose her, she chose me as I never asked for the thoughts and feelings that I've experienced my whole life. No matter how much I try to suppress her, she comes back stronger then before.
I lead a pretty stressful life with my work....I'm an EMT and I'm in the military (short timer now) between my life experiences growing up, and the "human condition" that I bear witness to everyday and when I'm on a deployment, Shelly is what keeps me cool, calm, and collective, when I dress as her it seems as if my troubles and drama disappear for awhile, she keeps me sane even though I'm still in the closet with her and the world. In time I'll come out using baby steps. Shelly is just as shy as I am, can't rush into it!

Zan Bandalora

10-12-2010, 04:40 PM

I don't care if the world cares how I dress, Its my friends and family that I worry about. Most of them would accept it if I dressed in public (in time), some would not. Losing even just one friend would make it not worth it to me.

I share the same view as above. I also only dress my lower half which leaves me looking like halves of two different people joined at the waist.

Carly D

10-12-2010, 07:56 PM

I went out a couple years ago in a controlled situation and all I can say is it was fantastic, but it was mine.. I would like to come out to everyone and throw caution to the wind and be what I want to be dressed the way I want to etc. etc... But there are two trains of thinking on my part and the one where I come out to everyone puts it as such as I am me doing as I please and screw you if you don't like it I'm free free freeeee ... Right, then there's the thinking that as of right now I have no true desire to be out because as I have said from before as me here not so much as the rookie poster but as the guy (gurl) that was here for a couple or so years that.. hold it.. let me read back and reacquire my point here.. THAT: Being in the closet gives my the.. Affords me the ability to not be out, and still have that exciting bit of a secret that I know and THEY don't.. Which may or might not be true but because I haven't actually told anyone to their face my assumption is they don't know..

Rianna Humble

10-12-2010, 10:47 PM

Why is it no matter how i read this thread i cant help but feel im being judged by my peers for the decisions i have made for myself.

Those of us who wish to be ourselves in our own homes for whatever reason should be safe from ridicule here.

Coming out and calling us cowards is not supportive, this is a support site: act like it.

We also should not have to defend our motivations for being in the closet. PERIOD

I agree with you about the shame of seeing people ridiculed for their position, however, may I put a different aspect of this thread to you that you don't appear to have considered? You have said quite rightly that this is a support site, how are we to support someone's decision to "stay in the closet" if we do not know why they make that choice? Again, how are we to support someone who wants to come out of the closet but feels held back if we do not know why they feel that way?

Lucy_Bella

10-12-2010, 10:55 PM

how are we to support someone who wants to come out of the closet but feels held back if we do not know why they feel that way

I agree and key words are for those who want to come out.. They shouldn't be shamed to come out or pressured , Support is always nice.

vivianann

10-12-2010, 11:11 PM

I am in the first group. I have been out and about since 2006 now, and there is no way I will ever go back to hiding my femme identity, I wish I would have come out years earlier, I have not lost any friends, or family, and if I did, its not my problem. I am much happier now, I enjoy the freedom of dressing whenever I want, peaple have been very understanding, and it seems that peaple in general treat me better.

Christy_M

10-12-2010, 11:41 PM

I have just sat here reading all the posts in this thread. Is it any wonder we are a misunderstood lot? We can't even agree whether or not it is ok to stay in the closet or to go out and about. I am quickly approaching my 50 year anniversary from the time I really started dressing as a CD to now as a TS woman. So many things have changed in that time. Then you would have been shot on site or lynched if you were brave enough to stroll down the street in womans clothing. Now, they hardly bat an eye. Yes, there are the hecklers out there but even they are becoming less and less.
We all have our comfort level and reasons. It is a matter of personal choice as to whether or not we stay in or go out. If you chose to stay in, you are just as much a CD and sister as you are if you chose to go out. To those who have said you stay in out of respect for your SO, I respect and admire you for your devotion to your SO. For those that can't grasp this logic, be on your merry way and go enjoy your time out and about. In the end we are all in the same boat. We love to dress as a woman. :)

Thank you for some sanity in this incredibly polarizing post. This is both well said and greatly appreciated.

