Wife concerned about upcoming "date"

[Karen Johnson]

I recently posted a thread about how excited I was to have a "dress-up" date with a fellow tranny. A friend recently "came out" to my wife and I about being a transvestite, not knowing that I was one as well. The friend now knows all about me and we've decided to have a "dress-up" date where I go to "her" house, we get all dolled up and head out to a tg friendly coffee house to sit and chat.

The wife will not be there so it will just be the two or us gurls. However, the wife does have some concerns about the whole thing.

One concern is that even though our friend has told us that he's not attracted to men, I'm bi and the wife is concerned that something might "happen". A legitimate concern but she trusts me and has left the decision of whether or not to go up to me. We've set the date for this Wednesday and at this point I'm very much looking forward to going. I am faithful to my wife but do appreciate the situation I'm putting myself in. I will be careful not to let anything get started.

Another concern is that if we go out we might get hurt emotionally or physically, that we might get "made" and be subject to ridicule or maybe even a physical attack. Another legitimate concern.

[DAVIDA]

Karen, you might want to stop calling it a "date".

[Vickie_CDTV]

Why doesn't your wife go with you? That way she knows everything is kosher.

Your friend probably is perfectly straight. But if there is any real cause to worry about you staying faithful to your wife, I wouldn't even go there (without your wife at least.)

[Pinky188]

I have a question Karen. To me, to concider ones self bi-sexual, would mean that you act on that. Do you and your wife have an "open" marriage? If your married to a moman, and are monogamous, you shouldnt call yourself bi-sexual any more. It may insult her!! Just something to think about!!!

[BRANDYJ]

I know me, if in the same situation and my SO had concerns, I'd back out. I wonder why you don't just invite this friend over to your home and include your wife in the visit. There is no way I want to cause her concern or wonder and worry, In fact I had a non-CD event I wanted to go to and she expressed some concern so I changed my mind about going. I guess it depends on just how concerned your wife is and if this will cause her stress.

[Julogden]

Like Brandy said, take your wife's concerns very seriously, she's more important. Get her involved and quit calling it a "date", as Davida suggested. "Date" has at least a bit of romantic implications.:2c:

Carol

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

I agree with everyone here about being more sensitive to your wife's concerns. It sounds like she is very supportive of your dressing so why do something that you know could make her second guess that? I think having your friend come to your place for the dressup session is the best call so that all of that part seems on the up and up. Your wife would probably be more ok with you two going out to the coffee shop without her if you want it to be a "tgirls only" thing if she knows the getting dressed up part is on the up and up.

[linda allen]

I have a question Karen. To me, to concider ones self bi-sexual, would mean that you act on that. Do you and your wife have an "open" marriage? If your married to a moman, and are monogamous, you shouldnt call yourself bi-sexual any more. It may insult her!! Just something to think about!!!

That's the way I feel about it also. You can't be "bisexual" and monogamous at the same time. According to Jerry Springer, if a man ever has sex with another man, he's gay. I don't think that's true. You are what you are now. You can be "ex gay", "ex-bisexual", etc.

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

That's the way I feel about it also. You can't be "bisexual" and monogamous at the same time. According to Jerry Springer, if a man ever has sex with another man, he's gay. I don't think that's true. You are what you are now. You can be "ex gay", "ex-bisexual", etc.

Does that mean that any time someone goes through a dry spell sexually they're asexual? Of course someone can be "ex-" something because sexuality is more fluid than people give it credit for, but if someone self-identifies as being bisexual, it really isn't your place to tell them they are or aren't based solely on the status of their current sex life.

[linda allen]

Does that mean that any time someone goes through a dry spell sexually they're asexual? Of course someone can be "ex-" something because sexuality is more fluid than people give it credit for, but if someone self-identifies as being bisexual, it really isn't your place to tell them they are or aren't based solely on the status of their current sex life.
We like to think that being married to someone is more than our "current sex life". It's supposed to be "till death do us part".

I think if a person is bisexual but commits to marriage to another person, he (or she) could no longer claim to be bisexual.

