My New Appointment - I/TG/TS Community Education

[Melody Moore]

Hi everyone,

I am just writing to tell you about a new appointment I have just received with QAHC (http://www.qahc.org.au/transgender) here in Cairns as a volunteer staff member. The focus of my work will be in Transgender Community Education. In this role I will be partaking in training seminars & a wide range of Community Education programs into Intersex/Transgender/Transsexual issues.

Part of my work will be to write & publish a one page article or series of articles in the Culture Magazine, a bi-monthly publication for the
GLBTI community in my regional area, which I will also use as well as to promote my local transgender social group in the Cairns community.

I am thinking of titling my editorial in the magazine...
THE THIRD GENDER
AN IN-DEPTH LOOK AT INTERSEX, TRANSGENDER & TRANSSEXUAL ISSUES

What do you think guys? I am open also to any suggestions you might have for a name for my editorial.

I am really happy & excited about this appointment as it will give me something very positive to do for our cause in my local community,
as well as it will be my springboard to get me back into the workforce after quite a few years of being on Disability support due to
anxiety & depression. I would particularly welcome any opportunity to work in this field on a full-time professional basis in the future.

[Stephanie Anne]

I do not like the title. The third gender signifies a new finite gender classification in addition to the binary. I think the best method for education is to try and not define gender of the trans community into a limited scope of existing categories. Doing so simply perpetuates the current knowledge of non trans people and diminishes the transitive nature of our issues.


Your title simply gives CIS people the ability to whittle down our concerns into bite sized morsels and place a wrapper around us that conforms to their defined restrictions.

If anything, your title needs to exemplify the fact that transgender is not binary and not limited by traditional beliefs.

It should read along the lines of "demystifying gender" or "gender unbound".

Also, why are you trying to isolate intersex from transgender and transsexual? We are trying to consolidate definitions so they are standard across "the board" and unified in our support for each other.

Transgender is the umbrella term for everything from cross dressing to gender queer to transsexuals. Intersex is a medical condition that is also under the blanket of transgender and is often involved in a transitional sexual correction. Thus, it should be considered transsexual from and educational standpoint.

I believe it would be more educational to simply announced transgendered issues. Defining the difference within transgender can be done on an article by article basis but should not be segregated like you have it less people assume one is better or worse than the other.

In short, the title and bi-line is confusing to those who are unfamiliar with our community.

[Melody Moore]

I do not like the title..

Also, why are you trying to isolate intersex from transgender and transsexual? We are trying to consolidate definitions so they are standard across "the board" and unified in our support for each other.

Transgender is the umbrella term for everything from cross dressing to gender queer to transsexuals. Intersex is a medical condition that is also under the blanket of transgender and is often involved in a transitional sexual correction. Thus, it should be considered transsexual from and educational standpoint.
That is exactly why I'm asking for ideas & feedback - I am far from stupid on these issues, I am fully aware that transgender is an umbrella term
that encompasses gender diversity, INCLUDING the cross-dressing community which many intersexuals & transsexuals often do not identify with
and they often get upset & don't identify which each other. So it's like you're damned if you do & damned if you don't separate these groups.

As for titling per article, my editorial might encompass multiple articles on the one page so I am
looking for a sectional type title for this publication. Also see what the meaning of Third Gender
is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_gender & why I thought of this as an appropriate name.

QAHC has already adopted the Two Spirit title (http://www.qahc.org.au/atsi) from North American Indian Culture for their Educational program for Aboriginal
& Torres Strait Islander Brotherboys & Sistergirls. I also wanted to focus on some of the historical & cultural aspects with being
Transgendered. I though that 'Third Gender' was more of a historical umbrella terminology just as Transgender is today.


The terms third gender and third sex describe individuals who are categorised (by their will or by social consensus) as neither male nor female, as well as the social category present in those societies who recognise three or more genders. The term "third" is usually understood to mean "other"; some anthropologists and sociologists have described fourth, fifth,and even some genders.