I choose to stay in the closet because I don't want people I love to have to deal with the issues surrounding my gender issues. Even if my family and friends accept me, society is a cruel bitch that will put them through the ringer just as much as me. I am a big gurl and can deal with this crap myself but nobody else should have to carry that burden for me.

To call anyone names is immature and counter productive. It doesn't produce any result other than resentment. If we as a community cannot come to grips with each other's position in the gender spectrum, we can never hope the rest of society will ever make that leap. We owe each other mutual respect at the very least and maybe more compassion than what is being weilded around in this post. We are not in high school anymore and shouldn't be stacking up the groups of popular kids and rejects so there are people to point and laugh at.

About being in a war and some watching from the sidelines, wtf does this even have to do with cders in the closet and those who go out? If this is a war, it is being fought in so many closets around the globe they can't even be counted. For those thinking they are on the front lines, you do so by choice but remember, every war has front lines and rear support all on the same team.

Kum bah ya - I'm just sayin' is all

tricia_uktv

10-13-2010, 03:59 AM

I can only comment on the mindset and attitudes of those found in my part of the U.K as it is still not ready to openly accept people who do not conform to what they deem as normal. I am not making excuses for not going out in public but that does have to be balanced with what sort of experience I would encounter.
I could live under the illusion that going out dressed would be great and without problems but the fact remains that it just would not be so. As mentioned by other replies to this thread I have rather too much to lose if I were to be outed in my own town, which is so inward looking and close minded as to defy description, that leaves the alternative of driving 60 to 70 miles to the nearest major connabation to spend a couple of hours of out and about freedom, which would still be laden with all the risks of been pilloried by the close minded members of society....I guess that we are just a few years behind our cousins over there in the U.S.A

Not sure I agree completely Calam but I think you are more than safe in the big Cities. I've been out dressed in London, Manchester, Sheffield Leeds and Liverpool and had a great time with no problems. I think if girls trully want to go out they will. Remember there are gay bars and transgender friendly places where you can practice before taking the big step of going out in open society. I would recommend any girl that can get out ther does so. Its such fun!

Emma England

10-13-2010, 08:32 AM

I can only comment on the mindset and attitudes of those found in my part of the U.K as it is still not ready to openly accept people who do not conform to what they deem as normal. I am not making excuses for not going out in public but that does have to be balanced with what sort of experience I would encounter.
I could live under the illusion that going out dressed would be great and without problems but the fact remains that it just would not be so. As mentioned by other replies to this thread I have rather too much to lose if I were to be outed in my own town, which is so inward looking and close minded as to defy description, that leaves the alternative of driving 60 to 70 miles to the nearest major connabation to spend a couple of hours of out and about freedom, which would still be laden with all the risks of been pilloried by the close minded members of society....I guess that we are just a few years behind our cousins over there in the U.S.A

Your location states South West, UK.

This is where I live also, I have been out publically with no problems.

For all those saying that they choose to stay in, there is no problem with that - the op was just wondering why that's all.

Sandra

10-13-2010, 08:38 AM

Why do some of you seem to be getting upset over the question asked? All that is being asked is why. No judgement has been made by the OP.

Nigella

10-13-2010, 12:48 PM

I see that a few of the respondees have got a bee in their bonnet with this thread. I certainly don't believe that I have been judgemental in either of my posts, indeed I respect each and everyone who makes a choice. That choice is based upon circumstances that are unique to the individual making the choice.

I was in the closet, as I assume were 99.9% of the membership, for my own personal reasons. Circumstances enabled me to come out of the closet and live as I do now. Due to this I will never presume to tell anyone that they should do this or that.

If you are happy with what you as an individual choose to do, good for you. The only adverse comment I would make is that you make the choice, so you must live with the consequences, as others have said, don't blame others because of what you choose to do!!

Jane P

10-13-2010, 03:39 PM

While there seems to be concern that a discussion like this can be polarizing , one can not deny that it is also thought provoking. It causes us all to search for answers within ourselves.