[Roberta Marie]

Karen,

I have to agree with most of what's been said. Don't risk your relationship with your wife. You only have one of her, and there WILL be other opportunities to get together with other TGs. Making it a girls day out with the 3 of you sounds like good advice.

As far as your wife's other concerns, she's partly right. Chances are that you will get read, that there will be stares, and probably even a snicker or two. But if you don't let it bother you, and you show your wife that you're not letting it bother you, it will help her to not let it bother her. As far as the possibility f a physical altercation, that is very unlikely as long as you use your head and don't go where it's more likely to happen, like, say a red neck bar. Use your head, and demonstrate to your wife that you are using your head. Don't go anywhere that you would not want your wife to go either alone or with a girlfriend or your daughter. Be aware of your surroundings and of any potential threats. But, this is a legitimate concern, and your wife's fears probably won't ever go away. This was my wife's biggest concern from the first time I ventured out in public, and it still worries her, but not as much. Just like it worries me when she, or one of our kids, is out alone.

Grace,
Bobbi

[Roberta Marie]

We like to think that being married to someone is more than our "current sex life". It's supposed to be "till death do us part".

I think if a person is bisexual but commits to marriage to another person, he (or she) could no longer claim to be bisexual.

At the risk of hijacking this thread, I have to disagree. You're confusing actions with orientation. A person can still be in a monogamous relationship and still get turned on when they see someone that they think is hot. Whether that person that is the subject of the arousal is the same sex or a different sex is what determines a person's sexual orientation, not whether or not that arousal is acted upon. If Karen sees a hot guy and is aroused by him but does not act on that arousal, then 10 minutes later her wife walks by in a tight sweater and turns her on, then she's bi. She's turned on by hot people of both sexes. Just because she only acts on that arousal with her wife does not make her straight.

Sorry, Karen, for using you and your wife as an example, you were convenient. Also, sorry for hijacking your thread. I think you are getting some good advice. Don't let the pink fog that is being generated by your friend's coming out cloud your judgement.

Grace,
Bobbi

[Katesback]

Is this a real situation or a sort of dream. I mean I am sorry but I got the impression is it was dream.

[Roberta Marie]

And a child shall lead them.

Before hitting the post button on that last post of mine, I let my 19 YO son, who is gay, read it for his opinion. His words of wisdom:

"People on that forum, of all forums, should not be so worried about labels. You [including his father] should should know better than anyone that labels don't always apply, and shouldn't apply to many situations. But, if people insist on using labels, at least apply the frickin' Kinsey Scale!"

Grace?,
Bobbi

PS. Again, Karen, sorry for hijacking the thread.

[Jay Cee]

Okay, so your wife trusts you, and leaves the decision to go on this "date" (um... yeah... stop calling it that :) ) up to you. That's good. Unless she is the type to throw it back in your face later, go out with your friend. Does she know your friend? Does she like him? If she hasn't met him, bring him over before hand.

Keep your own safety in mind, obviously. The fact that there actually is a TG friendly coffee house within the Ozarks certainly boggles my mind, and breaks at least one of my stereotypes of the area you live in.

Sometimes, I am absolutely staggered at how much spouses distrust one another. I can understand that if you have cheated on her in the past, or if you flirt with women and/or men on a regular basis. But all of a sudden, you are dressed as a woman, your friend is dressed as a woman, and all of your faithfulness just gets tossed out the window? C'mon, people, we're grownups, aren't we?

Anyways, hope you have a great time.

[Stephanie Anne]

If I was your wife, I would have the same concerns. You are going to another man's house and excluding your wife. I would be rightfully pissed if my husband decided to on a date with an other man. I agree that not calling it a date is a wise start.

I know you won't admit it here but if you are fantasizing about sex with him, you really should call it off until such time as you can get over it.

[Sara Jessica]

Interesting way to present the whole scenario, as a "date".