Although biology determines genetically whether a human being is male or female (on the basis of the XX or XY chromosomes), the state of being neither male nor female is sometimes considered in relation to the individual's gender role in society, gender identity, sexual orientation or any other characteristic. To different cultures or individuals, a third sex or gender may represent an intermediate state between men and women, a state of being both (such as "the spirit of a man in the body of a woman"), the state of being neither (neuter), the ability to cross or swap genders, another category altogether independent of male and female. This last definition is favoured by those who argue for a strict interpretation of the "third gender" concept. In any case, all of these characterisations are defining sex in a different way of the usual meaning that biology gives to living beings.

The term has been used to describe Hijras of India, Bangladesh and Pakistan who have gained legal identity, Fa'afafine of Polynesia, and Sworn virgins of the Balkans, among others, and is also used by many of such groups and individuals to describe themselves.

Like the Hijra, the third gender is in many cultures made up of biological males who take on a feminine gender or sexual role. In cultures that have not undergone heterosexualization, they are usually seen as acceptable sexual partners for the "masculine" males as long as these latter always maintain the "active" role.
I will take your suggestions of Demystifying Gender & Gender Unbound and put it to poll later,
but I just wanted to point out my line of thinking to work in with what is already in place with QAHC.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

I'm not a third gender...

if the outcome of the next 100 years of advocacy is that TS people end up being looked at as a 3rd gender..i think that would be a bad outcome ..

perhaps some ts and intersex people feel mixed about their gender identity...and perhaps some people have a mixed gender identity..but to me...i'm like cis person to a trans person on that issue...i can comprehend that a person wouldnt have an internal gender identity, or have a 3rd identity different from mine, but it doesnt compute with me...it's not me..i'm supportive of people that feel that way, but i don't want that to define me...

i think 3rd gender is a terrible way to describe the trans community as a whole..

[Jorja]

I agree Kaitlyn Michele, I think you will find that your gender identities will meld into one another once you are the way you believe you should be. You will become cis gender for all intense and purposes. Only you and thoes few that are really close will know. To describe the Trans community as Third Gender just leaves a terrible void to me (male,female and it?) and that is by far not what I have experienced over the years.

[Teri Jean]

Personally I love it and thank you for your efforts. We all do what we can and with what we have. You will do fine. Hugs Teri

[Traci Elizabeth]

I'm not a third gender...

if the outcome of the next 100 years of advocacy is that TS people end up being looked at as a 3rd gender..i think that would be a bad outcome ..

perhaps some ts and intersex people feel mixed about their gender identity...and perhaps some people have a mixed gender identity..but to me...i'm like cis person to a trans person on that issue...i can comprehend that a person wouldnt have an internal gender identity, or have a 3rd identity different from mine, but it doesnt compute with me...it's not me..i'm supportive of people that feel that way, but i don't want that to define me...

i think 3rd gender is a terrible way to describe the trans community as a whole..


I'm not a THIRD gender either. I am all WOMAN!

[pamela_a]

:iagree:

I agree with Kaitlyn, Jorga and Tracy. I'm NOT a third gender, I'm female. I may have a horrible birth defect but I AM A WOMAN.

I do applaud you on your goals. It's not an easy thing to try to explain this to anyone and it doesn't help that the Transgender label encompasses so much. I do like the idea of several segments each highlighting a different "aspect" of the transgender label.
I wish you well on this endeavor.

[Melody Moore]

I know exactly where you are coming from girls, I feel the same, however
my role will be to write about all transgender issues & gender diversity.

None of you have offered any suggestions for a title or other constructive feedback which is something I was really hoping for. :(

Can we leave any 'personal feelings or opinions' out of this please?

The topics I will be reporting on will include a wide range of transgender related subjected including
intersexuality, androgyny & both male to female & female to male transsexuality, cross-dressing etc.

[pamela_a]

Title? Of course you caught me in one of my less creative modes. I understand the difficulty of this because it encompasses a number of similar but still unrelated areas. Does it require a single title for the entire piece or can you title them specifically as you write them?

[Melody Moore]

Does it require a single title for the entire piece or can you title them specifically as you write them?
I am looking for a sectional title for my editorial because I might run multiple
articles in each edition touching on various topics relating to transgender issues.

At the moment I have about a week until the deadline for my first publication to decide on the Title.

PS: I am thinking of launching this new section by the way by focusing on some
of the historical aspects of the 3rd Gender throughout the history of mankind (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_gender).