As we have seen there can be many reasons or excuses to do or not to do anything. Here is another one. There are a lot of things that can bring us down in this world , for some, the simple act of dressing can bring us a little escape from the big bad world outside. A brief vacation from everything real that is wrong in our lives . If we were to go out into the big bad world like this we run the risk of losing that safe haven as well.

In the words of Billy Joel ," It's just a fantasy , it's not the real thing. But sometimes a fantasy is all we need."

I admit I am a crossdresser and even if I never wear clothes that are classified as that of a woman again, wherever I go , whatever I do , I carry that with me.

FroboMay

10-13-2010, 03:58 PM

I dont go out dressed because I just dont feel a desire to. I have all the privacy in the world up in my bedroom, and most of my dressing is about a more inward experience. "What would it be like if I were a girl.." "How does it feel to be a female" Those questions that drive me to dress are all asked around a personal perspective, be a female when she's alone with herself, the intimacies of it... not a female out in public. I dress and admire myself, and what I would look and feel like if I were a girl, and sometimes that leads to other things, but I dont think that should be covered here :p. I also actually like my life as a male, I like being physically strong and hard-bodied, I like my role in sexual experiences, and I like the image of being strong and whatnot. Im just very curious about what it's like on the other side, having a soft body that bounces in places, being able to squeeze and caress, having all the sensuous and wonderful curves of the female form. There's a lot of pretending involved for me. I have a very deep desire to experience myself... myself as a female. I dont need to go out for any of that. I think that's the best way I can describe my feelings on it.. so that's why I dont go out while dressed.

While there seems to be concern that a discussion like this can be polarizing , one can not deny that it is also thought provoking. It causes us all to search for answers within ourselves.

As we have seen there can be many reasons or excuses to do or not to do anything. Here is another one. There are a lot of things that can bring us down in this world , for some, the simple act of dressing can bring us a little escape from the big bad world outside. A brief vacation from everything real that is wrong in our lives . If we were to go out into the big bad world like this we run the risk of losing that safe haven as well.

In the words of Billy Joel ," It's just a fantasy , it's not the real thing. But sometimes a fantasy is all we need."

I admit I am a crossdresser and even if I never wear clothes that are classified as that of a woman again, wherever I go , whatever I do , I carry that with me.

I really love Billy Joel, and I really love the thought that you put down here. Dressing could be just a short little vacation from the stresses or harshness of the world. It could be like being a kid playing pretend again, or as serious as having the releif of spending some time with what you feel is your "true" self. It doesnt have to be something so passionate or intense as to feel some obligation to reveal it to the world. There are some comforts in the private little things that you have all to yourself. And no matter if I never wear another piece of feminine clothing again, I'll forever be a crossdresser because it was a real part of my life, and you cant remove that part of yourself.. and neither can anyone else.

RebeccaLynne

10-13-2010, 04:13 PM

:)
Why do some of you seem to be getting upset over the question asked? All that is being asked is why. No judgement has been made by the OP.

We have two camps on this forum,

Those who wear skirts, dresses etc and leave their houses etc and let the world see them.

Those who wear skirts, dresses etc and stay in their houses etc and hides.

I've taken issue with the OP's presumption that there are two distinct and separate categories of CD'ing, and that just isn't so. We've a wide variety of expectations and expressions, and all are acceptable. As Red Green says, " We're all in this together".

And let's not fail to recall Rodney King's words of wisdom: "Can't we all just get along?".

Peace and harmony in all things important to us all.:)

AndreaS

10-13-2010, 04:16 PM

To each his own. I won't look down on anyone who makes a choice based on their personal needs. I enjoy going out in public myself, but I can certainly see where others would feel uncomfortable based on there own situations.

Emma Leigh

10-13-2010, 04:39 PM

Earlier in this thread someone refered to myself and others in the closet as a wuss, so in response I went to the doctors today wearing my bra and forms (under a extremely baggy sweater, I might add), does that count???

msginaadoll

10-13-2010, 05:18 PM

There are a lot of reasons not to go out in public. A big one is being seen by someone you know. Another one is that you will get laughed at or worse harrassed. I know there are others including you really dont feel the need to get out, etc. The first two are real concerns for many. Some people have a lot to lose if there found out. Others may stand ot more in public than some. In the end we are all different. Just my 2 cents.