Got me thinking back to the friends I have made in the community. Although I can get my head around the allure of meeting up with a like minded person to have dress-up fun, there is a serious potential for mishap which is only amplified by calling it a date. It happens I have never participated in such an activity, that my friendships were cultivated as any other human beings might do so. Think about it. Women who become friends are hardly likely to get together to play dress-up in each other's closets as a first step towards friendship. People come together over common interests and/or by having like-minded personality types and go from there.

I guess my point is that the dressing shouldn't be what consumes a budding friendship. My advice is to simply meet at said coffee house as women. Talk about things, both trans and non-trans and see how you relate in a trans environment. You have already said you're friends so you are a step ahead in the right direction.

[Pythos]

I am going to also say the use of the word date was very unfortunate.

Dates are when two potential lovers meet over dinner, or movie, or what have you. Yes I know in our modern, and more dumb society we have used the word for more, but look at what that has got us. Kids don't go to play with their friends, they have play dates. LOL

As far as the wife having issues, it shows me that she is insecure, and that insecurity is going to lead to limitations placed upon you. You need to remedy this insecurity.

[suchacutie]

This thread started with "a friend coming out to my wife and me (sic)". If that friend came out to both of you, how is it that the meeting en femme left out your wife. Turn it around...wouldn't you be concerned if your wife had a girlfriend and suddenly the two of them announce that they are going on a "date", suddenly excluding you. This has nothing to do with crossdressing, and all to do with letting some emotional issue (like the good ole pink fog) cloud your marital judgement. If I were you I'd quickly apologize to my wife and literally beg her to come along, and you are incredibly sorry for stupidly excluding her! From my perspective this is not the way to treat a spouse, especially a supportive one.

And yes, I'm sure that every one of us on this forum (and the rest of humanity) has made this same faux pas. It's just the X dressing that seems to complicate this particular faux pas, and it's likely the pink fog that helped it along!

I do hope this all works out!

tina

[Pinky188]

A lot of great advice here! My main concern is for your wife's insecuritys! You two have a special bond that you dont want to risk breaking! You should never let her have any reason to think you will be unfaithful!!! Useing the word "date" was prolly not a good idea! You should include her on that "outing"!

[BRANDYJ]

I am going to also say the use of the word date was very unfortunate.

As far as the wife having issues, it shows me that she is insecure, and that insecurity is going to lead to limitations placed upon you. You need to remedy this insecurity.

I don't know how you can say the wife is insecure without knowing her or more about the relationship.
I don't think she is insecure if her concern is that her husband, who opening says he is bi is going on a "date" with another male crossdresser. You don't know how sexual crossdressing is to her husband.
If his sexuality and crossdressing are closely related as it is for some if not many other crossdressers. She has every right to think he may have a weak moment and become sexual in this situation. If I was on a diet and have not eaten for awhile and am hungry, don't expect me to not sample something if left alone in a pantry full of food.
If I was bisexual and promised to be faithful and wanted and earned my wife's trust, I damn sure am not going to put myself in a place where I could become weak. And that may be the legitimate concern of his wife. Being insecure may have nothing to do with this. My SO is far from insecure and she trusts me 110%, but she would question my motives if I wanted to "date" another female or even a transgendered friend.

[makin' it real]

I am completely and totally with Tina (suchacutie) on this one. I think she nailed it perfectly. Do whatever is necessary to back quickly away from whatever action produced concern for your wife, apologize sincerely, then talk with her about what just happened for both of you. Only after discussing it all with your wife would I then consider getting together with your friend, at whatever location and with whatever companions seems fitting to everyone involved. Do not run solo on this one. You are not alone.

~Rachel

[AllieSF]

Karen, enjoy you "meet up" with your fellow CD. Since you are the only one that really understands your situation and the printed word can only describe just so much about it, I trust your judgment and your potential need to show your wife that you can be trusted meeting up with other CDers. You did not say that you were going to go over to her house and play dress up all day. You said that you are going over there to dress up and head out to a local coffee shop for a moment out in the real world with a friend with similar interests, albeit strange interests in the eyes of others.