Also in addition to this, I have been invited last night to be a speaker at seminars for
PFLAG (Parents and Friends of Lesbians And Gays) (http://www.pflagaustralia.org.au/) to educate the community about
cultural, historical & biological aspects behind sexual orientation & gender diversity.

I really feel like for the first time ever I am starting to do something really positive with my life :)

[Kelly DeWinter]

Kaitlyn, I could'nt agree with you more. It appears the the direction of the articles and the opinions of columnist has already been decided. Mayby the title of the column should be "My Opinion". I'm not sure how this endevor will unite the TG community.

[Mahoro]

Melody,
Congratulations on your appointment, what a great opportunity for you to contribute to a greater understanding of our community, in all it's aspects!

The title does seem to imply trying to assign a single label to a large and varied group of quite unique and different situations (although I don't think that was really your intent), and you already know how most of us feel about labels, LOL.

I think the suggestion of 'Gender Unbound' is quite nice however, and it suggests that the information to follow will be informative, and free of the stereotyping attitudes that most of us want to steer away from.

Best Wishes with your new endeavor!

[juno]

What about a title something like "The Gender Continuum"? Gender is sort of like height; there are tall people and short people, but you would not call average-height people "the 3rd height". Actually, gender is more like body sizes. There is height, but also a hundred other measurements related to body size.

I think that "straight" people are more accepting of homosexuals than transgender is because thinking in simple categories give the sense of a distinct division between them and homosexuals. When people realize that gender is not a binary issue, they have to grasp that there is no magic cutoff to distinguish them from other gender variations. It is all a continuum. People have to realize that there is no such thing as 100% male or female. That is the fact that society has to accept before transgender will be accepted as a normal part of human diversity.

P.S. My opinion is that we should drop the GLBTIQA and other variants and just say "Gender Diversity". That solves the argument as to whether L or G comes first, and we will never have to add still more letters whenever someone feels that their sub-class is left out.

[Melody Moore]

I'm not sure how this endeavour will unite the TG community.
Many transsexual feel they don't fit with the cross-dressing community and some identify more with the intersexed community
however the intersexed community also takes some offence to that. Some are androgynous and accept the male & female aspects
and have no interest in transitioning to identify with a sole gender. So because of this there is nothing in my agenda about to trying
to unite the TG community, everyone has different feelings about this issue and that is something I am doing my best to respect here.


My opinion is that we should drop the GLBTIQA and other variants and just say "Gender Diversity". That solves the argument as to
whether L or G comes first, and we will never have to add still more letters whenever someone feels that their sub-class is left out.
I agree that while most of us don't like labels because of the misuse of labels, the greater majority of gender
diverse people will adopt some type of label around where they fit into the gender spectrum. So based on this
fact I really do like your suggestion of 'Gender Diversity' or the earlier suggestion of 'Gender Unbound'.

[Danni Bear]

Melody,

a title that might work for you is

EGWAKWEG
Gender diversity in society and its ramifications

which as you know is an Obijwe word denoting gender diversity and roles in society.

Danni

[Kathryn Martin]

The problem is that GLB is something different than TI which is different from QA. What brackets all of those is the overcoming of disdain and discrimination, and conversely recognition and acceptance by society.

What I understand Melody is doing is clearly only related to Gender issues. Any Gender Diversity or Gender Unbound name however encompass more than Transgender, Transsexual and Intersex and includes the binary genders as well. So this is a tricky one and I think needs a lot of thought. The Gender Diversity label deals among other things with sexism of all forms. Ahhm confoosed

[Kelly DeWinter]

[QUOTE=MelodyN;2346367]Many transsexual feel they don't fit with the cross-dressing community and some identify more with the intersexed community
however the intersexed community also takes some offence to that. Some are androgynous and accept the male & female aspects
and have no interest in transitioning to identify with a sole gender. So because of this there is nothing in my agenda about to trying
to unite the TG community, everyone has different feelings about this issue and that is something I am doing my best to respect here.
QUOTE]

yes, you say this in just about every thread, and the concern is as allways the quality of the information being put out, to say "Many" without properly surveying the community as a whole makes one wonder if the "Many" is localized within a small one block area of Cairms Australia.