Lucy_Bella

10-13-2010, 08:09 PM

Why do some of you seem to be getting upset over the question asked? All that is being asked is why. No judgement has been made by the OP.

Is not upset with the OP at all...She asked a very valid question and it was aimed to the direction of support for those in the closet not badgering them .. A few did badger and thats where the mis understanding is comeing from.. There can be two camps ,I understand that clearly. I also respect and admire those who choose to venture beyond the closet.

So why not allow those to stay , envoy the fact that there are some who go and leave it at that. If you are one of those who do get out ...Great I am happy for you but I am not a " Trail Blazing " admirer. . I too just as many others can go out but choose to remain in for various reasons that are NOT and Do NOT pertain to allowing others to do the foot work for us ... Why is that so hard to understand for some ( not everyone ) Peace and thanks again Nigella it started as a nice thread I understood where you where going with it..

Christy_M

10-13-2010, 10:20 PM

I agree that the OP was not offensive. Intolerance of others is always offensive. It is more hurtful here where I mistakenly assumed we are supposed to have more similarities than differences. It is very clear that people are people regardless of similarities and there will always be those who try to wield some form of supremacy over others regardless of how much they know or care to know about each other. Bee in the bonnet, I guess I am guilty as charged. Respect me if for no other reason, there isn't enough information not to. Once you can make an informed decision about me, I don't care if you respect me or not but I am on the same earth as you trying to figure out God's plan for me. Maybe some have already figured that out but the least one can do is support and offer guidance to others who haven't instead of making them feel inferior for not following the same path. To me that is self righteous BS that gets under my skin. IMO it gets under other people's skin, too.

I'm just sayin' is all.

Danni Bear

10-13-2010, 10:58 PM

Nigella,

I agree that that there are two camps on here. They are not mutally exclusive ones either. Many who go out and about do so far from home for many of the same reasons that others stay in the closet. There is nothing wrong in this, anyone who thinks so is so very wrong. I might not be the best example in this as I've been presenting female most of my life until transitioning. Although I do understand the need most feel about hiding their crossdressing from the world. That need is not there for some and needs approval,the same as those who have it need approval. We are all a part of a bigger thing than just ourselves. The need and desire to dress or present feminine is strong in all of us. How and where we do this is a personal choice that needs no explaining to anybody. How sad is it that we argue about trivial matters, there are so many better ways to use our time.

Danni

Shelly67

10-14-2010, 01:14 AM

Meh .

10-14-2010, 01:28 AM

Losing even just one friend would make it not worth it to me.I never understood that line of thinking. If you lost a friend over something that is part of you, were they really your friend? And more importantly, why would you want to be friends with someone who would reject you for what you are?

Shelly67

10-14-2010, 01:56 AM

I think as of now even with all best intentions , this thread will develope into a deeper realm . Just as there has been in the past so many troublesome stressed remarks and individuals on why they as crossdressers should kiss and tell , could it now develope with the same vigour into those who stride or hide ? crossdressers in part ALL hide a smattering of guilt .
Only time will tell .

Jamie001

10-14-2010, 02:12 AM

I couldn't have said it better.

I never understood that line of thinking. If you lost a friend over something that is part of you, were they really your friend? And more importantly, why would you want to be friends with someone who would reject you for what you are?

Jocelyn Quivers

10-14-2010, 08:37 AM

I never understood that line of thinking. If you lost a friend over something that is part of you, were they really your friend? And more importantly, why would you want to be friends with someone who would reject you for what you are?

I'll try and respectfully explain it, because I'm basically in the same situation. My male side is currently going through a phase wear he is losing most of his friends. This is due to things and actions that he has done. After awhile the isolation of losing contact with people who are very important to you starts to take a tole. Yes I am very blessed to have an understanding wife who in many ways is my best friend, but the male side of me is starting to miss losing a contact with the people and friends that he has made througout his life.