I don't know if you can dress openly at home whenever you want or whether you can leave your house dressed up. If dressing at home and then leaving is a complicated situation for you, which many here, including myself have, than it sounds very logical to me that you would depart in guy mode and take advantage of the opportunity to dress up somewhere else to avoid that complicated dressing and then leaving home dressed situation. I think that by showing over the long run that your friendship with this person is on a platonic level and your times dressing and going out with her is part of your dressing needs, you will be able to help your wife to understand that what you are doing by going out with this mutual friend is not a threat to your relationship nor to your safety and well being.

By following the advice here to give in to your wife's concerns it appears that you will only frustrate yourself, give credence to your wife's concerns and limit yourself from being "yourself". She said do what you want, so I say do what you want. She did not say that she did not want you to go. Next time, if she tells you that she does not want you to go out, then you have another decision situation that needs to be discussed and resolved.

Since we all here talk about the need for open and frank communication, that to me also includes the SO's being very clear about whether they mean "I do not want you to go out", or "I have my concerns, but do as you want and be careful". I think that by acquiescing to unclear communications we only foster the use of those unclear communications. We all need to be direct and say what we mean versus infer it. Lack of clear communications cause a majority of relationship problems.

[ReineD]

More mature women don't do this as much, but I do remember in my younger, single days, going to a girlfriend's house and both of us getting ready to go to a party. My looking forward to it had more to do with female bonding since I do not have a sister, and also the possibility of looking my best for the boys at the party. It's fun to get advice on what looks good. But, I never once entertained the idea that anything "might" happen between my girlfriend and I.

Add my voice to the others who say you should stop thinking of it as a "date". When you say that you will be careful to not let anything get started, are you admitting the possibility that it might become sexual even if it is only on your part?

Also, does the prospect of inviting your wife along and having her accept diminish the prospect of having an exciting time? If so, then you might reexamine your motives?

Edit - Allie above has a great point. Do make sure that when your wife says, "Do what you want", she doesn't really mean, "I made him aware of my concerns, and if he goes ahead it means that his girlie outing with our friend is more important to him than I am". In an ideal world, couples are honest and direct with one another. But, there are also situations that are more difficult to talk about.

[Tanya C]

How serious are your wife's concerns? If she would really be upset over this proposed date then perhaps you should consider cancelling. On the other hand she may simply be expressing a little apprehension over this meeting herself. After all, it will no doubt be nerve-racking for her. And I'm sure you can understand her being worried about your safety.
There is nothing wrong with the date as planned as long as it's just friendly. But, sometimes our wives have pretty keen insight into actions and motives, and as others have pointed out you have described yourself as a bisexual going out on a date with someone else.

[eluuzion]

I faced many similar topics brought up by my ex when we were married. Her position always involved attempts to "qualify" the meaning and implications of her behavior associated with ex-lovers and "friends". Specifically, what was appropriate behavior in a marriage.

To her, one-on-one lunches, meeting for drinks,exchanging letters,gifts, and other secretive meetings were just "normal" behavior, even when not revealed or denied to your partner. (it often starts with "I deserve to have a life too" logic. As if you get to be "married" "single" "with kids" "apart from kids" at the same time instead of being one person whose life changes.) lol

My position has always been the same. When you decide to enter an exclusive and intimate relationship with a partner, the goal is to behave, act and make decisions which support and strengthen the relationship, rather than "test" it or "weaken" the bond.

This typically calls for applying this approach during times when certain things make sense to your spouse, but not to you. Erroring in favor of the relationship is the right thing to do. If one partner is uncomfortable due to some painful experiences in their past, that may not be valid now or apply to you in any way...you honor that and place your partner's feeling first when deciding on your behavior.

It may be silly to you, or prevent you from some action you believe you have a right to take, but that is missing the entire point of marriage. If you value your partner, and the strength of the bond required to maintain it, you do not have to "question" which behavior is the best choice. You support your spouse by always choosing behavior which makes your partner most comfortable. That is what is important. It is not about "right" or "wrong", it is all about making each other comfortable...whether it "makes sense" or not... is irrelevant...

but that's just me...but I happen to believe that actions speak louder than words and justifications after the fact...