[Melody Moore]

Right on Kathryn! :thumbsup:

Although I should mention that some of my articles will discuss sexual orientation and gender identity related matters and will also show some parallels between the GLB & the TG/TS/I/Q/A communities, but I am not wanting to put anyone in a particular pigeon hole. So this is exactly why I am looking for feedback here to come up with the correct type of sectional title for a cultural magazine that is already predominately saturated with GLB issues and not much else. Its very confusing when you have so many gender & sexually diverse people to please. :confused:


yes, you say this in just about every thread, and the concern is as allways the quality of the information being put out, to say "Many" without properly surveying the community as a whole makes one wonder if the "Many" is localized within a small one block area of Cairms Australia.
Wrong... Dont make assumptions about things that you clearly don't understand,
I am involved in a number of networks apart from this one & my local TS Social group.

You only know me through crossdressers.com, but Im an active member of the Australian Transsexual Support Network,
The Canberra Transgender Network, QAHC, and a committee member of Out! Cairns a subsidiary organisation of QAHC
which organises events that promotes GLBTI education throughout my regional area where I have been following these
types of debates for quite sometime. Also in addition to this, I have been invited last night while at the QAHC Xmas party
to be a speaker at seminars for PFLAG (Parents and Friends of Lesbians And Gays) (http://www.pflagaustralia.org.au/) to educate the community about cultural,
historical & biological aspects behind sexual orientation & gender diversity. I have also been collecting submissions from others
in the Australian I/TG/TS/Q/A community to present to a Federal member of the Australian Government with regards changes
to our public health care system & Anti-discrimination laws. I am considered by many others to be an effective voice & a mover
& shaker despite your own personal feelings about me which I would rather you left of out this thread. So if you don't mind.


a title that might work for you is

EGWAKWEG
Gender diversity in society and its ramifications
which as you know is an Obijwe word denoting gender diversity and roles in society.[/SIZE]


Thanks Danni, but despite the fact I know the term, most other Australians don't and QAHC have already adopted Two-Spirits (http://www.qahc.org.au/atsi) the
translation of Niizh manidoowag (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-Spirit) for the name of a program aimed at the Australian Aboriginal & Torres Strait Islander communities.

So I am looking for a title in my publication that will be more widely recognised & better received by the greater community.

[Danni Bear]

[QUOTE=MelodyN;2346367]Many transsexual feel they don't fit with the cross-dressing community and some identify more with the intersexed community
however the intersexed community also takes some offence to that. Some are androgynous and accept the male & female aspects
and have no interest in transitioning to identify with a sole gender. So because of this there is nothing in my agenda about to trying
to unite the TG community, everyone has different feelings about this issue and that is something I am doing my best to respect here.
QUOTE]

yes, you say this in just about every thread, and the concern is as allways the quality of the information being put out, to say "Many" without properly surveying the community as a whole makes one wonder if the "Many" is localized within a small one block area of Cairms Australia.

Kelly,

I know you and Melody have had your differences in the past. This is a new day, let it go and try to help her put out something for all to learn from and profit by. This can be something that can benefit us all in the future and in the way society views all who fall under the transgender umbrella.

Danni

[7sisters]

I have brainstormed with myself!

Some conservative suggestions:
The Gender Debate.
Genderology
Gendermatrix

Some Creative suggestions:
GenderBlender
The G Spot (somehow I am partial to this!)

[Danni Bear]

I have brainstormed with myself!

Some conservative suggestions:
The Gender Debate.
Genderology
Gendermatrix

Some Creative suggestions:
GenderBlender
The G Spot (somehow I am partial to this!)

Somehow that does not come as a surprise 7sisters. A lot of us are partial to that phrase.:tongueout

:hugs:
Danni

[juno]

OK, maybe just "gender diversity" is too broad, because the idea is to cover intermediate physical or mental genders. Even that group is difficult to categorize, because some people may be a mix of male and female, and some can be mostly in the middle. The word "androgeny" includes definitions that match both forms. Of course, there are people that don't like that word either. There is no way to make everyone happy. When you try to please everyone, you just get stuck in the can't-do-anything realm of political correctness.

I know that many Intersex and Trangender groups discourage the idea of a 3rd gender, so I would work to find something else that works.