There are friends that I have known for my entire life and do not want to risk losing because of this side of me, because especially at this point in my life my male side needs what few friends he has not managed to allientate or lose contact with. My friends have been there for me during very rough turbulent times in my life. In many ways their friendship makes as much a part of who I am as "this" side of me. I have to be very realistic and realize that they might not accept their "boy" or "braugh" being a cross dresser.

NewDresser

10-14-2010, 10:16 AM

I never understood that line of thinking. If you lost a friend over something that is part of you, were they really your friend? And more importantly, why would you want to be friends with someone who would reject you for what you are?

Nobody is perfect. Intolerance is definitely not a trait I look for when choosing friends but it is not their only trait, for the most part they are still good people. If I were to judge them based on that one flaw I wouldn't be that much different than them.

t-girlxsophie

10-14-2010, 12:51 PM

I go out dressed as much as i can,but i wont go out Locally In case i get spotted by family/friends so i can understand fully those that choose to stay at home,I really dont know how some cant appreciate that.the only problem I have is that it can turn into a military operation before Sophie finally gets out,but does it stop me HELL NO! Those that hate us arent exactly,pillars of society AFAIC and I wont let those kind of people stop me,I dont believe any right minded person would have a problem with The TG Community,that thought kinda spurs me on as well

:hugs:Sophie

Michaela42

10-14-2010, 01:58 PM

Why do some of you seem to be getting upset over the question asked? All that is being asked is why. No judgement has been made by the OP.

Yes, my post was a bit snarky and I appologize. Let's just chalk it up to a bad day. That being said many people on the forum may not have the means (in whatever way) to go out. That dose not make their desires or wishes any less real because they can't.

And in all honesty to Nigella (and all of the posters on this topic) you have got me thinking about the subject again. Consider this your warning to head for shelter ;) but maybe, just maybe, it is time for Makaila to explore more of this world :)

/thanks all, I really did not mean to sound so b!tchy in my first post.

Sandra

10-14-2010, 02:33 PM

Yes, my post was a bit snarky and I appologize. Let's just chalk it up to a bad day. That being said many people on the forum may not have the means (in whatever way) to go out. That dose not make their desires or wishes any less real because they can't.

I totally agree with you, everyone has their own desires/wishes and people should respect them.

QUOTE=Makaila;2291652]
Consider this your warning to head for shelter ;) but maybe, just maybe, it is time for Makaila to explore more of this world :)

[/QUOTE]

It's not really so bad, I hope if/when it happens you do enjoy it :)

JohnH

10-14-2010, 03:04 PM

I never understood that line of thinking. If you lost a friend over something that is part of you, were they really your friend? And more importantly, why would you want to be friends with someone who would reject you for what you are?

I have had that kind of experience. I had to write that intolerant person off. That person rejected me simply because I was wearing an above-the-knee denim skirt with a man's shirt and man's pair of sandals. Now on the other hand, I have found that if a person tolerates the skirt I can wear a full-blown dress annd be accepted.

I do wear my feminine clothes publicly and make no attempt to pass as a women. So I see it as a violation of the really narrow conventions of dress conventions imposed upon men rather than a gender issue.

I have thought of wearing a black velvet dress (see the avatar) with black sheer pantyhose and heels to a formal occasion such as a symphony concert.
To make it appear a little less feminine I would have my fingernails painted dark gray and use dark red lipstick, while makeing the rest of the makeup subtle and continue to move and speak as a man.

Nobody is perfect. Intolerance is definitely not a trait I look for when choosing friends but it is not their only trait, for the most part they are still good people. If I were to judge them based on that one flaw I wouldn't be that much different than them.

The person who rejected me when I was wearing an above the knee denim skirt with otherwise male clothing (shirt and sandals) came out on the driveway when I dared walk on his driveway and yelled for the neighborhood to hear something llike "F**cking pervert - wearing a dress. If you ever show up on my driveway wearing a dress, I will beat your a$$". I don't need "friends" like that.