:love:

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

We like to think that being married to someone is more than our "current sex life". It's supposed to be "till death do us part".

I think if a person is bisexual but commits to marriage to another person, he (or she) could no longer claim to be bisexual.

First off the post of yours I responded to simply said monogamous, not married, which is different but it's a nitpick so I'll concede that issue to get to the larger point at hand, which is simply, you can think whatever you want, it doesn't make it right. The fact is you have no right to tell Karen or anyone else how they should define their own sexuality. Period.

Karen considers herself bisexual despite signing a piece of paper that apparently you feel has the power to change one's sexuality. If she considers herself bisexual, and a has a history of bisexuality, feelings of bisexual attraction, and is comfortable calling herself a bisexual even though she is married, and her wife is comfortable with the term, then who are you to say she shouldn't? No where did Karen say how her wife feels about her being bi, her wife is concerned because she was talking about going on a "date" with another man. It's the action that concerns her, not the orientation.

BACK TO THE OP, Karen, taking the bi angle, I have a thought here that might make you understand your wife's concerns. Do you think if you'd had a close GG friend who was excited by your crossdressing, and invited you to come over to her place and help you get dressed up, and then go out and meet for coffee, without your wife, would you feel comfortable with it? Would you even say to your wife "Hey you know what Sally and I talked about...." or would you go "well that might be inappropriate..."

[Loni]

have the wife along, just three lady's out for dinner.

wife mad = your life is going to be a birch.

and if you are calling it a date you are sunk no matter what happens.

think of it from her side...how would you feel if she was going out on a date with out you?

.

[Sophie86]

I think if a person is bisexual but commits to marriage to another person, he (or she) could no longer claim to be bisexual.

This makes as much sense as saying that marrying a blonde means a man would no longer find brunettes sexually attractive.

If, after 20 years of monogamy, the husband had an affair with another man, would you say that he suddenly became bisexual again? It went away for twenty years, and then mysteriously reappeared?

[Jill Devine]

Don't do it. At least not yet. Although your wife says it's up to you, she has raised her concern. In simple English, she isn't comfortable and doesn't want you to go. I would bet pennies to pounds that she wants you to back out but doesn't want to come across as controlling. If you are attracted to men then it would be the same as your wife going out with another man: getting all giddy and calling it a date. How would you feel?

Being married and sexually attracted to men is a very difficult situation if you also want to go out with other gurls. Tough one and the only solution is to include your wife when going out.

[Jill Devine]

I have a question Karen. To me, to concider ones self bi-sexual, would mean that you act on that. Do you and your wife have an "open" marriage? If your married to a moman, and are monogamous, you shouldnt call yourself bi-sexual any more. It may insult her!! Just something to think about!!!

Calling yourself bisexual, hetro or homoexual is to do with your overall sexual orientation and who you are sexually attracted to. So yes you can be a man married to a woman and in a committed relationship but still consider yourself as "bi" because you are still attracted to and sexually compatible with the same sex.

As mentioned in my previous post, being married and bisexual presents a difficult challenge if you want to go out alone. Most wives fear that a hetro CD is secretly gay or bi and that is a tough one to overcome. If the wives eventually accepts the fact that the husband is 100% straight and faithful, she will find it easier to allow him to go out. But if he admits to being bi and naturally attracted to men, you have a problematic mix. Only solution is for the husband and wife to go out together.

[Pinky188]

Calling yourself bisexual, hetro or homoexual is to do with your overall sexual orientation and who you are sexually attracted to. So yes you can be a man married to a woman and in a committed relationship but still consider yourself as "bi" because you are still attracted to and sexually compatible with the same sex.

As mentioned in my previous post, being married and bisexual presents a difficult challenge if you want to go out alone. Most wives fear that a hetro CD is secretly gay or bi and that is a tough one to overcome. If the wives eventually accepts the fact that the husband is 100% straight and faithful, she will find it easier to allow him to go out. But if he admits to being bi and naturally attracted to men, you have a problematic mix. Only solution is for the husband and wife to go out together.

Very good point!!! Thanks Jill!!!!