How about "Intermediate Genders", where the plural "genders" implies that it is not just a single type.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Kelly,

I know you and Melody have had your differences in the past. This is a new day, let it go and try to help her put out something for all to learn from and profit by. This can be something that can benefit us all in the future and in the way society views all who fall under the transgender umbrella.

Danni

Altho there is no doubt that sometimes conversations get personal sometimes, all i can say about that is that we should stop being such babies...every time some people are challenged they either complain that their life was tough, giving us a laundry list of links and organizations, and blathers about fetishistic crossdressers... i read ever post on this forum for years, and i have never seen a more divisive person.. This person's views are quite often not representative of the broader group ..

Paragraph removed

[Sharon]

Let's get back to the thread topic and stop the personal, and inane, bickering, shall we? We all have our opinions, frequently diametric to an extreme, but there are ways to disagree without getting nasty.

Posts have already been removed and edited in this thread and, as I am lazy beyond description, I wish to not have to do it again.

[Stephanie Anne]

My opinion is keep out gender and sex from the discussion. OH my gawd what else is there Steph?!? Well you claim to want to take on the daunting task of educating GLB members on the similarities of the trans struggle.

Most people have very solid opinions on what gender is and what sex is. The key is to tie in how our transitive nature is similar to the Gay and Lesbian movement.

You obviously want to refrain from a title that an english lit major would find ostentatious so it must be simple yet revealing while avoiding being smarter than the reader base.

Many of us obvious object to being pigeon holed as the third gender and fear the title will give the wrong impression. Trying to explain the difficult and subtle aspects of the different classifications within transgender could overwhelm your readers. Most people do not care that someone is intersexed while another is transsexed and yet another is omnisexual.

Since sex has nothing to do with gender and transsex/intersex, I would ask to avoid discussing that. I know it may be a bridge to homosexuality / pansexuality but it is something that needs to be either explained in detail or avoided.


Here are my ideas

Gender Divide
[The] Gender Frontier
Transgender 101 (I do hope you Australians have an understanding of the 101 and basic education reference)
Exploring Gender

[Melody Moore]

Thanks Stephanie, on the subject of Gender & Sex, I have been taking good stock on these types of issues lately - especially when I was researching my topic of discussion about EDCs in the environment and read the following editorial comment on OII (Intersexed in Australia) website - http://oiiaustralia.com/10694/waterworld-water-contaminant-studied-regulated-epa/


AND here we go again. Animals do not have a gender – they have a sex. Gender is man and woman – sex is male and female. There is no such thing as men fish and women fish or lady fish and gentlemen fish. The same applies to all other members of the animal kingdom except for human beings.

The word intersex does not require quotation marks around it thus – “intersex”. Simply writing it as intersex will do – intersex is a real word, folks, so no need to be frightened or suspicious of it.

Conversely, intersexed is not a real word and so it is appropriate to render it as “intersexed”. “Intersexed” is a phony verb masquerading as an adjective. Nobody “intersexed” intersex people – we are born this way.
As you can see what you publish in this type of editorial is like a proverbial minefield of political correctness gone mad!

[Melody Moore]

Hi everyone.

As I told you I was going to be writing for a regional LGBT magazine on gender issues. Usually each edition of the
magazine I now write for is published in .PDF format at http://www.qahc.org.au/newsletters/culture. However my
first article which introduced me to the local LGBT community appeared in the Jan-Feb 2011 edition which went to
print at the time, however I have no clue as to why the .PDF version of this edition wasn't ever published online.

So please accept my humble apologies for not being able to present this to you right now.

The good news is though my second article on Transgender History & Culture has just been released
so you can read it on page 27 here (http://www.qahc.org.au/files/shared/Culture_MarchApril__2011__in_a_table_-_Copy_-_Copy.pdf). You will have to excuse the poor quality of the .PDF file for this
latest edition, but I will be talking to those who produced this latest edition soon about improving the
quality for future editions. In my next article which will appear in the May-June 2011 edition I will focus
on the the biological causes of gender identity disorders such as transsexualism & sexual orientation.

I will keep you updated when it is released.

[Leanne2]

Danni Bear had it correct except just use the English version; "Gender Diversity and Roles in Society." Leanne